₦airaland Forum

@otolorin,

I'm coooooooool

@olabowale,

What about people who are naturally without facial hair? And what about women who are naturally wth a lot of hair?

The truth is how you keep your body (as long as it is decent) makes no difference to God at all. According to the Bible: , flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. So no matter what you do with that body it is turning to dust.

You are such a deceived fellow saying the Holy Spirit promised to the believers is Mohammed. didn;t you read in your Bible that Jesus told the Disciples that the Holy spirit will come upon them in Jerusalem? The last time I checked, Mohammed is a bedoiun Prophet of the tribe of Quaresh (I hope I got that spelling right) who has never been to Jerusalem. the attributes listed of the Holy Spirit is not one that can be fulfilled by anyone. If you insist on this folly, then I shall engage you in this debate.

The wonders of Heaven you described are far from what Jesus said. While Mohammed as described to you the heavens of his dreams, where sex is the order of the day, jesus said such a thought is a blasphemy: Matthew 22: 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

@TV01,

Ther are so many issues that has been raised in this discussion and the fact that I tackle one at a time does not mean I'm running away from others.  I did not accuse you of turning a tail when you refused to acknowledge the fact that Jesus indeed had political clout.  Same can be said of John the Baptist, Elijah, Elisha and even Paul.

For your information, I did not 'define' the world as you accuse.  Rather it is the scriptures that defines it for you in 1 John 2:16.  Your error comes when you ignore this definition and maintain the Bible is talking about politics, commerce and culture (can you show that from scripture?).  In your mind, we should stay away from anything political, commercial and cultural.  That is interesting noting that you have to work to survive (commerce), your identity as a Nigerian was not changed when you got born again (cultural) and the same Bible refers to the government as God's servant (political).  

I am baffled when you say we can't use tools to propagate the Gospel.  You tell us that the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but spiritual.  Please enlightene us how you intend to reach the unbelievers in the spirit alone without going through the medium of the flesh.  Please tell us you only pray and not even talk to them at all since that is entering the flesh.  I wonder what you are doing online sef when you are meant to be in the spirit.  Why use the carnal tool of the www in the first place.  You remind me of the Deeper Life Ministry who were so moved with zeal without knowledge, that they claim Television is sin.  some even claim now that the internet is sin.  But of course, same people are now on T.V and the www using that 'tool' to advance the Gospel.  Politics, like the www, T.V., cars, airplane, church buildings etc are tolls that we use to propagate the Gospel.

1 Corinthians 7:31 And they that use this world, as not abusing it: for the fashion of this world passeth away  From my understanding of this scripture, we are told we can use this world as long as we do not compromise our christian witness.  Politicians like every other professional are faced with the opportunity to compromise their christian beliefs in their daily activities.   Unless of course, you have a job that does not bring you in contact with unbelievers and never gives you the opportunity to compromise.  If such a job exists, please let us know about it.  

I have repeatedly ask for examples of where Christian politcs is making kingdom gains. As yet no response from proponents of the Christian lobby

You are either not reading what we've said or you want more examples which I will give to you.  The last Presidential election in the United States was influenced greatly by Christians.  If we had not come out to vote, then John Kerry would have won.  One of the reasons we voted for Bush was because of the possibility that the next president would likely have the opportunity to select Justices to serve in the Supreme Court.  Bush as promised, selected 2 conservative Justices who are very likely to overturn the Roe v Wade ruling which legalised abortion in the U.S.  Kerry would have selected judges that will do the opposite.   Imagine the millions of lives that this decision will affect.  And there still exists the possibility that Bush will still have the opportunity to select at least, one more judge to serve on the Supreme Court.   Bush, as a matter of policy, limits federal funding to scientific researches that kill the unborn while Kerry wanted to increase the Government funding to such research.  These and many more are issues we are dealing with and affecting as Christians who understand that what goes on in the Political realm affect our day to day lives and the propagation of the Gospel.

And if you read 1 Timothy 2:1-4, Paul linked our abilitiy as christians to lead a quiet and peaceable lives in all godliness and honesty to what happens in our government.  Please note how he said such efect has a direct impact on the salvation of the unbeliever.  1 I exhort 1 therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; 2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; 2 that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

The Lord desires Godly seed. Yes He does, Godly seed can only come from Godly parents, The scripture here speaks to believers in Holy Wedlock. One of the designs of Godly union is Godly seed. Your point here is fundamentally flawed and badly made.

Again, you are giving us your ideas contrary to the scriptures.  Here is that scripture again in another translation, since the KJV is a little mixed up there:  Has not the Lord made them one? In flesh and spirit they are his. And why one? Because he was seeking godly offspring. So guard yourself in your spirit, and do not break faith with the wife of your youth.   If you will throw your prejudice aside, please read that verse again noting that the only way a godly seed can be made is through the unity of a Man and a Woman in a holy wedlock.  The Lord asked Himself: "And why is the man and woman made one?"   And He came up with the answer: "so as to have a godly seed."  And you need to ask your self the question, does a gay marriage increases the possiblity of having a godly seed or not?  Then ask youeself, how can that also be stopped?

@otolorin,

Did I say anything about IBBor Buhari in office? or perhaps you want to explain what you mean by your question.

@olabowale,

While you dislike men who put on ear-rings, what is your feeling towards those who plait their hair?

Before you answer that question, please note that Mohmmed was described as plaiting his hair.  Read this: Muhammed was also, it seems, a striking man.  He is described as broad-chested, with a full beard and a hooked nose that gave him a stately appearance.  Numerous accounts speak of his wide black eyes and the long thick hair he kept tied behind his ears in plaits. Coutesy of: No god but God, by Reza Aslan.

By the way, I hope you will not issue a fatwa for my head for describing your prophet.  We know of the fate of those Cartoonists.

Are you guys for real? I'm surprised no one has mentioned the living legend of our time. He is my all time favorite.

His name is: Tyler Perry of the Madea fame. Do you know he is regarded as the most profitable actor in Hollywood?

@Grouppoint,

What do you mean God created sin? You can say that He created the law of sin and death, but He is not and cannot sin and did not create it. Sin is missing a mark. Show me what mark you require of God and I'll show you how He not only meets it, but exceeds the mark.

Titus 1:2 tells you what God cannot do. Titus 1:2 - In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

@TV01,

I intend to show you that your thoughts on this matter can not be sustained throughout scriptures at all. In the meantime, I want to share with you a practical way Christian's influence and participation in politics can make a difference.

Here is one of God's goals according to Malachi 2:15 And did not he make one? Yet had he the residue of the spirit. And wherefore one? That he might seek a godly seed. Therefore take heed to your spirit, and let none deal treacherously against the wife of his youth.

It is obvious from here that the Lord desire godly seed, i.e. children growing up in an environment that promotes godliness. In our society today, we have gay and lesbian couples who are bent on adopting children that they are incapable of having for obvious reasons. A State legislation that recognises the union between same sex couples encourages such couples to adopt children, and you can imagine what kind of up-bringing such a child will be subjected to. That child will consider a homosexual lifestyle to be the norm. The scripture says that what you teach a child is what he will keep to when he grows up. If you believe that scripture, then you will know that such a child is virtually confirmed as a child of hell through that adoption.

As Christians, we understand that we need to do all we can to save these people, and we use all the means available to us. Politics has been a very useful tool to combat this lifestyle in the U.S. Voting to limit marriage between a man and a woman is one means, while having a rightous person (a Christian) in a political office to push forward the legislation and ensure that our votes are not disregarded is another strategy.

Legislation against homosexual marriages does not change the nature and sexual preferences of those who practice this lifestyle, but it deprives them of a vital tool which they have used to propagate and extend this lifestyle to others. Ensuring that they cannot get married legally is another way of making sure our God's desire for godly seed is met.

You have rightly said that this is a 'war' situation, and it is obvious that one of your war strategies should include making sure your enemy is deprived of ammunition with which it can wreck havoc on you. Depriving the enemy the opportunity to adopt these kids is sure a way of limiting the advancement of his rampaging army.

You are so deceived!!! Since when did miracles become the yardstick forr determining the righteousness or otherwise of a Man of God?

Also, with respect to the Beny Hinn crusade, an investigation was carried out by the PFN, infact, i think 2 different investigations were done, and both indicted Bishop Obembe for his role in the whole financial mess. Of course, EFCC can go in and investigate this matter if pettisioned to do so, and they have every right to prosecute those found wanting.

And when should a less than righteous act of one Man of God or the entire PFN as a whole serve as a blanket for Christ Embassy to aid and abet a criminal?

What you are doing is what the Bible refers to as comparing yourself with others and proving yourself unwise thereby. Your standard should be Christ, and if it is below His standard, it is not of God.

TV01,

I like to have the Bible interprete itself.  That way, I know I am not bringing my prejudice to bear on what it says.  The Bible clearly defines what the 'world' consists of in 1 John 2:16  For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

If we go by this definition of the Bible, then maybe the scripture you quoted in Matthew 4:8 will be seen in a new light.  It is obvious that the devil wants Jesus to see what He will possess if He succumbs to the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life.  In order words, the devil wanted Jesus to have it the easy way, instead of going to the cross.  He wanted Jesus to see that the 'wordly' option aint so bad afterall, since the glories before Christ were obtained through that means.

If you are careful to read my response as well, you will find out that I also mentioned and differentiated between the world as used in 1 John 2:16, and the 'world' as used in John 3:16!  'The 'world' in 1 John 2:16 is an enemy of God, unredeemable and subject to eventual destruction.  The world in 1 John 3:16 goes beyond just humans, it includes the whole  of creation plus the kingdoms of this world.  While the kingdoms may be effectively in the devil's grip right now, that grip was shattered by Jesus' death and resurrection.  These kingdom was paid for by Christ's blood and will eventually be turned over to Him in full as we read in Revelation 11:15  , The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.  

P:S.
Since I am commanded to turn the other cheek when struck, I felt the need to do just that when you threw the first punch.  And knowing that you and I are one body, I decided to turn the other side of my body (You in this case), and returned the punch. 

@TV01,

I can't believe how you have used the scriptures 'unscripturally' to arrive at your conclusions.  I will show you what I mean:

Bad idea, we have a divine mandate to fulfil and enough to keep us occupied. Politics, commerce and culture (the world) are effectively under the sway of the evil one.

Is your definition of the 'world' here yours or the Bible's?  According to my Bible the 'world' consists of the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life.  For whatever reasons, politics, commerce and culture are conspicously missing from God's list.  And what is our Divine mandate?  And what are the tools that we have to carry out that mandate?  Please show us where God told us not to use politics, commerce and culture as tools to carry out our mandate.

"My kingdom is not of this world", would be a good start.

What 'world' is Jesus talking about?  Is it the same 'world' that He died for?  Or was He talking about the world system of consisting of the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life?  Please make this very clear.

May I point out the symbolism of those that represent the state in scripture. I'm sure your close to unlimited scriptural knowledge means you know exactly who they are. "The Leaven of Herod".

You have either tried to totally mis-represent the scriptures here or you just showed how ignorant you are.  Here is the scriptures you refered to in full: Mark 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod..  If we go by your interpretation, then Jesus must be telling us not to have anything to do with the Church as well.  On the contrary, He is advising us to desist from the 'leaven' of the church and the state, and not to stay away from the church and the state itself.

I'm also surprise that you felt Jesus never had any political clout.  Why were the Pharisees jealous of Him.  Why was the whole of Jerusalem moved on His triumphal entry?  What happened to Him with respect to the crucifixion was plainly because it must come to pass.  Someone who have thousands showing up at His meetings must surely carry His weight around politically.  That is a fact.

Hi lafile,

The scenario in 2 Kings 20 and the scripture in Numbers 23 aren't the same at all. The word REPENT in Numbers 23 means: to be sorry, console oneself, repent, regret, comfort, be comforted

On the other hand, God only informed Hezekiah what will happen to me from the sickness. It wasn't that God condemned him to die. Hezekiah did what he knew to do, Pray. God answered his prayer, healed him and ensure that he lived for another 15 years. This is my understanding of both scriptures and they do not appear to be intertwined at all.

@grace727,

EFCC is the acronym for Economic and Financial Crimes Commission.  If an economic and financial crime is commited within the State of Nigeria, then EFCC has every mandate to investigate and bring the perpetrators to book.  If an organization, be it a church, mosque or shrine is found to be a haven for financial criminals, then that organization must be brought to book.  If anything at all, these organizations are meant to be above board and abusing their priviledges must be dealt with severely by the law.

And for your information, the Church enjoins a big quota from the Government called tax break.  The Church is protected by the State and uses the roads built by the State and other ammenities provided by the State. 

While you are waiting for God to punish the churches that are out of line, God is waiting for the State to go ahead and punish them in fulfilment of the State's duty as God's servant to punish the evil doer.  Get your mind-set renewed to God's Word and you will come to the conclusion that EFCC -an authorised agent of the State is more than qualified and authorised to investigate an erring church. 
See Romans 13:1-6    1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.

The america you mentioned will not disregard their constitution like we are so quick to do. Even in a matter of national security, the constitution is still obeyed to the letter.

No one feels sorry for Fayose and his likes, but we cannot drag a whole nation down just to bring one man to justice. There are other means through which that justice can be attained.

So what happens if at all they manange to sweep PDP from power? What plans do they have for the country? Or are they just interested in sweeping them away so as to have their own turn at the nation's treasury?

@odeku,

so are you saying a rape of the constitution is okay if necessary to indict one man?

Hear what Soyinka has to say in an apparent refernce to the Fayose case: “But if you people don’t watch out, you will find that you have a set back for 50 years in terms of democratic struggles. This is one of the worst periods in our existence in the struggle for democracy.

“The courts have been disobeyed. The constitution subverted. Nobody says people shouldn’t go after criminals, thieves and corrupt people. We are all agreed on this. But if the methodology flouts the constitution of the land or the law or the methods being used, then we are in grave danger.

“What is used against the felons today will be used against the innocent tomorrow. All I want to say right now about the situation in the country is that democracy is being fouled up in a way that it is of enormous danger to future generations.” Reference: http://www.vanguardngr.com/articles/2002/cover/october06/16102006/f216102006.html

I only hope people will listen and not let a desire for good get us in deep evil.

@Odeku,

But does the Legislature hold the power to sack him? Whether he collected bribe or not is not the issue here. That is an accusation that has not been proven.

Hey guys,

I am surprised someone is asking what constitutional breaches took place. Are you not aware that the State's Chief Judge was sacked to pave way for the one that has now condemned Fayose through an unlawful panel? The constituion is clear that only the Governor has the powers to sack a Judge.

The Chief Justice of the federation also wrote a letter saying every action taken by this new Judge is unlawful and therefore void, because he has no business in the office he now usurps? I assume this new Judge is the one that swore in the new Governor. If that is the case, then we really have no Governor in that State. Isn't that a constitutional messm and an invitation to anarchy?

I am not in support of Fasoye's actions, if true, but we can't fight corruption with unconstitutionality. Nigeria will implode that way.

@gospelman,

How about words that heal the sick,cast out devils,and build people up?

How about you heal the sick, cast out devils and end up a son of hell? Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

How would you feel about all your works not passing the fire test at the judgment seat of Christ? 1 Corinthians 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

I can see you guys are runnig a popularity contest against yourselves. Keep running and wear yourselves out.

Jesus was a social, spiritual and political critic, and according to your gospel, he must have been so broke and unable to help His society. You have definitely taken your rampage for a ride on the world wide web.

A lady was in our church yesterday to share her testimony. She's 50 years old now and was born again at the age of 16. She has five children and 23 foster children that she raised up in her home along with the husband of her youth.

Her name is Mitchelle Bachman, a Minnesota State Congress Woman now running for the Nation's Congress. Against her candidature is the far-left who see her as a threat to the advancment of homo-sexuality. She's the author of the State's Marriage Ammendment bill which should be on the ballot this November. She is vehemently opposed to abortion and is known to be above board. Funny enough, her sister is a lesbian, but that doesn't keep her from standing up for what is true to her conscience.

This is a Christian in politics, using the world but not abusing it (1 Corinthians 7:31); being a salt and light to the world (Matthew 5:13-16), and being a minister of God (Romans 13:4).

Just like money, politics is a tool that can be used for right or for wrong. Politics in the hands of the wicked will bring suffering to the people, while politics in the hands of the uncompromisingly righteous, will bring blessings and rejoicing.

I am not in support of a situation where 2 arms of the government are hijacked by one of the branches for their selfish purpose.  The Judiaciary, usually regarded as the last hope of the common man was trampled and intimidated into taken unconstitutional steps and we are saying hurray.

What guards against this abuse taking place in the future for unjustified reasons.  Wisdom dictates that a better means could have been employed to arrest and prosecute Fayose, but personal ambition and possibly, ego was in the way.  Why couldn't PDP suspend the Governor, and hence deny him a ticket for re-election?  This way, it will only be a matter of weeks before he losses his immunity and can thus be arrested for prosecution.  Isn't this a better alternative to the constitutional mess brought on the State and by extension the Country?

While fighting corruption is good, we need to avoid doing it illegally and in flagrant violation of the constituion. To me, the Speaker of the House had his ambition to be Governor, and EFCC collaborated with their illegal acts to do the right thing. You don't do evil that good may aboud.

@belloti,

I wonder if those so-called little boys and girls are safe in "heaven" from peadophiles like Mohammed. If Mohammed could slepp with an 8 year old (Aisha) on earth, what keeps him from doing the same in the el-dorado of his dreams: Jannat?

@lafile,

Thanks for that scripture in 2 corinthians 8:20-21. I had thought about it during these discusssions but couldn't remember where to find it. It is so important to our discussion here.

@Goodguy,

Thanks for the second witness you provided.

To those who wanted us to check our source again, Goodguy has provided a second credible witness. I'm sure you know what the Bible says about having two or more witnesses.

Who swore the guy in as Governor? Is it the 'acting chief judge' whose appointment is a breach of the constitution? I think we have a real constitutional crisis in Ado-Ekiti right now.

I have it on good authority that Fayose may have absconded. This hasn't made it to the papers yet, and I am not sure if he actually fled the country or the State.

@akintos_o,

It is funny how you mentioned my name on this forum when I have not even conribued to it.  Is it my contribution on a similar topic in the religion section that's still hunting you?

As you have clearly shown here, you have absolutely no basis for asking EFCC to stay away from churches when there is a need to.  Someone even quoted the scriptures to you (which I refered to in the religion section), but all you can do is talk about lizards.  How shallow.

The fact is that EFCC has no right to just walk into any church and start looking into its finances.  However, if there is a justification for it, like an accusation of money laundering and corruption as we see in the case of Christ Embassy (http://www.thisdayonline.com/archive/2003/03/30/20030330rel01.html), then the EFCC or any other agency of the Goverment has every right to go in and punish those who are responsible.  No one, including Pastrs should be above the law.  Even God subjects Himself to working within the bounds of the law.  Disregard for the law is what is called lawlessness and guess who the Bible refers to as the lawless one?

@akintos-o,

Can you please provide the proof of my ignorance, either of the event I refered to in Christ Embassy or of the issue we are talking about as revealed in the scriptures.  Here is an article that deals with the stolen money donated to Christ Embassy: http://www.thisdayonline.com/archive/2003/03/30/20030330rel01.html

I assume you are a member of Christ Embassy and I won't be surprised if you are back here to try to paint black, white.  This won't be the first time we will see that happen.  Your Pastor has tried to portray T.B. Joshua as a man of God too and the only people he has convinced about it are his gullible members.  Perhaps another lie has being sold to you guys again with respest to this stolen funds.

While not trying to make this a witch-hunting process, I have tried to stay on the issue and only mentioned Christ Embasy while making a point.  However, if you are tryng to play on our intelligence and our good conscience here, I will not be afraid to take the gloves off and stand up for what the Gospel teaches: integrity and truth.  I wonder if you have ever received a biblical teaching on that.  If you have, then you will not make light of the issues we are discussing here and attempt to hide behind "God will judge".  Doesn't your Bible tell you that we are the ones that will execute the judgment that is written?

@hnd_holder,

Is that the best you can come up with? I rest my case.

I can understand the setiments attached to this issue, but I hope we can all jettison our prejudices and focus on the truth.

Apart from the fact that I find no basis for the church being above the law in the scriptures, I really do not see why a church's affairs cannot be investigated if there is a legitimate need for it.

Can you imagine the case I mentioned earlier about the guy who stole millions from his company and gave it to his church. Think of what would happen if the investigators just tell us "well, we traced the money to this church, and since it is God's house, we can not do anything about it." How would that sound to your intelligence and your conscience? Won't that tell rogues that all they need to do is set up a church, steal some money and give it to the church. Then go back and get a percentage of that sum from the Pastor. Afterall, when Ceasar traces the money to the church, they will only back-off and say it is in God's hands now!

If Ceasar does that, then he ceases to be God's servant who is meant to ensure justice and punish evil doers as the Bible said it should. Please let us look at it from that perspective and stop fuming over a legitimate request.

@lafile,

the only time efcc should be allowed to investigate churches should be when there is a specific report indicating that activities of this particular church violates the criminal code. a blanket probe on ALL churches should not be allowed for any reason.

You have said it rightly as I also indicated in my earlier post. Failing to investigate a church suspected of criminal activities solely because it is a church violates biblical injuctions. This will be like saying the so-called Rev King should be left alone from prosecution just because he is a pastor.

@gospelman,

I do not understand what you mean by the Church being superior to the State. Such a notion is not sustained at all in the scriptures. If anything, the Bible suggests the Church must be subject to the authority of the State. So tell me, who is in a secular sense greater, the one in authority or the one under it?

No one says churches should be probed because they are getting so much money. Why don't you respond to shat people say instead of trading unfounded allegations? What the church does with her money is the church's business and not the State's. But if the way the Church spends its money constitutes a criminal activity with respect to the laws of the State, then the State will be more than justified to address this situation.

I mentioned Christ Embassy legitimately and you cannot prove that what I said is not within the confines of both scripture and the constitution of the Federal Republic of Nigeria. A criminal act was carried out within the State, and the proceeds of that criminal act was traced to a Church and you think the State should just look away? Such action will breed lawlessness, since justice will not be served and such a move will emboldene other institutions within the State to do likewise knowing fully well that the State has no moral justification to posecute them as well. Besides, what will keep money launderers and other criminals from setting up a 'church' and using it as a front for their illegal activities?

Also, your argument is very weak regarding neglecting a criminal act just because of some good acts by the church. If that were to be the standard the society goes by, then all criminals will never be prosecuted because they will always have some acts of goodness they can point at to justify their criminal behaviour.

Your references to the church being wealthy is scriptural. However, you need to understand that God is not interested in prosperity for the sake of it. Money in the hands of the church must be money gotten through legitimate and uncorrupted means. If we do not get our money that way, then we are no different from the mafia and gangster out there.