DoctorAlien:


First off, you don't assume that I am arguing in favour of the doctrine of Trinity.

You call KJV spurious and contaminated? So your NWT is actually accurate and clean? LOL. Follow this link to see a thorough dissection of your clean NWT(note that I don't endorse their trinitarian teachings. I just provided the link so you can see how "uncontaminated" your NWT is): https://answersingenesis.org/jesus-christ/jesus-is-god/is-jesus-the-creator-god/

That Jesus was anointed by God, His Father, does not take away anything from His Deity. If Jesus is not God, why did Micah 5:2 state that Jesus's "goings forth have been from everlasting"? Who has existed from everlasting if not God?

Who was speaking in Rev. 1:11? I THINK THAT YOU MEANT TO CITE VERSE 8
Who was speaking in Rev. 21:6?
Who was speaking in Rev. 1:17-18?

enilove:



You should be careful with this your doctrine.
If Jesus is coming down with ----1 voice of an archangel and 2 ----- trumpet of God. Why do choose to call him an archangel only and not trumpet of God as well?


Jesus said I and my Father are one. Are you comparing God with an angel then?

Jesus is GOD.
John 1:1-4 KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. [2] The same was in the beginning with God. [3] All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. [4] In him was life; and the life was the light of men.


Revelation 1:8,11 KJV
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. [11] Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven .....

From the above, Jesus was called ,Word of God, the Alpha and Omega and the Almighty.

As per:
1 Corinthians 8:6 KJV
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

The above simply means that God is the Father of Jesus and Jesus created all things with his Father. It means God is greater than Jesus Christ our Lord. That does not mean Jesus is not God Almighty. The word lord was used in the old testament as God.

YOUR STATEMENT ABOVE IS THE MYSTERY THAT BELTS HERESY. LET ME TRY TO ARRANGE YOUR SENTENCE, "GOD IS GREATER THAN JESUS CHRIST + JESUS IS THE SAME ALSO GOD ALMIGHTY". HAVE YOU TRIED TO READ YOUR STATEMENT? DO YOU KNOW THE DEFINITION OF THE WORD "ALMIGHTY? HE IS ALMIGHTY YET THERE IS SOMEONE GREATER THAN HIM. THAT IS ALL I CAN SAY AS A RESPONSE TO YOU. YOU ARE CONTRADICTING YOUR OWN SELF. TRY TO GATHER YOUR THOUGHTS FOR A MOMENT.

No one can see God and live. How come Moses saw God and also could not see God. The answer is , he saw Jesus God the Son, but only saw the back of God the Father. It was not a mistake.

Exodus 24:10-12 KJV
And they saw the God of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness. [11] And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink. [12] And the Lord said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, and a law, and commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.

Exodus 33:11,21,23 KJV
And the Lord spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend. And he turned again into the camp: but his servant Joshua, the son of Nun, a young man, departed not out of the tabernacle. ..................
[21] And the Lord said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon a rock: [23] And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen.

God and Lord were used synonymously in the old testament.

Jesus Christ is not an angel. He created angel Gabriel and other angels .

Emusan:


Christ demonstrated everything we need to know about kingdom of God, which means if will die we'll resurrect not the same FLESH and blood but with that of uncorruptible body. This is what the Bible testified about Christ resurrection.
I CORROBORATE THAT

This is what we called lack of scriptural understanding, in fact using this verse doesn't favour your argument at all because if you can read downward you can see what the Bible says of how the believers will have the spiritual body of Christ.

in verse 49 it says "Just as WE are now like the earthly man (Adam), WE will someday be like the heavenly man (Christ)"

Please is it a life given spirit like Christ that everybody will turn to afterward?

WELL THE BIBLE TALKS OF TWO SETS OF PEOPLE THAT ARE PROMISED RESIDENCES IN MATTHEW 5:5;10. AS YOU CLEARLY KNOW IN REVELATION 14, 144,000 WILL BE KINGS AND PRIESTS WITH JESUS. AN THERE WILL BE ANOTHER EARTHLY GROUP AS JESUS PROMISED WHO WILL LIVE FOREVER ON THE EARTH. REVELATION 21:1-4 ALSO HIGHLIGHTED IT AND I WILL HOPE THAT THIS WILL BRING YOU SOME RELIEF.

Let me see your next twist
THE TWIST IS EXACTLY THE WORD OF GOD AS YOU READ THEM FROM YOUR OWN BIBLE. EVERYTHING I HAVE DONE SO FAR IS CITE SCRIPTURES THAT YOUR BIBLE AGREES WITH. IF YOU CALL THAT "A TWIST" THEN YOU ARE REJECTING THE VERACITY AND AUTHENTICITY OF THE BIBLE. YOU MAY GO THROUGH MY RESPONSES AGAIN BEFORE YOU SAY TWIST. AND ONE MORE THING, USING THE WORD CHERRYPICKING OF THE SCRIPTURES IS A NEGATION TO THE VERSES QUOTED. IT IS, BECAUSE INSTEAD OF DWELLING ON THE MESSAGE YOU NEGATE THOSE VERSES BY CLASSIFYING THEM AS CHERRYPICKED VERSES ( which in turn trivializes the content of the message). IT IS THE WORD OF GOD AND CANNOT BE CHERRYPICKED BUT STUDIED AND CHERISHED.

The way you people are Cherry picking the scripture baffles a lot.

HOW HAS THE WORD OF GOD SUDDENLY BECOME CHERRYPICKING FOR YOU? ARE YOU SCARED TO READ SOME CERTAIN VERSES IN THE BIBLE? MENTIONING VERSE 46 BELOW IS ALSO CHERRYPICKING, ISN'T IT?

Verse 46 says "What comes first is the NATURAL BODY, then the SPIRITUAL BODY comes later."
So every Biblical students of truth know that Christ body was spiritual body not FLESH and blood if not blood supposed to be drifting from the printing of nails in His hands and legs, and He supposed to feel pains after resurrection since He felt pains before He died.
I AM GLAD THAT YOU KNOW THIS BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES.

So the 144,000 people who will went to heaven according to your organization won't see God or they're life given spirit like Christ

SAYING "ACCORDING TO MY ORGANISATION" IS SYNONYMOUS TO THROWING DIRT ON THE WORD OF GOD. YOU MAY READ REVELATION 14;1-4 IN YOUR OWN BIBLE SO THAT YOU DO NOT MAKE SUCH BLASPHEMOUS STATEMENT AGAIN.
ASKING IF THEY ARE LIFE-GIVING SPIRIT LIKE CHRIST IS IDENTICAL TO ASKING IF YOU WOULD SPREAD SIN TO YOUR OWN CHILDREN (Romans 5:12). THE QUESTION OF WHETHER THE 144,000 WILL SEE GOD, WELL MATTHEW 18:10 See that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I tell you that their angels in heaven always look upon the face of my Father who is in heaven.
HERE WE HAVE CLEAR KNOWLEDGE THAT ANGELS SEE GOD. NEVERTHELESS 1 JOHN 3:2 Beloved ones, we are now children of God, but it has not yet been made manifest what we will be. We do know that when he is made manifest we will be like him, because we will see him just as he is.
HERE INDICATES THAT THE 144.000 WILL ALSO BE ABLE TO SEE GOD SINCE THEY WILL BE LIKE JESUS WHO SEES GOD AND SITS AT HIS RIGHT HAND, AND REVELATION 14:3 SAYS THAT THEY STAND BEFORE THE THRONE. THIS MEANS THAT THEY WILL SEE GOD

1 Corinthians 15 you're being tried to twist since explains better about earthly body and spiritual body, do you know the different between them?

I REFUSE TO BE'TRIED TO TWIST' LOL. I DO NOT WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO SAY THERE. ANYWAY, THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE EARTHLY AND SPIRITUAL IS CLEARLY STATED IN THE SAME VERSES OF 1 CORINTHIANS 15 THAT WE HAVE READ ALREADY.

Bible can't lie, God is a spirit but does having spiritual body make one not to be a spirit?

I AM GLAD THAT YOU ASKED THAT. IF I MAY ASK, DO YOU HAVE THE SPIRITUAL BODY NOW? ARE YOU BORNE OF CHRIST? AS YOU ANSWER, IT WILL BE KIND ENOUGH FOR YOU TO READ THAT VERSE 46 OF 1 CORINTHIANS CHAPTER 15 THAT YOU CITED AGAIN. THAT VERSE CLEARLY SAYS THAT THE PHYSICAL BODY CAME FIRST BEFORE THE SPIRITUAL ONE. WITH THAT STATEMENT WILL YOU SAY THAT JESUS WAS IN A PHYSICAL BODY IN HEAVEN PRIOR TO HIS EXISTENCE ON EARTH? DO NOT FORGET THAT THE NATURAL CAME BEFORE THE SPIRITUAL.

Why would the same Apostle Paul who wrote 1 Corinthian still called Christ "A MAN" after His resurrection?

WONDERFUL QUESTION! YOU SHOULD ALSO ASK WHY HE IS STILL REFERRED TO AS JESUS UP TO THIS DAY. YOU KNOW THE NAME, JESUS WAS GIVEN TO HIM ON EARTH. THERE WAS NO MENTION OF THAT NAME IN THE OLD TESTAMENT OR PRIOR TO THE ANGEL'S VISIT. THAT LETTER WAS WRITTEN TO THE CHRISTIANS IN CORINTHIAN WHO PROBABLY NEVER SAW JESUS. IT WAS VITAL TO WRITE IN A MANNER THAT THEY COULD UNDERSTAND.

Reading 1 Corinthian 15 from verse 35 with open mind can solve all your confusion about Christ.

enilove:


Jesus is not going to impersonate the voice of an archangel. What that verse means is that :

1....Jesus will descend and be accompanied by angel Gebriel .
Check for yourself , it is also written " with the trum of God".
Does that make Jesus the TRUMPET OF GOD? No.

It simply means when Jesus will descend , he will have angel Gabriel in his company shouting and the trumpet of God shall be blown.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 KJV
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

2....God is a title This title is also applicable to we humans as per : Exodus 7:1 KJV
And the Lord said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
How much more Jesus our Creator. He as the only begotten Son of God is worthy to be called God.
1Tim2:5 means God Almighty Jehovah is God to our Lord Jesus. Jehovah is Father of our Lord Jesus and also God to him. Just as God is our God and we are also gods.

Jesus says in :

Revelation 3:10-12,20-22 KJV
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
[11] Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
[12] Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name...........
[20] Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
[21] To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
[22] He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

We have one God. Father of our Lord Jesus Christ ,who was with God from the beginning and whose image we were created:

Genesis 1:26 KJV
And God said, Let us make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

PastorAIO:



I mean it in the general dictionary definition sense:

convenience
kənˈviːnɪəns/
noun
noun: convenience

1.
the state of being able to proceed with something without difficulty.
"services should be run to suit the convenience of customers, not of staff"
synonyms: benefit, use, good, comfort, ease, enjoyment, satisfaction
"a shower and toilet were installed for the convenience of swimmers"



Now, what is it that you want to proceed with without difficulty?

Your ideology which you (plural) came to tout even before you read the bible.

That ideology gave you the context for interpreting the text and where you can't make the text fit your preconceived ideology you change the text. A good way is by changing the received translation from the original greek.

I laid out my point here:

https://www.nairaland.com/839087/matter-interpretations

Originakalokalo:



Jesus is not Michael.

I told him but he kicked.

He said Calling Jesus God is a lie.


That is blasphemy.


The fact that one quotes from the Bible does not mean he understands it.

That doctrine of Jesus not being God is from the pit of hell.

...unto us a SON is born. His name Shall be EVERLASTING FATHER.


A SON IS CALLED EVERLASTING.

From Bethlehem a branch of Jesse shall come. WHOSE GOING FORTH HAS BEEN FROM EVERLASTING.


I will advise the op to be very careful.

You are propounding doctrines that seek to belittle Jesus.


I will not be part of it.

Originakalokalo:

Op does not believe in Trinity.
All core believes of the church.
If you want answers to your questions
Read some threads.
I am out.

enilove:
An archangel is the chief angel or senior angel.
This means he is still an angel.
Michael is Michael. His name is not Jesus. Angels are not gods. Jesus Christ is God . It is only God that worths being worshipped. It is a sin to worship angels. As below:


Revelation 19:10 KJV
And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.


But for Jesus , it is not a sin to worship him:

Philippians 2:9-10 KJV
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: [10] That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;


Revelation 1:13-17 KJV
And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. [14] His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were ........[17] And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:


Revelation 5:8-9 KJV
And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. [9] And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;


Michael is an angel .

PastorAIO:

It is very convenient indeed and it is a convenience that is been taken full advantage of to the point that everybody is now a master of utilising this convenience.

analice107:

Very convenient how you pick Scripture out of context assuming and speculating what you think they could mean but conveniently Dodged the ones which clearly says Jesus is not an Angel.

The Holy Spirit foresaw Charles Tass Russell centuries away as a false teacher with the intent to teach error, he gave this revelation;

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
Hebrews:1:3

Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
Hebrews:1:4

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Hebrews:1:5

And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.}
Hebrews:1:6

And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
Hebrews:1:7

But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Hebrews:1:13

Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?
Hebrews:1:14

@lovingjehovah pls explain what the Holy Spirit means by the above verses of scriptures.

Emusan:


I find this part very interesting, so "...A MAN, Christ Jesus" is what Bible says but you belief through your organization that Jesus after His resurrection isn't A MAN but a spirit.

Waiting for how you'll twist this one.

DoctorAlien:


"But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom." Hebrews 1:8

bloodofthelamb:




An infinite being cannot pay for a finite crime... Mankind committed an eternal crime by rebelling against an eternal God... The blood of Michael wouldn't have settled the eternal dispute...

Angel did not die for mankind, God did. Christ is God. The scripture says: in Christ Jesus mankind has been made higher than the Angels including Archangel Michael.

Originakalokalo:



Nice post.

I have some reservations though.

Jesus is a God head.

Don't compare Michael and Jesus.

In hierarchy, Lucifer is even higher than Michael.

Jesus created them all for himself. Michael is an Angel, Jesus is not.

Jesus is the son ..in the Godhead.