₦airaland Forum

Dalamama:
When humans were primitive and barbaric and engaged in things like owing and selling themselves into slavery, Yahweh was there with them giving them instructions on how to do it. In fact when they actually believed that stoning to death their disobedient children was the right thing to do, Yahweh was also there giving them instructions on how to stone their disobedient children to death.

Can you give me an example of a parent stoning his child to death in the Bible

Also, slavery was economical, cultural and ethical in ancient times.

Checkmate

superhumanist:
The Bible clearly said that slaves are the property of their masters.

The Bible allows beating of the slaves except when he beating leads to death.

The Bible has never been human to normal people not to talk of slaves. Prostitutes and blasphemers were stoned to death. How well would a slave be treated in the Bible.

When people sold themselves as slaves, of course they were properties.

Beating a slave was punishable by death, I proved that in my last thread.

The bible has been human to billions of people and has been the baseline for most Democratic foundations. The bible records prostitutes being stoned to death and still records Jesus (the focal point of christianiry) standing against religious zealots who were ready to stone a prostitute.

superhumanist:
You explained nothing.

You only claimed that there is good slavery in the bible. How silly

I explained everything perfectly.

Slavery is as old as humanity, people sold themselves into different forms of servitude due to financial reasons, criminals who otherwise should have gotten the death penalty were also forced into servitude. The bible gave human and legal conditions protecting such persons.

This is not similar to the transatlantic slave trade. No matter what you say, history is on our side .

superhumanist:
there is slavery in the bible whether you like it or not

Actually I like it, and I explained it effectively in my previous thread

Martinez19:
I repeat, all RELIGIOUS gods don't exist.

Proof?

Abi the burden of proof is on me again

Martinez19:
All religious gods don't exist and all the Holy books are bunks.

Okay, your own is that God does not exist, not that you lack a belief? issokay

Let's wait for Dalaman, Ranchhoddas, cutemadridsta, superhumanist and other non-deluded, scientific, logical, rational humans to tell us their own version of truth

Martinez19:
This is not good news. I thought our species should have started seeing the truth. Oga o.

What is the truth?



Dalaman, Ranchhoddas, cutemadridsta, superhumanist and other non-deluded, scientific, logical, rational humans...come tell us the truth

superhumanist:
It is called the gish gallop.

The Gish Gallop (also known as proof by verbosity[1]) is the fallacious debate tactic of drowning your opponent in a flood of individually-weak arguments in order to prevent rebuttal of the whole argument collection without great effort. The Gish Gallop is a belt-fed version of the on the spot fallacy, as it's unreasonable for anyone to have a well-composed answer immediately available to every argument present in the Gallop

E be like say you just hear this one.

bobowaja:
Smiles..... Now he is shifting. How possibly is it that you left out the part I said "most of them if not all" were compelled to the church? Can't you just read it up? I am not the one that wrote it (it is an historical fact).

What do you mean compelled to the church?

bobowaja:
I already gave an hint to what went down during the medieval period (go and read up). Most of the scientists were compelled to church and their researches must conform with church teachings before such is made public (something Galileo decided not to do because church will go against it). As at then church said the earth is flat and Galileo sees it otherwise. And he decided to make it public knowing fully well what the church can do (he was even warned by his close pals in the church hierarchy but he declined and was punished for it.

Go read bro

And for the records, Albert Einstein was not a Christian. He is a known agnostic. Neither here or there.

Galileo was a Christian dude. Other Christians who opposed Catholic views were also murdered.

bobowaja:
Shouting something and pasting pictures up and down cannot and will never affirm your claims. I have seen several of your posts, and fallacies is all they are. Jam packing and cherry picking is all you do.

I didn't claim anything.

The rest is your headache

bobowaja:
First and foremost what I meant by *most* in that context is those of us that went out of religious dogmas in our adulthood.

And secondly, you jam-packed scientists in the wagon of religion which is a fallacy on its own. Just as I can not say all scientist are atheist.

And lastly go and read history on the church and illuminaties during the dark and medieval ages. How scientists and church fought for dominance among the populace and how religion killed most of them or better still confine them till death (a case of gallileo).

I don't need to tell you that most of these renowned scientists came out under the umbrella of religion to save their own soul or to gather more likes and recognition just as a case of any greed atheist pope or pastor.

Galileo was a christian who was killed alongside other Christians by the catholic church. The catholic church killed Christians for reading from the bible rather than officially sanctioned roman catholic documents. Christians were also killed for opposing the catholic views on reality.


The scientists were not under the umbrella of religion, they were in fact religious.
Many christian scientists for instance were strong opponents of Darwinism (Newton, Agassiz, Pasteur, Lord Kelvin, Maxwell, Dawson, Virchow, Fabre, Fleming, etc.). Even those who lived before Darwin were strong opponents of earlier evolutionary systems, not to mention pantheism, atheism, and other such anti-supernaturalist philosophies, which were every bit as prevalent then as now.

The rest of your quote does not deserve a reply.

According to dalaman, superhumanist, cutemadridsta, frank317, Ranchhoddas etc, the scientists below are gullible, deluded, unscientific, illogical, irrational idiots.

The true scientists are and must be atheists


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469189_s13922213edit_pnga4e088555ca2a4fa0a0d30b455a4d3ff


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469190_s2477215edit_png7c5b9dbf27348f971ae8d89ba9610f74


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469194_s24767216edit_pngb37a004fd7df7925c6133e84609aabb2


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469195_s1511217edit_pngaac901122239c82f849e33053115aefd


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469281_athdei4_jpeg1054caf670ee07194a88ddeb43d6ce40


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469280_s950212edit_png95829bf9b148581556659c6cdc158e1f






Christians like me, prefer to step back and allow history to speak for itself.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/3469325_is_jpeg287d846c7e7e0032e95510b98432c51e

bobowaja:
I have read his story and that little boy will still end up like him just as others before him. Religion blocks foresight whenever God is mentioned.

How about these ones, what happened to them?

https://www.nairaland.com/2975009/christianity-reason-science


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3984109_119547188992702668083418614968478431285065n_jpeg230c5a16e26a432657700e09a942751c

Dalamama:
So God exist and you are the one telling people about it abi? Well done.

Dalamama

I didn't mention anything about God.

OLAADEGBU:
What will you say about the Nobel prize-winning physicist below says that he "believes in God more because of science than in spite of it."

This is the language of superhumanist and cutemadridsta. I recall them saying Christians ended slavery inspire of Christianity instead of because of Christianity.

Also according to an atheist that man whose picture you got there is not a scientist, but a silly deluded fellow. He's does not possess the same cognitive capacity like the brightest of minds such as dalaman.

superhumanist:
You have started being silly again. How can you say that all atheists are the same? Are all theists the same? Are all theists christians? Are all atheists like Chairman MAO Zedong? Why do you just want to be ignorant?

No need to call me names, I wonder why you are angry.
All atheists are not like Mao ze dong but 95% of atheists who have found their way to political power ended up like Mao ze dong. You're calling me names just because a thread hurts you, I'm sure of you find your way to the presidency of Nigeria, you will be like Mao ze dong.

superhumanist:
Oga, morality is a function of both logic and empathy. Both are needed for balance. Logic is true but cold and calculating while empathy balances the cold side of logic with love.

This is still just words, no proof.

It is logically right to kill a baby with down syndrome but morally wrong. I can logically rob an old lady of 10 million naira if I'm sure I'll get away with it.

Empathy is simply a construct of humanity according to most atheists. If you claim that empathy isbinnate, they it mean you're admitting that humans are not just most bone bags dancing to the tune of their DNA.

superhumanist:
To illustrate this and also show why religion and god are useless when it comes to morality, I have an example for you-

WHY IS IT WRONG TO RA.PE A LADY?

1. BECAUSE IT WILL HURT HER PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY
2. BECAUSE THE BIBLE SAYS RAPE IS BAD
3. BECAUSE YAHWEH DOES NOT LIKE IT
4. RAPE IS NOT WRONG. MORALITY IS AN ILLUSION



THE CLEAR ANSWER IS NUMBER 1. YOU WOULD EVEN RELY ON THE BIBLE FOR MORALITY BECAUSE THE BIBLE IS SILENT ON MANY ISSUES.

This is a wrong illustration . Most Christians don't rely on the Bible for many issues, nor are they instructed to rely on the bible for such issues.
Rape is bad because almost every human on earth knows it's wrong to hurt a fellow human. The question I'm asking is not whether rape is wrong. I'm asking you to justify why rape is wrong.


If I have the chance to rape a lady I've been wanting to have and I know I can get a way with it, why won't I go for it considering that my actions will satisfy me? This is simple logic.

Also several famous and outspoken atheists have opined that rape is perfectly normal and that we are biological animals. Many atheists who don't believe this "cold truth" are simply borrowing from God or whatever religion they were brought up with.

bobowaja:
Indoctrination is a bad thing. It turns brilliant minds to dumb fellow when the word "God" is called.

His father (a theologian) is toying with this youngster's brain and i can only hope he won't succeed. Now, this sharp brain is already concluding instead of asking questions/enquiries. I just hope he can recover in his adulthood just like most of us did.

Most?

Atheists are less than 4% of the total world population, I don't think that reflects most.

We know that Isaac Newton and most religious founders of the fields of science were not dumb. You're being a bigot.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/4037804_1218648010372215129885571185067119286766450o_jpegbb66ffe4cfcba0e4e77ebfcb9617cc3b

DeSepiero:
very biased and unscientific!!
A scientist doesn't conclude before enquiry.

one of the best minds ever Isaac Newton affirmed that God exists. Was he also unscientific?

superhumanist:
Stop repeating lies and revelling in ignorance.

There were freethinkers in the slavery abolition movement. Stop telling lies as if it was only christians that worked against slavery]

Apart from people like Ingersoll (an agnostic) who only voiced out after Christians led the front, please mention 10 other atheists who were slavery abolitionists. Don't forget agnostics are not even atheists but I give you the grace, you can also mention agnostics.

I can give you a list of 500 christian abolitionists by just a few clicks online

superhumanist:
2. There were also many christians who wanted slavery to remain the status quo. There was even a war to keep slavery in America.

this was mentioned and well explained in one of the points of the op. Don't just be in a hurry to refute anything Christianity, calm down and read. Don't develop high blood pressure for a God "that does not exist"

superhumanist:
3. In fact, christians enjoyed black slaves for over 300 years before abolishing it. So please, you cannot eat your cake and have it. Christianity supported slavery since the early catholic church- that is over 500 years and after enjoying it thoroughly, you want to take the glory for ending it.

The whole world enjoyed slavery since the beginning of humanity,

Many Christians used their worldview to justify slavery just the same way the pharisees tried to use the laws of moses to justify divorce and Jesus rebuked them.
I pointed out in the op that the christian abolitionists were infact the majority and they were bible believing Christians inspired by Christianity.

Christians can take the glory for ending the transatlantic slave trade, history is on our side.

superhumanist:
This your point 11 is laughable and false.

Of course, any rebuttal against atheism is false

superhumanist:
1) Morality comes from 2 sources; human logic and human empathy. God is not necessary for morality. In fact, religious people and countries are usually the most confused about morality.

firstly you have no proof of this.

Secondly, human logic always acts in the best interest of individual humans. And this has always been proven to be selfishly oriented. For instance, why won't I rob a bank if it will make me richer

Human empathy is also not a prerequisite for morality. All the humans who enslaved Africans had empathy, yet they didn't deem it fit to eradicate slavery until Christians took a stand.

superhumanist:
2) There are different kinds of atheists. Some are humanists, some are buddhists, some are liberal and some are conservative. Some believe in objective morality grounded by religion. Some believe in objective morality grounded in logic and some, do not believe that theres any objective morality.

Na you know. Atheists are atheists. Whatever sugar you wish to coat it with is your headache.

superhumanist:
3) You even contradict yourself by admitting that there are atheists who live a more moral life than some christians. How then are they able to live such moral lives if they cannot ground it? If one cannot ground his morality or beliefs, the person will never be consistent in that belief. The truth is that morality is and should be grounded on logic and empathy which is common to all humans (except the mentally challenged).

Its not a contradiction. Its only proof that morality is innate, it is god-given. You must steal from God while still claiming the God does not exist. This is the only justification for anything condemned by an atheist. I pointed out all these in the op, you people don't read.

superhumanist:
In summary, atheists have every right to question the immorality of slavery in christianity. The argument that atheists have no right to crtitize wrongs because their moral beliefs are different is just foolish. It is the equivalent of slapping an atheist and telling him not to complain because his morality is not grounded in God- you will find yourself in Jail

Loo, you've said nothing dude. Why is slavery wrong if my actions are calculated to satisfy me, did your grandma fix a standard for my morality or that of everyone on earth

I'm still wondering how atheists think they have the moral rights to blame anyone for anything.

An atheist never thinks he/she was indoctrinated with morality

CAPSLOCKED:

MORTAL MEN LIKE YOU AND I DISCOVERED IT WAS BAD, AND STARTED TO FIGHT AGAINST IT.

.

Read, read and read.

Christians ended slavery when atheists had all the chance to show the world how moral atheism is.

CAPSLOCKED:


YET YOUR BIBLE DISHED OUT INSTRUCTIONS ON HOW TO ENSLAVE AND TREAT THEM. YOUR BIBLE GAVE INSTRUCTIONS ON HOW WARS SHOULD BE FOUGHT.. THE MEN KILLED, THE WOMEN ENSLAVED, AND THE YOUNG VIRGINS MARRIED BY FORCE.

The bible gave regulations on how slaves were to be treated. People became slaves willingly, criminals who should otherwise be sentenced to death were enslaved and they had humane rights.
Learn to read.

CAPSLOCKED:


I'M NOT HAVING FURTHER CONVERSATIONS SOMEONE WHO SUPPORTS A TERRORIST RELIGION AND A POWER-DRUNK MISOGYNIST GOD.

I thought you said God did not exist?

Now you think God is evil

Lol. Atheist logic

www.nairaland.com/attachments/3805217_weah_pngf85713a799391ff3b1b9eee3632a3f34

superhumanist:
2) There was hard slavery in the bible. This is a fact that the op is trying to twist and deny.

You could beat your slave in the bible;
Exodus 21:20-21
20 “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property


The bible makes it clear that the slave is the property of the master and you can beat the slave as long as the slave does not die.

Try to read the 11th point downwards, your repeated chorus is already answered. Beating a slave was punishable (by death). That was a legal right.

CAPSLOCKED:

THE FACT THAT YOUR SKY DADDY PASSED UP THE CHANCE TO ABOLISH SLAVERY, TERRORISM, AND RACISM WHEN HE GAVE THE 10 COMMANDMENTS, BUT RATHER WASTED THE SLOTS ON TELLING US TO NOT HAVE SEX, IS ENOUGH REASON TO NOT TAKE HIM SERIOUSLY.

So who abolished slavery? Atheists?

And who is a Sky daddy?

superhumanist:
The op of this thread is a wilful slave (of christianity) and so, he must defend slavery.


However, lets examine the silliness in denying slavery in christianity as per the op

1. The op claims that the transatlantic slavery by Europeans and Americans was "raced based" but that of the bible was not "raced based". This is a lie because we know two things that happened in the bible;

a) Yahweh only cared about the slavery of Isrealites. He did not care about the slavery of the Canaanites and other people. Yahweh only acted when the Isrealites were enslaved by Egyptians- he sent Moses to save the isrealites.

b) It was a crime in the old testament to enslave a fellow Jew but not other people. A jew could only work 7 years as an indentured servant.

I'm a slave to God and theres nothing your daily wailings will do to end this.

I proved several points in the op which I'm sure you didn't bother to read. Not that the explanation was for you anyway.

a) Non isrealite slaves were legally protected as indicated in the op.

b) It was a crime to kidnap anyone and sell into slavery, Jew or no Jew.

You may focus on point 11, that in my opinion is what concerns atheists on this thread.

CuteMadridista:
I want to prove everybody wrong "jahduanxianzga does exist"

The difference is, no one cares if jahduanxianzga exists or not, certainly no one spends time on the internet talking about jahduanxianzga.

festwiz:
"to become am astrophysicist to prove god does exist"...sounds like an oxymoron to me. The kid is 11, i'm inclined to believe those were his father's words, but let's see what he proves. I'm not inclined to take him seriously since he didn't come forth when Hawking was alive, that might have been good entertainment.

He came out when Hawkings was alive, I read his story on nairaland early last year. He will be one of the greatest minds ever, just like newton, either you or other atheists take him seriously or not.

Emmanystone:
Let me call in an intelligent atheist and his fellows to.come and do justice to this thread.

Cc:@Fegelfire, Superhumanist.dalaman. Budaatum. Sheybebabe, Cutemadrista.

Remind them that they can ignore the first 10 points and focus only on the 11th

Good God.

.