WOW! This was an explosive debate. Both debaters did really well in defending their positions and also convincing the judges and audience.

For those who said i chickened out. That's not true. I've been very busy for the past few days that i even forgot about the debate. It may sound as an excuse considering the fact that i'm an Omni-present character on Nairaland but i was really really busy. I think it's even good that only two people debated, because i wonder how it would have been if four people had slugged it out on one thread. I hope to debate in subsequent debates.

Thanks@all

TRUTHTELA: I'm STILL in shock, I never knew that a SUBJECT could be discussed on nairaland, solely with FACTS and INTELLIGENCE, without the usual name calling, insults & RAZZ people taking it over. I wish the owner of Nairaland, take advantage of this debate and use it to REBUILD the IMAGE of this SITE & TAKE IT TO GREATER HEIGHTS. If SANITY has been RESTORED, I hope to be back from my SABBATICAL. Obinoscopy and Katsumo, you guys IMPRESSED me.

Pls come back from your sabatical, we need intellectuals of your kind here on nairaland

[b]With regards to the debate topic, IS AMALGAMATION A HISTORICAL MISTAKE? Personally, I think it's subjective, a Lord Lugard & his ilks will justify it. All the elites ( irregardless of his/her tribe ) that ENRICHED themselves through PRIMITIVE ACQUISITION of resources will not see anything wrong in AMALGAMATION. If amalgamation was successful in other regions of this world, what gave the british the confidence that it will work out well in the case of NIGER-area? If Igbos have been trading with Tiv's and the Yourba's traded successfully with the Nupe's or Hausa's during the PRE-colonial era, I STILL DON'T THINK IT'S ENOUGH JUSTIFICATION TO BRING THEM UNDER ONE POLITICAL LEADERSHIP or SYSTEM of GOVERNANCE.

In life, we all VIEW our ACTIONS as a MISTAKE or not, based on the END RESULT of it, WHAT IS THE END RESULT OF THAT AMALGAMATION?? If we can be HONEST with ourselves & stop playing the "OSTRICH" ( with naija go better attitude), we'll ACKNOWLEDGE that NIGERIA HAS FAILED ( you're free to argue otherwise) and everyone ( elites, foreigners, neighbors, terrorist,etc ) is taking FULL ADVANTAGE of that FAILURE.

In addition, there's a word called CONSULTATION, in hindsight, I can see that none of the tribes that made up the present day Nigeria, was consulted & asked , ARE YOU WILL TO ACCEPT/ TOLERATE THIS TRIBE THE WAY THEY ARE, under one government? ( you can't shave a man's hair in his absent ). No CONSULTATIONS, nor RIGHTS/RESPECT was accorded to anyone, hence, you will not have certain tribe thinking that they're BETTER than the other tribe, or hating on each other, simply because they were merged to be a country. For instance, an Igbo man has no reason to be HATING or attacking a Gabonese, simply because, he's a Gabonese, ( they're not under the same political leadership) and if all Gabonese, have been committing all sort of crimes abroad, the BAD NAME & DISGRACE is to his country & someone in Imo state, will not get on the social media to attack Gabonese, cos they have NOTHING IN COMMON.

Finally, prior to AMALGAMATION, the British failed to CONSULT, TALK & RESPECT the various tribes that made up Nigeria, before the independence, the so called "founding fathers ( SELFISH ELITES)" failed to TALK, CONSULT, & RESPECT the people at the GRASSROOT level, because, they were pre-occupied on how to kick the Brit's out and move into the GRA'S, BUY SHARES IN UAC,GBO, UTC, LEVER BROTHERS etc & be WORSHIPED like an emperor. NIGERIA, IS A TIME BOMB, whatever MISTAKE or societal ILL ( e.g, TRIBALISM ) that is rooted in the National consciousness of Nigerians, it didn't fall from the sky, the Brit's saw it, but the played OSTRICH, the post independence crew saw it, they played OSTRICH too, now, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE CALLING FOR SOVEREIGN NATIONAL CONFERENCE, so that " WE THE PEOPLE" can talk and IRON OUT our differences, but, the ELITES & Northerners are busy playing the same OSTRICH, thinking that TRIBALISM, CORRUPTION, NEPOTISM, MEDIOCRITY, WRITING OF ELECTIONS RESULTS in ABUJA, BOMBING CHRISTIANS, ASSASSINATION OF POLITICAL OPPONENTS, KIDNAPPINGS, LAWLESSNESS,etc, will VANISH INTO THE SKY. Their famous line is that USA, didn't become DEVELOPED overnite, folks, we all know that USA, wasn't RETROGRESSING.[/b]

Nice debate though. But my question is, where is naija heading to? As a nation to dis amalgamate or to consolidate on the amalgamation?

Hey, Obinoscopy, do you mind exchanging emails, ( nice_naija104@yahoo.ca)? It's late have to go & sleep.

ayox2003: Obinoscopy took the debate like he was actually talking to people sitting in a "Nairaland Hall". Great delivery - also throwing rhetorical questions to the audience. I think he diverted all the blames to our leader while there are other cogent points like human resource, influence and so on. Kudos!

Kats was very logical and in-depth. More like a thesis He took it from the scratch and gave it a good finishing. Kudos. But I think its was kinda lengthy. His further argument shows how really in-depth he is. I say kudos, again.

Kudos to the Mods and judges.

Truth be told, the amalgamation of the southern and northern protectorate was a costly mistake.

To corroborate this topic, I wrote an article around March after the Catholic church was bombed in Jos. As it stands, those who brought us into this mess, our colonial masters, are facing the same problem. Scotland, the oil-rich part of the UK wants to be on its own. Although there are some similarities between a Scot and an English man, the differences would always give them a terra firma to have their own sovereignty. Unlike the Scots and every other Britons, there is no pinch of similarity between a Southerner and a Northern. The difference between them is as vast as the difference between a giraffe and a kangaroo. I mean, u can't just bring groups of people with an extremely different culture and religion together under the same abode and expect peace. No. People invest somuch ego into their culture, religion and territory that it could make cannibals out of them!

Anyway, hope is not lost. God bless Nigeria.



Frawzey

Thanks for your insightful contribution. You might be right about the fact that a giraffe is different from a kangaroo. But despite their differences, we can still pinpoint one or two similarities such as:
They are both herbivores
They don't lay eggs but give live births
They are warm blooded
They not domestic animals
They thrive better in the tropics
I could go on and on

With all these points, definately a zoo can keep those animals together if he so wishes

Despite the obvious difference between the north and the south, there is still some iota of similarity (african hospitality, black race, extended family based social system, etc). This is what needs to be emphasized upon

..

TRUTHTELA: Hey, Obinoscopy, do you mind exchanging emails, ( nice_naija104@yahoo.ca)? It's late have to go & sleep.

Will mail you later in the day. Good night

Great job guys.
As expected katsu was academic & structured. If d debate was conducted in front of all Nigerians, I think Obino wld win d vote: he appealed to people's emotions.
It requires a degree of intelligence to understand Katsu's perspective.

Nice debate! Wonder what hapened to the other contestants. It would have been great to see the winner here fight it out with the 2nd winner in the snc topic today.
I guess the SNC topic will now be moved forward as November topic.
Kudos guys.
(is there no option for bookmarking a page in Nl? I need tips)

Obinoscopy:

Thanks for your insightful contribution. You might be right about the fact that a giraffe is different from a kangaroo. But despite their differences, we can still pinpoint one or two similarities such as:
They are both herbivores
They don't lay eggs but give live births
They are warm blooded
They not domestic animals
They thrive better in the tropics
I could go on and on

With all these points, definately a zoo can keep those animals together if he so wishes

Despite the obvious difference between the north and the south, there is still some iota of similarity (african hospitality, black race, extended family based social system, etc). This is what needs to be emphasized upon

Hahahaha

Somuch for a sunday morning!!!

Let's not start another debate here but this post also goes to show you've got great debating skills.



Frawzey

Just like my favourite seasonal movie, the debate was all encompassing, full of twists and turns. I couldn't get my eyes off my screens. Sleep became a taboo. Akin to Nigeria-Biafra civil war, my verdict is "NO VICTOR NO VANQUISHED" Kudos to KATS and OBI, you deserve to be indoctrinated into NAIRALAND HALL OF FAME pronto! And to the organisers, judges, mods, and especially SEUN and JARUS.... you're all priceless! Take my lips....KISS! KISS!! KISS!!!

Great inputs from the two contestants; more power to your elbows! I have added much facts to my library here. Hope to see more of this (insult free) thread in the future. Kudos to the organisers as well as the viewers. Thanks and God bless you all.

Jarus: CONSOLIDATED RESULTS

Kats. Obin.
Presentation. 9. 10
Logic. 10. 8
Facts. 11. 8
Persuasiveness. 8. 10
Knowledge. 11. 10
TOTAL. 49/60. 46/60

WINNER BY CRITERIA
Presentation - Obinoscopy
Logic - Katsumoto
Facts - Katsumoto
Persuasiveness - Obinoscopy
Knowledge - Katsumoto

3-2 in favour of Katsumoto

Winner by judges
2-1 in favour of Katsumoto

On behalf of my respected partner, OAM4J, and the entire Nairaland officials, I hereby declare KATSUMOTO as the winner of the October maiden edition of Nairaland Political debate. A very tough contest, great challenge by Obinoscopy.

See you guys in November by God's grace.

Thanks everyone.

Floor now open for the chair-throwers

Thank you the impartial judges for judging correctly KATSUMOTO argued sincerely and logically, while his opponent argued sympathically and pretence, you can never survive or succeed in a forced and un happy marriage no matter how you can pretend. Nigeria's Amalgamation is one of the worst decisions taken by any colonial masters in this world. What Obinoscopy based his argument on, Corruption is a product of the forced marriage the 1914 Amalgamation which brought many different countries, tribes, together without minding their differences, as people with different cultures, religions, believes, and ideologies. if Nigeria is seen and believed to be one as we pretend, the past and present rulers wouldn't have given more rooms for corruption. Hence the country is divided under tribal, religions and interests; no ruler finds it worthy to develop the country. I support the motion that says that the Amalgamation is a Historical Mistake. KATSUMOTO, well done for your great historical accuracy, Moore greases to your elbows.

SamAfrik: Great job guys.
As expected katsu was academic & structured. If d debate was conducted in front of all Nigerians, I think Obino wld win d vote: he appealed to people's emotions.
It requires a degree of intelligence to understand Katsu's perspective.

You said it all. Obino was somewhat cunning and witty and not unecessarily verbose! Exactly what an average Nigerian will go for.

Hmmmm, learnt a thing or two from these repertoires of knowledge. But taking the situation of Nigeria from post -independence, I think this argument actually tilted to Kat's favour. I would speak against the amalgamation myself. Obino was actually very scholarly given the irksome task of defending the entity called Nigeria. He arguably had more work to do. There are innumerable tonnes of evidence to speak against d amalgamation. All in all, u guys delivered and I must commend ur level of intellect. U are truly some of the intellentgsia we have on Nairaland. Big ups to the mods, panel of judges and errone dat was involved actively or passively. Happy Sunday to y'all

Good question @ Tony spike.

If the foundation are faulty what shall the righteous do? The then leaders are not true nationalist, they are much of regional or ethnic leaders and never belive in Nigeria project. The foundation of ethnicity have been laid, several stones of division have been used to build the nation Nigeria. There is need for the house to broken down to the foundation and rebuild this can be actualized through sovereign national conference that the progressives have been clamouring for over the years.
Kudos to Seun and his crew for creating this avenue who knows the impact the debates may have on we the upcoming generation that will eventually find our self in places policy making. The debaters are fantastic. Nairaland is filled with men of great mind and ideas even in the jokes section u will discover that while crying we still see.
Long Live Seun Osewa
Long Live Nairaland
Long Live all Nairalanders

control_seven: And to the organisers, judges, mods, and especially SEUN and JARUS.... you're all priceless! Take my lips....KISS! KISS!! KISS!!!

Why na? Where's my own kiss

Sirniyeh: I humbly respect the two debaters, they did a great job! But I sincerely could have voted for Obino if the audience is permitted to do so. Obino, kudos to your intellect. I knew the election was rigged, that's has been part of our culture. Now that the N1M cash prize had been awarded to Kat, dont worry as I will influence your ticket to be 2015 senate president. Warm up...

As if you knew what I want...the Senate Presidency

Thanks by the way. I wouldn't say the judges were partial. I didn't partake in the debate because of them. I partook in the event because of you and other Nigerians here on nairaland. I just hope I made an impression on my fellow citizens of this great country

afam4eva: WOW! This was an explosive debate. Both debaters did really well in defending their positions and also convincing the judges and audience.

For those who said i chickened out. That's not true. I've been very busy for the past few days that i even forgot about the debate. It may sound as an excuse considering the fact that i'm an Omni-present character on Nairaland but i was really really busy. I think it's even good that only two people debated, because i wonder how it would have been if four people had slugged it out on one thread. I hope to debate in subsequent debates.

Thanks@all

Afam! Afam!! Afam!!!

How many times did I call you?

Anyways I have no grudges against you, after all you on the opposing team. Its my fellow codebater Ikengawo that I'll kill if I get my hands on him

He obviously chickened out and preferred complaining about his handsomeness in the Romance Section. Check his profile you'll see the thread (he's the OP)

Anyways its nice to have you back. Look forward to seeing your debate one of these days.

Happy Sunday

Obinoscopy:

Afam! Afam!! Afam!!!

How many times did I call you?

Anyways I have no grudges against you, after all you on the opposing team. Its my fellow codebater Ikengawo that I'll kill if I get my hands on him

He obviously chickened out and preferred complaining about his handsomeness in the Romance Section. Check his profile you'll see the thread (he's the OP)

Anyways its nice to have you back. Look forward to seeing your debate one of these days.
@Obi, you won the debate, don't mind what the judges have released here. I saw it coming. Keep it up.

Happy Sunday

Dude you clearly won the debate. Forget the favouritism exhibited here. I saw it coming.

In my opinion, I think both debaters did marvelously okay especially Obinoscopy who did not have myriads of conjectural or factual information to throw at us. Obino’s presentation style was concise and straight forward. However, Obino failed to establish a common similarity between USA and Nigeria when he cited USA as an exemplary model. Obino appeared very evasive in his responses and seemed very interested in latter day achievements of USA.

It was either a matter of oversight or evasive method of debate when Obino yet again cited Somalia as monolithic society. There is nothing farther from truth than this postulation. Somalia consisted of more than five ethnic nationalists and primary among them are Samaal and Saab ethnic groups. As in case of Nigeria, foreigners decided who should be a Somali and delineated the common boundary with neighboring countries.

The Puritans, as in the case of USA, were determined to build a country through conquering, buying or annexing. In a 100M dash, how good a sprinter gets off the block has plenty to do in the outcome of the race.

As usual, Kats bored us with loads of “copy and paste” information and failed to be precise to the facts in order to help his plank. For example in Kats introductory epistle, there were citations of 1945 and 1953 riots in kano and Jos respectively. Howerever, Kats failed to use these incidents to drive home the idea why amalgamation of 1914 remains bad news to Nigerians. Both riots where incited by the British who scrawled at the nationalistic interests expressed by the southerners. What about 1949 riot in Enugu where the British commended a unit of riot police consisted mainly of Tiv peeps to shot hundreds of coal miners to death? I had expected Kats to capitalize and stress on issues that exposed the instances of base for unity and patriotism or lack thereof in Nigeria as rooted and pointed to attitude of uninterested agents of British government that amalgamated the protectorates without the fundamental interest of the people.

I think it is save to say the debate slightly went Kats way due to abundances of local information that support kat’s plank.

On one hand some say I provided way too much information, on the other hand another is saying I missed out on some information. My opponent did not even provide a rebuttal to my opening statement.

Dede1

It is not essential to provide information on EVERY incident and expatiate on EVERY example. I believe I provided a chronology of events and examples to support my position.

marion g: Quite interesting! They both did fantastic given how well they put forward their argument. Punch line upon punch line. @Katsumoto. You are good, it all seemed as if u had anticipated and prepared for this debate long before now. With the level of facts you tendered, i can only but salute. @obinoscopy. U where very cogent and i love the way you presented your points, concise and brief, quite convincing it was. Kudos to both guys, indeed it was educative. Looking forward to more of such.

Thanks

I actually replaced CheddarKing who dropped out during the week.

Katsumoto: On one hand some say I provided way too much information, on the other hand another is saying I missed out on some information. My opponent did not even provide a rebuttal to my opening statement.

it was too long....you coulda summarised and compressed some of the lines as well! it almost bordered on boredom....

coogar:

it was too long....you coulda summarised and compressed some of the lines as well! it almost bordered on boredom....

LOL

Judge Coogar, please go and read it all. Don't be lazy.

Please let's be careful throwing the word favoritism around. We all have someone we felt should have won that they didn't win does not mean it was because of some mago mago wuru wuru moves. We run the risk of discouraging others from participating if they thought the merits if their arguments will have no place in the final outcome.

There is no doubt both Katz and Obinoscopy brought their 1000%, A+++++ game on and they should be highly commended for that.

Now y'all can tell me to Sharrap.

9jacrip: @Kats: I have a question, a trivial one at that - are you a historian?

NO

Just fell in love with history from a very early age.

Katsumoto: On one hand some say I provided way too much information, on the other hand another is saying I missed out on some information. My opponent did not even provide a rebuttal to my opening statement.

Dede1

It is not essential to provide information on EVERY incident and expatiate on EVERY example. I believe I provided a chronology of events and examples to support my position.

If I did not know the cradle of the bases of your plank, I should have quit reading at the first epistle you posted as introductory. Believe me, you could have spared us the exigencies of skewed formation of political parties in the amalgamated Nigeria and stress sociopolitical interests of concerned principal players such as British and ethnic nationalists in the protectorate. Nigeria\Biafra civil war, Bakassi and retrogressive nature of Nigeria are foremost examples of the ills brought about by the 1914 amalgamation of the protectorates.

At least, you did me proud.

Darn ...took me couple of hours to get through.

Katz as usual you blown it outta of the roof with your submission.

Obino...wa ooo never know you were this cerebral. Kudos.

You guys are both winners....