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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion (25643 Views)
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Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by PastorKun(m): 12:12pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Ken4Christ: I have watched the video. I do not see anything strange about it. The truth is that the things of the spirit are foolishness to the carnal man. If frosbel and those who join him to speak againt these men of God live more than two years from now, I will call it a miracle. They are just progra ^^^ This guy must be a real m0ron 2 Likes |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Tgirl4real(f): 12:12pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: Very good advice. 2 Likes |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Tgirl4real(f): 12:16pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: It's either someone can't read or he needs glasses. 1 Like |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 12:24pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Ken4Christ: I have watched the video. I do not see anything strange about it. The truth is that the things of the spirit are foolishness to the carnal man. If frosbel and those who join him to speak againt these men of God live more than two years from now, I will call it a miracle. They are just progra Be careful before GOD starts on you. I can equally quote : "If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them if a large millstone were hung around their neck and they were thrown into the sea." - Mark 9:42 1 Like |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by dare2think: 12:29pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
frosbel: A typical Hagin revival - DISGUSTING !!!!!!!!!!! lol Psycopaths and sociopaths in the name of Christianity. If that charade above makes sense to you, YOU NEED HELP 3 Likes |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 12:32pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: Good,i have read drummaboy lengthy post and i still don't get it.Is it hagin that is responsible for the whole denomination thing in the church today? Are we to blame hagins teachings for the excesses according to him? We even asked him to quote from hagin book and show us the error so we could discuss this as bible students.He failed to do so and went as far as telling us far fetched stories about his personal experiences which we are not remotely interested in.If he can't take up this gentleman challenge then we are bold to call him a liar here. This is the crux of my post too. Let us stop elevating the men of God more than the God of man. as far as I can tell. Hagin is no greater than pastor Adeboye (the latest Arch Bishop in Nigeria). They all are men of like passion, just the way James said Elijah was a man of like passion (Jas 5:17). As long as they are flesh and blood, they will have corruptible and make mistakes, which is fine by me. The onus is on us to always balance their teaching by the word of God, and the holy spirit so that we are not misled, or act contrary to the will of God for our lives. I personally believe everybody cannot be rich, regardless of the level of faith exercised, why? we all cannot handle prosperity equally. the fact of prosperity alone will lead some people to hell, since they will unleash themselves on their enemies. If i were God, i wont bless anybody that prays God to kill his enemies as it will be an avenue for bloodshed |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by DrummaBoy(m): 12:35pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
^It reminds of another one @ my place of work who goes to Living Faith. He said he may not be known for much after he dies but HE MUST BE KNOWN TO HAVE BEEN SOMEONE WHO LIVED WEALTHY. I did not spare him but showed him his thinking is foreign to NT Christianity. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 12:55pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
pet_saint:No one is elevating any one here bro..You fail to address my post that i can understand.I am neither a catholic who elevates their pope but you will never see me attacking the catholics,rather i show them what the word of God says, i am neither an orthodox christian but you will never see me attacking their settings,rather i show them what the word of God says in love and humility, i am neither a pentecostal but you will never see me attacking what they stood for,making a mockery of them, rather i show them what the word of God says because i have been there before.I am an apostolic believer who believes in the totality of the word of God as the final authority and so far my bible did not say the gifts and manifestation of the Holy Ghost is done away with when the apostles(mere men like you said) left the scene.God is no respecter of persons but a respecter of principles. I personally believe everybody cannot be rich, regardless of the level of faith exercised, why? we all cannot handle prosperity equally. the fact of prosperity alone will lead some people to hell, since they will unleash themselves on their enemies. If i were God, i wont bless anybody that prays God to kill his enemies as it will be an avenue for bloodshedSo You believe prosperity is materialism abi? That is a shallow reasoning of scriptural truth. Biblical prosperity talks about total well being of an individual irrespective of seasons.The package comes with redemption.Are you redeemed? |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 1:03pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
[size=14pt]Do these Charlatans and their greedy followers read these verses :[/size] "Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter."- Isaiah 56:11 "...and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain" - 1 Timothy 6:5 You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me." - Matthew 26:11 "There will always be poor people in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your fellow Israelites who are poor and needy in your land." - Deuteronomy 15:11 "All they asked was that we should continue to remember the poor, the very thing I had been eager to do all along." - Galatians 2:10 " All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had. 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all 34 that there were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales 35 and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need." - Acts 4:32-35 1 Like |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 1:06pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: . So You believe prosperity is materialism abi? That is a shallow reasoning of scriptural truth. Biblical prosperity talks about total well being of an individual irrespective of seasons.The package comes with redemption.Are you redeemed? Paul, Timothy, Peter and the rest must have been ignorant of this health and wealth prosperity gospel then. What do you think? |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by DrummaBoy(m): 1:10pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
^He should read 1 Corinthians 4 and see how the apostles live and carried out their ministry |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by nlMediator: 1:54pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: I really do not have time to waste on you guys. So the basis of judging the quality of Christian writing is whether or not it is intellectual? And I guess you consider yourself and your writings as intellectual? You obviously need a dictionary. Again, if any of you is up to the challenge, meet it. If not, let it rest. That's the honorable thing to do. Everything else is hot air. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 2:01pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
shdemidemi:what do you understand by my post? Do you comprehend what I said at all? |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 2:13pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: ^He should read 1 Corinthians 4 and see how the apostles live and carried out their ministrySo why don't you humour us by forsaking your job,wife and kid and be the apostle of 1 cor 4.SMH! |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Yooguyz: 2:14pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: what do you understand by my post? Do you comprehend what I said at all?Dude, leave Frosbel alone, it is that his healing that he did not recieve, while trying to follow Kenneth Hagin's teachings that is what is making him to attack WOF. Many folks in this thread who claim to be pastors are criticising the WOF are doing so out of pure jealousy, they can't stand the impact that Hagin, copeland and likes of them, have in this our generation. It important you realize this so that they will NOT drag you into FOOLISH arguments. Bless you bro. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 2:14pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: what do you understand by my post? Do you comprehend what I said at all? You said Biblical prosperity talks about total well being of an individual irrespective of seasons. The package comes with redemption. Your statement led to my question which says Paul, Timothy, Peter and the rest must have been ignorant of your prosperity package What do you think?. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 2:20pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
shdemidemi:And how where they ignorant When you love to quote scripture to suit your private interpretations? Imagine someone quoting me 1 cor4..SMH!! |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 2:48pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: And how where they ignorant When you love to quote scripture to suit your private interpretations? Imagine someone quoting me 1 cor4..SMH!! Please show me how the apostles enjoyed the package that comes with redemption. SIMPLE |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 3:27pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Yooguyz:The problem i am trying to address here is this erroneous impression that we are the only one that have the correct biblical facts,hence we can hold others in judgement.This kind of mentality really demonstrate lack of truth. Improper judgement of others is the clearest sign of a failure to discern truth. Only the most pompous and arrogant of souls would profess to understand all truth.And this is exactly what frosbel and co are doing here in this forum,you can even see an atheist rejoicing with them in this thread. Which of us has not been made aware by the Spirit of some error in our attitude,action,or belief that required change? Hagin is human who might have made some mistakes,but does that remove his Christianity from him and the impact he made the world over? Certainly not. If these false accusers of the brethren are truthful to themselves,they will know that denominational labels don't tell us what a certain church believes but rather where it stopped. My stand here is that rather than the over amplifications of so called faults and excesses found in the body of Christ,which makes atheist to rejoice, we should seek to bury our denominational differences and walk in truth.Truth in the body comes as a consequence of a growing relationship with each other. When the Spirit is free to move among us and through us without the fear of criticism,judgment, or contention,the ability of the body to receive revelation and grow in truth is multiplied.Thanks. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 3:30pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
shdemidemi:Never mind! since you enjoy strife, divisions and two gospels.Enjoy your ministry. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Joagbaje(m): 3:58pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
shdemidemi: shdemidemi: What has the op video got to do with prosperity? . There is no special prosperity gospel . There is only one gospel. Which has to do with general prosperity ,spirit soul and body. 3 John 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth. 1 Like |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 4:18pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Joagbaje: He [b]wishes(a prayer) you to be in good health and he wishes your soul to prosper(spiritual prosperity). I don't see any profane wealth or money multiplication here. Whatever they did in the video has no precedence in the scriptures, it is total rubbish. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 4:49pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: Never mind! since you enjoy strife, divisions and two gospels.Enjoy your ministry. BIDAM!!! |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Kenny4lyfe(m): 5:49pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Joagbaje:Well said sir! Health and healing; prosperity and riches- they're all wrapped up in the gospel! That's Jesus Christ's mission when he came to planet earth! Read Luke 4:18 below! The Gospel is: riches and prosperity to the poor; healing and everlasting joy to the sick and broken hearted, the list goes on and on....
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Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Yooguyz: 6:07pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
[quote author=DrummaBoy] Ok, I take up the challenge. I took up the time to write this; pls read: MY POSITION ON KENNETH HAGIN AND THE WORD OF FAITH MOVEMENT The nairaland.com religious forum is supposed to be a public religious discussion internet site and it makes some sense that if we shall be discussing Christian doctrine we find a common ground to discuss from. For us Christians this is not difficult to do as we have the bible that most churches take as final authority on issues concerning our faith. That is why if the OP brought a video discussing the excesses of the Word of Faith movement I would expect that we use this bible to speak both for or against it. If however we find some folks come here and begin to make insinuations that are almost equating Hagin’s books with the bible, we must resist it adamantly. The Spirit of God is dynamic and can use the basest thing possible, which names the Lord Jesus, to bring men to faith in Christ and grant salvation ultimately. This does not mean that such means are scriptural and a time comes when He, the Spirit of Truth, comes to restore order to such a means. Such is the case with the Word of Faith movement – God used it for a time to bring about His purpose but the WOF is not necessarily scriptural. I have not been able to finish one book written by Kenneth Hagin despite the fact that I have come across many. The reason is simple: even before I got to know the errors in the WOF I have always found his books boring. The intellectual basis is very shallow; the books seem more packaged for sales than for edification with the glossy paper backs and so on; the text are replete with scripture quotation so that close to half of what is written in the book is a direct quotation from the bible – I often wonder why not just publish the bible and sell; the books contain little discussion on the subject of matter but so many stories bordering on the author’s experience; and finally, and the most tragic, the fact that Hagin uses his visions to grant authority to his writing – such that no one can question his theology and such that his adherents equate his writing with the bible (the very thing I am attacking on this nairaland thread). Hagin is not the only one guilty of this; virtually all authors from the WOF movement do the same. Unfortunately these are the literatures that make their way into the Nigerian Christian community and so we have the mess we have today. In the USA, were they operate, their fraudulent activities are well known – but they take advantage of our ignorance and gullibility in Nigeria to make money. Very few people know that Kenneth Hagin plagiarized a lot of the writing of E W Kenyon. A simple google search on this matter will reveal how Kenyon’s daughter had instituted court cases against Hagin on this matter. But even Kenyon’s ideas are not originally his. Kenyon was influenced by the teaching and ministry of Mary Eddy Baker, the founder of Christian Science. One of the major theologies of Christian Science is healing. Kia! "kenyon got his teachings from Mary Eddy Baker"? Am sure he would be turning in his grave by now. Bro drumma remember all Lairs shall go to hell oh! |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by shdemidemi(m): 6:19pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Kenny4lyfe: Give us the name of one apostle that enjoyed this health and wealth through the gospel of Christ please. If you can't show us how they revelled in this sort of riches, health and wealth you crave and pray for, don't you think there must be something wrong somewhere? |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 6:57pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
1 Cor 5:9-11 (NIV) I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people--not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or to the greedy or swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. WOF is a Gospel of GREED !!! Swindlers in this context will represent those false teachers who extort the fraudulent tithe from unsuspecting believers. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Ken4Christ: 8:55pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
I can see that there is so much ignorance today on spiritual matters. If the experience on the day of Pentecost was not weird, they would not have taken them for people that were drunk. If they had spoken in tongue in a quiet and most composed manner, nobody would have taken them for drunks. The experience the early disciples had could not have been much different from what you see in Kenneth Hagin's meeting. People will only talk about against people that are bigger and more knowledgeable than them. I repeat that Kenneth Hagin is the greatest teacher of the word in our generation. The effect his teachings have in my life are positive and not negative. Anyone that condemns his teachings is still a babe in the word. Grow up unto maturity. Besides the video experience, please quote some of his teachings that are not in line with the word of God. If you cannot, then stop criticizing for he knows more than you. He has even gone to be with the Lord for some years now and he lived to a fulfilled age. How many lives have most of you critic affected for the Lord? Are you even born again? I am terrified at the gross ignorance among those who profess to be believers. Instead of looking for how you will serve the Lord more faithfully, you are busy judging and condemning someone that has affected millions and is still affecting millions of souls positively. The dead have been raised in his ministry. Crippled have walked. Have you even even laid hands on people to be healed of headache? I am enjoying divine health today because of what I learnt from Kenneth Hagin. He has been a blessing to my life. God will judge every evil work will do. I am sure most of you do not want to live long. It is not an empty threat; it is the word of God. Your criticism is an evil work. Have you ever heard that Kenneth Hagin lived in sin? I am sure some of you critics are wallowing in sin. Jesus said, "By their fruits we shall know them". Lets discuss his doctrines and test them with the word of God and see who is the false teacher. 1 Like |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Nobody: 9:00pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
^^^^^ You need to humble yourself and deal with the sin of pride. |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by DrummaBoy(m): 9:03pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
Bidam: And how where they ignorant When you love to quote scripture to suit your private interpretations? Imagine someone quoting me 1 cor4..SMH!! 1 Corinthians 4: 1 Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God. 2 Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful. 3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment (but today we have who think we should not judge anyone just as they do not judge anyone. Here Paul shows that it is a small thing for anyone to judge him): yea, I judge not mine own self. 4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. 5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. 6 And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written (in other words, save for those authorized by scripture we should not exalt men above the normal), that no one of you be puffed up for one against another. That, oh Bidam, is 1 Corinthians 4, depicting the life and ministry of the apostles, not just Paul alone. Contrast it with how Hagin and these modern pastors live and make the right conclusions. The message these men claim to preach is not the gospel of Christ. Simple! |
Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by Kenny4lyfe(m): 9:35pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
shdemidemi:[b]First of all, The Desciples of Jesus are Jews (direct descendants of Abraham and therefore partakers of the Abrahamic blessing); so to answer your question, YES! they all enjoyed it! Simon Peter, Andrews, James and John for example were fishermen in The Sea of Galilee when Jesus called them into ministry, they were not just ordinary fishermen but BIG TIME fishermen and I'll explain. Firstly you might wonder, what's it like to be a fisherman in the Sea of Galilee? Sea of Galilee: The Sea of Galilee, also Kinneret or Lake of Gennesaret, is the largest freshwater lake in Israel, and it is approximately 53 km (33 mi) in circumference, about 21 km (13 mi) long, and 13 km (8.1 mi) wide. The lake has a total area of 166.7 km2 (64.4 sq mi) at its fullest, and a maximum depth of approximately 43 m (141 feet). At levels between 215 metres (705 ft) and 209 metres (686 ft) below sea level, it is the lowest freshwater lake on Earth and the second-lowest lake overall (after the Dead Sea, a saltwater lake). The lake is fed partly by underground springs although its main source is the Jordan River which flows through it from north to south. The Sea of Galilee lies on the ancient Via Maris, which linked Egypt with the northern empires. The Greeks, Hasmoneans, and Romans founded flourishing towns and settlements on the land-locked lake including Gadara, Hippos and Tiberias. The first-century historian Flavius Josephus was so impressed by the area that he wrote, "One may call this place the ambition of Nature." Josephus also reported a thriving fishing industry at this time, with 230 boats regularly working in the lake. Archaeologists discovered one such boat, nicknamed the Jesus Boat, in 1986. To think that the fishermen on this lake are poor men is an understatement, the fact that they do their fishing in groups also buttresses this fact see Mathew 4:18-21. Secondly, remember the rich young ruler in the Bible? Mathew 19:16-22. He came to Jesus asking what must he should do to have eternal life (despite the fact that he is a doer of the Law Mathew 19:20)! He was shocked at Jesus' reply, "when the young man heard this, he went away sorrowful for he had great possessions"-verse 22. The desciples were all present during this conversation. They all marvelled at Jesus' reply in asking among themselves, "who then shall be saved?" Matthew 19:23-26, Peter even spoke up in verse 27, "Lo, we have left all and followed thee..." NOW, PETER WOULDN'T MAKE THIS UTTERANCE IF HE WASN'T A RICH MAN NOW WOULD HE? THE DESCIPLES WOULDN'T MERVEL AND PUNDER WITHIN THEMSELVES ASKING "WHO THEN CAN BE SAVED?" (In other words "If the rich can't receive eternal life who will?" IF THEY WEREN'T MEN OF ESTATE? I'll advice you ask the Holy Spirit (If you've received Him) to open the eyes of your understanding whenever you're studying (meditating) on the Word of God, there's more to it than just reading it! That's all! Read Jesus' response to his desciples in Matthew 19:29[/b]
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Re: Kenneth Hagin & Kenneth Copeland - Pentecostal Confusion by DrummaBoy(m): 9:36pm On Aug 01, 2013 |
ANOTHER GOSPEL ANOTHER JESUS 1 Cor. 15:1: "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and in which you stand By which also you are saved, if you keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless you have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scripture."the Gospel consists of Three points according to the apostle Paul. 1) He died for our SINS 2) He was buried (proving he died). 3) He rose again taking up the same body he came in. The Gospel concerns Gods son and his work for us to remove our sin . If it is focused on something else other than the cross and his resurrection it is not the gospel of Christ. The Son of God came as the savior (1 Jn 4:14), that he is Lord of the universe (which relates to a triune nature of God). We stand in it by trusting in his work. Salvation is a gift freely given not earned. We work from salvation not toward it. Our part is that we are commissioned to preach it and to make disciples. 2 Cor. 11:3-4 "But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted-- you may well put up with it. (you will have to endure it, or you wear it beautifully, and some do)." another Jesus - (allos) is a primary word; "else," different (in many applications) The name is the same, its the name Jesus from the Bible but it is not the Jesus of the Bible. He is different one, with some similarities on the surface level. A different Spirit -(heteros)-to number as opposed to some former person or thing the other of two; referring to quality: that is, one that is not of the same nature, form, class, or kind, to be different. Another Gospel (heteros) of uncertain affinity; different: altered, strange. It is not the same one Paul preached, it has a qualitative difference. Alterations of the Christian message have always been with us but not since the beginning of the church have they become so rampant and outrageous. Some of the cults would blush at what is now being said from Christian pulpits. Paul warns Gal 1:6-9: "I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed." Another gospel; the same sort"; heteros expresses a qualitative difference and denotes "another of a different sort. "Paul speaks of "a different good (heteros), which is not another" in contrast to any other Gospel which there is none (allos, another like the one he preached), Angels were always involved in revelation to mankind. Paul under prophetic inspiration warns the believers then and us now of receiving new understanding from a spiritual source that would alter what was first delivered to them. Today so much gets blamed on the Holy Spirit with teachers speaking impromptu from the pulpits. To be perverted means to twist a thing around, they destroyed it by having additions to grace, distorting the nature of the person and the work of Christ. To anathematize someone is to label them a false teacher. If someone teaches another gospel that affects who Christ is or how one relates to him , or distorts grace by subtracting or adding any work it becomes another Gospel.They are to be cut off, cast away. anathema- a thing devoted to God without hope of being redeemed, in the O T. if it was an animal it was to be slain; in the N.T. it is person or thing doomed to destruction. According to those who are new Pentecostal leaders the church, Jesus took on the nature of Satan on the cross, died spiritually, and went to complete the plan of redemption in hell. But he had to be born again. No longer is it a baptism in the Holy Spirit as the "2nd blessing", but now are under an anointing for new revelations. They are changing the very message that can save a sinner by shifting the focus to another place. They also change the nature of Jesus at the cross and afterward. Lets take a journey into the new revelation knowledge of the more famous promoters, the men of renown. "When Jesus cried "It is finished!" He was not speaking of the plan of redemption. There were still three days and nights to go through before He went to the throne. He was referring to the Abrahamic Covenant. Jesus' death on the cross was only the beginning of the complete work of redemption" (Kenneth Copeland, "Jesus - Our Lord of Glory", ( Believer's Voice of Victory, April, 1982, p. 3). This is a direct assault on the Gods way for salvation Christ's physical death upon the cross. This is not debatable the Bible is absolutely clear in its teaching on this matter. Anyone who has read the NT accounts finds the phrase "it is finished" The Greek word for this term is tetelestai, which means the debt (sin) has been paid in full! To say otherwise is calling Jesus, the Scripture, and the Holy Spirit liars. "Do you think that the punishment for our sin was to die on a cross? If that were the case, the two thieves could have paid our price. No, the punishment was to go into hell itself and to serve time in hell separated from God" (Frederick K. C. Price,javascript:void(0); Ever Increasing Faith Messenger, June 1990, p. 7). This is what Price thinks of the sacrifice of the unblemished lamb, that if this is the case, two sinners could have obtained it. What does Peter say (2 Pt.2:1) who will bring in heresies that will destroy, even denying the Lord that bought them. They change what Christ said to the thief on the cross, instead of "Today you will be with Me in Paradise," He should have said, "Today you will be incarcerated with Me suffering in hell." Not too hopeful of a promise is it. "Somewhere between the time He [Jesus] was nailed to the cross and when He was in the Garden of Gethsemane—somewhere in there—He died spiritually. Personally, I believe it was while He was in the garden." (Frederick K. C. Price, Identification #3 ( Ever Increasing Faith Ministries, 1980) tape #FP545, side 1) If he was separated (dying spiritually in the garden) then why would he wait until the third hour on the cross the cry out "my God my God why have you forsaken me" Price shifts the focus to some other time.One can only wonder why they don' t want to see the glory in the crucifixion as the Apostle Paul did! To die spiritually meaning at the very least separation before he had the sins laid on him is to destroy the whole OT teaching of the blood put on the altar. To have the redemption in another place at another time destroys its very purpose. These become fables the very thing we are warned of in Scripture. 2 Tim 4:4-5 " and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry."Are you being watchful ? Or are you listening and believing what certain men are teaching. If not your work as an evangelist will be hindered and your ministries calling will suffer. that's what Paul said , its not my opinion. Titus 1:14 " not giving heed to Jewish fables and commandments of men who turn from the truth." Even in their day there were fables circulating from those who did not yield to the truth. Its been almost 2,000 years and not much has changed. "The righteousness of God was made to be sin. He accepted the sin nature of Satan in his own spirit. And at that moment that He did so He cried, 'My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me?' You don't know what happened at the cross. Why do you think Moses, upon instruction of God, raised the serpent upon that pole instead of a lamb? That use to bug me. I said, 'Why in the world would you want to put a snake up there - the sign of Satan? Why didn't you put a lamb on that pole?" And the Lord said, "Because it was a sign of Satan that was hanging on the cross.'He (Jesus) said, "I accepted in my own spirit, spiritual death; and the light was turned out." (Kenneth Copeland, What Happened From the Cross to the Throne? cassette tape 1990, Side B). Ask yourself is this truth, is it written in Scripture or are they going beyond the written word for their information ? If so, Then it is a fable. Why would the Lord tell Copeland it was a sign of Satan when there is not even a hint of this in the he word! While there are numerous problems to be answered with Copeland's conversation with God and being communicated false doctrine. To become sin in his nature does away with the lamb of God who now becomes the lamb of Satan. The only way the cross would be in reference to Satan is that Christ overcame him on it. Col.2:14-15 makes it clear he triumphed at the cross, not in hell. But the faith teachers are saying he became defeated on the cross, that's not the Bibles view, that's theirs. Col 2:15 " Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it." At the CROSS! Gloria Copeland agrees of course with her husband "He (Jesus) paid the price for Adam's sin. He suffered in His own body, and more important, in His own spirit. Jesus experienced the same spiritual death that entered man in the Garden of Eden." (G. Copeland, "God's Will For You", Fort Worth, Texas, K. Copeland Ministries, p.5) This means that Jesus became a sinner just like all of mankind. He was born sinless and died a sinner, how's that for a switch. Kenneth E. Hagin who is Copelands discipler states, "spiritual death means something more than separation from God. Spiritual death also means having Satan's nature... Jesus tasted death--spiritual death--for every man." K. Hagin, The Name of Jesus, 1981) p.31. Hagin explains, "...just as receiving eternal life means that we have the nature of God in us, spiritual death means having Satan's nature." K. Hagin, Redeemed, Tulsa, OK, Faith Library, 1966, p.29) As Adam received Satan's nature so did Jesus. Eph. 5:2 makes it clear Jesus did not become a unholy sinner on the cross, but was a holy sin offering who 'gave himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a beautiful fragrant aroma, Not a stench of sin! Benny .Hinn, "Ladies and gentlemen, the serpent is a symbol of Satan. Jesus Christ knew the only way he would stop Satan was by becoming one in nature with him. You say, What did you say? What blasphemy is this? No, you hear this! He did not take my sin; He became my sin. Sin is the nature of hell. Sin is what made Satan…It was sin that made Satan. Jesus said, "I’ll be sin! I’ll go to the lowest place! I’ll go to the origin of it! I won’t just take part in it, I’ll be the totality of it!" When Jesus became sin, sir, He took it from A to Z and said, "No more!" Think about this: He became flesh, that flesh might become like Him. He became death, so dying man can live. He became sin, so sinners can be righteous in Him. He became one with the nature of Satan, so all those who had the nature of Satan can partake of the nature of God." (Benny Hinn, Benny Hinn program on TBN (December 15, 1990). First of all the origin of Sin is not Hell but from man, it is in our nature. K.Copeland "The spirit of Jesus accepting that sin and making it to be sin, He separated from His God and at that moment He's a mortal man. Capable of failure, capable of death. And if Satan is capable of overpowering Him there, he'll win the universe and mankind is doomed. Don't get the idea that Jesus was incapable of failure because if He had been, it would have been illegal." (What Happened From the Cross to the Throne, Tape #00-0303) Not only does he have Satan's nature and has the Devil win (temporarily) but the Son who is God failed. "He [Jesus] allowed the devil to drag Him into the depths of hell....He allowed Himself to come under Satan's control...every demon in hell came down on Him to annihilate Him....They tortured Him beyond anything anybody had ever conceived. For three days He suffered everything there is to suffer." (Kenneth Copeland, "The Price of It All," 3.) Talk about a fable, how does he know this? By the new revelation of the Jesus he serves, the one who failed became a sinner went to hell and was born again. "For three days He suffered everything there is to suffer. Some people don't want to believe that. They want to believe that after His death, Jesus just stayed in that upper region of Sheol that the Bible calls paradise, but they're mistaken! If He had simply stayed there, there would have been no price paid for sin." (Believer's Voice of Victory, Vol. 19, No. 9, Sept. 1991) - http://www.letusreason.org/Wf2.htm |
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