₦airaland Forum

@KAG: Am not a Christian, but I am a Creationist. Your ability to continue to simple say Wrong about everything, does not mean that you are correct! I often wonder how you have not be able to tell us how the initial particle that existed before the big bang came about into existence? You should try to explain that to all of us and your heart that is harder than steel, deader than stone, yet it is flesh, pumping blood through your body to keep you alive. Yet this very simple process of life support has kept you alive from the time of your inception in your mother's body.

And why has not a group of humans and others evolved to breath in the huge amount of CO2 that is killing off the created humans and other animals who are designed to using O2 like humans?

After you do this, and others, I will ask you to tell us how the first particle that is so small that it has no size andno significan mass but that since it existed it must have a position, hence one is arbitrarily given to it by the theorist. The theorist can never proof their theory, because they know that nothing can exist (except God Almighty the Creator), without a causer to bring it about. They theorised something so small exploded with such a force that it had to be called Big Bang. And this then produced and continues to produce the tremendously immmeasurable large amount of weight of things, some already extincted, while others are not yet descovered, but what is known are so varied that we can't possibly explain how they could have had a direct link and common origin!  How can you explain that Jupiter or any of those other planets and you come from the same father and or mother?

KAG, you see that i cleverly did not say you and the earth, since you live on the planet earth. It is then that you will begin to explain how the elements in the earth and you are perfect with one another. I wonder why you could not go to the Moon near to us to live, except that you have to replicate the earthly condition on you whenever you even venture to a height just short distance off from the surface of the earth.

Now tell me how is grandma Gorilla doing? And grandpa Chipanzee, too? Am sorry KAG, you have flu or at least under the weather? I don't see the earth sneezing with watery eyes, and running nose in all my years alive. Ask those people who have been alive longer than all of us.


And your claim that science disagrees with theology, I bet you have based it only on what you know. n the Q.ur'an, in Surah Rahman, the Creator says penetrate the space, if you can. But you can not except with what its allowed for you to penetrate.

In other parts of this Glorious Book, the Creator gives hints, inferences on known science branches and what is yet on known, but will be only for the future generations. You see, you have cheapened the Awesomeness of the Bringer of what you think is the source of your life. You need to change your ways.

@Justcool: You were doing well on your own, before you bring m_nwankwo into the mix! He is a grail message person. Is it not like Lodge or something like that. Come on, give me a break. But you are right, its no use fighting a losing battle of trinity with me. I will never worship a multihead.

The NT nollifies the OT only when its convenient to push the Christian agendas. Otherwise, it is left in the Bible to give the impression of fullness to the Bible.

From among them you have the Coptics. So those can eat their burgers and their hams, too. They have a big community in Jersey City, you know.

@~Lady~ and 4Him:

it already did.

the "truth" has stood firm for 4000yrs.

Yeah and ever so shifting so slightly the goal line and the dimension of the goal post! If that readily and "already did" "stood firm for truth for 4000 years" then we are in great peril and we just don't know it yet. I wonder if Pharaoh is not still ruling Egypt? The world conscience must have been standing still all this while.

@~Lady~

I think that was my point. You, however, said there was nothing wrong in having a thought of you sexing another woman that is not your wife as long as your wife doesn't know. I told you to ask your wife and let me know her answer. Did you ask her, what was her answer? lol.

What I said though was that if a thought like that occured, you should fight it. And when you copulate with your spouse, if you role play all your fantasy at that time, then there is nothing wrong in it. I further said that whatever your spouse does not know that is in your head, but never practice it with somebody else except your spouse it is okay.

How can it be possible for anybody to know whats in other person's head? Further my wife said that the spouse have no reason to fantasize about anybody else. That was here first though. As we spoke about the fact that no one is beyond a flash or temptation thoughts, she agreed that if the person struggles and never acted upon it, then no harm done.

@~Lady~: lol. Time will tell.

@Cgift:

see who is talking You probably seem to have forgotten the sayins of MO that were written on leaves and tree barks only for goats to cart them away or the ones written on bones and walls that rain swept away?

I wonder how much rain falls in a desert? I remember that in all the years I lived in Las Vegas, Nevada, rain fell few times and and all of it was not more than 2 inches! No wonder we drink water from the artificial lake known of Lake Las Vegas, from Colorado River's Hoover Dam run off. How many herds of goat running around in the desert? I am giving you this analysis that your statement about goat eating and rain washing in away the Qu.r'nic verses, as if these parchments are things that people place about the places carelessly.


Please Cgift give me a break from all the "Odu!"

@ Justcool:

Despite your insults. I thank you for reading and replying to my submission, and although I disagree with you, I still respect your opinion and I will never condescend to insulting you. I never said anything about the spectrum being obstructed. I don't know what you mean by that. The spectrum analogy is to show you that many things can add up to one, even within the physical realms which science can investigate.  You called the 1/3 analogy absurd but it was you who kept posting that 1 + 1 +1 cannot equal 3. Even within your own mathematical analogy I proved you wrong because the Trinity means one God in three persons thus each person of the Trinity is 1/3. Then when you add the three persons you get ONE. Show show me whats wrong with this calculation.

You can not eat your cake and have it, too. It just does not happen. You can not have a portion off or cut off from a whole and continue to hold fast that what remain is still a comple entity, undisturbed. Thats excatly what you are putting forward when you claim that Jesus was part of a whole, but when he is cut down by crucifixion, what remain was still a complete whole. In addition thats what i was proving to you in my obstructing just 1 spectrum and allowing the remaining 6 to go through your inverted prizm and see if you will get a pure white light which was what you should have gotten if all went through .

But then, you have cheapened your god to common light, etc.

The above is completely yours and not drawn from my submission. I never said that God cannot independently be complete except he has son and Holy ghost with him. In reality God has no son. Jesus is a part of God. He is the love of God. Please tell me how God can be God without love which is an indispensable part of God. God can only save man by giving man His words. The man who lives according to the words of God shall be saved. He gave us his word during creation, when He created us He hardwired His laws and the ability to recognise His will in our spirits, He sent us so many prophets yet we refused to listen to them and submite to his laws. Infact we statred killing the prophets and due to our sins, the earth was speedily heading towards distruction. God did the ultimate by sending us a part of Himself-- His Living Love. In Jesus, God vissited the earth to give us His words or laws (the laws of His father) personally. It is unfortunate that we refused this help and had the audacity to destroy the vehicle(the Body of Jesus) through which God walked on earth.

I know you will put the blame on me, somehow. thats okay because God sees all. Hear yourself talk about the fact that God must have son and holy ghost with Him. And then you turn to God not having son and that Jesus is part of God and His love. So without Jesus God has no love or loveless and unable to love and without Jesus God is complete, since Jesus is part of Him? What happened when Jesus died, did part of God died, hence incomplete and had no love?

I see you saying that Jesus is the "words" of God that He gave us to live by at the time of creation, which is the only way we can be saved. So what was the need for the prophets of old, before Jesus? And what role did jesus played as the 'words' to live by before he came as his mother's  son and before he began to preach his 'gospel?' You spoke about hardwiring us with ability to understand God's laws and will in our spirit, but then, it seems as if you are all over the map without connecting jesus to any of mankind and prophethood before he was born. I guess I was not connected to anybody bfore i was born, too. Whats special about Jesus which ordinary humans don't have, before either was born?

You sping on the bandwagon again of saying we, instead of the Jews who received so many prophets and killed a good number of them as they refused to obey the laws and commandments of the god who sent the prophets. I will not accept blames for what the Jews did. And there was no single prophet was sent to the Africans and all mankind, up to and until M.u.h.ammad. The Jews were sent Moses and there is no way that you will deny that Jesus was sent to the Children of israel, alone. Afterall, he said that in your Bible, please read it!

I was right to have stated that you called Jesus "part of God, and His living love."  And now you add that God visited the earth through Jesus? I wonder what Jesus did to make you made that kind of leap of faith? Jesus was never more revered by the Jews more than Moses, since both were sent to them alone. There is nothing you can say about him that a prophet before him did not have a presentation of something similar. Adam was born by no vessel at all, yet he came alive as a grown man. His wife Eve was born through him, a small part of him, anfully grown, also. These were remarkable being and process of creation.


And by the way it is the jews who killed Jesus. There is no single Yoruba man that participated. And jesus was not sent to the yorubas. Check out his own words in the Bible. I was just wondering if the term "words' means more than speech, that is if I use your definitions, then Jesus 'words' will be what exactly?

God's words "let there be lights" are not words like human words. Every word of God is an act which is living. Let there be light is an act of God's creation.

And when i apply this concept to Jesus as the words, what i get is that Jesus was a creation of god and nothing more. This is the exact statement we have been making for you to underatnd, all along. You see how A.l.lah brings about His Victory, His truth?

God did not send Jesus to be killed for mankind. Like I said earlier Jesus came to deliver the word of God personally to mankind and only by living according to the words of Jesus will man be saved. His death is a murder that mankind committed.

Only the Jews committed the murdering of Jesus and other prophets sent to them. There is no prophet killed by Ijebu Ode man. If the words of God is part of God which is jesus. Then wouldn't the words of Jesus be Jesus and part of Jesus which means the Bible? Then when you put the Bible in a place that you know god will never be in your house arent you dishonoring God? When you read the Bible arent you reading God? And please tell me can you read God, since jesus could not even read God? Which was the reason he prayed in vain in the garden. God praying in vain? This is bizzare!

But all the prophets came to deliver the laws and commandments of God to their people, personally. Is the 10 commandment out of use now? Was it not that God wrote the 10 commandments, personally? Your argument is very weak, again.












[quopte] God did not create hellfire. Hellfire developed due to man's misuse of his free will. One of the laws of creation is that "whatsoever you sow, that you shall reap." Doing good deeds is tantamount to sowing good fruits which will only bring good to the sower. But instead of doing good man did so many evil. This is like sowing evil. These evil done by man are waiting for man in a part of the beyond. This part of the beyond is hell. it wouldn't have come about if man had not turned away from God. Therefor, my brother our Good God did not create hell. Hell is the work of man.

[/quote]You just proved what I have been saying all along: you cheapened God's ability. But now we realise that God by your definition did not even create Hellfire as well as Jesus, and the Holy spirit. How will God punish the evil doers? And do you think that the inhabitants of hellfire will design a just punishing tools for their offense.














[quote]God can do all things but God cannot do evil, sin or go against His holy laws. The laws of creation which are part of the Holy laws of God makes impossible for God in all his MAJESTY, PURITY, MIGHT, AND POWER to descend into this little earth. The earth cannot carry HIM but must incinerate at His presence. The only way he could come to the earth was by letting a part of him to enveloped (and the word was made flesh)in a physical body. Through an act of His love, He cloaked a part of Himself. This part of God that walked on earth was Jesus Christ.

I hope you read your own writing. Its shameful to go back to the same argument again. I wonder if any part of God, even the smallest part of Him, eg His finger, is not powerful enough to make the earth pulverize in awe of it? Then how much of God was Jesus when he walked th earth and the earth did not descentegrate? And when God punishes the evildoers, would He be doing evil, committing sin?

If your god can do all things, including sins and injustice, then he definitely is not my God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Am completely at a lose here. I do not know what you mean.

Jesus was, is, and will forever remain a part of God.

Your words.

My dear olabowale remain blessed. I wish you well.

Same that you wish me is what I wish you.

@~Lady~: Lol. Are you still in town or what? I wish you well.

Now about the Mus.lim women, you need to tell them to talk to me. Maybe All.ah may provide the needed advise and encouragement through His Servant/slave Olabowale. This is a good thing.

And Miss, I am like that grandfather of yours. But by All.ah, I can take care of a woman with the nature of your grandmother, and then replicate it 4 times. Or better because I want to amuse you, "to the power 4!"

Actually you miss the point am making. Lust is not a bad thing with your spouse. And when it occurs in the heart towards a strange person from the opposite gender, since we are no 100% immune to mistake, one is to curb oneself, by struggling against it. And never ever implement it, regardless the urge. The struggle against it is itself is a blessing. I think you and me have spoken about this subject before.

It is fighting temptation that led Joseph to Prison, a place that served as a refuge for him against the seducing wife of his master. And it was this prison by God's mercy and reward on him that he began his amazing glorification to the highest eminence in Egypt. A good reward is sweet.

@Cgift:

Can you please list the prophets from the descent of Ishmael your origin? Do you have any Arab prophets that you mooslims can lay claim to?

Ismail and M.uha.mmad. You remember the Yoruba proverb about multiple birth? I will apply the same here. The Yorubas spoke well. They said the last took the leadership from the first to be born. "Akeyinde (Kehinde) gbagba lowo ako de (Taiye)! See? Mu.ha.mm.ad is ever the leader of all the prophets and messengers!

And as to the ape and monkeys, that was for those who in the fishing village turned to those animals as a testament for their dishobedience and a way to begin there punishment from the earth to thereafter.

Have you ever spoken to a Jew before, in your entire life? I did yesterday, and i will do today, God willing. And in the future, too. So your sucking up in this case is weak and baseless. I deal with them. You don't and you are the one who started a thread lambasting them. Who is thehypocrite here? lol.

@Huxley: God did not forget them. He does not forget anyone, including people who do not even acknowledge Him. The case of Maynamar is resting aquarely on the shoulders of the Military junta dictatorship that is ruling them.

The USA is trying very hard to send aids to them. But they will not accept it in empty pride, so much so that they refuse to grant entry permissions to the US Relief contigents. Call America what you want, but it is never a country that fails in her obligation to at least debate within her citizenry a process of doing good for the people who are in distress.

And just my opinion, the leadership of maynamar needs to be replaced, if there is any that needs to be replaced around the world. here is a terrible and worse than empty rhetoric; puffing up when you can not even take care of your living and then dehumanizing your dead.

Are the dictators not the ones to be blamed here?

Are christian romantic? Are they sensuous? Do they know anything about love at all? If you are not lusting after your spouse, who should you lust after? Christians must be boring lovers. You need to learn a thing or two about keeping the lve and romance at the peak for a long time from the Mus.l.i.m!

Where is Nwando? lol.

@Cgift: Bawo ni? Before I prepare myself for Jumuah, am gonna yab you for a moment! lol. Okare.

Yes he was a human being, yet He knew the mind of God and gave full expression of the image of God. He said I and My Father are one! Anyways, there is no need wasting time on his divinity and oneness with God. You can never understand and i would not even try to make you understand.

I wonder why he failed to know when the hour is for all mankind? I wonder why he did not know that his prayer at the garden of geshemane will not be accepted? Or was it for show of hypocracy since he knew it will never be accepted anyhow, yet he went through with it? Was there a doubt in the process all along by him? In I.s.lam we call this act the act of munafiq. Finally, why would he be surprised to the point that he let everyone know when he yelled about been forsakened? Is this an act of ust for the public consumption or that he did not know or both? In yoruba language we say "ko seku ko seye." Is that what it is?

And I will not touch the Satanic/ Demonic temptations and the ignorance of the knowledge of the season of fig tree fruit, because of hunger from fasting.

That is why we do not refer to Abraham as a prophet as christians. We however refer to him as the friend of God. If you want to know the prophets, i think i will recommend Elijah, Elisha, Isaiah, and the likes. Not Abraham. Do you care to list Abrahamic prophecies in the Qurihan for us?

From the Q.u.r'an, we see that his prophesy is that all prophets shall come from his bloodline, after him. Now tell me if there is a prophet after Ibrahim that is not from bloodline, be it the branche of his first son who was at sometime the only son, Ismail, and Isiaq the second son who is the son of the first and older wife Sarah? This prophesy alone and all his prayers were 100% true and in truth.

Can you challenge me? Please top that!

Keep consoling yourself.

Step out of the septic tank you get yourself into! Orishi rishi! Awon arale nko o? Bami ki won o.

@Eniyan: Corinthians was written after Jesus, right? I mean Jesus himself was not walking the face of this earth when the book of corinthians was put into process. And the witer of corinthians is death already? How is it possible for somebody to bring up an idea that jesus himself did not put forward and you guys believe it?

If death were not to occur to anyone, should it not have been Jesus, or and his disciples or the immediate generaton or generations? Is any of them on this earth today? Was it not even the bones of Elijah that raised somebody up? Is that person alive today? Is elijah himself alve?

Have we have in the modern ea any proponent of being alive in rapture that Jerry Fahwel of Liberty University/ moral majority of America? Did he not die last Summer? Think of it, Jesus never said anyone will not die. If he did, he probably lied, which is not the case, or somebody put it in his mouth, a certain scenerio.

This is why am not a christian, I don't wanna live in fantasy world.

The questioner is asking that the exodus verse be thoroughly explained, pastor. Your asking question gives us an impression that you are trying to deflect your religious responsibility to us laypersons of nairaland. Please explain, instead of hidig behind a single finder of your hand!

@Backslider: Okare. The below that you have written as advise to Justcool is a load of crock.

God is three seperate different persons in one Godhead. God did not Manifest as jesus and God did not manifest as the father or holy Ghost.

Persons will mean humans. Not animals like lions, etc or trees like mahogany or spruce, etc. So from the above, we read that you have different gods which make up your one god. Think about it can this ever make sense? How is it that your god give you a thing that can not make sense to you here, the most central to his decision and yet give you ideas that make sense in other things?

It is very easy to know that there is hellfire and its a place of punishment because we see that the fire we use for a load of benefits can also be a thing of pain. We see that we are in enjoyment when we are in a felicious setting. But to give you a three for one concept, yet one dies off, the remaining 2 are still one without missing a beat is cowhide. I just don't know how to help you because your heart and soul are not spiritually acute, right now. Hopefully our dialogue on this board will benefit somebody to know the truth about the Creator of all. The three in one racket will not save you. O repeat, it will not benefit you no how.







[quote]God was not lying when Jesus was baptized and he said this is my beloved son in whom i am well pleased and at the same time the Holy Ghost come upon Jesus.

Let me start from the last: the ghost that could not be seen now suddenly became visible? And ordinary folks who were standing around heard the voice of God Almighty and they all lived, even though they were not prophets? How is greter, the one who Baptised or the one who was baptised? And I have not used the Q.u.r'an here, at all. I will leave you to debate your statement about God and His prophet, Jesus in your heart.

The thing is to think that God was trying to play with our minds but NO God was showing that there is three person and they agree so beautiful in service and love.

God serves you, you said? God will only love you up to the time of death, except that you do His will as per knowing who He is, One indivisible God, worship Him alone as He should be worshipped without any mediator between you and Him, and put your trust and direct your request to Him alone. In the day of Judgement, those who see Him as multiple person, godheads, setting up rivals, associates, partners, etc with Him will definitely be hated as the other idol worshippers.

There is no Fraud in God or deception there are three person and they are very different.

You are now showing your understanding of your god! Tell me, what is the definition of different, other than indicating a condition where there is more than one? It is true that there is no fraud in God. But you have been very fraudulent in describing more than one god to us and passing that up to us as One Supreme Lord God. Could there be more than One Supreme Lord God? Never!

The Holy Ghost Commander in Chief of the heavenly Host

Heavenly host means angel(s), doesn't it? Is there any host in the heavens except the angels? Who could be the head of the Angels except Angel Gabreil? And we have been telling you all along that the Holy spirit is nothing more than an Angel; Gabreil, whom is known in the Q.u.r'an among many great noble names as Ruuh Qudus!

The son Jesus The solicitor, the law giver, the lamb, the High priest, The saviour and prince of peace

I used to call a cousin of mine Dad after the passing of my father many a decade ago. I also called my older brothers who were olde than him dad, also. So were my Uncles from my father and mother sides. I had so many fathers more than youcan shake a stake at. Was anyone of them my true father? It is obvious that it was my way of respecting each of them. They knew who my father was. They knew that they were not my father, because they did not sire me. They did not mount my mother Mariam and therefore did not beget me. Now tell me how did Jesus become God son again? Am listening and don't side step the issue as I believe you will. Surprise me, because i like to be surprise here and now.


Solicitor, Law giver, the lamb, the high priest, savior and prince of peace: Did he do more than Moses in any of these quality? No. Moses solicited for the children of Isreal before the Black King Tyrant of Egypt; Pharaoh. Moses said let my people go from the burden of slavery in order to serve and worship God their creator. Moses gave the children of Israel the laws, the tablets containing the commandments which Jesus himself obeyed! Is there anyone a higher priest than Moses among the Children of Israel; aand it is stated that there was never appeared among the Israelites any prophet that is up to Moses. Was Jesus not a prophet, considering that he called himself and his disciples called him a prophet after he had been lifted to heaven? Moses saved the Israelite sfrom the calamity that they were suffering and the certain destruction they would have suffered from Pharaoh. Moses saved them and suffered so much as the lamb in the hand of pharaoh. Moses brought peace into their hearts at least after Pharaoh army perished. Imagine what Moses went through pleading the case(s) of the israelite with God, since they are stffnecked people? Can there be a children of israel higher than Moses?

The father The Judge of all. The only being that is called Love

Note that I used to call many of mymale relative dad? But finally many call me dad now. And not all of them are my children. And in the Judgement and Love we see that Jesus is conspicuously absent, as you put "father god' in charge here. But where is holyspirit god in any of the after life events?

Note the difference

The difference is that you are completely off the chart, since you are very wrong in your exposition of what god is. You provide a gubbly gook at best. I will just take it that you were sleep writing. Thats my defense of the nonsensical that you wrote.

Jesus will judge Church

The church he did not build now suggest that it should be built. Before you try to say that he did mention anything about church, be assure that I will ask you to show me where the word "church" ever existed in the lexicon of the Children of israel, before you christians go to Greek on a Jewish message from a jewish messenger for a jewish pwople. It sounds like democracy, don it? Finally who will judge the son? Who will Judge Adam, Noah, Ibrahim the friend of God, Isiaq, Yaqub, Yusus, Moses, Yahya who performed the rites of Bermitva on Jesus, etc? And who will Judge Mary the mother of Jesus, who will Judge david and his wise son (with his wisdom, was it likely to commit any sin, yet you people said that he worshipped idols?), who will Judge Zachariah, and who will Judge the Apostles/or the twelve disciples which does not include Paul, who will Judge Paul? Who will judge the holy spirit? Who will Judge the Angels? Who will Judge the Jinns?

The father will Judge Satan and all his followers

The son is left with the easy task, right? But will any in the church be found to err by Jesus? Be very careful as you know that being in the church is to accept the lordship of Jesus, so that should qualify them to go to christian heaven. Whatever heaven means, you know it already. But did all who were in the church do 100% good? What happens to those who are less than 100%, eg Mussollini, etc? I see that you hate the catholics, what happenes to them? What happens to the jehovah witnesses? What happens to the Jesuit? What happens to the cleargy homosexuals? What happens to all the deviants and then what happens to you in the hand of Jesus? Will he say that he did not know you as he will say to many?


You know i set the scenrio of jesus as the judge up since you brought it up to go against the "ge away from me, I do not know you" future statement from him. The reason is that that statement shows that he is not the one judging the people he is saying this to. It is very clear that they went to him seeking his protection to act as savior or intercessor. But he did not even want to plead their cases before the judge. Obviously, the judge is not him and those who went to him are not muslims, but christians. Yet he failed them.


Now you have to excplain to me, how can this scenario above happen, if he was the one to judge the church? How is it possible that your god is now refusing your pleading with him to intercede on your behalf when you already billed him up as a judge in the first place? Ae you in the church now asking him to intercede on your behalf with himself as your judge? Would it not have been prudent for you to wait your turn when you appear for his judgement to now plead that he simply have mercy on you, but not as intercessor? How can he judge you when he is not even allowing you to come to him to intercede for you as your savior with himself as your judge?


If you and me had wagered, by A.ll.ah I would have won, and your ransome for freedom whould have been Laa ilaha ilallah, M.uhamm.adanr Rasulullah (as), Isa bin Mariam Rasulullah. (as).

Read from the scripture that is qouted to you when explaining any doctrine so that you are don't go into Heresy. No one is above natural mistakes but the sin is to continue therein.

I have no comment. But Justcool, not all that glitter are gold.

[/quote]

@Backslider: I am laughing at you. Your most high was the one who was staked on the cross? If he could not defeat those crudely armed mob, how is he going to be able to stand the warring of a modern day well equiped man? He will be doomed again in equal time as before or faster,you see. Except he was not the true MOST HIGH.

Why worshipping in another way like the Onisangos or the Aborishas of the Yorubas? It reminds of Salvadorian people of Brazil who are still pursuing their Yoruba agenda in all things including worship. They now call Yamaja, yemaya, and a veriety other Yoruba religions, mixing them with a splice of Christianity. The Cuban and the Panamanians, etc are just the same.

I don't think these people actually vie too far off from christianity; they have an intercessor (the idol) and they call it their savior. Backslider, I continue to invite you to I.s,lam, the same way I invited Ndidi, who immediately reverted, Bola who took a longer time to accept and my mother who finally did. The door of the mercy of Al Rahman is wide and is open. Accept guidance and be benefitted. Jesus will never be able to save you. It is a guarantee from The TRue Most High.

@~lady~:

So did God write the Qu'ran and dropped it from heaven?

Thats not the way it happened. In a period of 23 years, 13 in Makka and the last 10 in Hijra (the Madina period), the verses of the Qu.r'a.n were revealed to M.uha.mmad via Angel Gabreil. Except the last 4 verse of Chapter 2, Surah baqarah, which he received in heavens on the Night Journey known as Isra wa Miraj, all were through Angel Gabreil.


Where are you woman, I have been trying to reach you on the thread you promised. Enjoy the Special occasion. Keep in touch.

@Justcool:

The son of God is not an entirely different person from God. It is not like when a human being has a son, humans sons are completely different persons and not one with their father. The human father is complete even without the son, and the human son is complete even without his father. But in the case of Jesus, HE is a part of God and God is not complete without Him neither is HE complete without God. Hence: "I and My Father are One." The same is the case with the Holy spirit. Like the seven colours that make up the color white. Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and God the father represent three colours that make up God.

I was going to laugh at your light specrum analogy, and simply give you a response about if a condition is developed where a sprectrum is obstructed from the seven, what would the outcome be when you invert a prizm to converge them a single sprectrum of light, Would you get a pure white or something ooff white? But you already see your own follow with your seven smileys that ended the second absurd 1/3 3 sections that make up 1 whole. See what you reduce your god to?


But as i read your thesis of your god's inability to be independently complete except he has son god and holy ghost god with him, I have to cringe about how your mind works. You cheapened your god so much that the hindus and all the others have more trust in their god than you have on yours. There god only manifested in many things, but no manifestation form needs another before it can completely function. Unlike you, your father god need son god to talk to and save mankind, and your holy spirit god is the one that created. Shameful thoughts by you and it is only for your type of mindset that can accept it.

Ironically, you forgot that your god only commanded that light should exist when he decided to create light. That same god who created mankind by simple pronouncement of the commandment, is now incapable of forgiveness of humanbeings, his priced creating, which he made in his own image? He did not know that man are imperfect before he created it, even he had already hellfire and paradise, for rewards of evil and goods respectively? Is your good an all knower or lacks some knowledge still, and this is why he had to send himself, or his son, or his third to be killed for saving mankind? Again, yet before he jhad created hellfire to punish?

Are these two ideas not opposing each other with complete strength? Your god is not my God, for sure. My God is complete. He lays down the laws and commandments. He supports His creations with mercy and allows them the freedom to choose. Yet He is full of mercy and accepts rependance again and again, until just before death. And throughout the period that humans are alive the door of mercy is never closed. My God is indepently capable of doing all things.

@Vivaladiva: Easy woman. Don't ask for what you can't handle. Shaitan will not be able to handle hell. But of course ask for Paradise, because in heaven (Christians listen up), there is Paradise and Hellfire.

@4Him:

Plenty of noise making and YET not a single attempt to answer the KEY question?

I wonder what benefit you have derived from the truth that you have been presented with all the over 1 year that I have known you? Please make a triangle a straight line, without destroying its structure. And when you do remove one side from this triangle, would you still have a triangle or will it continue to have the same strength, mass,structure, etc? Can a triangle ever pass for a straight line? Can you have three componenents of the same object have 100% value each and when you add them together will still have 100%? And if you destroy one of them what you have remaining is still 100%?

Will it not therefore means that either One of them is truly 100% and the others are 0% each, or that each is 100%/3? Either way you look at it your math will have to be not confusing, because God is not the Author of confusion!

You are a classic example of the dishonest. Please see below for proof:

Se e ri omo yi to nbu mi o. Jeje mi ni mo nlo o. lol. I will see what you wrote and then give you a neck shot with it. David, David. Omo obanta, O kare.

- Joseph and the children of Jacob have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the children of Ishmael as they had already separated as a people, to attempt to smuggle both into the same lineage is to play the hypocrite.

I id not ask if if they had nothing to do with each other. However, since you raise this matter, again, it is not the position of even Isaac or his mother Sarah to deny the Arabs of the lineage from Ibrahim through first son Ismail. I wonder if they were never in contact with each other, will these two families as branches of the same Tree trunk, Ibrahim know about each other? Check the Bible. You have alot to learn. How did the Israelite knew about "Ismail" bloodline, since you people where able to trace the line of M.u.ha.mmad; remember you were always bloastfully proud of it, David? Hypocritical forgetfulness: give me a desease name that i can say that you suffer by being selectively dishonest on this potent matter. Help me out here, Dave.

- We don't know the exact details of every single day in the life of the biblical heroes but we know and can trace their journeys through biblical and historical records of their most important acts.
WHERE IS THE HISTORY OF THE DESCENDANTS OF ISHMAEL? The qu'ran contains jumbled up and plagiarised stories of the jews, where is the story of the ishmaelites? Did all'ah consider them too unimportant to include in his q'uran?

Each time I read your Ismailite debackle, I smile because you could have easily punched Ismaila and Arab in the Qu.r'a.n, on google. Or Arabs and Makkans before Prophet M.u.hammad,I have not tried it but you would have seen plenty to read from in the Qu.r'an. I think you are being lazy in not doing your research properly before you asked this above question. Thats your assignment, agent Spacely, in the get smart TV series.


.

what is the meaning of this drivel? What question are you attempting to answer here?

Since you did not do your homework about the arabs/makkans before the prophetic presence of the noble soul in Makka, you do mnot know the event of the Elephant people. I am trying to help you here, instead of asking me questions, which you could have gotten the answers in the Q.ur'an.

this is a question that exposes the fraud of is'lam. It considers jewish historical details important enough to include in the qu'ran and deems pre-is'lamic period as unimportant? Who is fooling who here?

My dear David, Aburo, Omo mi. You fail to realise that the branch of the house of Ibrahim which you clearly love to pieces, like the reeces pieces , from the Bible only are a chuck full of deceits: Leavin Sarah out of this, Isaac was blind when his wife deceived him, favoring Jacob over Esau, both of them her sons. Is this the mark of a good mother? Shall we go to the Children of Jacob because I do not want to waste too much time on Biblical Jacob? His sons plotted against their own brother, while they deceived him in his state of blindness! And it took a black man and a black nation to bring them to prominence.

If I jump to Moses, we see how they traverse the wildness for forty years instead of 40 days! Why, because they did tremendous evil. You need more? How about their many idol worshipping? Are they really better than the arabs preM.uhamm.ad? How about their harlotry? You know the whole story maybe better than me, but your biased mind will not let you tell the truth. How about their disobedience to God and killing a number of the prophets? Afterall the kill your god, Jesus. These are the people you align yourself with and called them the elect of God still, after all of these? Elect of your god who killed your god is your best friend? You must truly love your god. If he is truly a god he should reject you.


From this above, we see that there is a great lesson to be learnt about doers of evil, and the rewards for them. We also see the many examples of true believers in true belief and in their steadfastness, they are rewarded and a good place is awaiting them in the hereafter. This is why you have the history of the Children of Israel from Israel (Jacob) onward to Jesus. Remember there were stories about people before Jacob ( these people were not "Children of Israel" and stories about people after Jesus; (the arabs; before M.uha.mmad. That was my reason I was telling you about the people of the elephants lead by Abraha of Saba (a territory covering Yemen all the wat to Ethiopia).

Beyond murder, terror and suicide bombers how has is'lam benefited the world?

The University system is based on Is.lam.ic academic. So give thanks for your Educational system which is based on Al Azar University in Cairo, Egypt. What about medicine and other branches of academics? What about constitution/treaty between people to live by, giving rights to everyone, irrespective of gender? Check out the constitution of madina under the prophet? What about alliances and being true to your promises? Finally what about Banking? The word and system of Checking account is from where?

read through your own post, if you see a smidgen of truth there please show me.

There is no God but One. He is Supreme. He depends on no one. But all depend on Him> He has no father or mother. Yet He has no offspring, be it male or female. There is nothing is liken to Him. My Unique God!

but the qu'ran cares enough to include that of the jews?

The Jews are your chosen people. God put their unclothedness in front of you, so that you can see their true nature. Will you learn from it and take admonition? In all the 4000 years as you have said, they never become true believer enmass. They did not even believe your god no how! Aree!

Really? Is'lam came to eradicate all the evils that are the hallmark of typical mus'lem states? wow!

Q.ur'a.n is the primary manual for eradication of all evils. And at the same tiime the master blueprint for goodness. This does not mean that all m.u.sl.ims will be 100% good. Afterall there will be 73 sects coming out of it. Except one, the 72 other sects will go to hell along with Chrsitians, Jews, Hindus, buddhist, etc.

I wonder what is the hallmark of the Jews and Christians who are the ones who had the many types of nukes and ammo? The christians let us know that they have them, but the Jews are not telling about what they have.

@M_nwankwo: You see why education does not necessarily translate to good and accurate practice of true religion. You and many are struggling explain 3 to mean1 without any success. Its like me trying to pass up triangle for a straight line, or someting that it is not.

I wonder what happens to the God Who is not the Author of Confusion?

@Olaadegbu: It is the mercy of God Himself that led me to and keep me still in I.s.lam. I will not turn back from it, InshaAll.ah. I am very satisfied, and do not intend to worship a multi headed god.

@Lamide:

You either return to something or go back to something.
@ topic
As clearly stated in the Holy writ: by their fruit (i.e. the end product of their ways and manner of life) you shall know them.

I wonder what your point is? Lamide, did you get my drift? Thats what counts. And as you have said, its at the end shall you know where lies the truth. While a person is still alive the future is never known, Angel.

The Angel should always be clothed.

@Kola Oloye:

Olabowale,
Your knowledge is great,i really appreciate it but you still lack something.
Understanding of the word of the Bible. If you had spent 1/4 of the time you
spent on the The Great Book on bible study you would have been so great.There are
some things i'd need to explain to you but let it be tomorrow.Thanks.

Am laughing, Kola. All my life up to 1975, I never held a Q.u.r'an. I was raised by a christian mother and went to Christian school and study Bible knowledge. What else. And truly, I did not begin to to study the Q.ur'an until 1998. Now tell me, you want me to return back to ignorance?

Olowo Tee;

Thanks @Lady for taking time to explain to our brother Olabowale. But, it's just a pity that he knows some of these things, but just wouldn't admit. The doctrines are too comprehensive for him to understand!! he needs spiritual awakening. I pray God opens his eyes. Amen

Only doctrine, and no reality.







@~Lady~[Quote]:There is just no point explaining what the Bible itself calls a mystery to minds not renewed by the blood.[/quote]Mystery to mind not renewed by the blood you said? Is this not the same blood letting that you complain about the Jewss? While their God demanded blood of animals, your demanded blood of human. AAnd yet, in both cases no one can guarantee that all Jews or christians will be spared of the fire of hell! No one, and that included Jesus., can make the guaranty.

1Ti 3:16 says , And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. To all who have tried to give a valid explanations, well, you have tried but these guys will never understand it. It has not being given to them.

Arbitrary statement that has no proof or foundation. Its ironic that you quoted Timothy to explain Jesus. Is it because Jesus could not explain himself? Or did he tell Timothy about all of these?

You are right. Your explanation is very weak because your hypothesis is very weak. I wonder if you actually believe that M.us.lims need to listen to you, especially considering that we have the Glorious Q.u.r'an with us? Its you who should now move to taste the sweet nectar of I.sla.m and shed off your burden.


Exactly my point. . . . . .I just read through this.

@Cgift:

Point of correction. Jesus is not only a prophet. The Bible and the The Great Book calls Him the Messiah! So what is this fuss about Him being a prophet. It is also unfortunate that you can't even understand what and who a prophet is according to your qu'ran. How do we identify a prophet if we do not have his prophecies. Why call Abraham and jo, etc prophets when you do not even have their prophecies in your book. This is delusional!

What was Jesus if he was not a Prophet? Was it not in your Bible that Jesus said that a prophet has no honor in his own house, while he referred to himself? What was Jesus except that he was a human being since he referred to himself as son of man? We agree that Jesus was a Massiah, but tow whom, except that he was to the Children of Israel, alone. Did you not find this written in your Bible?


And please tell me the prophesies of Ibrahim or/and Jo (what do you mean by jo?), that are in the Bible and I will tell you what is in the Q.u.r'an,. We will compare and see which book is better and comprehensive.

A prophet tells you the mind of God and by virtue of the Holy Spirit of God is able to tell you very secret things you never knew any other persons would know except you. He can also tell you what plans God has for you and what to expect at a certain point in time in your life and you will be surprised things will just fall into place the way he has said it. Its one of the manifestations of the gift of the Holy Spirit of God. The Holy Spirit of God knows the mind of God and any person/thing that knows the mind of another must be one / same with that person. That is just taking you on an introduction to the mystery of the oneness of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost that has eluded you mooslims till now.

So aburo, Omo yaa, why did Jesus failed to know the time of the hour when he was asked? I am just using your Bible to destroy your fallacy. Why was Jesus begging in prayer in the Garden of geshemane and of course from your Bible we see that he was killed on the cross, a proof that his prayer was rejected? Why did Jesus cried out as he complained or lamented that he was abandoned? These showed that you put a label that does not belong to Jesus on him. This will be your big problem in the future. Maybe these are the reasons of "i do not know you" even as they used to performed miracles by his name. Don't be one of those people, Cgift.

So, bros, that you have refused to wake up to study and know more of the things of God happening in the church does not mean they are not real. You people have decided to remain in the dark in this age of revelation of of's knowledge. So revel in your darkness but never lay claim to what you don't know and have never experienced.

The reason traditional religion leadership or for lack of better words "Witch Doctors," are still in existence is that sometimes what they say to their believers are true in the lives of these people. But the truth about these thing is more illusion and there is no reality to it. Its like magic. It is a slight of hand. All are terrible shows. If the razzle dazzle in the churches are signs of success to you, then wait till the time of death.

But don't we see the folks healed in the churches now claiming that they were just propsto deceive the gullibles? And as yo your knowledge, I need to remind you that Al Azar University in Egypt is Oldest University on earth. It is an i.sla.mic Institution. The first revelation in the Q.ur'a.n commands mankind to read. You are just saying things that do not help your cause. But your cause is very weak.

@Backslider;

THE Qu'ran has no single verifiable History.

Its very hard to know what you mean. But if you are saying that Q.u.r'a.n does not have any history except what the Bible contain, then I ask you where is Luqman in the Bible? Or where is the information about the body of Moses Pharaoh? If you mean that what historical process that brought about the Q.u.r'an, then i will ask you the same thing about the Bible, in general. But when you read the history of Mu.h.ammad, you will understand better. All in all, i do not understand your question, so my answers above are just my effort to read between the lines.

Even in the times of m.oha.med we see that the hadith is flooded with contradiction.

There were no contradictory hadith in this time. The word hadith itself is the saying of this noble prophet. Hadith are being formed by his saying, so there could not have been contradictions. There are gradual weaning of drunks from drinking for example. And there are gradual processes that stopped the people who used to have sexual orgies from stopping it altogether. there was gradual process of getting them to pray to compulsion to pray. There was gradual stoppage of people talking in the prayer from total silence and full concentration in prayer. I wonder if these are your confusions? To bring a people who used to have intercessors and saviors numbering over 300 to direct worship of One True God who is Unseen is a contradiction to you, then I see why you limit your intercessor to one and your gods to three. In all you may not be better than them with 300 plus intercessors.

I.slam will slam you to hell

You mean fire of lake. You have no hell in Christianity. I guess your christianity will lead you to heaven and not Paradise. But in heaven, there are 7 heavens. I gues you dont know which one is your heaven. I dont wanna surprise you that in heaven, presently, there is hell and paradise already. And since you have no understanding of Paradise, i guess you will have to go to the other place in heaven.

Please tell me the History of I.Slam before mohamed.

After you tell me the history of Christianity before Jesus. You find me taking you to task, right away.

Show me the geneology of Ishmeal that shows arabs as descendant.

There was no dispute about who the father of M.u.ha.mmad was. Or who is grandfather was, or his great grandfather. There was no dispute who his forebearer was to Ibrahim, in the bloodline of Ibrahim. So where is your problem and why the hot on the collar matter?


You may not know that it is because of the fact that Mary was unmarried at the time of the birth of Jesus was the singular reason the Jews accused her of infidelity. If she were married already, it will be hard pressed for her to remain a Virgin pass the first night of her marriage to a normal husband. Maybe you will argue that Joseph was a sexual invalid. (Even me at this age, no woman will last the night with me, remaining a Virgin as my wife. Then you will have to explain that it is temporary condition which Joseph suffered, and the Bible failed to record it). We also find that Joseph fathered Jesus brothers, which you are insinuating that they are also Mary's children. If you look at all of these, the Bible must have omitted many factual information, or embellished many to provide a very far fetched concept, or both.

Please don't use the "fraudulent" bible.

And I did not. Why would i use fraud when there is truth available to me. The prophet was not happy to see that Umar read the bible. The part of what he read happened to be true because he saw it in the Qur.'a.n. Yet the master was there with him, alive and there was no need to go into what may be a mixture of some truth and alot of lies.