₦airaland Forum

Rondo for finals MVP.

Tinneh:
�� the guy no good??
I think I watched him play in one Olympic like that he looked very good to me
Sha who I'm I to argue

Yea, he's a legend in the national colours.

Tinneh:
Thanks for the reply, I just started following NBA of recent, I try watching clips of games time to time whenever I can, its hard watching NBA games live cos of time factors and some other stuffs,,
So far I think I love lebron, he made me fall in love with Basketball
My best players in the league are.
Lebron
Irving
Trae young
Curry
Ad
Victor oladipooooo

Don't know much about legends tho but I like
Kobe
Dwayne wade
Bosh
Luis scola

You got me there. I didn't see that coming

nairamaniac:
My top 5 of all time based on unbiased skill setup:
1. Jordan
2. Lebron
3. Magic
4. Olajuwon
5. Between Bird/Kareem


Honorable mention in Top 10 should be Kevin Durant, Duncan.

That guy called Durant (if he leads to win another chip, he should be clearly ahead of bird, worthy, pippen, Barkley, Malone) as a forward. No homo.
Durant is at worst a Top-10 ever to me. No one with that height has ever shot the ball so well in the history of the league.
And he depends the least on physical a contact than any other great player in anyone's TOP10.
if only he stayed as OKC and lead to a title, he shd clearly be in Top-10 to Top-8 ever by now.


But if u ask me top10 ever with bias to storylines, inspirational influence, career attraction, who I loved from my heart. Having one reason or another to just love the player.

1. Jordan
2. Iverson
3. Lebron
4. John Stockton
5. Magic/bird


Then best players currently and for past 5seasons;

1. Lebron
2. Durant
3. Curry
4. Kawhi(for showing up in 2 NBA finals)
5. Harden/Anthony Davis

At least you're a Jordan fan who is objective and sincere about other superstars(insert popular name here). That's really hard to find on this thread.

Lakers planning to start Caruso tonight.

WeissVonner:
Cut some things out to spare the thread and people scrolling through.

Dude, I'll be 100% honest with you, I didn't read your whole post but I get the gist of it. Jordan was better, he was a great scorer, a god, same old hokum nostalgic old people keep spewing. I get it, he dominated an inferior watered down extension era of basketball with clearly the best team in the league in an era without mobility. Then there was the marketing, what he meant to the sport, many people love and play the sport because of him and I understand all of that, I give him his props for that. But that whole 6-0 thing, no one is ever going to achieve that in the modern player mobility era, in my eyes Jordan is actually 6-9, I wont give him a pass for losing before the finals if we are going to hold LeBron responsible for losing in the finals. It's a dumb argument because I always say the best team beats the best player but since that's the game you want to play.

Here's what LeBron is:

6'9, 250lbs, so hes bigger and stronger. He's as good of a scorer as anyone who's ever played the game, as good as a playmaker as anyone who's ever played the game, as good and as versatile of a defender as anyone who's ever played the game. If passing and rebounding didn't matter people won't be in the HOF because of it. This is another extremely asinine argument, because if assisting didnt matter we wouldn't need point guards, people like Magic and Stockton and Kidd wouldn't be all time greats. Then theres Rodman and Russell and co. You need assists to create for other players because not every player can create for themselves, even all time greats like arguable the GOATs KAJ or Wilt, and other all time greats like Shaq etc needed players to create for them. You need rebounding to gain possessions and extra possessions to score. Its these little things that make a team win, believing on scoring matters is incredibly myopic.

The summary of LeBrons case is this, No one can deny he's the most complete player who's ever lived. No one impacts winning more than LeBron and no one has done more with less than LeBron. LeBron left Cleveland and both times they proceeded to have one of the worst records in NBA history, Jordan left the bulls and they won 2 fewer games and Pippen is second in MVP voting. The worst team LeBron played in the finals is better than the best team Jordan beat in the Finals. You really think if things were same as before where each team only had two stars in this era, you really believe LeBron would lose any of the Finals he played in the last 9 years? Then your man had Phil Jackson, every single coach LeBron has taken to the finals has ever been to the finals before him. I repeat, no one impacts winning more than LeBron, this is a fact, I don't think any objective person will deny this.

If you're questioning his mental strength this is someone who as the teenager was dubbed "the chosen one", he literally put this pressure on his back. Exceeded all expectations and never put a foot wrong on or off the court bar maybe 2011 in Dallas. He embraced the pressure and thrived under it. Anyone who questions how tough minded he is is a clown.


And if you lot are starting up this argument because LeBron is going 6 with Miami, let me tell you what Jordan at 35 in year 13 did in the finals.

Jordan went 3-0 against a supersonics team with an injured Gary Payton. Still needed 6 games to win, and in game 6, he shot 5/19 and still won. Bron shot 71%, dropped a 40 point almost triple double and lost.

This is why this era is so funny to me. We rely on sensationalism, every play LeBron makes is critiqued, Jordan didnt have the media ubiquity and certainly had an air of mystique no one will enjoy again. In game 5, Bron made the right play to a role player who bricked it and the immediate reaction is Jordan or Kobe would never when they literally did the exact same thing multiple times and their teammates have hit multiple shots like that. This is the player with literally the most playoff buzzer beaters in NBA history and with the best clutch stats in NBA history. Really? scared? LOL!

In the end there's subjectivity in all our arguments. I will still tell you R9 is the greatest footballer of all time because I'm trying so hard to cling to that. But in my opinion, MJ vs LJ is really no debate at all. It certainly won't be by the time LeBron is done.

Nuff said *drops mic

nairamaniac:
why do u focus more on what u disagree with than what u agree with?

I dropped an epistle, and u focused on the negatives.

well, personal opinions.

I love Iverson with all my heart. but he was an unattractive teammate. no one wanted go play next to him. That made him unattractive.

To be great, u need to attract the best skillset from other players to your own skill set.

Iverson was a one-man-army.

he transferred his real life experiences to the game. soooo much attitude, arrogance and passion.


As for wade, he had a better finals than Clyde ever did. but I still its either they are on same level or Clyde is ahead.


Sorry to ask, did you watch the 92finals in real time?

I'm not talking about google o.


Clyde was the closest to Jordan as a shooting guard for a period of time.



Maybe Iverson at his best but not wade.

Iverson is my best pound for pound scoring small-sized guard. but he was never going to attract the right players to be built around him to form a legacy.

he wasn't even really interested in the business side of it to place him in that position.

You want to eat your cake and have it. Are we talking about pure skills or greatness? Because if it is pure skills, Drexler doesn't come close to Iverson. And for greatness he doesn't cone close to Wade, the skills comparison is up for debate.

benji93:
At 31? Against your GOAT? and your GOAT can't put him in his place? Continue. . As i said Lebron fans will change the narrative. I am not surprised. We were talking about a sweep, and nobody ever ever called Jimmy butler a superstar, until this series. Abeg say something else. Abeg shift. .

Who even get time to argue with you. When we win the championship nobody go ask whether Butler na superstar or not. There'll be too much celebration to care. This one na una last resort to try and diminish the title, because you know it's coming for sure

benji93:
Giannis is a Superstar obviously has asterisk. . At least at the moment. Besides. Besides superstardom is a title that's conferred based on dominance over a period of time. I am talking about at least 2/3 years. If you can not deliver it through incredible regular season performances, then you better get to the finals and win it. The latter is how Kawhi made into superstardom. If you have a different criteria for measuring superstardom, that's ok. Remind me again when Butler had been this assertive. If he was 24/25, i could say oh, he was learning how to win in his younger years. And please neither Curry nor Kawhi- who just had a choke tag placed on his playoff career- is the subject of discussion here. Neither of them is placed at the same level as Lebron. The discussion is about your so-called GOAT. You allow a guy who has at best pulled off a few star performances in his career to attain superstardom in a series against you? That's unacceptable. . Wake me up when this dream is over.

Every player has his own coming out party, and this playoff run is Jimmy Butler's own. Kawhi won finals MVP because his team won. Jimmy Butler is on course to win finals MVP if his team wins. And don't forget that he has been an all-star since 2015, except for last year. . So, yes, he's a superstar

nairamaniac:
can u imagine? is derozan better than prime Iverson or MITch Richmonds.

The only shooting guard better than Clyde since Clyde should be Kobe.


And Jordan overshadowed Clyde thruout their careers

You're kidding right? I've been sceptical about most of what you've been saying since you started posting today but this one right here got my attention. Iverson and Wade were definitely better

nairamaniac:
pls elucidate.

what does Russell and dennis have to do with my post? I noticed u highlighted my statement that as regards to scoring being the hardest thing/stat.

do u disagree??

I addressed a few more things in that post, you can go back to it

nairamaniac:
nice one guys, I rarely comment on this thread, tlll its playoffs or finals.


but God wouldn't forgive me if I don't clear this up.

The arguments here between A40 and
WeissVonner.

The only part A40 gets it quite wrong is that "Lebron isn't as bad as he depicts him".


but on 90% of the arguments, A40 is spot on.


Guys Lebron may be the 2nd or 3rd best ever after Jordan.
but definitely not on same level.


Jordan was ahead of his time.

A40 has said it all. *The most important and hardest stat in the game is SCORING*

Assist, rebounds, triple-doubles and even Defence is nothing compared to scoring.


When Jordan came into the league in the 80's, guards(point&shooting) had no business scoring as much as Jordan did.

back in the 80's and early 90's, whenever u look into the 1st 20 highest scorers, 80% of them where centers and power-forwards.


Jordan changed the game. And he did it for his first 10years of being in the NBA for 10consecutive years.


The closest to him for those 10years in terms of Scoring prolifically were Ewing, David Robinson, Shaq, Kareem Abdul Jabber, Karl Malone and perhaps other bigs/forwards I can't remember right now.


Jordan came Into the league as a slender guard, not even physical or muscle-equipped and got to the hole better that all these guy for 10years.

all he had was a very good leap and skillset to dominate.


That alone is the most iconic shift I have seen in any sport.

Do not think it was just his leaps that took him to that level of scoring.

Dominic Wilkins and Clyde drexler had equivalent leaping abilities, but could they dominate as much as MJ? NEVER.



Then talking about the 2
second 3peat, from 1996 to 1998, I watched almost every finals games in real time.

when i say Real-time, I mean *REAL TIME*


Pls you guys are over exaggerating Dennis Rodman's significance to MJ.


in those back to back finals between the bulls and Utah, Dennis rodman with alllllll his rebounding prowess were hidden/covered and buried in those games against Utah.


if u say Dennis disturbed Shaq, when bulls played Orlando in the 96 finals, I can sit Down with u and agree.

but against "karl Malone", against Utah are u guys okay.
I love Dennis, but I cried for him against Utah for their back to back finals.
pls 70% of the reasons bulls won those last 2finals were all becos of Jordan.


Are u guys okay?

u are mentioning Dennis.


God bless the mind of A40 in here. he may not be 100% the best analyst or basket-ball historian, but he is a genius and we should all listen and learn whenever he speaks.


A40 is 100% spot-on as regards the kind of offensive/scoring help Jordan got from Pippen.


imagine Jordan's number 2 scorer averaged less than 20points in his career. where in the world has that ever happened in a championship team that depended on SCORING to win games.

Do u feel me??



if you say it happened with the piston's when they last won the title, I would tell u "that pistons depended on defence/physical play to dominate"



But for a team to win 6 tittles in 8years and the team for all those 6titles were always In the first-to-third in terms of "most points per game", and their second best scorer can't easily score 20points in 5 consecutive games, then you guys should loooooook very very deeply into the MJ-factor.


Then u guys are talking about Magic Johnson killing Jordan until Pippen came to bail MJ out.
using that particular series/occurrence to downplay MJ's game.


Are u guys okay? (with all due respect)


In the first place, Jordan had no business guarding magic.

Magic was a point guard in a power forwards body.
Its a physical mismatch.


Jordan brought the kind of entertainment the game had never seen before him.

Before Jordan, the 2most exciting players were bird and magic. Then a bit of isiah Thomas, due to his ball handles the game had never seen.


Then Jordan came into the league 84 and consistently was on TOP10 play of the day with highflying moves, hangtime layups and dunks.


While the whole world was still stuck with all those bird, magic and isiah's moves on the ground, Jordan took all that to the air.

I wasnt told this. I witnessed the iconic shift in realtime.

Also permit me to tell you how great Jordan's stardom was back then: Jordan was the only star(black or white) that came close to popularity and glamour of Michael Jackson.

Not even Madonna or bill Cosby or opera Winfrey came as close to the popularity of Jackson in the late 80's to 90's.

We are talking about someone who conquered basketball with 3chips, got demotivated, retired, came back like 2years later with only one teammate left from where he last played, dominated again and won 3chips.

Mind you, the game had changed when Jordan came back. No one ever believed that the bulls would win a chip before Orlando magic or Miami heat.

These two teams played very very fluent basketball.

Ohhh God, u needed to watch Orlando in the mid90's, or Miami in 96.

These teams had like 4players that could singlehandedly destroy any team.

The bulls had no business sweeping Orlando in 96 or even defeating miami 4-1 in 97 with Tim hardarway, Dan majerley(perhaps I got spelling wrong) and Alonzo morning.


The Miami heat at the time is the closest I saw to the recent Warriors.

They could shoot and had sooo much multiple plays to kill any team.

Yet, bulls beat Miami 4-1, its like saying Lebron should have beaten the warriors without Durant, with such a margin.
miami was that efficient.

The kinds of teams the bulls&Jordan made look so ordinary, my God we are yet to see such again.

pls forgive me, I don't have strength for aggressive arguments.
I just enjoy coming here to learn from u all. but my conscience wdnt permit/forgive me if i stay silent.

u guys all rock.

but get one thing clear,
Jordan isn't just the goat. He is a god.

I would have agreed with you if Bill Russell isn't a top 5 all time player and Dennis Rodman isn't a hall of famer

Jerry West and George Gervin were excellent scores before Jordan, so I don't know what you're saying. They had a 5 scoring titles between them.

Magic Johnson averaged less than 20 in his career. So your point about a second superstar never averaging less than 20 on a championship team apart from Pippen is invalid

benji93:
Yes, he should normally be hitting that.But in the heat of the moment, when you are down by 1, the pressure is just up there Curry misses wide open threes too. If you do not want such a thing to happen, how about you try not to get it get to that point? With 2 super stars, i suppose that shouldn't be too much to ask. To minimize the damage, the narrative will then be, they actually had a super star in Jimmy butler. . I mean this series on paper was was looking like a gentleman sweep at worst.

All this one na okoto you dey talk. A team that gentleman swept Giannis and dispatched the Celtics quite easily is nor a joke. If dem like make dem no get superstar, if dem like make dem get 5 g-league players, the bottom line is that they're there because they are the best team in the east.

benji93:
I mean a superstar-less team.

What's the definition of superstar? Is the superstar tag given based on reputation or performance? You can call Giannis a superstar, who couldn't take his team to the finals on two occasions even though they were favourites. But you can't call Jimmy Butler a superstar, someone who took his team to the finals and is busy dropping 40 point triple doubles. Even Steph or Kawhi have never dropped a 40 point triple double in the finals. And don't even get me started about how Steph comes up smaller in the playoffs than the regular season, just like una MVP Giannis. Those are who you call superstars abi?

benji93:
Na this person people dey call GOAT? . You no fit beat a super-star-less team. Ofcourse we can now Jimmy a superstar. How do you give up 2 games to this Heat team? I don't care if Danny Green misses an open 3. Perhaps it's the Lebron factor that makes these players shrivel in this moment. Perhaps Lebron can understand that this thing is becoming normal and make a different decision. I mean Danny Green has been off and on in this playoffs like NEPA. . I do not know what it is, but that thing keeps repeating itself. How did this happen? And do not tell me AD was injured. This is unacceptable.
@steady986, come an shalaye for your GOAT.

This post has the handwriting of someone from this thread because I know you can't write something like this.

Danny boy...come on man

AD will be fine on Sunday. Let's not give the haters hope.

WeissVonner:
I hope Kuzma and Danny Green have a great game 6 to raise their trade value. Pelinka needs to trade those two skunks as soon as the trade window opens.

This hasn't been the Danny Green I know. He has to go. On to game 6

WeissVonner:
Dude, the LeBron propaganda is going to be out of this world man. The amount of all time greats who have come out and called LeBron the GOAT over the past couple of days is just crazy. Love how the narrative is changing.

They ain't ready for it.

We will win this championship, and we will troll with it. We will bring out receipts of you talking sh*t about LeBron and the Lakers. We will remind you haters every single day that LeBron won a championship with the Lakers. We will flood this thread with photos of LeBron smiling with the championship trophy and his FMVP trophy. We will remind you for months to come that LeBron has now won a championship and FMVP with 3 different teams. We will make sure you get so annoyed that you begin to think of deactivating your account.

Brace yourself.

WeissVonner:
Executives also hate Pelinka because he's a former agent. They're the ones voting for these awards.

And so they voted Frank just to spite him. That's just petty

[quote author=WeissVonner post=94747472][/quote]When the Clippers traded all their assets for PG it was widely considered one of the worst deals ever. Even more so because PG was largely trash and they didn't make the playoffs. Sam Presti even deserves to be exec of the year because of that trade and because his team was still able to make the playoffs despite losing his two stars.

But what I don't get is Pelinka coming seventh. This is the same Lakers team that nobody gave a chance even after acquiring AD. That he was able to build a championship roster in a couple of days is just overlooked. How the hell do these people think? Man, the hate for anything concerning the Lakers is real. I wouldn't be surprised if Jimmy Butler is voted MVP when the Lakers win the chip.

This just buttresses my point about LeBron being the one who takes over in the 4th. It's happened throughout the season. Perhaps it's something they agreed on.

WeissVonner:
Isn't it strange how A40 didn't miraculously wake up today?

He got "banned"

WeissVonner:
Not really sarcasm. He's right, this is a poor finals showing by LeBrons standards.

Shows you just high that standard is.

I agree

I love the sarcasm though

All the Lakers starters apart from Dwight(0/1) shot 50% tonight. That's encouraging. Green 4/8, KCP 6/12, AD and Bron 8/16

Afromentalist:
I had predicted in 6, but I think We have a good shot next game especially with an additional day of rest.

Also let’s give credit to Coach Vogel. Benching Howard in the second half made a significant impact

Yea. This series wasn't made for him, especially now that Olynik is getting game time

Jimmy Butler is human after all

The Heat are actually much better than I thought they were. I now see why they were able to overcome the Bucks and Celtics almost seamlessly. Kudos to them, but the fact that they're not finding it easy with the Lakers is because the Lakers are made of something different.

Now let's wrap this up in 5.

How did Jimmy Butler become an excellent shooter all of a sudden? Like out of nowhere; boom-boom-boom 5 for 5 first quarter.

I won't be surprised if we continue to see more of Olynik even when Bam returns. I've always said it here that a big who is able to shoot jumpers is more dangerous than a big who can't. It's no surprise that the easiest game the Lakers have had in this series is game 1 when Bam started at the 5. I know Bam brings a lot to this Miami team, but coach Spo should certainly know that Olynik, and to a lesser degree, Leonard, has brought a different dimension to their attack.

Going forward, we should see AD at the 5 more, and Morris playing more minutes. Get more shooters on the perimeter. Danny Green is not helping matters. I wouldn't mind giving JR more minutes. And our 3-point shooters need to learn to pump fake; because of the zone defense Miami plays, they usually get to the shooters late and flying in.

I'm going to take game 3 in isolation though because of the fact that AD got into foul trouble. What Miami needed to win the game is just impossible to replicate i.e AD scoring 15 points and Butler going for a 40-point triple double. I expect this series to end in 5.