₦airaland Forum

Ferisidowu:
oh thanks the question is originally mine....
to be sincere the question is foolish and lack logic, it's even contradictory

just that there are foolish atheists That delight in foolish questions lol
although not all :;
some still admit that the question is baseless

I brought it here so as to see how fellow Christians would answer...

thanks for your contribution...

also the question is meant to be taken literally..

lol

Whatever you think you are doing is unfair.

OkCornel:
It would be sad if that guy you've been discussing with ends up criticizing the Pharisees as well.

So much for trying to remove the speck in another person's eye.

Traditions vs TRUTH, that is what the guy is struggling with

I gave up when he said "whatever his son does with the money he gives him is not his business"
It's a pity. I don't think I will be quoting him again.

asuustrike2009:
Like I said freeze should mind his business. Whatever my son does with his money is not my concern.my concern is that he graduate with good grades that's the aim. My brother forget pride, whatever heat freeze and co are receiving, they deserve it. They should learn to mind their business

I wanted to ignore you from this point as per the bold statement, but I will be doing you a great disservice. First, you should care what your son does with his money....he may be sponsoring book haram with it. Again, I don't think the good grade your son is aiming is one that should be gotten at all cost. Change that mentality.

Moving forward, about heat....we all know who is really receiving the heat.

About minding his business, well obviously, from your statement church is business and since freeze is not in that line of business. I get it. More like saying if you are not a politician just shut it, and let the rot GI round. Never you complain when they loot and embezzle. That's a way a nation grows. Kudos to the leaders of tomorrow. Kudos to Christians o today!

Thanks for your time bro.

asuustrike2009:
1. Have you admitted that Christianity is all about love? ...before we start to distinguish between love of god and love o neighbor, as if they are different.
Yes.

Good. It shows you may be teachable after-all. Please, don't fall my hand as we progress.
Well, the ONLY way to show your love for God is by loving your neighbor (who of course is the image of God).

2.Have you acknowledged that you are doing the same thing you accuse freeze of which is fighting for God.
no because Freeze is a confusionist.

Maybe he is a confusionist, you may have to prove that anyways. But, the thing is this you are fighting him (for God) because according to you he is used by lucifer (If only you knew whom Lucifer is) and at the same time accusing him of fighting for God. Have you acknowledged that you are wrong in that aspect? Remove pride so that we can proceed.

3. Freeze should remove the log in his eyes before finding faults. it would have being better if he had mind his business instead of causing confusion and breeding hatred,

Maybe his business is pointing out the ills in the church. If that is the case, I am sure he is trying hard to mind his business. He may have log in his eyes, but the fault he has found is still there unaddressed. Can't we address both his log and the fault? If a thieve points to you that your house is on fire, will you leave your house to burn down because a thief informed you of the fire?

4. Back to the message, is it right to receive first fruit of gifts given to students, aged, poor and jobless?
yes is it right. it is not compulsory that you give but if you give from the little you have then it shows that you are doing it out of love not compulsion.

So, if you give your son money to return to school in January and he comes back the next day saying he gave it to pastor as first fruit, what will you do?

Finally, I wish that you take your time to read and understand my post before answering. Thanks.

soulpeppersoup:
If you need the Abrahamic blessing, you must do it the way he did it.

You are very correct my brother...

The problem is that most if not all Christians do not need Abrahamic blessing but God's blessing.

But as for those of us looking for Abrahamic blessings, here is also a list of other things we MUST do the way he did it.

1. sleep with and impregnate our wives' maids.
2. offer burnt sacrifices.
3. be willing to offer our sons as burnt offering.
4. lie about the relationship with our wives.

asuustrike2009:
Admit nonsense fron someone causing division in the body of christ? Is that how they preach love that the so called movement advocate?. He should focus on his career and learn to mind his business. If a Christian has an issue that bothers him, the bible recommend how to go about if not be scandalous like what freeze is doing. Freeze has the bible he should read instead of finding fault like the accuser of the brethren.

Why are you so mad at freeze?

If you have issues with him, why not follow the bible recommendations that only you know of?

My questions remain,

1. Have you admitted that Christianity is all about love? ...before we start to distinguish between love of god and love o neighbor, as if they are different.

2.Have you acknowledged that you are doing the same thing you accuse freeze of which is fighting for God.

3. The problem is that you don't even take your own advice. Instead of finding faults in Freeze's personal life like the accuser of the brethren, why not find fault in his message using the bible.

4. Back to the message, is it right to receive first fruit of gifts given to students, aged, poor and jobless?

asuustrike2009:
Christianity is about love indeed! I presumed your leader Freeze is only preaching one sided love. Love your neighbours but he forgot the other part which is loving God. didn't same bible say if you love me you would keep my commandments? That's loving Jehovah

Have you admitted that you were in error about Christianity and love?

Have you also admitted that you are doing the same thing you accuse freeze of, fighting for God?

That simple act of humility is expected of any reasonable human being before you start tales of your presumptions.

BushWickBill:
Typical Christian.

When they can't counter you with logic or common sense, they resort to insults.

This is why nobody takes you people seriously, because you never practice what your Jesus tells you. You just go to church because you are poor and need a miracle to solve your financial problems. You do not even love your Jesus enough to obey him.

I'm pretty sure that your Jesus is proud of your conduct on these pages. And if this is how you uncouth lot behave, I don't want any parts of it.

And these are the people that will disturb people in public places with preaching and speaking in tongues. How can any sane human being identify with their Christianity if it is practised thus.

Penalty82:
Anybody can write anything to get attention.

True. You've gotten enough of my attention.

asuustrike2009:
Is Freeze now God or Can't God fight for justice ?
Freeze claims to know the bible right? Can't he see that false prophets are bound to spring forth? Were Christians not warn? Why is Freeze fighting for God? . am not in support of pastors neither do I support freeze either. Am hard on him because he his being used by Lucifer. The handwriting is one the wall to see. Does he think everything is about money and showing love as he advocate? It goes beyond that. Money and love isn't all about Christianity has he had made many to believe.

You are hard on him because he is being used by Lucifer and you are fighting hard for God. Twale.

If the bible is anything to go by, then you are wrong Christianity is all about love. Everything about Christ as the bible made us believe is centered on love....his coming, love. His messages, lovr. Even his death love.

What then did your GO tell you is greater than love? Tithe and first fruits?

After now they will say you don't use logic to interpreted the bible. Melchizedek collected Abraham's tithe by himself, why then is Ashimolowo and his crew collecting Abraham's Children's tithe on Jesus' behalf. Who send una?

Ndi oshi!!!!


Just imagine the pain it took this man to put up this logic for tithes.. From Jan 7th to Jan 9th. 3 whole days. Nna mehnnn

asuustrike2009:
1.We have that oil and anointing yet God selects his own to be his servants. Why didn't God appoint all of us as pastors? Why did he choose some persons to be his mouthpiece? Can we have 4 captains in a ship?
2. Who is freeze? Someone that can't keep his home,. Is that the person to be taken serious. Until he puts his house in other then he can talk well.He should remove the stain in his garment before pointing out stain on someone's garment.
3. If there are errors what stop freeze from sending the message directly to whom it may concern must it be on social media?
4. Wh

1. He chose some people to speak and others to listen. All are equal before him. "None is more equal than the others". At end of the day the criteria for salvation remains same for everybody.
2. Freeze is a human being created in the image and likeness of God. He may not be able to keep his home better than you do but he has spoken out against atrocities that others condoned. Like you rightly put, our gifts are different.
The fact that there is stain in his garment does not mean the stain he sees in another's garment is not there. It means rather that there are two stains to be cleaned.
3. Nothing stops him, but social media makes it easier and faster. Besides, most of these atrocities committed in the Lord's name are posted on the social media. Again, he is trying to alert the public of the antics used to swindle them of their hard earned money.

Penalty82:
Which church said that?. Don't let freeze deceive you. Youths and students are bn helped in every church, they're always excluded in so many thing that has to do with money. Get your facts right.

Did you read the OP? Try, it is not long.

The one in the OP did not spare even the poor and jobless.

asuustrike2009:
There is no sense at all. Nobody is protecting daddies in the lord at all. Most of us respect the oil and anointing in them if not they are just mortal like us. What freeze is doing is in the wrong way.He maybe fighting a good cause but he is sending many to hell in his crusade against false prophets. No amount of propaganda will change false prophets from springing forth. Many false prophets must arise and deceive people whether we like it or not just the way persecution is the cross every Christian must carry

Respecting the oil and anointing doesn't not equate pointing out their wrong doings when you notice any. This should be clear enough.

The next thing should be understanding that we all have one form of oil and anointing or the other on us. And as such we all should be respected still.

Again, if we take Freeze out of the equation as he is only a message, can we admit that some of his message are correct and should be acted upon.

Lastly, are we now to say because their must arise false politicians among us who will steal our money therefore we should do nothing to deter them or at least send a signal that we understand what they are doing. Do you know what moral booster it will be for the genuine ones?

Let us try not be sentimental and look at these messages as logically as possible..... The poor, jobless, students, aged (without pension) should bring their gifts and allowances as first fruit. Just Negodu that kain thing.

OkCornel:
They are stealing in the name of the LORD.

What baffles me is how an anointed man of God who has read the bible cover to cover in addition to reading concordance and attending Bible school would still conclude that the poor and helpless should still pay first fruits...

SMH

Not just stealing in the name of the lord but also stealing from the most vulnerable....the poor and jobless.

Guy, jobless means people who have no means of livelihood if I am not mistaken. People you are supposed to support. Nna Mehnnnnnnnnnn

Even, the aged with no pension should pay their children's allowance not minding whether the children have paid tithe, first fruits, offering, prophet sacrifice, thanksgiving from the money.

OkCornel:
Daddies in the Lord are so perfect they can never make mistakes na...

I just tire for people wey dey defend unscriptural doctrines and yet dem go still criticize Pharisees wey dey Bible... not knowing they are doing the same thing as them...rejecting the bitter TRUTH because it hurts

This is painful to say the least. It goes on to show the degree of moral decadence into which we have sunk. How can we survive a society thinking like this?

That pastor or whoever wrote that book even had the mind to include the poor and jobless bringing their GIFTS as first fruit and we see nothing wrong with that. I weep for myself and my generation.

Penalty82:
God doesn't use a fornicator to correct his prophets.

You detect to him whom to use? No wahala.

Nobody is extorting money from the poor. I am a successful businesses man and I never pay first fruit to my church before and nobody will force me to do it. If the poor feels like giving, let them give but I doubt if there's any poor individual that can do that. Freeze should be ignored.

That write up said "For students, the poor, the jobless it is your first GIFT for the year. The fact that you don't pay doesn't mean you should keep quite when atrocities are being committed. Where is our consciences for god-sake? So, these categories of people should bring gifts given to them as first fruit and you see nothing wrong with it because a fornicator pointed it out?

asuustrike2009:
Don't mind that man. He should continue because he shot himself in the wall very soon.

And you are earnestly waiting for that very soon when he will shoot himself instead of examining his message to see if there is even a bit of sense in his nonsense.

Is that how we reason in this country?

Just because we want protect our Daddies in the lord?

Penalty82:
He should remove the lug in his own eyes first.

I understand that. I also understand that god can choose to use anyone that he wants to, but that is a story for another day.

But in all honesty, not minding the messenger, is it right to exhort money from even the poor ones and students in the name of first fruits?

Penalty82:
That's what Freeze wants you to believe. He want to appear to be educating people but ending up making a fool of himself. If truly he knows the Bible teachings as he's making people to believe, why is he having a baby mama which fornication?

Does having babymama make collecting money from students, poor and aged all in the name of first fruit right?

Condemn his having babymama and condemn still this brazing act o wickedness being displaced in that write-up above.

The convener of the #Freethesheeple Movement and the leader of #FreeNation in Christ, Daddy Freeze is at it again. He has vowed to stop the pastoprenures and the yahoo boys parading themselves as men and women of God before they completely destroy what is left of Christianity in the country.

This time, he took to his Instagram page to condemn a printed booklet allegedly from one of the Pentecostal churches in Nigerian asking students, the poor, orphans and even the aged to bring money as first fruits for God to bless them. According to him "they have made their God their belly"

TreasuredGlory:
Must you react to everything? This is 2018: This nonsense must stop. Grow up and do your own thing. If you know the number of people RCCG employs and pays salaries to, you go fear and ask God for forgiveness.

Who tell them to employ people? No be to preach the word of god them send them?

kosisoOkafor:
My friend no body has ever forced you to pay tithe. And if I may asked, since you've not been paying didn't you know that nobody has even noticed, because your tithe is irrelevant to the church. No body needs your 10 naira tithe.

Nobody has ever forced you not to pay tithe to the best of my knowledge. I think you are right as far as Jesus and Christianity is concerned "your tithe is irrelevant".
Honestly, the pastors don't need his #10 but the poor do.

AkpaMgbor:
Exactly the point I made a few weeks back here on nairaland...the tithing issue isn’t what freeze and his ilk are really after...that is just a decoy, their main aim is the church and everything the church represents..which is holiness, freedom, joy, peace, wealth and LOVE...

The question is "is he right on the tithing issue?"

What the church represents is tithe?

Validated:
I do not discuss "hearsay". Present the fact. If you do not have it, then do the respectable thing. Be silent!

Well, I do not have fact to present to you. I was hoping you as an insider will have all the facts and first hand information. A simple "yes it is true as far as I know or no, that's a lie from the pit of hell" would have been enough.

But of course you are typical Nigerian christian who hates questions.

Validated:
I have restained myself from this tithe bruohaha for a long while. However, I realise that ignorance will keep people deceiving others for what they do not know. For many years I served as a freelance Treasuer at RCCG. Tithe is not given to GO, rather the Parishes retain a greater %, Area Hq, Regional HQ and Provincial HQ share the rest. The same applies to offering and first fruit. I observe that lot of comments are made sarcastically by those who are ignorant of what obtains in Christendom. I cannot speak for other churches but OP and his co-travellers should be advised that GO of RCCG Pastor EA Adeboye was not the first GO and neither does he claim to own RCCG. Anytime he retires or he is called to glory, a new GO will emerge, who may not necessarily be a family member.
On tithe and other givings in church, noone is forced to do these. If your faith is not able to carry it, you are free to attend church as a "goatie" rather than be a "sheepie". Let the goats live and let the sheep also flock. God knows His own.

By the way, am not a pastor not church leader, but a simple brother and follower of Jesus.

I heard that the first Daddy GO of RCCG did not collect tithes and that tithes and tithing was introduced by this present Daddy GO. How true is this statement Sir?

GoodMuyis:
I Myself love the initiative but the initiator started with bad motives. As a christian I love and still support the TAP.

But the problem with the concept it that people will abuse it, the neighbor you help financially will find his way back to you for another help. This has happened to me a lot, small boy like me in my 20s being approached by the married several times after initial help.

Secondly, giving money to people won't help them much, except you connect them to financial liberty. Either Job or Occupation. A Muslim convert with 3 kids abandoned by husband was won into our local church, what my pastor did was to fund her to stretch business of her choice now she is doing fine till date.

So instead giving people money, lead them financial freedom

Exactly Sir,

As much as possible, the #TAPChallenge avoids giving money. Identify the need and solve to the best of your ability. You can start a petty trade for someone, offset their school fees or hospital bill and pass the Barton.

In order to avoid my neighbor coming back to me...I Tap to someone whom I don't know. If I identify someone close who has a need, the I TAPChallenge someone else.

Personally, I think it is a noble idea if we carry on with it.

Abjay97:
TapChallenge that is not inspired by GOD... Why will it work?

Why would you say it was not inspired by God?

Are you telling me that 'God' does not appreciate showing love to neighbors?

I think you should follow Daddy Freeze on IG to know whether it is working or not.

I have been TAPchallenged twice, and I have challenged 4 persons two of whom have responded and I think you should do the same.

Somebody shout alleluia!!!!

He is right.

No prophecy on #freethesheeplemovement?

asalimpo:
ok. i think get you. I thought you were taking a stand but if i'm to rephrase,you mean, a pastor who has preached a lot of a central topic like tithe had never heard of a verse that talked on it!
Poor /lax /lazy /typical researching on his part. I think this is what you were saying

Exactly Sir... Do you think he is alone? No, I don't think so. Myself, I saw that passage for the very first time after being a Christian almost all my life last year when sonofluc1fer brought it up on his thread "Guide to Tithing" or something like that.

Mine is even worse in that in the church I was born in (Catholic church in Imo State) nobody ever mentioned tithe, I attended a Seminary School, no mention of it until I came to Port Harcourt in 2012. For the very first time in my life I was in a catholic church and at the end of the Mass the Priest stood at the alter and called out "those attending for the first time for prayers". My shock was yet to settle when the announcer called out those with their tithe envelopes to come out. Instantly, I knew I was no longer in my village.

You think it was laziness on the part of my Boss, you may be right, how about the people he is teaching? What becomes of them if he is teaching them only half truths in sincere ignorance?

Now, answer me in all sincerity, have your pastor every preached that part of the bible to you before? If yes, what did he/she say? If no, why not?