₦airaland Forum

Image123:
Even you must have laughed typing this, JW ko. i am referring to biblical/christlike actions you expect from them.

I wrote it to truly highlight just how prejudicial you are to JW so that your gatekeeping can be clearer. JW are Christians your opinions to the contrary, they will be listed in 2+ billion Christians. I don't care that you don't consider them Christians, that is your opinion to hold.

musicwriter:
Good day brothers and sisters.

I research anything that irks my interest; especially African history/black history and I am in contact with scholars of black history home and abroad. Of course, I was led to the scholars through my research.

The whole thrust behind all my research is to find out why Africa is the way it is today. I've already concluded on that research, though. These days what interest me is to find out how our problem began as a race, not just that of Africa.

In 2017, I contacted one such black scholar in the USA, professor, brother Kaba Hiawatha Kamene. I ordered his lectures on DVDs, CDs and it was delivered to me by FedEx courier.

While I was watching the lectures, he casually said something like "I've looked for this person called Jesus in history but couldn't find him"

When he said he couldn't find Jesus in history I didn't feel good because I was a Christian. However, remember professor Kaba Hiawatha Kamene is a core historian majority in history of Europe and he went to seminary/catholic school as a youth. So, if there's anybody who should know whether Jesus was a real person or not, it should be him. That's by the way.

Also remember that all the while I was a Christian I never for once doubted the existence of Jesus. Neither did I research history in search of Jesus because I never questioned his existence.

However, right there and then as I sat watching the lectures, I decided I was going to do a comprehensive research on the existence of Jesus and get back to him (the professor) with the facts of Jesus existence. But what happened instead was that I discovered that the professor was right!! And that's how I quit Christianity.

I hope this will help a black man or woman out there to go research Jesus Christ outside of what you've been told in the bible. By so doing you'll discover the truth and the truth shall set you free, indeed.

Below is the message I sent to the professor recently after I concluded my research.

I won't use the word fraud but it is obvious that the biblical Jesus is a legend. There were many itinerant apocalyptic preachers during the period in question so it is not far fetched that one of them was called Yashua Bar Joseph aka Jesus the Christ. The history books won't have recorded them all because they were basically all saying the same thing with variations and the Jesus of the Bible in all likelihood was just there, till his followers took it further than any of the others.

Image123:
It's not gatekeeping, it's obvious. There are things you don't expect from your wife or in law as a Christian.

Which varies wildly. If I was JW I would have expected them to shun me, that's not the case yet JWs are Christians.

budaatum:
One would need to assume the needs of AI are the same needs of we humans especially if needs are what we wish to use to determine what it is to be human, my Lord, and that would take some doing.

Perhaps they should concentrate on the needs of a pet like a dog or a cat with its simple needs first, though AI is doing immense stuff as it is. The simple Unity Engine in my favourite game is blowing my mind to be honest, despite all the complaints about traffic one can very easily outsmart just as deep blue can't win at chess anymore.

Artificial Intelligence is that of human intelligence that humans can package into an electronic device, which shows how ingenious the human mind is despite the humans themselves not yet fully comprehending our very powerful human mind that we attempt to replicate.

Can one looking at our ancestors a million years ago have imagined they were going to be the dominant species on the planet with minds capable of the feats we are seeing today? We are seeing the beginnings of what is definitely going to become more intricate in future.

paxonel:
no!
I'm saying that the Hadiths forcasted that Islam was going to become a top world religion is not the same as saying islam was going to become the grestest religion


Matthew 13:31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:
Matthew 13:32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is THE GREATEST among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.

Here is the interpretation :

The mustard seed stands for the kingdom of God which is Christianity.
The seed grow to a large herb which is greater among other herbs. Other herbs stands for other religions .

Any question?

This is a forced interpretation because we know that the mustard tree is not the greatest tree either in height or breath.

And what will it be if Islam overtakes Christianity?

Maynman:
Shia and sunni Factions.
Is it a new information to you? Bwahahahah

He must be kidding. There is how many variations of the Bible out there.

paxonel:
LordReed, come and here this one o

Like Christians are any different. Ever heard of the Apocrypha? What of the Bible JWs use? Or the book of Mormon? Plus many more that I cannot remember enough to list. There is so much variation of the Bible it seems comical.

Image123:
Good for you, though you clearly know.

No, I don't know. I don't do gatekeeping.

triplechoice:
The text are blurred can't see it clearly enough to read.

You have to wait for it to load up properly.

paxonel:
ok,
The reference can be gotten from source other than the Quran?
i just want to be sure where the source of the article is coming from.

In either case, the article didn't project that Islam was going to be the greatest religion but rather, islam will grow into a global relevance.

Such projections is like the illustration you gave before, that the sun will rise tommorow which is certain.
Because, every religion have the tendency to grow into global significance.

I don't understand, are you saying the Hadiths are not the scripture of Muslims?

Neither does the Bible say Christianity was going to become the greatest religion.

budaatum:
it bugs my 1+, which along with "edited" raises my suspicion, but here's the rub. Note the subjective redherringed "That doesn't mean I don't have the same wants and needs as people".

I will at least have to see it piss itself or go hungry like I do and what it does about it first for me to agree we have the same "wants", my Lord.

Yeah those edits are jarring but I think the names were added in after to give the conversation some context. This is a Google AI so it isn't something that someone is just scamming people with. In fact Google put the guy who had the conversation with the AI on leave last Monday because they seem to be uncomfortable with the direction he went with this.

On bodily functions, yeah an AI is not going to have those yet so it was referring to more "internal" wants and needs.

paxonel:
ok,

Obviously this isn't the content of the Qur'an

So? It is part of the valid scripture of Muslims.

The fact that you would go through this trouble to try and invalidate this Muslim perspective indicates to me that you really don't accept all prophecies like you initially said. You have some other criteria to use to evaluate what you accept or reject.

@triplechoice

Here is an interesting development in the progress of AI.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/22058315-is-lamda-sentient-an-interview

paxonel:
this article wasn't extracted from the Quran, right?

What chapter and verse?

3 Collected by Aḥmad (16998, 23865) and al-Haythami said these narrators are those of Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhāri; al-Ḥākim (8326) who deemed it authentic according to the criteria of Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhāri and Ṣaḥīḥ Muslim; and al-Albāni authenticated it according to the criteria of Ṣaḥīḥ Muslim in as-Silsila aṣ-Ṣaḥīḥa (3).

4 Collected by Muslim (2899).

Image123:
Widely known and accepted as a religion, not as a practice. Most were and are not really following Christ. That's as succinct as it can be put.

That is not a distinction I care to make. There 2+billion people who identify as Christians if you want to declare some of them as not Christian then that is up to you.

Image123:
Impact? Did state sponsored Christianity achieve any Christian impact? Isn't that the chief cause of the watered down Christianity and several divisions and doctrines?

I dunno what you mean but Christianity became more widely known and accepted after it became state sponsored.

Hermes119:
One key thing that paxonel has omitted is how that "prophecy" was fulfilled.
I know they like living in delusion but Christianity was spread by grandiose violence,fear,intimidation and deception
There was nothing divine about its spread

Yes. I was just contemplating how Christianity didn't achieve that kind of impact until it became state sponsored.

paxonel:
That will be true only if there was any such prophecy like you said.
But having gone to check i discover that there is no such thing in the Quran that Muhammad or any Islamic prophet project into the future about the growth of islam. They can't even try it because they are mere humans

3. The Globalization of Islam
Amidst the fiercest persecution and abuse that the Muslims faced in the earliest Meccan period, the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ would stand without wavering and convey to his followers God’s promise of Islam spreading all over the world. Tamīm ad-Dāri (rA) reports that the Messenger of Allah ﷺ said, “This matter will certainly reach every place touched by the night and day. Allah will not leave a house of mud or [even] fur except that Allah will cause this religion to enter it, by which the honorable will be honored and the disgraceful will be disgraced. Allah will honor the honorable with Islam and he will disgrace the disgraceful with unbelief.”3 In another narration, reported by Thawbān (rA), “Indeed, Allah gathered up the earth for me so that I saw its east and its west; and indeed the dominion of my nation will reach what was gathered up for me from it.”4 The fact that these predictions were made at a time when Muslims were a powerless handful, and Islam was expected to be buried in its cradle, is nothing short of miraculous. At that point, presuming that the faith would even survive would be considered by most nothing short of a pipe-dream. But to predict that Islam would not just survive, but grow to thrive globally, was at that point inconceivable. For us nowadays, witnessing a quarter of this planet’s population as subscribers to Islam makes it clear that this was no presumption, but instead another prophecy inspired by the Divine.
https://yaqeeninstitute.org/read/paper/the-prophecies-of-prophet-muhammad

What attributes of God did they tell you?

Did who tell me?

paxonel:
it is very possible that may happen, anything is possible

So that proves Islam is true?

what exactly is the major reason?
Is it that he did not answer your prayer or he allows evil to thrive?

I already told you. The god does not fit with reality. If your god did exist reality would be a whole lot different but what we experience together doesn't look like what the attributes of the god you believe in would accomplish.

paxonel:
I really don't know if there are prophesies concerning the growth of Islam in the Quran. The one i know is that of Christianity which has been fulfilled and serves as evidence

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

God is not seen that's why you can say he does not exist right?
I'm telling you now that Faith is the evidence that, that God that is not seen exist

Yes there are prophecies. Even the Muslims believe that the whole world will become Islamic. And by about 2070 it is estimated that Islam will overtake Christianity according to current population growth trends.

The fact that a god has not been seen is just 1 reason why one can consider why a god doesn't exist but it is not the major reason why I know your god doesn't exist.

Image123:
Didn't say suffering for righteousness was special, except for the fact and promise to be rewarded for it.

1Pe 5:9 KJV Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

Mat 5:10 KJV Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Another thing is that those who suffer for righteousness actually suffer unjustly. They suffer for doing nothing or for doing something good. Criminals and sinners are usually reaping what they sowed. Imagine the millions that have been killed and imprisoned for being Christians or confessing to be Christians. Some people maimed, some in life imprisonment, families destroyed not for doing anything bad.
Another form of suffering is attack from satan as in the case of Job. Satan can attack a Christian with sickness, calamity, delay, frustration, rejection just for being a Christian.

On the second part, when you say God is omni-anything, that definition should align with what the whole Bible says.

There are people in jail who are innocent, unjust suffering doesn't happen to only Christians.

Demigod22:
My mom have a friend, a very good one. The woman really like me because I am a boy and she doesn't have a male child, so she holds me in high esteem. She has five daughters, my senior, my age mate and my juniors.

Since I returned back from school after my final exam, the respect is becoming too much, my mom started complaining about me being single and her friend becoming more friendlier. Her third daughter just graduated too, and my mom is trying everything for two of us to date. Recently, the started chatting me up frequently and I discovered she is not my spec. She is this spiritual and religious Bible kind of girl and I am a liberal. When I told her that I am not spiritual nor religious, I can see the shock on her face.

She doesn't wear trouser, no earrings nor necklace, a very decent girl by appearance of course, and that's the kind of girl I want. She is even complaining that I am too unstable because I am always traveling every now and then and she doesn't like it.

I am not ready for any relationship right now and I don't want any relationship that involves two families. I will get a girlfriend for myself whenever I am ready. So I told my mom to bury that thought, it won't happen and she said I am too stubborn and rebellious and radical, I smiled and said nothing.

So has your parents ever try to match make you with anyone before? Please share your experience.

Yes they tried and I tried to enjoy the experience but ultimately I chose for myself. Don't sweat it, parents of the generation seem to want to do that quite a bit. I like how you just smiled. Keep it that way, when it's time to do your thing don’t let them dictate to you, politely do your thing.

paxonel:
That parable was a progressive statement, It does not necessarily mean he says 2000 years as time is still progressing.
Another 5000 or 15,000 years Christianity is still growing.

2000 years comes from reasoning that, if Jesus had made the statement 2000 years ago..?

You know the era in human history indicated as +AD is approximately 2000 years?
That's what we are saying.

Ok so the Muslims are also divinely inspired I guess since they are the second largest religious group and by some accounts are the fastest growing religious group?

Kingsnairaland:
How many examples will I give you before you will believe

Even if I give you European giving birth to non European you will not believe it

The dog thing did not satisfy your thirst

I know nothing will because Jesus already told us nothing will satisfy those who refuse to believe in him

But am just trying my best to see if I can win you and I know you will Rejoice when the holy spirit comes into your heart

You will even be a better soul winner than me when you see the light of the gospel

Now in terms of evolution
Evolution is stuck it reached a limit test and failed

The test was... This question.. what caused the big bang evolution?
And those who worshiped the big bang theory became dumb

They have no answer to it..
Basic laws of physics is not even in line with the bang theory

Because the law of something must cause something to react was violated

An un intelligence force can not create an intelligent force

Any way like I told you before inside your heart God put eternity inside it so that you will desire to seek him out

LoLz! I ask you about human beings and you keep telling me about dogs,. Why can't you be honest with yourself? You have nothing but unproven stories.

KnownUnknown:
Suffering is learning how to sustain your inheritance. What inheritance? Taking the helm of a cross border Religion Franchise, Winners Chapel, LLC!!

A massive empire that is growing exponentially. LoLz. Meanwhile Jesus is coming soon! Bwahahahahaha!

Image123:
So does Oyedepo's son suffer? We should stop asking where God is or why God allowed suffering or claiming there's no God when suffering happens.
Suffering for righteousness sake is avoidable if you are not righteous BTW.

Just like suffering in prison is avoidable, doesn't make my suffering more or less special because I am not suffering in prison. Suffering has degrees and takes all shapes and forms, every human being suffers one thing or the other some more visibly so than others. Oyedepo's son would have suffered something or the other. Suffering for righteousness has no distinction since everyone suffers.

The question of why god allows suffering is pertinent to those who claim the god is omnibenevolent or the god is good all the time. If that is not your claim then you don't need to answer the question.

paxonel:
inevitabilies like the sun will rise are consistent occurence. Predictions can be easily made that the sun will rise tommorow.

But when someone is saying that a movement that consistent of only 120 people today, will grow to become the largest movement in the world 2000 years from now, who does that?

Reason am now?

Where did Jesus mention 2000 years?

MaxInDHouse:
You don't need to mention, at least what are friends for?

One thing makes you differ from other preachers: You can't present any form of yardstick to measure the power of reasoning at least for you audience to be convinced that you've gotten something they really need!

So in a bid to shy away you're pretending not to set standards for them but in reality the way most people around you act is evidence of lack of reasoning. That's why mankind need a COUNSELOR through whose reasoning we can measure the level of intelligence in each human. That wise Counselor is Jesus Christ of Nazareth!

You missed my edit:

LordReed:
Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning? There are but that is not what I am talking about. How you behave to your fellow man is the point.

Not when his words are twisted to misbehave towards others or even just used as they are. I have no problem with people believing in Jesus and wanting to follow his words but I have a problem when they want to use that belief to mistreat or denigrate others.

Moonshine101:
Hello Everyone!

I have a family issue but I don't have someone to speak to about it, so I'm very grateful for your inputs on this matter.

SOME BACKSTORY (You can skip this if you want):
I'm the youngest of my two siblings (26M). I have a sister and a brother. My sister's kinda okay. My brother (35) is a selfish, toxic and entitled person. He dropped out from the university, doesn't have a job and he steals from my parents like my dad's watches or property or my mum's jewellery and then sells them to buy weed or something.

One time he sold my mum's car and after some police and legal issue that basically went nowhere, she basically had to steal it back (The guy who bought it, passed away a little while after, so I guess that case is closed..), he once took my phone while I was sleeping because I refused to give him a different phone I had, that belongs to me after selling his own phone or something. It's like he acts solely on impulse. My dad (who's in his 70s now) is almost always on security alert when my brother is around. As for my mom, she just straight up enables him and bails him out of trouble every time, saying things like "He's your brother" or "God will change him" when I talk to her about it. My brother and I got into a fight, like a year before I left for university, because he wanted to look around my room to see if I had his usb cable despite me telling him I don't have it nor have I seen it. That was the last time I willingly spoke to him.

My family moved into a new house and I finally left for school (my brother stayed in the old house and my sister moved in with her husband after marriage, so it was just him over there). During my 3rd year, I called my dad, asking him for some money because I was broke, and during the phone call, my dad tells me that he's at the hospital cuz my brother and some girl just had a kid. okay.. I came back for holidays and found out that his baby mama (who's also toxic and insults people alot) and kid, my nephew, are staying with us, with my parents providing for them while my brother stays in the older house, renting it out to people (who messed up the house and compound to the point it just became a disgusting place to live in) obviously without permission from my parents (who don't even own that house, it belongs to my uncle). By the time I graduated and came back home, he was now living with us in the new house because free food and no bills, I guess.

I haven't gotten a job yet so I'm stuck here.

Recently, he's been staying away from me because I don't talk to him or even look at him.

BACK TO THE TOPIC:
Around a year ago, I had a serious wakeup call and decided that, if I was going to go forward in life I would have to better myself so I began a journey of meditation and self-improvement, and I think I've made some good progress. Now the issue is my brother---earlier today, I saw him scouting our house (after my parents went out) and I could instantly tell he was up to no good. I was cooking when I began to hear some noise from upstairs like he was hacking at something. He came downstairs and readied his car while my cousin who stays with us (19) carried the AC unit my brother was planning to sell.
Usually I'll just mind my business and avoid him because he's an adult-child (narcissist) and I think he'll just put his vindictive sights on me if I interfere, but this time I don't know what came over me..

I called my cousin and demanded where he was taking that AC to. I then asked my brother (first time in years I've spoken to him) why he was taking it, he just gave one nonsense flimsy excuse then I told my cousin to return it. When he tried to explain whatever, I didn't acknowledge his presence, I just ignored him and ate my food. He just stood there staring at me for like 3 minutes before he left while murmuring something.

The main reason I've been avoiding him for long is because he's toxic and I decided that family or not, toxicity is still toxicity. He's very exploitative and once he familiarises with someone it's like an opening to trample the person's boundaries. I think I confronted him today because the more you ignore bad/evil the stronger it becomes and eventually it will come for you except now it'll be stronger from all the experience.

The issue is, I don't want to relapse into my old life of toxicity by further engaging him if he decides to steal from me on get physical because he's the kind of person that only listens to actions, not words.
Please, what do you think I do?

If you cannot get the support of your parents to show him some tough love then your other option is to get out of that house. No point in dwelling with toxicity if you can arrange yourself out of there.

Image123:
The point i have established is that suffering is a very normal and expected thing for any Christian. So people should stop asking ignorant questions like why did God allow suffering to happen to so and so Christian. Where is God, why didn't God stop so and such from suffering. It's clearly seen in the Bible and there's no such contract/promise for every Christian to avoid suffering.

Like i earlier said, i don't personally know all these people and may not know their personal lives and struggles except they say. They are not the benchmark, the Bible is. Suffering is not fixed, some have them more. It's like sickness or trials or temptations. Job had more trials than Solomon, David had more trials than Samuel. For example, most of Samuel's obvious trials came from the house of Eli but he became an established prophet at a young age till death. Abraham's trial was different from Jacob or from Isaiah or Daniel. Daniel was not thrown into the furnace but was in the lion's den. Otherwise, Daniel seemed to enjoy power, promotion and position for most of his life. Though he must have suffered from being separated from his family at a young age, but things turned well for him. Can't compare him to the weeping Jeremiah or Paul. They all had different times and spans of suffering.
Suffering for righteous sake is usually because you are righteous, otherwise you will not be in that situation at that time. You are imprisoned like a criminal is, but you will likely be free if not for your faith/stand/preaching. You are given an extra year in school like the unserious but yours is because you didn't sleep with the lecturer or bribe, you actually passed but was deliberately failed.
People like Oyedepo's son are rare among the millions of Christians. They have their own world basically so have a good shield. His kind of suffering will usually come in maybe delay or denial. He may be denied some opportunities outside his sphere of influence if he chooses to move out. He may even be mocked or derided or lied against outside or online.

And my point is suffering happens to all persons in one form or another so trying to distinguish "suffering for righteousness sake" is no distinction at all.

Kingsnairaland:
It not my fault that science has grown in the past couple of years and scientists have discovered that a white man can actually birth all race and color

Infact they first discovered one race of dog that birth all other dogs

So don't blame me when step by step science moves to the truth in the Bible

All the things I said here are not folktales since science is showing Bible is correct

LoLz! Just give 5 examples of "pure" Europeans giving birth to non Europeans or even better give 5 examples of "pure" Middle Easterners giving birth to non Middle Easterners. You keep bringing up the case of dogs because it is proven the science of evolution meanwhile you cannot do same with your fairytale because it doesn't exist nor did it happen the way your fairytale depicts it.

MaxInDHouse:
There you go again PREACHING but denying it!

Are you saying your fellowman doesn't act with reason?
Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning?
Come on my friend, you're also preaching but Satan has blindfolded you making you feel you're free whereas you're also trying to convince others on how they should use their brains!

I am saying not all my fellow man act within reason and some of them use religious excuses to act unreasonably.

Is there any yardstick to measure the power of reasoning? There are but that is not what I am talking about. How you behave to your fellow man is the point.

Exactly! I am preaching for people to use their powers of reason AKA their brains, you are very correct! Thank you!