₦airaland Forum

AjanleKoko: Well, during that period, I did both short term trading (using a broker), and I did value investing as well.
I started in 2001, signed up with a broker, and opened a trading account which is still active till date. Also started doing commercial papers with Denham at the time.

I also particpated in a lot of the post-consolidation IPOs, a[b]nd private placements.[/b] Also did mutual funds with ARM (Discovery, Aggressive Growth), and IBTC Equity, which are still active, though the AGF and IBTC Equity took major hits as a result of the stock market tank in 2009.

Most of my blue chip stocks were bought off the secondary market, like Guinness, WAMCO, Nestle, etc., as well as public offers for FBN, GT Bank, Oando, WAPCO Lafarge, and a host of others. Also did private placements with the likes of IGI, ARM Properties (which is why some of us support the toll road )

I took a break in 2009 to focus on real estate, mostly due to the crash of the markets. This had mixed results. I lost a significant amount of money on some very bad buys and also suffered due to lack of information about the dynamics of the market. Also have money stuck in some of the frozen projects along the Lekki-Epe expressway, but still managed to make some valuable purchases. Which forms my conclusion that the real estate industry is still in embryo stage, not even infancy. You have to get down and dirty to make it in real estate.

I've also done some private equity investing in ventures within and outside Nigeria, which is beginning to show some positive results. But these days I am starting to trade actively on the short sell. The market is starting to pick up again, so some coins can still be made there

That means you were one of the investors that sold their blue chip stocks to invest in Private placements. How are the private Placements doing.

Private Placement and over priced Public Offers were the major scam used to defraud the gullible retail investors.

Redoil: apart from the banking stocks which other sector do you think is profitable

Cement manufacturing stocks, Agricultural stocks like Okomu and Presco, Pharmaceutical sector, Food and beverages sector.

If the power generating firms are privatised, it wont be a bad idea to invest in them.


Banking stocks like FBN, GTB, Zenith and may be UBA are okay at the current prices. I only have my reservations for the management style of Tony, but Tony is no longer in the bank.

We have a lot of stocks that we can all analyse and discuss about.

Xsolutions: @Manie:Thank's for opening this thread...i believe this is going to be one of the best nairaland thread ever.
Pls for some of us who don't really know our 'left from right' as per Shares,could you turn this thread to your virtual classroom?
Thanks.
Besides...what's the difference btw Shares and Stocks??

I think they are the same. I think Americans call shareholders, stockholders.

AjanleKoko: You know, I did that N600 NBL analysis.
Even if the stock was priced at 1 naira a share back then (which was impossible in 1972), and the company did a 1:1 every four years since then, you would have ended up with around 307,000 shares today (2013).

Though you could argue that N600 (300 Nigerian pounds) in 1972 was most people's six months or 1 year salary. A brand new car in 1972 (Opel Kadett), bought by my father, sold for less than one thousand Nigerian pounds.

Did you take into consideration when the par value of shares on the exchange was changed from N1.00 to 50k per share.

Even at that 307,000 units of NB shares will be worth almost N50 Million, not bad for an investment of N600 some 41 years ago.

AjanleKoko: Hmm.

I have these kinds of conversations with my broker all the time. Over time, I learnt to listen rather than debate. And I was very active on the market between 2000 and 2009, so 90% of the information manie is providing is not news to me. Not news, and very valid. People who want to, should listen and learn. So far what I have read is very positive.

Please share your experience with us, i don't want to be the only person doing the talking.

Were you a short term trader, long term investor, or you do a combination of both.

I have 4 stock broking accounts, that were used for different purposes, trading, long term investment and real estate investment.

sixteen08: The fact that a lot of people got burnt in the stock market in recent past don't make manie's points slightly untrue or invalid....the stock market is still a viable machinery for wealth creation with enormous potentials anyday anytime in as much as you do your home work right (like the saying in economics "there is no free lunch,its either you are paying or someone else is" i guess we'll just have to see the stock market either way (as a glass half full or half empty). The stock market is a highly volatile money making terrain and d last time I checked " no pain no gain" "no guts no glory"
@mannie has been on the positive side of the market and he's seeing the glass half full(he's got d right to) and I'd be glad if he (mannie) also share some of his investment downsides too so people can actually see he is not as perfect as they think.

My 2 cents
God bless us all.

Wema Bank, OANDO, Intercontinental, Union Bank were some of my worst investments, but generally the market has been good to me.

AjanleKoko: You know, I did that N600 NBL analysis.
Even if the stock was priced at 1 naira a share back then (which was impossible in 1972), and the company did a 1:1 every four years since then, you would have ended up with around 307,000 shares today (2013).

Though you could argue that N600 (300 Nigerian pounds) in 1972 was most people's six months or 1 year salary. A brand new car in 1972 (Opel Kadett), bought by my father, sold for less than one thousand Nigerian pounds.

You now know why some retirees have stocks running into hundreds of millions or billions of Naira.

bigx: Apart from the media hype, did you ever take time to study the annual reports from these companies? it helps,
If you don't take time to learn the necessary skills and practice to build a bridge you would never build anything solid, same with the stock market, there is a lot you need to learn about it before putting 1 naira inside.

Stock market investment is an intellectual business that involves a lot of study, if you are not ready to do this do not put your more into stocks.

There is no investment that does not require study, but Nigerians are generally lazy. We do not blame ourselves for our mistakes, we always blame others for our mistakes.


According to Barrack Obama, our destiny is not written for us, but written by us.

Nobody will make us financially independent, we are the one to devise means and strategies that will make us to be legitimately financially independent.

Redoil: though you are doing a great job but let us be truthful to ourself. Intecontinental was having the highest share price in the banking industries oceonic was being given award for the best performing bank afribank was a very large bank, costain was the second largest construction compay and a host of others. Finnaly if you compare and contrast the gains from the stock market to that of nigeria inflation, where are we going to stand

Returns from the stock market over the last 30 years is far more than inflation.

Redoil: though you are doing a great job but let us be truthful to ourself. Intecontinental was having the highest share price in the banking industries oceonic was being given award for the best performing bank afribank was a very large bank, costain was the second largest construction compay and a host of others. Finnaly if you compare and contrast the gains from the stock market to that of nigeria inflation, where are we going to stand

Intercontinental sold for close to N50.00 before the crash, the fundamentals of the company do not support the price, Oceanic and Afribank did not do better either. Shoreline owned by the Karim Brothers became the new core investors in Costain and we saw the price move from about N2.00 to over N30.00 within few months, yet the company did not have any audited result.

Penny stocks became the in-thing people were selling blue chip stocks to invest in penny stocks like Constain, Afroil, Capital Oil, Private Placement like Geo fluid, Tetrazini, IIA etc. Investors threw caution to the wind and people like us were referred to as old school investors. Forgetting that the stock marlket is not a Casino, but a market where firms come to raise fund for their businesses and investors share in the returns from these businesses.

Reference: And can you tell what government policy will do next to your portfolio. I mean Sanusi's actions are still hotly debated today and you prescribed their stocks when a postmortem hasn't been done.

Look at the effect of Obasanjo's policy on the importation of fruit juice or cement.

The policy on the importation of fruit juice created wealth for companies like Chivita, Fumman etc. it also led to investment by MNC in that sector.

The policy on cement led to capacity building by WAPCO, CCNN, Ashaka Cement and Dangote Cement. I saw the price of WAPCO move from N8.00 to the current price of N71

Josh121: Manie Morning sir , what are the good stocks with fundamental that are selling on discount please list , i want to add to my portfolio. Thanks

If you can not detect the curent stocks that are selling at discount out please stick to mutual funds, or money market investment.

Lilimax: Better put former MD/CEO of UAC-Mr Ayo Ajayi as he is no longer the MD/CEO. The current MD/CEO of UAC is Mr Larry Etta.

manie: UAC was a rejected stone in 2000, the company was undergoing serious turn around. The MD/CEO in person of Mr. Ajayi shifted the focus of the company to food, logistics and the real estate subsidiaries.



Was Larry Ettah the person who shifted the focus of UAC to foods, logistics and real estate in 2000. The answer is no.

Reference: Hmm. Lies, damn lies and statistics. Anyway we've not considered the biggest daddy of them all - inflation. Manie can you kindly adjust for inflation and re-contextualize.

Thanks and God bless you.


In the investment world few are called and fewer are chosen. You don't have to invest in the the stock market, there are other investments that suit your temperament, risk tolerance and intellect.

Reference: Hmm. Lies, damn lies and statistics. Anyway we've not considered the biggest daddy of them all - inflation. Manie can you kindly adjust for inflation and re-contextualize.

The ASI grew from 100 to over 28,000 in 29 years. This is a growth of 27,000%, giving an annualized growth rate of over 23%, when the market is appropriately priced the annual growth rate we increase to 30 or more.

I don't think inflation rate over the last 30 years is more than an average of 10%

Redoil: oando went for ipo at 75 naira, it is now 17 naira under some scammer which i will not mention thier name. Transcop 7naira formaly .50kobo nown 1.50 naira Daar is almost dead intercontinental bank, oceonic bank, bankphb, costain west africa etc. All these ones are dead or reduced to ground zero. Finnaly statistics lies a lot, about the all share index, all those figure you are seeing were cooked up to show the outside world that we are moving.

it actually did the offer at N95.00k, do not forget that you have enjoyed bonuses on your investment in OANDO, but all the same I think the management of OANDO could have done better.

We over paid when we bought OANDO for N95.00 and the right issue for N70.00 some years back. We bought based on the growth picture painted by Wale and co, but generally the stock market is a good route towards attaining financial independence.

Redoil: oando went for ipo at 75 naira, it is now 17 naira under some scammer which i will not mention thier name. Transcop 7naira formaly .50kobo nown 1.50 naira Daar is almost dead intercontinental bank, oceonic bank, bankphb, costain west africa etc. All these ones are dead or reduced to ground zero. Finnaly statistics lies a lot, about the all share index, all those figure you are seeing were cooked up to show the outside world that we are moving.

Did you analyse OANDO, Transcorp, Costain, Bank PHB etc before you committed fund, it is very obvious that you are not ready or willing to learn how to value a company, therefore I will advice you to only invest in Mutual funds, money market instrument or real estate. Most people over paid for investment be it stock or real estate during the last bull era. Smart investors that are currently buying are under paying for good stocks, that are selling at a discount.


You do not need to wait for the statistics from NSE, tou can also do your personal research. The ASI mirrors the total average performance of the market, a number of good stock did far better than the ASI performance, and some badly managed companies under performed the ASI.

[quote author=K,k]National sports lottery. I bought them 2008[/quote]Very sorry about that. Why did you invest in the company? I always advice starters to invest in companies with track records, I don't know the records of NSL nor the growth potential of NSL.

sixteen08: @manie ur doing a great job *thumbs up*

God bless U

Thank you sir.

ogalanya: Pls maine, what of dunlop shares? Its been dormant on 50k everyday, no up or down movement. Any hope of resurrection?

I am not too sure. Government policy really affected the performance of Dunlop, that is why investors and corporate managers need to be conversant with happenings in the business environment.

Peterwins: "Over 2 million units of NB shares were sold yesterday" is an incomplete information in the context of my comment/query. I would have sincerely appreciated it if you had completed the statement by stating the number of deals that transpired in order to properly inform naive investors . It may surprise you to know that those that bought 100,000 units and above in a single deal in yesterday's transaction where institutional investors. Most individual investors don't get a chance to purchase these stocks in large quantities even with available cash. You may be lucky to get even 10,000 units.

I was a bit miffed when you said you could have purchased 3,000,000 units of NB shares in 2007 as if the quantity of the stock was readily available to individual investors. If you had mentioned bank/insurance stocks I would have agreed with you because they were in abundant supply in 2007.

The daily average quantities of tradeable stocks like Nestle, Cadbury, Guinness,Unilever, etc are quite limited compared to financial industry stocks. This can easily and readily confirmed. The financial sub-sector have the highest quantity of tradeable stocks in the NSE.

It would have taken you several months (if not over a year) to have purchased 3,000,000 units of NB shares as an individual investor in 2007. You would have needed to purchase an average of 250,000 units of NB shares a month for 12 consecutive months in 2007 to acquire 3 million units. A rare stunt for an individual investor back then.

There is a need for proper information.

Who are your stock brokers? I will advice you to sack them and move over to mine. I use stock brokers that controls 60% of the trade on the exchange.

I stand to be corrected 3 million units of NB be shares can be bought within maximum of 10 trading days in 2007. Do not forget that the stocks that were never available in 2006 to 2008 were the banking and insurance stocks.

A lot of gullible investors sold their blue chip stocks like NB, Guinness, Unilever, PZ, Total< Flour Mill to invest in Private Placements between 2006 and 2008. That was why these stocks had attractive PE ratios because they were on offer.

manie: This is the historical performance of the All Share Index from 1984 to date



Year ASI % gain or loss
1984 105 5
1985 127 21
1986 163 28
1987 190 16
1988 233 23
1989 325 39
1990 513 58
1991 783 53
1992 1107 41
1993 1543 39
1994 2205 43
1995 5092 131
1996 6992 37
1997 6440 (
1998 5672 (12)
1999 5266 (7)
2000 8111 54
2001 10963 35
2002 12137 11
2003 20129 66
2004 23844 18
2005 24085 1
2006 33189 38
2007 57990 74
2008 31450 (46)
2009 20827 (33)
2010 24770 19
2011 20730 (16)
2012 28079 35

Looking at the performance of the stock market from 1984 to 2012, we will discover that the market lost 6 times out of 29.
That means the market gained 23 times out of 29, giving 80% success rate over the last 29 years.

manie: I also invest in real estate and I know how cumbersome it is. You need a high capital to start a real estate investment in Nigeria, artisans are not reliable nor readily available, Omo onile and their palaver, stress of getting title to your property. I have not gotten title to the property I bought since 2001. Difficulties in getting building approval, issues of multiple taxation from local government and state government etc.

When you do not have a title to your property, you can not use the property as a collateral whenever you need funds to multiply your wealth.

manie: If you do not know how to pick and invest in under valued stock you should have invested in the index.

The ASI gained 54% in 2000, this may be due to the return of democratic rule.
It gained another 35% in 2001, it gained 11% in 2002 and gained 66% in 2003.

The market gained 18% in 2004, the market was flat in 2005, the market gained 38% in 2006,the market gained 74% in 2007.


The market lost 46% in 2008, it also lost 33% in 2009.


The market gained 19% in 2010.

The market lost 16% in 2011.

The market gained 35% in 2012.



From Jan 1st 2013 to date the market has gained 19%.

Redoil: Manie thier are lot of kwestions about the stock (scam) performance you can not answer. I can see that only those stocks that were able survive the scam b4 proper regulation came into existence you are proud of analysing and they are just 3% of the stock (scam) market. What about those that never survive the scam 97% analyse them and let us see.

If you do not know how to pick and invest in under valued stock you should have invested in the index.

The ASI gained 54% in 2000, this may be due to the return of democratic rule.
It gained another 35% in 2001, it gained 11% in 2002 and gained 66% in 2003.

Redoil: Manie thier are lot of kwestions about the stock (scam) performance you can not answer. I can see that only those stocks that were able survive the scam b4 proper regulation came into existence you are proud of analysing and they are just 3% of the stock (scam) market. What about those that never survive the scam 97% analyse them and let us see.

This is the historical performance of the All Share Index from 1984 to date



Year ASI % gain or loss
1984 105 5
1985 127 21
1986 163 28
1987 190 16
1988 233 23
1989 325 39
1990 513 58
1991 783 53
1992 1107 41
1993 1543 39
1994 2205 43
1995 5092 131
1996 6992 37
1997 6440 (
1998 5672 (12)
1999 5266 (7)
2000 8111 54
2001 10963 35
2002 12137 11
2003 20129 66
2004 23844 18
2005 24085 1
2006 33189 38
2007 57990 74
2008 31450 (46)
2009 20827 (33)
2010 24770 19
2011 20730 (16)
2012 28079 35

Redoil: Manie thier are lot of kwestions about the stock (scam) performance you can not answer. I can see that only those stocks that were able survive the scam b4 proper regulation came into existence you are proud of analysing and they are just 3% of the stock (scam) market. What about those that never survive the scam 97% analyse them and let us see.

Let me know the scam, which of the stocks did you buy between 2000 and 2003.

HAH: What happen in the nigerian stock(scam) market is that they: Rob Peter to pay Paul, now some here may be paul and some peters.

Unfortunately I happen to be a peter cos I was rob of my hard earned income of about 15 million now worth less than 500k mostly in the banking sector.

The stock brokers will always give you an advice to go for particular stock just for it to start dwindling after small time.

To cut long story short I will never invest in. The stock market, I rather take my destiny in my hand by going into real estate,or commodity market.

I also invest in real estate and I know how cumbersome it is. You need a high capital to start a real estate investment in Nigeria, artisans are not reliable nor readily available, Omo onile and their palaver, stress of getting title to your property. Difficulties in getting building approval, issues of multiple taxation from local government and state government etc.

HAH: What happen in the nigerian stock(scam) market is that they: Rob Peter to pay Paul, now some here may be paul and some peters.

Unfortunately I happen to be a peter cos I was rob of my hard earned income of about 15 million now worth less than 500k mostly in the banking sector.

The stock brokers will always give you an advice to go for particular stock just for it to start dwindling after small time.

To cut long story short I will never invest in. The stock market, I rather take my destiny in my hand by going into real estate,or commodity market.

Don't base your investment decisions solely on recommendation from your stock broker, Religious leaders, Investment advisers etc. Take time to do your personal research, but Nigerians are lazy we always want the easy and blame others for our failures.

KingPradas: Oga what about unity bank. I had share since with them dont know there value now

What value did you see in Unity bank when you committed your funds? I don't have unity bank shares because i don't like their business model, organisational structure and management.

manie: What is NSL?I don't know about this stock.

I will not advice a starter to ever buy penny stock, invest in companies with track records that are currently selling at a discount, most banking stocks are currently in this category, learn how to value a stock or a company, read about investment and the economy as a whole, network with fellow investors, stock market investment should be a long term investment, if you want short term returns it i8s better to buy treasury bills, bonds and other money market investment.

As a matter of fact I don't buy penny stocks.

[quote author=K,k]As an undergraduate, I bought 2000 units of NSL. I have been to a couple of stoke brokers and non of them can give me any information on the status of this stock, I have not heard from NSL too. What is the market value of the stock now and how can I get my money back.[/quote]What is NSL?I don't know about this stock.

I will not advice a starter to ever buy penny stock, invest in companies with track records that are currently selling at a discount, most banking stocks are currently in this category, learn how to value a stock or a company, read about investment and the economy as a whole, network with fellow investors, stock market investment should be a long term investment, if you want short term returns it i8s better to buy treasury bills, bonds and other money market investment.