₦airaland Forum

@spyderman880, how much would a 2/3 bedroom cost in Enugu(sale) if looking to buy in a good area or near the centre.

Nothing will please most southerners than to see their bothers and sisters up north get educated. But 4 some reason the leaders up North don`t want these 4 there people. What can we do but hope and pray 4 a Northern Nig Ataturk. Nigeria can only develop if all of its people are educated and that means both North and South. Education is what we need in Nigeria not religious dogma.

Islam religion of peace? Only if u believe in a make believe World. The Founder of Islam, Mohammed was involve in over 50 wars. Find below:History of Islamic conquest starting with Prophet/General Mohammed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_conquests

I don`t think its that common in other parts of Nigeria, it seems to be a Lagos thing. Wayo Lagos.

One of the Greatest juju of all time, live on camera. Maybe juju really exist? Watch below


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImSjQZDoixU&feature=watch_response

levitation juju trick

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkHDERRjajI&feature=fvwrel

Thank heavens we don`t have Yakubu and Amodu to blame this time, but at least they got us to the AFC and World cup tournaments.  Nigeria is paying 4 the injustice of sacking Amodu after he guided us twice to WC qualification only to be denied the fruit of his labour. Serves u guys right. U bring Oyibo man we no even qualify him own country to come and enjoy another man`s hard work. Our god the Oyibo man failed so badly it was obvious Amodu couldn`t have done worse if he had been given the chance. The evil that men do will always live with them. A lesson 4 Nigeria.

Thanks Amodu for never failing Nigeria even though your people never appreciated your accomplishment with the National Team.

@Onlytruth, I am disappointed you have reduced our civil conversation to the typical Nairaland ethnic bashing. What as my ethnicity got to do with our conversation. I thought u were more into positivity, I guess I got u wrong.

What did you say about my people again? I will not say your people to u, as far as I am concerned u are just an individual, not the whole Igbo race. Please lets be civil when discussing issues.

@Onlytruth, When we make a claim people should be allowed to dispute that claim and from what I can see that was all Nolongthing was doing, disputing the statement "Eastern Nigeria gradually opening up a huge lead in development" I agree he could have posted nice pictures of the SW to show that we are not being left being, but maybe he lives too far from Yoruba land.

I guess its nice to sometimes show positive things about our country instead of always only showing the negative.
Thanks for that.

PC: If u think he`s my man then u are also my man, we are all Nigerians.

@Onlytrutrh, You are being unfair to Nolongthing. I think he as the right to post pictures disputing some peoples claim about the East being the cleanest and most developed state in Nigeria. You could have posted more pictures of the good things happening in the East instead of attacking the person.

I drove from Lagos to Port harcourt many years ago and I have to admit I didn`t see one single mud house in Igbo land, I even went to some villages outside Enugu. I think if more of us Yorubas travel East, we might be inspired to do the same and develop our sad looking Towns. I drove from Lagos to Akure last year and I was so disappointed, most of the houses were still made of mud. I hope we can catch up to you guys soon. We need to develop all parts of Nigeria, Ndigbo have started well.
Nigeria kwenu

Born again gone crazy.

@Beaf,
The truth must be told, we should all be posting what ever as long as it`s true and relevant to making Nigeria a great country. Nigeria kwenu.

@Beaf, No mind them. We need to be kept informed of what our elected leaders are up to and you don`t have to be from any state or even from Nigeria to keep us informed. Thanks for sharing. The truth will set us free.

@Sweetner, I know religion can prevent us from thinking clearly but in your case day as become night and night, day. You are no more from our World, but from a make believe one.

Saudi Arabia is recognised as a country by every Nation on earth even by Muslim countries, all Muslims need a visa to enter it, if it was just a district of the Islamic Ummah, there would be no need for any Muslim to get one. A citizen of Rome does not need a visa to visit Venice because it`s one country, but a Pakistani or Indonesian needs a visa to visit Saudi. That is because in reality they are not from the same country, though they are all muslims. Keep on living in a fantasy World of make believe. Ummah is only good for Jihad and the Hagg

Where have I said I wanted non Muslims to pray in your living room or your lawn, you refuse to compare like with like because when you do, the intolerance of Islam towards other religions becomes obvious. To use your analogy, if the so called property belongs not only to you but also to your brothers and sisters, would you then deny them the right to eat pork because you don`t like it or pray to Shango because you are a Muslim and have the power to enforce your will on them? To those that believe in freedom and justice, that would be unfair and unjust. But for you, religion is always above justice and fairness. Islam must really eat away at mans ability to value fairness and justice above religious dogma.

The French Muslims can move to Saudi since its part of the Islamic Ummah, If they don`t want to obey a law that applies to all religions. At least in Saudi they can pray and disturb any non Muslim as much as they want, but sadly they will need a visa and probably get treated like slaves by their Muslim brothers. That is the reality of Islamic Ummah. I keep on reminding you, we can only compare like with like, you cant compare Saudi Arabia to a cave, a better comparison would be to compare Israel the birth place of Jesus and Judaism, to Saudi Arabia the birth place of Mohammad. If Muslims are allowed to pray and build a mosque in Israel, why do Muslims deny this basic human right to non Muslims in Saudi.

Think of justice and fairness above religious dogma, not to do so would live you blind to reason.

I refuse to support Sanusi based on his views and idealogy, it`s got nothing to do with being blind. If anyone is blind, its you that support him because of his ethnicity and religion. I have nothing against Fashola even though he`s a Muslim but a secular one, unlike Sanusi who is a fundamentalist. I do not like extremist and believe strongly in the separation of state and religion.

I do not want Nigeria to be ruled by a right wing christian scholar why should I then want to be ruled by the Muslim equivalent.  Nigeria needs a secular leader and Sanusi as made it clear is not for that.

You guys keep on evading the issue, why as Sanusi not done or said anything about the plight of the poor voiceless almajarii kids who roam the streets begging for food while being force fed the Quran but denied proper education? Who will fight for these abused kids, not you or Sanusi obviously, who care only about your share of the Ooil money.

@Alienvirus, have u heard the saying one man`s meat is another man`s poison, sharia is haram to most southerners and non muslim Nigerians, but its halal to Sanusi. Most of us in the South want a secular state, he wants a religious one. We do not blindly support someone because he profess to speak the truth or claim to be transparent. Neither do we care about no-nonsense policy, what we want is a rational and thoughtful person who is not dominated by religious dogma and value its laws above that of the land. Islam and sharia is not the change we want or need and that is the only change the man is able to offer Nigeria.

Millions of Northern kids are denied basic education and training. What as Sanusi done to change the situation of these voice less kids, who end up being uneducated, unskilled and unable to contribute to society, other than being used as religious/ethnic thugs to further the ambitions of these so call elites. All he does is write articles fighting for Islam and sharia, but cares less for these poor souls. Any leader from the North that doesn`t fight for the right of the Almajiris to be educated and freed from religious indoctrination is not fit to rule Nigeria.

@Sweetne, I think its almost impossible to reason with someone whose ability to think outside the box was killed through religious indoctrination from a very early age.

Saudi Arabia is a country, u can only compare it to Italy not the Vatican which is only a district. Big difference. Tolerance is about allowing people to practice their religion. All the talk of unbelievers and believers is just what you were force fed as a child. Why not let God be the judge instead of preventing them from practicing their religion. God doesn`t need you to do his dirty work for him, unless you don`t really believe there is a god. Practice your religion and let me practice mine and let god be the judge. Muslim apologist always quote the Quran where it says there is no compulsion in Religion any time someone mentions the intolerance of Islam towards other religions. I guess you are telling us that these people are wrong, Islam cannot live side by side with other religions. Thanks for confirming Islam as a religion of Intolerance.

On Sanusi`s  religious mind set, I think that is even more scary. The belief system in Islam is totalitarian and without compromise  unlike the other religions you mentioned. The ifa priest or pastor doesn`t believe the law of his religion should be the law of the land. His religion is between him and his god. But a good Muslim and scholar wants the law of Islam to rule over the World because that is what God(Mohammad) commanded. This mind set is what makes it very dangerous to have someone like him, a good Muslim and scholar as a national leader in a heterogeneous society like Nigeria, because at the end of the day his religious belief is supreme and above the law of the land.

The Ifa priest also believe that if you make human sacrifice you will get rich, but he will not fight for it to be the law of the land but the Muslim believes in chopping up peoples hands for stealing and wants to make it the law of the land. He doesn`t want or believe in secularism because its against Muslim teachings. He can`think outside the box.

Why have you side stepped what I wrote about Sanusi`s lack of interest in Educating the Almajiris but more interested in giving them sharia and the Quran, tools that leaves them ill equipped to contribute positively in a modern World. Who is going to fight for these voiceless oppressed youth.

We need someone like the great Ataturk to rule Nigeria.

reactionary tendencies.

I hope you know what it implies calling Sanusi`s ethnic bashing articles as reactionary. A word defined as extreme conservatism or rightism in politics; opposing political or social change. I agree no other word describes the man better, he`s a throw back to the thinking and politics of the Usman Danfodio/ Alimi days. An era he is so proud of since he comes from that link of Fulani Aristocratic, jihadist.

You are also right in saying all the problem facing Nigeria today can`t all be blamed on the Hausa-Fulani/North. I believe we are all responsible, Igbo, Hausa, Yoruba and all the other ethnic groups. One just needs to look at the achievement of State Governors and Ministers over the years to realize that we are all to blame.

If Yoruba leaders of yesteryear's belittled and painted other ethnic groups in a derogatory manner is that a good reason for him to do the same, especially from a man that claims to speak in the language of a new generation, different from the leaders of the past. By repeating the same mistakes of these people, his shown himself to be a retrogressive leader of a gone by time, when our leaders where nothing more than ethnic champions. I do not subscribe to that law of an eye for an eye, for that leaves all of us blind. He is no different from the ethnic champions we have here on Nairaland that are quick to belittle and insult other ethnic groups because they feel their ethnicity is being insulted. A National leader should be above that, in our time.

I have already mentioned where he  favoured one group over another. Go back to my post and you will see it. Calling Igbos and Yorubas trouble makers while leaving out the Hausa/ Fulanis is a good example. Yorubas planned the first coup, Igbos staged the first coup, what about the first ethnic cleansing/genocide committed by his people against Ndigbo that led to the temporary break up of the country. This fact of history was side stepped. I personally think his actions regarding the dismissal of bank executives was motivated by ethnic bias, after all Banks in the West did similar if not worst things and non of the executives were locked up or had their assets taken from them. These business people spent time, money and energy to build and create employment for Nigerians, only to have it taken away from them just like that. What business as he established in the country besides using his privileged background to secure top govt jobs.? The man his not even fit to rule a modern Muslim country.

@Saintneo, is very right. Why does the law apply only to muslims and not other religions. But the threat of violence by them is so wrong. Violence can never be right.

@Jarus, I do not need to post the complete article, I was only interested in sections where he was was pointing fingers at other ethnic groups(Yorubas and Igbos to be precise)

Sanusi should not be judged on sharia banking, there is nothing wrong with encouraging a business venture that can only be  good for the country. It will create employment and give borrowers options they never had before. I think the idea is a win, win situation for the country. We should not condemn it just because we hear "Islam". No one is being forced to do business or borrow from an Islamic bank. Live and let live.

But I think his articles paints him in a negative light and shows him to be a Fulani/Hausa crusader and Islamist, based on his strong defense of sharia and attack of other ethnic groups. It would have been great if the man wrote about the plight of the poor almajiris who are not being educated but instead force fed religious dogma that leaves them with no practical skill to contribute to modern society. He wants them to have sharia and the Quran but no eduction to make their lives better in the 21s century He writes articles similar to what a KKK member or a Nazi would write about other ethnic groups. He blames Yoruba people and Igbo people for the ills of Nigeria and for its lack of unity, while conveniently leaving out the genocide committed by the Hausa/Fulani North against the Igbos, which led to the civil war. The most important episode in Nigerian History and the main reason we are not united. If Sanusi was a modern muslim like the great Ataturk of Turkey, he would have been suitable to rule a multi ethnic and multi religious country like Nigeria.

Based on his views backed up by his articles, the man is only fit to rule a muslim country like the Sudan where he studied Islamic law. Islama bad.

@Lagosshia, The vatican is a small enclave of Rome, it`s not even big enough to be called a city. Saudi Arabia on the other hand is a Country, big difference. We can only compare like with like.

@Sweetner, By justifying the intolerance of the Saudi Govt for not allowing any building to be used for worship except it`s a Mosque, can only mean you subscribe to the fact that Islam is a religion of Intolerance. Islam just like Christianity is man made, passed on from on generation to another. If you were brought up as a Hindu, you would be screaming Krishna as God. All these religions are just what we learn from our parents, nothing to do with the true religion myth. Open your mind read outside the box.

We are religious because of our level of development. We still think the way our ancestors used to think, believing in spirits to solve   practical problems. Bible to give us children, Koran to help us win wars and Juju to give us money. The mind is not yet enlightened, we are yet to break free from the shackles of dogma. The developed World was once like that but they have moved on and embraced science and reason while we are still stuck in the World of spirits and make belief. Our brain is like that of a child, still developing but at a very slow pace. We will get there it might just take a bit of time.

Islamic banking is not the problem with Sanusi, his mind set and indoctrination is the problem. I have read many articles by this man and it makes me wonder how on earth he was made CBN Governor of a multi ethnic and multi religious country like Nigeria. If only we took some time and read some of his articles glorifying the imperialist tendencies of the Fulanies, no fair or objective person would wish him on Nigeria. Sanusi to put it mildly is an ethnic bigot and a religious fanatic. Please guys before passing any judgement, take the time to read his articles on Nigeria.

We all know the greatest problem facing the North today is the lack of basic secular education, hence the reason for the almajiri problem where millions of kids are force fed religious dogma but denied basic education. What as Mallam Sanusi done to change this situation? When Northern leaders were busy implementing sharia law instead of providing education to these poor Almajiris. where was Sanusi?This man just like most Northern leaders have failed us all, but they have done more damage to their own people. If he meant well he would be a champion of education for his people instead of being a sharia defender.  The North needs a leader like the great Ataturk of Turkey and that leader is yet to emerge. A leader who can separate religion from politics and value education of his people over Islamic dogma. What they have are feudal lords that still want to keep their people in servitude and use them in keeping a firm grip on the power given to them by the Imperialist war lord, by the name of  Usman Danfodio. .

http://www.nigerdeltacongress.com/warticles/yorubas.htm

The Yorubas: Between Madunagu and Abati

by

Sanusi L. Sanusi

just a taster of his bigoted views

{Will the Yoruba finally learn humility, and accept the need to treat others with respect? Or will they continue to be dribbled, as usual, by "cattle and goats" (which makes them even worse than cattle and goats)? The choice is theirs to make)

(The struggle in Ilorin is between descendants of two men, Afonja and Alimi, who lived in Ilorin at the turn of the 19th century. It is a case of rival claims as to which of the two factions has the legitimate right to rule Ilorin. This one question is best answered by reference to history, and by applying the laws applicable to society at that point in time. The parties to this dispute are aware of this, which is why the Yoruba have actually descended to the level of distorting historical facts and fabricating fables about what transpired between Afonja and Alimi)

The writer is a manager at the United Bank for Africa, Lagos, Nigeria  


BETWEEN THE SHARIAH AND "BARBARISM"

BY

SANUSI LAMIDO SANUSI

http://www.nigerdeltacongress.com/barticles/between_the_shariah_and.htm

(This is the Shariah, the Divine law of Allah which some persons have taken to calling "barbaric". The wisdom of this Law, as exemplified in the law of inheritance, can be seen in each and everyone of its aspects: In the law of personal status, in contract, in criminal law etc. It is within the context of what is civilised and what is barbaric that I write this essay)

(I will go beyond that and take the example of theft. Islamic Law cuts of the hand of a thief once his crime meets all the stiff conditions defining it in law. The law cuts of what Bola Ige calls " the offending instrument," and frees the man to go and live with his family. What does our "civilized" law do? It gives him accommodation and feeds him for months or years in a place called a "prison" it keeps him in the company of "experts" with "varied experience" who teach him more sophisticated and more violent techniques for his craft. In addition to petty theft, he probably now learns how to procure a weapon, and is likely introduced to the "joys of Same-sex relations" in the cell. After this period of accommodation and first-class training at the expense of the state, he is brought out to a society in which he is stigmatized. This frustrated character is unleashed on innocent citizens. This is our civilized law)


ISSUES IN RESTRUCTURING CORPORATE NIGERIA

BY

SANUSI LAMIDO SANUSI

http://www.nigerdeltacongress.com/iarticles/issues_in_restructuring_corporat.htm

i. The Sharia and religious intolerance in the North

(To ask Muslims to abandon Sharia in the name of a Secular Nigeria is to give them an unjust choice. The matter is not one of being either Muslim or Nigerian when they can be both Muslim and Nigerian. The attempt to turn Nigeria into a Secular State seeks the erosion of Muslim identity and history. This will continue to be a source of conflict as Muslims will always resist it, with justification)

The Yoruba Factor and “Area-boy” Politics.

(In sum, the Yoruba political leadership, as mentioned by Balarabe Musa, has shown itself over the years to be incapable of rising above narrow tribal interests and reciprocating goodwill from other sections of the country by treating other groups with respect. Practically every crisis in Nigeria since independence has its roots in this attitude)

The Yoruba elite were the first, in 1962, to attempt a violent overthrow of an elected government in this country.


iii.The Igbo Factor and the Reasonable Limits of Retribution.

(The Igbo people of Nigeria have made a mark in the history of this nation. They led the first successful military coup which eliminated the Military and Political leaders of other regions while letting off Igbo leaders. Nwafor Orizu, then Senate President, in consultation with President Azikiwe, subverted the constitution and handed over power to Aguiyi-Ironsi. Subsequent developments, including attempts at humiliating other peoples, led to the counter-coup and later the civil war. The Igbos themselves must acknowledge that they have a large part of the blame for shattering the unity of this country)


In conclusion, Mallam Sanusi in pointing out all the ills of the Yorubas and Igbos, conveniently forgot to mention that the single most important issue responsible for shattering the unity of this country was the killing of thousands of innocent Igbos by the Fulani/Hausa Northerners (first genocide of independent Africa) which led to a bloody civil which we are yet to recover from. The man loves pointing fingers but refuses to look in the mirror.

Nigeria needs not an ethnic but a National champion.

Boko Haram is a national problem created by a retrogressive feudal system, where the under class of society are stripped of their humanity and the ability to reason.  Modern day Almajiri problem in Nigeria shows man`s inhumanity to man. Why are we surprise these children grow up to be killers.

We should stop this ethnic war, game playing, it`s old and played out.

The story might not be true, but if true they OP should send video to the police and also post it on Nairaland and youtube. We are our brothers keeper. We have a duty of care to expose evil where ever we see it. Show evidence of claim.

Help The weak if you are strong, Imo state is strong and progressive. I only wish the North would do the same for its people. The Almajiris need education not religious brain washing. I weep for these voiceless kids. May the almighty bless Imo state for doing the right thing. Instead of Northern leaders giving their youth free education they rather give them sharia. Buhari, IBB, Shagari, Abdulsalam, Sanusi, Northern governors and  and the Emirs all support sharia but non of them as done anything to make sure these poor Almajiris get educated. While they are busy stealing Millions of $ and getting away with it, they wanna cut off the limbs of these poor souls for stealing peanuts. Northern leaders are more callous than their southern counterparts, at least they give their people education. I weep for my poor Almajiri brothers, I hope we can one day all (Northerners and Southerners) fight and defend the rights of these voiceless kids, instead of belittling them. They are victims of the system and they suffer the most from the inhumanity of our Northern leaders. The North will never know peace uuntilthis injustice in the name of religion is corrected.

@coogar, U way off the mark, kids raised in England that come from good homes are better behaved than kids raised in Nigeria. The badly behaved kids usually come from bad homes where there is an absence of good parenting. The violent ones usually come from a very abusive and violent homes, the sort that u seem to be glorifying. Nigerians are not only badly behaved in Nigeria, they are known all over the World for bad behavior. I met some girls few months ago from The Czech Republic who were telling me of the bad reputation Nigerians have in that country, the same story of Nigerians behaving badly in America, England, South Africa, Italy and so many countries around the World. Do u ever hear of Scandinavians behaving badly anywhere in the World? They are usually kind, respectful, disciplined and trustworthy, these are virtues that are lacking in most Nigerians, with all the spanking and beatings we get when growing up.
I am lucky to have lived in three different continents and from my experience, it`s always we blacks that believe in this culture of violence in raising kids that are always badly behaved and violent. Lets for once try and think outside the box, our culture isn`t always right, just because that's the way we were raised and its all we know.
Violence breeds violence.

@Okada_man, this where we get it wrong, spanking kids is just a culture of violence which we have taken as a necessary tool in raising good kids, but it`s a fallacy. If spanking actually worked, Nigeria would not be filled with thieves and ill disciplined people. Police ole, politician ole, servant ole. pastor ole, the whole society is rotten with all the beatings and spanking most kids get from Nigerian parents. The best societies are non violence and they raise great kids. The Scandinavian countries are a good example, they don`t spank their kids but they turn out to be better behaved as adults, unlike us who get spanked, but yet are so badly behaved all over the World. Violence breeds violence, hence the reason Nigeria is one of the most violence societies in the World. A country where causing physical pain to another human being means jack shit, a place where taking a life is as normal as the day.

Parenting is about communicating with kids, teaching them right from wrong through dialogue, reward and consequence, instead of brute force. By using violence we will only be reinforcing that culture of violence that we were raised in, which depicts violence as the only way in solving a problem. This topic brings back my horrible memories of Nigeria and its culture of violence and sadly enough we are still "bound to violence" Black culture needs to move away from this, if we want to be seen as non aggressive people.

Teach reason over brute force. We need enlightenment in our society. Thank heavens we have a Gov like Fashola who is trying to eradicate this barbaric behavior from our society, I hope he goes further than just no spanking in schools. Parents don`t need to spank.

Biafran war history needs to be thought from a early age at our schools so we can learn from the mistakes of the past. The killings of Igbo people after the Nzeogwu coup had more to do with the humiliation your average Northerner felt after the killing of their prominent leaders by Igbo Army, after which Igbos in the North went out on the streets celebrating and mocking their death. We the younger generation seems to have learnt nothing from these events of History. Today we still have the same people quick to belittle and humiliate those that have welcomed them in their home land and given  them a sense of belonging. People that leave you to do your business without anger or jealousy you are quick to belittle and tell them you are more hard working, smarter, richer, that you own all the businesses in their land and that your intention is to dominate and belittle them after all the love and affection they have shown you over the years. The same pattern is developing of creating hate and resentment when there should be non. Why is there the need to feel superior to your host and even if you are superior do you have to poke our eyes with it.

The Hausa Fulani that have ruled and dominated Nigerian politics have never come on this site telling us how much smarter and better they are to the rest of the population because of their political and military dominance in fact they play it down. If the Igbo`s were in their shoes from all the chest beating we get from some of them on Nairaland, they probably would  be telling us to our face they are the superior race hence the reason they have ruled for so long and will continue to do so. Humility is golden but some of our brothers seem to lack this basic principle.  

Many of us Nigerians, Igbo, Yoruba, Hausa and the rest of us live in countries where everyday we are fighting to be respected and treated as equals because of our color, we fight not to be seen as inferior to other groups that feel superior to us, yet we are more than happy when it comes to our fellow black brothers to play the superiority game and to belittle other ethnic groups. Why do we keep on doing things to others that we don`t like done to us?

At the end of the day there is nothing wrong with an Igbo person ruling Lagos as long as he can do a good job and loves the state as he would love his home, but if the idea is to rule so we can be told how much smarter and that you are better than every other ethnic group in Nigeria then no one will want an Igbo as Governor of Lagos or even as  President of Nigeria.
If you believe in the superiority of your ethnic group over others then you should believe in the superiority of every other race over the black race. After all we are at the bottom of development in the World today. Next time the Arab or White man calls my Igbo brothers monkey he should just accept his faith as a second class citizen since he believes in the superiority of one ethnic group over the other based on material wealth.

I do not subscribe to that believe, no ethnic group is superior we are all struggling to raise our head above water.

Yoruba de talk am say man wey never see another farm before go think say na im papa farm big pass, OAU students need to open eye. I am from Ife and love the University but to call it the best in Nigeria is going too far, maybe one of the best makes more sense.

Bad habits die hard, now I understand the Odechukwu name calling brigades, na from school dem learn am and have refused to grow out of it.

What exactly is wrong with Islamic banking or wrong with providing loans where u share profit instead of charging interest. I call it partnership banking. Islamic banking hurts no one so why all the force. We must stop this our culture of intolerance, on both sides of the divide. I think Sanusi made a big deal of this issue. Why promote it instead of just approving or denying the license application. Marketing should have been left to the Islamic banks themselves.