₦airaland Forum

Ohyoudidnt:
1 Yes, Believers Will See Allah in Heaven

You're right. Islam says that true followers will see Allah later, as told in many hadiths. Early wise ones like Ibn Kathir, al-Jalalayn, & Imam Abu Hanifa said so too.

But this does not mean that Allah has a set shape or is part of creation.

Why?
Because the rules of this world do not bind what comes later. Light, time, & space don't work the same there. That’s why.

"His eyes do not catch Him, but He catches all eyes." (Qur’an 6:103)
"There is nothing like Him." (Qur’an 42:11)

So yes, believers will see Allah, but not like we see things here. Allah stays great, beyond all, & free — even if He shows Himself in a way fit for His grandeur.

But you IGNORE the fact that your prophet explicitly states that Allah will come in A SHAPE which you wouldn't accept initially, then Allah will come again in his original SHAPE and say I am your Lord!

You see why I said:
The whole of Islam is following
1. Your Scholars as a first priority
2. Mohammed as a second priority
3. Allah as a third priority

#In the Qur'an, Allah say pray THREE times: how many times do you pray? FIVE!
#In the Quran, Allah say do Mutah: you say Mohammed abrogated Mutah so you do not do it!
#Allah and Mohammed believes in the Preservation of the Injeel and Torah: your Muslim scholars say NO, that they are corrupted!
#Allah accuses people of the book as taking their Rabbis and Monks as LORDS instead of Allah AND the Messiah. But your scholars rewrote it to exclude the Messiah as LORD!
#Allah say that ALL Muslims must enter Hell Fire at least for some time. Your Islamic scholars created the Bridge of Sirat

Ohyoudidnt:
2 Is All That Can Be Seen Bound to End?
No, that's a deep thought, not a God-given truth.

If you think so, then angels, jinn, & even the soul would have to be real things. But we learn from God's words that their true form is beyond us or not known.

Just because you can see it does not mean it is made of bits or is part of the big space. The truth of Heaven & how Allah shows up there is not bound by our world's rules.

Are Angels finite or infinite in size?
And it take EIGHT angels to carry the throne of Allah: thus Allah is finite sir.

There is not going around it.

Ohyoudidnt:
3 What About Allah's Hands & Making Adam?

You bring up: Qur’an 38:75 - Why did you not bow to what I made with My hands?

Muslims take this as it is, without making Allah seem like us.

We do not say Allah’s hands are like ours.

We do not make His hands seem less.

We do not take them as just a symbol.

We say they are real, fitting His grandeur, & we do not ask how.

This is not doubt; it’s just the way. We don't ask how Allah knows, sees, or hears yet we trust those are true.

No one is speaking about the size of Allah's eyes or its colour: neither are we speaking about the looks of Allah's hands whether long or short, lean or stout: we are speaking of the function of hands as Allah has described them AND not how you wish Allah's hands to be.

Allah used his TWO hands to mould Adam from clay and we stand by that!

WHy do you like manufacturing Allah different from what he himself claims to be?

Ohyoudidnt:
4. What If Allah Takes a Form?

This asks if Allah is like things that do not change, & if He shows up as new, does the old go away?

That's the wrong view. Allah is not made of parts or shapes. He shows Himself by His wish, not by turning or leaving a shape.

When Allah shows a form we know, it is just a show, not a change in who He is. He stays The First, The Last, The Seen, & The Unseen — all at the same time. (Qur’an 57:3)

Your question, "What happened to Allah’s form when He took on a new shape?" thinks wrong that He has a set form. But:
Allah does not change. He is not a thing.

Who should I believe first
1. Allah and his prophet Mohammed
2. You and your Islamic scholars?

Are you saying that the shape of Allah doesn't exist?
If Allah doesn't have a shape, how is he sitting upon his throne?

Ohyoudidnt:
5 Is It Blind Trust to Not Guess?

No. Not to speak of what we don't know is not blind trust; it’s just wise.
"Do not go into what you do not know." (Qur’an 17:36)
Islam lets us ask, but not guess, boast, or cause mess & false beliefs.
The wise ones said:
Say it as Allah did — without asking how.
This does not mean we drop logic. It means we don't act like we can grasp all that is unseen fully.

Blind trust is to hold to things with no proof. Islam's faith is based on:
God's words (Qur’an & true Hadith), good thought, logical sense (no clashes in what God is), & knowing our limits.

The Quran is a claim NOT a proof!
A proof is based on verifiable EVIDENCES that show that other claims can be trusted!

When God Divided the Sea through Moses: were there Witnesses? Thus we can trust God by the claims of Moses!
WHen Jesus raised up the dead were there Witnesses? Then we can trust God by the claims of Jesus
When Elijah made prophecies in the name of YHWH and it came to pass, were there Witnesses? Then we can trust God by the claims of Elijah!

What is the proof that Allah is God other than claims in the Quran?

Ohyoudidnt:
6. Qur’an 5:101–102 — "Don't Ask" Words
These words warn of asks that lead to loss of faith, not real seeks:
"O you who trust, don't ask of things that, if shown to you, would hurt you." (Qur’an 5:101)
In the Prophet’s days, some asked things not needed or to mock, & faced what they asked.
It's like when Israelites asked Moses about the cow in Qur’an 2:68–71. The more they asked, the harder the rule got. Their want for small things led to their fall.

These words warn us not to play with faith or test God with nonstop asks.

You are not answering my question nor reading my argument

Why would the knowledge of the TRUTH lead to loss of Faith?
Knowledge should increase faith!

Ohyoudidnt:
7. Qur’an 19:71–72 — Will Every Muslim Face Hell?

Every one of you will face it [Hell]...
Then We will save those who feared Allah...
(Qur’an 19:71–72)

Facing it doesn't mean going in & burning. Wise ones were not all the same on this. Some said it's like crossing a bridge over Hell.
Others said it's seeing it up close.

But Allah says He will save the good from it.
This is not wrong. It’s a test & a sign. Those who fall in are just, & those saved are by God’s love.

Can't you acknowledge the truth for once?

You will NOT face Hell. You will BE IN IT: then Allah will remove the Believers and leave the unbelievers on their knees(in Hell).

If only you can truthfully answer these two questions below, the truth rather than sentiments will come to you:
Will the Unbelievers be on the bridge of Sirat?
Will the unbelievers be left on their knees on the bridge of sirat?

If the unbelievers wouldn't be left on the bridge then everyone including you Muslims will be INSIDE the Fire before Allah removes you Muslims and lees the unbelievers on their knees!

Qur'an 19:71-72
"And there is none of you except he will come to it (Hell). This is upon your Lord an inevitability decreed. Then We will save those who feared Allah and leave the wrongdoers within it, on their knees."

1. If the Truth is that you will certainly enter hell fire (even if it is temporarily), would it distress you?
2. Knowing that you will enter the fire even if it is temporary is certainly NOT Good because the time you will spend is undefined!
3. Wouldn't this knowledge help you to begin to seek for a way of avoiding this calamity?
4. What will you call anyone who says you will pass over the bridge of Sirat or you will fly over hell contrary to Qur'an 19:71-72: would such be a friend!?

Kobojunkie:
The problem is none of what you listed; like I said, I know what is behind the problem, and it is plaque build-up on my enamel that would need to be taken care of at my biannual dental appointment soon.

No problem!
I just cared as someone who used to have serious halitosis. Brushing even four times a day didn't even help till I stumbled on an unconventional solution!

Have a nice day!

Kobojunkie:
It is not easy but it must be done and in the politest of ways too. Many times, a simple brushing of one's teeth will not make the problem go away, and this can happen to any one of us. It becomes very important, then, to ensure we are informed on the many possible causes of bad breath. (Bad habits or poor grooming are not the only reasons for bad breath.) This way, we don't go in assuming it is exactly for the reasons we think in our tiny minds.

Right now, I know my breath is bad. I do brush and floss, but it's mainly because I have not seen my dentist for my regular cleaning for a very long time now. So, whenever someone complains, I let them know that I already have an appointment to see a dentist for a cleaning soon, and smile. That typically puts the person at ease.

DM me. I can give you a cheap and effective solution.
Free of charge.
Halitosis is not for many people because of bad hygiene but
1. Dentition
2. Tongue surface structure
3. Digestive problems.

Stay blessed!

Ohyoudidnt:
4. Is Allah’s Form Eternal or Temporal?

Another question often raised is if Allah’s form is temporary or eternal?

Allah’s essence is eternal, and He does not change. If He chooses to appear to His creation in a way they can recognize, it is by His will, and not because He has taken on a new shape or has been limited by time.

Islamic theology carefully avoids such philosophical traps. We affirm what Allah reveals about Himself without asking how.
Asking if His form is temporal assumes He has a physical body in the first place which Islam explicitly rejects.

These are not philosophical traps, they are pitfalls in your theology!

*Allah is ONE
*Allah cannot enter into his creation
Yet we see that Allah puts on a different form from his original

Then, we want to ask
What happened to Allah's real/original body when he appeared to you Muslims with a strange shape? Did this body die? And what happened to the strange shape of Allah when he came back to you Muslims in the shape you know?

Ohyoudidnt:
5. Do Muslims Avoid Reasoning?

No. Islam encourages deep reasoning, but always within the boundaries of revelation. Islam makes a critical distinction between:

Sound reason that submits to revelation,

And speculative reasoning that imagines Allah based on creation?

The Qur’an itself refutes blind speculation:
And do not pursue that of which you have no knowledge.
(Qur’an 17:36)

Faith in Islam is not blind. It is built upon reason, evidence, and a deep awareness that human logic has limits when dealing with the Divine. As Imam Mālik famously said Allah’s rising above the Throne is known, how is unknown, belief in it is obligatory, and asking about it is a bid'ah (blameworthy innovation).

Of course you do avoid deep reasoning.
You will note that most of my questions were answered with

We don't answer such questions because they are philosophical traps!
OR
We do not imagine size or dimensions or etc
OR
We do not speculate beyond the text

Yours is what is called BLIND faith my friend!

A blind faith is a trust based on no credible evidence such kinds of faith are based purely on emotions!

Ohyoudidnt:
6. The Meaning of Qur’an 5:101–102

Critics often quote:
Do not ask about things which, if made apparent to you, would distress you...” (Qur’an 5:101)

This is not a command to avoid all questions. It refers to harmful, speculative, or rebellious questioning, like what some people did to past prophets out of mockery or stubbornness.

Islam welcomes sincere, honest inquiry. In fact, the Qur’an commands believers to reflect, contemplate, and seek knowledge but within the scope of what Allah has revealed.

Who are those who asked questions and thus became disbelievers?

Why do you think Allah says that knowing the TRUTH could cause you distress ?

Quran 5:101
"O you who have believed, do not ask about things which, if they are shown to you, will distress you. But if you ask about them while the Qur'an is being revealed, they will be made plain to you. Allah has pardoned that which is past; and Allah is Forgiving and Forbearing."


1. Shouldn't you want to know the TRUTH even if it would distress you?
2. Are you aware that the end of any Truth that will cause you distress is NEVER good?
3. Are you aware that when you know the Truths that could cause you distress, you have an opportunity to avoid the Harm coming to you?
4. Would you call anyone who withhold a Truth that would cause you distress if you know about it a friend or an enemy?

My brother, I beg you to THINK about this verse.

Qur'an 19:71-72
"And there is none of you except he will come to it (Hell). This is upon your Lord an inevitability decreed. Then We will save those who feared Allah and leave the wrongdoers within it, on their knees."
1. If the Truth is that you will certainly enter hell fire (even if it is temporarily), would it distress you?
2. Knowing that you will enter the fire even if it is temporary is certainly NOT Good because the time you will spend is undefined!
3. Wouldn't this knowledge help you to begin to seek for a way of avoiding this calamity?
4. What will you call anyone who says you will pass over the bridge of Sirat or you will fly over hell contrary to Qur'an 19:71-72: would such be a friend!?

Ohyoudidnt:
1. Can Allah Be Seen, and Does That Require a Shape?

Yes, Muslims affirm based on authentic Hadith that believers will see Allah on the Day of Resurrection. For example, the Prophet pbuh said you will see your Lord just as you see the moon on a clear night.(Sahih al-Bukhari 7439)

However, this does not mean Allah must have a shape that conforms to the laws of light, eyes, and space. The Prophet pbuh compared the clarity of vision not the form of Allah to the clarity of the moon or sun.

Furthermore, vision in the Hereafter is not like vision in this world. Just as the nature of Paradise, its pleasures, and the bodies of the resurrected are unlike anything we know now, the act of seeing Allah is also unique. It does not require light, retinas, or reflection, as those are worldly mechanisms. Allah, being the Creator of light and vision, is not subject to them.

As the Qur’an declares:Vision cannot grasp Him, but He grasps all vision.
(Qur’an 6:103)

To insist otherwise is to impose created limitations on the Creator, which is both theologically and rationally flawed.

Good that you finally acknowledged that Allah can be seen.

I am sure that you will agree with me that the difference between our senses here and in paradise is that our senses would be heightened.
Colours would be brighter, Sights would be sharper and clearer, Hearing would be perfect, Pleasures would be heightened etc

Thus, you Muslims would be able the see your Allah as clearly as younger the sun or moon. Al-Jalalayn and Ibn Kathir explained that the exception for Qur'an 6:103 will be in paradise. The believers will see Him with their own eyes, effortlessly and without any difficulty.

Imam Abu Hanifah states:
"The people of Paradise shall truly see Allah without manner, resemblance, or direction. The believers shall see Him in Paradise with their own eyes, without any distance between Him and them."



Do you know that ANYTHING that can be seen is a subset of the extended Universe and thus FINITE?

Ohyoudidnt:
2. Does Allah Have a Shape or Form?

Certain Hadith mention that Allah will come in a form that believers do not recognize at first, then later in a form they will recognize. Critics often seize on this to claim that Allah must have a shape.

Islamic scholars from the earliest generations responded clearly and
we affirm what is revealed, including that Allah will come in a way believers recognize.

But we do not define this as a shape in the material sense.

We do not imagine dimensions, size, light, or shadow.

And we do not speculate beyond the text.


The term shape in this context is part of the unseen and is affirmed without likening it to any human or material reality.

To say that Allah must have a shape simply because He is seen is like saying the soul must have a skeleton because we believe it can feel. It is a false analogy based on worldly assumptions.

My argument is NOT about the LOOKS of Allah but that he has a FORM or SHAPE!

Are you aware that ANYTHING that has a shape is BOUNDED in Form (has a limited dimension)?

Furthermore,
Allah seems to have at least TWO forms or shapes which I want to believe are both eternal as they are of his essence.

So, what happened to Allah's real/original body when he appeared to you Muslims with a strange shape? Did this body die? And what happened to the strange shape of Allah when he came back to you Muslims in the shape you know?

Ohyoudidnt:
3. The Issue of Two Hands in Qur’an 38:75

One of the most cited verses by critics is What prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My two hands? (Qur’an 38:75)

Muslims do not deny this verse. Instead, we affirm it in a manner befitting Allah without imagining, likening, or interpreting it through human experience.

The mistake critics make is assuming that because humans use hands to grasp, Allah’s hands must serve the same purpose and therefore imply a physical body. But Allah has attributes unique to Him, and nothing is like Him.
There is nothing like unto Him, and He is the All-Hearing, All-Seeing.
(Qur’an 42:11)

So, while we affirm Allah has two hands as mentioned in revelation, we do not define or describe them. We do not say they are limbs, appendages, or tools, nor do we say they are metaphorical.They are real, as Allah intends, but not like ours in any way.

Unfortunately, what you do or do not do is immaterial in this case: why!?
Because Allah defined exactly what he used his hands to do.

Allah used his two hands to mold Adam.

Quran 15:26
"And We did certainly create man from sounding clay, from mud molded into shape."

Otherwise, define what a HAND is and compare the functionality with respect to moulding clay/mud.

DENYING the Truth doesn't make you right: it actually guarantees that you are wrong!

Easyincome24:
Will you stay or leave, if your examiner sets this type of question?

It is most likely a PRACTICAL Examination.

If you don't have the necessary skill set, no amount of asking others will help you.

You may get help to confirm your analysis BUT you wouldn't get help for fabricating the Object with your Lathe Machine or Welding Machine etc

Ohyoudidnt:
1. Does Seeing Require Allah to Have a Shape?
Absolutely not. In Islamic theology, the ability to see Allah doesn’t hinge on Him having a physical form or shape as we know it. The Prophet (pbuh) explicitly mentioned, "You will see your Lord..." but left the specifics of His appearance undefined. Think of it like this: the sun and moon analogy isn’t about form but clarity. Seeing something especially in the unseen, eternal realm doesn’t demand a spatial or tangible structure. Allah is beyond comparison, yet He can still be perceived. It’s not a contradiction; it’s the reality of the divine.

We see with our EYES, don't we?
We see when Lights from an object trajects into our eyes!

When you Muslims see Allah, will it be with your eyes or nose?
When you speak to Allah will it be with your mouth or ears?

Then, stop deceiving yourself by closing your mind to reality: If Allah Allah can be seen by mere humans, then he has a shape and light can reflect from him to your eyes.

At resurrection, will you Muslims have a body or not?

Ohyoudidnt:
2. Does Allah Have a Shape?
Hadiths do reference Allah appearing in a form, but here’s the catch: it’s not a form bound by human concepts like size, material, or features. Muslims affirm that Allah will manifest in a recognizable way, but we don’t box it into terms like "physical shape" or "body." Why? Because the Qur’an (42:11) states, "There is nothing like unto Him." So yes, He can be seen, and yes, He’ll appear in a manner believers recognize—but we don’t dive into speculative details about that form.

My argument was not that Allah has a human form: he could as well be a transformer, I don't care.

The important thing is that Allah has a SHAPE!

Do you still contest this?

Ohyoudidnt:
3. Is Allah’s Form Temporal or Eternal?
Allah’s essence is timeless and unchanging, free from the constraints of time or space. Any form He takes when appearing to believers isn’t like ours, but we’re not told whether it’s an eternal attribute or a temporary manifestation. Bottom line? We stick to what the texts say and avoid overstepping.

If Allah's shape is his essence, Will Allah take up a form that is Temporal?

You do not want to delve into it because your theology breaks down.

Let me help you: Allah is so great that it is beneath him to enter his creation: Is this a true statement?

Ohyoudidnt:
4. About Quran 38:75 – “My Two Hands”
Mainstream Islam doesn’t shy away from affirming that Allah mentioned "two hands." But let’s be clear: these aren’t literal, physical limbs. It’s a majestic expression of His power and favor, like when He created Adam "with His two hands"—a truth that stands apart from human comparisons. We take it at face value without reducing it to human terms.

For the thousand time: My objective is not to compare Allah's hands with human hands.

What is a hand?
A hand is an appendage used primarily for holding, grabbing or touching things rather than walking.

This is what Allah says he has: two hands with which he created Adam!
Show me with evidence either from Allah or Mohammed that Allah's hands are not literal?

Ohyoudidnt:
5. The question of whether Muslims are denying obvious truths is a matter of perspective, as the Islamic faith emphasizes the transcendent and incomparable nature of Allah. Unlike tangible entities, such as human beings, Allah’s essence is beyond physical representation or direct observation. The Qur’an and Hadith explicitly state that Allah is unique, with no likeness or equal, as evidenced by verses like Surah Ash-Shura (42:11) and Surah Al-Ikhlas (112:4). These texts also affirm that human knowledge cannot fully grasp His nature. When posed with queries like, "Does Allah have a shape?" the response is nuanced: while believers may recognize His manifestations, attributing physicality to Allah is inappropriate, as it imposes limitations on His infinite and unseen reality.

Allah could be unique in the sense that
1. He is bigger , taller and stronger than us
2. He is older than us humans
3. He has a complexion that is different from human complexions
4. His two hands are right hands

All these are obvious differences between Allah and us.

The problem of Muslims is that they shut down their reasoning facilities in other to avoid the Truth!

It's like you asking me the Question
Question:
TenQ, is the addition of 4 oranges to 5 oranges equal to 9 oranges?

My Response:
You see, we don't ask ourselves these kinds of questions! Human knowledge cannot grasp these answer because we don't even have the oranges at home! We don't overstep our boundaries beyond the oranges we have are ripe or unripe? It is inappropriate to ask such questions as we don't even have ripe oranges with us?

If these look silly to you, then just imagine how it looks to me!

These are problem of Islam. Islam cannot withstand scrutiny: all your claims always break down with questions

This is probably why Allah says:


Quran 5:101
"O you who have believed, do not ask about things which, if they are shown to you, will distress you. But if you ask about them while the Qur'an is being revealed, they will be made plain to you. Allah has pardoned that which is past; and Allah is Forgiving and Forbearing."

The next verse gives the reason
Qur'an 5:102
"A people asked such [questions] before you; then they became thereby disbelievers."

Who are these people of old who became disbelievers because they asked questions?

So, you swallow LIES hook, line and sinker because you wouldn't ask questions that will set you free!

Only the Truth you know and imbibe will set you free.

John 8:32:
"And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free.”"

Matt 7:7:
"Ask, and it shall be given to you. Seek, and you shall find. Knock, and it shall be opened to you."

God want you to ASK Questions sir!

Sand2022:
I am familiar with the position of JWs, I just don't know about bookmark.

It's okay!
For me, I think it's the same argument slightly different flavours!

Sand2022:
This sounds like the position of JWs, but it doesn't appear that bookmark is a JW. So I want to understand his perspective. So all the point he is making then is that Jesus is not Almighty, but he can be worshipped?

It's the same misunderstanding
The same argument


They cannot fathom how YHWH can be Somewhere and Everywhere at the same time.
They cannot fathom how YHWH can be Unlimited and Limited at the same time.

This is their problem!

This is why if your ask them the Question :
if Jehovah is Omnipresent, you may be shocked with their answer .

I don't waste much time with them!

Sand2022:
I wanted to reply to all these, but the first point you made was that Jesus is God, but not God Almighty. I need to understand your position well. What do you mean by the word "God"? How many Gods di we have? Jesus being God, do you think he should be worshipped?

Is the point of difference only the claim that Jesus is not the Almighty? Only his Father is Almighty?

Based on their wilful IGNORANCE, they created TWO Gods for themselves
1. The Almighty God
2. The Mighty God.

They then Demoted the Holy Spirit to a mere Influence or Power of God!

Gabrielshow24:
TenQ, that's how it has become. We can't say anything 👀 critical to their beliefs. One of the reasons, I have left their section altogether. It's just 🤦🏾‍♂️.

Thanks, for the submission. You have totally dissected their book. No one could have done any better. More grease to your elbow.

As for your opponent, he is being intellectually dishonest. No one, points to the Sun and then you intrepret it as clarity.

I can't point to the world cup and someone will reintrepret it as atmosphere 🤦🏾‍♂️. The context doesn't warrant such re-intrepretation! This is the only way they can patch up the inherent contradiction of these with the standard narrative!

Islam is a LIE that Muslims try their best to protect by telling covering lies. They honestly wish their lies would be true at the end of the day BUT this is an impossibility.

The Rules Seun is using in applying AI to flag post is completely unfair to the truth.
I have been shadowbanned to a point that for every post I make, I have to check if it has been banned or not. Thus, I hardly make original posts again.

I guess this is Seun's objective. This will end up being counterproductive to Nairaland

Ohyoudidnt:
You also mentioned that Allah has two right hands, a face, smiles, and that He’s described in contrast to the Dajjal. These descriptions come from authentic Hadith, and scholars from early Islam warned us not to interpret them in human terms. When the Prophet pbuh said “Your Lord is not one-eyed,” it was to show that Allah is perfect and has no defects not that He looks like the Dajjal. It’s about affirming Allah’s perfection, not making a comparison.

How else would you understand what it means to SMILE if not in reference to human smiling because of all creations, ONLY humans smile and a SMILE is a physical expression of the FACE.

Allah's face according to your prophet is like Adam's face, thus the link is established.

Your scholars do NOT want you to examine the FALSEHOODS in their theology, thus, they don't want you to ask any questions.

Don't forget that the same questions you don't ask your scholars is what you use to claim the falsehood of Christianity!

How will you feel if someone sells a PLOT of land to you and ask you not to ask questions about the document he gave you?

Could such a seller be a 419?

Ohyoudidnt:
You say that Muslims follow scholars instead of Allah and His Messenger. But scholars didn’t make up these beliefs. They carefully studied the Qur’an and Hadith, staying true to what the Prophet’s companions understood. They taught us to affirm what Allah and His Messenger said, without likening Allah to anything, denying His attributes, or speculating about how they work. The reason Muslims don’t say Allah is a body or has a shape isn’t because we reject the Hadith, but because the Prophet pbuh and the Qur’an warned us never to compare Allah to creation.

Scholars have preserved that warning. When you say the Hadith are “haunting for Islam,” you’re assuming they mean Allah has a human-like form, but that’s not what the Prophet intended or what the earliest Muslims thought. So yes, Muslims believe that Allah will be seen.

Check sir!
The whole of Islam is following
1. Your Scholars as a first priority
2. Mohammed as a second priority
3. Allah as a third priority

#In the Qur'an, Allah say pray THREE times: how many times do you pray? FIVE!

#In the Quran, Allah say do Mutah: you say Mohammed abrogated Mutah so you do not do it!

#Allah and Mohammed believes in the Preservation of the Injeel and Torah: your Muslim scholars say NO, that they are corrupted!

#Allah accuses people of the book as taking their Rabbis and Monks as LORDS instead of Allah AND the Messiah. But your scholars rewrote it to exclude the Messiah as LORD!

#Allah say that ALL Muslims must enter Hell Fire at least for some time. Your Islamic scholars created the Bridge of Sirat

The list goes on and on!
Who truely do you believe as a first priority?
Allah or your scholars?

Ohyoudidnt:
Yes, we believe in Allah's attributes as mentioned in the Qur’an and Hadith. But we don't describe them in physical or human terms. We accept everything Allah and His Messenger have said, and we avoid comparing the Creator with His creation. That’s the core of Tawhid — complete oneness with God.

You don't have to describe them in human terms: Allah already did and, that's the point.

When Allah and your prophet has spoken, do you think it is important to value the opinion of your scholars?

Ohyoudidnt:
You have a flair for having the same thing repeated isn't it?

I didn't even repeat anything. I just showed you two similar Hadiths because you don't answer direct questions. The truth usually has to be forced out of you before you acknowledge it.

Ohyoudidnt:
So you're saying that if Allah can be seen, then maybe He has some form or shape. Muslims do believe that Allah will be seen on the Day of Resurrection, but that doesn’t mean He looks like His creation or has a body like ours.

Good.
If Allah can be seen, he MUST necessarily have a SHAPE!

Note that my argument isn't about whether Allah hooks like us humans (even though this is true).
My goal is to help you admit that Allah has a shape...In don't care how Allah looks like.

Is Allah's shape (the one you will see on the daynof resurrection TEMPORAL or ETERNAL ?

Ohyoudidnt:
The Prophet (peace be upon him) compared seeing Allah to the clarity and ease of spotting the sun and moon, not in terms of Allah’s appearance. Seeing doesn’t mean being physically similar. Allah Himself states in the Qur’an (42:11), "There is nothing like unto Him, and He is the All-Hearing, All-Seeing."

You also mentioned those Hadiths where Allah appears in a way believers don’t recognize at first, and later in a form they do. And that believers will recognize Him by His Shin. These narrations are authentic and widely accepted. Scholars explain that the description of His form and His Shin are qualities of Allah that we affirm without trying to understand how. We accept these descriptions as truths but don’t interpret them to mean Allah has a body or limbs, or that He resembles creation.

Aren't you wilfully DENYING obvious TRUTHS by refusing to examine it?

It's like saying that President Tinubu is a White Caucasian Man in spite of the evidence with the excuse that in my household, we don't look at skin colour!

Ohyoudidnt:
Just like we acknowledge Allah’s ability to see and hear without needing eyes or ears like ours, we also accept these attributes without trying to picture them. Regarding the Hadith “Allah created Adam in His image,” scholars like Imam Nawawi and even Ibn Taymiyyah clarified that this refers to Adam being made with a complete human form (speech, intellect, dignity) not that Allah looks like Adam or vice versa. Claiming that Allah looks human goes against the core of Islamic belief, which stresses Allah’s absolute uniqueness and that He isn’t like anything in His creation.

If Allah never mentioned that he created Adam with his two hands, you may be able to wriggle out but Allah's inclusion of the qualifier TWO fixed Allah's words as literal

Quran 38:75
"He said, ‘O Iblis! What prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My two hands? Are you arrogant, or are you among the exalted?’

Ohyoudidnt:
Saying that your Lord isn’t one-eyed doesn't mean Allah has two eyes like we do. It’s more about clarifying that He’s perfect and doesn’t have any flaws, so there’s no room for confusion about His nature.

Sorry!
All Mohammed needed to say was
"If you are confused about the Dajjal, your Lord is NOT physical"!

But what did Mohammed say!?
1. He describes the Dajjal in detail
2. He mentioned one serious flaw in the Dajjal: as the ONE eye
3. He says: if you are still confused note that Allah doesn't have one eye!


Is the Dajjal ALMOST perfect but with a flaw?
Then why compare him with Allah!?

Ohyoudidnt:
No need to as my answer is in my earlier response.


Allah is fundamentally different from creation. He isn’t a physical body, isn’t limited by space, and isn’t bound by time. Yet, His knowledge, power, and will are present and effective everywhere.

I didn't ask if Allah has a physical body!
Iblis has a shape but he doesn't have a physical body. He is made from smokeless fire

Angels have shapes but they don't have a physical body. They are made from light.


The Question is whether Allah has a BODY or not!

Do you deny that Anything/Anyone that has a body has a SHAPE!?

Ohyoudidnt:
Allah has beautiful names and attributes, like hearing, sight, hand, and mercy. These are mentioned in the Qur’an and Sunnah, but none of them are like anything in creation. Allah is not a body, has no shape, and isn’t limited by space or time. He is above His Throne, so that suits His majesty (Qur’an 20:5). Still, His knowledge, power, will, and commands include everything, even though He isn’t physically inside creation (Qur’an 57:4). This balance shows we affirm His greatness without likening Him to anything human, and acknowledge His transcendence without denying His existence. Allah is above the Throne. The Qur’an describes how The Most Merciful rose over the Throne (Qur’an 20:5). He is exalted above creation, not part of it. Nothing is like Him. There is nothing comparable to Him, and He is all-hearing and all-seeing (Qur’an 42:11). His attributes are unique and do not resemble human body parts. And no matter where you are, He is with you (Qur’an 57:4). His knowledge and power are everywhere, but His essence isn’t limited to space. He knows everything – He is all-knowing (Qur’an 2:282). Knowledge surrounds all places, but His presence isn’t bodily. Some of His attributes like hand, eye, and shin are mentioned in the Qur’an (Qur’an 38:75, 20:39, 68:42). We affirm these without asking how, and without making them like human parts, or denying their reality. Imam Malik explained that when it comes to His rising (istiwa), we believe in it, accept that we don’t understand how, and avoid questioning it as an innovation. Belief is essential, and asking details about it is not correct.

I agree that these are the things you wish to believe about your Allah BUT

Your prophet disagrees with you as Allah has at least a shape.

Sahih al-Bukhari 6573
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Some people said, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Shall we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?" He said, "Do you crowd and squeeze each other on looking at the sun when it is not hidden by clouds?" They replied, "No, Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)." He said, "Do you crowd and squeeze each other on looking at the moon when it is full and not hidden by clouds?" They replied, No, O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)!" He said, "So you will see Him (your Lord) on the Day of Resurrection...


Do you deny that:
Whatever can be SEEN has a shape?
Your prophet says that you will SEE Allah!


Continuing with the same hadith

Sahih al-Bukhari 6573
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Some people said, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Shall we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?"
.......
similarly Allah will gather all the people and say, 'Whoever used to worship anything should follow that thing. 'So, he who used to worship the sun, will follow it, and he who used to worship the moon will follow it, and he who used to worship false deities will follow them; and then only this nation (i.e., Muslims) will remain, including their hypocrites. Allah will come to them in a shape other than they know and will say, 'I am your Lord.' They will say, 'We seek refuge with Allah from you. This is our place; (we will not follow you) till our Lord comes to us, and when our Lord comes to us, we will recognize Him. Then Allah will come to then in a shape they know and will say, "I am your Lord.' They will say, '(No doubt) You are our Lord,' and they will follow Him. .....


Do you deny that your prophet said that Allah will come to you Muslims in SHAPES?

Two Eyes (as the Dajjal has only one eye
One shin
Two right hands
Even Allah will put his FOOT over hell fire and it would scream.. enough.. enough!


Sahih al-Bukhari 6573
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Some people said, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Shall we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?" .....
.' Then Allah will turn his face away from the Fire. The man will say after that, 'O Lord, bring me near the gate of Paradise.' Allah will say (to him),....

Do you deny that Allah will turn his FACE away from the fire of Hell?

Because, Allah has a Face. His face is only different from our face.


Sahih al-Bukhari 6573
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Some people said, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Shall we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?"....

O Lord! Do not make me the most wretched of Your creation,' and will keep on invoking Allah till Allah will smile and when Allah will smile because of him, then He will allow him to enter Paradise, and when he will enter Paradise, he will be addressed, 'Wish from so-and-so.' He will wish till all his wishes will be fulfilled, then Allah will say, All this (i.e. what you have wished for) and as much again therewith are for you.' " Abu Huraira added: That man will be the last of the people of Paradise to enter (Paradise).


Do you deny that Allah smiles?

Smiling is a human attribute isn't it? Let me know of any other creature in heaven and non earth that smiles other than humans and probably the Jinn.

From what I know, smiling is a FACIAL expression involving the physical mouth.

Your prophet who knows Allah better that any Muslim seems to know that Allah looks very much like the Dajjal EXCEPT that, Allah has TWO eyes while the Dajjal has only one eyes: he this warms you not to be confused about the Dajjal when you see him


Mishkat al-Masabih 5485
`Ubada b. as-Samit reported God's messenger as saying, "I have told you so much about the dajjal that I am afraid you may not understand. The antichrist is short, hen-toed[*], woolly-haired, one-eyed, an eye sightless and neither protruding nor deep-seated. If you are confused about him, know that your Lord is not one-eyed."
*It may also mean 'bandy-legged.


So, you see:
A wish and the Truth may be very different!
Allah has a shape and he is NOT a spirit.
Don't forget that the Jinn also has bodies and they are not spirits (according to Islam: they are made of smokeless fire)

Ohyoudidnt:
No need to as my answer is in my earlier response.


Allah is fundamentally different from creation. He isn’t a physical body, isn’t limited by space, and isn’t bound by time. Yet, His knowledge, power, and will are present and effective everywhere.

You did NOT answer my question
Can Taoheed allow Allah to be simultaneously truely in two places at the same time? Does the Taoheed allow Allah to be Somewhere and Everywhere at the same time?

You said:

Allah is fundamentally different from creation. He isn’t a physical body, isn’t limited by space, and isn’t bound by time.

Yet, His knowledge, power, and will are present and effective everywhere. So yes, Allah can act on earth while being above the heavens, without being in two places like a creature, because nothing compares to Him (Qur'an 42:11).

But Allah has a Body
Allah indeed has hands (even if his hands are not like our hands)
Allah indeed has eyes (even if they are not like ours)
Allah indeed has a shin( even if it is different from ours)
In summary:
1. Allah has a shape
2. Allah is NOT a Spirit

If there is anything FALSE about any only claims, let me know

This shape of Allah sits on one throne that eight created goat like angels carry.

If Allah sits on created throne which is carried by created angels AND Allah is looking like created beings then Allah's nature would at best be like the nature of Angels and Jinn!





I didn't ask if Allah can ACT on earth while in Heaven. I asked if it was possible that
Allah to be simultaneously truely in two places at the same time? Does the Taoheed allow Allah to be Somewhere and Everywhere at the same time?
You did NOT answer my question sir. You answered about acting remotely not direct presence!


Please, with evidence!

Gabrielshow24:
I
They just like to blame Paul, which by the way they affirm👀 as one of them. People caught on to their discrepancies hence the standard narrative of other books being corrupted. Till now, they haven't showed us one Jew that worshipped Ezra. 👀

Sorry!
I've been banned thrice for replying to this post of yours!

Ohyoudidnt:
Allah is the ultimate source of everything. He may create through various means, like how humans come up with inventions such as iPhones, but at the end of the day, He is the true Creator behind it all.

When the angels declared, We will destroy this place,they were acting as messengers on God’s behalf, not as independent forces; the destruction ultimately came from Yahweh. This aligns with the Qur'an, which teaches that while Jibril conveyed Allah’s words, he did not originate them.

In a similar vein, when Moses parted the sea by raising his hand, it was God who truly split the waters. There’s no contradiction here; it’s all about divine action through chosen agents.

Allah is fundamentally different from creation. He isn’t a physical body, isn’t limited by space, and isn’t bound by time. Yet, His knowledge, power, and will are present and effective everywhere. So yes, Allah can act on earth while being above the heavens, without being in two places like a creature, because nothing compares to Him (Qur'an 42:11).

Therefore, it’s misguided to mock the role of agents like angels in God’s plans or to impose human limitations on how the Creator operates. The consistent message in both the Bible and the Qur’an is clear: God commands, angels execute, but only God holds the true power.

It is good you answered your apparent initial confusion about who actually destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah.

Now
Can Taoheed allow Allah to be simultaneously truely in two places at the same time? Does the Taoheed allow Allah to be Somewhere and Everywhere at the same time?

It is a Yes or No answer!
If your answer is Yes and knowing that Allah is NOT a Spirit, give explanation with EVIDENCES!

Ohyoudidnt:
Well you should expantiate as Genesis 19:13 tells us that angels were the ones who destroyed Sodom, but then in 19:24, it says that the Lord Himself rained down fire.

What’s even more puzzling is the phrase that suggests the Lord rained from the Lord, which makes it sound like there are two Lords involved, leading to more confusion.

In verse 19:13, it mentions that the Lord sent the angels to destroy the city, while verse 19:24 states that the LORD rained brimstone and fire upon Sodom and Gomorrah from the LORD out of heaven.

These kinds of contradictions and vague wording can really lead to misunderstandings about who God is and what His role is in these events.

Let me ask you a basic question to test your comprehension

Who parted the Red Sea for the Children of Israel
1. Was it Moses?
2. Was it God?
Is this contradictory?


Whose words is the Qur'an
1. Is it Jibril's?
2. Is it Allah?
Is this contradictory?



So, how is it confusing for you that two angels are sent as emissary to Sodom and Gomorrah for it's destruction BUT God was the Power behind the Destruction?

Ohyoudidnt:
Well you should expantiate as Genesis 19:13 tells us that angels were the ones who destroyed Sodom, but then in 19:24, it says that the Lord Himself rained down fire.

What’s even more puzzling is the phrase that suggests the Lord rained from the Lord, which makes it sound like there are two Lords involved, leading to more confusion.

In verse 19:13, it mentions that the Lord sent the angels to destroy the city, while verse 19:24 states that the LORD rained brimstone and fire upon Sodom and Gomorrah from the LORD out of heaven.

These kinds of contradictions and vague wording can really lead to misunderstandings about who God is and what His role is in these events.

You desire a God that is LIKE objects in creation!

What is confusing with the Fact that God YHWH can be simultaneously independently in Heaven and Earth at the same time?

Is it confusing because NOTHING in creation can simultaneously be in two places at the same time?


I guess it was Paul that wrote this verse too!
LOL!!

Can Taoheed allow Allah to be simultaneously in two places at the same time? Does the Taoheed allow Allah to be Somewhere and Everywhere at the same time?
It's a simple question o!

SeeWahala:
Link or proof of such facts please 🤡

Because I can mention some people who came out openly to say that during the years your tilumbu said he attended that school they never saw or knew anybody like him. These people who made such statements are still alive today mind you

Such was possible in early times in Nigeria. An elder brother of a friend never attended Primary or Secondary school BUT he is a Graduate of a University.

He did both O-Level GCE and A-level GCE by correspondence

Gabrielshow24:
Quite false and misleading. God gave his Son, the fullness of God, to us. Also, appealing to Tertullian also grants his other debilitating remarks to your JW doctrine. I for one don't hold such appeals! Some time ago you brought up some footnote commentaries to prove that "spirit of trees" were angels😂!

JW are like Muslims, they tell lies a lot.

Why don't you appeal to any AI and find out if it is actually true that Tertullian said what he is being accused of saying.

Thanks

Expanse2020:
We all know Christianity was based lies so don't let robb salt to your injuries🤣🤣🤣


Answer the question and let move to another one
Show us where the bible or your God said he created you in Trinity
Or Jesus was created in Trinity

Islam is from the father of lies : the Al-Makr himself!
He misleads as his first assignment!

Only the truth sets free!
Only liars say Jesus wasn't crucified nor killed!

Ken4Christ:
Good day friend. I disagree with a point you made concerning persecution of Christians alongside with the Jews. Their persecutions will be separate. I have been trying to get the church understand this truth for some years now but it seems not to be sinking into our spirit because of what we have been taught over the years.

Immediately after the rapture of the church, the saints of the present day church will face severe persecutions. But the persecution will not come from the antichrist for he will not be revealed Immediately.

God's dealing with the Jews will only commence when God is through with the present church age - Romans 11:25-26.

The persecution of Christians is revealed in Revelation, chapter 7:9-16.

That of the Jews is Revelation 13 and there are unknown years in between the two events

I will write on a very detailed book concerning this very soon. May the Lord grant us understanding.

The church is separate from Israel.

But it seems they will share the same fate in parallel to each other.

I am still learning: I don't think I have all the answers!
I say only what I know!

Truvelisback:
Thanks for insightful input.

You are welcome sir!

Truvelisback:
Good day, fellas. Let's discuss the Phases of the endtime e.g Rapture(a sudden take up to heaven), Great tribulation, heaven, hell, lake of fire, Millenium reign with Christ etc.

Some things are certain
1. The Rule of the Antichrist for seven years
2. The first 3.5 years would be bliss for Israel and Christians and a lot of people will see the antichrist as a kind of saviour
3. The beginning of the second 3.5 years: the Antichrist will revoke his apparent support for Israel and Christians most likely because of the resistance by them from recieving the mark of the beast
4. This will lead to Israel and the church being divided by the Antichrist.
5a. The persecution of the Church and Israel will intensify to the peak as many will pay with their lives
5b. The martyrdom of the TWO witnesses
6a. It seems that no Christian will survive this seven years and Israel will also be almost annihilated.
b. Sealing of the 144,000 of the children of Israel
7. The second coming of JESUS Christ and Marriage Supper of the Lamb will happen with the descent of His Saints with the New Jerusalem from heaven.
NOTE:
It is difficult to place the exact time of rapture between these 7 items above. Rapture could be Pre-Tribulation, Mid-Tribulation or even at the tail end of the Tribulation.

The exact timing of the Judgment of Babylon the Great harlot is also difficult to place.

8a. The Antichrist (the Beast) and the False Prophet are arrested and Judged with the Lake of fire.
8b. The inhabitants of the Nations of the Earth who actively wage war on Israel are killed at the battle of Armageddon.
9a. Satan is bound for 1000 years
9b. The 1000 year reign of Christ on earth.
10. The temporary release of satan from the bottom-less pit
11. Satan goes to deceive the whole world again.
12. Resurrection of the Dead and Final Judgment of the people of Earth with anyone whose name is not in the Lambs book of life thrown into the lake of Fire (the Great white throne Judgment)
13. Replacement of the Heavens and the Earth with newly Created heaven and earth.
14. Judgement of Believers for Reward of their faithfulness and their eternal Reward.


Anyone with more time can support each of these with appropriate scriptures.

NOTE:
There is no one on earth who fully understand every event and sequence of the end times.
We all know in part and speak in part.

It is just like the prophecy of the Messiah: it didn't make sense until it was fulfilled.
1Cor 2:8:
"Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory."
So likewise the second coming of Christ.



We are commanded to be sober and vigilant for we do not know when the Son of Man will come

CreativeOrbit:
Your claims are sloppy, theologically confused, and easy to shred. Let’s do it quickly.

1) “Tawḥīd isn’t in the Qur’an”

The word “Trinity” isn’t in your Bible either, yet you build your entire creed on it. The doctrine of Tawḥīd (pure, absolute oneness of God) is spelled out all over the Qur’an:

“Say: He is Allah, One (Aḥad). Allah, the Self‑Sufficient… He begets not, nor is He begotten, and none is comparable to Him.” (Qur’an 112:1‑4)

“Your God is One God (Ilāhun Wāḥid).” (Qur’an 2:163)

“We did not send any messenger before you except that We revealed to him that there is no deity but Me, so worship Me.” (Qur’an 21:25)

Tawḥīd is the air the Qur’an breathes. Pretending it “doesn’t exist” only exposes that you haven’t read the text you’re attacking.

Taoheed is NOT anywhere in the Qur'an. If you know where it is, show me

CreativeOrbit:
2) “Jesus is co‑creator of life with Allah”

False. The Qur’an explicitly limits his miracle to Allah’s permission:

“…I create for you out of clay the form of a bird, then I blow into it and it becomes a bird by Allah’s permission.” (Qur’an 3:49)

“…you created from clay as it were the figure of a bird by My permission…” (Qur’an 5:110)

“By Allah’s permission” ≠ “co‑Creator”. It proves the opposite of what you’re claiming: Jesus is not independent, Allah is.

1. According to Allah, who said:
"I create for you out of clay the form of a bird, then I blow into it and it becomes a bird " in Qur’an 3:49
2. According to Allah, who was he referring to when he said:
"you created from clay as it were the figure of a bird by My permission" in Qur’an 5:110

CreativeOrbit:
3) “Jesus is uniquely born without a father”

Miraculous birth ≠ divinity. Adam had no father and no mother. The Qur’an levels the point bluntly:

“The likeness of Jesus with Allah is as the likeness of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him ‘Be,’ and he was.” (Qur’an 3:59)

If a fatherless birth makes Jesus God, what does no parents at all make Adam?

Adam couldn't have had either a father or a mother but not so with Jesus.

Why was Jesus born without a father as it wasn't necessary either as a miracle or as a prophet?

Do Muslims have any answer?

CreativeOrbit:
4) “Jesus is the only ‘spirit from Allah’”

The Qur’an says Allah breathed of His spirit into Adam (32:9; 15:29) — and humanity generally. “Rūḥun minhu” is an honorific attribution, not ontological divinity. Everything is “from Allah” (creation, mercy, rain, revelation). That doesn’t make everything Allah.

Who else is a spirit from Allah apart from Jesus: Jibril!?

CreativeOrbit:
5) “Jesus is the only ‘Word’ of Allah”

Again, you’re ripping the phrase from its Qur’anic meaning. “His Word” means created by His command “Be” (Kun) — not a divine, eternal Logos becoming flesh (that’s your Hellenized theology, not ours). See Qur’an 4:171; 3:45; 16:40.

Are you saying that Allah is not good with speech again!?
Since Allah is not a toddler, don't help him say what he did not say. Except you think that the Arabic of Allah isn't good enough or he is not precise in speech.

Otherwise, Jesus is the Word of Allah cast down to Mary

CreativeOrbit:
6) Your own citation (22:73) backfires

Qur’an 22:73 proves no one creates independently of Allah. Exactly. Which is why every miracle of Jesus is explicitly chained to “by Allah’s permission.” You just cited a verse that destroys your thesis.

Bottom line

Tawḥīd is everywhere in the Qur’an; your Bible doesn’t even contain the word “Trinity”, nor does Jesus ever say “I am God, worship me.”

Jesus’ miracles prove he’s a messenger empowered by Allah, not a co‑equal God.

Adam’s creation and the “spirit from Him” language show your “uniqueness” claims are theologically hollow.

Stop projecting your confused Christology onto Islam. The Qur’an is consistent: Allah alone is the Creator, Absolute, without partner. Jesus (ʿĪsā) عليه السلام is His servant, word, and prophet — not His equal.

Quran (22:73)
"O people, an example is presented, so listen to it. Indeed, those you invoke besides Allah will never create [as much as] a fly, even if they gathered together for that purpose. And if the fly should steal away a thing from them, they could not recover it from him. Weak are the pursuer and pursued."


Only God can create life according to Allah and everything else even if they unite together cannot create the simplest of life.

Jesus created a BIRD from Clay exactly like Allah created Adam from clay.

WritterNg:
Bring proof of Putin saying it'll be a 3 weeks operation?

So, it was meant to be a three year special military operation!?


Wonders shall never end!