₦airaland Forum

rudedough: You lack the knowledge of who an Atheist is, you should get some help from the English dictionary friend. You rant too much without facts.

Some how, when i ask you question, have you notice you have no answers ?

If Herod was not an atheist, who did he worshiped ?

Ah! You will dodge!

What has he to do with killing young children ?

Keep dancing.

Keep denying to shield your master

rudedough: No need to sweat it out anymore. I have uploaded the full text of the story here, just interpret the bible text above you and tell us what vow the father fulfilled. Read the full story above you.

Thanks

The firstlings of the land of Israel is Yahweh's and it is given to him.(first fruit).

Including the first born sons of Israel.

Though all firstlings are given to Yahweh, when it comes to Humans, what happens ?

Were they sacrificed as stated or they will be redeemed since human was not accepted as sacrifice ? Yes, they were redeemed.

But a gift of a human son to Yahweh will have to be dedicated to Yahweh, hence they remained in the temple serving Yahweh.

That is what happened to the daughter of Jephther.

Project all you want, Yahweh does not accept Human sacrifice, if he does, it would have been written all over the bible.

You know quite well that Yahweh no dey fear face.

rudedough: [b]Your problem is you hoard too much emotional attachment to God that you have turned a blind eye to the truth. What was the bragging for? Did Satan ask him. "Have you considered my servant Satan"? Consider him for what? Was he looking for a job.

When Satan criticized he authorized Satan to do his worse just to proof his ego. Doesn't this God act childish sometimes? Put your servant to sufferings just to feed your ego. Would you blame a man that was challenge to this type of contest for "Doing the needful" to proof his criticism?

Satan was so bad and he's having a meeting with God. So the Devil knows where God lives and visits him at will and they have friendly conversations? They didn't tell us that in Church

Yes Satan is a Saint compared to God. If he wasn't challenged to do his worse to proof Job won't curse God, he wouldn't have. Satan only came to say Hello but your God was a proud bragging e-diot who cannot even protect the ones who have been good to him but give them up to his over bloated pride to suffer for no just reason.

Did God give Satan the instruction to do his worse to Job or not? If YES!! then who's to be blamed? Satan and God?

Now where did Satan kill, destroy and lie? Please show me in the bible. If you cannot show me these 3 things, then the joke is on you my friend.[/b]

Yeah! The children of Job commited sucides. , they were not killed.

When satan left, he went to bed to have a good night rest.

And, yes, Satan has no standard, yes, you heard me, he does not know who should be discipline and who should not.

And see, Yahweh told him so:

"And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause." (Job 2:3).
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Yeah! Satan has no standard, anthing goes. Even innocent people he strikes.

That you did not see that it was Satan that does the striking of Job's children to proved his points is your waterlooo.

And yes, satan continued having access to heaven until the messaiah came and went back, that was when Angel Michael sent him permanently out of heaven. See Revelation 7:12.

That tells you that Yahweh is never rash in his taking of decisions, he gave Satan all the oppurtunity to proved all his claims.

Very soon the bible says he will be removed from this earth and subsequently destroyed.

It is your mind that is preventing you from seeing satan for who he is.

We trust Yahweh, he does not lie, he says that satan is a destroyer and satan destroyed the family of Job, satan that is a liar does not deserved the trust of honest hearted people.

Since you dont trust Yahweh, you find it hard to accept the truth he is telling you.

But i absolutely trust him, hence, what he said was truth, not when he asked for permission to deal with the righteous man Job for no just cause.

Denie all you want, it wount change what is written about satan in the bible.

rudedough: Dude we are not stu.pid here so please stop taking us back and forth. If you want to write, write in context and present your facts straight up, there is no need to write many things at a time. Let's take it one at a time please.

On the bolded, all the little Children and unborn babies God killed in the bible, what were their crimes if God does not kill innocent people?

Now this discuss is going back and forth cos we have discussed this part earlier already.

Please explain to NLers what the sins of these Children were to be slayed by the sword.

You will readily agree that a son should inherit the wealth of his parent should they die, but what about the debt of the parent ?

Is it not what a father has that he bequeath his children ?

Why are children of Adam paying for the sin of Adam ?

If a father has genetical disease, is it a crime should the child inherit it ?

Well, the actions of the father affects the children, either for good or for bad.

Yahweh says that he is the one that visits the errors of parent to the sons and to the grand sons till the fouth generations, in the instance of those that hates him".

"Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;" (Exodus 20:5).
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Worshiping Satan and Satan worshipers that ^.

Yap! Thats ^ it .

That was what he says, and for a reason.

The children of the Amalekite were like their parent that attacked Israel unprovoked on their way to the promised land, they kept on attacking the nation of Israel over and over again, why the hatred ? You dont think it has anything to do with their god/Satan do you ?

Even into a foreign land > Haman that wanted to exterminate the Jews according to the book of Esther is an Amalekite.

However, Yahweh said he is the only one that should do this, that Judges in Israel should not visit the errors of the fathers to the sons, you can understand why he had to be the one that had asked for the seven men from the lineage of saul by himself.

The point is, sometime, the Hatred for Yahweh always have the Devil backing, and Yahweh always knows more.

Consider king Saul, a king that Yahweh appointed, he had the mind to disregard Yahweh and even visited a witch in Edor.

Was Saul's action with a clear eye ?

Such people that Jehovah takes up vengence on, he always knows more than we do.

Satan is very tricky

rudedough: Bro are you joking or you're serious with this nonsense. Has religion really made you this dumb that you don't think before you talk anymore? How did Satan through Herod kill children.

Mehn wahala dey ooo

Yeah! I forgot, Herod was a worshiper of Yahweh. Right!

No, Herod was an atheist. Yap!

Ok, he had wise men, they know about the Messaiah.

Yes, the men from the east were woshipers of Yahweh. No ?

I thought that it was only the Jews that Yahweh revealed himself to ?

Was it not a crime to get involed in astrology in Israel ? Yes it was, so, we can conclude that The astrologers(the 3 wise men from the east) were not from Yahweh, else they would not have mised the location of the son and went to meet Herod.

If Yahweh was guiding them, why will Yahweh send an Angel to warn them not to go back to herod ?

If Herod was not an atheist, who was he worshiping ?

If the 3 wise men were not sent by Yahweh, who sent them > satan ofcours!

The eastern people worship other gods.

This gods leading the 3 wisemen knew what Herod will do, and he did just that, but for Yahweh intervention, the enemy of the son(Jesus) would have gotten him kill.

That long time aim of Satan to kill the Messaiah, is what Yahweh has been ensuring to keep satan away from the nation of Israel for all along.

Had Satan had an inroad in Israel, how easy it would have been for Satan to get Jesus killed.

For you @Rudedough.

Keep on thinking you are wise, pride goes befor a fall.

Those that are not humble and can see all this reality in the world and still say "there is NO GOD", are the most proud people, for they over estimated their self intelligence > PRIDE

rudedough: [b]Read the bible with an open mind bro. There's no need to try to label the Devil as bad and evil, let the truth previal here.

Job was a man who sacrificed to God and hold feast every year for his Children.

Job 1:5-6
When a period of feasting had run its course, Job would make arrangements for them to be purified. Early in the morning he would sacrifice a burnt offering for each of them, thinking, “Perhaps my children have sinned and cursed God in their hearts.” This was Job’s regular custom. One day the angels came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them.

And God started bragging about his servant Job.

Job 1:8
Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”

And Satan said, "Na lie jor, because you don bless am, suffer never touch am, if suffer wipe him belle him go curse you, abeg leave that thing God"

Job 1:9-11
“Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. 10 “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. 11 But now stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse you to your face.”

God come proudly say oya go do your worse make we see.

Job 1:12
The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.”

So Satan put Job to the test under God's instructions.

Now tell me, how did Satan sin? No be God dey go brag? Dey go form one thing for where Satan dey. If na me i go do worse cos i must wan prove am wrong. So where did Satan sin here, please tell me.[/b]

Hehehehe, lol.(lauphing out loud).

This below made me laugh.

rudedough: If na me i go do worse cos i must wan prove am wrong.

Now, tell me, is it a crime for a father to be proud of what his ward/son does ?

Please, answer that ^ first.

The same thing Yahweh did with Jesus, celebrated him for standing up against his enemy satan.

See here:

"My son, be wise, and make my heart glad, that I may answer him that reproacheth me." (Proverbs 27:11).
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Well, Satan hatred for Yahweh is so large that he will swallow up anybody that stands on his way.

But when Yahweh takes appropriate measures to counter the threat posed by this Satan, you cry foul!

Well, some of us knows better.

"And Satan answered the LORD, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all what a man has will he give for his life. But put forth your hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh, and see if he will not curse you to your very face." (Job 2:4-5).
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Hehehehe, we know better, see what plans he satan have for you, are you not a man ?

He said if he tempts you, you will curse Yahweh, na lie ? Have you not ?
Well, not all of us wish to be like you.

BTW, i thought Satan was a saint ? He does no wrong ?

Keep deceiving yourself.

When Yahweh will deal with satan, be ready to stand up to defend him.

I wish you well in your endeavour and fight against Yahweh.

I also hope that Satan will reward you with enternal life.

Peace.

rudedough: Well, you have already given the classic answer before i even presented my facts.

So we are now properties of God and whenever he wants to kill us and we don't like it, it's unjust to God.

Alright, i give up.

Nope!

Though he owns all things, he is a God of justice.

Yahweh does not kill innocent people.

Read this below, that you dont know/understand what is happening does not mean he is a bad God.

The fact that he let and asked that all those be written down for us today is enough to inspire confidence in Yahweh, that he has nothing to hide.

His justice is so prominent that he will never abused it, all his ways are justice:

"Therefore hearken unto me, ye men of understanding: far be it from the true God, that he should do wickedness; and from the Almighty, that he should commit iniquity. For the work of a man shall he render unto him, and cause every man to find according to his ways. Yea, surely God will not do wickedly, neither will the Almighty pervert justice." (Job 34:10-12).
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Read that and understand the reason for my confidence.

Even Job that satan wanted to swallow up knew better later.

The principles of justice of Yahweh is so high that he does not bend them, hence, the angels can trust him absolutely, and Jesus can trust him absolutely.

That ^ cannot be said of satan that always operate in the dark and is always hidding his ways and intention.

All of satans agrement is in secrecy.

Peace

rudedough: You know people like you talk too much without facts. We know about God through the bible, so did we know about Jesus and Moses and Joseph and every character in the bible. We also learnt about SATAN / DEVIL / LUCIFER from the bible.

I am ignorant, agreed but just show me where SATAN / DEVIL / LUCIFER killed, lied or destroyed anything. Make me look stupid before Nairaland please.

"And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Does Job fear God for nothing ? Has not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land. But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy very face. And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD." (Job 1:8-12). (to do what ?)

to do this below ?

"And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them: And the Sabeans fell upon them, and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The fire of God is fallen from heaven, and hath burned up the sheep, and the servants, and consumed them; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother’s house: "And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only i escaped alone to tell thee." (Job 1:14-19).

^^^ yeah right ? Satan kills no one, but Yahweh knows better.

who do you think is responsible for all those ?

See who is behind all those death and destructions:

"And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life. So went Satan forth from the presence of the LORD, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown." (Job 2:6-7).
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What an innocent Satan!

But for the fact that Yahweh had ask him not to kill Job, what do you think he would have done ? Smh.

The most disgusting character i have ever heard about is Satan himself, is that the way to talk to ones creator ? :

"But put forth thine hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh, and see if he will not curse you to thy very face." (Job 2:5).
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Keep deluding yourself and let satan play on you as a pun while you keep deluding yourself that you are in control.

The person in an effort to turn Job against Yahweh had to kill all his children and his lives stock and all his properties, he destroyed, even went ahead to strick him with a terrible sickness all to make him turn against Yahweh. smh. You are here praising because your ignorance is not letting you to see it.

In an effort to get the massaiah kill when he was born, satan through Herod got all children of two years and above killed in Judeah and you cant see it since he is a saint.

Your own case is a finish case in his pocket.

He is definitely the ruler of this world and we can see how well his rulership is.

rudedough: I gave you 2 (two) instances of God demanding and accepting human sacrifices, why are you emphasizing on this one and ignoring the other? Is the other a revenge too or justice?

OK let's take it that the later was for revenge, justice right...? I hope if i produce more evidence, you won't go around the tangent and tell me the classic "God gives life and he has a right to kill anytime he is blood thirsty" excuse. Please promise me this one last thing and i shall provide 3 innocent sacrifices offered to God as a lasting evidence to his human sacrifices.

All i need right now is your promise that you wont say "God gives life and he has a right to kill anytime he is blood thirsty". Once i have your word, i shall present it. Be a honorable man.

What kind of conditional debate is this sef ?

I dont need to promised you anything, but rether, i promised to show you what the reasons are for Yahweh's actions.

If you are ask not to do with your property the way you wish, will you be happy ? Is it just ?

There is no such thing like Yahweh killing people for their blood, no such thing.

He owns the life and lacks nothing.

He accepted blood sacrifices(animals) from the Jews to show them that they are unclean and needed forgiveness of sin so that they can relate with what the Messaiah will later do.

But for such examples, we will not have come to know the significance of sin and forgiveness of sin from Yahweh to be in good relationship with him

rudedough: I don't know where you got your statistics from but I am not sure Okija has killed 25 Million people.

If you compare God and Okija, I am afraid Okija will look like a saint. Even the Devil did not kill a single person, he didn't destroy anything even a glass cup, he didn't lie anywhere according to the bible.

Now you get to wonder why Christians lie that the Devil kills, lies, destroys etc. Accusing the Devil falsely of the crimes their God committed.

If you know anywhere where the Devil Killed, lied, or destroyed anything please show me in the bible.

Is the bible the life history of satan ?

Your answer please.

If you dont answer, then you are exposing your ignorance.

You see satan that accuses innocent people and killed them all the time and you come here to expose ignorance.

Even though the bible is not the biography of Satan, i can show you his actions and his mind set, hence the wise at heart knows what to do, but you ? No!

You dont know, you are asking someone to "show you where satan killed one person even one".

rudedough: If you know anywhere where the Devil(Satan) Killed, lied, or destroyed anything please show me in the bible. [/size][/b]

^^^
I laugh at your ignorance and such ignorance.

Just ask me to show you and expose that your glaring ignorance.

When i say you and your kind are ignorance, you think am lying, just ask me.

rudedough: How has what you wrote disproved that God accepts "LIFE" human sacrifices? Whether they killed Gibeonites or not, God accepted 7 "LIFE" human sacrifices before he stopped the famine.

2 Samuel 21:6
Let seven of his male descendants be given to us to be killed and their bodies exposed before the Lord at Gibeah of Saul—the Lord’s chosen one.” and verse 14 says ...After that, God ended the famine in the land.

Where is the lie i told now? Ehh which kind wahala be this self.. Even when evidence full plate dey throw way my Christian brother still dey say i dey lie.

"Then there was a famine in the days of David three years, year after year; and David enquired of the LORD. And the LORD answered, It is for Saul, and for his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites." (2 Samuel 21:1).
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The reasons for that was given, so, what else doe you want ?

Tell yourself whatever you want to hear, abi ? its your life!

Will Yahweh have ask for the seven people to be killed if saul has not commited the crime of killing the Gibeonites ?

If you understand the principle of blood for blood and life for life, you would not be here dancing.

Yahweh does not bend his standard of justice, if Saul killed people, Yahweh will ask that vengance be taken, of, "life for life".

Since saul was a king and hence his family is of the Royal family and no one else will or can take vengence for the killing that Saul killed innocent people, how do you want Yahweh's standard of justice be met ?

You are just not having the capacity to understand what we are talking about, do you ?

Even those that were kill all this while including Abel, the bible says that their blood cries out to him for justice, what do you say about that and what do you think that Yahweh should do ?

Yahweh was angry that murder was done and not just any sin, and the standard was blood for blood and soul for soul and it was meeting this devine standard of justice that can satisfy his standard, he did the needful and not that he was in need of blood.

He needed to see that justice was satisfied and he let them know what to do.

He need not let individual take laws into their hands as not to call for vengance from others, as such, he asked them to present this people to him so that all Israel will know it was Yahweh that is calling for this retribution.

Even this below, Yahweh will still take action:

"And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?" (Revelation 6:9-10).
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When Yahweh demands for that ^ you will cry foul and say that he accept human sacrifices. Smh for ignorance.

He is the universal soverign, he is the giver of life and all life belongs to him, he is the owner of all power and as such does whatever he wants and wishes, he does not need blood to have power but rather, he avanges injustices.

You better watch you life, cause, you dont even know what you are saying.

He is the rightful avanger of the innocent and can take any life that defaults.

He is too holy to act unjustly, his justice is so strong that it permeates all he does.

That you could not understand that ^ is your folly and not mine.

Peace.

^^^

How can you take someone posting without scriptural references seriously ?

Is christianity lawlessness ?

"Not every one that say unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father who is in heaven. " (Matthew 7:21).
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That ^ is plain enough for any honest hearted person to see.

rudedough: [b] Of course, your God accepts "LIFE" human sacrifices.

** Here God is sending his servants to attack an innocent city, kill everyone in it and sacrifice their bodies to him as burnt offering.

Deuteronomy 13:15-18
15 You must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. 16 Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the open square and burn it. Burn the entire town as a burnt offering to the Lord your God

The Lord your God will be merciful only if you listen to his voice and keep all his commands that I am giving you today, doing what pleases him.

** And here again they are appeasing the Lord with 7 "LIFE" human sacrifices.

2 Samuel 21:1-14
There was a famine during David’s reign that lasted for three years, so David asked the Lord about it..... Let seven of his male descendants be given to us to be killed and their bodies exposed before the Lord at Gibeah of Saul—the Lord’s chosen one.”

...He handed them over to the Gibeonites, who killed them and exposed their bodies on a hill before the Lord. All seven of them died together; they were put to death during the first days of the harvest, just as the barley harvest was beginning.

...After that, God ended the famine in the land.

If you want more "LIFE" human sacrifice just type YES!!! and i will make your acquaintance. I am at your service tonight. [/b]

Even in my post above, i had addressed that ^.

If you want to have a rational discussion, you need to state the back ground context to make sense of what happend.

Those people presented are from one family, and there is a reason why they have to be let to die on the mountain.

Even saul consulted a spirit meduim against Yahwehs command.

That you lack comprehension is the reason for your bankruptcy:

"Then there was a famine in the days of David three years, year after year; and David enquired of the LORD. And the LORD answered, It is for Saul, and for his bloody house, because he slew the Gibeonites." (2 Samuel 21:1).
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Simple call for justice.

Yahweh is a God of justice.

Keep feeding whatever you are feeding.

Are atheist dishonest lots ?

Well, the bible says so, clear any iota of doubt there is.

rudedough: Just say ordinary YES and i will show you not 1, not 2, not 3 but many. Just tell me how many you want.

Why should i tell you yes for what i know does not exist ?

If yes will make you happy, then yes!

Just know that what we are talking about is a matter of life.

Peace.

rudedough: @truthislight I see you're still filled in the spirit. Do you want more proof of God demanding and accepting human sacrifices? Just say YES and i will make your acquaintance.

There is nothing like that in the bible my friend.

Bye.

[quote author=frank3.16]Lol, i recAll reading where u were screaming and shouting that no one wantS to respond to u, i am really surprisd To see u write this[/quote]Hehehehe.

But Seriousely, do you want me to show you how the Jews offer to Jehovah persons as their vow?

Smh for this Elementary instances.

You guys allowed speculations to confusef you really ?

Why not read on how Sammuel was offered to Yahweh to know more if you wish to learn ?

Or that Jephter's daughter received visit years later ?

Are you not aware that to Yahweh all Israels first born belongs ? Why did he not used them for sacrifices ?

Keep feeding whatever you are feeding then.

I have done this ones too offten that it has lost appeal here.

Look for a better instance if any.

Not when Yahwehgave Abraham Ram insteam of isaac even though it went in detail to set a precedence as to who Yahweh is.

But you lot will grasp at straws at all times.

rudedough: Just like Drummerboy who came full of the spirit chickened out, you also have Chickened out.

You didn't even address the part where Jesus was ready to show some love to his Jewish brothers. Anyway i just want to advice you to leave the bondage of religion and experience peace.

Now do we have anymore Christian in the house who hold any grudges? Make your grudge known now or forever remain silent.

Hehehe. Funny dude.

Thank Drummer boy later.

Sorry!

If this is what you have to remain what you are, i wish you well in your endeavour.

Carry go!

But when you have a genuine quest, we will know.

Jephters quest and his daughters dedication is too low to necessitate a banter.

Peace.

rudedough: [b]@truthislight Since Drummerboy has given me the "Carry go" to convert one more Christian to Atheism, let us look at your reference to Abraham's son Isaac.

We all know the Abraham story and "it was all a test" excuses, nothing serious at all. But was Jephthah daughter "a test" too?

Judges 11:29-40

Then the Spirit of the Lord came on Jephthah.... And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord: “If you give the Ammonites into my hands, 31 whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me when I return in triumph from the Ammonites will be the Lord’s, and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering.”

Then Jephthah went over to fight the Ammonites, and the Lord gave them into his hands.....

When Jephthah returned to his home in Mizpah, who should come out to meet him but his daughter, dancing to the sound of timbrels! She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter. 35 When he saw her, he tore his clothes and cried, “Oh no, my daughter! You have brought me down and I am devastated. I have made a vow to the Lord that I cannot break.”

... After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed. And she died a virgin.

This was a test too right? I see it is all but "a test".

"whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me... I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering."

Does this sound like Jephthah was expecting a cow to come out of his house? He was probably expecting one of his wives to come out 1st to greet him.

"She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter"

This part means that just like Isaac, Jephthah daughter was his only child and a little girl. Why didn't God reject the burnt offering and provide a goat like he did for Isaac? Oh no "that was just a test".

"and he did to her as he had vowed"

Meaning he sacrificed his daughter as a burnt offering. Mehn!!! I can't even imagine. You all Christians are sick in the head.[/b]

rudedough: @Drummerboy you opened this thread so I am inviting you to discuss about God with your Christian brother. I think he is confusing the human sacrifices I was talking about with Jesus's death and Abraham's son Isaac.

Please save your Christian brother before I take him through the path of truth and you end up loosing one more Christian brother.

Drummerboy please ask your Christian brother to stop writing else I take him on the journey of truth through his bible. I beg you, tell him to shut the hell up for peace to reign on this thread.

One more quote and I won't stop until he gives up on religion.

Hehehehehe funny dude.

Your limitation is not a general disease.

This are your opinion. No ?

But you will insist even if you were shown the truth.

rudedough: [b]You can lie to yourself all you want

you can say that again.

You are the honest person, but we know better.

rudedough: but that does not change the fact that your God accepts human sacrifices and kill innocent people.

What do you call Him ? God! Did you see him tie up his son and shot him ? No.
But he takes the outcome of what happend to his son as the sacrifice needed to reconcile man.

I wander why he was accepting animals from the Jews and not humans, i wander why he did not accept Abrahams son Iseec for a sacrifice but rather gave him a Ram instead. Can you please tell me why ? Please do, am waiting.

Ok, if you have the power to replace my car and am aware, then you asked me to risk mine for a usefull course, what do you think i will do ? You guess right, risk it i will!
Why not ?

If you are Jesus christ and your dad said you should go and set a perfect example to all men to follow and prove satan's accusations a lie even till death, what will you do since you know your dad has the power to bring you back to life ?

Well, you are not Jesus christ, maybe you will have refused.

Yahweh knew that Jesus mission will lead to death, but still, he sent him, was that not a sacrifice ?

rudedough: It doesn't change the fact that your God prefers ra.pe to fornication and adultery.

Hehehe. You are funny dude. You lost me there ^.

rudedough: And Jesus is not any better as he's as immoral and violent as his father.

evidence please.

rudedough: Forget about those cheap excuses of the law and grace and what not.

but that is true! Yahweh is not dealing with humans on those terms anymore.

Yahweh now considers what Jesus went through in dealing with humans.

Did the Jews prayed "in Jesus name" ? No.

That ^ changes every thing.
Not too long, someone will show you that we are in a new covenant. True!

rudedough: He came not to abolish the law but to fulfil it.

which he did, the law was made to lead to the messaiah, the promised one.

Hevent fulfile what the law was put in place for, why do you have to ignore Jesus for ?

Did you not hear him say "i am giving you a new commandment" ? Yes he did.
The law served it purpose.

If animal sacrifice was used for forgiveness of sin in the OT, keeping the Jews clean to welcome the messaiah in their midst, do you still have to do animal sacrifices again today ? No naw! So, what are you saying ?

Which of the 613 laws do you think is not captured on the two new laws of love ?

If i love my neigbour, will i steal his property ? No.
If i love Yahweh, will i worship other gods ? No.

So, why do you still need the 613 laws for ?
They are all captured in the two new laws.

rudedough: If there is anywhere he said he came to abolish the law please show me.

He said the "law is fulfiled" on his first sermon in the temple. And see ^ above.

rudedough: Have a nice time worshipping your God.

Thanks a million for that ^.
But for Yahweh, i will have stabed myself all over with many pains due to wrong decissions.

But thanks to him, i have a 100% safe proof laws to guide me in this corrupted world today.

rudedough: the day he gets bored he will ask Drummerboy to strike you with the sword and sacrifice you on the alter.

Naaaa! He wont.

The Angels that have been living with him all this while, he did not destroy them, even when they disobeyed.

He did not even destroyed satan instanter in Eden, but gave him time to proof that his suggestions and accusations where true, which they are not, going by what we are experiencing today.

And drummer boy knows that Yahweh will not do such.

rudedough: That's what he did to a Priest that didn't do anything wrong.

He did the same thing to another Priest that tried to help balanced the ark from tripping. A good samaritan. Yeah!! That's how insane your God is.

Yahweh is not human, he demands exclusive devotion, thats the least he can ask from us.
The laws were clare on who should carry the ack.

Adams disobedience brought us a lot of problems, that show you that Yahweh is taking actions to correct what Adam did by such action and example.

rudedough: Read your bible son, read your bible. [/b]

I really do enjoy doing that, please do join me.

Peace.

rudedough: Christians listen to your fellow Christian brother. He still thinks God does not accept human sacrifice. He thinks Jesus was the human sacrifice I was talking about.

Please don't waste your time with this man, this type is ready to print out your picture from your profile and be ready to strike you when he meets you personally.

Abeg make I kukuma stay my own jeje before person go do me the thing wey God command "Stone all unbelievers to death"

Deuteronomy 17:2-5

If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the Lord gives you is found ... worshipped other gods,....If it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death.

Hmmmmm what a loving God!!...

Hehehehe. All is well with you with a good sense of humour.

However, the action you quoted from the scripture you quoted will not be necessary since the reason for such a law has come and hence gave us a new law > "love of neighbour and love of God".

Not taking note of the pivotal part the messaiah plays is why the moslems still kill today for the sake of such scriptures.

However, since such scripture was put in place to protect the nation of Israel from Satan and his demons while the plans was on going, it has served it purpose and hence i dont have to disobey Jesus christ to attempt killing my fellow human for whatever reason, but to turn the other chick.

Anyway, its been good talking to you.

Though i am very much aware of the damage that has been done in the name of God, i do stand to say that the purpose of the bible is a very seriouse matter that any honest hearted persons should do well to investigate.

Yahweh took hard measures because that was what was needed to overcome the enemy and send the messaiah.

Again, people should not let themselves be exploited in the name of religion-"christianity", shine your eyes cause the bible does not support such.

So long friend, its been great talking to you, have a nice day till we meet some other time.

Peace.

highyo: we are created in God's image, and were given a special breath by an imortal God, and his breath gave us Imortal soul. If God cannot die, then our soul can not die. Your body will surely go back to the dust where it came from but your soul, the real you will go back to God to give account what you have done with your earthly body.

Please, to avoid going up and down, can you verify what you have there to say with scriptures please, then and only then can i know what you have in mind.

Peace.

frosbel: Are you a religious clone or a follower of Jesus.

A religious clone, walks, talks and acts like their spiritual leader or father , while a follower of Jesus walks , talks and acts like Jesus.

So which one are you ? Clone or follower of Jesus ?

A clone is a replica of the leader of a sect or church or cult and repeats everything the leader believes, cherishes, talks, does etc without any deviation. A clone does not have any individuality or ability to think outside the group. A clone does as told and cannot operate independently either in thought or action from the leader.

A follower of Jesus is a believer who is becoming more and more conformed to his image in righteousness and holiness with the sole objective of pleasing God and carrying out this will. A follower is not a clone because its individuality is preserved , it can operate independently from a person or group especially those who have left the way to walk on a strange highway. A follower is alert , sober and reflective on the great truths of God.

A clone puts its trust in a MAN but a follower puts its trust in Jesus.

A clone will abuse , fight and slander anyone who hates its leader or group while a follower of Jesus will forgive, love and pray for anyone who hates Jesus.

A clone is protective of its own group and will not share with other cloned groups, a follower of Jesus will share with anyone who names the name of Jesus in truth and deed.

A clone will only marry from its group, a follower of Jesus will marry anyone who is a proven and true believer in Jesus.


We have many clones in Nigeria, Kumuiyi clones, Adeboye clones, Oyedepo clones, Chris Oyakilome clones.

Tell me where are the followers of Jesus ?

"This is what the LORD says: "Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who draws strength from mere flesh and whose heart turns away from the LORD." - Jeremiah 17:5

Hehehehe. Lol @ "clones".

frosbel, you no go kill me for NL. Lol.

Why is this interesting thread getting so silent ?

Today is a public holiday, so, time is not a problem, can an atheist come up and proof those my lies and post the truth.

And i await the main character of this thread to come and show that what i have posted above are not the msgs.

If anyone has this opportunity and keeps silent, may he keeps silent forever.

Please, i await such a man that will show that what i have posted is not the bible msg or, someone that will post the right msg that shows Yahweh to be what he is being accussed of.

Am in a public forum and am asking for it openly.

Dont just make noise an run along.

Peace.

Mr Troll: So when exactly did the old testament start?

Pls truthislight ignore the question.

Who cares!

As long as lies are kept far from the bible

Is it NL that turned you to Atheism ?

rudedough: truthislight must be new here. He doesn't know that his God demands and accepts human sacrifices

He still thinks God kills only people who commit sins. By the time we take you through the journey of truth, you go relax.

If you are talking about Jesus, say so, dont use that to threaten people.

Jesus death was fortold that his faithfullness to the end will be a scrifice to God and a reason/answer to satan, that will make God consider his effort and reconsider what our parent did under the taotulage of satan.

The action of Jesus life and his shade blood open up the way to Yahweh to all men.

Jesus faithfulness gives an answer to all of Satan's accusations against Yahweh, that humans will not love Yahwah without selfish gains expecially if their lives was at stake.(read the book of Job and see what satan told Yahweh).

Sacrifice goes as a ransom, what is used to buy back or change a situation without twisting or banding Justice > Yahweh is a God of justice and his justice dictactes his actions with intelligent creatures.

Blood for blood, life for life, what Adam lost was a perfect life and what exchanged to change the sentens of death on Adam's children was equivalent to what was lost by Adam. No injustice with Yahweh, and not when he had the power to restore any life. But his justice must hold and sets a precedent that should never be repeated by disobedience.

Even, on a situation that Yahweh was angry due to the actions of the household of Saul, Yahweh also specify that to correct the situation, the people have to be presented to him, not just any person, but the specific people concern, all of them and not from another house hold.

Precedent sets in the bible was to averts repeating certain ills, hence, death is almost always the sentence for defiance as to keep this nation clean and ready to welcome the promise messaiah that was the reason for the Existance of the nation of Israel at the first place.

Yahweh build the nation of Israel in the bible for the sole purpose of bringing forth the messaiah, and any contrary action to that end was instant dealth to removed obstacles on the set objectives.

The bible is not a text book to explain the life history of Satan or to explain the way satan dealth with other nations that have been worshiping him in the absence/seperation from Yahweh in Eden, but rather, a book to explain the process of the reconciliation of man back to Yahweh via the Messaiah, and we know the cause of the problem in the first place.

Satan is only mentioned in passing in the bible some of the times that his action to destroy this plans for the messaiah is considered.

But Yahweh knows and says that the rest nations except the Nation of Israel worshiped satan directly and indirectly, hence, Yahweh had to warn the nation of Israel not to get involved with any other nation and share with them in their worship, so as not to give room to satan into the Nation of Israel, that he will have access to the coming Messaiahs plans taking place there.

Along that ^ line, Yahweh had to build the nation of Israel devoid of the traditions of other nations, he sent the nation of Israel to grow in the land of Egypt, in a condition they cannot assimillate the traditions of Egypt > 'slavery'.
And the traditions of other nations that was influence by the anemy of Yahweh.

When this slaves had became populous and many in numbers, he took them under this state/condition devoid of tradition of men to the promised land, and on the way, gave them all the 613 laws and.

Do you think those slaves had the capacity to developed those laws for themselves under that conditions in the wilderness ? Laws they could not keep ? Your answer pls.

This ^ arrangement by Yahweh ensured that the sons of Israel was a unique nation, absolutely different from every other nation dwelling upon the sufface of the earth, hence, any contermination was cutoff.

Meanwhile, all other nations under the influence of satan hated them, that explains why the Nation of Amalekite will attacked the innocent harmless slaves from Egypt on their way to the promised land, by the dictate of their God(unless the Amalekites had no god, but Egypt does).

It was Yahweh that has the ability to directly see and know the plans of satan and the effort he puts in to thwart the coming of the Messaiah, who he satan knew will destroy him at the end.

I think i am not in the best position to asses Yahweh and pass sentens on him owing to my limitations, since there are more than meets the eyes.

But since you say you know better, i beckon on you to come foward and educate me.

Thank you.

rudedough: Bro leave that guy alone. If you read what he has been written, even without any diagnosis, you would know he takes hard drugs.

You better use your time to play SimCity 4 like I am doing right now than waste it on a crackhead.

Hehehehe.

I hope the main character is not going the same way like the praise singer ?

Dont go down on me now!

Come and tell Yahweh what he does not know the all wise one.

We await your respons please.

rationalmind: Are you alright? I challenge you to back up your claim that I copied and pasted. What is wrong with you?

I stopped reading your message at the bolded. When you provide evidence that I actually copied and pasted, we will proceed from there.

Bunch of liars

So long now! Run along now.

It is good that we dont decend too low.

We await the main character of this thread since the praise singers have decided to leave.

Peace though.

rudedough: Pastor I quoted the verses there, why don't you just read it yourself. Which kind wahala be this ni tori olohun.

Error! Am not a pastor and never will be, going by who a pastor is today, though i preach the bible.

That ^ been said, i proceed.

My friend, i thought i did read those verses myself also, but did not arrived at the same conclusion like you did, hence, since you are of the opinion that you know what i/we dont know, i implore you to do the needful and either show what has been asked for.

Most of the story in the bible are as a result of some other incidence that led to warning and prophesy to that end and the possible consequences given, so that the sons of Israel will never say that he was not warned.

Just like the bible warn about furnication and someone went ahead to commit furnication and picks up HIV, instead of bleming himself, he says that God is punishing him, how true is that ?

The reason for the warning/prophesy is to prevent such outcome:

"If you abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: if you carefully keep yourselves from this things, you will proper.Good health to you." (Acts 15:29).
........................

From that ^, the part on red is the way i see the reason/law on funication, but then, someone can say that the bible is restricting his freedom on se.x and so on, well, there is freedom of speach and freedom of action.

So, what people read out of the bible most times is a function of their mind condition.

If my son beliefs that i am more experience than him and that i did not kill him when he was an infant and vulnerable, he will not abandon my house and ran away when i discipline him unless he has come to the conclusion that i have a mental problem.

If someone beliefs that Yahweh can forsee the Future and that there is an enemy that he sometimes takes proactive actions to twart the actions and plans of this enemy and someone that cant see from his nose or the next hour in front is judging him, i say, weldone to such a person.

A man puts his hands(with a gun) through my window and i the father of the house saw this hand and heat it with an object, but my son on getting up runs away that i am wicked, what will i say then ? That my son is right cause his limitation and being devoid of all the facts makes his ignorant reaction right ? No.

We have so many instances of such ignorant actions in the bible, like Abraham bagaining that there should be over 50 righteouse people in Sodom and the reality of him that sees the future and have the facts says otherwise.

So, please, do the needful, educate us.

Thankyou.

Peace.

rationalmind: This is pathetic. I'm not here to defend rudedoughs arguments. He should defend arguments he raised. I'm here to state my own arguments and if you have no answers, quietly walk away and stop saying its nonsense.

Ooh sharrap!

You have been dancing all along and as such, the least you can do is stand up for it...

It is not just to copy and pest but to give the full gist of what led to it.

I will explain and also give an example.

One mr Dehomer will post that Yahweh commanded that infants should be killed and also pregnant women etc, but he ignores that Yahweh Justice demanded that the Amalekites be payed in their own coins just as the Amalekites had done to the sons of Israel at Nephidim. Killing innocent sons of Israel unprovoked on their way out of Egypt.

That someone is devoid of justice or Ignorant of the facts does not make his accussations right.

So, you now, if you are to post an incidence, be ready to present the full story and if you ignore or are ignorant of certain facts and went ahead to post incomplete imformation, since you are here not to learn but to accused, i will tell you your life history(no offence, i will), so that you will learn how not to peddle lies.

So, my friend, you are welcome to tell Yahweh what he does not know.

For all those statement, you will also give the full bible story on how things got to that point in time and answer some other questions.

Since you have decided to use the bible to proof that Yahweh is wicked, you will also realistically consider the incidence from the start of the book so that we get the whole picture.

1. What was the Origine of things and what parties were involved and how did it turn out ?

2. What were their interest and positions on things.

3. What was Yahweh's reaction and what did Yahweh do ?

4. Who are the nation of Israel and how did they come to be and on what basis/purposed ?

5. Why did Yahweh build the nation of Israel and what was the target of Yahweh and what/who stands against those objectives of Yahweh from being realised according to the bible ?

6. Who was the God every other Nation On earth worshiped except Israel and why was it sow ? Does the bible say that every nation have their own God ?

7. when did it becomes possible that other nations beside Israel came to know Yahweh ?

8. The king in the Bible that offered up his first born son in an alter during a battle, was it to Yahweh or another God of his Nation ?
Why do you arrive at your conclussion ?

9. Is there evidence in the bible that Yahweh can fortell the future and how does that affact what is recorded in the bible ? (prophesy).

10. If you have a property that is not serving your purpose, are you justified in doing with it as you chosed ?
Is it good if someone is to stop you from destroying your property if you have decided to do so ?

Please, this simple questions for you my learned teacher is aim at doing justice to the discussion since the bible is the issue here and Yahweh is on trial by you, so, justice demand that you leave no stone untouched as to ensure that the truth and nothing but the trusth is arrive at. > facts should be the hallmark.

Emotions blinds one to reality, hence, appeal to it is sentimental

rationalmind: Lol, like how Achan committed an offence only for his wife and children to be killed with him.

The precedence: God had decreed whoever committed such offence will have to die and all his properties confiscated.

You people are jokers. How you manage to read such verses without cringing and burying your head in shame is beyond me.

When does a wife start becoming the property of the husband? And how about the children?

How about the rationality in killing someone for the offence of another.

How about you being killed for the offence of your father?

Let me guess you peoples answer.

1.I'm mere human, I can't question the ways of God.

2.It wasn't the dispensation of grace

3.I don't understand the bible

4.Its an allegory

5.Wives are truly properties of their husbands

One word for you people, JOKERS

Now, you are testing my petience with that nonsense up there.

Someone posted scriptures with sword and blood and said that Yahweh is blood testy, and we say no props.

Am asking that the reasons for those statement attributed to Yahweh be posted full so that we can all learn, if you dont, it is then either Yahweh have a mental problem for making those statements without a reason or the is something wrong with another person somewhere.

That you posted that rubbish up there that does not address what was being discuss is testing my patience.

Please do.

For every blood on sword posted, there should be a background consquence to it, befor and after, we need them ASAP.

Peace.