ak47mann: i no you people have short memories so i will always remind you that food aid agencies where being shot down by nigerian soldiers or do u want evidence on that one?truth is making you people have sleepless night deal with it...

Answer my questions and if you can not, shut your mouth and move on.


Was if right for Ojukwu to send you to war without food?

Was it right to go to war while depending on the same enemy you are shooting and killing to give you food to eat?

Was it right for ashebe and ojukwu hijack and divert food for their people to feed the rebel army?

Was if right for ashebe and ojukwu to deny landing rights to food aid groups trying to feed ibo people unless they pay bribe aka landing fees?

ACM10:
Sometimes I question the quality of your education. You are so ignorant. Facts cannot be changed with logic. Don't think that you sound intelligent. Get some books and read before commenting on some topics. I will suggest that you read this book to get an insight on how the North was able to dominate the military after independence.

*Nigeria's Five Majors by Ben Gbulie.

There are several books which you can read on how the North came to dominate the political sphere. But the root of it is on the census carried out by the British before the independence.

I have to cancel the remaining part of your comment because it's a load of excrement.

There's no need for name-calling, brother... I'm a student of Nigerian history, and I'm willing to learn... If the British did everything in Nigeria based on merit, how come they never replicated the same merit-based system in their other colonies around the world?? As a student of African history - I know the colonial masters were more favourable to subservient/disorganised tribes around the continent, than the rebellious/dominant tribes...

You also didn't say anything about the allegation that the late Nnamdi Azikwe was a MI6/MI5 agent...

Revelation(I've got the audio clip as well):

One day Smith was given a secret file containing a minute that ordered him to get involved in regional elections taking place in the late 1950s in the run up to independence. He was to make vehicles, staff and other resources available to the NCNC colleagues of Okotie-Eboh who was standing in the elections. Smith was shocked at the request.He explained that the election had to be fixed because the plan was that the Northern region would hold power on independence.

This is why, explains Smith, he had been ordered to help the party of Dr Azikiwe (Zik), in the East, the NCNC. He explained: “They had to fix Zik of course, there was stuff they have got him for that could send him to prison ... [they] forced him to do a deal with the North.”
Smith is adamant the orders to help the NCNC came from the top, the governor general Sir James Robertson. Smith described Robertson as “a thug and he had a terrible reputation....We loved Africans, but these people who came to do this job were a different breed, these were the ex-SOE [British Secret Service outfit set up during the Second World War] and MI6.”

Because it is certainly the case that the NCNC would not have won the election it did without British support. Nor could it have formed a coalition with the NPC at independence without British support. So I would love to see what’s in those two files about Sir James Robertson and Dr Azikiwe.”
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2007/aug2007/nige-a09.shtml

Hey, I'm willing to learn - and no name-calling, please...

afam4eva:
Go and read about the introduction of indirect rule in Nigeria and you'll understand a lot.

Indirect rule was very successful in the North because over there they had central authorities in form of Traditional rulers who were respected and not to be challened.

In Yorubaland it was partially successful because they also has traditional rulers. But in Yorubaland, their traditional rulers did not wield the kind of power that those in the North had. But it was succesful to some extent.

Indirect rule failed in Igboland because of the egalitarian nature of Igbos. Igbos did not have a central authority like the North and the West and so, they were very difficult to penetrate.

That's why the British left the running of the country to the the North because they were easily swayed through their central authorities. So, the North controled the government but the civil service from the south to the North was dominated by Igbos and other southerners. That's because there was merit to a large extent. If merit were to be returned to Nigeria you will see how Igbos, Yorubas and other southern groups will dominate the scheme of things in Nigeria. It's a no-brainer.

I'm not arguing against the last paragraph - however, what I've got problems with is the incessant lies by Igbo icons that Igbo "dominated" everything in Nigeria pre-independence because it was based on meritocracy... If it were based on meritocracy, the Yorubas from Lagos and Ogun, and the Itsekiris should have dominated because they were by far the most educated and qualified group in Nigeria at that point in Nigerian history... Even NCNC(which was later hijacked by Zik and Igbos) was a party started the Yoruba elites in Lagos and an Ijaw man...

To be honest, the rise of Igbos had more to do with their individualism, ability to migrate to the unknown, and their willingness to accept Christianity/westernisation at the expense of their culture... Suffice to say, the colonialists partially civilised the Igbos - and they saw Igbos as willing tools for servitude, period... Most of these people were psychologists and they knew what they were doing...

shymexx:

I'm not arguing against the last paragraph - however, what I've got problems with is the incessant lies by Igbo icons that Igbo "dominated" everything in Nigeria pre-independence because it was based on meritocracy... If it were based on meritocracy, the Yorubas from Lagos and Ogun, and the Itsekiris should have dominated because they were by far the most educated and qualified group in Nigeria at that point in Nigerian history... Even NCNC(which was later hijacked by Zik and Igbos) was a party started the Yoruba elites in Lagos and an Ijaw man...

To be honest, the rise of Igbos had more to do with their individualism, ability to migrate to the unknown, and their willingness to accept Christianity/westernisation at the expense of their culture... Suffice to say, the colonialists partially civilised the Igbos(just as the Luo tribe of Kenya) - and they saw Igbos as willing tools for servitude, period... Most of these people were psychologists and they knew what they were doing...

Pls let's desist from making assertions that we cannot prove.

afam4eva:
Pls let's desist from making assertions that we cannot prove.

Lmao... Who were the Nigerian elites back then?

shymexx:

Lmao... Who were the Nigerian elites back then?

There were elites from all over the country...what's your point exactly.

shymexx:

I'm not arguing against the last paragraph - however, what I've got problems with is the incessant lies by Igbo icons that Igbo "dominated" everything in Nigeria pre-independence because it was based on meritocracy... If it were based on meritocracy, the Yorubas from Lagos and Ogun, and the Itsekiris should have dominated because they were by far the most educated and qualified group in Nigeria at that point in Nigerian history... Even NCNC(which was later hijacked by Zik and Igbos) was a party started the Yoruba elites in Lagos and an Ijaw man...


To be honest, the rise of Igbos had more to do with their individualism, ability to migrate to the unknown, and their willingness to accept Christianity/westernisation at the expense of their culture... Suffice to say, the colonialists partially civilised the Igbos(just as the Luo tribe of Kenya) - and they saw Igbos as willing tools for servitude, period... Most of these people were psychologists and they knew what they were doing...

Which Yoruba man started NCNC? Why do you guys insist on twisting facts and history? Now tell me how NCNC was formed?

afam4eva:
There were elites from all over the country...what's your point exactly.

However, most of the educated elites were Yorubas... Most of the colonial schools were also located in the SW...

Even the few Igbo elites were based in the SW...

shymexx:

However, most of the educated elites were Yorubas... Most of the colonial schools were also located in the SW...

Even the few Igbo elites were based in the SW...

Don't reiterate your statement. Just provide proof for your assertion.

Who are the most elites that were Yoruba. Name the Igbo elites that were based in Lagos. I expect you start with ZIK. Goodluck.

ACM10:
Which Yoruba man started NCNC? Why do you guys insist on twisting facts and history? Now tell me how NCNC was formed?

Herbert Macaulay - the grandson of Bishop Ajayi Crowther..

He was the grandson of bishop Samuel Ajayi Crowther and the son of the founder of the first secondary school in Nigeria, the CMS Grammar School, Lagos. After going to a Christian missionary school, he took a job as a clerk at the Lagos Department of Public Works. From 1891 to 1894 he studied civil engineering in Plymouth, England. On his return, he worked for the Crown as a land inspector. He left his position in 1898 due to growing distaste for the British rule over the Lagos Colony and the position of Yorubaland and the Niger Coast Protectorate as British colonies in all but name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Macaulay

shymexx:

However, most of the educated elites were Yorubas... Most of the colonial schools were also located in the SW...

Even the few Igbo elites were based in the SW...

Whenever you make a wild assertion like this, I expect you to produce list. Don't include Lagos politicians like Herbert Macaulay in your list. They will slap you when they are alive if you mistakenly call them Yorubas. They reject Awolowo and his politics and even take to western names culture and lifestyle.

shymexx:

Herbert Macaulay - the grandson of Bishop Ajayi Crowther..

He was the grandson of bishop Samuel Ajayi Crowther and the son of the founder of the first secondary school in Nigeria, the CMS Grammar School, Lagos. After going to a Christian missionary school, he took a job as a clerk at the Lagos Department of Public Works. From 1891 to 1894 he studied civil engineering in Plymouth, England. On his return, he worked for the Crown as a land inspector. He left his position in 1898 due to growing distaste for the British rule over the Lagos Colony and the position of Yorubaland and the Niger Coast Protectorate as British colonies in all but name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Macaulay

Herbert Macaulay did not form NCNC alone. It was a collabo between him, ZIK and some other people even though he was made the first president of the party while ZIK was the secretary. You guys should desist from making wide assertions that you can't defend. If this were communist China someone would have been shot.

shymexx:

Herbert Macaulay - the grandson of Bishop Ajayi Crowther..

He was the grandson of bishop Samuel Ajayi Crowther and the son of the founder of the first secondary school in Nigeria, the CMS Grammar School, Lagos. After going to a Christian missionary school, he took a job as a clerk at the Lagos Department of Public Works. From 1891 to 1894 he studied civil engineering in Plymouth, England. On his return, he worked for the Crown as a land inspector. He left his position in 1898 due to growing distaste for the British rule over the Lagos Colony and the position of Yorubaland and the Niger Coast Protectorate as British colonies in all but name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Macaulay

hahahahaha
You are a fo0l for quoting wikipedia for me. Now I will tell you how NCNC was formed.

NCNC was formed by the coalition between Nigeria Youth Circle(NYC) and the Nigeria Union of Students(NUS). Their patrons includes Zik and Macaulay. The seed was sown in November 1943 at a youth rally in Ojokoro. It might interest you to know that Herbert Macaulay was still the leader of Nigeria National Democratic Party(NNDP) at that point in time and their sphere of influence is limited to Lagos. In August 26, 1944, it formerly became known as National Council of Nigeria and Cameroon. Herbert Macaulay was adopted as its pioneer leader.

{How Zik Fought For The Freedom And Unity Of Nigeria} by Anikputalu Egwuonu; 1979.

afam4eva:
[s]Herbert Macaulay did not form NCNC alone. It was a collabo between him[/s], ZIK and some other people even though he was made the first president of the party while ZIK was the secretary. You guys should desist from making wide assertions that you can't defend. If this were communist China someone would have been shot.

Fixed

afam4eva:
Don't reiterate your statement. Just provide proof for your assertion.

Who are the most elites that were Yoruba. Name the Igbo elites that were based in Lagos. I expect you start with ZIK. Goodluck.

Let's start with the Schools:

CMS Grammar School
University of lbadan
Yaba College of Technology
King’s College
Methodist Boys High School
Queens College
Eko Boys High School
St. Gregory's College
St. Finbarrs College
Methodist Girls High School .... etc..

http://www.onlinenigeria.com/education/?blurb=534
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yaba_College_of_Technology


Mr Akintola Williams, Chief Frederick Rotimi Alade Williams, Dr Henry Carr, Herbert Macaulay, Otunba TOS Benson, Chief Folarin Coker, Chief Remi Fani-Kayode, Bala Miller, Professor Ayodele Awojobi, T. K. E. Phillips, Chief G.O.K Ajayi, Major General Henry Adefowope, Prince Tanimose Bankole Oki, Mr S. O. Wey, Mr Ola Vincent, Professor Babs Fafunwa, Chief Ernest Shonekan, Rt. Rev. George Bako, Chief Ayo Adebanjo, Taslim Olawale Elias, Jacob Ade Ajayi, Ransome Kuti family, Adeniran Ogunsanya, Sir Adetokunbo Ademola, etc. Throw the Saros and Amaros in there
http://www.nigeriavillagesquare.com/bookshelf/book-reviews/book-review-nigerias-first-secondary-grammar-school-by-reuben-abati.html

For the Igbos - Nnamdi Azikwe and Ojukwu's pops(There aren't too many of them in my source)...

ACM10:
hahahahaha
You are a fo0l for quoting wikipedia for me. Now I will tell you how NCNC was formed.

NCNC was formed by the coalition between Nigeria Youth Circle(NYC) and the Nigeria Union of Students(NUS). Their patrons includes Zik and Macaulay. The seed was sown in November 1943 at a youth rally in Ojokoro. It might interest you to know that Herbert Macaulay was still the leader of Nigeria National Democratic Party(NNDP) at that point in time and their spere of influence is limited to Lagos. In August 26, 1944, it formerly became known as National Council of Nigeria and Cameroon. Herbert Macaulay was adopted as its pioneer leader.

{How Zik Fought For The Freedom And Unity Of Nigeria} by Anikputalu Egwuonu; 1979.

You see, that's why i told him not to say what he doesn't know and can't defend. He's not the firs person that's been saying Herbert Macaulay founded NCNC. This is a lie that has been passed down from generation to generation. When a lie goes on for too long, it becomes the truth to some people.

ACM10:
Whenever you make a wild assertion like this, I expect you to produce list. Don't include Lagos politicians like Herbert Macaulay in your list. They will slap you when they are alive if you mistakenly call them Yorubas. They reject Awolowo and his politics and even take to western names culture and lifestyle.

So, because a man rejects Awolowo and his policies, that automatically disqualifies his Yoruba-ness, no?

Is Awolowo the progenitor of the Yoruba race? - you're actually dumber than than your name, Afam, sounds...

afam4eva:
Herbert Macaulay did not form NCNC alone. It was a collabo between him, ZIK and some other people even though he was made the first president of the party while ZIK was the secretary. You guys should desist from making wide assertions that you can't defend. If this were communist China someone would have been shot.

Nah, the same lies you lot peddle were the same reasons why Hitler committed holocaust against the Jews - go figure...

shymexx:

Nah, if the same lies you lot peddle were the same reasons why Hitler committed holocaust against the Jews - go figure...

This is the wikipedia page for NCNC. Check it out yourself http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Council_of_Nigeria_and_the_Cameroons

ACM10:
hahahahaha
You are a fo0l for quoting wikipedia for me. Now I will tell you how NCNC was formed.

NCNC was formed by the coalition between Nigeria Youth Circle(NYC) and the Nigeria Union of Students(NUS). Their patrons includes Zik and Macaulay. The seed was sown in November 1943 at a youth rally in Ojokoro. It might interest you to know that Herbert Macaulay was still the leader of Nigeria National Democratic Party(NNDP) at that point in time and their sphere of influence is limited to Lagos. In August 26, 1944, it formerly became known as National Council of Nigeria and Cameroon. Herbert Macaulay was adopted as its pioneer leader.

{How Zik Fought For The Freedom And Unity Of Nigeria} by Anikputalu Egwuonu; 1979.

Don't cite an Igbo author when we're having a discourse - provide the neutral author, who's neither Igbo nor Yoruba...

And you still haven't said anything about the allegations against the late Nnamdi Azikwe and how he rigged the election with the MI6...

afam4eva:
This is the wikipedia page for NCNC. Check it out yourself http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Council_of_Nigeria_and_the_Cameroons

Anyone can edit wikipedia - Kats provided the background history about how NCNC was started...

I'm checking his post history now - I'll provide the link in a bit...

Lmao at these clowns trying to bamboozle me because they know my background - thank God for the internet, I'll hit you back with more links...

Destroying the myths!!

Rossike, can you post the link for all the missionary schools in the Nigeria that you posted last week?

shymexx:

Let's start with the Schools:

CMS Grammar School
University of lbadan
Yaba College of Technology
King’s College
Methodist Boys High School
Queens College
Eko Boys High School
St. Gregory's College
St. Finbarrs College
Methodist Girls High School .... etc..

http://www.onlinenigeria.com/education/?blurb=534
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yaba_College_of_Technology


[s]Mr Akintola Williams, Chief Frederick Rotimi Alade Williams, Dr Henry Carr, Herbert Macaulay, Otunba TOS Benson, Chief Folarin Coker, Chief Remi Fani-Kayode, Bala Miller, Professor Ayodele Awojobi, T. K. E. Phillips, Chief G.O.K Ajayi, Major General Henry Adefowope, Prince Tanimose Bankole Oki, Mr S. O. Wey, Mr Ola Vincent, Professor Babs Fafunwa, Chief Ernest Shonekan, Rt. Rev. George Bako, Chief Ayo Adebanjo, Taslim Olawale Elias, Jacob Ade Ajayi, Ransome Kuti family, Adeniran Ogunsanya, Sir Adetokunbo Ademola,[/s] etc. Throw the Saros and Amaros in there
http://www.nigeriavillagesquare.com/bookshelf/book-reviews/book-review-nigerias-first-secondary-grammar-school-by-reuben-abati.html

For the Igbos - Nnamdi Azikwe and Ojukwu's pops(There aren't too many of them in my source)...

These are mostly Lagos politians and activist. These people hardly regard themselves as Yoruba before Lagos was incorporated into the western region. Hahaha

Prof. Eni Njoku
Dr. Akanu Ibiam
Mbonu Ojike
Michael Okpara
Prof. Kenneth Dike
Professor Liyel Imoke
Professor Mbanefo
Philip Ojukwu
Gen. Aguiyi Ironsi
Mr. Mbadiwe
etc

Do you know about
DMGS Onitsha
CKC Onitsha
Saint Charles Onitsha
QRC Onitsha
CIC Enugu
etc

[s]

ACM10:
These are mostly Lagos politians and activist. These people hardly regard themselves as Yoruba before Lagos was incorporated into the western region. Hahaha

Prof. Eni Njoku
Dr. Akanu Ibiam
Mbonu Ojike
Michael Okpara
Prof. Kenneth Dike
Professor Liyel Imoke
Professor Mbanefo
Philip Ojukwu
Gen. Aguiyi Ironsi
Mr. Mbadiwe
etc

Do you know about
DMGS Onitsha
CKC Onitsha
Saint Charles Onitsha
QRC Onitsha
CIC Enugu
etc

[/s]

I gave you a more comprehensive list of renowned achievers, who're still celebrated in Nigeria... However, you provided a list of people no one remembers except people from their villages... The joke is on you, bruddah...

You still haven't answered my question about the allegations against Zik and his romance with the MI6...

And why the same British colonialist who NEVER practiced meritocracy in any of its colonies suddenly changed and embraced meritocracy in Nigeria..

Yo, Kats is here - watch ACM10 run with his tail between his legs...

shymexx: [s][/s]

I gave you a more comprehensive list of renowned achievers, who're still celebrated in Nigeria... However, you provided a list of people no one remembers except people from their villages... The joke is on you, bruddah...

You still haven't answered my question about the allegations against Zik and his romance with the MI6...

You're really a joke. The people you provided are mostly Lagosians are were/are celebrated in Lagos while the people he provided their names are celebrated in the east. It seems you think Nigeria starts and ends in Lagos.

shymexx:

Don't cite an Igbo author when we're having a discourse - provide the neutral author, who's neither Igbo nor Yoruba...

And you still haven't said anything about the allegations against the late Nnamdi Azikwe and how he rigged the election with the MI6...

I hate dumb debaters. Better grab your copy of the book or I can scan it and send to you. What the author did was to compile the speeches Zik gave and the documents he possessed. He did not know that debate will arise one day on how and who formed NCNC. The book was even published in 1979. Your excuse for casting away my proof is lame.

shymexx: Yo, Kats is here - watch ACM10 run with his tail between his legs...

Is Kats your father?

shymexx: Yo, Kats is here - watch ACM10 run with his tail between his legs...

I will burst the combined balls of you and kats without much ado.

afam4eva:
You're really a joke. The people you provided are mostly Lagosians are were/are celebrated in Lagos while the people he provided their names are celebrated in the east. It seems you think Nigeria starts and ends in Lagos.

The discourse was about which region had the most elites - and I most of the Nigerian elites at that point in Nigerian history were from Lagos and Ogun... I also gave you proof - so what are you on about?

Lagos has always been the "Mecca" of Nigeria - so anyone celebrated in Nigeria is celebrated across the country!

ACM10:
I hate dumb debaters. Better grab your copy of the book or I can scan it and send to you. What the author did was to compile the speeches Zik gave and the documents he possessed. He did not know that debate will arise one day on how and who formed NCNC. The book was even published in 1979. Your excuse for casting away my proof is lame.

I don't need to grab a sentimental book written by a tribalistic author... The only Nigerian authors I admire are Wole Soyinka and Ben Okri - I don't care about the rest, to be honest...

You still haven't answered my questions... These are the questions again:

- Was Zik and MI6 agent or not and was he used by the MI6 to start election rigging in Nigeria?

- And why would the same British colonialist who NEVER practiced meritocracy in any of its colonies suddenly change and embrace meritocracy in Nigeria?