₦airaland Forum

Chrismario:
He will be remembered for years.
Iniesta may last for few decades but as for hazard, he's nobody as it stands

that midfield trio of Iniesta-Xavi-Busquets will never be forgotten. Ronaldo will go the way of Marco Van Basten and to a lesser extent Puskas, he won't be remembered as one of the best. Compare Solksjaer and Scholes

bataderemi:
Football is about the goals.
Ronaldo has more assists than Iniesta.
Hazard is overrated.
Football is about the goals, again.
He grew into a goal scorer, same way Messi is looking more like a playmaker. If you can score an impossible number goals, I dunno what else you need to be a football genius. Since, you know, football is about the friggin' goals!

This will not lead to another 10 pages, hopefully.

if football is all about goals then Romario is the second best player ever behind Pele because he too has 1k goals and some more. You are shouting Cr7 because you were born in this era, if you had the chance to watch Van Basten you would know that Ronaldo does not even come close as a goalscoring great to that guy. At age 28, the guy already had a lot of goalscoring records to his name, scored some truly ridiculous goals. Like KevinDein aptly pointed out, a lot of guys can lay claim to the title of being a football genius even before Cr7. Hazard is overrated but still he can do a lot with the ball than Cr7 PRESENTLY can

jihday:
well, I'm guessing they are Pele maradona CR7 and Messi

CR7 is not a football, a goalscoring genius yes but not a football genius. Come on, apart from posting astronomical goal scoring returns, what else can Ronaldo do with the ball that.....Hazard cannot better? His goalscoring ability is at a genius level but generally he is not a footballing genius

Gattuso was a football genius, he was a totally classy baller, anybody that says otherwise will have me to deal with

Mujtahida:
Omo at this rate every old player is a genius ooo. From legend to genius is a far stretch ooo. Abeg oo.

Goodjoe and Joebie said Okocha is not fast yet on his Wikipedia page Okocha is described as 'quick and skillful'. Goodjoe don't say it's someone's opinion oo cos you just cited Matic's opinion to buttress your argument that Roy Keane is a genius (although Matic never said genius but legend)

I just dey monitor the thread Sir ,

TheGoodJoe:
Does that say anything about his footballing ways?

No wonder you goofed. I said Roy Keane is a balling genius you are showing injuring somebody. Na wa O.

that means his first duty was to destroy attacks(players). Atleast I watched Roy and this your assumption that he was a balling genius is false, agreed he was a good footballer with the ball at his feet but hardly does he even show that ability because he is busy ruffling opposing teams

Mujtahida:
But Iwobi has not been that impressive for us since the Zambia first leg. How about retaining the two Moses to give width to our attack and stretch the Zambian defence(which is weak) Retain the same old midfield trident with Mikel at the tip to thread passes for Ighalo. Hopefully And then bring in Iwobi for Mikel, Aina for Echiejile (which I doubt cos Rohr will want to wrap this up now and give Aina a go during the Algeria match)

just posting two wide-men to provide width does not always work. Their wing-forwards are young and they respond to instruction so they will occupy our wingers so that the fullbacks can maintain shape(which Cameroon lacked because their wing forwards thought they were big boys). I have no problem with any system the coach employs or the players(well maybe except Echejile and that my other guy )

goldfish80:
Maybe you're related to Dunga or you were privy to watch him when he played in the streets to know he had immeasurable technical abilities that he sacrificed for the team. The Dunga the world saw was a thug. Just like Roy Keane, Diop, Thomas Graveson, Gattuso, Deschamps and the rest skin heads I have over the years watched play the DM role.

There used to be one guy who played for Iwuanyanwu in the 80's and 90's I'm sure Kog45 can remember his name. His only job was to come in and break the leg of the opposition's best player's leg. Guess what position he played? DM of course!

DM's are meant to be strong, powerful and they usually take one for the team. Do you know what it means to take one for the team in this context? That means to kick the opposition when they are threading dangerously to goal..

you won't kill me with laughter. Them no dey give the guy red card?

Mujtahida:
This argument on legends is becoming legendary. Are we suffering from paucity of issues to discuss that we have to go back to this beat up topic.
Guys let's deliberate on this Zambia matter
Abeg Joebie give me your outline for the best tactical approach to this Zambia game. Wing play abi midfield thrust abi combination of both? How do we contain the pace and athleticism of the Zambians.
Cc
Forgiveness, goodjoe, mickael2, goldfish80, kog45, bigblang, Chrismario, etc

me I have already said I'd favour a more compressed midfield display which means Iwobi starts for me especially since his confidence will be high after scoring against Brighton(MS has zero goals and zero assists could be low on confidence which was clearly shown in that first leg against Cameroon when he missed a certain goal). The only difference is that I will play Iwobi on the right instead, why? Echejile. First, Echejile will not provide enough cover for Iwobi(since his defensive side isn't the best). Second, Echejile won't provide a passing option for Iwobi something I believe Shehu(Aina) who is naturally a midfield will be able to provide easily(you can see that brilliant combination play he had with Ndidi in the first leg). On the left, VicMo can post his one-man-army display. If we can isolate him and their right back then expect him to atleast cause them some problems alone without Echejile's help while also helping out the liability in his defensive work

forgiveness:
Mikel Obi is not considered by some Chelsea fans as a Club legend not to talk of world renowned Football.

is he an African legend?

Most Chelsea fans(well except Nigerians, not all nigerians anyways).

African football legend? Arguable.

Nigerian football legend? Unanimously unarguable

Joebie:
My brother. I understand you very well. For you legendary status mean a player that far above his peers in that club or country (?) considering history. I was going by that definition myself earlier.

But that's not the definition we are using here. So we are all now in agreement.

thank you very much

Joebie:
my final take. (see dictionary below)

1st Application in support of mickael2 's argument
When you say Chelsea legend, Chelsea is the adjective here. Legend is the noun.

The adjective meaning below may not apply
The most appropriate meaning is Noun definition (2).
Hence, "EXTREMELY famous".
The bolded synonyms below is how Mickael2 likes to see it
Synonyms of the word: celebrity, star, superstar, icon, famous person, great, genius, phenomenon, luminary, giant, big name; informal: celeb, megastar

2nd Application in support of Chelsea and most of us
Chelsea legend.
E.g the contributions of Mikel in Chelsea Champions League victories is/were legend.
Take note of the adjective form of legend in the sentence above

Hence the adjective meaning becomes most appropriate. Meaning: very well known chelsea player for his contributions as a holding midfielder.

Conclusion: Even the first application when used loosely can mean icon, famous person, great, star etc. Hence Mikel is a Chelsea legend.
However if you want to use the word more strictly and reserve it for a special few, then Mickael2 you have a case.
So really there is no point having this argument.

exactly. Everyone knows I pick my words careful, words like world-class and legend are not words I throw about so I deal mainly with the first definition you gave above. Thanks a lot

TheGoodJoe:
Tell that to Kanu and Okocha when they faced Spain. Hierro was the one who caused the havoc we fought back.

Do you think that pass he gave Raul or the freekick against us was ordinary? Rufai saw that ball going out but the curl on it was superb.

You do not get to that status by being ordinary. You can also not judge based on because you did not watch them.

Hierro is a legend. Even if you do not know, at least check reviews on him.

if we start grading players based on your own blueprint then each team might be having close to 200 legends and then being a legend becomes something ordinary. That is why we have great players and then legends, if not then every great player can be a legend

safarigirl:
Moses Simon that is younger than Victor Moses?

but you will agree that SM was a better player three years ago(I think that is why he is doubting his age)

Ok do you know that many Argentines consider some players that played with Maradona as legends(me I don't even know the name of those players anymore) but in recent times all you hear is that Maradona won the World Cup single-handedly which means his teammates were average at best. Do you know why? Because those players, despite how good they are, did not do something we haven't seen before. Legendary status changes with generation, maybe for you, you watched Hierro well enough(I watchd him too although not so much because then I was in boarding school) but from some of the matches we have watched that he played, he didn't really do something that I haven't seen past Real players doing and that reduces that legendary status for me

TheGoodJoe:
Go and check past FIFA and PES games where you have World and European Legends. You will see Hierro listed there as European Legend. It is not even a debate. Any Madrid fan that says Hierro is not a Legend should stick to watching Nadal play Tennis.

KevinDein:
The Zambians are so boastful it's unbelievable. They're delusional, almost bordering on psychosis. Below is a comment from their forum zamfoot which I found utterly ridiculous and amusing
.
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Mtembo says:
September 28, 2017 at 7:31 pm
Chipolopolo should win in Nigeria convincingly. The Nigerian players are old and immobile and can’t stand the heat for 90 minutes. Mikel, Onazi and Moses are past their prime and i doubt their real age. I expect Stopilla and Sinkala to crush the eagles. Zambia hardly loses when there is qualification as stake. Head to head also favours Zambia. I hope Nigerians will be here after we have embarrassed them in Uyo.

Reply
.

Noticed where this dude said Moses is past his prime; and that Zambia hardly loses if qualification is at stake even though they've never qualified for the World Cup.
They don't seem to know what they are talking about.

I am thinking that he is talking about Moses Simon

Kog45:
Correct u made my day

you wan corner me abi, I don dey age small small since I was able to figure out what my Oga wanted to do to me

tglobal:
@TheGoodjoe and @goldfish, your views on the role aren't different from each other (from what I have been reading at least, or am I missing something?). Take a step back and see that you are both essentially saying the same thing about the DM role and in no way denigrating the players who play in it.

@Mikael2 and others, Mikael's view that Hierro isn't a legend indicates that he has a different definition of the word than most people here (particularly with regard to longevity). Hence that is the fundamental point of disagreement . I was surprised anyone could ever suggest Hierro isnt a real madrid or spanish legend. It is not the case however that he hates Mikel or something like that. If we take time to read and understand what people with opposing views write sometimes, we might be able to skip some unnecessary arguments

I must say I learn a lot from this thread and the healthy discussions devoid of personal insults are commendable! Thumbs up!

this conversation dragged me to a site managingmadrid.com which is a broad blog for Madridstas from all over the world and I asked that same question and most of them agreed that he was a great player for them but when you talk about legends....well not so much. I mean people here think a particular team can have like 50legends, for me it doesn't work that work. If 20 persons have done what you managed to do then you are displaced as a legend for me(and well for most of the members at managingmadrid.com) but I didn't want to drag the argument and I don't want to do that now either. Just made the point because you approached in a very very awesome manner

safarigirl:
Moses Simon get athleticism, Leon Balogun and especially Victor Moses he athleticism.

Mikel does not need athleticism, he will decimate those kids with ease, I have confidence in that.

I hate reading anything you post and even more, I hate conversing with you because you aggravate me.

You can think whatever you like, but it dies not change the fact that our team is better than Zambia's just like Manchester City had a better team than Chelsea.

God! I hate talking to you

slow down.

You know these our players play week in week out, high intensity games but the Zambians(the home-based ones) have been camping for two weeks or more, resting and preparing for the game. They might be able to last longer than we would.


Hwever I totally agree that we have a better team but slow down and don't attack

Kog45:
Castigate ke! Busquets na my man o but i just want u to say something on it coz I remember then a lot castigate Mikel for not scoring for Chelsea.

I think Busquets has scored quite a few goals. I can remember his winner against Valencia sometime ago.

However, do you know why Iniesta keeps on making the FIFA XI? Why he won the UEFA man of the match in the 2015 Ucl final despite not scoring or even making an assist? Because he controls the game. Me I don't care if Busquets doesn't score or if he scores as often as Santa visits my place so long as he does his job perfectly well. Same goes for Mikel too

Kog45:
Sergio Busquets scoring his first goal since 2014?

wait oo you wan use the goal cast my guy? I told you goals alone don't matter

safarigirl:
after Zambia game ke? Some of us wey get exams throughout October nko?

we will send you pictures na. I sha have exams too so I won't come but the thing is that such an event should go ahead even if everybody won't attend, the first they say is always the eye-opener. If we can host the first one well enough(even if it's just 10 persons) then the subsequent ones will be a lot better

komekn:

It seems I didn't make myself clear.

There is no comparison between the Bundesliga and the Scottish premier League. They are MILES APART
in quality, not on the same level AT ALL.

However, just like the Scottish League they are a one club wins all just like the Celtic in the Scottish premier League. You have very similar characteristics with Bayern winning everything going for the past 17 years plus, bar 2/3 titles. Bayern success in Europe pushes the Bundesliga up on the national league ratings table by UEFA.

The gap between Bayern and everyone else is considerably large. Then the gap between the top 4/5 teams and the bottom section is also considerable.

Unlike in the EPL where it's impossible to predict who as among the top five will win it. In thus regard the EPL is the most competitive league in Europe.

Back to Felix I asked you how many games he has played in the Bundesliga. You still haven't answered the question.

in the last ten years we have had 4 teams winning the Epl, 3 have won nine.


In the last ten years, we have had three teams winning the bundesliga, pretty much the same with the Epl.


Among the Epl top4 I am pretty sure I can tell you that Arsenal, Liverpool and Tottenham won't win the league and they won't. I can even go as far as telling you that once Manu starts meeting tough opposition they too will crumble making it a two horse race. For the past 4 years the Epl has been won with atleast 3matches left to play.

Dedebanky85:
My only problem with thus us that we lose Vistor Moses's versatility. Against CMR, V.Moses was a planning winger as he was always roaming. Due to this I'd say Iwobi sits for Moses Simon to be the out and out winger.

For me I'd rather have Iwobi in the midfield than Moses, Moses can make some rather childish decisions in the middle of the pitch, Iwobi always keeps it cool.


However I understand your fear and it is true. But this system will also ensure that Moses gets the ball a lot more often. When the middle gets crowded all we have to do is pass out to Moses(who will stick to his position as a winger) and in so doing create a one-vs-one situation against their fullback and I trust Moses to do a lot more damage in situations like that

komekn:
A big resounding NO.
On what basis youthful past glories and or promising potential.

theGoodJoe doesn't want to see that at all

neighy:
abeg where are my ogas
tbaba1234, thegoodjoe, mickael2, kog45, mujtahida biko i need just 1.. N21,000 only

Komekn will buy for all of us as independence day gift from abroad

Napoleon55:
between IWOBI and MOSES SIMON,who starts against zambia?
@Icons,Goodjoe,Mickael2,Goldfish80,forgiveness,etc
for me i will go for IWOBI

I think Iwobi played very well today as part of a front three playing out wide. It is just a matter of what the coach wants and if he wants to retain possession(like I know he will) then Iwobi for me, we don't need two wingers who will be trying to play totally on the wings. In context this was how Barca won their last treble, Neymar was stationed out wide as the only true winger on the team(VicMo can do that) while Messi was always coming into the midfield as a midfielder and of course Messi does not exactly track back(almost identical to what Iwobi can do). I think this system will work wonders if Ndidi can be technical enough to cover Iwobi's wings when we are without possession just like Rakitic used to do(Onazi should not do it at all because that will leave an empty space in the middle)

Mujtahida:
To you he was a great player but not a legend. But he is- legendary for his longevity at the club in the club most fruitful years, legendary for surviving under many different coaches, legendary- he was unique in that aspect. Go and understand what legend means.

his longetivity is/was legendary no doubt but generally he wasn't a Chelsea legend for me.

There are some people who may have a lengendary quality but that does not make them a legend. A player like....Ikedia, his pace is legendary but he isn't a legend. You can't name 5 fastest players for the SE ever without naming him

Mujtahida:
I also detest that low, crude method of shaming someone rather than countering their points.

point taken

Mujtahida:
My last mention came before I read this. So you preempted my thoughts.

as in eh, Okocha is not fast. The guy had the speed, he just didn't like using it, I mean why would I want to use my pace when I can just stand on one spot and destroy your career with a rainbow flick?

Mujtahida:
You sabi. In any case on this Mikel legend stuff it's all a matter of opinion. But if the club says he's a legend then legend he is. All other contrary opinions are academic.

Simple!!! And I am entitled to my own academic opinion, that does not make me a hater, your brain is working today my friend, that stuff you ate this morning continue eating it everyday

Kog45:
Michael 2 must know that KANU didn't had a goal in Afcons.Mikel Legendary stuff must have take a toll on him coz it was a long discussion.

Boss, the discussion was loooong and I sent in that comment around 12am? You can see I even ended the argument myself.

Back to Kanu, Mujitdha I pointed out that a legend need not score goals or even assist but his input in the team is all that matters. I can remember a game against Cameroon(can't remember the year) but we won 2-1 or so(okocha and Utaka), Utaka's goal came from a brilliant pass from Kanu that sent him clean through. Kanu is a legend, that he didn't score goals in the Afcon does not change that fact for me