₦airaland Forum

I don't think this shameless pissing contest flatters either university. What are the big achievements of OAU, Ilorin or any Nigerian university for that matter? The Ebola issue has exposed our shame for the world to see once again...poor funding or no poor funding, there is little cutting edge research going on in our universities. Rather than indulging in this silly game, perhaps the universities should reflect more on how far they have let down the country?

Best university in Nigeria? Pfft. Can there really be a "best" among underachievers?

EasternLeopard: So we are all driving towards the solution from different angles.Thanks for answering my question on your relation with science and I want to believe you understand my stand.

Yes, I agree with you. Ideally, the FG should have groups exploring/executing each of the three approaches. They are not mutually exclusive.

ElFenomeno1: Does anyone know how long it will take to develop more doses of Zmapp?

God bless you. This is a question I've been asking myself, and one that I hope the FG has tried to ask the manufacturers. That, and the other important question: "how much?"*

*of course, we are still hoping the darn thing actually works...

phreakabit: Nice answers, you seem like someone knowledgeable in these things. Whats Ur view on the use if foodgrade hydrogen peroxide? Its know that pathogens can't survive in oxygen, and hydrogen peroxide poses an extra oxygen molecule. I think it might not cure but will surely help.

No, not knowledgeable on the specifics o!

I am an engineer, so I only have a general understanding of the issues involved. You got me cracking when I saw hydrogen peroxide...you go expose my ignorance o! (sorry for smiling about a serious topic)

phreakabit: 1, Should we just fold out arms n watch them die or should we try something?

No, we shouldn't. We should evaluate all available options that show some promise, and find out whether there is anyone that we can nudge along faster (we should be ready to spend money on this; research costs money). We are not equipped to go into Ebola research, and we should not even dabble there. It takes a decade of planning and funding to grow competence in a research area, so lets not start something we can't finish.

In the interim, we manage the patients using best practices that have been developed and refined since the first Ebola outbreak. That way, we expect ~40% of them to survive, drug or no drug.

2, Since we say bitter kola is a hoax, Nano Silver looks like our only option at the moment. . . What next?

What next is: as I said above, we are in no position to conduct Ebola research. Dabbling into it may result in devastating long-term consequences.

3, Shouldnt we allow Ebola patients consent to treatment with Nano Silver?

This is an ethical issue with deep implications. If an Ebola victim decides to try swallow an acid, should we stop him? I think in this case, the view of doctors is that they cannot ethically allow their patients to try an unscientific cure. When lives are at risk, doctors often turn a blind eye (allowing a patient to drink holy water etc) however, I believe that the ethics of their profession cannot allow them do this *while the patient in under their care*. However, in the case of a pathogen such as Ebola, I think the risk of mutation prevents a doctor from allowing a cure unless there is some evidence (no matter how tenuous) of efficacy.

4, If nano silver does cure Ebola should the cured be put into observation again for some weeks just to monitor their health and behavior before allowing them back into public? I think they should.

The premise to the second part of your question is that Nano does cure Ebola in humans. There is nothing that indicates that at the present.

EasternLeopard: If Lagos state has demanded that it should be tested in the lab, I would have supported them.But outright rejection without scientific verification is madness at its peak. Now concerning the type of lab to be used, Lagos state can check round the country for such labs if it exist. If such labs do not exist it can approach other nations in asia europe etc. If they approve, Nigerian scientists will be send there to work with that nation's scientists to verify the authencity

I get your point, I really do. However, research doesn't work like that. I am confident that there is no lab in Nigeria which can conduct research on Ebola. Also, such labs, where they exist, operate on very strictly-defined mandates such that they wouldn't undertake to test Nano for us. Were we to eventually get around the red tape of identifying a willing lab, the entire process would take, I think, up to a year.

This is longer than even the timeline that GSK is giving for the testing/availability of their vaccine.

What the Lagos government/FG should do is: start a conversation with Zmapp to see whether infusion of funds can move their testing along further, or ramp up production capacity faster*

*all of this assumes that Zmapp does cure Ebola in humans. We hope so, but the jury is still out.

On a lighter note Did you study any science related course in the university/polytechnic

I teach a science related course in a federal university

Redstone: If the US FDA says the Nano Silver is a pesticide, I will refute that because I have read a lot about nano silver and I understand it could kill almost any bacteria, Virus and fungi. So my take is this, if this drug or food supplement as they say; could be used in controlled and effective doses and it gives us the expected result, then we have a way out. I think there is no harm in trying this nano silver experimentally too on other mammals rather than bringing politics into this. This is human lives we are talking about and people dying just in a jiffy. I think it is really dangerous to play this sort of politics o.

I understand your pain at the lives being lost. I have to remind you however that there are far worse scenarios: for example, a strain of Ebola that is airborne. One reason why scientists have to follow certain protocols in searching for cures to pathogens is the risk that we could inadvertently aid the organism to mutate in nasty ways.

So, yeah, there is some harm in randomly trying nano (until we can, with some level of confidence, verify that the risks are minimal - to the infected, and to society at large)

Panter215: Only difference is that US is selling it.

Wrong, very wrong. Zmapp has been tried, with very encouraging levels of success, on primates. That is very far along the animal testing stage. Do you have evidence of any such tests with Nano?

I agree with you: FG should (ideally) first commission a test of Nano. Unfortunatelya)following proper protocol, such tests would take months (my opinion; I'm not really an expert in this area) (b) there is NO lab in Nigeria that can carry out such tests.

People, we need to calm down.

EasternLeopard: What is wrong in getting monkeys, infecting them and trying the thing on them to see the effect

Even fruit bat should be captured and studied to see why it is immunized to this virus

What is wrong with your suggestion is: that is not how research is done. First, you should know that there are few labs anywhere in the world that can safely experiment with pathogens as lethal as Ebola. So, no, Lagos state government cannot do that. Instead, they have to depend on the best scientific evidence available.

Their decision to back away from Nano probably has lot to do with the absence of any SCIENTIFIC evidence that Nano is effective in curing Ebola (I will be happy if you will point me in the direction of any such evidence).

This is one issue on which I agree (sort of) with that strange fellow GenBuhari. You use experimental drugs CAREFULLY. You don't go and swallow a beaker of conc. acid just because it will kill the bacteria in your gut.

Summary: there is no scientific evidence that Nano works, so why should Lagos state government use the Ebola patients (who have a ~40% chance of surviving) as guinea pigs, and further, risk making the virus evolve scarier strains?

GenBuhari: My friend it is quite common to get names of people who die from high profile diseases.Or at least more detail than just saying a nurse died from Ebola. If it was in theUK whenever somebody died from disease like mad cow disease some years back there was a report on the news with details.I am not surprised at the secrecy because it is propaganda to panic us into believing that there is an epidemic.

Okay, I think I understand you better now. It's okay, really. You're welcome to your conspiracy theories. I just hope you're not someone with social, economic, religious or political clout. I fear what someone like you would do to people under your influence. All the best sir.

GenBuhari: But that is my point, all that is scare-mongering propaganda because as far as I am aware only one confrimed case and it was Patrick Sawyer.

Sorry, I don't get you. What is your point again? You need to see the names and email addresses of all ~1000 casualties to date before you believe that there is a disease that is killing off more people at an (almost) exponential rate?

aolatunde00: I agree with you that there's something fishy definitely going on.A disease is this dangerous and contagious and it's killed how many people in the whole of Africa?less than 5000.
Someone should tell me something else abeg.Even with the so called epidemic in Liberia?whats the casualty figure?
More people will die from typhoid in Nigeria than they will from Ebola.
Soon them no begin share drugs and vaccine(who knows what those actually contain)?
I take precautions but I still have my brains

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-08-06/ebola-deaths-go-exponential-nigeria-demands-experimental-drug-us
[2nd graph]

What do you think? Should we be worried?

GenBuhari: I am saying the names do not exist unless someone can prove me wrong.

Whoever is behind this moniker, I just hope you are not related in any way to a certain retired general of the same name.

Why you have chosen to keep harping on rabies, I do not know. Or, have you heard of a rabies outbreak anywhere in Nigeria that has been swept under the rug? Chief, no one is suggesting that people panic, but we do have a serious problem on our hands here. You may chose to stick your head in the sand, but while you do that, Ebola is going EXPONENTIAL on us.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-08-06/ebola-deaths-go-exponential-nigeria-demands-experimental-drug-us
[check the second diagram]

Do you have any inkling whatsoever about the implications of that graph? In simple terms, the number of Ebola cases keeps doubling in shorter and shorter units of time. I shiver to think of how many cases this graph predicts we will have by December.

Do you still think the hue and cry is for nothing?

teeowl: Dear Nairalanders please sign the petition. It is by a doctor and his name is Ahmed Tejan-Sie MD and he wants us to get the FDA (USA) to fast-track testing of a possible treatment for Ebola. This petition on change.org requires another 12,000 supporters.

I am pleading to all Nairalanders to support this noble cause, don't joke with this problem called Ebola. We remember the massive amounts of deaths that SARS caused in south east asian countries, please let us support this cause, it takes only 1 minute... just 1 minute to sign and please invite your friends to sign the petition. We would all live long to play with our grandchildren and great-grandchildren amen!

Please go there and chip in with your support. Let's do something - anything - to stem the tide that looks set to consume us all...

Sign here RIGHT NOW - DON'T POSTPONE THIS:

http://www.change.org/petitions/food-and-drug-adminstration-fast-track-drug-and-vaccine-research-for-ebola-hemorrhagic-fever

PS: PLEASE ALSO INVITE YOUR FRIENDS TO SIGN THE PETITION.

Thanks for echoing the call (I'm posting this primarily to bump the thread...)

Oduduwaboy: Oooookay.They will now give it to you people free abi? Pfizer tested a new antibiotic for meningitis in Kano and our politicians turned it to a fiasco; Pfizer paid damages in millions of dollars. The black should learn to live responsibly.

So what's your point?

I just found someone who is trying to get the FDA (US) to fast-track testing of a possible treatment for Ebola. His petition on change.org requires another 12,000 supporters. Please go there and chip in with your support. Let's do something - anything - to stem the tide that looks set to consume us all...

Sign here (if you're interested):

http://www.change.org/petitions/food-and-drug-adminstration-fast-track-drug-and-vaccine-research-for-ebola-hemorrhagic-fever

I just found someone who is trying to get the FDA (US) to fast-track testing of a possible treatment for Ebola. His petition on change.org requires another 12,000 supporters. Please go there and chip in with your support. Let's do something - anything - to stem the tide that looks set to consume us all...

Sign here (if you're interested):

http://www.change.org/petitions/food-and-drug-adminstration-fast-track-drug-and-vaccine-research-for-ebola-hemorrhagic-fever

I just found someone who is trying to get the FDA (US) to fast-track testing of a possible treatment for Ebola. His petition on change.org requires another 12,000 supporters. Please go there and chip in with your support. Let's do something - anything - to stem the tide that looks set to consume us all...

Sign here (if you're interested):

http://www.change.org/petitions/food-and-drug-adminstration-fast-track-drug-and-vaccine-research-for-ebola-hemorrhagic-fever

I just found someone who is trying to get the FDA (US) to fast-track testing of a possible treatment for Ebola. His petition on change.org requires another 12,000 supporters. Please go there and chip in with your support. Let's do something - anything - to stem the tide that looks set to consume us all...

Sign here (if you're interested):

http://www.change.org/petitions/food-and-drug-adminstration-fast-track-drug-and-vaccine-research-for-ebola-hemorrhagic-fever

Bamibor: Webometrics has just updated their latest rankings of world universities.

Webometrics, as their name implies, is an
organization that ranks universities based
on the size, content and publications,
global performance and visibility of THEIR
WEBSITE, and they’ve been ranking all
countries Universities, but today, we’re
choosing the one that concerns us, and
that is, the NIGERIAN UNIVERSITY
RANKING.
The Webometrics team believes that if a
University or Institution has a strong web
presence, then it should directly affect
general performance of such institutions.
And this year, the BEST University in
Nigeria is
★ University of Ilorin
★ .
This university has been named the best
university in Nigeria while Akwa Ibom
State University has been listed as the
worst by the Webometrics.



So let's hear from you, what do you think about the ranking?

Is there something I'm missing here? I've just checked the new (July 2014) rankings, and, lets just say your information is iffy at best...

DocRhymes: Follow link and read. A current write up on prevention and what we can do. Some health care professionals like I and my friends are trying to educate people.

http://ayomideadebayo.com/ebola-nigeria/?utm_content=bufferf478f&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Excellent. We're on the same wavelength there.

What you have on your site is an excellent write-up of the sort I was suggesting.
Beyond that however, let's get Nairaland and other Nigerian sites and blogs to either link to your site from their home page (many will balk), or create versions on their home pages.

You see, I want us to catch casual and lazy readers who will usually not go looking for information outside their immediate online environment. Let's bring the information right under everyone's nose, and hopefully, inundate Mr. Ignoramus on the streets with information.

What gives us a fighting chance is that, with proper information and precautions, Ebola is actually not very contagious. Lets grab that chance.

Oh, BTW, I think it might be helpful to talk about incubation period and disease progression/duration?

ps: are you and your friends mulling any ideas targeting rural areas? If this thing hits the villages, and mixes with superstition...

masonkz: While many would rather be shouting "not my portion", as if ebola is for just certain type of people. The African mentality had better be cleansed during this period. Get more info about preventive measures and inform those around you.

That's the least we can do right now.

Correct.

Suggestion: Can we ask Seun to create a sticky on Nairaland front page with information on (a)symptoms+what to lookout for (b) preventive measures + suggested lifestyle adjustments?

I hope doctors in the house will volunteer to help with the write-up. If none does, I will be happy to generate it.

Can I also suggest that Seun and others here who manage sites try to start a chain where every Nigerian blog and site also carries such a sticky on their home page?

I also encourage everyone who has a social network page to consider linking to such a short, quick source of info on what to look out for, and what to do.

We may not be doctors, but we can kick this thing's butt!

Boss13: I have some issues with this Ebola. I believe there are some conspiracy theory. How did it get to Africa? I can swear it never existed but was created. But why should Africa be the testing ground

Please stop.

Médecins Sans Frontières. Google them up. You quite possibly owe those guys (mostly white) your life, because they, along with a few organizations like them, have been responsible for keeping Ebola from our doorsteps for decades. Ebola could very well have been created in a lab (another discussion that will be counterproductive at this time). You should however consider that the overwhelming bulk of efforts to keep this epidemic from decimating us, have been by the same oyinbos you're blaming (abi, what important role has any African aver had in containing Ebola?).

Long story short: please lets try to keep the conspiracy theories out for now.

Just my opinion.

This is a serious matter, and I suspect that very few people grasp just how dangerous the present Ebola outbreak is.

We Nigerians are very poor at actually doing something to solve our problems. I pray that will not be the case this time.
Whether Ebola is in Lagos (as seems likely) or not, six months into the epidemic, it's not too soon to start positioning ourselves. Believe me, this thing can get much, much worse. I have cast nervous glances at the Central African map over the last few decades, as valiant scientists have risked (and lost) their lives to keep Ebola contained. It appears our worst nightmares may yet play out in our lifetimes...unless we ACT!

I suggest that everyone does two things, both on this forum, and in our personal and professional lives: first, get people aware and informed, and second, let us be active. Do not assume Fashola or GEJ will do anything. Assume already that someone in your neighborhood is at risk, and that you alone can do something about it. Let us figure out what we can each do (rather than talk about).

By the way, if anyone on this forum has the ears of any top-ish NMA members, please beg them to strongly consider shelving their strike for now. I will also be doing the same. What looms before us is a national emergency of truly unprecedented proportions, and I think history will judge NMA harshly, unless they lead us to face it.

Davo93: The leadership of the Union resolved to demand the immediate intervention of the new Minister of Education,Ibrahim Shekarau with an ultimatum of a week. A failure to intervene within a week will mean a mass mobilization to the Ministry's Secretariat in Abuja for an "Operation Occupy Ministry of Education until our Demands are met"...Enough is enough!

Sigh.

You guys just seem determined to do everything wrong. Do you think the above language accords proper respect to the Minister whose help you are trying to get?

I wish you guys the best in your struggle, but perhaps you should bear the following in mind: the university is leaning strongly towards not opening the school till September at the earliest. You may argue that we will all lose if that happens, but take a trip to campus and see staff spending more time on their research, looking more relaxed, and happily collecting their salaries, you may have a rethink about that.

Once again, I wish you the best in your struggle.

rutchiekens: The day u figure out the answer to this question... That day would mean your IQ just improved...

I'm truly sorry I ever wasted my time on the likes of you. You represent the sort of student that I hope the ongoing dialogue about tertiary education will flush out of my class. Have a good life.

jaryeh: N450,000? In what way? If ASUU felt we needed more and demanded for it, why can't I?

Are you saying you do not think you cost FG that much? How much do you estimate is the value of the education you currently get? I think this is the crux of the matter.

PS: sorry I have to leave for a meeting now (just informed). Be assured however that I will return by around noon, so please post away!

MOBBDEEP: Again @ Prof ( don't mind me Sir )
I will continue to reiterate that the fee/funding is not the fundamental problem!
It sure needs assessment but it is just a side problem.
Fix this & leave corruption + defective accountability + rotten Civil-Service un-tended to, our condition will be more pitiable.

So, in your opinion: corruption in Nigeria, and in the universities is the major problem of the sector?
In your opinion, assuming we could wide out corruption in Nigeria, the universities would immediately get to global standards at the current level of funding?

rutchiekens: My argument was with Abraham2013 but since u getting head over heels with yourself..... U're welcome..

Here are some countries:

Argentina
Greece
Denmark
Brazil
Sweden
Finland
Norway.

To mention a few

Let me get you right: you mean every country on that list is POORER than Nigeria? By what metric, pray tell?

jaryeh: Ok. What's your say on it?

I hope you don't think I will shy away from stating my mind because my stand may be unpopular?

I think students are being silly in their demands. They should not argue that N30,000 is too much for tertiary education in 2014 (how can anyone say that, and not slap himself?). They should have focused on the fact that some students cannot afford to pay such.

Your focus should be on how serious the university is about helping indigent students. By most of their utterances and actions, the students have demonstrated that the school showed them too much respect by offering to dialog. Their utterances did not show that they grasp the issues at stake.

rutchiekens: Saying the population is getting out of control just makes u a political b:itch and senseless Nigerian...Nothing can get out of control in this world... Cos u are not the one that created the universe.

MOBBDEEP, this is one of those I was talking about.

jaryeh: The change has to start from the government because it has all the needed resources. Starting it from us - by introducing tuition and other unnecessary fees - would cut off the development because we do not (and should not) trust them. We would see any of their plans to get from us as another scam - and so it has been.

There are certain aspects of the change that will start from government, but this is not one of them.
Let me personalize this matter a bit: do you Jaryeh believe that the government spends up to N500,000 on your education per annum? Since you pay less than N50,000 currently, do you Jaryeh think the government has not done enough by paying N450,000 on your behalf? As someone has asked, do you think it is fair that it is this same you (and not the hairdresser or mechanic) that is demanding for more?