₦airaland Forum

1. National IDs - Smaller African nations have well managed citizens' identity systems. Better African nations eg South Africa rely on IDs for everything. No ID, no services. A nation that doesn't know who its citizens are isn't going to be great soon.

2. Borders - Nigeria borders have holes big enough for armoured tanks and armored boats to be illegally brought in. Think about any useful nation in the world with such borders.

3. Alien Nigerians at home and abroad. No one knows the number of Malians or Libyans (a la Fulani herdsmen) who are now carrying Nigerian passport. Thousands of West Afticaners voted in the 2015 elections. They even have national ID cards and of course voters card. Pity most Nigerians can't boast of both.
Do you know lots of criminal Africans abroad claim Nigeria? And they have the passport. Ask if they can easily acquire Moroccan or Egyptian passports (won't mention S. African)

4. Low knowledge syndrome. Nigerians are intelligent but lack information literacy. Why was it easy for bank workers to fall for Ponzi just recently? Those are people who are expected to be knowledgeable. Another example? Which Nigerian university/professor can boast the current FG/state administrations consults them? Low knowledge. How many times have you heard international media talk positively about anything from Nigeria's govt? How many public libraries are in Lagos, the "Centre of Excellence"?

5. Hardcore/unreasonable sentiments. In Nigeria, if he is from my hood, he is OK. Even if he actually is the hood's fool. If she is from my village with a degree in F9, and applies in Lagos where I am, I will easily embrace that F9 degree than a promising and more valuable maven with A grades.


To be continued.

By M.A.D (Make A Difference)

I repeat it, Christians defend yourself.

AntiWailer:
MAy be you watch his video

he said

"Any Fulani Man you see here, slaughter him, kill him"

"How about a fight far away and somebody says any Yoruba Man you see around here, Kill him"

If the second statement make you feel some how, how come the first looks normal to you ?

The violence, death, and mayhem has left for the homes of killers and haters of Christians.

Mujtahida:
They will stay in the comparatively safe enclave of the south and be making statements that can have serious negative reverberations which can lead to violence, death and mayhem for Christians in the North.

Advice taken. But the day you attack an innocent Christian or support the killing of an innocent Christian may be the last.

Austinoiz:
Rightly said BUT Pastor, get it right, OFM workdwide wont do no shit if you get thrown into Daura's cubicle any day.
If they kill you, your people will only grumble fot a week or two and dazzol.

So stop forming COMMANDO...you aint above anything and there wont be consequences other than protest-related deaths of your gullible followers.

When you see a person talk they way you did, it isn't hard to know who they are.

peteruapata:
El-Zakzaky is in custody for daring to stand military authority

Once you claim to be a pastor, you are free, but if you claim to be an Islamic cleric,you are a terrorist!!!! Not your fault, that is what the terrorists and some of the Christian leaders want us to believe and you fell for it..

Are you of the killers of Christians and their supporters?

Aremson14:
What is the difference between this man and shekarau. Shekarau actually decievess people that they are being oppressed by education. He should be declared a criminal

Trust me you don't want to see the days Christians begin to fight back. By the way don't bother asking Christians not to fight back. Most of you here are the same breed that allowed Boko Hiram to become the death it is today.

They killed Mama Bridget and released the suspected killers within six months. That has been happening for ages.

But when people steal pot of stew they are burnt and most people even say good riddance.

Attacks on Christians must stop. Period.

AntiWailer:
See if you recall when they killed people in Kaduna back then that their was reprisal attack in Ogun State.

That is why irresponsible utterances like the one the 'Apostle' said must not be encouraged.

Trust me, you don't want to see a religious clash.

Ask people living in Jos, they will tell the Keyboard Warrior it is not 'reply and click submit' war

Buying a dog, building a fence, forming vigilante, having armed guards - how does that turn to instigating violence. He said to defend. If you aren't out to kill and destroy Christians you need not worry about Apostle Suleiman.

AntiWailer:
it is sad.



Jos Crisis, Ife Modakeke Crisis, Kaduna Crisis all have history. They should be resolved sensibly.


Instigating violence and hiding under defend yourself is not what a responsible 'Man of God' should do.

I am even tired of Nigeria because it is hard to tell who is scared of EFCC, who lost money in MMM, who missed the money GEJ shared back then and who is genuine.

Oh a lie? Just click here so you can update this secondary school 'school of thought'. And maybe you'll stop defending killers and terror. Same Google, thousands of reports.

http://www.google.com/m?hl=en&source=android-browser-type&q=fulani+herdsmen+christian+communities

duni04:
This is a lie. I even indulged you and googled and found nothing of such. This farmer - pastoralist conflict has been on since the 90's. It has taken a more dire and bloodied turn recently, especially since the Jonathan administration and after the boko haram insurgency in the north because the conflicts there and the scarcity of water has forced pastoralists to move south with their cattle in search of grazing land.
We all did this in secondary school. In the dry season pastoralists/herders move south in search of pasture and in the rainy season they move back North when there's more pasture up north and to avoid tsetse flies.
With climate change reducing water availability especially with the drying up of the lake chad, these pastoralists have been forced to move permanently south. A migration pattern that used to be seasonal has now turned permanent.
I remember reading a report by the US AFRICA COMMAND (AFRICOM) in 2007 in which they were forecasting future sources of conflict in Africa. Somalia was mentioned in East Africa, and then they mentioned pastoralists and farmer conflicts in West Africa because of the drying up of major rivers and lakes in West Africa especially the Lake Chad.
So my friend, this is a conflict that is not particular to Nigeria. Its affecting all the countries bordering the lake chad and experiencing water scarcity induced by climate change. How do we resolve this conflict? By using the Ayo Fayose method and turning it into a hate and religious conflict, crying that people are killing Christians which is a lie that even he himself knows?

LaEvilIMiss:
better than going to heaven where you will wear cele gowns carrying a trumpet belting alleluia for all eternity

Which heaven is that? China-heaven?

But let me tell you this - if you have a microsecond flash experience of heaven, you will never see anything in this world as wow ever again.

Go to hell!

Do you get it now? I didn't easily get that it was sarcasm too. People tell you "go to hell" when they don't support what you said or did.

So he said I' going to "hell" cos that's where the good folks are.

I hope that's how he sees it ...

LecciGucci:
Dude im not against his opinion.
Im just suprised he chose hell.
Bcoz no sane person would aslong as u bliv in heaven and hell.
Thats why i asked if hez not into hard drugs.
one can easily say brymo live a decent lifestyle atleast compared to other muscians.
U hardly hear abt him on d negative side.
not into This trending babymama ish and crazy stuff they do in videos Even though its not d yardstick

LIKE I SAID EARLIER Im NOT AGAINST HIS OPINION IM ONLY SHOCKED COZ I DIDNT EXPECT SUCH FROM HIM.

kropotkin2:
Nothing will happen if he arrested
Who the hell does he think he is? Bloodthirsty false prophet of doom

Hell, bloodthirsty, false prophet, doom - all in reference to someone (A. Suleiman) who is genuinely annoyed that nomadic terror is left uncontrolled by the government?

unmask:
Religion is the bane of our society.......do away with it and three quarters of our problems will be solved.......the thieves in political offices and the corporate world occupy the front seats of religious houses

Which religion are you talking about?

ylaa:
cry no more my brother
their reward awaits them
he who kills by sword will and must surely
die same way

Amen, Amen, Thanks.

The 'arguments' we need to have is how herdsman get the right to carry AK47 in the first instance and who sponsors their armoury. A more massive security threat than Boko Haram is nomadic terror.

But then if you Google you will see as usual Christians have been largely targeted. So please it is now 80% religion+ethnic and 20% grazing.

duni04:
Exactly my friend! These are the kinds of arguments we should be having! Do we allow them settle in these communities and build ranches for them there like the Benue State government just did in Agatu, or do we send them back to their communities with their cattle to build ranches for them there? These are the important questions! Not listening to the likes of Fayose and Suileman who want a religious war over something that has absolutely nothing to do with religion.
Hope you see my point now.

saaedlee:


Can you prove to me, that the Federal Government hasn't done anything in response to the senseless killings by Some Fulani Herdsman?

Can you see how the same govt treated Niger Delta militants, IPOB protesters, and Zakzaky's IMN?

But the 3rd or 4th most deadly terrorist group in the world is rather pacified with money by El Rufai.

ylaa:
Have you ever seen any, I mean, any Islamic Teacher, openly saying kill all the Christians? Even though, we know terrorism and violence is synonymous to Islam, I have still not seen one ( I stand to be corrected). They do it in their closets.

they do it in their closet hmmmmm
closet or openset, its wrong
thanks

One cool evening years ago, in the capital of one of the states in the South West, Muslims went on rampage. They attacked the home of an innocent teenager. Others fled. The boy was asleep at home. They killed him in his sleep. Why? Because the young chaps were pasting posters of Reinhard Bonnke crusade.


When I remember, tears come to my eyes. Nobody was brought to justice for that killing by that Muslim mob.

Quote me anywhere, the religion is hate by nature. They don't even need to preach it in the open. They are born into it.

veraponpo:
I wonder oh.

Have you ever seen any, I mean, any Islamic Teacher, openly saying kill all the Christians? Even though, we know terrorism and violence is synonymous to Islam, I have still not seen one ( I stand to be corrected). They do it in their closets.

It is totally wrong to incite violence, especially when you are a leader and you expect the Govt to fold hands?

When trouble comes, it doesn't recognize anybody. It may swallow you, its promoter.

Oyedepo ( my pastor and mentor, unfortunately) and Apostle Suleimon ( I doubt his own calling and anointing) should read their bibles very well.

They are not just God- believers; they are Christians ( Christ-like).

Some modicum of life of Christ is expected from them.

If you read your Bible well, you will not comment anyhow.

Amen

*#Any Nigerian politician who received a single Christian vote to come to power and yet is a sponsor of Jihad against Christians, a sponsor of elimination or subjugation of Christians in Nigeria - must not finish his term in office.*

*#We withdraw his mandate - in the name of Jesus!*

*#Let his seat reject him*.

*#We invoke the blood of the innocent to speak against him;*

*#We invoke the tears of the fatherless and widows to speak against him.#*

We want one million voices to cry to Heaven in this respect - for only one minute .

If you are too holy to pray this, God bless you. If you support this move, do your praying now and then send it out massively. This nonsense must stop. Children of God are precious species. We have a destiny to fulfil on earth. God did not create us to be wasted by evil men. That is why He called Himself the Lord of hosts. That is why He defends Israel and fight for them. If we don't cry to Him for deliberate intervention, we would continue to suffer.
Pass this on.

Blessed

The current venting in the society today isn't against the government; it is against Pastors, and mainly Pentecostal pastors. This phenomenon interests me.

I'll understand if it were the jealous hordes who really wished they were the ones who had access to the 'power', cars, jets etc that a few Pastors have access to. But in this case, it is government/government agents who are now after churches. They are clearly threatened by the Pentecostals influence. But why?

But let's face it, the NG government also sends people to church! How.

1. Terrible Healthcare System - people can't afford healthcare. And even when you can afford, quality care isn't assured. So people (including myself) have to pray and fast that God keep us in health. If you've ever been bitten by the private or public hospitals before, you will understand why we pray and fast for health.

2. Physical and Spiritual Security of Life. Because of heartless politicians and wannabe politicians that engage in human rituals, not to mention their witch-mothers and witch-fathers in the village, Nigerians need a place to go to for security. When police don't have a crisis line, you better find your way to God for Angels.

3. Unemployment. When firstclass results won't get you a job after 5 years, won't you think witches are after you? The solution for most will be to find a prophet somewhere.

4. Admission / the principality called JAMB - of course when you have Nairalanders sharing testimony of admission breakthroughs after 7 years of 'waiting' you'll understand why we pray.

5. Economy-induced late marriage. Bro didn't propose or no bro to propose. Why? I have seen the mean age of marriage rise. It is no longer 20s now, it has hit 30s. May it not hit 40s. When you spend years to seek admission, years to grad, and years to get a job, how will marriage not tarry? So we need to go to the Almighty to help us restore the years the cankerworm (Nigerian government) has stolen.

I can go on ...

What about the fasting and prayers for getting visa (so as to flee Nigeria)? Enemies here and there (such as those who don't want Pastors to 'enjoy' their years of service in the vineyard)? Prayers for business breakthroughs (especially in a recession)? The list is endless.

The government haven't seen anything yet. The number of churches are not enough to accommodate the impact of a govern-less or is it government-less country like Nigeria. The government need not be jealous now. The church offers a solution, the Almighty is working for his people, and the people expect the Almighty to come through for them. Unlike their govt.

The people have no more hope in their government, so they stick to churches. As long as the government remains comatose and people keep seeing the apparent visionlessness, churches will remain overloaded with both real worshipers and those who came for bread and miracles.

The govt is being very ungrateful now. It is time the NG govt thanks the church.

From the thoughts of Make A Difference.

getostar:
Oya tell us about Matthew na. We all want to learn. Secondly master meant Teacher. Stop misinterpreting terms. Jesus was not rich...neither was any disciple. U hv conveniently forgotten all d verses were Jesus talked ab riches.
Let's n even argue too much. Jesus is th only teacher. He has given u the bible which is all u need. Stop following pastors!!!!!!!!

You already made the point. See this https://www.nairaland.com/3511054/christians-alone-know-god-go; and judge whether I 'follow pastors'.

hopefulLandlord:
it seems you're getting this mixed up

you CAN'T be cut off on Nairaland

you'll finish whatever you're typing, attach file(s) you want to and click "submit"

but you can be cut off in real life before even saying a word

for example, this part of your writeup implies that you cut in while they were discussing in agreement

No mixup. I wasn't interested in what they were saying because they weren't analytical. When it got to a point where I saw my silence could be taken for agreement, I spoke out.

delishpot:
I still do not know how going to church schools which are mostly paid schools any differentbfrom attending a non church owned private school. I do not see any thing you gained by just belonging to a church that a non church's person with a good and wise uncle or aunt would not get from paying them a visit.

Ok, let me elaborate a bit. The value churches add to the Nigerian society is immeasurable. Simple.

getostar:
very convenient to quote Jesus christ when it supports ur claim.
shebi Jesus didn't have a home, or a personal donkey, or a armed guards.
please remind me which disciple died peacefully....
ur so called men of god conform to the world...thus they are at peace.
the bible states its clearly, u cant conform to the world n live in 'peace'...cuz the world is evil.

You are one of those people who don't know Jesus at all. I once had to *study* Matthew in the Bible. When I was done, I realised how little I (and most people) knew about Jesus. He had no home ble ble ble; but even the 'big men' of those times called him Master.

hopefulLandlord:
what they mean is that there are churches that use POS, attached is a pic of one such


HOW?


Universities that the average member of that church can't afford to send their children to?

are you sure you were talking to your mates and Superiors? cuz I'm sure someone would've cut you off right here



the professor probably doesn't want argument or they already know you to be very opinionated


good for you but this has next to nothing to do with this


empty

Picture noted, those POS are response to cashless whatever.

You said "re you sure you were talking to your mates and Superiors? cuz I'm sure someone would've cut you off right here"

Cut me off? Well it wasn't a NL discussion where people go on concreteheaded. It was in a place where people know that they only learn where they listen to *different* thinking from the one they were used to.

wirinet:
Your story is misleading and so your conclusion is also misleading. At the end you did nothing to dispel the accusation of Churches (Nigerian) being ponzi schemes.

All those christian institutions you said you benefited from are not recognized as " Nigerian Churches". The typical definition of Nigerian churches are Pentecostal, prosperity preaching, demon casting, tongue speaking and most importantly, tithe emphasizing church, owned by one man, living extravagant life and who has been raised to a status of an infallible god.
Name one Nigerian church that provide the sort of free or cheap services you enjoyed ie hospitals, schools, etc.

Nigerian churches give very little to the youth. In fact they exploit the youth for tithes and offerings and their energy. I have seen youths walking the streets, distributing tracts, selling books and evangelizing for various churches without getting paid one naira. The amount of time nigerian youths waste for church activities would have been better put to use to improving their lives

1. Free is given when free can be given. Millions of people benefit daily from their church. If you are in need and your pastor didnt lend a hand shout out here and I will personally call him to accuse him.

2. Nigerian churches give very little to the youth. Have you ever been to a Nigerian church? Nowhere is there a concern for the youth than in many of these churches that the devils in our midst won't stop blackmailing. There are so many youth around whose only role models are the people they see in church. They have no better example at home or in their community.

3. Nigerian youth waste time for church activities - I salute you! The same church activities that smart Nigerian youth will add to their CV and use to get leadership points in better countries.

thesicilian:
The church is not a Ponzi Scheme, but 90% of Pastors are ponzi schemers

Give me facts, numbers, and empirical arguments to back up this statement and I will send you $90.

getostar:
This write up is very shallow. Did nothing to differentiate the Nigerian church from any ponzi scheme. Every line shows you exactly why our churches esp the prosperity driven ones are nothing but an advanced MMM. Collect from the poor to fed one or some!

Ponzi scheme - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme
A Ponzi scheme (/ˈpɒn.zi/; also a Ponzi game) is a fraudulent investment operation where the operator, an individual or organization, pays returns to its investors from new capital paid to the operators by new investors, rather than from profit earned through legitimate sources.

What is similar between this definition and what I wrote? Please help me out people!

I was invited to dinner one day with a professor of theology and some housemates. The housemates were mainly Nigerians and also theology students (research students). Myself and another lady (a non nigeria) were the only non-theologians there.

During dinner, a discussion (brought up) by our white host went on about Nigerian pentecostal churches. I was quiet. Then it got to the point where the man said Nigerian churches has ATMs etc. Those other guys too went ahead saying all sorts of things. And here are research students who were supposed to be more fact-powered rather than assumptions and insinuations.

But at one point I couldn't take it anymore, I really don't know what triggered me to make corrections. So I started by telling the man there was no church I know with an ATM. Secondly, the leadership of mega churches motivates millions of Nigerian youths (and only those who have insight will understand this fact). I explained to him the role those ATM-churches play in the society, mentoring Nigerian youths.

The role of 'ATM-churches' as he was calling them in providing an avenue for young people to be responsible - you'll see them in church engaged in one activity or the other. Such is very important in a country where government can't provide any recreational amenities.

I explained to him how churches are turning out desirable graduates through their universities. Those universities which had added so much value to Nigeria's higher education.

The next thing that came from this professor was in agreement, suddenly he remembered and mentioned a research report he had read that said the churches had serious and meaningful impact.

Those other guys went silent. I left that place satisfied I wasn't an 'omo ale to fowo osi juwe ile' - Yorubas say that phrase when they want to make a point that you can't rubbish them. If only because I was Nigerian, I wouldn't allow him rubbish things bigger than him - in his country they don't have a 'vibrant church' like in Nigeria by the way.

Beyond that, I have also been a beneficiary. I was born in Our Lady ... Hospital, went to St ... Nursery School, then was in St John/Marys for JSS and then was in Wesley ... of Science for my SSS. Am sure I would have attended a private church varsity if there were any then.

So go on and liken churches to Ponzi, it just shows which side your brain(s) operates from.

I have always read how people cry when they see pastors enjoying, crying that they are fleecing members. By the way go and see thousands of pastors in villages etc giving their time and little personal incomes to their society. Of course you won't see those ones, you will only see a few 1. .. 2... 3... 4 ... which your short-range social media vision permits you to see with so called riches and affluence.

Do you know how much the total offerings in most churches are? If you want to see how 'easy' it is, don't even bother to start a church; just go to the next door church that is about to fold up. Start a church for the sake of money and you'll be well into money rituals to bail you out before you finish saying In Jes' name.

Those that really give in churches never come around to complain; at least I am yet to see one complain. And I don't mean 'fake' givers who will carry their money in a tray to the pastor's nose so they will be saluted.

No one has ever said I gave to church and my life became grounded as a result of my giving. And check sincere givers, as they give to church, they give to society, they give all around. It is a spirit, simple. Just like being stingy is one (like most people who complain about Christian giving naturally are).

I got a new thought in my mind today, and it further strengthened my resolve to do whatever I can when I have. Not far from me is a RCCG church, I sort of just considered the structure and the facilities. How will I go into a nice environment (donated by someone), sit inside the comfy place fitted with conditioners, sit on comfy chairs ... etc. Meet nice people etc. Listen to music accompanied with ... for free?

Never! God forbid. I won't be a parasite. Some people spent their funds to make me have a comfortable place to worship. I won't be a user. No. When I thought about it this morning, I decided whether anyone asks me for money or not, I won't be a 'taker', a user, a chancer, an opportunist, a gold-digger. Never. I will also contribute something anywhere I find myself.

So, there are various reasons why people give in church. I just stated one of the reasons why I will always give. No matter how much you count and 'wail' over private jets or private rockets (hopefully one church will have a private rocket soon for space evangelism), people will still give.

Call them (us) mumu, it doesn't matter. If you ever read about an Alabaster box, people had been lavishing on the gospel before y(our) forefathers.

By the way I am totally anti-chancer (in case you are a real or fake pastor who uses church offering to buy popcorn and groundnut); if you are reading this don't think I wrote it in support of ....... like you. Better repent before your stomach bursts!