₦airaland Forum

pappilo: Fantastic thread Mannie Fresh

Hindsight is a biyatch!

As a young man fresh out of Uni with personal funds of approximately N1 million back in 2001, I wish I had invested N500,000 into Nigeria Breweries back then. My investment would be worth about N15 million now according to your calculations

Man chose to buy a Skirach and travel to London with the money instead. Well, in my next life I wont make the same mistake.

It is never too late to make amend.

Opeoluwaadewole: pls can somebody help me calculate my gtb shares of 10000unit with dividend warrant since 2004 ipo till date.

Did you have 10,000 units in 2004, if you did your units of GTB shares must have grown to about 50,000 units in 2013.
As an investor you need to keep a record of the income from your investment.

AjanleKoko: 'Good stocks', hmm. Everybody has said a lot about 'good stocks'. A young salaried employee certainly would not have the time or ability to watch stock market movement and accurately predict stock performance, unless he or she happens to be an investment professional themselves. Besides, wouldn't you rely mostly on the advice of a broker, who you will pay?

It's safer for someone young and largely ignorant to invest in bonds and commercial papers, or mutual funds to start with. For both investments, you don't need to pay anyone for advice. Many of the mutual funds have consistently outperformed the capital markets over time, they have a significantly low threshold of entry (ARM Discovery has an entry point of something like 10 thousand naira), and you can monitor the performance easily, unlike having to rely on a broker who's going to take a cut of your profits.
More importantly, you can cash out at any time.

The real estate question - real estate is much more complicated than the stock market to manage. The entry point for investment is much higher. There's no real estate index to monitor, and the market is 100% unregulated. People with greater means than the OP have lost significant amounts of money on real estate in Lagos. I know this one first hand.

The best way to learn about the market is to start small, invest regularly, read about the company and be interested in business news, and youth should change their orientation from short term thinking to long term thinking.

AjanleKoko: 'Good stocks', hmm. Everybody has said a lot about 'good stocks'. A young salaried employee certainly would not have the time or ability to watch stock market movement and accurately predict stock performance, unless he or she happens to be an investment professional themselves. Besides, wouldn't you rely mostly on the advice of a broker, who you will pay?

It's safer for someone young and largely ignorant to invest in bonds and commercial papers, or mutual funds to start with. For both investments, you don't need to pay anyone for advice. Many of the mutual funds have consistently outperformed the capital markets over time, they have a significantly low threshold of entry (ARM Discovery has an entry point of something like 10 thousand naira), and you can monitor the performance easily, unlike having to rely on a broker who's going to take a cut of your profits.
More importantly, you can cash out at any time.

The real estate question - real estate is much more complicated than the stock market to manage. The entry point for investment is much higher. There's no real estate index to monitor, and the market is 100% unregulated. People with greater means than the OP have lost significant amounts of money on real estate in Lagos. I know this one first hand.

You are right, I have real estate investment and stock market investment, and I know that my real estate investment is more difficult to manage.
I bought a plot of land at Abijo in Ajah axis in 2001 for about 120k. Although the land is now worth 6 million Naira, I have spent more than 1 million Naira to Omo onile for foundation, roofing, fencing, borehole etc. I have also spent money to get my building plan from government all to no avail, even though I have built a three bed room bungalow on the plot of land.

Fashola wants us to pay more than 4 million Naira to get ratification for our plots of land, it is after this is paid that we have be given building approval and title to the property. Without title to a property you can not use the asset to secure loan from financial institutions.


Whereas if the 120k used in buying the plot of land in 2001 was invested in Nestle shares, the investment should be worth close to 9 Million naira excluding dividend received.
If I add the money paid to Omo Onile, processing of land document and the over million spent on erecting the building, may be if I had used all these money investing in good stocks from 2001 to date my investment would be worth some tens of millions of Naira. Main while my tenant pays less than 700k per annum.

AjanleKoko: 'Good stocks', hmm. Everybody has said a lot about 'good stocks'. A young salaried employee certainly would not have the time or ability to watch stock market movement and accurately predict stock performance, unless he or she happens to be an investment professional themselves. Besides, wouldn't you rely mostly on the advice of a broker, who you will pay?

It's safer for someone young and largely ignorant to invest in bonds and commercial papers, or mutual funds to start with. For both investments, you don't need to pay anyone for advice. Many of the mutual funds have consistently outperformed the capital markets over time, they have a significantly low threshold of entry (ARM Discovery has an entry point of something like 10 thousand naira), and you can monitor the performance easily, unlike having to rely on a broker who's going to take a cut of your profits.
More importantly, you can cash out at any time.

The real estate question - real estate is much more complicated than the stock market to manage. The entry point for investment is much higher. There's no real estate index to monitor, and the market is 100% unregulated. People with greater means than the OP have lost significant amounts of money on real estate in Lagos. I know this one first hand.

What happened to Naira cost averaging, with that you do not have to bother your self with the daily stock price movement, what about value investing. A number of stocks are currently selling at a great discount compared to their intrinsic values. Tell me an average salary earner who made his money legitimately and was able to retire with a net-worth that runs into hundreds or millions or billions of Naira and I will tell that that average worker invested in the market during his working days in the 70s, 80s and 90s. If I tell you the value of N600 invested in Nigerian breweries shares in 1972 you will never believe the worth of that investment.

Rather than investing in bond or treasury bill, I think a mutual fund will be better. Treasury bills and bonds are basically money market investment that should be for the short term. Investment for the next 15 to 30 years should be in stocks and real estate.

Onuels: @olusho, I eagerly follow your topic. But u talked abt sports trading. Cud u emphasize on it. Thanks.

Please don't go there, invest your money in legitimate and visible ventures that have the ability to satisfy consumer wants.

DictatorZAR: I've been reading through that business day report and I can't stop laughing. Now here is another report which states the opposite.
http://sustainablecitiescollective.com/futurecapetown/124706/will-nigeria-overtake-south-africa-africa-s-powerhouse

Anybody who is not fully invested in this economy will have his or her self to blame in 6 to 10 years.

AjanleKoko: Very good analysis, done for free
A classic case of high risk high returns presented here.
In my view, anyone who's earning a salary has no need of a high-risk investment. If you're earning a salary, and you have enough idle income to invest, why do you need an investment like Keke NAPEP? Your daily needs should be taken care of by your salary.

What you need is a secure investment that doesn't depreciate in value and doesn't require significant maintenance overhead. Your Keke NAPEP is likely to earn good returns, most of which will likely go into maintenance, repairs, settling touts and police, etc, as well as pilfering by your driver. Plus the equipment itself will depreciate very quickly in value.

The bonds or TBs are assets that you could even borrow against if you need to in the future. Try getting a loan from any financial institution with your Keke NAPEP as collateral

Have you considered the effect of inflation on the the bond. I will not advice a young man to have more than 20% of his asset in bond, his assets and income should be invested in developing himself, buying good stocks and real estate. He should have a long term view when making his investment decisions over a period of 10 years or more investments in stocks or real estate will out perform investment in bond or treasury bill.
Enduring wealth can only be built by having a long term perspective whenever it comes to investment.

manie: Can somebody give us the performance of Flour mills from 2001 to 2013

I also got a bonus of 1 for 3 in 2006,another bonus of 1 for 10 in 2010. Yet Flour Mills is now selling at over N70 per share.

ocman: stay away from nigerian stocks. if u have ear hear it now. STAY AWAY FROM THE STOCK MARKET, STAY AWAY FROM ALL THESE INVESTMENT AND ASSETS MANAGEMENT COMPANIES, DON'T SAY I DIDN'T WARN YOU. YOU CAN BUY FGN TREASURE BILLS, BUY LANDS AND SAVE THE REST STAY IN YOUR ACCOUNT AS SAVINGS. IT IS BETTER THAN YOU CRYING AND HAVING SLEEPLESS NIGHTS OVER YOUR HARD-EARNED MONEY IN SOMEONE'S DISPOSAL WITH NO HOPE OF RETURNING

What happened to those who bought Nigerian Breweries at N40 in 2009 and it is selling for N165, Unilever for N8 in 2009 and it selling for N44, Okomu Oil for N10 in 2009 and it is selling for N61, Flour Mills for N20 and it currently selling at over N70, NESTLE at less than N300 in 2009 currently selling at over N800

You need to learn how to detect under valued stocks, you also need to learn how to value a stock or a company, you need to invest in the growth sector of the economy, you also need to invest in companies with track records of giving good returns. Do not invest on hot stocks, or invest based on recommendation from your pastor.

kay1983: Hello All, interesting to stumble at this sitem a share was transfer to me sum yrs ago by a friend. A Gtb shares. I went to the registrar to confirm it then. And wit their help I was able to locate the stockbroker who printed the statement for me but could nt find it again. Also, I attempted selling but they told me the account has a debit balance. When I went back, they have relocated. What do I do?

Take the statement to CSCS or the registrars from there they will be able to give you the appropriate advice.

Omexonomy: Uacn property are selling IPO 10 naira per unit and a minimum of 10,000 unit. Now my kwestions are:

thier price per unit on the stock list is 15 naira

why have they chosen to make it minimum of ten thousand unit for start

how profitable will it be in future

finally, how encouraging is it to buy.

What UAC Property is currently selling is a REIT. Real Estate Investment Trust. The shares of the REIT is different from that of the company.

Seun: Another way to earn 10 million naira in 10 years is to simply save 8,333 naira naira per month. Anyone can start doing this, even young graduates. And don't forget that 1 million in ten years will be worth much less than 1 million naira is worth right now.

And the money you have invested can't be used for other things. But - then again, you say that the stocks can be used as collateral for a bank loan. This is interesting to an entrepreneur.

It is the ideal collateral by most financial institutions. Most especially if your have liquid stocks like Nigerian Breweries, Guiness, FBN, Zenith, GTB, Flour Mills, Unilever, UACN, WAPCO etc.

IAH: Exactly! That's what I'm saying. You can't make your millions from scratch through shares investment. Well, maybe it's possible after like 80 years sha, your millions from shares will meet you in the grave.

I disagree with you. What will you say about Akintunde Asalu, he started investing in the stock market at the age of 21, based on his holdings he retired at the age of 37 to concentrate on managing his portfolio.

Chuks0485: I have AP shares (though not that much,just 108 units) and for over 15 years i have not heard from them, had wanted selling it in the year 2006 but was told that i cannot sell it( reason i think is that NSC placed a ban on the sales of AP shares then)can someone please tell me what to do about it.

Have you dematerialized your shares, if not get a stock broker who will assist you in opening a CSCS stock broking account.

You can only sell your shares through a stock broker. The registrars of AP is on Broad Street Lagos.

saibuhari: Icon8 says gtb will pay dividend of 1.50 but manie says its going to be 1.60.who should we believe? Icon8 sounded more authoritative.

We are both speculating based on last year's payment and the expected EPS of N2.70 for GTB.

Paying either, N1.50, N1.60 or even N1.80 as dividend is very possible.

When I am blessed enough to throw money around.

elvis10ten: 7th i didn't say i want to use the investor money to hire employees or spend unwisely. I said i needed it for expansion and to implement our new idea.

It is easier said than done, that is why your pedigree in business is important. I said getting a small loan and paying before due date is one of the ways of building your credit worthiness.

elvis10ten: 2nd you said microsoft was funded by family members and close friends. But this says it was self-funded. He advised to take money from investors.

If a start up company is self-funded, that means they did not get outside fund from an angel investor. Even before an angel investor invests in a company some structures and systems ought to be in place.

remzytimer: I have bank PHB and Fin. Bank's share, are they still quoted in d stock market and at what value. Pls advice on what to do them

These are dead stocks.

I will advice to subscribe for e-dividend. Find time and make a personal visit to the registrars.

Ekans: Who is talking of bank shares and dividends?,they only know how to syphon peoples money for the ogas at the top.Buy nestle or guinness shares and you wont be sorry.Please quote me.

Those stocks are currently over valued, do your research an investment in under valued stocks that have very good fundamentals but are currently selling at a discount.

amokemi: @ manie, I like your analysis, but you failed woefully in all your estimates. If it is that easy then we will all be multi millionares by now.

As per the question, FBN financials should be released in about two weeks time.
Enjoy your day dream.

Where did I fail, did you buy FBN shares in 2001. I did, and I have been reinvesting my dividends from FBN for close to 2 decades.


If you are in doubt go to First Registrars and make inquiries about the capitalisation history of FBN from 2001 to date.

hayoakins: This is a joke, right?

Scrutinize all my posts and you will find out that i don't post what I am not sure off.

[quote author=OK_2_NV]1.50k will that cover the postage?[/quote]The N1.50k is per share. If you have 10,000 units that means you will have a dividend of N13,500 after removing the 10% with holding tax

jposuagwu: Is Guaranty Trust Bank Going To Pay Dividend And Bonus This Year?

Please does anyone know what GTB and FBN are likely going to do this year in terms of bonus and dividend? Information about what Zenith bank will do is already out why is there no info about what GTB is going to do this current year? Please share any gist you have.

We should get the needed information, latest by 2nd week in April 2013

jidebobo: FBN bonus is out .I received mine yesterday.

Which bonus are you talking about?

[quote author=K,k]Shares still exist!? Or you talking about something else [/quote]They don't exist.

N102,000 will buy 20,000 units of GTB in 2001. This 20,000 units would have grown to 140,000 units valued at N3.4 Million in 2013.

GTB should pay a minimum dividend of N1.60k

140,000 units of GTB will have a dividend after with holding tax of roughly N200,000

First Bank should pay a minimum of N1.20k per share.

100k will buy 25,000 units in 2001. This 25,000 units would have grown to 195,000 units valued at over N3.8 million in 2013.

A dividend of N1.20 per share will give a dividend after with holding tax of N210,600. This is not bad for an investment of 100k

When and if you get an infusion of real money from investors, what should you do with it? Not spend it, that's what. In nearly every startup that fails, the proximate cause is running out of money. Usually there is something deeper wrong. But even a proximate cause of death is worth trying hard to avoid.

During the Bubble many startups tried to "get big fast." Ideally this meant getting a lot of customers fast. But it was easy for the meaning to slide over into hiring a lot of people fast.

For the angel to have someone to make the check out to, you're going to have to have some kind of company. Merely incorporating yourselves isn't hard. The problem is, for the company to exist, you have to decide who the founders are, and h[b]ow much stock they each have[/b]. If there are two founders with the same qualifications who are both equally committed to the business, that's easy. But if you have a number of people who are expected to contribute in varying degrees, arranging the proportions of stock can be hard. And once you've done it, it tends to be set in stone.