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Christianity Etc › Re: Seun Doesn't Exist by MuttleyLaff: 1:46pm On Feb 13, 2018

hopefulLandlord:
Educate us,
what is God and what is god?
and what is the difference?

You have a go first.
Give us your best shot.
Don't hold back.
Go above and beyond, leaving no stone unturned.
Exhaust all descriptions and examples

1 Like 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: Why Generational Curses Still Affect Many Christians by MuttleyLaff: 11:56am On Feb 13, 2018

Emmanystone:
I have seen videos of flakka victims. How is it a form of bathing salt and does it connect with a Christian bathing salt.

It hasn't reached Naija yet,
but I can bet my bottom dollar, it's a matter of time.
Olamide's "Chemistry Student" song is incognito warming people up to it.

You read and see what you want.
I correctly referred to it as bath salts,
How you managed to to have seen bathing salts, I don't know

Bath salts are manmade drugs

Christianity Etc › Re: Why Generational Curses Still Affect Many Christians by MuttleyLaff: 11:48am On Feb 13, 2018

Emmanystone:
Pls expatiate more on the bolded.
Don't get it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtFCzu74e30
Flakka in America,
is a form of bath salts
Listen to and watch the above video
to hear and see the after effects

Christianity Etc › Re: Seun Doesn't Exist by MuttleyLaff: 10:22am On Feb 13, 2018

chemystery:
Must you deify everything? What is "the god of nairaland"?
I'm not surprised. That's how your ancient goons invented Allah, Yahweh and the rest

Most humans always, subconsciously or not, do deify things

You talk like one who doesn't fully understands what a god and God is.

I wonder how you will fare, if given the opportunity to describe and/or explain in details with as much examples you can muster what god and God is

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Seun Doesn't Exist by MuttleyLaff: 9:22am On Feb 13, 2018

Martinez19:
Seun is a mortal while yahweh is not

Who says the god of Nairaland is mortal?
The god of Nairaland?

Martinez19:
Yahweh is all powerful and everywhere so revealing himself is not too big

So too the god of Nairaland is all powerful and everywhere on Nairaland
The god of Nairaland revealing himself is not too big

Martinez19:
You can't use the criteria for testing a mortal existence to test that of an all powerful yahweh.

What is good for the goose, is good for the gander

3 Likes 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: Why Generational Curses Still Affect Many Christians by MuttleyLaff: 9:16am On Feb 13, 2018

Processor01:
The example you gave about that Church in your post is typical of most Nigerian church where their doctrines or beliefs are not based on God's word but on human feelings or their misunderstanding of the bible. Faith without works refers to what exactly? Casting out demons from Christians? Is this what we were commanded to do? Did any of the early believers cast out demons from new converts? At least, if any group of people needed deliverance, it must have been the gentiles who worshipped all manner of gods.

Please, bring it on but let's divide the scripture - I don't want experiences with no scriptural backing becasue it's a good recipe for confusion

shadeyinka:
Actually if you studied the scriptures, Jesus didnt seem to draw much distinction between healing and deliverance; for healing is a form of deliverance.
Most diseases are Pathological in nature.
Sometime we break down because of bad diet
and Sometimes also, we breakdown because of lack of excercise
BUT
Sometimes too, it is an affliction.

About 2 years ago, a couple came for prayers in our church. They were looking for the fruit of the womb. Hospital report showed that the woman had fluids in her Fallopian tube. She was supposed to go for surgery. We prayed for her and less than 5 weeks after, she conceived.
Am I saying she was demonized? No.
But her situation had been clinically diagnosed and ordinarily should require medical intervention BUT Jesus came in and vola..pregnancy.

The man at Gadarene should have been put in a mental institution. Jesus could correctly diagnose his problem: demonic possession. The sickness of his soul was healed. In modern terms we would talk about Multiple Personality Disorder, Schizophrenia etc

Of course not everyone who is an active church goer is born Again. Even some Pastors are not Born Again.
However, we most often conclude a person is born again because of the kind of interaction we have with them. I dont know you but I cant help but believe that you are born again.

In church, there are some people like that. When you see them manifest, you will be confused.

Apart from that, most often when one is not sure of a persons stand in Christ, before ministering deliverance, the first thing you want to do is to lead them to Christ.

What happens if you were praying for a young man you personally lead to Christ and he starts manifesting: would you conclude that his salvation was questionable?

I have explained the second part of your question:
A Christian CANNOT be possessed by demons.
A Christians SPIRIT is RENEWED/RECREATED by the Holy Spirit so it cannot harbor demons or curses
However
A christian can be afflicted/demonized/influenced by Demons
A christians Body, Soul or Possessions can be put under satanic seige

Good post
Meanwhile, there was no science as such in biblical times to understand neurons
So, of course the neurotic man Jesus healed for lack of a better word and/or understanding was put him down as being "demon possessed"

Jesus knew that the man has some unpleasant brain effects causing his anxiety and neurotic behaviour
and so merely just restored the chemical imbalance in the man's head to heal him.

There is a spirit or demons, of course behind the man's neurotic behaviour, which got casted off into the herd of pigs

Get a christian and/or believer to take bath salts', then standby to watch the manifestations of spirits or demons

shadeyinka:
You seem not to get me.
When a christian begins to PReach Salvation, he encounters people who will need help. As he prays for them, a few would manifest. And part of those few would be Born Agains who has problems.

In other words, the more surgery a doctor does: the higher the tendency of seenig men with their heart on their right side of the chest.

Please put some extravagant and generous meat on the emboldened
What are you saying here?
As I dont seem to follow

Christianity Etc › Re: Why Generational Curses Still Affect Many Christians by MuttleyLaff: 8:12am On Feb 13, 2018*

Processor01:
Sure, demons can attack Christians and they do almost everyday.
Now, can they reside in Christians - my answer is NO!

Happy to hear your views.

My Aussie friend!
Long time, how the outback?

petra1:
I just remember a case of a lady I ministered to yestaerday. She always moves.
If She works in a place, After some months she just leaves.
She stays with someone after a time she moves.
Always acusing everyone for not treating her right

Sebi you're petra1
If you know Petra, you must be familiar with Simon then

The lady was unbalanced because the Petra/Peter rock of her personality was missing
She essentially, is Simon, without the Petra/Peter

It is the missing Petra/Peter in her, that was causing the Simon in her, to be drifting from place to place
She is incomplete without her rock, Petra/Peter, grounding her,
that is why, she swayed when under pressure and/or when in contact with any force that pushes her

petra1:
I spoke to her some years ago that she had Issues with marine spirits, spiritual husband, pride etc but she wouldn’t hear it.
I told her that from my experience she can’t settle for marriage until these are cast out.
She was offense claiming her body is the temple of the Holy Ghost etc. I left the matter. 3 years have passed. Same story.
She had left a good pharmaceutical job and now she sells ground nut.

Nothing wrong in selling groundnut
After all, somebody and/or someone has to sell groundnut for another to buy
if not, no one will see groundnut to buy

I know of one head of a blue chip high flying company in the city,
who one day, just woke up, decided he has had enough, so tendered his resignation
and went to go set up a landscape business
He swears by it, that he is more fulfilled with the landscape business than when he was working in the city

petra1:
She even stop house fellowship and blaming her cell leader.
When she finally called me and told be that’ people are saying something is wrong with her.
I reminded her what I had told her I saw before. I told her on phone that it was spiritual .

I told her to say this prayer. “YOU SPIRIT OF INSTABILITY I REBUKE YOU. I COMMAND YOU IN THE NAME OF JESUS COME OUT!”

She called back and told be she did and she started belching and was asking what’s the meaning of that.
I told her demons comes out by yawn, belching, farting, vomit, poo etc .
I told her to come over for ministration but she still refused she said she has authority to cast it out .
I agreed with her that every Christian has authority but not every Christian is trained to handle every case . We argued again

Does her not coming over for ministration pose or cause a barrier?
Is the assistance you aimed to give her subjected to a condition of her coming over?

petra1:
I know it’s the demons trying to block her from help.
I told her
“you only dealt with one that you identified
what about the others you haven’t identified

Do you really?
OK ooo

petra1:
We cut off communication again until 2 days ago she came over and I minister to her yesterday

How did you minister to her?
What does this imply?
Please give full details of all and what you did

petra1:
Vomiting everywhere .
Many many demons came out her after wasted years of pride and argument and many losses .
She is so humbled now. Joyous and making confessions of her inheritance without any resistance .
She has been making confessions of faith before but there was resistance

So, in short, you managed to identify all the others demons she couldnt identify by herself

Christianity Etc › Re: Seun Doesn't Exist by MuttleyLaff: 7:23am On Feb 13, 2018

Martinez19:
Oh really, have God spoken to you before?

Oh really, have the god of nairaland spoken to you before?

Martinez19:
Have you seen him before?

Have you seen the god of nairaland before?

Martinez19:
Has he healed an amputee before? Answer with detail.

Has the god of nairaland healed an amputee before?
Answer with detail.

8 Likes 4 Shares

Christianity Etc › Re: Seun Doesn't Exist by MuttleyLaff: 8:51pm On Feb 12, 2018*

bingbagbo:
They say a certain seun created Nairaland but I don't believe it.
Nairaland has no creator, it existed on its own
I have never seen the so called seun before
I have never heard his voice
Yet some fools say he exists
Seun does not exist

NNonsense

https://gifyu.com/images/steadylaugh.gif

25 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: 1 Corinthians 16:1-2 VS 2 Corinthians 9:7 by MuttleyLaff: 1:05pm On Feb 12, 2018

Osezua:
2 corinthians 9:7 - "Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver".

1 corinthians 16:1-2 - "1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye.
2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come"

Can someone explain this two verses.
One is talking about giving in proportion (according to how God has prospered you and to be given every first day of the week

This one is about monetary donations to the body of Christ at Corinth where the Corinthians were asked to give in proportion to how much one has financially made, as in, the more money you make, the more money it is expected you give

Osezua:
and the other is talking about giving according to what you have proposed in your heart

For this one, the choice is left to the giver in making up his/her mind, the amount he/she decides to give.
Essentially, just give any amount comfortable with, giving.
The caveat is he/she shouldn't feel coerced to give, shouldn't feel bad or regret giving
It should be a pleasure doing the giving
It shouldn't be a painful experience

Christianity Etc › Re: Why So Many Atheists On Nairaland Forum? by MuttleyLaff: 9:45pm On Feb 11, 2018

Emmanystone:
I know that, but there's a reason i asked that. I needed him to clarify because i am waiting for him somewhere.

I know, I know you do and you're going to pummel him there
Just put on velvet gloves whilst at it
and remember, he said:"... I didn't knw most of these though..."

Christianity Etc › Re: Why So Many Atheists On Nairaland Forum? by MuttleyLaff: 8:49pm On Feb 11, 2018

Ronpet777:
Hahhaahahahaha! Na so I see am o.
Its just all abt perception u knw.
It's not so much of a wrestling.
Like I said earlier, if he disagrees with me, it's OK,
but d general idea is that we all serve the almighty God d creator of all who we call Jehovah and d Muslims call Allah.
That we serve a diff God is another ball game entirely and we r free to hold a different opinion on that.
That is definitely not a tussle.

[img]https://s1/images/armWrest.jpg[/img]
Sure looks like an arm wrestle to me

Ronpet777:
And I think d question was from emmastone not Frank

I know the question was from my sister and not Frank
That's why it's her post I quoted her and not Frank's

Christianity Etc › Re: Why So Many Atheists On Nairaland Forum? by MuttleyLaff: 7:34pm On Feb 11, 2018

Emmanystone:
What do you mean by Channels and instructions pls?

Ronpet777 and frank317 are having a tense arm wrestling thing going on
By source, channels and instructions,
they are referring to Sender (i.e. Source) that converts messages (i.e. instructions) into signals
and uses transmitters (i.e. channels) to transmit the signals which arrives as information that can be used and understood by people

Someone certainly had a dodgy radio and/or television with a faulty antenna

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 4:44pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
babbling because it is as meaningless as cleaning the outside while the inside is dirty.

What a strange simile
You say; Isaiah 29:13 is talking of babbling
because babbling is as meaningless as cleaning the outside while the inside is dirty

jamescross:
having an appearance of righteousness denying/lacking it's power thereof

Is "having an appearance of righteousness denying/lacking it's power thereof" too babbling?

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 4:35pm On Feb 11, 2018*

Ronpet777:
[s]Now u want to get all righteous with me. No problem[/s].
If u wish to back up a notion u shld do with complete clarity.
D topic is very misleading and will instigate so much confusion and disbelief.
But no problem, u knw more obviously.

I believe you read OP's "Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie" opening post
to find out if the topic heading was appropriately and with good reason titled the manner it was

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 4:27pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
you will again quote half my post an try to take it round and round just to go in circles, in chess it's trying to be tricky and play for a draw.

I chew your post(s), and then spit it out in pieces
Stalemate, so that's your game plan

jamescross:
now muttleylaff, i say something is for nigeria and you jump in and say it's for yoruba.
i said you CLAIMED because it's not what your saying it's what your are claiming and still claiming.

your questions and that your response show your confusion. anothe analogy, it's like
1. are you a girl?
2. when do you change your sanitary pad?

first such a question as in 2 is based on what. was question 1 answered before such question 2 was asked. it could be a boy, or even a girt that doesn't use pad.

How would I know, if the question isnt asked.
Let me, let you on to something, sometimes the questions asked isnt for the benefit of the questioner

jamescross:
and i did answer 1,2,3 i just didn't number it.
now i am going to make an assumption about you
- it shows you don't take time to read and study before you draw out observation.
your reacting to my writing in my posts and not necessary my point.

You call "yes, as often as the spirit groans in me" answering 1,2 and 3?
Why didnt you number them?
You could have at least put in the same the effort, if not more, I put into dialoguing with you
It shows to deliberately was trying to be evasive as much as you can get away with
I looked at the initial responses shook my head,
and looked at the feeble subsequent ones and dismissively further shook my head

jamescross:
you want to reach my mind? lol
first reach the point of my posts.

You have no point

jamescross:
no just clarify your own point

To be honest, it getting more clearer by the day, that you really aren't ready or have the stamina for it

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 3:59pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
those two options are as useless as your refusal to accept the true meaning of the texts

What is the true meaning of the text?
What was the issue text was highlighting or addressing?

jamescross:
why are you confusing yourself bringing up lip service and babbling.
are you saying God only listens to intelligent people, because i do know the bible says God sees the heart.

It you.
You tied yourself up
You brought up Isaiah 29:13 and tried to equate with babbling
but I said, No, that its about lip service
and flipped out Matthew 15:7-9, echoing Isaiah 29:13 talking about when people talk the talk but dont walk the talk

I have no issues with your straw man "God sees the heart"
That is Bible 101 things

jamescross:
you do know that matt 15 was rebuking the traditions of men. do do do..

So does the traditions of men equate to babbling?
Or does it equate to lip service?

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 3:31pm On Feb 11, 2018*

Ronpet777:
I take back my harsh words to u sir, U seem not to listen to any other opinion thoroughly, hence, my frustration with u.
I just hope u don't end up achieving apposite of Wot u shld be doing.
U are creating negativity in pple's hrt, making them bliv speaking in tongues is scam and lies like ur topic states.
This is unfair as a Christian.
Speaking in tongues is a special gift of d spirit given to born again Christians.
He that prays in tongues speak mysteries to God.
But u r proving d whole idea as erroneous and it is sad coming from a Christian.

I bear you no malice.
People make mistakes and learn from them.
You need to pray and work on yourself in areas of the fruit of the spirit though
The flavour you need are gentleness and self-control

Just that you know, it is not my thread, nor my topic
Also I doubt you can produce where I have knocked speaking in tongues
What OP, I, Paxonel and others have tried to shed a light on,
is the elephant in the room counterfeit, you and others have probably gotten used to as speaking in tongue(s)

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 3:10pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
that's a reply to someelse about 1 corin 14:14 and 15

is it the 'if' there that you issue with. the condition there is simple and clear now. MY SPIRIT

Dont skirt from the issue.
Did you or did you not make an ostentatious claim that Paul said he prays in the spirit and lacks understanding
and other times he prays in the spirit with understanding?
When you are pulled up on it, you are forming wobble

jamescross:
dude all this your talk it's clear you don't know Holy Spirit
(note= i didn't write you don't know ABOUT the Holy Spirit)

I was wondering when will you ever get to use the "it's clear you don't know Holy Spirit" line

Was it not you, I warned to stick to the board and not the player
Why, instead of taking pot shots at the player, cant you focus on the board and play your piece or cards
Let the piece you move, the card you play, do the talking
Hit with your moves, hit with the card in your hands and not with your hand

jamescross:
The condition for him praying in tongues is the Spirit.

vs 15 i will pray with the spirit
in vs 27 also tells you there are times another person is needed present to interpret.

now telling me to quote from scripture an explanation to a scripture i gave using my own words in a simpler form so another can understand is what?

If I won a lot of money, I'd travel the world" is an example of a conditional sentence
The statement doesnt mean I have or had won a lot of money
Same way, Paul wasnt saying he prays or prayed in an unknown tongue, where his spirit prayeth, and that his understanding is unfruitful.
Just a conditional clause of if, if it happens that I do, then this that or that happens or will happen

Here is the example to illustrate:
If I speak in an ibo tongue, in a Hausa tongue speaking gathering where none present in the Hausa tongue speaking gathering, understands the ibo tongue I am speaking, please tell me who is benefiting?
Who is being built up or edified, in that Hausa speaking gathering, where I was speaking in an ibo tongue?
It is going to be only me of course
but the minute, I or someone else, interpretes, then the rest present understands all said and get edified

For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God:
for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries
- 1 Corinthians 14:2 KJV

Here is an illustration of what 1 Corinthians 14:2 is saying:
If you speak and understand only Ibo, but I, bilingual in Ibo and hausa, start to speak, preach or pray in hausa
Then the hausa tongue or language would be unknown to you, you wouldnt understand what I said, preached or prayed in hausa
I wouldnt be communicating with/to you, as it all be mysteries to you what I said, preached or prayed in hausa
Only God will understand what I said, preached or prayed in hausa, not you, as God understands all languages or tongues

¹³So anyone who speaks in tongues should pray also for the ability to interpret what has been said.
¹⁴For if I pray in tongues, my spirit is praying, but I don’t understand what I am saying.
¹⁵Well then, what shall I do?
I will pray in the spirit, and I will also pray in words I understand.
I will sing in the spirit, and I will also sing in words I understand.
¹⁶For if you praise God only in the spirit, how can those who don’t understand you praise God along with you?
How can they join you in giving thanks when they don’t understand what you are saying?
¹⁷You will be giving thanks very well, but it won’t strengthen the people who hear you.
- 1 Corinthians 14:14

"Baba wa ti nbẹ li ọrun
Ki a bọwọ fun orukọ Rẹ. Ki Ijọba Rẹ de
Ifẹ tiRẹ ni ki a ṣe, bo ti walọrun, bẹni ko wa laiye
Fun wa li onjẹ oojo wa loni
Dari gbese wa, ji wa
Bi awa ti ndariji awọn onigbese wa
Ma si fa wa sinu idewo
Sugbọn gba wa lọwọ bilisi
Nitori ijọba ni TiRẹ, ati agbara, ati ogo lailai. Amin!
- The Lord's Prayer in Yoruba language or tongue

Imagine this one too, a Hausa non-Yoruba speaking person has just being made to recite the above prayer
This was repeated without understanding or knowing what exactly the prayer is saying
Though in the spirit the praying is done but the soul (i.e. the mind faculty part of it) is unfruitful
The mind was unfruitful because it didnt understand diddly-squat of what's prayed in that Yoruba language or tongue that he/she just repeated

Lets get Emmanystone here to repeat that above The Lord's Prayer in Yoruba language,
she will gladly repeat but her mind will be unfruitful because it didnt understand diddly-squat of what's prayed in
Out of curiosity, she'll probably make a call out to Ishilove for interpretation and meaning of what she recited

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 2:35pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
muttleylaff when seperating what tongues is for you and what it is for others as the bible wrote i didn't specify who in the 'others'.

I will again refer you to what you wrote
This is what you originally wrote:
"speaking in tongues is for prophecy, edification and needs correct interpretation. this is service, for others"

jamescross:
now you brought in the who and claimed the others are only unbelievers

"Speaking in tongues is for unbelievers
I doubt you understand the identity of the unbelievers
or know who originally the unbelievers were,
that spurred speaking in tongues and of which the statement in 1 Corinthians 14:22 is based on"
- © MuttleyLaff

jamescross, please, I beg you play fair and square.
Dont introduce words I didnt use, when referring back to whatever I've written
Do you see ONLY in my above reproduced remark?
Or you just felt, it will be nice to add ONLY to the statement I made

I take time to carefully read your posts and try to understand them, where I dont, where its not clear or is murky, I ask questions
so please be focus and let that be the last time you go for cheap shots

jamescross:
then i mentioned to you a sign to unbelievers w/o interpretation

How do you mean:
"a sign to unbelievers w/o interpretation"

jamescross:
and like i said an edification to believers with interpretation

Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not:
but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.
- 1 Corinthians 14:22 KJV

"So then languages are established for a sign, not for believers, but for unbelievers,
but prophecy is not for unbelievers, but for those who believe."
- 1 Corinthians 14:22

Wow, I just marvel, it must be a gift, how you effortlessly and so easily stand 1 Corinthians 14:22 on its head

jamescross:
in your 10 questions you did a lot of assumption of what my answer would be, making your own conclusions and interrogation.

yes, as often as the spirit groans in me
4. i can name it if i was taught it
5. my preference would be considered if it's inspired from my mind. but i am spirit and i'm willing
6. yet again you assume my answer is yes
7. am aware i am praying in it
8. oh i understand very well
9. repeat of number 6
10. in private, in prayer as i am lead and in time God gives me the interpretion.
he is the revealer of all mysteries and speaking in tongue is speaking the mysteries of God.

jamescross you've the wrong assumption of me
I havent asked you any hard questions, at least not yet for now
How can I have already made conclusions when I dont even know your answers to the questions I asked?
You made a right dog's dinner in answering the questions
Questions 1, 2, and 3 are missing, the ones that arent, they are half heartedly answered with a defensive and suspicious mind set
You made sure you defeated the purpose of trying to search your mind

I expect quality plus high standards
not mediocre, badly planned thought outs and/or knee-jerk reactions from you

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 1:31pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
Paul said ALSO he didn't say ONLY.
it means there are times he prays in the spirit and lacks understanding
and other times he prays in the spirit with understanding. ok

SMH. Chief, be careful.
What is OK in what you wrote? Stop it already.
Where, how, when did Paul say he prays in the spirit and lacks understanding and other times he prays in the spirit with understanding?
Is that what 1 Corinthians 14:14-19 is dealing with and talking about?
Are you sure you know, recognise and/or understand a conditional remark when you see one?

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 1:09pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
if your saying i misused those verses, and your correct explanation is just lip service,
does that nullify my point that the 'babbling' stated isn't just gibberish that the human mind can't understand.
but like lip service it lacks heart and so did your interpretation - which bypasses the point of a text to argue words out of context.

Do you accept that Isaiah 29:13 or Matthew 15:7-9 is talking about how some promise to do something but in reality do diddy squat nothing?
Do you accept that Isaiah 29:13 or Matthew 15:7-9 is talking about when people talk the talk but dont walk the walk?

Babbling is talk done rapidly and continuously in an excited unintelligble and/or incomprehensible way
whilst lip service is just saying something but not actually do it or plan to do what's just said

jamescross:
it's not the words God looks at, it's the heart.
the heartfelt prayer but when you focus on the intellectualism of prayer as it much be understood then you forget hannah and become like those ever learning but never knowing the truth

I am glad you brought up Hannah
Though I was waiting for a window of opportunity to bring her on to the thread, I will leave her for latter and a much more appropriate time

jamescross:
worshiping with rules taught by men yes could be lip service as stated in isa 29:13

Refer back to above

jamescross:
then consider the full text and see that to God it's about the relationship with him and not what is spoken out.

This is just a straw man

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 12:54pm On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
muttleylaff
when i first said you leave out words i meant it.
"tongues are a SIGN for unbelievers"

I am glad you know and accept that speaking in tongues is a SIGN for unbelievers

Remember you wrote:
"speaking in tongues is for prophecy, edification and needs correct interpretation. this is service, for others"

Now, tell me, with your remark reproduced above, which is what I responded to,
who really left words out, who is leaving out words, when after all, I was just sweeping and picking up after you, what and all, you dropped?

jamescross:
do tell me who this original unbelievers you are referring to.
is it those that witnessed the event of the upper room?

I love enquiry minds
To be honest, I like your inquiry mind, but I doubt you're ready or have the stamina

jamescross:
just like God's miracles are signs he does through a believer to display his wonders and presence.
it is not even for them to understand it.
you can read vs 21,24 even in acts only a part of them came to understand what was happening.
except you have another reason written in the bible why God gave tongues, as a sign unto others.
vs 5 tells us that interpretation to tongues edifies the church, tongues is not as you put it > (just) for unbelievers.

This is hard work
that only can be done as a labour of love and nothing else

1.) jamescross please tell me do you speak in tongues?
2.) Are there any of the tongues you speak, that you dont understand what you are saying?
3.) How often do you speak in this particular tongue, that you dont understand when speaking it?
4.) What is its name, what do you call this particular tongue, that you dont understand when speaking it?
5.) Do you prefer speaking in this particular tongue, that you dont understand when speaking it?
6.) What is the reason(s) why you prefer speaking in this particular tongue, that you dont understand when speaking it?
7.) Do you pray in and/or with this particular tongue, that you dont understand when praying in it?
8.) Do you sing in and/or with this particular tongue, that you dont understand when singing in it?
9.) Why, what is the reason(s) why you prefer praying in this particular tongue, that you dont understand when praying in it?
10) Give all places and instances, where and when you speak in this particular tongue, that you dont understand when speaking it?

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 12:10pm On Feb 11, 2018*

Ronpet777:
Sir, with all due respect, U sound more shallow than ur age commands

Isnt it charming when people have no other choice other than to resort to ad hominem
Keep your eye on the board, not the player

Ronpet777:
I have gone tru d comments and hv seen someone who corrected u that Speaking in tongues is completely different from Praying in tongues with Bible citations but u insulted him instead

I dare you to reproduce where and when I insulted anyone on this thread

Ronpet777:
How then will I waste my time with an obstinate ignorant dogmatic individual

You've just succinctly described yourself

Do you, after off loading that bile off your chest, feel better now?
Obviously, the only people who are mad at anyone for speaking the truth are those people who are living a lie

Ronpet777:
I speak with pple who can learn not pple who feel they knw all

"Ọgẹdẹ nbajẹ, o nsope o npọn"
loosely meaning:
The banana is yellow and rotting away but it likes to think, it is ripening and so maturing

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 11:29am On Feb 11, 2018

Ronpet777:
So by going to church just to return to reply comments now is running away?
U expect me to be online even while d main topic of discussion shld be happening in church?

What and where is church Ronpet777?
What and where is ekklesia Ronpet777?

Ronpet777:
Abi na by force to reply
I tire for pple here o

Next time think twice before biting on more than you can chew
Or better still, dont nibble on something your stomach hast been trained to handle

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 10:58am On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
¹³So anyone who speaks in tongues should pray also for the ability to interpret what has been said.
¹⁴For if I pray in tongues, my spirit is praying, but I don’t understand what I am saying.
- 1 Corinthians 14:13-14

Muttleylaff, to speak is to be heard by men, to pray is to heard by God.
Do you agree?

Face palm. Please, please spare me this
OK, let me give you a chance to explain yourself
What are you getting at with:
"to speak is to be heard by men, to pray is to heard by God"

jamescross:
speaking in tongues and praying in the spirit/in tongues are two seperate things.
people can forge speaking in tongues like they tend to manipulate any other gift

SMH, brother. Brother why, why now, why this
OK, lets go there
1) jamescross how are you? (i.e. written out words said in a language, and the spoken language happened to be english)
2) jamescross may your day be blessed today (i.e. written out a prayer said in a spoken language, and the language happened to be english)

jamescross, please tell me how #1 and #2 are separate things, where and when, using words, I first spoke and then prayed in english?

jamescross:
when a person gets born again by the baptism of the Holy Spirit like every new born child they cry out.
that praying in tongue that is not a result of human mind but of the Spirit is a praise to God. it comes upon a person suddenly overwhelming that person with God's love. this is personal

You havent properly understood speaking in tongues,
yet you are bringing born again into the mix

jamescross:
speaking in tongues is for prophecy, edification and needs correct interpretation. this is service, for others

Speaking in tongues is for unbelievers
I doubt you understand the identity of the unbelievers
or know who originally the unbelievers were, that spurred speaking in tongues and of which the statement in 1 Corinthians 14:22 is based on

jamescross:
babbling is vain repitition of words thought by men. isaiah 29:13 instead of inspired by the Spirit john 4:24

Brother, in order to correctly understand what Isaiah 29:13 or Matthew 15:7-9 is talking about
I think you need to pretty fast, look up, the meaning of lip service

Politics › Re: Osinbajo: I Am The First Born Again Vice President Of Nigeria by MuttleyLaff: 10:22am On Feb 11, 2018

https://gifyu.com/images/steadylaugh.gif

16 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 9:48am On Feb 11, 2018

jamescross:
you highlighted babbling but left out many words

you stated what a thing is not and not fully clarify what exactly it is.

What is there to clarify?
It is exactly what is said on the tin.
What more do you want made clear, shed or throw light on about speaking in tongue or speaking in a language?

jamescross:
so is groaning in the spirit babbling?

No, groaning in the spirit is not babbling

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 9:48am On Feb 11, 2018

paxonel:
Tongue speaking is absolute deception when the speaker have no interpretation

The present and prevalent view on "speaking in tongues" also known as tongue speaking or alternatively as speaking in languages which most are raised with and made or forced to believe, is incorrect because the indoctrination is based on faulty understanding and misinformation

jamescross:
so Paul was deceiving himself

Paul wasnt deceiving himself brother
unfortunately same cant be said of many misled into peddling a con

Do you know the great advantage about telling the truth?
Nobody ever believes it.

Truth is like the sun.
One can shut it out for a time, can run from it, can bury head in sand to hide from it
but it dont mean it is not still out there, it doesnt mean it's gone or will go away.
Truth like the sun, doesnt go away.
Truth haunts.

jamescross:
1 Corinthians 14:14

¹³So anyone who speaks in tongues should pray also for the ability to interpret what has been said.
¹⁴For if I pray in tongues, my spirit is praying, but I don’t understand what I am saying.
¹⁵Well then, what shall I do?
I will pray in the spirit, and I will also pray in words I understand.
I will sing in the spirit, and I will also sing in words I understand.
¹⁶For if you praise God only in the spirit, how can those who don’t understand you praise God along with you?
How can they join you in giving thanks when they don’t understand what you are saying?
¹⁷You will be giving thanks very well, but it won’t strengthen the people who hear you.
¹⁸I thank God that I speak in tongues more than any of you.
¹⁹But in a church meeting I would rather speak five understandable words to help others
than ten thousand words in an unknown language
- 1 Corinthians 14:14-19

I have helped with bringing out the context surrounding 1 Corinthians 14:14
So please share your understanding of 1 Corinthians 14:14

Christianity Etc › Re: Poverty In Nigeria Is Caused By Religion by MuttleyLaff: 1:26am On Feb 11, 2018

shadeyinka:
I think your analysis is a little narrow

Dont think. Feel. Feeeeeel me.
Keep your eye on the ball
You think amiss, probably because you were paying attention to my finger and so missed that, I was pointing at

Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life,
and few there be that find it.
- Matthew 7:14

You see, in all what you tagged as "analysis" Jesus actually, was always walking on that little narrow path, being the difference that makes a difference

Now in contrast to the path of selfishness, I might warm up to agreeing with your thinking, that, yeah, the idea is a little narrow
The narrow path, is less travelled by
No wonder, Thomas Dewar, once famously remarked:
There is no traffic congestion on the straight and narrow path.

shadeyinka:
If I ask you to proffer a solution to our problem, would you say: scrap all religion?!

Paradigm shift will be the solution
Religion that is pure and faultless, is about not how regular one prays, is not about regular congregated attendance,
Religion that is pure and faultless, is not about wearing hijab or burka
I am quite sure sure you're familiar with the story about a priest & levite (i.e. "church" worker) who slipped up, on what pure & faultless religion is

shadeyinka:
Certainly Not!

Scrapping them all, will probably create more problems, than solving any

shadeyinka:
I means our problem is more fundermental than Religion

The problem is the common act of pure selfishness

shadeyinka:
Do we have problem with the way we practice religion?
Yes!

Yay, we incontrovertibly, at least, agree on this one

shadeyinka:
Religion as a problem is too blanket a generalization

Do you agree that the word "religion" has changed its meaning from what it originally meant and/or means?
Do you accept that religion which God our Father, accepts as pure and faultless, predates(d) Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Judaism, New Age etcetera?

shadeyinka:
We don't think as a Nation

We actually do think as a Nation.
Too much thinking, we do a lot of cunning-cunning thinking, crooked thinking, perverse thinking etcetera
We do selfish thinking, thinking only about self, what you need or want,
and not thinking about how other people feel or what other people need

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 1:17am On Feb 11, 2018

Kolanist:
I just dont want u to decieve other people .
here is proof even from the scripture of the validity of speaking & praying in tonges openly.
There is nothing wrong in PRAYING in tongues aloud in the church.

it is just that when ever u pray in an unknown tongue in the church try to pray in a known tongue also~1CORINTHIANS 14:14-17.

There is a difference between PRAYING in tongues (1 CORINTHIANS 14:14-15) and SPEAKING IN TONGUES WITHOUT INTERPRETATION FOR UNBELIEVERS TO HEAR (1 CORINTHIANS 14:21-22) and SPEAKING IN TONGUES TO MAGNIFY\PRAISE\TELL OF GOD'S WONDERS\WORSHIP\ which is the evidence of The Holy Spirit baptism(ACTS 2:1-15; ACTS 10:44-46 ) and SPEAKING IN TONGUES FOR INTERPRETATION FOR BELIEVERS TO HEAR (1 CORINTHIANS 14:27-28).

Every christian can PRAY in tongues (it is called PRAYER LANGUAGE) & all can speak in tongues for unbelievers to hear and all SHOULD speak in tongues to praise\magnify\tell of God's wonders\worship\ (this is the evidence of The Holy Spirit baptism)
but not all christians can SPEAK IN TONGUES FOR INTERPRETATION(it is a specific gift of the spirit in 1 CORINTHIANS 12:10&30).

If the bible condems speaking in tongue openly for unbelievers to hear why does it say in 1 CORINTIANS 14:21-22 that "with men of other tongues will i SPEAK UNTO THIS PEOPLE yet they will not hear wherefore tongues is a SIGN TO UNBELIEVER" .
If tongues is a sign to unbelievers as the scripture says, how will they hear it as a sign to them if it is not spoken openly to them or for them to hear. 1 CORINTHIANS 14:39 says "........FORBID NOT TO SPEAK WITH TONGUES" .

Even in the first church, they ALL spoke with tongues to tell of God's wonders for the unbelievers to hear (ACTS 2:1-15).
The fact is this, if ALL of them were not speaking in tongues in the first church during penticost, why did the people MOCK THEM SAYING THEY WERE DRUNK OF WINE in ACTS 2:13-15 ,
if they were all speaking with understanding the people would not have said they were drunk, this is what happened in Cornelius's house
(ACTS 10:44-46).

This is proof of the validity of speaking and praying in tongues openly.
SPEAKING in tongues (without interpretation) should be done for unbelievers;
SPEAKING in tongues to praise\magnify\tell of God's wonders\worship\ SHOULD be done any were by all believers (any were,in &outside the church) but SPEAKING in tongues for interpretation(with an interpreter) (not all believers can do this) can be done in the church,

there is the speaking with TONGUES OF ANGELS in 1 CORINTHIANS 13:1 which i guess no man can understand, PRAYING in an unknown tongue can be done every were(in and outside the church) but try to pray with a known tongue as also with the unknown

SMH. Facepalm. SMH
I have never read nor come across a discombobulated post such as this before
I expect you too, do a runner soon after questions are put to you, just like Ronpet777 earlier did, running away retreating with tail between legs

Honesty007:
you just blasphemed the Holyspirit and insulted him. no forgiveness in this world. by saying tongues a work of the holyspirit is a lie,there is no forgiveness.

I doubt you objectively read OPs post
SMH. The greater the ignorance, the greater the dogmatism.
The thing about the truth is, not a lot of people can handle it

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Speaking In Tongue; A Great Lie By Olakunle Allison by MuttleyLaff: 12:13am On Feb 11, 2018

MizMyColi:
Hehehhehehe
*Evil grin*
At least I've not wrapped you around my fingers yet
Breathe, juuust breathe

Ishilove:
Indeed you won't
*evil grin*

Once Evil grin bitten.
Twice Evil grin shy
Thrice Evil grin's not going to happen

1 Like

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