₦airaland Forum

achorladey:
E no dey easy at all. Na me know how I started my investigation and even tested those findings to check how true it is. I can confidently say even here on Nairaland the investigation and experiment turned out to be true. That's why when I found out the very same thing that they use in condemning others is the very same thing they do then I know staying is IDOLATRY basically worshiping men who say they are apostles but are liars

I know most of the Jehovah's witnesses on this platform while I was still active and locked in the believe will readily support my post. Commend the knowledge and how verse I am even when I still be ordinary publisher.

The moment they detected a slight change in the way I express those beliefs, they come raging at me. Then I know they are always about you towing the line no matter how glaring the lies are.

Is it not same Jehovah's witnesses on this platform that tried everything in their powerful to lie that child abusers are carried not by real Jehovah's witnesses, Is it not same Jehovah's witnesses that was trying to tell me Christians have two hopes when the Bible says one when I challenged that belief?

Thats how it goes, just tell us what agrees with the GB, we're ok, but if you say anything different from the GB, you've become their enemy, yet they will tell a churchgoer to go against his own Pastors teaching. And tell him to question his pastor and even read the Bible to show why one supposed to stand for what the Bible says even if his pastor teach something different. But whenever it comes to their GB, remain dumb. They fail to see that the same scripture they read to others apply to them as well. Make sure of all things and hold fast to what is true is not for only churchgoers. We must obey God as ruler rather than men is not only for churchgoers but for all leaders who go against what God says.

achorladey:
Gbam, amongst all the publications the GB cherish most is the Watchtower study edition. It is there the indoctrination of all members take place. That's why the Watchtower conductor are hardly changed or rotated. They must be proper organization centric man. Who is ready to hold all doctrines unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses. Any dissenting comments are shut down and those persons if they continue will never be called to contribute during the study.

Like someone said, on Sundays they are not studying the Bible but Watchtower

Yes, Sundays are mainly watchtower study. Many talks are sleep inducing. Watchtower is the part people enjoy the most. Super indcotrination tactics.

The watchtower conductor is selected from among the best teachers among the elders. I happen to handle that office when I was serving. The watchtower is carefully written and screens out what could raise doubt in the subject under discussion. At times, I do see ways in which one can squash the argument presented therein, but of course the questions are worded to be pro-GB teachings.

You see what I have discovered is, you dknt get to get see the error in your religious group by studying the proofs they presented in there publications, even if those publications are filled with biblical proofs. They will deceive you right within your eyes.

The best is, get what they say is rhere interpretations. Write it somewhere. On your own consider that topic as a study project. Gather ALL the scriptures relevant to that subject by using a concordance. Then ask each of those scriptures gathered the question under discussion, then you will start to see that the whole argument presented in the publication are full of inconsistencies with many other scriptures. Research one subject at a time, don't bring many subject together.

This was rhe method I used, and saw that many things I was thought was just the GB picking view supporting scriptures while ignoring many others that opposed their theology. My shock is when realizing that some key scriptures that opposed a particular subject do not get used more often or are used in a different topic not related to the k w is it against. So that, you can't put the pieces together and spot a contradiction.

I encourage people to engage in this type of Bible study. Use concordance, gather ALL the scriptures for that subject. In many cases, you will see scriptures that relate to that subject that the publication never mentions. This type of study is the MOST progressive method of Bible study. I have never in my life seen a study method that is so eye opening than that method.

achorladey:
I am not using strong words against him. Someone read most of my comments and words I used while conversing with MaxInDHouse and said I am not abusing him at all or using strong words on him. He added, it was just a proper description of MaxInDHouse on Nairaland.


I told you that the main purpose of this thread was for Max to tarnish your image, rubbish you so that anybody reading your threads exposing their beliefs and how it does not align with scriptures won't bother reading. He will have easily say Sand2022 is an APOSTATE but because you said you are PIMO he knows you have gotten to that extent here. So what can he do? Call you insane, mad and added you can never be his brother



This is the more reason I just looooool about Jehovah's Witnesses and the mentality they pack into their brains. A former member of the religious organization stated they like to play God and they have shown over the years to be terrible about it.



I readily want to see the shock in MaxInDHouse face when that happens because one of those he refer to as faithless miscreants in his madness and insanities peddling brains gets to be in that Kingdom



The reason we do what we do here. We are trying as much as possible to make people see that that religious spirit of comparing a Christian religious denomination with another and seeing one as superior to the other is smallness of the mind about what Jesus taught and even his disciples that followed him after his death.

Ok

MaxInDHouse:
This is what makes Jehovah's Witnesses organization the only true religion.

It's either you adhere to the teachings of those taking the lead {Hebrews 13:7} or take your leave to prove that you're not ready to be a part of such a system! 1John 2:19

That's what orderliness means!

True orderliness is seeing Christ as the head of the congregation (1cor 11:1-3). Such that if those taking lead goes against Christ, you go against them.

True worshipers obey God as ruler rather than men (Acts 5:29).

That's where the problem is, Christ told you to obey his shepherds, did he mean that you obey his shepherds when they tell you to do what Christ himself doesn't approve? It is even worse when there is no evidence that Christ appointed them.

True worshipers are Christ focused not GB focused.

achorladey:
I agree, they don't believe they persecute others for their faith because the only thing called truth is from them and originate from them, so when they treat other Christian denomination members badly they are only in a way carrying out God's judgment on vengeance as it were on those they call Satan's agents.

The whole book of revelation they published is filled with how God is using them to carry out vengeance on false Christians and Satan's agent

It is a religious organization that don't practice what they preach and don't believe the Golden rule applies to them.

That book title seem to carry the notion they had that this system won't go beyond the 20th century. Revelation- It's Grand Climax, at hand.

achorladey:
It definitely does not happen only in Nigeria. As long as this religious organization maintain the way they are set up internal conflict and external conflict will persist.

Are you aware this internal and external conflict is equally a valid point I threw to Jehovah’s witnesses elders that they were unable to respond to. It is within those conflict the flock of Christ get killed or suffer for long.

Tell me more about the boldfaced

MaxInDHouse:
Of course he did!
When Judaists questioned him why he's always criticizing their leaders Jesus didn't say he wants to correct them rather this is what transpired:

in response the Jews said to him: “What sign can you show us, since you are doing these things?”

Jesus replied to them: “Tear down this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

But he was talking about the temple of his body. John 2:18-21

Jesus claims to end Judaism and replace it with another form of worship which is what his disciples began in the upper room on the day of Pentecost.

So his consistence at the temple is to surrender his life in order for a new dawn to begin in the life of faithful people the temple in Jerusalem was destroyed according to Jesus' prophecy and Christianity replaced Judaism.

I think I posted more than what you just quoted.

If joining there worship was a sin, Jesus wouldn't have done it, and also stated that even after the establishment of Christianity, Jesus apostles also went to the temple. So this is not an escape route.

I don't see the GB joining a church just so that they can get followers

achorladey:
It givedyhim room to peddle the stupidity of his madness and insanities peddling brains

Just take it easy with the strong words you use against him. I think we all have different perspectives. Do you know what I ask myself sometimes? God knows all false teachings and wrong understanding we all have kn earth today. Can you imagine if God will use that to judge any of us? All of us will fail the exam because even when we think that doctrine A is correct, it may be wrong, only that we just don't know.

God really have much patience and endurance for our mistakes and misunderstandings.

Forget the individual theological position, Jehovah loves each of us very much. You might be in the area with Max in God's kingdom. Religious spirit has not been helpful in uniting the body of Christ, only division.

achorladey:
Something we saw from afar. He simply wants to tarnish your image because you kept exposing their beliefs. Had you stated you were disfellowhipped or disassociated, it will be easy for him to say others should run away from you the apostate. You are not giving him for that the next step is to say you and see you as a mad person.


The problem I have with him now is, he has always said they are true disciples of Jesus Christ when others call them mad. Does that same standard applies to you?

MaxInDHouse wetin be the response from your madness and insanities peddling brains?

My brother, only God will help us. When I was active, I didn't see this truth as well. The JWs will persecute others for their faith, but they don't see that as persecution, but when it is done to them, it is persecution. See him calling me names, that is an obvious persecution for my biblical stand.

Many die-hard JWs won't allow their relatives who visit their house to sing church song in their house. Many won't allow you to attend your own church while staying with them. Some witnesses will tell that there relative to either stop singing church song, join them to the kingdom hall or go back home. This is a form of persecution.

achorladey:
Obviously yes, the same people that MaxInDHouse said Jesus worship with only in Jerusalem and not anywhere else

Of course, but he won't just accept the obvious truth.

Gabrielshow24:
What a hypocrite! 😂 When CJStars asked him to stay off his mention, he ignored it. Now he’s suddenly demanding that no one mention him at all! 👀

Oh really? Someone told him to cease mentioning him, he refused?

achorladey:
This is what determines your being one of Jehovah’s witness

Approved association with Jehovah’s Witnesses requires accepting the entire range of the true teachings of the Bible, including those Scriptural beliefs that are unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses. What do such beliefs include?




1. That the great issue before humankind is the rightfulness of Jehovah’s sovereignty, which is why he has allowed wickedness so long. (Ezekiel 25:17)*

2. That Jesus Christ had a prehuman existence and is subordinate to his heavenly Father. (John 14:28)

3. That there is a “faithful and discreet slave” upon earth today ‘entrusted with all of Jesus’ earthly interests,’ which slave is associated with the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. (Matthew 24:45-47)

4. That 1914 marked the end of the Gentile Times and the establishment of the Kingdom of God in the heavens, as well as the time for Christ’s foretold presence. (Luke 21:7-24; Revelation 11:15–12:10)

5. That only 144,000 Christians will receive the heavenly reward. (Revelation 14:1, 3)

6. That Armageddon, referring to the battle of the great day of God the Almighty, is near. (Revelation 16:14, 16; 19:11-21)

7. That it will be followed by Christ’s Millennial Reign, which will restore an earth-wide paradise.

8. That the first to enjoy it will be the present “great crowd” of Jesus’ “other sheep.”​—John 10:16; Revelation 7:9-17; 21:3, 4.

@ Gabrielshow24 tell me how Sand2022 will survive this? You will see all Sand2022 thread are basically exposing all those eight beliefs they say is unique to Jehovah’s witnesses

I can't survive it. That's why I resigned, stopped preaching with them and started a fading process. I am technically not a Jehovah's witness as your post shows. I don't even tell people that I am a JW. I've already told those in my office that I no longer hold to JW beliefs, but you know, the friends in the church don't make big deal about church name and they don't even understand what being a JW really means, some still address me as a JW even when I join them to sing praises and pray together, something I wasn't doing before. My Mom and family members in the village who are in the church, I've also informed them that I no longer hold to JW beliefs.

I like being called a Christian than being called a JW. It is true that I am not officially removed from the cong.

They harbor a lot of false teachings, so where will I start and where will I end, how can I even pretend? The more I research more topics, the more errors I see. It's too much bros.

achorladey:
Why do Jehovah’s Witnesses say they are God’s organization so matter of fact as though such an audacious claim is an undisputable fact?

Here is how one person sees this claim.

"The entire Jehovah’s Witness religion is founded on unsubstantiated hubristic claims which are continually repeated until they are assumed by adherents to be a proven fact.

Never is this more evident than when the beliefs of a Jehovah’s Witness are successfully challenged. The more compelling the evidence against them, the more they resort to repeating their convictions with a sense of insistence, as if they are chanting a mantra.

Confirmation bias is prevalent in all religious ideologies, but particularly with Jehovah’s Witnesses. The reason for this is that their evangelical work puts them in contact with many rival belief systems.

In order to overcome challenges to their beliefs and to prevent any doubts creeping in, Jehovah’s Witnesses have to retreat to their echo chamber to bolster their faith.

By repeatedly discussing their beliefs with fellow believers, they convince themselves that what they teach is the only ‘truth’. As well as supporting their own need for certainty, they in turn are helping to reinforce the delusions of other members.

There is a very interesting logical fallacy which highlights this method of confirmation which Jehovah’s Witnesses use, called ‘proof by repeated assertion’.

Here is a brief description:-

“Proof by repeated assertion is an informal fallacy in which a proposition is repeatedly restated regardless of contradiction and refutation. The proposition can sometimes be repeated until any challenges or opposition ceases, letting the proponent assert it as fact, and solely due to a lack of challengers. In other cases, it’s repetition may be cited as evidence of its truth, in a variant of the appeal to authority fallacy.

…In its extreme form, it can also be a form of brainwashing.”

At their meetings, Jehovah’s Witnesses are trained by role playing, acting out the arguments they regularly encounter in their ministry. However, they only ever consider the scenarios which present the softest resistance to their beliefs.

By constantly ‘overcoming’ the more easy arguments during practice sessions, Jehovah’s Witnesses are lulled into a false sense of security, believing that they have watertight answers to all the questions and objections they can expect to encounter in their ministry.

However, in real life JWs are occasionally confronted with much more profound and difficult challenges to their faith which they have not previously encountered. They invariably refrain from directly arguing or debating on these topics, but instead use deflection tactics such as referring the questioner to their website, and then they quickly retreat.

Later, when no longer under direct pressure, JWs are likely to replay the difficult challenge over in their mind. If there are no set answers in the Watchtower literature, they are compelled to fabricate a refutation themselves, perhaps by looking for relevant bible verses. The motive for this is often more to reassure themselves than to answer the challenger.

But many times there is no valid refutation. A frequent recourse if they can't find a gratifying way to refute the objection to their religion, is to vilify the character of the challenger, as a means to negate the challenge.

They are then compelled to use flawed logic to find a ‘solution’ to the challenge. Once they have an idea, they cling to it and repeat it, however false or illogical it is, until it becomes an ‘established’ counter argument (at least in their minds).

A classic, often repeated example is as follows. After pointing out a flaw in the Organisation they will reply by saying:-

“Show me an alternative religion that has more truth than ours”.

If their adversary fails or declines to suggest an appropriate alternative religion, the JW erroneously concludes that this is decisive evidence that theirs is the true religion by default.

Many people who have had encounters with Jehovah’s Witnesses will recognise this trait. Very often, when Jehovah’s Witness are confronted with contrary evidence, they simply repeat an invalid point over and over, even though they have been presented with well-founded objections or incontrovertible evidence.

After several such encounters, Jehovah’s Witnesses begin to have misplaced confidence in their false reasoning, which leads them to the absurd conclusion that their religion is the only one God is backing.

The Watchtower literature is also a factor which builds confidence in JWs that their religion is God’s organisation. The articles repeatedly make the hubristic claim that they are God’s ‘channel’, that God is using the ‘Faithful Slave’ to convey his message, etc.

Despite the lack of sufficient evidence, the constant repetition of these claims forms a confirmation bias in the minds of the followers, and these invalid assumptions become an established fact.

One only has to read the posts of many JWs on Quora to see this process in motion. There are countless answers from JW apologists in which they claim to be God’s people.

Remaining in an environment where this predominant attitude is constantly played out, has convinced millions of followers that their religion is God’s organisation, even though they lack sufficient evidence to back up this baseless claim."


cc Sand2022, Gabrielshow24

I think this is true. When a strange teaching comes from the GB, some brothers see to speak against it initially like the trouser change. Many didn't like that change, but now, it appears those who initially hated it are now accepting it.

What happens again is, the community of JWs are programmed to follow the GB, so even if you don't accept it, you resistance can only last for a few time. You can't even voice out to your fellow brother that much about it because he might start seeing you as an apostate. So the entire system is GB focused.

Another thing is that they will through organized talks and watchtower study pa in NT any who oppose their views as enemies of Jehovah. It is a high control group.

MaxInDHouse:
Now you are doing the right thing as you console your fellow worshipers regarding the nonsense and ingredients happening in their gathering.
Please i'm begging you in the name of God STOP TAGGING ME ON YOUR THREADS IT'S DISGUSTING TO ME.

FAREWELL!

Why did you quote me here then and then tell me not to tag you?

Is the congregation exempt? What is this judgemental attitude about? Is it not the GB that keep suing people who come to expose their dirty secret? Was it not after Barbara Anderson came out to expose the many pedophiles they have they disfellowshiped her and tell people not to talk to her?

Were they not the one targeting the innocent group in Spain who were there to help the victims of watchtowers members abuses. And the GB lost the suit even though these were small group with little money compared to the fat WT?

This is what happens when people are just worshipping church instead of following Christ.

MaxInDHouse:
NO!
Jesus has began to organize another group that will replace Judaism that's why he could confidently say his mother and brothers who were Judaists at that time aren't his real spiritual family rather it's those who now gather round him sharing the same line of thought with him are his real spiritual families!
Matthew 12:46-50

But what about Judaists who are against his line of thought?
Jesus has this to say to them:

You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. John 8:44

So Jesus was only waiting to sacrifice his human life which will Kickstart the new spiritual family.

Jesus didn't tell you that that was why he went to the temple.

Luke 4:16-21 – "He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom..."

Mark 1:21 – "They went to Capernaum, and when the Sabbath came, Jesus went into the synagogue and began to teach."

Luke 13:10 – "On a Sabbath Jesus was teaching in one of the synagogues..."

He worshipped with them. If worshipping with them was a sin, he won't even do it for a second or can you join a church perhaps in a need greater area, with hope that with time, when you get many members, then you pull off?

Secondly, the apostles also never avoided the temple even after Jesus family has been formed as you say. We read:

Acts 3:1
"One day Peter and John were going up to the temple at the time of prayer—at three in the afternoon."
. Acts 21:26
"So the next day Paul took the men and purified himself along with them. Then he went to the temple to give notice of the date when the days of purification would end and the offering would be made for each of them."

Acts 22:17-18
"When I returned to Jerusalem and was praying at the temple, I fell into a trance and saw the Lord speaking to me.

So again, the scripture is clear. Don't think I took my stand without researching it scripturally.

Ken4Christ:
It's worrisome to see common trends amongst most GOS or Church Founders especially in Nigeria.

1. They abuse their powers by arresting and putting in prison anyone who speaks against them. What then is the difference between them and politicians?

2. They oppress younger ministers they perceive carry unusual grace. And when such ministers try to leave to establish their own ministries, they frustrate them.

I could go on and on.

These evil trends should stop. Otherwise, they will be cast away on judgement day. God is no respecter of persons.

It is worrisome. GOs, we can remember are humans as well. So we need not get discouraged or stop following Christ because of their human imperfections.

It is possible that it doesn't happen only in Nigeria.

sunky97:
In this breathtaking near-death experience, She shares her miraculous journey after being declared clinically dead for 72 hours. What she witnessed in Heaven will leave you speechless — radiant angels, the heavenly gates, a personal life review before God, and a chilling confrontation with darkness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgVKoWX5ul0

I prefer NDE interviews not one related by someone else.

MaxInDHouse:
This is what lukewarm means:

You claim you are a JW PIMO which means you are PHYSICALLY IN the gathering of JWs but MENTALLY OUT of our gathering.

What else do you call LUKEWARM?

Did Jesus gather with the judaizers and criticize them as well?

MaxInDHouse:
I'm not advising you i'm telling you what you are from my own point of view so if others feel like chatting with you i'm not because from my own standpoint you are insane.
So if there is any atom of sanity in you try to avoid me completely!

You're still charting with a mad person for how long now. Are you sure you're not envying my insanity? But wait, youre telling a mad person what? So you expect a mad person to do what you tell them? And keep chatting with a mad man till this time? Wait, who is really acting mad here?

MaxInDHouse:
The same Jesus said:

So because you are lukewarm and neither hot nor cold, I am going to vomit you out of my mouth. Revelations 3:16

So according to Jesus you can't be in and out at the same time.

Do you now see why your PIMO status is evil from the viewpoint of Jesus?

Lukewarm people don't preach about their beliefs to others. They don't expose the false teachings of their leaders. It is the lukewarm who goes with humans rather than Jesus.

Jesus was among the judaizers, attended their meetings, but he expose their false teachings. Was Jesus being lukewarm?

MaxInDHouse:
I hate discussing with mad people but i need to clear this once and for all time so that next time you won't claim i'm one of your brothers! Proverbs 26:5

And you're giving that instruction to a mad person, and hope that a mad person will follow your advise? Who really is acting mad here if I may ask?

immaculatesense:
I think you understand me better after reading my reply to a quote.

Thanks.

Yes

MaxInDHouse:
Out of love when your cohorts come and say JWs are Satanists you keep quiet shey?

Now i know why you are running mad.

Please don't me again in any of your stupid threads.

Bye!

My cohort. You're my cohort as well. You're my brother in Christ.

It is interesting that you like speaking to mad people. Are you jealous of my madness?

immaculatesense:
Thanks a lot for the compliment.
One thing I have come to understand is "the evidence of righteousness is peace."

Thanks.

That's true.

MaxInDHouse:
I hate when a mad person claims to be my brother, i don't have a mad brother so one man's meat is another man's poison!

I am happy that I am mad at least I have a sane person who agrees to discuss with mad people. At least we can see from your approach who really is following Christ.

MaxInDHouse:
Satan might have succeeded in blinding you for not sticking to what the faithful and discreet slave taught you ọmọ that's not my own portion.
It's differences in theology that makes people claiming Christians to raise up weapons against their fellow believers when Jesus commanded us to have love among ourselves! John 13:34-35

So when Jesus prayed for one line of thought among us {John 17:22} and Paul seconded him {1Corinthans 1:10} we know the practical benefits that comes out of it! Isaiah 2:4

You may continue deceiving yourself i'm not!

Those are fine advise. Neither of them said that if you don't have one thought, then Jesus removes you from being part of his body.

Even in the first century, they have differences of opinions and viewed each other to be part of the body. This is the area the GB gets it wrong, or perhaps they harped on that to create control groups when in reality that is not what Jesus meant.

Paul who advised one thought even at 2 Corinthians people had different opinions and even criticized Paul himself. What, did Paul say, ok, you're no longer in the body of Christ.

Let them be, when Jesus comes, he will remove those in his house that are not doing what he says. Simple. Is it not Jesus that sajd that let the wheat and the weed grow TOGETHER until the harvest? My dear the GB wanted a high control group. The scripture is clear.

The church however is united by worship. Just as Jesus united in worship with the Pharisees and saduccees, although of different theology. The church have differing understanding, but when a worship song starts, they all join together. That is scriptural standard oga

MaxInDHouse:
Who first started countless threads and tagging me?

So you prefer to join stupid thread whenever you're tagged? Ok. There are some here who I tagged, that have not said a word.

MaxInDHouse:
But please where do you stand gangan?

Jehovah's Witnesses teachings you said it's wrong OK i'm quoting God's word to help interested persons see reasons with Jehovah's Witnesses you are now going back to Jehovah's Witnesses.

Abeg which one you dey gangan?
Are you for the Bible?
Stick to your personal interpretation of the Bible and leave JWs.
And if you are for JWs stick to the interpretation of JW leaders.

Jesus said:

"I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were cold or else hot" Revelations 3:15

Please stop being indecisive! James 4:8

I am decisive, and stand for the truth. I didn't tell you that I hate JWs. I've already told you that what I do is out of love. So you deliberately write what is not the truth about them because you believe that no one will know?

Jesus loves both you and all JWs, including those in the church. His intension is individuals, not church name. It is best you decide to stand with Jesus than humans.

The advantage of focusing on Jesus is that you won't be biased. If JWs are good in an area, you will say it, if the church is wrong, you say it. But if you are church based worshiper, you will back your church even when they have policy against Christ command.

MaxInDHouse:
Did i say there is poison in it?
In fact after the event we drank the wine that remains in the bottle but that which is poured into the cup during the memorial why didn't you eat and drink nah?
That's the question i'm asking you!

I ate and drank.

Stop spreading what is not true.

MaxInDHouse:
You disrespect my wishes by mentioning me in your stupid threads.
So can you stop doing so from the moment?
In fact can you just remove my name on your stupid threads?

Remove mine from yours first. See how you're boiling.

You're still commenting in what you call a stupid thread, it appears you like stupid things.

MaxInDHouse:
I'm for Jesus and Jesus is not interested in religions contradicting themselves in teachings and doctrines.
So my own Jesus differs from yours just as Kumuyi Jesus differ from Adeboye Jesus and so on.
Please stop mentioning me on your stupid threads i'm not interested in your madness.

You keep making this mistake. Differences in theology doesn't affect your being in the same body of Christ.

Ask Kumuyi and Adeboye whether his Jesus is different from each other. They will tell you No. And we see that in scripture as well.

Paul has been teaching against circumcision is gentile lands, while in Jerusalem, they were preaching circumcision. In fact one group is known in Jerusalem as supporters of circumcision. Paul even wrote a letter of Hebrews to explain why they should leave that circumcision issue at Hebrews. Yet Paul won't see these brothers as following another Jesus than he does. I did explain this in your thread.

GB keep making you feel that christians jn the first century saw eye to eye in everything . That's not true. The history of true christians has always been with some level of differences.

MaxInDHouse:
Can you present a better performing group under the leadership of any other religion?
See what our leadership has produced with whatever they are teaching us:



Do you have any religion close to this? Matthew 7:16-18

Better performing group? How?

If a church follows what the Bible says, it is better performing. I don't know what you mean by better performing again.

The guy you're quoting his comment is not Jesus.

1. Steadfast and committed.
Yes JWs are committed to the direction of their Governing Body. They will die for whatever the GB says. They will follow GB if ever what Jesus said contradicts what the GB says. So yes, they are committed.

2. They do not commercialize their religion.
I personally respect that. This is one area I commend them. Kumuyi is doing well in this regard as well.

3. They make sure everyone is at the same level. Yes, they try in that regard. Apostolic Faith try in that regard as well. But the Governing Body is definitely not at the same level. Women are more treated honorably in the church than among JWs. It's as if the males are more human than females among JWs.

4. They frown at flamboyant lifestyle.
That's not true. It is true in paper, but not in practice. Many circuit overseers will prefer to stay in the house of a wealthy brother than a poor one. When branch committees visit you, they expect preferential treatment, and they prefer the wealthy than the poor. Ask anyone in construction work how their budget is affected when those in branch visit. I agree that this is not what the leadership encourage on paper.

JWs have thousands of real estate to their name. They spend millions on them. And other assets. This organization is strikingly rich, but does near to zero uncaring for the less privileged. No single less privileged center to their name, but many real estate to their name.

5. Politics.
They are apolitical. Some JWs will make good politicians for sure. But not in the area of being less corrupt. Nope. Many of them will still be very corrupt. I fact they will teach those today how to be corrupt in a smarter way.

However, scripturally, politics should be left for personal decision.

On the flip side, the church excels in:

1. Worship, namely
A. Praiseful worship
B. Fasting and prayer. You see these feature in the bible, but JWs as a group is zero when it comes to quality prayers and fasting. Zero.

2. JWs excels in house to house. To be commended and all baptized are encouraged to participate. This is good. But the church has more result in preaching than JWs.

JWs started sound 1879, till date they still struggle with about 9million. Assemblies of God started around 1906, but they are counting around 200 million members. Even Kumuyi that started around 1950 has more members in Nigeria than JWs that came around 1921 in Nigeria. Although the JWs spend billions of hours preaching, the church has more growth.

3. The churches have more dedicated preachers. You see them in Afghanistan, Islamic rich regions, areas where JWs don't even have one missionary representatives. The church is more persecuted than JWs. If you check persecution.com, the record has around 150 million christians under persecution. But since they don't sing it as song like JWs do, it appears that only JWs aee being persecuted. Think of the chibok girls, and many churches being burned in the north and kidnapping there. Those are persecutions for rheir faith.

4. The church is more loving without discrimination than JWs. They have more humanitarian agencies, companies etc for the homeless, less privileged, widows, orphans. And the Bible says that this is a form of worship that God views as undefiled.

5. The church pays their church pastors. This is a plus, because the Bible says that elders who work hard should be given double honor. JWs interpret this to mean financial support to them. But they don't give elders kobo. They only pay those who are in their direct employ like special pioneers, male and female, and elders who work with their money receive nothing.

So when you talk about which church is better, I don't understand what you mean. No single church has it all.

I don't view one church and above another. JWs may excel in one and falter in another. Our focus is not on church but Jesus.