wiegraf:

You do notice you've just stated he can NOT build a rock he cannot carry, yes?

Below is wat i shared wit someone on nairaland who claims a knowlegde and life outside God, i think it will benefit u too. He wrote:

wat word of God? have u heard God talk that u say u know the word of God? word of Jewish men u call word of God.

My response:

U see, such intelligence u claim is referred to vanity in d Word, the best of d knowledge of ds world is darkness, vanity and foolishness. I m not here to argue wit u on whether thr is God or Savior. I will rather strife 2get u saved in Christ wit every opportunity given to me by God than engage in unending fallacy/argument. Anytin i need to discuss outside ds wont benefit d unsaved.

See, ppl wit lik tot dt u portrayed ar fully identified in d scriptures even b4 we were born and d more i hear u, d more i see God's grace and power abounding to save u thru d Gospel of Christ. Definitely wiegraf, u wont escape ds grace because b4 ur rejection and acquiring of knowledge, He has loved u. Ur struggling wit it or trying hard to prove it wrong cant nullify His desire for u - "To be saved and come to d knowlegde of His glory".

ajayikayod:

Bro, every christian article relates to every believer, we only need to benchmark it with d Word as d final authority.

I will ask u,which should we hold to, Man experience or d Word of God, especially whn thr are contradictions?

U hav reduced a spiritual question of urs to mere human experience, quoting Shamback, quoting others except d Word of God. If i were u, Bro, i ll back it up wit Paul, Peter.. most of all Jesus. U seems not to hav enough prove from them or u feel u hav a "personal experienc" outside wat they teach?

And what is wrong with expetience ? the apostles documrnted their exoerience . jesus hungry ,jesus cursing a tree, so in what way does cursing a tree glorify God. It's obvious you don't flow flow in the supernatural. You're merely a critic displaying ego And your criticism is unnecessary.

What is edifying is paul and alexander experience .

2 Timothy 4:14
Alexander the coppersmith has done me much harm. The Lord will punish him,

Or his afflictions and sufferings? Why need he pen it down?

2 Corinthians 11:25
Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep

Criticism is very sweet you know, it gives you the holier than thou feeling

apostle007:
The implication of Paul needing deliverance is beside the point. And whatever meaning you assign to Paul's "messenger of satan" is also beside the point. What is clear in the Bible is that Paul was tormented by it and needed relief and asked to be free of it! If that is not needing deliverance, I wonder what is!

Whn u throw things away in d name of beside d point, it doesnt allow a proper understanding of issues at hand. Following ur line of tot, we then conclude dt Jesus needed deliverance too (Let ds cup pass over...). But glory b to God, he is d deliverer.

U ar not answering my questions

Act 10:46, Act 19:6, Mark 16:15-18. If a believer had to grow for some time, lik u said b4 functioning in Spirit abilities, why is tongue diff. D truth is they ar all of one - Spirit given.

You implied that Paul didn't preach deliverance. Nor did he preach Baptism. Jesus went through baptism. Believers are still being baptized, what then is your point? That Paul didn't preach deliverance is irrelevant to the validity of the ministry of deliverance.

Never told u Paul didnt preach deliverance but not to d believer except u show us one here.

The scriptures you quoted are promises made to believers, nevertheless you would exercise faith to walk in the fullness of these promises. But faith is a gift (1Cor 12:9) and also a fruit of the Spirit(Gal.5:22-23), so the exercise of faith differ from one believer to the other despite the fact that they've all accepted Christ as Lord and Saviour. If faith is a gift to one believer, to another it is a fruit of the Spirit which develops over time.

U said Col 1:13 is a promise? Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son. Bro, past tense a promise?. They ar not promises they ar realities. Greater is he dt is in u. Bro, wat actually is salvation, wat do u think Jesus saved us from, wat exactly is the origin of oppressions, who actually is d oppressor, wat is his position to a believer. Whn u read we ar complete in Him who is d head..., wat goes on d ur mind on dt.

The preaching of deliverance in any form to a believer is just to enslave them and keep them coming to church. Having God's revelation thru is word is enough without putting them in bondage, they ll come.

Bro, Holy Spirit doesnt bear fruits, dt refered to the recreated human spirit, check well.

You asked me to remove renewing of the mind from the list of what deliverance is because it would make deliverance a continuous process. Not a chance! Who told you deliverance is a one time event? Else, there wouldn't be any need for believers, as demonstrated in the Lord's prayer, to pray for deliverance from evil. Nor would we need an Advocate on the right hand side of God interceding for us (Romans 8:34, note the present continuous tense). As long as the works of darkness is ongoing, deliverance will be a lifetime process until the trumpet blows.
Further more, deliverance is also a function of knowledge. And in so far as you agree that none is above renewing, then none (including Paul) should be above deliverance!

Here's the thing, every time you overcome temptations or undo any work of Satan, you are going through deliverance. Deliverance could be from sickness or anger or lust or fear or even pride. So your suggestion that no believer needed deliverance is arrogant and unwarranted. Are you implying that you are perfect and immune from sin? You see, wanting deliverance doesn't necessarily mean you've submitted to a "messenger of Satan." It could mean being tormented by it, just as in the case of Paul.

And lastly, deliverance does not in any way demean the position of a believer who lives not by works but by God's Grace.

Romans 8:34? try take it from verse 31 till 37
31: What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
37: Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able (to be against us) to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Jesus advocating wit d father is a reality of our forgiveness not deliverance, he wont deliver again, he has delivered, one and for all
Heb 10:10, By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. Sanctified thr implies hagiazo (to make holy, i.e. purify or consecrate).
Heb 9:12
1 Pet 1:9-10, But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar (purchased) people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light.
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.

Bro, most things u listed requiring deliverance are solved by common sense. D man dt stole, Paul didnt say lets condcut deliverance for him, he simply said, steal no more. Today, ppl would hav conducted series of deliverance for such. Paul wrote 14 books and all filled wit teaching of God's Word, no single mention of conducting deliverance for a believer in all d books yet we dwell on our own "personal revelation/experiences" straying from His word. A thorough exposure to revelation of God's word and proper discipleship/training is wat every believer needs to kno thr right in Christ, sadly dt s d most church and leaders lack today.

superior1: I have seen demons begging and threatening to deal with the minister on many occasions. I remembered praying with a Brother to God to direct His Angels to bring a Sister we had an appointment with but in the last minute decided not to show up, the first thing she said when she entered the ministration room is 'who brought me here from my room?'.

Never had the SMS scenario but from experience know the world of angels and demons is more real than most realized.

Amazing very true that world is more real and tangible than we can infinitive discuss or comprehend

Joagbaje:

And what is wrong with expetience ? the apostles documrnted their exoerience . jesus hungry ,jesus cursing a tree, so in what way does cursing a tree glorify God. It's obvious you don't flow flow in the supernatural. You're merely a critic displaying ego And your criticism is unnecessary.

What is edifying is paul and alexander experience .

2 Timothy 4:14
Alexander the coppersmith has done me much harm. The Lord will punish him,

Or his afflictions and sufferings? Why need he pen it down?

2 Corinthians 11:25
Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep

Criticism is very sweet you know, it gives you the holier than thou feeling

Stop hiding behind ds criticism or ego of a thing, lets talk God's Word.

I never told u dt experience is bad but it must align wit d word of God. All Paul experiences u quoted has a place in His Word and for our learning, i.e. persecution. Then give me Paul's writing supporting ur Op claims or we should just stay in d realm of nairaland human experience to jugde spiritual things?
See, no one is criticizin u, just sharing and admonishing u but taking it as criticizin wont help.

ajayikayod:
I never told u dt experience is bad but it must align wit d word of God. All Paul experiences u quoted has a place in His Word and for our learning,

Really? so what's the edification and learning in Paul's experience here.

1 Thessalonians 2:18
Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

So Paul was exalting the devil to be so powerful to hinder a whole apostle! Isn't it? .

I received an sms like I had mentioned earlier but didn't have time to explain and share by virtue of a tight schedule, but here it is, my story of my very first encounter.
My first experience was somewhat absurd and nothing near the least of my expectations, a dear lady had responded to a "WORD OF KNOWLEDGE" regarding those who have been tormented by strange voices you know they'll just be hearing voices and her case was rather quite pathetic because for her it was one torment she had had to live with for years silently but she was fed up and wanted freedom.
Just a brief background on her past, she had been initiated into witchcraft at a very tender age Infact she had mentioned that on the occasion of one of her birthday she was corona ted as "a bride of Satan" on which occasion Satan had sex with her(which virtually continued) and she had been raised by a so called "queen mother"(whose name it won't be necessary to mention".
Now I had been opportune to participate in ministering with my pastor to her who(my pastor) later left the work for I and a couple of us that were present to finish so he could attend to other pressing matters.
After we were through with ministering to the dear lady oh what great joy and fulfillment seeing the power of God through His eternal Spirit in the Mighty name of Jesus Christ bring demons to compelled obedience, those devils cast out and what a relief for the lady who by this time was all in tears.
After everything that day I personally took interest and responsibility in monitoring the lady considering the fact that I had previously known her from another of my friend but from a distance it was in the course of this monitoring and follow-up that my moment of truth came.
I had gotten seriously involved in praying, interceeding, and encouraging her along with my pastor and often times she will share experiences again again some as testimonies others as counter attack attempts so on this particular I remember it was a Friday and I was observing a fast while I lay down, then my phone beeped and I looked it was an sms bearing the name of my friend so like every regular sms the next thing is open it and read so I wasn't at all ready for what I was to see moments following.
I opened and read, now she had told me of a certain "queen mother" who claimed to be her mother and had raised her in witch craft and the said the "queen mother" told her(my friend) that "...I know your weak point..." so that was more or less like a threat so the sms that I received was along those lines (paraphrase) "... I told you I know her weak point...she is mine...leave her alone..." wow! I had never seen this before so I had to read it again because I needed to be sure this was real I confirmed the contact again because she would not sound like this usually she almost always sounded very polite and respectful especially with the use of "sir" so I was wondering where was this coming from but then I now remembered the conversation we had previously so I just decoded and smiled.
So much to say but so little time to type nonetheless this is a summary recount of my first experience because I had other instance. All praise and glory to God Almighty

Joagbaje:

Really? so what's the edification and learning in Paul's experience here.

1 Thessalonians 2:18
Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

So Paul was exalting the devil to be so powerful to hinder a whole apostle! Isn't it? .

Bro, we were admonished to always explain scriptures wit scriptures becos no scripture stands alone nor contradict the other.

1 Thess 2:18 u quoted is not about spiritual oppressions, its all about persecution. Read Paul well, he always talk about utterance given so dt d gospel may hav free course (not hindered). D only trick devil has today on any believer is IGNORANCE (lack of knowlegde of God's word0 AND PERSECUTION (ability to use d unsaved hinder d gospel of Christ). aside these, he is just a big lair, fearful and defeated.

And in the area of persecution, God will not just "wipe out" all those who oppose us so that we can preach the Gospel without any hindrance. He loves even those who reject Him. God's mercy toward those who persecute us may cause us some hardships, but it allows the unbelievers the opportunity to receive salvation

Paul made a similar statement to this one in Ro 15:18-24,
(I will not venture to speak of anything except what Christ has accomplished through me in leading the Gentiles to obey God by what I have said and done— 19 by the power of signs and wonders, through the power of the Spirit of God. So from Jerusalem all the way around to Illyricum, I have fully proclaimed the gospel of Christ. 20 It has always been my ambition to preach the gospel where Christ was not known, so that I would not be building on someone else’s foundation. 21 Rather, as it is written:

“Those who were not told about him will see,
and those who have not heard will understand.”
22 This is why I have often been hindered from coming to you.
23 But now that there is no more place for me to work in these regions, and since I have been longing for many years to visit you, 24 I plan to do so when I go to Spain. I hope to see you while passing through and to have you assist me on my journey there, after I have enjoyed your company for a while.)

In that passage, he explained that the hindrance to his traveling to Rome was that there were unreached people around him that he felt compelled to preach to before he could leave them. It is most probable that he was describing the same thing here. He wanted to return to Thessalonica; but Satan was hindering the preaching of the Gospel, so it was taking Paul longer than he anticipated to finish his work there.

1 Corinthians 16:9, For a great door and effectual is opened unto me, and [there are] many adversaries.

Paul was saying that the Lord had given him a great opportunity to share the Gospel in Ephesus, but there was much opposition.

ajayikayod:

Bro, we were admonished to always explain scriptures wit scriptures becos no scripture stands alone nor contradict the other.

1 Thess 2:18 u quoted is not about spiritual oppressions, its all about persecution.

Says who? Dont add to scriptures . The afflictions of paul is not all about persecution, he could only be persecuted after preaching . But in this case he didn't even get there . He was impeded by the enemy from making the trip. It's not persecution dear.

When Paul talked about his weaknesses or bodily affliction and weaknesses was it persecution. When he fell into the hand of armed robbers was it persecution. Was shipwreck persecution.?

newmi: I received an sms like I had mentioned earlier but didn't have time to explain . . . I remember it was a Friday and I was observing a fast while I lay down, then my phone beeped and I looked it was an sms bearing the name of my friend so like every regular sms the next thing is open it and read so I wasn't at all ready for what I was to see moments following.
I opened and read, now she had told me of a certain "queen mother" who claimed to be her mother and had raised her in witch craft and the said the "queen mother" told her(my friend) that "...I know your weak point..." so that was more or less like a threat so the sms that I received was along those lines (paraphrase) "... I told you I know her weak point...she is mine...leave her alone..." wow! I had never seen this before so I had to read it again because I needed to be sure this was real I confirmed the contact again because she would not sound like this usually she almost always sounded very polite and respectful especially with the use of "sir" so I was wondering where was this coming from but then I now remembered the conversation we had previously so I just decoded and smiled.
So much to say but so little time to type nonetheless this is a summary recount of my first experience because I had other instance. All praise and glory to God Almighty

So who types the sms and how did the matter eventually end?

ajayikayod:


Below is wat i shared wit someone on nairaland who claims a knowlegde and life outside God, i think it will benefit u too. He wrote:



My response:

U see, such intelligence u claim is referred to vanity in d Word, the best of d knowledge of ds world is darkness, vanity and foolishness. I m not here to argue wit u on whether thr is God or Savior. I will rather strife 2get u saved in Christ wit every opportunity given to me by God than engage in unending fallacy/argument. Anytin i need to discuss outside ds wont benefit d unsaved.

See, ppl wit lik tot dt u portrayed ar fully identified in d scriptures even b4 we were born and d more i hear u, d more i see God's grace and power abounding to save u thru d Gospel of Christ. Definitely wiegraf, u wont escape ds grace because b4 ur rejection and acquiring of knowledge, He has loved u. Ur struggling wit it or trying hard to prove it wrong cant nullify His desire for u - "To be saved and come to d knowlegde of His glory".

You see, such 'wisdom' you have here is a lot of things, all silly. And I don't need a storybook to tell me that, simple common sense can discern that. For instance, I cannot but note you did not answer anything. You simply blatantly threw a poor cop-out, one that translates mostly to mysteriosnesees. Also, you seem to be asking me to defer to your authority, just because. What is wrong with you? You're telling me 1+1=10 and I should just accept it because? Are you high? Do I look like your slave or something? You expect me to simply believe obvious nonsense just because??

A simple question, can your god build a rock he cannot carry, yes or no? I am trying to save anyone with a semblance of a brain from folly, hope you can understand that?

And again, if you can accept nonsensical claims because of mysteriousneseses, why do you have problems with the op? He has as much evidence backing him up as your storybook; non. Indeed his claim is more plausible than many in the bible, yes? Spirits can possess, yes? It's in your storybook. So why not possess someone at mtn even, then troll for souls with bulk sms? If you insist there must be a natural means of achieving this feat, why can't the demons use unknown technology to achieve his objectives? They're capable of turning into snakes and having conversations yet incapable of this?

Why the opprobrium for the op?

wiegraf:

You see, such 'wisdom' you have here is a lot of things, all silly. And I don't need a storybook to tell me that, simple common sense can discern that. For instance, I cannot but note you did not answer anything. You simply blatantly threw a poor cop-out, one that translates mostly to mysteriosnesees. Also, you seem to be asking me to defer to your authority, just because. What is wrong with you? You're telling me 1+1=10 and I should just accept it because? Are you high? Do I look like your slave or something? You expect me to simply believe obvious nonsense just because??

A simple question, can your god build a rock he cannot carry, yes or no? I am trying to save anyone with a semblance of a brain from folly, hope you can understand that?

And again, if you can accept nonsensical claims because of mysteriousneseses, why do you have problems with the op? He has as much evidence backing him up as your storybook; non. Indeed his claim is more plausible than many in the bible, yes? Spirits can possess, yes? It's in your storybook. So why not possess someone at mtn even, then troll for souls with bulk sms? If you insist there must be a natural means of achieving this feat, why can't the demons use unknown technology to achieve his objectives? They're capable of turning into snakes and having conversations yet incapable of this?

Why the opprobrium for the op?

Sir, i m definitely HIGH and i ll remain high on this. And watz wrong wit me is dt i find it hard to giv up on u.

Its important u kno dt God is not mysterious as u may hav heard many times. He s only mysterious to d outside but to us (Christian) it has been given (revealed) to know Him and things concerning Him. These things will remain mysteries as long as someone is far from him, hence to understand Him, i want u draw nearer, closer to whr mysteries are turned into realities. i kno u desire explanations of many things in d scriptures, u just felt how can i just believ in someone i cant see and many explanations u ve gotten couldnt answer ur questions. i show u a true way to get all answered without shadows of turning.

Joagbaje:

So who types the sms and how did the matter eventually end?

I wouldn't know exactly how the sms was typed because she was miles away at that instance but almost immediately I received the sms I sent a reply with the words "WHO ARE YOU" hoping to get a reply but none so I waited with the hope to asking the lady in question on seeing her and that I did.

When I saw her I walked up to her and almost immediately she saw me she confronted me with the question "...I don't understand your message...please why are you asking me who am I..." and my response was hey look at the message you sent me so I was simply replying then with a gesture I showed her the message but she was shocked and bewildered and she couldn't remember sending such message at all even she herself couldn't believe it and that same day we dismissed with a prayer because in the course of these events she had been attacked with an illness and she was fine.

Joagbaje:

Says who? Dont add to scriptures . The afflictions of paul is not all about persecution, he could only be persecuted after preaching . But in this case he didn't even get there . He was impeded by the enemy from making the trip. It's not persecution dear.

When Paul talked about his weaknesses or bodily affliction and weaknesses was it persecution. When he fell into the hand of armed robbers was it persecution. Was shipwreck persecution.?

Bro, u really are not reading all i wrote or possibly reading wit defensive goggle. I will lov u to do a thorough study on 1 Corith 12 without a mindset.

Rom 15:19
Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
20, Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
21, But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
22, For which cause also I have been much hindered from coming to you.

Which cause? verse 20 and 21 giv u d answer. I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named.

Bro, ppl in serious evangelism will tell u dt, dt is one of d hardest feat in mission work. Demanding so much from u. We ve seen ppl been hindered to even see thr families, children etc for d cause of d gospel.

1 Thess 2: 14
14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: {persecuted us: or, chased us out}
16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
17 But we, brethren, being taken from you for a short time in presence, not in heart, endeavored the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

Verse 18 says: wherefore. "Wherefore" is not an english word dt can stand alone, we need to read previous verses to kno d knowledge transmitted.

Verse 2 down answered dt
2, But even after that we had suffered before, and were shamefully entreated, as ye know, at Philippi, we were bold in our God to speak unto you the gospel of God with much contention., Read up to verse 16.

Can i ask u, wat exactly did Christ saved us from? wat actually is d origin of devil tormenting man. Do u agree dt salvation and newbirth are total (new created spirit, born of God).

Lastly, falling into criminals' hands, having shipwreck, having flat tyre whn going on mission, raining heavily whn set for crusade can all b hindrances but never ever call for deliverance show because a believer has overcome already. In fact d wreck described by Paul, he had a foreknowledge of it, he was never in darkness.

Bro, we also are not in it. We ar always aware, nothing take us by surprise or by chance, children of light (no darkness in or around us), light of the world Bro, The greater one lives in us. As he is (complete, justified, glorified, righteous, delivered, triumphant), so ar we in ds world (1 John 4:17).

ajayikayod:

Bro, u really are not reading all i wrote or possibly reading wit defensive goggle. I will lov u to do a thorough study on 1 Corith 12 without a mindset.

Rom 15:19
Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
20, Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
21, But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
22, For which cause also I have been much hindered from coming to you.

Which cause? verse 20 and 21 giv u d answer. I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named.

Bro, ppl in serious evangelism will tell u dt, dt is one of d hardest feat in mission work. Demanding so much from u. We ve seen ppl been hindered to even see thr families, children etc for d cause of d gospel.

1 Thess 2: 14
14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: {persecuted us: or, chased us out}
16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
17 But we, brethren, being taken from you for a short time in presence, not in heart, endeavored the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

Verse 18 says: wherefore. "Wherefore" is not an english word dt can stand alone, we need to read previous verses to kno d knowledge transmitted.

Verse 2 down answered dt
2, But even after that we had suffered before, and were shamefully entreated, as ye know, at Philippi, we were bold in our God to speak unto you the gospel of God with much contention., Read up to verse 16.

Can i ask u, wat exactly did Christ saved us from? wat actually is d origin of devil tormenting man. Do u agree dt salvation and newbirth are total (new created spirit, born of God).

Lastly, falling into criminals' hands, having shipwreck, having flat tyre whn going on mission, raining heavily whn set for crusade can all b hindrances but never ever call for deliverance show because a believer has overcome already. In fact d wreck described by Paul, he had a foreknowledge of it, he was never in darkness.

Bro, we also are not in it. We ar always aware, nothing take us by surprise or by chance, children of light (no darkness in or around us), light of the world Bro, The greater one lives in us. As he is (complete, justified, glorified, righteous, delivered, triumphant), so ar we in ds world (1 John 4:17).

Let me understand you, when you become a Christian, you do not need deliverance ministration or something?

A Christian can get obsessed and oppressed by demons but can't be possessed. I have never ministered to anybody who is not born again anyways because the end will only be worst if otherwise.

superior1:

Let me understand you, when you become a Christian, you do not need deliverance ministration or something?

A Christian can get obsessed and oppressed by demons but can't be possessed. I have never ministered to anybody who is not born again anyways because the end will only be worst.

I asked some questions in d post u responded to, can u kindly provide answers or clarification?

ajayikayod:

Bro, u really are not reading all i wrote or possibly reading wit defensive goggle. I will lov u to do a thorough study on 1 Corith 12 without a mindset.

Rom 15:19
Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
20, Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
21, But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
22, For which cause also I have been much hindered from coming to you.

Which cause? verse 20 and 21 giv u d answer. I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named.

Bro, ppl in serious evangelism will tell u dt, dt is one of d hardest feat in mission work. Demanding so much from u. We ve seen ppl been hindered to even see thr families, children etc for d cause of d gospel.

1 Thess 2: 14
14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: {persecuted us: or, chased us out}
16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
17 But we, brethren, being taken from you for a short time in presence, not in heart, endeavored the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

Verse 18 says: wherefore. "Wherefore" is not an english word dt can stand alone, we need to read previous verses to kno d knowledge transmitted.

Verse 2 down answered dt
2, But even after that we had suffered before, and were shamefully entreated, as ye know, at Philippi, we were bold in our God to speak unto you the gospel of God with much contention., Read up to verse 16.

Can i ask u, wat exactly did Christ saved us from? wat actually is d origin of devil tormenting man. Do u agree dt salvation and newbirth are total (new created spirit, born of God).

Lastly, falling into criminals' hands, having shipwreck, having flat tyre whn going on mission, raining heavily whn set for crusade can all b hindrances but never ever call for deliverance show because a believer has overcome already. In fact d wreck described by Paul, he had a foreknowledge of it, he was never in darkness.

Bro, we also are not in it. We ar always aware, nothing take us by surprise or by chance, children of light (no darkness in or around us), light of the world Bro, The greater one lives in us. As he is (complete, justified, glorified, righteous, delivered, triumphant), so ar we in ds world (1 John 4:17).

Just clinging on straws , humble yourself. Paul's hindrances and set backs were caused by a demon. That demon was responsible for the afflictions ,persecution, hardship ,and many weariness of Paul.

ajayikayod:

Bro, u really are not reading all i wrote or possibly reading wit defensive goggle. I will lov u to do a thorough study on 1 Corith 12 without a mindset.

Rom 15:19
Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
20, Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
21, But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
22, For which cause also I have been much hindered from coming to you.

Which cause? verse 20 and 21 giv u d answer. I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named.

Bro, ppl in serious evangelism will tell u dt, dt is one of d hardest feat in mission work. Demanding so much from u. We ve seen ppl been hindered to even see thr families, children etc for d cause of d gospel.

1 Thess 2: 14
14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: {persecuted us: or, chased us out}
16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
17 But we, brethren, being taken from you for a short time in presence, not in heart, endeavored the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

Verse 18 says: wherefore. "Wherefore" is not an english word dt can stand alone, we need to read previous verses to kno d knowledge transmitted.

Verse 2 down answered dt
2, But even after that we had suffered before, and were shamefully entreated, as ye know, at Philippi, we were bold in our God to speak unto you the gospel of God with much contention., Read up to verse 16.

Can i ask u, wat exactly did Christ saved us from? wat actually is d origin of devil tormenting man. Do u agree dt salvation and newbirth are total (new created spirit, born of God).

Lastly, falling into criminals' hands, having shipwreck, having flat tyre whn going on mission, raining heavily whn set for crusade can all b hindrances but never ever call for deliverance show because a believer has overcome already. In fact d wreck described by Paul, he had a foreknowledge of it, he was never in darkness.

Bro, we also are not in it. We ar always aware, nothing take us by surprise or by chance, children of light (no darkness in or around us), light of the world Bro, The greater one lives in us. As he is (complete, justified, glorified, righteous, delivered, triumphant), so ar we in ds world (1 John 4:17).

Joagbaje:

Just clinging on straws , humble yourself. Paul's hindrances and set backs were caused by a demon. That demon was responsible for the afflictions ,persecution, hardship ,and many weariness of Paul.

Enough of all these Infact they are mere distractions there's so much to talk about and discuss on this topic so if you don't a story to share its on wise u listen to those who have and let's discuss meaningfully. Thank you

superior1:

Let me understand you, when you become a Christian, you do not need deliverance ministration or something?

A Christian can get obsessed and oppressed by demons but can't be possessed. I have never ministered to anybody who is not born again anyways because the end will only be worst.

please guys I don't want to ensue in this arguments that has been going on for eternity,but I know that when a christian is genuinely born again,saved,you don't need any form of deliverance from the power of darkness again cos col 1 I think frm verse 13 explains that.maybe the only thing one needs is trying to make sure one dsnt go back to sin.in the case one does,an maybe one is ministered to,I wouldn't call that deliverance from the power of darkness,rather restoration from the bondage of sin.thanks.

Crixina: please guys I don't want to ensue in this arguments that has been going on for eternity,but I know that when a christian is genuinely born again,saved,you don't need any form of deliverance from the power of darkness again cos col 1 I think frm verse 13 explains that.maybe the only thing one needs is trying to make sure one dsnt go back to sin.in the case one does,an maybe one is ministered to,I wouldn't call that deliverance from the power of darkness,rather restoration from the bondage of sin.thanks.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.Ephesians 6:12

That verse was a message Paul sent to technically born again Christians. Christians have these false believe once they become born-again, there is an end to the warfare they will be engaged in.

A born again Christian cannot be possessed by demons (Because the Holy Spirit reside in his spirit) but I have seen genuinely born again come under attacks, sickness, oppression etc inflicted by demons and prayers of warfare (that is what i meant by deliverance) had to be conducted for them to be loose.

Becoming born again is like giving birth to a new child, that is not the end of the whole story, dirt has to be washed off, umbilical cord (former oaths, allegiances to demons, curses and spells etc) all have to be broken, most times these newly born can hardly wash themselves (hence they depend on someone more mature), adult Christians atimes also get involve in things and come in contact with warfare that makes them approach a matured and experienced Christian to assist them in prayers of warfare (deliverance)

Like someone said, i think the problem is that people have got these fake thinking whenever you mentioned deliverance ministration, you are talking of rolling on the floor, vomiting, demonic shouting etc, whereas these kind of outward manifestation do take place (an experienced minister will not even allow it, because it is both time and energy consuming, it also wearies the one being ministered to), sometimes, it s just praying and issuing commands to the harassing demons to stop

superior1:

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.Ephesians 6:12

That verse was a message Paul sent to technically born again Christians. Christians have these false believe once they become born-again, there is an end to the warfare they will be engaged in.

A born again Christian cannot be possessed by demons (Because the Holy Spirit reside in his spirit) but I have seen genuinely born again come under attacks, sickness, oppression etc inflicted by demons and prayers of warfare (that is what i meant by deliverance) had to be conducted for them to be loose.

Becoming born again is like giving birth to a new child, that is not the end of the whole story, dirt has to be washed off, umbilical cord (former oaths, allegiances to demons, curses and spells etc) all have to be broken, most times these newly born can hardly wash themselves (hence they depend on someone more mature), adult Christians atimes also get involve in things and come in contact with warfare that makes them approach a matured and experienced Christian to assist them in prayers of warfare (deliverance)

Like someone said, i think the problem is that people have got these fake thinking whenever you mentioned deliverance ministration, you are talking of rolling on the floor, vomiting, demonic shouting etc, whereas these kind of outward manifestation do take place (an experienced minister will not even allow it, because it is both time and energy consuming, it also wearies the one being ministered to), sometimes, it s just praying and issuing commands to the harassing demons to stop

sir,pls being possessed an being attacked are two different things,possessed-this demon owns you,you do its bidding,but being attacked-this demons must definately be angry that you were delivered from it,hence they want to afflict you,to hurt you,an if possible get you back,in this case,you are not doing their bidding,hence the admonishment from paul to the Ephesian church that they should know that they are not 'wrestling'which paints the picture of contending so that they won't be won.

No one is saying(atleast I'm not)that christians don't come under attack,but they are no more possessed by this demons once they have truly been delivered(being saved by the blood)having spoiled principalities an powers,he made an open show of them,an nailed it to the cross.thanks

Crixina: sir,pls being possessed an being attacked are two different things,possessed-this demon owns you,you do its bidding,but being attacked-this demons must definately be angry that you were delivered from it,hence they want to afflict you,to hurt you,an if possible get you back,in this case,you are not doing their bidding,hence the admonishment from paul to the Ephesian church that they should know that they are not 'wrestling'which paints the picture of contending so that they won't be won.

No one is saying(atleast I'm not)that christians don't come under attack,but they are no more possessed by this demons once they have truly been delivered(being saved by the blood)having spoiled principalities an powers,he made an open show of them,an nailed it to the cross.thanks

Let me make a little clarification so you can understand me better.
Man is a spirit, born again Christians have got Holy Spirit residing in their spirits hence can't come under demonic possession.

Man also have a soul which is the seat of his sub conscious and conscious mind, this also influences his emotion. It is possible and I have seen born again being obsessed by demons, you see issues of trauma, depression, insanity, hearing strange voices etc affecting them, of course for this to happen, the demon will have a legal ground or open door which it is using, a trained deliverance minister will try to identify this (most times direct or inherited sins), the born again Christian repents of this and the demon will be sent packing.

Man also have a body, it is possible and I have seen born again come under attack also in this area, I have seen cancer disappearing without a trace, illness that have been reoccuring in a family or a person gone without medical intervention etc.

Every born again has a protecting wall around him, like Job was protected and satan needed permission to cross that wall but sin most times open up this wall giving room for a legal ground (it is he who opens the edge, the serpent will bite). That is why Christians should not give room to the devil or indulge in sin

ajayikayod:

Whn u throw things away in d name of beside d point, it doesnt allow a proper understanding of issues at hand. Following ur line of tot, we then conclude dt Jesus needed deliverance too (Let ds cup pass over...). But glory b to God, he is d deliverer.

My line of reasoning does not force the conclusion that Jesus needed deliverance. Remember Jesus was without sin. Was Paul without sin? After all, the source of all bondage is sin. So how can somebody without sin need deliverance?

ajayikayod:

U ar not answering my questions

Act 10:46, Act 19:6, Mark 16:15-18. If a believer had to grow for some time, lik u said b4 functioning in Spirit abilities, why is tongue diff. D truth is they ar all of one - Spirit given.

I was specific. I referred to faith! I don't want to detract from the present issue by entangling myself with the issue of tongues, that is for another thread. I deliberately quoted 1Cor 12:9 and Gal 5:22-23 for you to read carefully, but your response indicated otherwise. The Scriptures you reeled out would work for a believer if and only if he has unflinching faith in them. As I said before, and I reiterate, faith is both a gift and a fruit of the Spirit. You however do not agree that faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit because according to you the "Holy Spirit doesn't bear fruits."

Gal 5:22-23 KJV reads thus, "22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." If you pay careful attention to the word "Spirit" you will notice that Spirit is a capital S which refers to the Holy Spirit and not the human spirit. Fruit is also singular not plural...I need not dwell any more on this, Galatians 5:22 is clear enough.

I agree that when you have strong faith and therewith act or stand on the word of God, of course the word of God will prevail. But this begs the question, "Do all believers operate like this? The answer is NO. Why? We need not go far: strongholds! Some believers have been born again for decades and yet still behave like spiritual babes. Why again? Strongholds! A stronghold may not allow a believer to walk in the fullness of the victory of God's Word, unless and until the stronghold (vitiating his faith in God's Word) is mortally dealt with. What is even most troubling is that some of these strongholds are so carefully hidden from the believer that he doesn't even know they are there!

A sermon can expose and destroy a stronghold. Prayers (with fasting if you like) can expose and destroy a stronghold. Praying in the spirit can expose and destroy a stronghold. Studying and Meditating on the word of God can destroy a stronghold. A word of knowledge from the ministering pastor can expose and destroy a stronghold. What else apart from these do they do in a deliverance service? So a believer that goes to a deliverance service is not acting against the Word of God, regardless of whether Paul mentioned deliverance or not! Praise God to many believers who now walk in victory due to deliverance services.

If you believe that common sense is good enough to deal with particular strongholds, and it works for you, glory be to the Name of The Lord. To others who believe they can get and are getting help from deliverance services, I say again, glory be to the Name of the Lord. However, if you do not belong to the latter group, let not thy faith be a stumbling block to thy brethren.

superior1:

Let me make a little clarification so you can understand me better.
Man is a spirit, born again Christians have got Holy Spirit residing in their spirits hence can't come under demonic possession.

Man also have a soul which is the seat of his sub conscious and conscious mind, this also influences his emotion. It is possible and I have seen born again being obsessed by demons, you see issues of trauma, depression, insanity, hearing strange voices etc affecting them, of course for this to happen, the demon will have a legal ground or open door which it is using, a trained deliverance minister will try to identify this (most times direct or inherited sins), the born again Christian repents of this and the demon will be sent packing.

Man also have a body, it is possible and I have seen born again come under attack also in this area, I have seen cancer disappearing without a trace, illness that have been reoccuring in a family or a person gone without medical intervention etc.

Every born again has a protecting wall around him, like Job was protected and satan needed permission to cross that wall but sin most times open up this wall giving room for a legal ground (it is he who opens the edge, the serpent will bite). That is why Christians should not give room to the devil or indulge in sin

Thank you very much!

Joagbaje:

Just clinging on straws , humble yourself. Paul's hindrances and set backs were caused by a demon. That demon was responsible for the afflictions ,persecution, hardship ,and many weariness of Paul.

I discovered u are just sitting on a knowledge dt has no place in d scriptures. I asked u questions u cant answer and u r deliberately refusing it whn u r pointed to d scriptures. U hav been using words lik humble urself, u hav ego etc, do u kno wat pride is? Its when u r shown realities from d scriptures and u deliberately ignore in other to follow ur own knowlegde dt has no proof in d scriptures but rest on man's experiences.
1 Pet 2:2,
1 Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,
2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

1 Tim 6:2-4, 2
.... These things teach and exhort.
3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,


U cant giv me a single scriptures to justified ur claim of casting out demons from a christian (temple of d Holyghost, a man possesed by d Spirit of God).

Demons responsible for Paul's afflictions ,persecution, hardship ,and many weariness of Paul? If d early church hear ds from u they will actually had preach d gospel to u to believe, get u filled wit d Holyghost and speak in tongues, becos obviously wat u believ in is God existence (Act 19:1-6) not in redemptive work of Christ.

U kno, whn all u do is sit in church and wait till d prey come asking 4deliverance so dt u can exercise self owned authority on them in d name of casting out demons, u can never kno wat persecution means. If not u ll understand dt persecution (human oppositions to d gospel) is far greater and ur so called demonic activities. Early church dont even need more than a second to cast out demons but did u read how persecution was able to distort church activities?

U mentioned hardship, weariness?
Joh 16:33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

Is that demonic oppressions? Ar u part of those dt promises believers wat scriptures doesn't promise. Brother of God we glory and rejoice in tribulations, hardship, weariness, persecutions, perils becos we hav overcome d world, and d greater one lives in us.

newmi:
Enough of all these Infact they are mere distractions there's so much to talk about and discuss on this topic so if you don't a story to share its on wise u listen to those who have and let's discuss meaningfully. Thank you

Story to share? Ds is a big shame, christians now turned to story tellers, following man's experience dt has no place in d scriptures, Is dt how u share stories to ur sheepey in church every meeting days: full of human experience, quoting everytin in ds world expect d Word of God. Christians comparing scriptures wit scriptures and u said it should be put aside so dt u can enjoy ur tales by moonlights? Bro, just knee down whr ur and ask for 4giveness becos actually u ve committed a greater one wit such sayings.

U call ds mere distractions, Word of Life. Bro, u really need scolding o (sorry to say) by ur Pastor.

Crixina: please guys I don't want to ensue in this arguments that has been going on for eternity,but I know that when a christian is genuinely born again,saved,you don't need any form of deliverance from the power of darkness again cos col 1 I think frm verse 13 explains that.maybe the only thing one needs is trying to make sure one dsnt go back to sin.in the case one does,an maybe one is ministered to,I wouldn't call that deliverance from the power of darkness,rather restoration from the bondage of sin.thanks.

That's d spirit of Christ talking, God bless u bro.

superior1:

Let me make a little clarification so you can understand me better.
Man is a spirit, born again Christians have got Holy Spirit residing in their spirits hence can't come under demonic possession.

Man also have a soul which is the seat of his sub conscious and conscious mind, this also influences his emotion. It is possible and I have seen born again being obsessed by demons, you see issues of trauma, depression, insanity, hearing strange voices etc affecting them, of course for this to happen, the demon will have a legal ground or open door which it is using, a trained deliverance minister will try to identify this (most times direct or inherited sins), the born again Christian repents of this and the demon will be sent packing.

Man also have a body, it is possible and I have seen born again come under attack also in this area, I have seen cancer disappearing without a trace, illness that have been reoccuring in a family or a person gone without medical intervention etc.

Bro, all u explained here are human experiences. Can u giv us scripture and verse to back up?

Every born again has a protecting wall around him, like Job was protected and satan needed permission to cross that wall but sin most times open up this wall giving room for a legal ground (it is he who opens the edge, the serpent will bite). That is why Christians should not give room to the devil or indulge in sin

Christians dont hav walls around, we are overcomers, Haaaaaaaaa. More than conqueror. We are not doing hide and seek o.WE ARE DELIVERED.
Lessons from Job's story, 1st; Job wasnt a christian, Job wasnt as knowledgeable (no knowlegde about d devil) as u r today, he put all blames on God.

See in reality, if thr is anyone who needs protection it should b d devil (if he can get any) becos he s been stripped of his power, He only works wit deceptions and ignorance.
I think most of our movie industries hav done more arm than good to d christian faith. The bible christian goes from places to places looking for who to deliver from oppressions of d devils.

ajayikayod:

That's d spirit of Christ talking, God bless u bro.

am a sis though.God bless you too.

[quote author=apostle007]

My line of reasoning does not force the conclusion that Jesus needed deliverance. Remember Jesus was without sin. Was Paul without sin? After all, the source of all bondage is sin. So how can somebody without sin need deliverance?

Going by d concept of sin in d scriptures, do u actually think u can bear d consequence of sin? I asked u wat exactly did Jesus saved (delivered) us from? Do u actually believ in a believer as d righteousness of God (11 Corith 5:21), do u actually kno wat it means to be a new creation?

U asked was Paul without sin? I answer u, Yes, Paul was/is without one, Saul was (If anyman b in Christ, he is a new man: righteousness of God, 1Jo 4:17 ... because as he is, so are we in this world.

I was specific. I referred to faith! I don't want to detract from the present issue by entangling myself with the issue of tongues, that is for another thread. I deliberately quoted 1Cor 12:9 and Gal 5:22-23 for you to read carefully, but your response indicated otherwise. The Scriptures you reeled out would work for a believer if and only if he has unflinching faith in them.

Bro, dont add to simple English (Mark 16:17; And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues. Which one is unflinching faith again. pls dont deprive believers of thr right in Christ, why demand wat d scripture doesnt demand.

As I said before, and I reiterate, faith is both a gift and a fruit of the Spirit. You however do not agree that faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit because according to you the "Holy Spirit doesn't bear fruits."

Gal 5:22-23 KJV reads thus, "22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." If you pay careful attention to the word "Spirit" you will notice that Spirit is a capital S which refers to the Holy Spirit and not the human spirit. Fruit is also singular not plural...I need not dwell any more on this, Galatians 5:22 is clear enough.

Bro, pls try do a more diligent study on dt.

I agree that when you have strong faith and therewith act or stand on the word of God, of course the word of God will prevail. But this begs the question, "Do all believers operate like this? The answer is NO. Why? We need not go far: strongholds! Some believers have been born again for decades and yet still behave like spiritual babes. Why again? Strongholds! A stronghold may not allow a believer to walk in the fullness of the victory of God's Word, unless and until the stronghold (vitiating his faith in God's Word) is mortally dealt with. What is even most troubling is that some of these strongholds are so carefully hidden from the believer that he doesn't even know they are there!

A sermon can expose and destroy a stronghold. Prayers (with fasting if you like) can expose and destroy a stronghold. Praying in the spirit can expose and destroy a stronghold. Studying and Meditating on the word of God can destroy a stronghold. A word of knowledge from the ministering pastor can expose and destroy a stronghold. What else apart from these do they do in a deliverance service?

Pls wat deliverance service did Paul organised for new born babes o, He only taught then Word of God day and night. Enlighthening them to kno better than entanglement of men lik d one we ar discussing here.

1Pe 2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

1 Corith 3:1-3
1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

In Paul's church, thr ar babes, carnal Christians, him dt stole, him dt fornicate, fighters, haters, yet we can find a single account of casting out demons from them or organizing ur called deliverance.
Giv me a believr dt knows his right in christ, i will hav a believer who can cast out demons anyday, anytime. Its funny how many specialised in such, ministries today. I think it sells fast in African becos we cant seperate our tradition from faith.

An oyinbo man pikin dreamt of takin an ice cream in d night, he woke up and tell his dad, his dad response was, i will get one for u today.
An African man pikin had d same dream (possibly eating Eba & Okro soup), d next thing is Pastor i need deliverance.
If u had such dream and u check thr is no meat in d meal, ask for meat jo o, d earth is d Lord. Wat does d devil made.

So a believer that goes to a deliverance service is not acting against the Word of God, regardless of whether Paul mentioned deliverance or not! Praise God to many believers who now walk in victory due to deliverance services.

Words lik ds (bolded one) always leave me asking, do some churches actually believe in d final authority of the Word?
Regardless simply means disregardin wat Paul wrote. So u hav ur own personal inspiration? Mayb from ur Onlyghost not the Holy ghost.
I believe the Word of God is d final authority of church issues and contain d the singular solution to all human's problems.

If you believe that common sense is good enough to deal with particular strongholds, and it works for you, glory be to the Name of The Lord. To others who believe they can get and are getting help from deliverance services, I say again, glory be to the Name of the Lord.

Rather put lik ds, "to others who ar enslaved to believ in a diff gospel aside wat Paul's preach" Becos its all manipulations of believers.

However, if you do not belong to the latter group, let not thy faith be a stumbling block to thy brethren.

Stumbling block? No the faith of Christ in me liberates men.

ajayikayod:

Bro, all u explained here are human experiences. Can u giv us scripture and verse to back up?



Christians dont hav walls around, we are overcomers, Haaaaaaaaa. More than conqueror. We are not doing hide and seek o.WE ARE DELIVERED.
Lessons from Job's story, 1st; Job wasnt a christian, Job wasnt as knowledgeable (no knowlegde about d devil) as u r today, he put all blames on God.

See in reality, if thr is anyone who needs protection it should b d devil (if he can get any) becos he s been stripped of his power, He only works wit deceptions and ignorance.
I think most of our movie industries hav done more arm than good to d christian faith. The bible christian goes from places to places looking for who to deliver from oppressions of d devils.

My first inclination is to give my favorite response 'you are free to believe what you chose to believe' but on a second thought decided to list out bible verses you can look up when you have got he time

On wall of protection around Christians

1.1John 5:18 We know that everyone who has been born of God does not keep on sinning, but he who was born of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him
2..Psalms 34:7 - The angel of the LORD encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them
3. 2Thessalonians 3:3 But the Lord is faithful. He will establish you and guard you against the evil one.
4. Psalm 91:1-3 He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. I will say to the LORD, “My refuge and my fortress, my God, in whom I trust.” For he will deliver you from the snare of the fowler and from the deadly pestilence.


On Christians obsession and oppression

1.James 5:13-16 - Is any among you afflicted? let him pray
2. Mark 8:33 But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. "Get behind me, Satan!" he said. "You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns."
3. Luke 4:38-39 Jesus left the synagogue and went to the home of Simon. Now Simon’s mother-in-law was suffering from a high fever, and they asked Jesus to help her. So he bent over her and rebuked the fever, and it left her. She got up at once and began to wait on them.
4. 2 Corinthians 12:7 Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me.

superior1:

My first inclination is to give my favorite response 'you are free to believe what you chose to believe' but on a second thought decided to list out bible verses you can look up when you have got he time

On wall of protection around Christians

1.1John 5:18 We know that everyone who has been born of God does not keep on sinning, but he who was born of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him
2..Psalms 34:7 - The angel of the LORD encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them
3. 2Thessalonians 3:3 But the Lord is faithful. He will establish you and guard you against the evil one.
4. Psalm 91:1-3 He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will abide in the shadow of the Almighty. I will say to the LORD, “My refuge and my fortress, my God, in whom I trust.” For he will deliver you from the snare of the fowler and from the deadly pestilence.

Protects, delivers, guards etc are promises made which are now legal realities of evry believer based on positions not locations. The encampth, the establish, the shelter, the fortress arent a function of locations but position. And our position is In Christ at d right hand of the Father. D bible called the far above principalities... Ephe 1: 20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

Col 2: 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power.

Our position is In Christ, thats not a question of whether he can get us, he doesnt even hav d power to do so. He s rendered useless.
Col 2: 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

Heb 2: 14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

All his strategies now only lies in persecutions, deceptions and ignorance not demonic possession or oppressions.

Infact, ds might shock u, D POWER D DEVIL EXERCISE OVER AN UNBELIEVER IS ILLEGAL, BECOS CHRIST DIED 4HIM,RESURRECTED 4HIM SAKE, EXPOSED SATAN 4HIM, HE ONLY HAS REFUSED TO ACCEPT CHRIST DELIVERANCE, HENCE D DEVIL'S OPPRESSIONS.

On Christians obsession and oppression

1.James 5:13-16 - Is any among you afflicted? let him pray
2. Mark 8:33 But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. "Get behind me, Satan!" he said. "You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns."
3. Luke 4:38-39 Jesus left the synagogue and went to the home of Simon. Now Simon’s mother-in-law was suffering from a high fever, and they asked Jesus to help her. So he bent over her and rebuked the fever, and it left her. She got up at once and began to wait on them.
4. 2 Corinthians 12:7 Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me.

1.James 5:13-16 - Is any among you afflicted? let him pray
afflicted kak-op-ath-eh'-o from the same as to undergo hardship:--be afflicted, endure afflictions (hardness), suffer trouble.

i ve said earlier hardship is not an oppression or possession. Hardship can come in form of persecutions, oppositions, troubles.
Infact, Paul prayed
2Th 3:2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith
3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil. (These ar opposers (MEN) of the Faith not demons)

Romans 15: 30 ¶ Now I beseech you, brethren, for the Lord Jesus Christ's sake, and for the love of the Spirit, that ye strive together with me in your prayers to God for me;
31 That I may be delivered from them that do not believe in Judaea; and that my service which I have for Jerusalem may be accepted of the saints;
32 That I may come unto you with joy by the will of God, and may with you be refreshed.

Paul was never and can never b oppressed/possesed by a demon. Dont u understand, he has d Spirit of Christ in Him.
1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

If Paul and every believer is one spirit with d Lord, then is d Spirit possesed, God forbid, dts d Spirit dt raise Christ from d dead, dts wat dwells in us.

2. Mark 8:33 But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. "Get behind me, Satan!" he said. "You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns."
3. Luke 4:38-39 Jesus left the synagogue and went to the home of Simon. Now Simon’s mother-in-law was suffering from a high fever, and they asked Jesus to help her. So he bent over her and rebuked the fever, and it left her. She got up at once and began to wait on them.

We ar talkin about Christian (new creation) here not ordinary men.
Peter denied Jesus, Peter turned back to go into fishin again after Christ death but when d Spirit of Life possesed him.... He was never d same Peter again.

But i will need to point out to u dt not all sickness ar possessions of d devils, u hav ur environment saturated wit mosquito and u then hav malaria, dts not possession o. If dts possession/oppressions dt means Oyinbo drug too can cast out demons.
U kno most atheist stand point? If i can be healed b oyinbo drugs why need deliverance for healing.
Bro, prayer can heal all sicknesses including d ones oyinbo drugs handles and beyond, but whn sickness comes becos of demonic possesions, then check d man is not born again and simply preaching and accepting d POWER OF GOD i.e. d gospel is enough to to free him from demonic activities. Why didnt Paul conduct deliverance for Timothy weakness, or he ran out of power?

See wat ever d message of freedom from possession u preach in d church, u ll always hav d sick, d poor among us. Its not a casting out demonic activities, its all about them walking in light of God's word.

4. 2 Corinthians 12:7 Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me.

Brooooooooooosss, Brother Paul will quarrel wit u whn he sees u in d kingdom o.

I checked thru all bible translations i hav wat i see is "THORN IN THE FLESH NOT THORN IN MY FLESH", I dont kno whether u inserted dt deliberately.

Wat is thorn in d flesh in English idiom (a constant bother or annoyance to someone). Wat if i say sometin is a pain in d neck? Does dt mean its in my body?

Thru out Paul's ministries wat bothered, tormented him? Men (influenced by Satan) thru persecutions, oppositions to Faith. These are hindrances to his ministries.

Time wont allow me to dwell on ds Paul's Thorn but u can check these passages whr we hav closer words to these and conclude war it means.

Num 33: 55 But if ye will not drive out the inhabitants of the land from before you; then it shall come to pass, that those which ye let remain of them shall be pricks in your eyes, and thorns in your sides, and shall vex you in the land wherein ye dwell.

Josh 23:13 Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out any of these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you.

Judges 2: 3 Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.

Eze 2: 6 And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house.

Also check this
http://www.kcm.org/real-help/article/what-about-pauls-thorn-flesh