like i said b4 and i would say it again, u terrorist suporters calling themfreedom fighters if u can pls tell themto stop the show biz and stop escalating figures of number of women and children killed every day
ah ah wat is it self? when ur freedom fighters throws rockets into isreal wat happens? simply it does not kill as much jews as u want because the isreali installed siren to warn people when the rockets are coming. or do u want to tell me u did not hear about the amount in kg of the rockets used yesterday? imagine if there were no sirens in isreal that means thousands would have died.
i dont care who started it or who did not but i would state it categorically that ur freedom fighters dont respect civilians in any form be it jews or arabs, they threw rockets into nazareth killed a man's children meanwhile nazarite is filled with arabs and funny enought the arabs in nazarite blame isreal for the rocket. tell me who fired the rocket?

Afam:

Nilla,

The truth of the matter is that there is no justification for the killing of innocent people by any group.

That is why it is easy for some people to take sides based on religion and hide under such covers to support wickedness.

What is the crime of the innocent Lebanese who may not like Hezbollah but is being maimed or killed by Israeli bombs?

Why must innocent people pay for actions of another?

the answer to ur question is simple , the price innocent lebanes pay for allowing hezbollah use their backyards irrespective of hteir children watching is to be bomed by iaf.
the innocent lebanes in quote should stand their grounds and dont allow freedom fighters to hide in their backyards
if the freedom fighters really luv them they wont do such cos they know isreal would retalliate

come to thinkof it wat are the freedom fighters fighting for this time around? fame or wat.
i can see ur not looking at the issue much more than a face value, quite unfortunate lebanes are dying but should we wonder why iran should calculate world affairs and send its allies hamas and hezbollah alike to attack isreal during the G8 summit so the world wont talk about its nuclear program? too bad isreal had to take it personal- there is a limit to provocation.
let me tell u the arab world dont help each other out, isreal left lebanon isreal left gaza did u take a sneal preview into gaza they could not run it poverty abounds lies and fraud so is that also isreals fault
common the arabs are just jealous wondering how these jews do it with little resources compared to theirs

well said nilla i dont live in lebanon i live in ph but lets watch and see if this war continues for some more weeks and see if ur muslim folks up north would not start killing fellow nigerians (xtians) since they r used to doing so

@ kaecy5,

i don't just sit down and totally find fault in all you say. It just pick on the things that i have a problem (for example, the one i quoted earlier) with or the ones that i see a different view of.


Your saying,

we wonder why iran should calculate world affairs and send its allies hamas and hezbollah alike to attack isreal during the G8 summit so the world wont talk about its nuclear program?

,  thats just speculation, like so many other opinions.
You don't know for a fact that thats what happened. its just like other people that have mentioned that this is just a proxy war for US and Iran etc (this is not so far fetched)

No one really knows how this war is going to turn out. Both sides are going to maintain that they are right in what they are doing. Even if someone or some people around the world think they know the solution, it does not mean its going to work well for both sides of this war.

About Nigerian muslims starting problem (killing rioting etc) with christians:
most of these things arise from ignorance. this war is in the middle east and people are interpreting it (whether rightfully or wrongfully) as a muslim christian war. and we know whenever anything muslim/christian related happpens, we always suffer for it (because Nigeria has both religions as majority religions). Ofcourse Nigerians exaggerate their reactions. But thats sth that has always been and will always be.

I FEEL FOR HONEST CIVILIANS THAT ARE CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS NIGHTMARE.

Taking sides in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is a tough thing to do. While it might be easy for those who are fed by American mainstream media reports to believe that Israel is right and the Palestinians wrong, the truth is much deeper.

The problem in the Middle East persists because since the State of Israel was violently created in 1948--largely by the efforts of the United States and Great Britain--the voiceless predominantly Arab Palestinians have had no where to turn to. Many of these Palestinians were forcibly removed from their homes—an act driven by a pseudo-religious belief that Palestine was the God-promised ancestral homeland of the Jews.

There were Jewish terrorist organizations, which worked with Zionists to see that as much Arabs as possible were driven away from Palestine, while Jews all over the world were invited to return. And in 1948, Israel was created. This Israel had the character of a Jewish State and an Arab minority.

Isn't it logical that most Arab governments, embittered by what happened in Palestine, chose not to recognize the State of Israel? Some have described the creation of Israel in Palestine as the worst blunder of the latter half of the twentieth century, for ever since it happened, that region has known no peace. But with American and British support, it appeared that Israel had come to stay. United Nations resolutions affirm its right to exist, a right which every modern nation states should respect.

All too often Israel is portrayed as a secular moderate republic by the mainstream American media, while Palestine is viewed as an aggressive and unsustainable state. In 1998, the then Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu came on CNN to clearly state that he did not believe in the creation of a Palestinian state. A large fraction of Netanyahu's Likud party (an extremist group in my opinion) holds a similar view, though according to this Wikipedia article, Ariel Sharon changed Likud's official policy with regard a Palestinian statehood.

However, it appears that even Sharon could not placate the more extreme members of Likud, which led him to create the Kadima party in late 2005. In other words, there is a powerful force in Israeli politics that is doing everything possible to see that Palestine never exists—contrary to United Nations resolutions. This force is the Israeli equivalent of Hamas and Hezbolla, the only difference being that it has American weapons to fight with and the American mainstream media is more sympathetic to its cause, making it appear morally superior.

While Israel preaches peace, it continues to flout United Nations resolutions by building settlements in the West Bank or Palestine if you prefer. Gaza, the most congested nation on earth is like a refugee camp. From the look of things, it is either that Israel doesn't want peace or that it is not willing to compromise. Before we can start talking about peace in the Middle East, Israel must cease all settlements in the West Bank and abide by outstanding United Nations resolutions. It must also dismantle the apartheid wall it is currently building, by which it covertly steals land from the Palestinians. A growing number of Arab countries have indicated their willingness to recognize Israel if it returns to the pre-1967 border.

Destroying the infrastructure of Lebanon isn't going to achieve much. It would surely not make Israel any safer. The disproportionate use of force in Lebanon clearly shows that this isn't about Hezbollah having captured two Israeli soldiers. From the look of things, support for Hezbollah has been on the increase in Lebanon since the bombing started, even amongst factions of Lebanon's 40% Christian population (who generally hold Hezbollah in contempt). Hezbollah isn't a political party per se that could easily be destroyed. It is like a movement, an ideology, formed in 1982 to drive Israeli forces out of Lebanon.

Israel is gradually driving itself into isolation on the international scene. For now, it does what it wants because the United States (the most powerful nation in the world) stands by its side. Fifty or sixty years from now, the tables may turn and Washington may have ceased dictating what goes on. All we hear from the United States now is that "Israel has a right to defend itself." Well, so do the Palestinians, a large part of whose land has been usurped by Israel. Until sanity and rationality are brought into resolving the surrounding issues, the fighting would go on and on. America may first have to lose its superpower status and its urge to control the world's oil resources for Middle East peace to be possible.

by Chippla

Erm, for those y'all who say all Northerners are dunces, Chippla is a Northerner. . .

I quoted this again because it is a oversimplification of the history and current situation but is the most accurate assesement in this thread. There are extremists on both sides, and the generals and politicians allowing this war to happen are just as extreme and morally equivellant to Hezbollah, Omert is no different from the leader of Hezbollah, they are both scum for what they do.

I just wanna add that the US saying Israel has a right to defend itself is important in the use of the terminology. the US Arms Export Control Act http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode22/usc_sup_01_22_10_39.html says we cannot export weapons to aggressor nations, only to nations that are defending themselves, hence the silly mantra by Bush et al. Same politics to cover their ass with the name change of the Department of War to the Department of Department of Defens in the early 20th century.  Most Israelis and Palestinians do want a 2 state solution and want them to live side by side, according to International law Palestinians do have a right to return although it is not feasible thanks to the circumstances, and now extremists on BOTH SIDES will not make that happen, especially when one of the extremists is being made a mini superpower and has unshakeable support from the defacto world super power.

In a country like Israel created by a one country backed Mandate and expanded on by brute force cannot be willing to comprimise and practice racist and imperialist actions without consequence. Instead of belligerence a country like Israel should be doing everything in its power to live side by side with palestinians and its Arab nation neighbors. And it is doing the opposite no matter what the right wing extremist government says. If the Israelis where not treating the Palestinians like dogs, controlling their water supply, having them go through multiple checkpoints, etc, it would go a long way in promoting peace for one.

some of y'all on this forum are so naive, it hurts. It's so easy for people to condemn isreal, especially jobless naijans who know nothing of living with a siege mentality.
Hezbollah crossed over into the sovereign territory of israel, killed a couple of soldiers, destroyed a tank and kidnapped two others. Hezbollah currently has a sizable population in the lebanese government. ergo, the lebanese goverment was involved and this legitimises the act as an act of war.
if we must repect the sanctity of life, why not do it in a balanced way? Do you think the missiles Hezbollah lobs at israel does not inflict casualties too?
The Katyusha missiles fired by Hezbollah at israel has a limited payload. If hezbollah could fire 500kg warheads, do you think they wouldnt have done it to cause more casualties?
8 people were killed in Haifa when a missile came down through the roof of the building they were in. why? because the warhead was liberally laced with ball bearings, an act designed to send out waves of shrapnel into clusters of civillians, causing as much damage as possible. How many of you all slagging israel have seen pics of the 33 civillians killed in israel so far? yet we all are willing to buy most of the Al-jazeera hype.
at least the IDf and IAF drops leaflets most times, telling the civillian populace to evacuate. yet they still stay behind often as human shields for the terrorists. Of course, the ever grateful Hezbollah scum show off the dead bodies of such misguided people as signs of 'israeli aggression'.
then lots of naijans, sitting in comfy armchairs, knowing nothing of what it is like to be surrounded by nations completely dedicated to ur destruction.
I keep hearing the refrain "only 2 soldiers" over and over again. of course, its understandable coming from my fellow nigerians. Fools!
no wonder we gave charles taylor refuge here in calabar, even after it was common knowledge that he fed 2 nigerian reporters alive to crocodiles in liberia. did we care? after all, it was 'only 2 journalists'.
we should cringe in shame that we live n a country where our lives do not matter.
after the entebbe hijacking, the israeli nation decided never to leave any of their citizens behind. Asking to exchange 2 foot soldiers for thousands of brigands and terrorists is absurd.
so what was israeal to do? leave the guys to rot there? release killers who would go ahead and kill again?

Don't fall for the hype. Hezbollah millitants custmarily drive to a residential area, launch several missiles and then wait for the Israeli air force to plaster the area with bombs, then fish out the corpses and go to Al-Jazeera with cries of outrage. All this while they coat their warheads in ball bearings, preparing to fire them into civilian areas in haifa et al.

For crying out loud, talking about the land 'usurped' by israel in 1948 is not constructive. except u can create a time machine and go back in time to reverse this, all we need look towards now is the solution.

shango:

If the Israelis where not treating the Palestinians like dogs, controlling their water supply, having them go through multiple checkpoints, etc, it would go a long way in promoting peace for one.

spoken like someone who hasn't had a suicide bomb balst in his neighbourhood in recent times. FYI, these security checks were put in place to check suicide attacks and other terrorist incidents. How u can even question the necessity behind suh an action escapes me. why do u think Bin Laden hasn't been able to attack israel? why did he go all the ay o the US and psain to carry out attacks?

If u were an american, and u knew that in 1981 Hezbollah blew up a us base, killing 241 Us marines in one fell swoop, would u not encourage someone in stamping them out?

@ Texazzpete
This is a public forum meant to educate and inform ourselves.  That you disagree with other people's point of view does not give you the freedom/latitude to rain abuses or use uncouthworthy language in condemning and ridiculing people who hold contary views.  People will measure your intelligence by how well you articulate your viewpoint and not by how versatile you are at insulting those who hold opposing views.

from the bible, both the jews and the arabs can never come to an agreement and from my own perspective the arabs are nothing more than war mongers who go to war at the slightest provocation and later conjure up false sentiments to gain pity from the outside world when they are being beaten.

           ISRAEL CARRY GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@ Abeem, good talk

You guys need not worry about Texazzpete's conduct, it is typical of anyone that finds it supremely difficult to marshall out points in a discussion or arguement.

People like that simple shift focus to personalities and leave the issues. If you fall for the trap you will end up discussing the insults and leave the main issues, which by the way is what he wants since he cannot make any reasonable statement on the issues on ground.

Only those incapable of using their brains will be the first to abuse others especially when they start losing arguements.

Concentrating on the issues as against throwing invectives on other people would help.

Afam:

You guys need not worry about Texazzpete's conduct, it is typical of anyone that finds it supremely difficult to marshall out points in a discussion or arguement.

People like that simple shift focus to personalities and leave the issues. If you fall for the trap you will end up discussing the insults and leave the main issues, which by the way is what he wants since he cannot make any reasonable statement on the issues on ground.

Only those incapable of using their brains will be the first to abuse others especially when they start losing arguements.

Concentrating on the issues as against throwing invectives on other people would help.

Perhaps i used strong words in my reply. I freely apologise for this, even though i can't recall ever targetting any one person in particular.
On the other hand, comments that i made no point at all in my submission are strange, to say the least. As for the incapable of using their brains' bit, if you dont think that's kinda hypocritical, you don't know me. I sincerely doubt you can muster up a much cerebral power as i can. take your own advice for a change.
then again, i'm falling for YOUR trap, wasting valuable time and effort replying you. such senseless waste will cease.
I find it absurd that a comment in this thread that 'gadd!! Why didn't Hitler finish the job' went unpunished, while i draw so much flak for a few regrettable, but not as terrible comments. Since when did the slaughter of 6 million jews become less vile than a few 'insults'.

I made a few points in my argument. perhaps not as good as i'd have done if i wasnt so tired when i wrote it in yesterday, but points nonetheless. Reply them if you will, but don't try to take me on.
And just for the record, i apologise for any errant remarks i made in my earlier post. You can either accept that, or continue in the 'let's flame texazzpete' vein. na u know.

I believe the world will be a much better place if we avoided problems rather than do damage control.

I am not competing with you neither did I insinuate that I am better than you.

Forgive my remarks even though I felt I needed to draw your attention to your very unfair comments and what you choose to call "few insults".

Let's focus on the main issues so we can see a world where injustices will be frowned at and the leaders and the led told the bitter truth about what happens around us.

what kind od reply was dat texazzpete? how can u justify qana?

how do you justify the waves and waves of suicide bombers isreal ahs had to endure?

i cannot justify any loss of life in anyway, but at least there's a reason to any madness (well, most of 'em anyways)
The building in question was a derelict 4 storey building. the israeli air force had spent time and effort with announcements, telling all civilians to flee southern lebanon and leave the hezbollah alone. you'd think, just like they did that people would evacuate. unfortunately, several families did not leave, o their own free will. hence the carnage.
the israeli airforce released a video showing hezbollah millitants firing rockets into israel from residential areas. naturally, such sites would be targeted for bombing. the onus now is for the civillians in the area to escape far away from such sites before the hammer falls.
Sky News did a story recently on wave of child casualties during such incidents. Usually, kids from 7-16 flock around the fighters even during the fighting. it's normal childish bravado. unfortunatley it has gotten lots of them killed before.
It's not an easy pill to swallow, but we play Hezbollah's game when we shift all the blame to israel.
Ultimately, the people who brought grief to lebanon in july 2006 weren't jews. They were the Hizbollah terrorists. Pure and simple.
BTW, the day Qana happened, hezbollah rained down over 100 missiles at israel. the katyushas have only a small warhead, imagine if they had 500kg warheads. U know the carnage they would have cheerfully caused?

Let's stop deceiving ourselves. these Hezbollah don't care much about their own people. they just want the slaughter to ontinue unabated.

BTW, i can't recall ever hearing the lebanese president condemning Hizbollah,

Finally, all terrorist groups need/want is public opinion in their favour as they continue their campaign of bloodbath and terror. I hope y'all heard what Al Qaeda said. not content with the 'freedom' of the midle east, their new aim now is the reclamation of all muslim lands from iraq to SPAIN. i hope the spanish people heard that. I wonder where Nigeria fits in all that.

Israel made a huge mistake on the 48hrs cease fire agreement,if you ask me. I am glad to announce that the Air campaign on Southern Lebanon has resumed. This is something the Arabs/Muslims will learn in the future, when you go and kidnap soldiers, you will get heavily bombed from the sky. American made F-16 and F-15's are performing admirably. Iran and Syria have been put on notice.

isrel's stated objective has been the destruction of hizbola. they have faild to get that, and have instead growna whole new generation of recruits for hizbola.

on that point, all other arguments falter, and this war has been a waste

@Giorgio,

I disagree that the Isreali aims have been defeated. This war and its repercusssions are not over. Far from it. Isreal will not rest, and rightly so, until something is done either by Isreal or the international community about Hezbollah. As Bush has said, though this may be a time of great conflict, it also presents a huge opportunity to settle the problems in the Mid-East once and for all.

Hezbollah must be disarmed by every means necessary if there will be lasting peace between both neighbours. It is going to be now or never. A hasty ceasefire will only postpone the evil day and I hope one or the other (Hezbollah or Isreal, prefereably hezbollah) is finally crippled militarily so we can all heave a sign of relief.

sorry to sound rude, but i think u need to watch somehing other than cnn

isreali had never been to arsh on the lebanese, the impotence of the lebanese government resulted to the development of the terorist group called hezbollah to the point that they had the largest share in their governance. Honestly this set of people are too dangerous to mankind that's related to the jews, sorry to use the word "sturborn goat" but i think that is what the hezbollah suporters really is that might be related to the islamic relegion as a whole   . I never blamed the isreali for their relentless action against this so called terorrist, they need to be severely dismantled or betterstill disarmed, beive me this people are ready to rule the wholed if they are given the opportunity, so great isreali keep up the good bombing until the lebanese realise that the hezbollah are not fit to be in their mist .

Giorgio:

isrel's stated objective has been the destruction of hizbola. they have faild to get that, and have instead growna whole new generation of recruits for hizbola.

on that point, all other arguments falter, and this war has been a waste

well said

TayoD:

@Giorgio,

I disagree that the Isreali aims have been defeated. This war and its repercusssions are not over. Far from it. Isreal will not rest, and rightly so, until something is done either by Isreal or the international community about Hezbollah. As Bush has said, though this may be a time of great conflict, it also presents a huge opportunity to settle the problems in the Mid-East once and for all.

Hezbollah must be disarmed by every means necessary if there will be lasting peace between both neighbours. It is going to be now or never. A hasty ceasefire will only postpone the evil day and I hope one or the other (Hezbollah or Isreal, prefereably hezbollah) is finally crippled militarily so we can all heave a sign of relief.

you have got to be kidding me. peace in the middle east  
I know we want that but it does not look like there will be peace (maybe short term, but never long term)

Giorgio:

isrel's stated objective has been the destruction of hizbola. they have faild to get that, and have instead growna whole new generation of recruits for hizbola.

on that point, all other arguments falter, and this war has been a waste

Thats a load of rubbish. Already you can see the effect of the Isreali offensive. A town in Northen isreal that recieved dozens of rockets a day has as of today, not recieved a single rocket.

And now that Hezbolla's human shield have wised up and are finally leaving, we will see what will happen. You can make noise from now till enternity but, one way or another, Hezbolla will cease to exist as a militant group. One way or another. It's that simple.

i don't think hezbolla will disappear like that. this is because they have won the hearts and souls of the people of the middle east (except of course israel). and with that kind of support,they have got the spirit of the region with them and defeat will be difficult.

why?

no amount of physical force can quench the invinsible spirit of a nation.

That is just to show you how much the people have been brain-washed by their religion. How can the action of a guerila group who undermines a legitimate government be received with such fervency, especially when it only brings about death and destruction to the populace? This beats my imagination.

If it was in the West, it is the populace that would have disarmed Hezbollah themselves. Hezbollah has only thrived on ignorance and no wonder they encourage the obvious backwardness that this war will bring about for the Lebanese.

There can never be peace in the middle east in this present world coz people believe that they are right about what they are doing coz of their religion

Its a pity that things are going this way. Let us try not to 4get something that happened in 2001 in WTO when some muslims hijaked four plane and flew them into the WTO and Pentagon my people more than 3000 people lost thier lives in just that single act . And we say they are fighting for thier rights. Every day these same muslims wear bombs on them blows up any suppermarket and stores in the name of fighting for thier rights. In Nigeria they slaughter hundreds in the north all in the name of fighting for freedom . them no still free reach 4 here abi.

Hezbollah is a terrorist group not a freedom fighter y would lebannon habour any of such people in thier soil if they really are relly looking 4 peace.

I dont like it when we say things without looking the otherside of the coin. These Lebanese should be ready for the worst because Isreal cant have a snake in thier room and go to sleep on the same room they must kill the snake first.

Let them continue the raid on lebanon It is a warning to all other countries that habour terrorist including Nigeria

Giorgio:

isrel's stated objective has been the destruction of hizbola. they have faild to get that, and have instead growna whole new generation of recruits for hizbola.

on that point, all other arguments falter, and this war has been a waste

My brother nobody say make new recruite no join them oh But soon them go end up for grave.

One thing we should know is that arabs don't give up like that they will always come out in their thousands but Isreal no be US them no be Peace keeping force them be soldiers and the truth be say Lebannon no go fit kidnap even any small boy from Isreal again

@texazzpete, @TayoD, @Old Glory, etc, justify this:

www.fromisraeltolebanon.com/index.php

Hezbollah is a Terrorist organization not an elected government. Whether they have the hearts and minds of the Lebanese people is irrelevant. They are still a terrorist organization, and should be treated as such.

@Old Glory

How do you define the word terrorist? Who is a bigger terrorist, the person that enters and kidnaps 2 soldiers or the one that makes false claims, invades a country and eventually makes it worse of than it was? If only you could answer that without being biased,

medube,

Perhaps you will start by justifying the acts of those terrorists that massacred 3,000 people on 911. Hezbollah, if given the chance will do same and worse. And while going about your justification, please do not forget to tell us the just reason why Hezbollah and their backers have for planning to anihilate Isreal.

The US and the UK were the creators of Zionism (Balfour decalaration). How ironic that they are now the ones allowing the continuation of bloodshed at the hands of a cruel and overzealous country which should not have even been put there in the first place.
Its good to see that in this day and age, vested interests still overrule justice. And the US and UK wonder why they are the two biggest targets for international terrorism

The Israeli Ministry of Lies, I mean Truth, needs to come up with a new handbook of propaganda for its people to quote whenever anyone criticizes its war crimes, genocide, ethnic cleansing, colonization, apartheid policies, racism, aggression etc etc. The old classics-"terrorist, anti-Semite, self-defense, surgical precision, everyone hates Jews so we needed to steal someone else's land and build a morally superior society"-are kind of, well, OLD. Entertain us with some new BS, please.

Texazzpete, perhaps watching Indecency would do you good, rather than watching foxnews or cnn

Gadd!!!!!Where is Hitler when he is needed

Medube


Thats some scary shit you gat there dude (link)