₦airaland Forum

@Chxta,

Yeah. What about Oxfam?

@Nutter,

I await your response to prove my wrong use of the words as related to economics. I am not an economics major, but at least I was the best at it in my secondary school days. And by the way, your humble self is an Ijebu (economics is a way of life)

Talking about trade now. Have you heard about AGOA? Maybe your knowledge of this would make you see the U.S. in a better light. You can check out the site at http://agoa.info/

@Nutter,

Of course. I will do better next time to understand that I need not use technical terms with you and some others when making a contribution on nairaland. I just need to assume that I am talking to my 5 year old niece and make my statements as simple as possible becaue I wouldn't expect some reasoning on your part. But then, even after making an explanation of the same statement, you still blurted out such words.

In any case, now that you've rightly acknowledge that you know nothing about the trade relations of African countries and the U.S., why are you then condemning the U.S. as regards unfair trade?

@Nutter,

I believe my explaining what I meant earlier goes to show that I am in agreement that my statement could have being better worded. I would expect you to take that in a gentlemanly way and allow the conversation to progress while noting the point I brought forward. But trying to tell me I meant what I did not mean is just way out of line.

On the other hand, going by the economic terms I used, the 'and' in my statement is justifiable. Scarcity is directly proportional to trading value. In other words, the cost of garri in naija is the effect of the scarcity of garri. Scarcity in economics does not mean unavailability. it means there is more demand than the supply, and such a situation creates an increase in the price of the particular commodity. It is a cause and effect scenario.

Hope you will be at ease now.

@Afam,

Your response to the issue of gari and the U.S. just shows you either don't understand what you read or you are outright dishonest and bent on painting those who have varying opinions to yours bad.

Maybe you should tell us what you understand by my statement, then I can begin to explain it to you so you can understand. Or am I the one not communicating clearly enough?

@firdausus4us,

Question to Jews and Christians:   How is the Bible supposed to prevent some loser from stalking the most beautiful single woman in town, rape her, and then sue her in court to become his wife so he can continue raping her for the rest of her life?!

The answer to that is very simple.  Romans 13:1-6 tells us how societal lawlwssnes should and is meant to be handled: 
Romans 13:1-6 1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.

The rule of law that governs that society is meant to handle such cases.   The Bible also provides for us the 3 branches of Government (as practiced in most democracies) and how each is meant to work.  When these branches do their jobs as required, then every evil doer like a rapist will face the judgement for such actions.

There is more to those verses that you read and I just don't have the time to go into it with you now. But first, maybe you should read all the chapter and find out what the Bible compares a rape to and tell me if you feel the Bible encourages rape.

@dearzi,

Why do you feel the need to make this a Pastor to Pastor issue and not deal with the issue raised? Was any of my submissions wrong? A man who claims to see so much into the Spirit but cannot see past T.B. Joshua to discern him as a fake requires a lot of scrutiny as far as I am concerned. If the spirit he works by can stand side by side with the spirit behind T.B. Joshua to minister healing, then there must be something wrong somewhere. Anyway, I hope you will be there whenever T.B. Joshua comes to minister as a guest at Christ Embassy, and I hope you will gladly come forward to have him lay his hands on you for impartation or whatever.

If you want to attack Chris Okotie, kindly do so on another thread. This is all about Oyhaks and I have every right to question and inquire about what I do not know. Instead of providing answers, all you do is threaten and huff and puff. And why are you so irked when this man is brought under scrutiny? 'Cos he is your pastor does not elevate him to the realm of unaccountability. He is not the Holy Ghost for me to be careful what I say about him. He is a man, like every other minister out there, and to be a man is to be subject and capable of missing the mark.

I am sure you will be so happy if I were to sing his praise here. So does a man's praise mean that much to you guys?

About the one who left Household. It happens all the time. I can tell you that one of the guys that was a keyboardist with household was once a member of Christ Embassy. There will always be normad christians who will always find a reason to move around. Every church under the heaven must have lost members and gained members one way or another over time. It is nothing new.

And thanks for the compliment that I am Smart

What guides the churches you mention? Is it the Bible or just another Book?

@Nutter,

Please try to read a person's posts in context before you just arrive at conclusions that best suits your predispositions. Here is my stament in full with regards to scarcity of garri in naija:

But you also fail to state here that every goods and foodstuff coming into the U.S. from African countries are exempted from tarrifs at the U.S. Ports. This was done to stimulate more trade and to encourage African Enterpreneurs. But the down side of this which the Nigerian government has failed to tackle, is the fact that many would rather send their garri to the U.S. and get paid (though some will like us to believe that the U.S. gets them for free), than to make the produce available in Naija for less. This means garri is now scarcer in naija and more expensive than it should be. Cassava growers will like to export them to China and the rest of Asia than to sell them in the local markets for less. This action has led to more food insecurity in that country.

I would expect you to tackle the issue I raised and to prove my conslusions wrong by a superior argument, but instead you just want to lay hold of a word that clearly means another thing in the context I have used it.

Why don't you say anything about the tarrif-free trade that the U.S. grants African Enterpreneurs? A simple law of economics tells you that excess supply of a good will translate to lower prices and scarcity of that same good will mean higher prices. So if the cost of garri is going up in naija doesn't that relate to scarcity and not excess? Please tell us.

Afam said he has some business interest in the U.S. Perhaps he also trades in foodstufss. Maybe you can get some education from him in this regard.

@Afam,

At least now you are talking of Switzerland. I thought all the evil you see is only limited to the United States. Let the blame go round when it is justified and not just heap everything on the U.S.

@Otokx,

How much is a bag of garri now in Naija? I was in Naija in June and I can tell you first hand if you have no clue. And can you please tell us the average salary of low-incomers such as Drivers etc, Please compare that to the cost of garri and other food items and tell me if it is still not scarce. Scarcity in the sense I used it does not mean unavailable, it only means unaffordable.

where do the other Governors lie?

@Nutter,

If indeed you guys are out to profer a solution to the world's problem, you will have to do so comprehensively and not attack a selected few. It's just like saying terrorism will end once Osama is reighned in. We know that isn't true. That Zawahiri accuses Osama of being a terrorist shouldn't make Zawahiri a hero unless he renounces and ceases his act of terrorism.

This logic is what we should bring to play here as well. Failure to do that only strengthens my earlier position that you guys are just on a US bashing mission. The problem here is imperialism and it must be addressed broadly and without a cheap recourse to character assasination and US bashing. When we treat it that way, then we can begin to agree on a common goal and means of attaining that goal.

@davidylan,

Thanks so much for coming out with the truth.  This is exactly what I have been trying to point out to these folks.  Those they consider heroes are as guilty of the same crime they are accusing the U.S. of.  So why would they neglect the actions of these guys and start crying foul about the U.S.  Smirks of hypocrisy doesn't it?

@Chxta,

That I condemn Chavez for that unruly behavior in the UN means that I am in blanket support of the US? If that is the way you guys think on this thread, then it explains just how difficult it is to make you see the half-truths in your positions.

@nutter,

When I said the US was imperialist, don't you find that an answer to your question?  Or is imperialism a virtue to you?

@Afam,

Where did you find me support the US or Bush blanketly? Haven't I pointed out the fact that the US is imperialist? Or must I condemn the US totally because you do?

There is never a situation in life where a man or nation gets better until they take therir future in their hands and chart a course for themselves. Blaming the US is an escapist strategy and it will never bring about the desired change.

Here is what Toshman who started this thread had to say:
the question now is, is America spreading democracy (as they say) or is it 21st century imperial expansion?

give your thoughts

And here is what I had to say:

The U.S has done more to help humanity than any other nation in the world today.  They have shown they value the life and interest of their citizens only second to the nation of Isreal.  Agreed they may be imperial, but tell me what other nation that isn't.  The only reason why these folks are shouting imperialism is because the U.S. is more successful than them at the game and not because they care a hoot about the other nations.  The way the so-called champions against the US imperialism are treating their own citizens tells us this much.   I hope you do not think that Iran, Russia, Syria, Venezuela and the likes are free of imperialism!!!  If they are not, then what gives them the right to attack the morality of the U.S.?

But what exactly are you trying to say.  that other nations are free of imperialism?

@ Nutter,

I think you need to show that other nations are not guilty like the U.S. before you can regard my statement of "U.S bashing" as being out of order.

@Afam,

You have consistently proved you have nothing to say other than rubbish.  Who is being hypocritical when the topic is all about how the developing nations can become better and all that is said is that the U.S. is responsible.   Do you know the meaning of the word 'hypocricy' at all?  I have mentioned that you need to prove that it is only the U.S. that is guilty of all these 'crimes' you claim, and that others crying foul are free of such malaise.  Until you do that, then the nations that are championing the fight against the U.S. are the ones that are hypocritical.  The term hypocrite can also be extended to you for claiming to stand on the side of justice, which you do only for some and not for all.

@Mariory,

The solution isin't faire trade. Fair trade deals are part of the solution. The real issue we must address in Nigeria is that of corruption and tribalism.

I do agree with you here.  While they will like to blame the U.S for everything, they will not look inwards and see what they are doing to themselves.  But since there is a common stance to blame the U.S., they all go on that easy route and continue further in their sorry state.

EFCC recently said over $20-trillion have been stolen from Nigeria between 1960 and 2005.  Hear him: "About $20-trillion had been stolen from Nigeria’s coffers by leaders who had access to the nation’s money between 1960 and 2005.  This was disclosed by Dapo Olorunyomi, chief of staff to the chairman of the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC) at a function in Lagos.
Olorunyomi, who was speaking at the yearly Dinner/Re-union of the Lagos State chapter of the University of Ilorin Alumni Association, said the figure was sourced from the records of the United Nations Development Programme (UNDP).
Olorunyomi said the amount was six times the amount needed to rebuild Europe after world war two.
The EFCC boss said it was saddening to know that the bulk of the $20-trillion stolen came after year 2000.
"It is rather appalling that as at year 2000, record showed that $100-billion had been stolen, with an external debt of $33-billion", Olorunyomi said.
Olorunyomi said the central problem facing the nation was that of governance, "Leaders are just looting, not caring for the people that they are expected to provide basic amenities for".
He challenged Nigerians to wake up to their responsibilities, "as the looting spree of our leaders has now constituted itself into a national problem, which is very bad for our economy. I want the public to help in the fight against economic and financial crimes, please, do not leave it for the EFCC only".
He encouraged the association members to go into their offices and homes to impact the drive to do away with economic crimes in the society.
This is coming at a time when there are allegations against the president and his vice, bothering on economic crimes.
Source: BusinessDAY"  
Now can you imagine what could have been done with that money to develop our nation?  But since they are now trying to blind us from what the real problems are, they choose to go the route of "it's the U.S."  

@otokx,
You need to understand that the U.S. must first show responsibilities towards its citizens before it does to the rest of the world.  That the Government subsidises agriculture only shows that it is a responsible government.  Until a nation has food security, it will be on the very brink of anihilation in the event of a global trade war.  The solution to this is for the other governments to live up to their responsibilities to their citizens and subsidise as well if necessary.  But you also fail to state here that every goods and foodstuff coming into the U.S. from African countries are exempted from tarrifs at the U.S. Ports.  This was done to stimulate more trade and to encourage African Enterpreneurs.  But the down side of this which the Nigerian government has failed to tackle, is the fact that many would rather send their garri to the U.S. and get paid (though some will like us to believe that the U.S. gets them for free), than to make the produce available in Naija for less.  This means garri is now scarcer in naija and more expensive than it should be.  Cassava growers will like to export them to China and the rest of Asia than to sel;l them in the local markets for less.  This action has led to more food insecurity in that country.  Now do you blame the U.S. for that as well?

Nutter,

While I do not agree with the U.S. withdrawing inside her borders, I am of the opinion that there is absolute validity to the statement made by that individual. Can you analyse what the effects of the US withdrawing its army from all over the world would be? Think of the Koreans and the entire Asian continent before you make your conclusions. Economically, every one will suffer and since there is no political will to fight and stand up to Islamo-fascists by the rest of the world, you can be certain of a Jihad that will engulf and overtake the rest of the free world. Consider the enormous charities by the U.S citizens (not Government) around the world, and tell me if there wont be massive catrastrophe's in the event of such disasters as the Tsunami. Take away the Red Cross and the contributions by the U.S., and takle away the UN with all the funds put into it by the US, and tell me what you come up with.

You say that the U.S is getting paid, and you neglect to say that the US is also paying for the goods it buys. Do the simple mathematics, if I pay more than I am paid, then the ones who I'm paying are getting richer than I am. This is the simple scenario painted by the article and it suggests that a downturn in the US economy will surely affect the rest of the world.

You are way out of line saying I am no better than the terrorists. I am far better than they are. I am not a coward who kills innocents just because of an escapee tendency to go drink wine in the hereafter in the bossom of some virgins. It is those who lack the hope and the strength to face another day in this life that kill themselves in the hope that things will be better for them in the hereafter.

I have told you the U.S. has been better at imperialism than the rest of those who are crying foul. Does imperialism sound like a virtue to you? Since my submission remains that other nations are guilty of whatever you may accuse the US of, then it is up to you to prove otherwise and not claim I should start pointing accusing fingers at the U.S. You tell us what faults different than others that the U.S. is guilty of.

@Nutter,

That is exactly the point. If I am putting up a defense for the US, I am not the one that should be levelung accusations at them.

The report that the US is the one holding up the economies of most developing countries is not mine, but produced by a UN representative. The links is still there for you to go through. You may do well to disprove this article by your scholarship refutal of the facts provided therein.

@Nutter,

I am not the one feeling disfranchised by the U.S. and I'm not obligated to tell you what I feel is wrong with the U.S.  I have stated simply that the U.S. has no fault that is not apparent with any other nation, and Bush has no fault that is not exhibited by those who are championing a crucifixion of the man.

And if you read what I have written earlier, I think the biggest issues all have with the U.S. is their imperialism and that is a vice that is embedded in every nation.

And by the way, I am not in agreement with your conclusion that the U.S. broke international law with regards to Abu Graib and whatever. If we are to get in a court of law, the Geneva Convention which is binding all the nations is very explicit that the laws is binding on uniformed soldiers fighting under the banner of a country. These terrorists do not qualify as such. Now, it is another thing to talk about the wisdom of maintaining those prisons, and the fact that there are innocent people detained there as well. But in a technical sense, terrorists are not uniformed soldiers fighting under the countol of any government, and as such cannot be subject to the Geneva Convention.

@nutter,

Any nation with more than one person living in it will have some faults.

I do agree with some of your conclusions but not all. I'll deal with them as we go.

@Nutter,

I do have an open mind to these issues. I live in the U.S., and I am not at all unaware of the ills in that society and of it's leaders. Believe me, I just had a very unpleasant experience today.

One of the things I have tried to point out is the fact that Chavez is a very wrong person to champion the cause for reform. He needs to lead by example, and he has shown that he is only after some cheap publicity. Roundly condemning Bush's person is also wrong. making him out to be a liar is un-called for. The fact that a lot of people now believes that he is after Chavez's life without any proof also tells me that the guy is not getting a fair hearing. I believe in justice, but I believe it must be for all, and not for some.

I guess one of the problems Chavez and his folks have is the Veto Power by the U.S. in the UN. But is it just the US that holds such a priviledge? The use of the veto power was done legally and within the confines of the UN charter. On the other hand, one who wanted to come to power through an illegal means of coup plotting is now trying to make himself our hero. What a joke.

If you want to make changes, then you have got to change the laws. As hated as Bush is, no one will be able to impeach him because he operates within the law. At least, he has enough sense to do that. The clarifications he requested recently about the Geneva Convention was so he does not break the law.

While the Iraq war may be his greatest undoing, no record shows he took that action based on a deliberate lie to his nation, neither did he forge or see to the embelishment of evidence. He went to a costly war war on a wrong premise. At least one thing you can never accuse Bush of is that he is complacent. He is a man who stands up to what he believes is right, and we can only pray he believes the right things based on accurate information.

Okay here is what you said just before I opted in:

Bush has no business in governance and he is responsible for the increase in hatred against the West especially the US based on his hypocrisies and double standards.
We need more courageous leaders like Chavez and the president of Iran even though I disagree with him on the destruction of Israel.
Funny enough, a free and fair democracy brought the Hamas government into power and yet the West does not like that type of democracy, a democracy that does not take instructions from the white house or 10 downing street.

this is in addition to other statements against the US before yours. I am not against people pointing out america's fault, but try and do so from an unbiased perspective, and with a due sense of responsibility.

The anger against the West has always being there and will never be eradicated. Bush has only stirred the hornet's nest even more and let us see these people for who they truly are - cold-blooded murderer. I wonder what Bush did that brought about September 11. I wonder what he did that brought about the Danish Cartoons protest. I wonder what he also did that has now resulted in these murderous bunch going after the Pope's life, and promising to 'continue' the fight against christianity and the west.

Bush's stance is very clear. Peaceful negotiations makes this guys feel we are weak. Perhaps a armed conflict will show them our resolve. Whether he is right or wrong is yet to be seen, but one thing clear is this: there has not been a single terrorists attack on the homeland for the past few years, not because these murderous bunch are lack the will to carry it out, but because a tight noose has been placed on their neck by the actions of President Bush.

And one other thing that irks me from your posts is the fact that you have chosen to call and label Bush a liar, despite the fact that you or anyone else for that matter has no proof of this. That sole action cuts across to me as character assasination, and I really feel pissed off by those who attack other's integrity while showing none at all.

But this post is already about Imperialism until you guys turned it into another oppoetunity to bash the U.S. Give us ideas on ways to move other third world countries forward and not try to give the impression that the US is the cause of every evil in the world today.

@Afam,

Can you please tell us if it is only the US that is guilty of imperialsm. If that is not the case, why is it just the US that keeps geting all these bashings? What about Russia, Iran, Venezuela, Britain, France and the likes. If you are really interested in world peace, then you have to deal with the problem in totality and not vent your frustrations on the U.S. alone.

@Afam,

I wish you'd discuss the U.S. policies that is causing the world-wide problems you are quick to blame the U.S. for.  You talk of double standards, and yet are not quick to judge other nations by the same standards you choose to judge the U.S.  Hypocite!  Can you show me where you've praised the U.S. at some point on this thread or any other?  You are just full of rubbish, aint you?

You should be more ashamed of yourself at the way you arrive at conclusions based on what you deem 'obvious.'  Is that how you were taught in school?  Where are the facts that connect Bush to an assassination attempt at Chavez?  You just believe anything that is anti-Bush and anti-U.S. and you want us to take you seriously even when you cannot prove anything.

The post you refered to has no facts but is another person's opinion.  But again, since it is in line with your biased pre-disposition, you accept it as a Gospel truth.

I have never painted Bush as a saint, but I know that Chavez is not on a moral higher ground to now be attacking the man's personality.  Bush, like everyone else is human and he will make mistakes.  The U.S., like every other country is not perfect (especially when they allow people like you to have business interests in it  ).  Common sense teaches that the best way to change a person is to dwell on their good points while changing our own habits and behavior for the better.  I believe same can be said of a nation.  

The U.S has done more to help humanity than any other nation in the world today.  They have shown they value the life and interest of their citizens only second to the nation of Isreal.  Agreed they may be imperial, but tell me what other nation that isn't.  The only reason why these folks are shouting imperialism is because the U.S. is more successful than them at the game and not because they care a hoot about the other nations.  The way the so-called champions against the US imperialism are treating their own citizens tells us this much.   I hope you do not think that Iran, Russia, Syria, Venezuela and the likes are free of imperialism!!!  If they are not, then what gives them the right to attack the morality of the U.S.?

@Afam,

You have just confirmed what I have thought of you all along. You are a man who does not make a stand on principles!!! You claim you do not attack personalities, but you have done so twice now without any form of self restraint. You claim you stand for justice, but it is obvious you do so only for some and not for all. You project a sanctimonious fascade of one who believes the best of every man, but not when the man is a U.S citizen or Mr Bush himself. What a pity.

I suppose your blind hatred does not reveal to you that this forum was turned into a personality bashing before I came on board. Perhaps you need to go back and read all the responses to the first post and see how many times Bush was bashed just to make a non-sustainable point. I have not seen anyone articulate a policy that will help these developing countries, but I have seen too many personality attack on Mr Bush. I guess going the route of personality bashing is considered a legitimate course of action for people like you who think that Chavez is a hero.

You will do well to treat the issues raised and address a legitimate and scholarship UN report I pasted earlier that deals with the effort of the US at sustaining the world economy. But since someone in your camp already dismissed it without even reading it, I suppose there is no need for someone with contrary views to be a part of this forum. That is why I was quick to say that this forum was turned into an opportunity for U.S. bashing and I have been proved right time and time again.

Can you tell me what birth-right you have and are enjoying now that I am deprived off? You are such a low-lifer Afam. I know people like you quite well. You blame the U.S. for all things, yet you'd be the first in line at the US embassy at 4:00am in the morning. Infact, people like you will sleep over by the embassy gate just to be the first in line to be denied a VISA into 'God's Own Country.' You are trailing behind others, and instead of asking questions and doing legitimate things to be a leader, you will rather see to the downfall of those who lead. What a saddist!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's amazing to what extent people will go to criticize the U.S. A recent AIDS conference also provided an opportunity for many to criticize the U.S. for stating that a percentage of the money donated by the U.S. must go into teaching abstainence as a form of eradicating the AIDS pandemic. Instead of praising the U.S. for providing more money than all other countries, they were doing nothing but saying the U.S. should change their policy. What a bunch of ingrates. If you'd rather have more money going into other forms of combating AIDS, why not ask the other 'saintly' countries to increase their aid? But of course, U.S. hatred has blinded otherwise intelligent people from reason.

All that you and others have said here have been based on conjecture and we will require hard facts to begin to deal with your petty grievances. and one more thing Afam, please grow up!!!

@Afam,

Toshman,
I agree with you that some people have conveniently shifted the focus to Chavez instead of the issues he raised.
TayoD,
It is funny how you ask for proof whenever the US is accused of anything even if obvious and at the same time you will make sometimes completely baseless statements and pass them off as facts.
The day you replied that the republicans that opposed Bush in the Article 3 of the Geneva Convention did so because they wanted to covert the bystanders because it was election time was the day I stopped taking your posts serious.
You are an unrepented and blind supporter of the US regardless of the issues on ground.
Talk about Iraq today and you will bring a whole lot of useless justifications, you may do well by contributing to jokes and rumours setcions and allow people to discuss real issues without the unnecessary distractions.
A thread came up to discuss issues raised and you turned it to US bashing, this is disgusting!!!

Why shouldn't we take a closer look at Chavez? Even in a court of law, the background and credibility of a witness is taken into consideration. A witness' testiony, though true, will never be taken seriously if he has no credibility. I would wish a more righteous man than Bush were making this accusation, then I'll begin to take him seriously. As far as I am concerned, Chavez is just an eccentric looking for a cheap way to win popularity. And since the most part of the world is anti-Bush, we will expect him and others like him to take that route.

Can you please tell us why it is so obvious that Bush is out to kill Chavez? Or do you expect me to just believe that eccentric just because he said so? I'm not surprised anyway, a coup plotter will always be on the edge thinking others are out to topple him. And his constant accusation of Bush will distract others from his own incompetence.

Are you accusing me of being a blind supporter of the US or of Mr Bush? I can't fathom how I am a a blind supporter of the US when I am in support of the Presidency against a faction of the Legislature. YFor your information, the Presidency and the Legislature are both different arms of the same government of the United States of America. You obviously don't know what you are talking about at all. Perhaps you are the one that should contribute more to the rumours and jokes section since you expect us to take accept as fact anything that you say, and you deem 'obvious'. I hope I am right to consider your sly remark an attempt at a complement, since you have claimed before that yo are not one to attck personalities first.

I have not justified anything about the Iraq war. You can bring your proof of this accusation. Oh I forget, it is 'obvious' that I justify that war, and by your standard, any 'obvious' scenario amounts to a fact. I have only tried to let you see that you have no basis to call Mr Bush a liar. His decision was based on available facts provided by the CIA. These facts are now discredited, but there is absolutely no proof nor an accusation by the Democrats that Bush influnced that report. Everyone who voted for the war did so based on the same information that Bush had, but of course, the final responsibilty and the blame must fall on Bush.

And for your information, Bush got what he rightly wanted in the compromised bill that will likely be brought to the Senate floor sometime this week. All he asked for was some well-defined coerced interrogation of terrorism suspects by the CIA. The coerced interrogation was not even supposed to be the rule, it must be authorised by the President when it is required and when lives are imminently at stake. I expect you to have applauded the US for even considering trying these criminals under the Geneva Convention. Unknown to you, the Geneva convention was agreed upon for uniformed combatants fighting for a nation, not some Islamo-fascists who kill in the name of a religion.

And when you are talking about issues, perhaps you should discuss why other nations in unison, are not doing half as much to help the developing world as the U.S. is doing. The U.S. is not perfect, but others should at least do smething comparable to her to be worthy of criticizing her.

@toshman,

I guess you believe everything that people who oppose Bush say. Where is the proof that the U.S. is planning
a coup to topple Chavez? The guy is just trying to make himself more important than he really is.

As to the U.S. oil reserve, a new an inconclusive findings has just boosted U.S. oil reserve by another 25%. So you can add some more years to that.

You sure show you have no idea what the effect of a US withdrawal will cost the rest of the world. The US is the sole sustainer of many economies around the world today. The U.S trade deficit is basically because we buy more than we sell. If both parties decide to stop the trade, believe me, there will be a lot of countries up in flames due to economic hardship. Here's a BBC article for your perusal. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/5303006.stm

Here is what someone had to say on another thread:

I am so sick and tired of the rest of the world. You insult us everyday. I would gladly remove all of our soilders, businesses, charities, and any other organizations that you spit on dailey. You go your way with your Chaves', Bin Landens, Kim Jongs, and whoever else you seem to want to exhalt as wise and loving people. I wish we would build a wall all the way around our country and try to forget the rest of you are out there. I'm sure you wont post this but I promise millions of Americans agree

Zane, USA