₦airaland Forum

I know that Nezan loves his face to be smooth as the face of infants or women! Short pamts like Knickers must be a terrible thing, though the whole of southern hemisphere,including Tpia in New Zealand are now wearing it because its good for the weather. In July, everyone in northern hemisphere will adopt this very comfortable, weather appropriate clothing. And I am not sure you do not have a knicker, yourself?

@javalove: « #8 on: December 02, 2008, 05:12 PM » 

Quote from: Mustay on October 30, 2008, 12:43 PM
Muslim women are not required to cover their face and hands.
remember,
"Verily, this religion (of ours) is simple and easy to follow; whoever makes it hard will only be overwhelmed by it."
is this a quranic verse, a hadith or words of scolars. pls lets be clear on this.
and what does what do u mean by "simple" those wearing niqab make it hard?
pls xplain sir.

It is a statement of the prophet (as). But it is an explanation of Quranic verses "Muslims of Muhammad is a nation of middle course, not extreme in either case, unlike the christians who are to open that human becomes God and no reparcursion for anything, while the Jews are so hard that they exclude almost everybody from possibility of having mercy since God becomes a tribal thing! Niqab at best is a sunnah, copying the household of the prophet. it is however not a commandment in the Quran for all muslim women, who are required to cover all that have to be covered in Salah, and thats all.

@Toba;

A Rough Analogy
About 20 years ago, Dr. Harold Willmington (Liberty University) shared an analogy he had heard with his students, comparing the Trinity to a book. For example, a book has length, width, and thickness. The length is not the book’s width, the width is not the book’s thickness. These three dimensions can be described separately, yet they are connected together. If you remove one dimension, you are no longer describing a book. In the same way, the Godhead has three separate members that are connected together, and if you try to remove one you no longer have the Godhead.

I wanted to ridicle your doctor, but he ridicled himself, already! So if the book is chopped off 1/3, by either length, or breadth, or width, the book will not be a complete book, anymore or in your mind, still a complete book? That would have been the condition of your Godhead when you said Jesus died for badly calculated 3 days, either using Jewish sundown to sundown or the 24 hours a day calculation? Was there not a time then that Christians did not have a living God as the above proved, accurately, if Jesus was part of the Godhead, yet died even for a moment, even an incomplete God? Is that a good understanding of Christian God? Does a dying God make any sense, if you really have a God? Does Godhead really need to be existing?

Just for kicks; what if a new book gets a cover damage, shall the buyer pay full price for it or it becomes a damaged good, at knock off price? What if couple of pages are torned off? Will you still call it a complete Book? Is this what your Godhead is, Toba?

@Ayusman16; « #4 on: Today at 07:49:34 PM »

So shall all be wiped out of the face of the earth. Insha Allahu!
Why drink & drive when u can weed & fly!!!!!!

I see you are already flying since you believe that Allah will wipe out Muslims, when you see with your own eyes that Muslims are getting larger in population.


@Abu Zola (m); « #5 on: Today at 08:20:52 PM »

May Allah forgive you amen

Only if he wishes for forgiveness, then the Forgiver will forgive him. The guy has to want it.


@ayusman16 (m):« #6 on: Today at 08:22:12 PM »

Allah is so powerless hence he cannot forgive me. Allah that Mutallab and his cohorts are fighting for? Is he not powerless.
Why drink & drive when u can weed & fly!!!!!!

Ayisman16 is beside himself in silliness. The same Allah he says is powerless, is the same Whom he had prayed to above! This guy Usman is a confused soul. Abdulmutallab (why Abdul with Mutallab, when it is not one of Allah's praising Names?) Senior was the man who reported his son to the American authorities who dropped the ball, unable to "connect the dots"! Is there a greater honesty than a father who reported the evil of his offspring? Can any 70 year old christian father report his 23 year old engineer "son" who can actually be his grandson concerning his intended evil?


@toba (m); « #7 on: Today at 08:26:54 PM »
]quote]so u can pray for people? May allah be praised

[/quote]Allah, not allah, mr. keferi of true belief! Abu Zola has always been praying for people. Duuh!


@ayusman16 (m): « #8 on: Today at 08:28:48 PM »
[quote]His prayers does not go above the floor he hits his head while praying, Canal Religion!

Liar. When he stands he makes dua. Thats higher and above the floor he touches his head. Am sure there must have been something evil about Christianity; touching doe not necessarily mean hitting, mr. Usman, you need to drop the name and adopt Saul or Paul; a befitting name for you!

Why drink & drive when u can weed & fly!!!!!!

Big fighter (sorry follower of Jesus) do fly after weeding!

« #10 on: Today at 08:31:25 PM »
You mean your Allah is a killer? I pity the idiots like you he uses. Where is Mutallab now? Am sure the American prisoners would have shifted his gindi.

Just like Yahweh/Jehovah, or the one that slept (sorry came upon and over shadowed Mary so that the virgin can get pregnant, and after Joseph the capenter slept with her for real, she miraculously maintain her virginty! no wonder jesus is miraculously god; liar falling blindly for stupid miracles or actually dumb to realise that these are impossible), and the meek Biblical Jesus who threw temper tantrum at early age throwing out old people from their favorite business; charging interest which they still do, today! The big difference is that Allah did not wipe out people, except that they are adult disbelievers, and or evil doers. but the Jehovah killed everyone, including men, women, animals, children, etc, and wo will forget the innocent first sons/births of all things; including animals of Egypt?

which tongue did you laugh in; Jesus's or Paul's? What did it sound like and what did you say? whats the meaning of what you said? i just laughed in oyinbo; hahah!

@Toba: « #222 on: Today at 04:21:38 PM »

Quote from: olabowale on Today at 03:58:52 PM
@Toba: « #218 on: Today at 02:33:52 PM » If Jesus was not married, how could he truly know the joy of marriage, being a spouse, a parent? No wonder many of the Chistians dont follow him in this respect!
Is any of the verses, or books from the above words of Jesus? Did Jesus pass more than "Gospel" time, even up to the "Acts" and now you are quoting the epistles, and others as if they are from Jesus? Quran and ahadith teached better than that; wife is mate of husband, equal in every respect, except in the obvious; strength! They are both responsible, individually for their own actions. Unlike the Bible, where Eve is the culprit of all sins, and neither is forgiven and thereby saddled with original sin, Quran takes it that both were responsible, equally, and eventually forgiven and there is no original sin! The Quran has a Chapter dedicated to "WOMEN", cautioning people to continue to have connection with the womb that bore them, the whole family and even mankind as a whole! The hadith of Muhammad (AS) says that no one is a true believer except he is kind to his wife. Muhammad (AS) says that women are made from the bent part of the rib (we all agree on it), and be gentle with the rib so that you do not break it!
Inferior in the same way that the one you call God is having a messenger/prophet experience in Matthew 4 verses 1-11? Thats some inferiority, just like thats some God in Matthew 4 [1-11]!
Jesus needed not marriage, he came for a reconciliatory mission and not make babies colossians 1:18-23

The bolded is ridiculous. You left of the "Gospel; John, Matthew, Mark, Luke" and you are giving me Colossians? What has Jesus got to do with it? Oh, he is the writer, another parable, you are telling me?

Also peter and other disciples were eye witness to Jesus' account and they reported it. Read what paul said in 1corinthians 15 1-3

Can you imagine yourself, toba? You mentioned Peter and other disciples, but arguing with Paul! When did Paul ever was a disciple? Are you ok? The whole of the Quran was revealed to Muhammad in 23 years, with many people witnesses, since each verse is either an answer to question(s) and or instructions or example of what has passed, and or what is to come. The Quran is from Allah, Alone, while hadith is from Muhammad, therefore similar to your Bible, espectially the Toraha and the Gospel!

Lastly Jesus is superior to mohammad becos Jesus is God see the above explanations on trinity Mohammad admitted he was not more than a messenger and JESUS was more Than that

So if Jesus is God, explain Matthew 4 verses 1 through 11 to us? Explain Trinity to us, a word that is not even in the Bible!

@Toba: « #220 on: Today at 03:47:23 PM »  

Quote from: olabowale on Today at 03:29:26 PM
@Toba: « #200 on: Yesterday at 07:36:06 PM » then Jesus must have spoken in parable, everytime he spoke, if you can call a physical sword, spiritual as if it cant be seen, felt as if its not made of metal! Jesus must have been talking in parable (what he meant is different from what he said) when he said he and his father (not really his father) are one (not really one). Matthew 4 verses 1 to 11 show us that Jesus is a slave, a worshipper of God!
should there be a need of an interpretation of an obvious thing, like "Buy swords, and two were purchased"? By the way, when Jesus overturned the Table of the exchangers "he was just playing them", and "he was not showing any violence!" Can we just imagine if Jesus had a sword at that time that he was chasing the moneychangers off the plaza of his "father's house (not really his father since everything is parable)" he will strike them with it and it would have been a strike in parable, too. So if they died, it would have been death in parable, and not in reality!
When Jesus said it is finished on the cross, it was a parable, he did not truly died, no worldly death. No way, no how. Lol. Toba, am following your thinking, man.

NO PROMBLEM. WHAT DO HAVE TO SAY TO THESE

Sacrifice:   Jesus voluntarily laid his life down for others

Are you for real man? Jesus pulled all the tricks to not die; begged, prayed, cried, wept, etc and thats before he got to the Garden of Geshemane where he prayed all night till morning about "please take the cup off my head,, and finally on the cross blaming God; my God, my God, why has thou forsaken me." Where is the voluntary in all of that? Ande those who commit suicide will go to hell fire!

Muhammad saved his own life many times and had others killed.

Muhammad (AS) did not save his life, except that Allah did not wish him dead, at the times you are complaining about. Proof, when he was poisoned, he did not cower, and he did not kill the jewish woman who put te poison. At the time of his death, which were already predicted in the Quran (Surah Imran, Surah Azhab, etc), he was given opportunity to remain on earth, but he said he was eager to meet his Lord! The second to the last verse of Surah Taubah, Allah says that Muhammad (AS) is a messenger who has come among mankind, concern about man's condition in the day of Judgement if he does not obey God, eager that man changes his way to good and righteous guidance.

Sin:   Jesus never sinned (1 Pet. 2:22)

Jesus said whoever says a person is a fool will go to hellfire because of that utterance. But he turned around and called people fool! Now tell me where will such an utterance will lead the speaker? If its hellfire, who are in hellfire, except sinners?

Muhammad was a sinner (Quran 40:55; 48:1-2)

There is no place where Allah says, Oh Muhammad, you are a sinner! Whats interesting is that you do not see that Allah says that He has protected Muhammad from all evil, hence admonishing Muhammd in what you quoted is simply indicating that no one is independent from the mercy and forgiveness of Allah, even His beloved Messenger/Prophet is not independent!

Slaves:   Jesus owned no slaves   Muhammad owned slaves.

You are a slave of Jesus. Islam came to eradicate slavery, so Muhammad (AS), as a prophet did not own any!

Virgin Birth:   Jesus was virgin born   Muhammad was not virgin born.

This means what? Then please tell me what A woman who came to existence without a birth of virgin or not virgin mother, and no father either! Tell  me about a man who came to existence without father and without mother!

Voice of God:   Jesus received and heard the direct voice of God (Mark 1:10-11)

Remember that Jesus said "what he shall hear, from God, he sahll repeat". Who was that person, if not Muhammad (AS)?

Muhammad did not receive or hear the direct voice of God. It was an angel instead.

Surah Najm proofs you wrong. Go read it! I dont want to upset you since you dont even know that Muhammad even went to heaven, returned to earth in one night when he got the commandment of Salah.

There is no comparison between Jesus and Muhammad. Muhammad falls so far short that he cannot be held on any level remotely close to Jesus. Muhammad is clearly inferior to Christ.

Only from your mouth, the same way it is only from your mouth that Jesus is god! The truth in both cases is different. Jesus was no god, since Matthew 4 verses 1-11 among others point completely opposite. Muhammad is not inferior since the Bible talks about the anothet Comforter, hearing and repeating, and we can say that ghost which you said is god, too is hearing and repeating what another God commanded, for God cant command God! The ahadith of Isra wa Miraj showed that Muhammad (AS) led all prophets, including Jesus and even Malaika Jibril in Salah.

There is no comparison between Jesus and Muhammad. Muhammad falls so far short that he cannot be held on any level remotely close to Jesus. Muhammad is clearly inferior to Christ.

You repeat yourself, arguing against "The another Comfort which is Muhammad (as)"!

@Toba: « #218 on: Today at 02:33:52 PM »  

WOMEN & MARRIAGE AS DESCRIBED BY JESUS AND MOHAMMAD(SAW)
JESUS:  was not married.

If Jesus was not married, how could he truly know the joy of marriage, being a spouse, a parent? No wonder many of the Chistians dont follow him in this respect!  

He healed women, forgave women, and encouraged women.  The New Testament teaches that husbands should love their wives and not be harsh with them:  Col. 3:19, Eph. 5:25,  that men and women are equal in Christ - Gal 3:28, that they should be treated with respect - 1 Pet  3:7.

Is any of the verses, or books from the above words of Jesus? Did Jesus pass more than "Gospel" time, even up to the "Acts" and now you are quoting the epistles, and others as if they are from Jesus? Quran and ahadith teached better than that; wife is mate of husband, equal in every respect, except in the obvious; strength! They are both responsible, individually for their own actions. Unlike the Bible, where Eve is the culprit of all sins, and neither is forgiven and thereby saddled with original sin, Quran takes it that both were responsible, equally, and eventually forgiven and there is no original sin! The Quran has a Chapter dedicated to "WOMEN", cautioning people to continue to have connection with the womb that bore them, the whole family and even mankind as a whole! The hadith of Muhammad (AS) says that no one is a true believer except he is kind to his wife. Muhammad (AS) says that women are made from the bent part of the rib (we all agree on it), and be gentle with the rib so that you do not break it!

Once Again Im bold to say There is no comparison between Jesus and Muhammad. Muhammad falls so far short that he cannot be held on any level remotely close to Jesus. Muhammad is clearly inferior to Christ.

Inferior in the same way that the one you call God is having a messenger/prophet experience in Matthew 4 verses 1-11? Thats some inferiority, just like thats some God in Matthew 4 [1-11]!

@Toba: « #200 on: Yesterday at 07:36:06 PM »

Did u read vs 35? When jesus said to his disciples not to worry about anything.Jesus spoke in parables&wasnt refering to wordly sword but spiritual.

then Jesus must have spoken in parable, everytime he spoke, if you can call a physical sword, spiritual as if it cant be seen, felt as if its not made of metal! Jesus must have been talking in parable (what he meant is different from what he said) when he said he and his father (not really his father) are one (not really one). Matthew 4 verses 1 to 11 show us that Jesus is a slave, a worshipper of God!

If not, y didnt he tell them who to kill with d sword or to go to war with it.U lack interpretation skill my Guy

should there be a need of an interpretation of an obvious thing, like "Buy swords, and two were purchased"? By the way, when Jesus overturned the Table of the exchangers "he was just playing them", and "he was not showing any violence!" Can we just imagine if Jesus had a sword at that time that he was chasing the moneychangers off the plaza of his "father's house (not really his father since everything is parable)" he will strike them with it and it would have been a strike in parable, too. So if they died, it would have been death in parable, and not in reality!

When Jesus said it is finished on the cross, it was a parable, he did not truly died, no worldly death. No way, no how. Lol. Toba, am following your thinking, man.

Tpia, se emi lo nba soro? O kare.

@Jairzinho: « #38 on: Today at 01:41:02 AM »  
[Quote]You are getting angrier & angrier,[/quote]you must be a seer of the unseen to know my state of mind? i dont think your or what you wrote, so dont make yourself important man.

what’s the problem? Is everything okay? This is not the normally level headed olabowale ,I’m used to.

i have no problems, man, so stop sweating it. am talkiing to a nairalander who is like my own daughter. chill, man.

HOW CAN YOU SAY JUDAISM DID NOT EXIST UNTIL AFTER JESUS??!!! Surely you’re joking??

Am not. And thats a fact.

Zechariah,the father of John the Baptist 9Prophet yahia in Arabic)was a priest,the old testament is replete with information on Levi priests, Aaron, Moses elder brother was a priest. What has these got to do with ethnicity?

Jew or Judaism, a religion of the Jewish tribes, was not practiced by any prophet, including Zachariah, his son John, Jesus, and those before them! A priest does not have to be a Jewish religion priest, since you have priesthood among the Christians, now! Did the religion of Aaron different from that of Moses? No. Was Moses of a different religion from Noah, or from Ibrahim (AS)? No. Did the religion of Noah different from that of Ibrahim? No. When was the word Jew or Judaism ever used? Check your Bible: Jew as a tribe is coined from Judah, a son of Jacob. It was only a tribe and not a religion, but one of the 12 nations of the children of Israel/jacob at the drinking wells!

It was later used, as Judea, a nation along with nation of Israel, after the death of the son of King Solomon, when as Biblical Go punished them by tearing them into 2 nations! It was never use as a religion at no time, but alwats as an identity of ethic people, when the single tribe absorbed all the others, and their collective identity "Children of Israel" was dropped for it! Today, those who know enough about them will let you know that the Book known as Mishnash and Mamodian, etc were not known to anyone, including Jesus, your human God! What we find, from your Bible, is that Jesus was correcting the hypocracy of his people as he said, "i am but sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Whats the qualification for being a lost sheep, except deviation from Torah of Moses and Sabur of Daud (AS)?

Jesus said to not cancel the laws and the prophets. Neither is an indication of a religion, and when Jesus said worship God alone, and ignore everything else, it means innovations; books and methodologies! Show me the "ark of covenant, and those things that Moses brought in his form of religion of Islam"? The Jews of Today in their religious services bop their heads towards the Wailing wall! Moses did not do that. Jesus did not do that! The religion of Jesus was the religion of Moses! Today, the Jews have some kind of leather band on the head "similar" to coal  miner's head lamps or a bandana. Please tell me if Jesus used to wear that? Again give me the qualitative elements of "the lost sheep" of the house of Israel?

THE PASSOVER FEAST IS STILL CELEBRATED TODAY by Jews , pre-dates  Jesus.

I have been in many Jewish homes. My senior legal adviser is a Judge in Nevada, a Jewish man who is like a nephew to me. We lived together when I was living out there. Fred is a Jew in New York New Jersey and a VP of my Company. I know many in Borough park/Fort hamilton Parkway in Brooklyn. Sam, probably dead now, if he were to be alive will be 97, in Manhattan's 73rd Street was my attorney for 10 years straight. Nathan, who was a Rabbi of the Labovitch of Eastern Parkway was so close to me in the 1990s. I say all of these to mean what; did Passover rites occurred as part of the development of the "Jewish rites?" Of course not! When, the Children of Israel wereslaves in Egypt, they were simply called 'hebrew' based on their origin, and remnant of language' spoken. They were not in any place referred to as Jew, neither by by ethnicity, nor by religion! Their religion is based only on their not being oppressive like the Egyptian, but in addition being patient in belief of God! When were they Jews, Jairzinho! I have been in may homes of Jews, attended their Sedas. Have you. Seriously?

You normally research before you post, I’m sure you’re tired, pls take your time next time around.

Am not tired. It seems to me that you are the one who is probably tired, since beer and all the trimings of New Year's eve and New Year's day must have flowed liberally with you.

Abraham & Adam could not have been muslims because:
The Five Pillars of islam are: shadadah, salah, zakat, hajj & fasting. Please show me where Adam and Abraham went through this either in the Qura’n or in the Bible.

Shahadah is the most important. Those born into Islamic homes dont have to take shahadah when they become practicers of what you listed. Those who never practiced any religion as they reach puberty, even if they are from Ogun worshipper's home, they do not have to take any shahadah, for the pen is lifted before puberty! Now, the salah of Adam might have been just 2 salah and not five. For example, we read that Jesus made prostration and prayed in some parts of the night (Quyam), and I asked you to see the below that some christians and jews are still doing it like Muslims of Today; Youtube: Early Christian Prayer and mysticism.
                                                                                                          Possible origin of Islamic Prostration.
                                                                                                          The Jesus Prayer
                                                                                                          Ethiopian orthodox christian prostration in prayer
                                                                                                          An Ethiopian orthodox Easter in Lalibela
The Jews have the same sets of videos: Prostration in daily Jewish prayer.
                                                               Daily Jewish prayer and submssion.
Am sure you will find a good size library, so help yourself. As for Zakah, who should Adam give Zakat to, when he was the father of his children, husband of his wife, and grandfather of his grandchildren, all of them he is responsible for, naturally? Hajj, was prescribed by the call of Ibrahim (AS)  and not before. Saum, fasting: a great testament to the Islam of Jesus, Moses, and others. While it was compulsory for Jesus to fast, it is not compulsory on you, a man who claims to follow him, while in reality you follwo Paul, and company, the developers of the Christian doctrines!

The rest of your retorts, I leave alone, because they are not relevant to me. Are you okay man? I hope the hangover wears off, soon.

@Jairzinho: « #36 on: Today at 05:16:07 PM »  

Baseless assumption-Islam has foundation based entirely on the Qur'an and this was revealed to Prophet Mohammed, so it cannot exist before the prophet mohammed,just like me claiming Adam or Abraham were christians and please lets not waste time on that,you're a muslim. . . .you're entitled to your opinion,I'll stick to mine. . . thank you very much ! And repeating your assumptions  over & over again cannot change my opinion,so I'll advise you don't waste your time,so we don't descend to childish exchanges.

Childish exchanges my foot, and its only you that will engage in it. While you keep your position, ignorantly like a mule, the truth is the truth. I hope you are not going to stake your life on any statement that Adam and or Ibrahim were or was a Jew, a religion that was not in existence even until after Jesus, for religion is not the same as the ethnicity?! You will not argue either that Adam and Ibrahim did not have the same religion, or were not religious, for the worshipped their Creator? Is it not true that Islam simply means submission to the Will/Commitment/etc of the Creator?

Did Ibrahim submitted to his family idolatry? I am asking myself if a group of people from say Ghana who are blacksmith/iron worker worship a god based on their trade, and it is symbolised by Iron efigee, they must be ogun worshippers, based on how the yorubas understanding, though the Ghanaians may never say it is Ogun worship. Do you agree or disagree? The other day, we say a clip about Witchcraft religion. In the US, the witchcraft people wear black clothing, and have group sexual orgies. I dont think it is exactly the same in Yorubaland, or Igboland, or other african cultures. Yet they are all witches, even in a contemporary time, which is now. Let us then imagine the Islam of Adam that would have to be so basic, since in his lifetime, you had only his family and no other people.

The Islam of Noah would be based on what led people to be saved in the boat, while it must be against what made people perish! Islam of Ibrahim will have to be more than the basic one practiced by Noah. For example, we see that the essence of Lut, a contemporary of Ibrahim was purely against the evil of sexual deviance! Was Lut a Jew, Jairzinho? Argue with sense and not with digging yor heel so stubbornly in the ground of ignorance. I dont wanna us the tongue out emocon on you! I want you to not be blind, even as you are standing arrogantly!

Again you employ pseudo-intellectual arguments,3 religions have this story of Nimrod/Babel-Islam,Christianity & Judaism,only the Islamic version is different,incoherent or all together non-existent,I wonder why you're trying to refute a story that does not clearly exist in your holy book

What is pseudo intellectual is your argument, think that its not existence can not certainly translate to the fact that it is a lie! I gave you websites for a purpose, man. Use it to refute me. It was absolutely impossible to build a structure (building with mortar or stone or etc) that will extend, to the heavens. No structure of that kind is possible. The tafsir of when Pharaoh said it in Quran simply pointed out that the hypocrite Hamana did not tell the tyrannical Pharaoh that such a structure he arrogantly asked for can never be built! And the reason I am trying to refute the story is that there is no truth in it and I cant just laydown and let you plant a seek of lies with it. There are people who will fall for it. Afterall, you see many falling for Trinity, man god, while they argue blindly about wrapping them, still under ONE GOD? Are you listening to me, Jairzinho?

. No one said anything about anyone running anywhere,Lamurudu according to oral yoruba mythology was the father of oduduwa,this should be taken literarily as he may not necessarily be 'the biological father' as the word father could have come into the narratives as it passed from generation to generation.

While I will not argue Yoruba mythology with you, do you see the possibilty of beloved slave, Jesus and his children of Israel people suddenly calling themselves children of "GOD"? There is a yoruba saying: Tia ba ka eru, inu eru aba je. This simply means that a slave blood that rose in rank and became beloved, even as he moves freely in the court with free and the princely, he may just forget that he is a slave, so he demanded from the king that they should have a head count on the slaves. Surprise, surprise, he was counted among them!

The linkage of Lamurudu to Nimrod is essentially my own,I have not seen it any where else,I rest my case.

And to have allowed you to perpetrate a fraud in form of argument, will be an indictment against  clear minded people, who will stand idly to let your injustice run amock in the mind of innocent people. This is why I nip it in the bud, before it festered. I hereby rest my case!

@TheSeeker: « #26 on: Today at 03:08:09 AM »

@Habib16

please dont get so upset that you loose control that you become unjust. dont curse anybody, please. try to be calm, ignore the bad manner of others, and dont adopt any, for you are a representation of Islam. your mistake will be a stigma on Islam, and your good will be classified as personal good, having no root in Islam. This is the way the enemy of Allah sees Islam. but in all cases, it is better that no one uses you to justify their own evil opinion of Islam. If you can apologise to Theseeker, please. Theseeker, I am sure habib16 did not mean any curse that he pronounced.

I am just only try to let you think and have a rethink about yourself and your future so that you wont end up blaming your ignorance.

I hope you apply the same to yourself. Let me just excite you for a moment; Jesus is a slave of his Lord God. In Yoruba language I called that God Yoruba. In Arabc I call that God Allah. We already know His name in English. Please proof me wrong that Jesus is not a slave. I will use your Bible to support my statement. If after that you refuse to get out of Christianity, which takes Jesus, a slave of Allah, as god, you will end up blaming your ignorance!

I hope you understand Yoruba Literature? In Yoruba belief as stated in the book "Asa ati Ise Yoruba" by C. L. Adeoye,(mine was giving to me free in the days of free education) Obatala is belief to be a god that helps in creation, he will add mouth, nose and eyes to human to make them alive.

Help in creation? How many of them creating or who is he helping? I hope you understand yoruba literature and word and its origin?

Obatala is equally known as Orisaala, Orisaala can mean Orisa Ala and according to a reference work Allah "was also used by pagan Meccans as a reference to the creator-god, , the supreme deity in pre-Islamic Arabia" -Wikipedia

Orisaala, does not mean Orisa ala, for ala in yoruba means dream or white (funfun), plain color. Orisaala is your pronounciation or that of the writer, instead of Orisanla; the big god! The big god is very appropriate even today in the exegese of Trinity, for we read that the big god (father) was the one speaking while son god and ghost god (smaller gods) were mute/silent in the statement of creation of man as in "lets make man in our own image." We see that since you said Jesus is god, he had a mouth, eyes, etc. Lol, TheSeeker, you kinda rubbish Christianity. Thank God who instigated your opening of this thread!

Orisa (deity) + Allah = Orisaala, I think that make a sense to you.

You are from Modakeke, or Ife, or some place like that where they dont know how to pronounce nla! My people from that part of yorubaland, please forgive me; am an ijebuboy, and we pronounce many words badly too. But it is your amuni buni eron ibiye [theseeker] that brought this upon himself, unfortunately, all of you! Let me rubbish you even further, theseeker; if ala now translate to Allah, hence your Orisaala, what will Eloi, said by Jesus translate to? Remember language is oral/vocal before it comes written down and read!

aala means white in Yoruba land, we use to see Ifa and Obataala worshipers dressing in white garment during their festivals, does that not similar to the dressing we use to see in tv when people go to Kaaba for worship around the black stone in Mecca.

I thought ala is plain color? Lets just accept it as white. In yorubaland, and indeed nigeria, what color do you guys wear to Church; the Cele, the Aladuras, etc? Is it nnot white? Hiram worn in hajj, symbolises death, and it is not a festival clothing, and hajj is not a festival! The jews when they die, they wash their people and shroud the, just like the muslims, or very similar. Unlike you in agbada, or worse suit! I dont know where you are going with these imaginations, but am not feeling it!

[/quote]Yoruba use to say "Ara Ifa ni Fatima wa" meaniing Fatima is part of Ifa. Fatima is an arabic name but Ifa is a Yoruba deity (Orunmila is equally refer to as Ifa).[quote]

There is our lady of Fatima in christianity. There is a town called Fatima in Christian Spain! I bet it must have something to do with Islam and or Ifa of Yorubaland, too?

Hence we use to have name like Ifatunde = Fatunde, Ifadairo = Fadairo in Yoruba land. So do you think that all these following arabic names are just coincidental with Ifa, name like: Fatai (Ifatai) Faruok (Ifaruoku), Falilat (Ifalila), Fatimat - (Ifatimo) and so on.

Ara oko. No ara egon ni ogebni yi. He is so funny in his deceit. Fatimah, Fathah, Falilah, Faruuq, have no bearing to Ifa, man. Faruuq is a nickname of strength, firmness given to Umar bin Khattab. Fath, is Victory, an Attribute of Allah the Almighty. Listen, if Ifa idolatry is going to have a second look, based on your argument to Islam, it should have had something derived to the names of the human messenger unique only to Islam, the Makkan Muhammad, Ahmad, Mustapha, etc (AS)! Where is it man? Iro fo wo omode yi, nfun!

More is coming, Watch Out for Part 2, have you watch this Nigerian home video titled "Oodua"? it is a good reference work.

Lol. Ara ufe. Thats how the ijebu people call Ife people.

@TrueSeeker: « on: Yesterday at 11:04:50 AM »

Quran means recitation.

Quran having its root word from the same as Iqra, Qirat means recited, read, proclaimed. To Muhammad (AS) who could not read, it meant "proclaim" to everyone else, and also recite so that your tongue is used to it, your heart is familiar to its injuctions, so do others. For those who can read, it also means read!

The Yorubas also recite Odu-Ifa and memorize it.

Poetry is recite, memorized. Plays, lie that of William Skaespear, are memorized, recited.

History has it that Yorubas are from Mecca, so that might make one to wonder if Quran is part of what they left behind.

Wonder no more, for jairzinho already pointed out that Quran a mere 1400 years Book, is young compared to the agreed arrival time of the Yorubas to their present location. And who knows how long it took them from their origin to arrive in Yorubaland?

Quran and Odu-Ifa they are too much alike, just try and make some research and compare their story they both look much alike. For example Quran talk much about Jinn, Odu-Ifa talk about Irunmole,

You have ghost god or spirit god in Christianity! Is that not also similar to irunmole? Lol. While the muslim hates Jinn for the most part, for Shaitan is a Jinn, you worship one in your ghostly god!

Muslim talk about Quran descended from heaven just as Yoruba talk about Oodua descended from heaven.

Are Oduduwa and Quran both of the same nature? Oduduwa is in nature of your god, the ghost and or the son or even the father who send dove from the open gte of heaven. Quran are words, revealed in piecemeal, during a 23 year period! Did it take Oodua 23 years? Did it take your ghost god not a very short time, like just immediately? Remember the joke of Day of Penticost, when your people spoke in tongue, just like awo or some jinn/esu in yorubaland?

You just try and research you will be surprised with this revelation.
Imagine the Following Similarities
Pronounce these word: Alfa - Ifa, aren't they sound alike?

Alfa is a nonArabic word. Just like Imole, it has no pronounciation to Arabic word! And not all arabic is Islamic.

Quran can only be accurate interpret by a Muslim Clergy, Odu Ifa too can only be accurately interpret by an Ifa priest.

And anybody, including ignorant people can accurately interprete Christian Bible? I am free to interprete the Bible then and you must accurately follow my interpretation; so get out of Chrstianity! I pray this guy accepts my interpretation. Amin. Actually this is my best wishes on him.

Correct rendering of Quran can only be in Arabic Language, one most vast in Yoruba language before he can recite Odu Ifa.

I know you dont have to speak the language of Jesus to render correctly the Christian portion of the Bible. No wonder the Jews call them "anything goes pagans!"

Muslim do competition on reciting Quran, similar things happen among the Ifa worshipers.

There is no competition in the Christian understanding. Whatever you want is good for you. The Jews do recite, and they have their Torah in a particular language, but thats beside the point. By the way, those who do competion must be copying either or both the Muslims and the Ifa people. The people of acamedia do compete in accurate reading in languages, literature, etc!

They both come from Mecca.
More are coming. watch out!

Two people come from the same womb, even in the same birth, but have different life path. Where is their commonatlity, if any after birth?

@Jairzinho: « #32 on: Today at 12:44:00 PM »

Quote from: TrueSeeker on Yesterday at 11:04:50 AM
Imagine the Following Similarities
Pronounce these word: Alfa - Ifa, aren't they sound alike?
Quran can only be accurate interpret by a Muslim Clergy, Odu Ifa too can only be accurately interpret by an Ifa priest.
Correct rendering of Quran can only be in Arabic Language, one most vast in Yoruba language before he can recite Odu Ifa.
Muslim do competition on reciting Quran, similar things happen among the Ifa worshipers.
They both come from Mecca.
More are coming. watch out!
Your level of imagination is admirable.

While, theseeker is trying hard with his "imagination", he limply forgot that not all imagined things are reality in truth. Who will forget the Odunjos and the Fagunwas in their imagined "Irinke rindos", "Oke Langbodos", etc, stories that will almost come alike, that you cant put the books down? Yet with all of those imagined gimmicks, only fibble (mostly youngs) believed it, until they attained "wisdom". Its like father christmas/Santa Claus, Trinity, Tower of babel!

While the progenitor of the Yoruba race(oduduwa) indeed originated from 'somewhere in the middle east' (not necessarily Mecca) like all of mankind,the yoruba race certainly preceeds Islam by many generations.

The Yorubas preceeded the Islam under Muhammad (AS), but not under Adam (AS), for the definition of Islam will remind you that Adam was a muslim, and practiced Islam, in the form that was available to his community! Mankind having the same origin (Adam and his mate Hawa) made us all brothers and sisters, the reason Mary the mother of Jesus (AS) was referred to "Sister of Haruun"!

From oral history,Oduduwa's father Lamurudu (which I have come to believe is the corruption of the name Nimrod),left the Middle East possibly as a result of the confusion arising from the Tower of Babel saga as documented in Genesis 11:9. How Middle east became 'Mecca' in yoruba history books, I still do not understand.

Did King Nimrod leave his people? Was he not the king that was ruling during the youth of Ibrahim? Was he not the King that built fire to punish Ibrahim, who was thrown into the inferno? I doubt if an ancient king will abdicate his throne, but even at war will die fighting, the reason the story of Pharaoh of Moses exodus does not make a lick of sense in the way it is told in the Bible!

Kings do not return from the battle front defeated without putting up a fight, yet remained a king to an empty kingdom! Tower of babel assumed "story" must be incorrect, from the Bible, because the period assigned to it, there were already nations and languages different from Babel! There were the Chinese, the Indians, definitely the Coptic Egyptians, and Ethiopias and Yemenis in existence! These people were already speaking different languages, so there was no need to diffuse any people's singular language, because they threatened "God", except its a made up story and or a truly weak, powerless "god!"

God knows the limit of man, and from the Quran's Surah Rahman encouraged man to explore this very quality, challenging man to penetrate the space, with the knowledge He gave. This was well before the space explorations, and we now know that the shuttle has the ability to travel many hundreds of miles deep into the space, yet extremely far below the heavens, even though many landings have been made on the moon, the humans can never reach the gate of the Heavens! So there is no challenge to the Authority of God coming from any and all creations, combined! Below are website addresses which spoke about Tower of Babel; The material employed, according to one Christian writer were Bricks and stones.

I remember Davidylan arguing true to his true deceitful mind that the material described by Pharaoh to Hamana, his chief building engineer, as he was intending to climb up to heaven to challenge the God of Moses, could never can be what the Quran described! Just because it was not popular, does not mean it was not suggested as the bricks of choice, for before anything becomes popular, there must have been a time that it was first tried or hypothesised! Today, introvenious Fertilization is popular, but in the early 1970s, a mere 4 decages ago, at best was just an idea among many in science and medical laboratories!

christianity.about.com/, /biblestorysummaries/, /towerofbabel.htm - Cached - Similar

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Babel - Cached - Similar

While I do not completely agree with your assertions,its not unlikely there is some shared history both (yoruba & Islam)being from simlar environments.

If slighted sign of any commonality can be assigned to make two completely different things to be inferred as one or brothers, then human beings may be said to be a tree or like a tree, because both have origin, germinate, grow to maturity, live for a period of time and die off! Christianity do sign, make music, etc, clap (lol), and so does Hinduism! I guess they must have the same orgin, actually same religion. They both have human gods, and multiple personality gods or Gods!

@Aloy~Emeka: « #10 on: Yesterday at 01:10:09 AM »

Quote from: olabowale on Yesterday at 12:30:16 AM
. Islam does not make a person a slave.

I beg to differ. Didn't you once say call muslims the slaves of Allah?

Slave of Allah, yes. Not slave of Islam, for Islam liberated me from al the schisms; the true Yoruba[ism], like the old man zikism!

So, emeka, i beg to differ because Jesus himself is a slave of god, just like me! And if you dare deny the slaveness of Jesus, you have to wager that you will finally grow spine and leave Christianity the moment I quote the verse in the Bible to support my statement!

Wa aleykum salaam wa Rahmaullahi Ta'ala wa Barackatuh. What is clear is clear. Allah has spoken the Truth and the Messenger (as) had acted on the Truth. Suicide is not permisable. Killing of innocent is not permissable. Even when a fighting enemy comes under your control, seeking your protection, you should treat him well, as you will treat yourself well. Allah Loves those who are just, showing mercy.

We have known conditions where muslims suffered more than and longer than what is happening presently, the muslims were consistent in perseverance, patience until Alah gave them victory. Muslims have defeated people without shedding a single drop of blood, or lost of life.

We should follow Muhammad (AS), only, for he is the messenger and prophet of for after him, there is no other. Please no one should fall for a false situation of glamor, which will lead to Hellfire. The means are clear; they must be good and not evil. The end is success, a Mercy from Allah, the destination is Paradise. If anyone wishes to talk because of any pressure, please seek companionship of true believers, those who show mercy, patience, forgiving, strict followers of Muhammad (AS). Dont be a lonely lamb that will be devour by pack of wolves. Shun evil at all cost, even as you shun Zina, consumption of alcohol, etc and idol worshipping.

No one understands Islam as Muhammad. No human is an authority of it like him. Whosoever does not copy his good manners, but adopt the evl of others, is not from Muhammad, for Allah honored him and comfirmed that he delivered the message without hiding any part. We are means of guidance for one another, protecting against evil, racing one another in goodly deeds. Lets be patient, and accept guidance for Allah Loves the patients.

nuclearboy, o ti sun nda yi? Abi o npalemu pati ni? Esha eyin keferi ko ni kie lo jebo daaroo ko ni? Ki lo nshe nle?

opinions of disbelievers do not count when it comes to belief! If there is true light, how is it there is still darkness, after "let there be light"? With this in mind, I think you people should be able to know that Abu Zola does not care about your conclusion! No one among the muslim does!

@Doofan: « #44 on: Today at 05:57:39 PM »  

i dunt  understand how somepeople will go to church n go clubin later,those two things dunt go togeda.

Same exact reason i dunt understand how somepeople will say God is One, n tell us there are three persons, Jesus, Yahweh, Ghost are gods, later, those two things dunt go togeda.

For real, sis.

God Almighty in Yoruba is Olorun, in Igbo Chukwu, in Hausa Obangiji, in Arabic Allah, is not a christian, jew, or muslim ownership exclusively. He the Creator belong to every creation. So your claim about it for the Bible, is incorrect.

Oh, Jesus is a mere messenger and prophet (AS) in the Quran, though he is a god to you among the three gods; father, ghost and son. Or, am I incorrect, because I am waiting for your denial of the three gods, you idol worshipper!

Back to the topic; the fact that you dont have these prophets of God Almighty Who is Alone in His Completeness, unlike your so call god of three persons (lol) shows that Islam is separate and different from your christianity and its varied bible. Your religion is similar to ogun of the yoruba religion.

@Tpia: « #70 on: Today at 07:22:29 PM »  

dont know when people will learn to limit the way they expose themselves on the web.
dont be too naive.
There are people monitoring everything you type here.
Its good to serve God but Jesus himself said be wise as serpents.
The question seems innocent but think it through.
just an observation.
carry on.

Lol. Its after your midnight sis. Is it funny that you have to be "wise" like a serpent, an advise from Jesus? The same god that the serpent pull a trick on to confuse the "woman" whom the "man" blamed for the sins of man? Tpia, o je ye tele nkon tio daa.O je di muslimi ododo, ko jawo ni oro olorun meta!

@No2Atheism: « #97 on: December 29, 2009, 05:15 PM »

. . .I noticed that this thread was opened a few months ago, can someone please confirm to me whether or not Olabowale has answered the questions yet or not . . .

Please defined what you call "Islamic killing", so that I may provide my own view from Quran and Sunnah! I do not know what could be defined as Islamic Killing except death of a person by himself, or by somebody else: both are generally forbidden. Definitely a person killing himself is completely forbidden by Quran and Sunnah. Killing somebody is forbidden, except by a mistake, or after thorough and complete judicial process, found guilty because of evil against the community and even individual who is bent on revenge.

The most liberal society, individual will act in the same manner. Is there a person whose loved one is killed off that will not want the killer to be punished in the same manner? What if the person the killer killed off is a 25 year apple of the eye, the rose flower of the heart of his beloved? Am sure you will like to string up the "armed robber gangs" of nigeria, who wake people up at night, ransack the whole house, sexually abuse the females, including the wife, the sisters, the daughters, while the male of the house cant do anything about it! I know you will like it, if its your home, for me I will be dead before that happens! Now thats my Islamic killing. I do hope you can tell me where I am wrong, or better give me your Christian killing, sorry Christian forgiveness in this case and see how your wife will rubbish you after that! No person in the community will accept your calling yourself a man, after that!

@Trueseeker: « #8 on: Yesterday at 02:17:59 PM »  

@Abu Zola
Quote
Prophet Muhammad is the greatest man
How can Muhammad be greater than Jesus when he, himself (Muhammad) confirmed Jesus as the Messiah. Or you haven't read that in Quran? Even here we are talking about achievements.

And Jesus said that "I have come not to abolish the laws and the prophets, but to fulfil them, shall be the least in the kingdom!" If simply because Jesus was mentioned as Messiah in the Quran translate in your mind that he is higher, I will leave that alone to you, and then use that very thinking to point you to the fact that Jesus's statement about prophets before him must also be because each of those prophets are "higher" than him!

Imagine one of Jesus Christ teaching: “All things, therefore, that YOU want men to do to YOU, YOU also must likewise do to them; this, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean."

Sadist, psychopaths, sedomasochists and those who love pains must be loving your "Jesus" argument above. Muhammad (AS) says something different; Do what is good and lawful to other. Be merciful to them.

What a golden rule. How different do you think our world will be if only we can all follow this Christ teaching?

Those who love pain, will inflict plenty on you, even though you may not like it, as long as it is what they want others to do on them!

Do Muhammad made similar teaching, if he do perhaps  he copy it from is Leader Jesus the Messiah

Muhammad (AS) would have no need to copy from anyone, since his Lord says of him, "he says what he was instructed, supported by one mighty in power." Muhammad says that if Musa were to be alive and hear about my prophethood, he will but follow me, immediately. That should go for all, including Jesus. This you can find to corollate what Allah says in Surah "Imran" that all prophets took oath to support Muhammad the Messenger of Allah, if his messengership coincide with their own prophethood!

« #10 on: Yesterday at 05:17:52 PM »  
@the_seeker
Tell me the effect of Muhammad life on non-muslim world. and remember your worship is not complete if you Muslim don't acknowledge Jesus Christ as Messiah. Whereas Christian don't need to accept Muhammad.

And the Jews dont have to acknowledge Jesus at all, whereas you Christians must acknowledge Moses, otherwise you dont even have a Bible now anything of argument, though your religion started as a sect of the Jew! You are not making any sense, man.

the Point: Jesus Christ life cut across different religions and nationals.

Lies. The Jewish religion dont even acknowledge Jesus, and no Saudi is a Christian and still maintain to be a saudi!

Stop wasting useful space with all your cut and paste post.
Jesus Teaching was so impressed the late Indian leader Mohandas K. Gandhi that he reportedly told a British official: “When your country and mine shall get together on the teachings laid down by Christ in this Sermon on the Mount, we shall have solved the problems not only of our countries but those of the whole world.”

Gandhi said greater things about Muhammad (AS) considering that he had to pander to the oppressive British, in his coyness to get the "followers of Biblical Jesus" to leave his poor people alone, and not mass slaughter them. While you guys claim that you follow Jesus, I guess he never has any effect on you: he said dont abolish the laws and prophets, immediately, less than a century, you did. He said no illegal sex, no one is more openly and unshamely sexually freaky than you. The more out of cloth the better for you, and only extreme winter can make many keep their cloth on!

That was from a non-christian religion.

Actually, my reason for even contributing here is that I wanna point out the fact that when it is "convenient" for you guys, Jesus is human, then when it is to the detriment of your making him a god like yoruba's ogun the god of iron, he is not human! Is there no limit to this level of deceit?

@Nizoral: « #104 on: Today at 12:20:12 PM »  

@the seeker, quit calling my God names no one has done dat 2 your god thruout d entire post i av read. Its obvious dat u ar a potential terrorist wiling 2 kil xtain anytime anywhere wit d way you ar going. Seeker my foot

How did he call your "God" names? Which God; Son God, or Father God, or Ghost God? My woman, you can only have one God. Why is yours Three and which one did he abuse by the name calling? With your three Gods you have the gull to say that Muslims who have just One Complete God worship god? Did you ever hear a Muslim that he/she worships other than Allah the Almighty, while you cant deny that you worship Jesus, Ghost, and then of course Father? Who really is an idol worshipper, here? keep your foot to yourself!
 

« #105 on: Today at 12:22:45 PM »  
And wat atrocities has Jesus commited mad man, you would av continue now satan incarnate right from pit of hell

Is Jesus not father? Is Jesus not Ghost? Ghost slept with Jesus Mother by overshadowing her and "coming" upon her. Father killed all the people in the Bible, evil people, like Pharaoh and Egyptian army, and of course innocent people like the people of Jericho! Jesus himself as a son planned to commit mayhem, except that he did not have a strong supporters, but betrayers, deniers, doubters, etc!


@toba (m); « #106 on: Today at 12:23:22 PM »  

See someone who is sick mentally, saying others are sick.Im driving now but will hook up with u shortly.U ve refused to answer my questions by showing d quranic qoutes

Toba, arent you ashamed to call anyone sick, especially when you say there are three gods as One, or there is One God with three personalities? Are you for real, man? When you have persons, changes have occurred!

waleshakur can never be a muslim. he has gone against all legality of Islam. he stands in the same pull of water as noetic15.

Killings; suicide, innocent people, starting any fight is forbidden. Islam does not permit any of them and forgieness is better, depending on Allah, Alone.

No muslim should ever copy any evildoer, even if the evildoer is a bigtime name and muslim. Both are vain things, and neither can benefit.Whosoever have any problem and or any temptation, please seek comradry of people who are moderate in their practice of Islam. Allah describes the right and correct measure of Islam as "moderation" (wasathur). There is no reason to let your emotion run wild and deviates you from Islam. Suffering is part of Islamic belief, it is a Jihad (struggling against evil, starting from whatever evil in your heart! The biggest and hardest form of Jihad).

We are supporter of one another into what is good and against what is evil.

Islam does not make anyone robotic. The truth about Islam is that you have a fully fulfilled life; participating in what is good and wholesome about life, while you have the full opportunity to seek forgiveness when you make mistakes. Thinking about evil and not doing it does not constitute to sinfulness in Islam, while the mere thought of it condemns you in Christianity!

For example on friday, you can engage in lawful worldly activities before and after Jumuah salah, even on the day of either of the Eid. Islam does not make a person a slave. Even approaching the salah is supposed to be in honorable manner, not rushing, not hasting into it.

If a person wants to abandone Islam because it commands against illegal sex, he/she should know that there is HIV/AIDS as evidential proof of the truth of the Islamic injuction. If a person wishes to abandone Islam because of prohibition of alcohol, he/she should not forget that many calamities, like rapes, accidents, etc do occur under the influence. A person who wishes not to be reminded of the certain disaster of Hell as consequence of evil does not belong in Paradise, for there is no better friend or lover than the one who advices against evil while directing you to what is good.

Islam stands firm, muslims should stand firm on truth wit it, regardless of how attractive evil has been beautifully colored or wrapped. Truth is bitter and always hard to swallow.

Aloy~Emeka, Islam is different from Muslims. Muslims should be judged by Islam and not the other way around. You know that already. As I feel sad about the who issue of Umar Farouk, I personally blame his father for not taking a stronger role in the life of his own son. My Allah forgive me if I am wrong in my opinion. A father who realises that his offspring is going against the grain of what is right, he should have gone many steps further than just stopping at merely reporting his son. I as a father will chase such a son all over the world, until I snatch him and get between he and evil. I would have to die first before my child will have such a free range to evilness! Again, Islam stands and muslims are the ones who should stand with it.

@TrueSeeker: « #15 on: Today at 01:49:44 PM »  

If The Holy Bible as claimed by the poster is a distorted scripture, why are you looking unto it for guidance?

No one looks into the Bible for any guidance, from among the muslims. The Bible consists of now corrupted Torah, Sabur, Injil and the other self deluding books from acts of apostles to the end. The muslims said the first three books are corrupted. That does not mean that they do not contain any single resemblance of truth. God Almighty has made sure that some truth remains.

That only meant that you believe Bible to be a Book of Truth and Prophecy, if not how can you conclude that it predict the coming of Muhammad in a clear term?

If this is your position, fine. The above is my position and it is the position of true believers from the Muslims. Book of Truth and Prophecy, the "Bible" is not it. Stop making it up.

Since the Bible has not been distorted as you claimed in the day of Muhammad (7th century), because he (muhammad) claimed that his Quran is confirmation of the Bible, when was the distortion took place?

The Quran says it is the confirmation of what was the "Truth" that remains in what was revealed before it. The Bible was not revealed before it, but Torah of Musa (AS) was, so was the Sabur of Dawd (AS) and so was the Injil of Isa bin Maryam (AS) was. The truth in them, like "Oh Israel, your God, and my Lord is but One God", "Thou shall not worship any other (god, God, person, Angel, etc) but God the Creator Who is One", etc. Not the places where it says "Let us create man in our own image", for God is not a Partner with any other, and there is not a single quality of man that is equal to His, or there is a Quality of is that man can say it has in full measure. Finally man is not an image of God, and God does not look like man! There are many and whereever the Bible says God and Jesus are one, or God has a son, or sons or cildren, or begotten son, all of that are part of the corruptions.

How can you say that Mohammad is the holy spirit promised by Jesus Christ?

Doesnt the Bible say that you know the true Prophet by his (know there is no her in there, so all those Prophetess are liars, for starter) Spirit. And the false prophet by his false spirit, too? Was it not in the Bible that you should "test" the spirit of that prophet? Now did you test the spirit of the "holy spirit" and how did you test it? Do you know what or who the holy spirit is? Give me his nature, name, identity, just like you can give me details of Prophet Jesus as son of Mary, a man who is a prophet to his people, etc?

Or can you say that Mohammad is the prophet for-told by Moses when the more evidence point to Jesus Christ?

Give me the evidence of Moses fortelling Jesus by name. Then look at what Muhammd (AS) did, and you will know that the another Comforter was not a ghost, only in your selfish desire if you continue to insist, but Muhammad, a human, a tangible, audible, seen by people of his time who preserved his whole message for prosperity, while only some part of what Jesus preached survived, and please what did the "Ghost" preached, taught, who heard the ghostly voice? Please tell me!

if your claim is right don't you think that Mohammad would had referred to it in the Quran when he was seeking for approval from his kinsmen and Jews of his time?

Surah Saffa, verse 6 is enough, because it says Jesus preached proclamations of the "truth of Torah", which you people already thrown into the gutter by not following it, but dubiously said "it has been reduced to; love your God with all your heart (but you love Jesus and ghost just as much) and love your neighbors as yourself", and Jesus preached that there is a messenger to come whose name is Ahmad (AS; thats another name for Muhammad). Google Ahmad as a name for Muhammad and search for its meaning! You should do that, if you wanna know the truth.

It is true that Ishmael died in the presence of his bother,

If Ismail was rejected and ignored as you people always claim, the remnant of truth in the Bible proofs you wrong: afterall, the descendants of Isaac his younger brother from a different mother who by your Bible wanted him and his stranger mother out of the house knew him well. Not only Jacob, but the children of Jacob knew about their father's Uncle, so stop your silly opinion and the position of Ismail does not depend on you, or any Jew or Christian, not even any deviant Muslim, but with Allah, Alone and He is Sufficient as Protector, Preserver and Elevator of Ismail (AS)

but you don't know that it is a warning prophecy that all the enemies of God people will died in the presence of God people including their religion and belief.

Did Ibrahim has the misfortune even in his commitment to God that his first son should be an enemy of God and the enemy of his younger brother and his children, and grandchildren who knew him and yet,never recorded that he "Ismail" did anything against any of them? Who is more unjust to mankind than the liars against good people? And Ismail is a good "people". Can you proof anywhere for any reason from your Bible if Ishmael the first son of a "Godly man" should be an enemy of God's people? Is there a need to let Abraham have a bad son as his first son, yet the same "bad" son never done anything bad? Is the Christian god honest or false?
And we see that Islam continues to "WAX" better even though you are advocating for its demise; christians, jews, and others are reverting to Islam!

Stop twisting the scriptures as "untaught and unsteady are twisting, as [they do] also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction."

Show us what the "Holy Spirit" which is unseen taught, spoke, proclaimed, reminded, you as a person who says it is not Muhammad (AS)? Where is the book of the instructions and revelations of the "holy ghost/spirit"? Please tell me what Ishmael did that calibrated him to be enemy of "God's people?" Just one thing and not more and give me a good argument!

@SEFAGO: « #454 on: December 28, 2009, 02:28 PM »

allah doesnt exist

Oh empty heart, I did not say allah, but Allah. Big difference. One is your imagination. Mine in my Reality.

@ohsisi: I hope you will have a firm statement about Victoria Gowon that befits her persona, a woman who did not discourage her husband from prosecuting a 30 month war against her tribe. In all, she allowed millions of pounds to be spent on her wedding, from Nigerian Treasury while many were dying.

reindeer forgets that the only one who knows why he/she does something is the doer. Of cause, God Knows it more than the doer. if this is so, and i am certain it is, the christians who are not yelling jehovah, Yahweh, halelluyah, etc, are quitely in their heart saying it is for their god(s). this reminds me of former US attorney general John Ashcroft's "their God asked them to send thir children to die for Him, while our god(d) sent his only begotten son to die for us" statement. It reminds me of the american conservative military general who said "our god(s) is bigger than their God" statement. Well neither of these people opposed the killings of Palestinians mostly muslims in the hands of Jews of israel with all their supports. That was before 911. after 911, both relished in the mass killings of the the muslims. if you are naive enough and you want me to draw you pictures, i shall.

now tell me, where is the politics in your christian god(s) is bigger than my muslim God? Where is the politics in your christian god(s) sent his/their only begotten son to die for you, while my God asked me to send my sons to die for Him?

When you lie, man, lie like an educated man. Substantiate you lie, not like a street and ignorant man. I expect better from you, even though you have never in your life seen a yoruba muslim doctor from Lagos Island before. Yet the commissioner of health for the state of lagos is a native lagosian. I have known many of them who have been muslims, since my youth.