Peaceworld: You're biased. We both know that the consultant nurse who stopped the surgeon from seeing his patient can always be sanctioned after getting to the root of the matter. That's not enough reason from stopping her from being a consultant nurse. It's pure wickedness for anybody to stop any other person from getting to the height of his or her career. Period. This goes for the director issue as well. NMA, which in itself doesn't represent all medical professionals in Nigeria (I still insist it should be NMDA), is doing doctors a disservice by towing this line. Rather, 'NMA' should be emphasizing on Doctors being the team leaders. That is the more honorable thing to do.

Peaceworld: She's right, you know. Doctors shouldn't be the only ones planning for the patient. That's why medicine is a team effort. You don't bully your way through as a dictator here. You get ideas from everybody in the team, but when you now think that no other person has an input, who is causing the trouble. Team leaders trying to be team dictators...lol...in my hospital, when was the last time we had a general ward round? Can't even remember! Mtttschhhew...

timowale: Its quite amazing how majorities of respondents who are doctors on this topic have expressed such hieght of amateurish reaction to it.
i mean how possible is it for a so called professional in a specific discipline to have expertise also in virtually all other affiliated discipline
The claim by all doctors and the pro-doctors on this issue that all the other health workers are half baked is fallacious.
Each profession within the health team has its context and curriculum of study different from another health profession.you can only show expertise in a specific profession you have chosen
Next time you want to rubbish a practitioner in another discipline,do come up with more credible points instead of just typing to satisfy your egos

Peaceworld: Very funny, in the UK, the last wrung of the career ladder is nurse consultant...check it out:

http://www.nhscareers.nhs.uk/explore-by-career/nursing/careers-in-nursing/nurse-consultants/

The truth is this: OUR VARIOUS ALLIED HEALTH PROFESSIONALS ARE GETTING BETTER BY THE DAY THE WORLD OVER, UNLIKE HERE IN NIGERIA WHERE NMA IS TRYING TO STIFLE GROWTH OF OTHER PROFESSIONS. MAY GOD HELP US.

saxywale:

Sorry i misunderstood you. I never said there was anything wrong with naija qualifications, atleast my first degree and my wife's Bpharm are from naija. What i was trying to say is that, it's not as easy as the other poster before you was trying to portray i.e naija doctors are being poached by Advanced countries.


Those Nigerian doctors practicing in 1st world countries are not just Nigerian doctors but the "1st class ones" among them. Those qualifying exams are not rice and beans.

:to take without permission and use as one's own: to poach ideas; a staff poached from other companies.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/poach

phantom: THE TROUBLE WITH THE NIGERIAN HEALTH SECTOR
For a longtime now I have come across so many articles and reports in the national dailies and in online social media on the rife in the health sector which centers mainly on the row between doctors and non-doctors working in the healthcare system. Most of these reports and articles, mostly lopsided, have one common denominator, presenting the Doctor as an enemy of the people and the manner of their submissions is such as to draw undue sympathy from the unsuspecting public. But for the neutral members of the society who have had cause to have sufficient contact with the hospital environment, I’m not talking of some quasi journalists, they need not be told, if there are, who the Angels and Demons are.
This article is not aimed at indicting or exonerating any of the two combatant parties as both have had a fair share of the blame, and honestly, the deplorable state of our healthcare system is not as a result of the performance of the health workers, but it is a component of an overall failed system called Nigeria which the current government is still trying to salvage amongst other difficult challenges. Considering the lines along which the divide has been made, I shall delve into an inquest of some of the key issues at stake, mostly those that affect the general public, and this I will do by placing the Nigerian Doctor on one side to be reviewed alongside a few of the numerous “health professionals” working in the healthcare system with due consideration to the most important person in the system, the Patient. I shall concentrate mostly on the tertiary healthcare institutions where the bulk of the rivalry is most felt.
The Patient and the Hospital:
Let us begin from the beginning. A healthy person falls sick and needs to regain his health and function properly. He says to himself, “I don’t feel well enough, I need to see a Doctor. May be I should go to the hospital tomorrow”. He sets out of his house with this principal aim. On getting to the hospital, he first gets to the reception, obtains a card at the Out Patient Department and then proceeds to see a Doctor (usually a Medical Officer) if his condition is one that necessitates a Specialists attention, he is then Referred to another Doctor, the Specialist (Consultant) for further treatment. On getting to the point of referral, the Record staff assist him in opening a folder containing case notes, and in the process of this, a Doctor (Consultant) is assigned to him. The entire process of obtaining a card and folder have no direct effect on the patient’s condition but help ensure proper documentation and recording within the hospital. He is then directed to the designated Specialist or Consultant Clinic where he is received by a Nurse who does further documentation and records his vital signs which may or may not be repeated by the Doctor. Then the patient enters the clinic to see the Doctor, his primary aim for coming to the hospital ab initio.
The Patient, the Doctor and Other Health Workers:
The Doctor begins by taking a complete history of the patient which includes his current complaints, previous health challenges, living condition, social habits, family history, drug history, financial capacity, religious and cultural beliefs, and then proceeds to do a complete physical examination of his entire body system, at the end of which the Doctor would have verified the patients complaints and identified any other problems unknown to the patient, before arriving at a Provisional Diagnosis. He then counsels the patient, draws up a treatment plan, which is to be strictly adhered to provided the patient is within the hospital environment, and automatically takes full responsibility for any problems encountered along the line. He finally schedules him for a follow-up visit to ascertain his response to treatment. This process of history taking creates a personal relationship between the Patient and the Doctor and this is where the confidence of a patient on the Healthcare system of a Nation is built; the Doctor-Patient Relationship.
The treatment plan of the Patient, drawn by the Doctor, may or may not include; the investigations (or tests) both laboratory or radiological to be carried out, the drugs to be dispensed and the appropriate prescription, the additional care to be rendered outside the basic nursing care and the treatment orders to be followed, some of which he does himself (or via his subordinate Doctors) and others by the Nurses. There is no stereotyped outline of what must be done for every patient; investigations to be carried out, treatment to be administered or drugs to be prescribed lies solely at the discretion of the Patient and his Doctor.
Apart from the Nurses, all other “Health Professionals” come into patient care when the Doctor’s plan involves them. Clearly, a patient has no business with the Radiographer if the Doctor’s plan does not involve radiography, neither does he have any business with the Pharmacist if the patient does not require any drugs, of course, not every patients require drugs. Therefore, it is safe to assert that if Patient Care is the sole interest of everybody in the Health sector, then the Doctor takes the Central stage in this service to Patients and must carry the Nurses along at every point in time, and together they look out for any other “Health Professional” that should be roped into patient care. Why then should the Doctor take the Central stage? Very simple. He has been trained thoroughly to do so. Invariably, the Doctor is naturally the undisputed leader of the Health team and only two classes of people can challenge this standing; the criminal minded ones pursing their selfish interests and the dim-wits incapable of any logical reasoning.
On the Headship of the Hospital:
Over time, the functional head of the tertiary hospital setting has been the office of the Chief Medical Director, CMD, and part of the Act establishing the hospitals specified that this position be held by a Medical Doctor. However, there has recently been a loud cry from other “Health Professionals” under the auspices of the Joint Health Workers Union (JOHESU) for the chance to also partake in the “enjoyment” of this office, as if to say it is a political office, a “National Cake” which should be shared equally to everyone in the scene, whereas, it is the most sensitive of all positions in the hospital setting, one with huge implications on the health of patients. The Medical Doctors on the other hand, insist that the office of the Chief Medical Director and the headship in general, of the Hospitals is their exclusive reserve.
How true is this claim by the Doctors? Again, it is very simple. Healthcare is all about patient care, and in rendering care to the patient who is the main focus of everyone, the Doctor is the arrow head. He brings together the activities of all in the health care delivery system to bear fruit on the health of the patient. He has a broad-based and yet in-depth medical knowledge that enables him to function as a leader in patient management and take responsibility for the outcome. It is then indeed a funny ideology to expect the Doctor to maintain leadership of Patient Management and then cede the leadership of the Hospital Management to a Non-Doctor. Right thinking people would agree that whoever takes the blame should take the lead. Leadership is about responsibility, and Doctors embrace such responsibility mainly as it involves lives which they have sworn an oath to protect.
Furthermore, JOHESU, a body comprising of other “health professionals”, support staffs and in fact all in the Hospital setting except Doctors, claim to be equal and allied to Medicine. But my question is, how is the clerical staff allied to Medicine? How can a support staff head the core members of the organization? Also, why should a “profession” that is “allied” to Medicine surmount Medicine? Can a Non-Lawyer become the Attorney General of the Federation? Why isn’t the office of the Vice-Chancellor made open to every staff in the University system since ASUU and NASUU both consist of “professionals”? How would ceding hospital leadership to JOHESU improve the health indices of our country? These are people that do not deal directly with patients, people that do not really understand the agony of patients which Doctors do. The saddest part is the extent they can go to press home their irrational demands. We have a documented occurrence of how they turned off power supply to the Intensive Care Unit during a JOHESU orchestrated strike action in a southeastern Teaching Hospital leading to death of patients on life support. This was an attempt to frustrate the Doctors’ effort to keep hospital services running while they were “striking”. How can people who have displayed this level of irresponsibility be allowed to head the Health sector? Again, God forbid!
It is a common saying that Doctors are “proud”, and I insist, they have very just reasons to be, and when it comes to arrogance, the patients can tell who amongst Doctors and Nurses are more approachable. Doctors are a select class of elite and comprise the best brains of the society. Yes, the entry requirements into the profession and the medical training ensure that only the best emerge as Doctors. As such, the government has to understand that any arrangement that sees a Non-Doctor in a sensitive position to head Doctors in any Health related issue would be met with fierce resistance and the never ending tussle it will ensue will have detrimental effects on our nation’s healthcare delivery. In the interest of peace and decorum, the Federal Government has to dig in and ensure that the status quo is been maintained. The ear that will hear needs not be the size of a raffia palm.
On conferment of Consultancy on other “Health Professionals”:
A Consultant (Medical) is the title for a senior hospital-based physician or surgeon who has completed all of his/her specialist (Residency) training and has been placed on the specialist register (Fellow) in their chosen specialty. This level of Doctor joins the Civil service as a Consultant and automatically leads a team of Doctors comprising Residents, Medical Officers and House Officers who train under him.
Currently, there has been an outcry by JOHESU to also be awarded Honorary Consultancy based on the fact that Doctors are been appointed as Consultants, why not they too. The concession of the government to this particular demand has led to the entire hospital going berserk in some centers. This was done against the warning of the Nigerian Medical Association that the introduction of such “alien” practices would be detrimental to the lives of patients and the results are showing.
At the Nnamdi Azikiwe University Teaching Hospitals, it is been said that a “Consultant Pharmacist” invaded the wards with his team, cancelling patients prescriptions and also demanded that a Consultant Cardiologist remove a key drug in an inpatient prescription, on grounds that the drug has some known adverse effects. Another report has it that in Abuja University Teaching Hospital, the Ante-Natal Clinic was invaded by Nurses who decided to consult patients and make prescriptions, of which the Doctors left the clinic and the Patients were confused. Patients who sought to see their Doctors were told that there was a “Consultant Nurse” who does whatever a Consultant does. Also, in University College Hospital, Ibadan, stories had it that a Consultant Plastic Surgeon was barred from reviewing the surgical wound he created post-operatively because a “Consultant Nurse” had reviewed the wound earlier and was satisfied with her findings.
Let us address one of these occurrences. It is grave ignorance for a Pharmacist to tamper with a drug prescription simply because he has looked through his drug formulary and has identified a known adverse effect of the drug when he/she has no knowledge of the processes involved in the making of diagnosis and prescriptions. Patient management is highly individualized. To make a prescription, the Doctors put many things into consideration viz; patient’s history and examination, financial cost of the drug, benefits against the risk of using the drug, other drugs to be administered etc. Sometimes the side effect of a drug is the desired effect needed in one patient but would remain a serious adverse effect in another patient. But no, the Pharmacist didn’t think in that line before cancelling prescriptions. I am not saying every doctor’s prescription is infallible. No. But if a pharmacist wishes to express concern over a patient’s prescription, he should discuss with the Doctor to sort out their concerns.
This whole consultancy for non-doctors arose as a result of their quest to have better remuneration. I am not opposed to better remuneration for other health workers, but looking for cheap means to it at the expense of the lives of patients is grossly unacceptable. Why would you want to be a Specialist (Consultant) when you have no specialty, or you have a specialty in an area whose service is not needed? Even if a non-doctor must be a consultant that does not automatically make him/her a Doctor. We all know how to become a Doctor and age is no barrier.
If non-doctors must immutably be made consultants, their duties and jurisdictions must be clearly spelt out and understood by all involved. A Consultant Nurse should be confined to Nursing Practice and she will be expected to enhance it, not to invade Medical Practice. She must ensure that the management plan of a Doctor is properly carried out, even if he is a House Officer. Unfortunately, the idea of non-doctor consultant emanates from the desire of these other “health Professionals” for position and better pay than the desire to meet any specific needs. For instance, a ward Nurse that does her duties properly becomes a Consultant, what extra services and improvement does that bring to nursing care? The fact that there exist non-doctor consultants in a few foreign countries does not explain why the government should channel huge sums of money into the payment of honorarium to consultants that add nothing to the existing system but chaos. The NMA have identified these unhealthy health policies and should do all it can to prevent it from killing Nigerians.
On relativity of Wages:
Another very important object of discord is the demand by JOHESU for a unified salary scheme for everyone in the health sector and that will see a close approximation of the eventual earnings of all in the sector. What else can be sillier? Need I remind us that in every organization there is usually an established strata. Even in heaven, there are Angels and Arch angels, and the angels are content with their positions and would not want to usurp the duties of the Arch angels either. People cannot obtain different qualifications, different expertise, subserve different needs and end up earning similar pay. No. That cannot happen. Why would a non-specialist insist on being paid specialists allowance? Why would a Non-doctor terrorize the government because he wants to be paid like Doctors? Where in the world is that obtainable? Relativity is sacrosanct and must be reflected both on the basic salaries and all allowances.
Granted. Doctors are few. Very very few. The World Health Organisiation recommends that a Doctor should consult not more than seven patients in a clinic session and should pay maximum attention to their needs, but our environment see us in a situation where a Doctor consults over 40 patients in one clinic session, yet, he is underpaid compared to his colleagues even in nearby Ghana. There are less than 30,000 Doctors currently practicing in Nigeria subserving over 170 million Nigerians, and there is a dire need for more, but that will not push the Medical schools to take in everybody and churn out unqualified people as Doctors, neither will the Nigerian Doctor allow a Non-Doctor to tamper with the lives of patients. Doctors swore an oath to preserve lives and the NMA must see to it that the lives of Nigerians are safeguarded. If the Hippocratic Oath is to be taken serious, then the NMA must win this battle.
More often than not, we are clear on the knowledge that it is injustice to treat equal people unequally, but it fails to come to our minds that, it is graver injustice to treat unequal people equally. This is not pride, it is a statement of fact. Doctors and Non-doctors in the Health sector are not equal and they cannot be treated as equal. There is a reason why some students work harder than others to become Doctors. Some sat for JAMB several times to achieve that, although many fail to do so and even some do fail out of medical school and end up as “other Health Professionals”. To eventually anticipate to be rewarded equally with those who triumphed where you failed is simply madness. The government must see to it that relativity is maintained. For if a Nurse or Pharmacist consults patient, not regarding quality of the consult, earns equally with a Doctor and even get a chance to head the Doctor, why then would one need to work harder to become a Doctor when he can easily become a Pharmacist? Tampering with relativity is a conscious attempt at breeding mediocrity, again at the expense of lives. If the Nurses and Pharmacists accept to be paid equally with the Lab “Scientist” and Janitors, it’s their own cup of tea, but paying Doctors and Non-doctors equally? God forbid!
On the Physiotherapists’ demand to make first contact with Patients:
According to Prof. K. E. Obidike, there are three reasons why patients go to see Doctors. Firstly, is to ascertain the causes of their complaints and resolve them. Secondly, is to identify any other health problems unknown to the patient, and again, resolve them timely, and finally, to have a baseline documentation of the patient as a reference for subsequent health issues. The second reason especially, answers the question as to why a Physiotherapist cannot make first contact with patients. Medicine is holistic, and the initial assessment of a patient takes the entire body system into account not just the presenting complaints. Therefore, Physiotherapists should remain Physiotherapists and should come into action when consulted. Simple.

treasuredbytemi:
Thats what u think but my facts are as right as they can be. “Sections 4e and 19d of the Medical Laboratory
Science Council Law Act 11, 2003 (Cap M25, LFN
2014) specifically mandates the MLSCN to
“regulate the production, importation, sales and
stocking of diagnostic reagents and chemicals
and make rules for the maintenance of good
standard of medical laboratory practice and
services.
This is “with respect to regulation and control of
private practice, including statutory inspection,
approval and monitoring of all medical
laboratories, including those adjoined to clinics,
private and public health institutions.” Doctors have left what they should do they just running after name, fame abd money. spending more time on strike than they do inside a hospital

nobilis:

NMA is not trying to stifle anybody's growth. You are the ones causing troubles for yourselves. Let us take one instance. Just like lab scientists will say, there is a difference between a lab technologist and a lab scientist. What will the lab scientists do when the lab technologists start agitating that they are not being paid equally and that they also want to be addressed as scientists and that they should also have a say in the work the lab scientists are doing to the extent that they may actively disrupt such work?

Other health professionals in Nigeria are not trying to grow. No. They are trying to measure up to the doctors. They want to be paid the same thing as the doctors. They want to accorded the same amount of respect and prestige that they see doctors as having. You and I know that it is the truth. Because if they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" pharmacist will swear that he must make sure that the position of Chief Medical Director is not left to doctors alone. (But in our universities for example, there is ASUU and there is NASU. And we all know that VC's, Deans, and HOD's all come from ASUU. Yet NASU has never gone on strike to protest that. Because they know what their position and their work should be. After all, both ASUU and NASU are "professionals in the university educational system). What concerns the noble clinical pharmacy profession with chief medical directorship. Is dat position the highest position a clinical pharmacist can attain in his life?

If they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" nurse or "consultant" pharmacist will want to be paid the same thing a doctor is paid when they are not doing the same kind of job. That alone is against all forms of justice available on earth. Just like I suggested before, when janitors and orderlies start clamoring for consultancy and equal pay with nurses and pharmacists, I would love to see the pharmacists and nurses accept that in good faith. After all, the janitors are also entitled to advancement in their careers.

I still advise you, JOHESU, always speak the truth and it will set you free. Stop saying that doctors are trying to prevent your advancement in your field when it is obvious that the only advancement you seek are those backhand and ill-gotten advancements that will make u earn the same thing as doctors. You guys should stop deceiving the unsuspecting and gullible Nigerian citizenry.

YourHealthlabs:

Oga you are misinforming people. Legally, Medical laboratory technologists do not exist, only MLScientists, MLTechnicians, MLAssistants.

If you meant Technicians (which is an associate diploma holder), many of them still go back to the university to obtain B.MLS degree and get paid like Scientists. It's something we encourage because it keeps a lot of knowledge and experience in the profession and makes them very good Scientist as they already have the experience as to how a medical laboratory works.

nobilis:

Oh good. Thanks for giving me the correct info. So you guys encourage the technicians to obtain a BMLS in order to get paid like the scientists. Yet when doctors encourage you guys to go back to school and obtain the MBBS degree in order to get paid like doctors, you will say doctors are being unrealistic.

The bottomline still remains that a technician cannot be paid the same thing as a scientist even though both of them work in the laboratories. But JOHESUITES want to be paid the same thing as doctors just because they all work in the hospital.

This is pure injustice. And even a blind man can see it.

iiiyyyk: This jack of all trade mentality of nigerian drs is very embarrassing.
They have somuch allowed their ego to becloud their sense of reasoning.
Very very painfull and shameful.
why stop others from reaching the pick of their choosen career, NMA dont want others to be consultant or Directors. This is witchcrafting.

This is what we want, consultant physiotherspist, consultant optometrist(low vision, contact lense etc) consultant pharmacist, etc
If NMA dont like it, ok lets go to court, NmA shlould stop creating unnecessary tension and suffering the masses with their selfish egocentric strikes.

YourHealthlabs:

The Scientists, Pharmacists, Physios all have Bachelor's degree like the Doctors. The federal civil service scheme do not value any degree above the other and 10 combined bachelors degrees is not greater than one in the Civil service.

Every degree-holder has the right to reach his peak without any group of organised criminals meddling with their growth scheme. It's a crime to do so.

Rosebert: I am of the opinion that the NMA should be interviewd possibly by channels television..let the public really know the real reasons behind this strike... Cos from what i have gathered these demands are not for public benefit or interest but individual greed... Seun please help us get this message across through the right channel

Jman06: And the same lab technicians now want to bear the title of consultant medical lab 'scientists' even when we know they are not scientists. No wonder they are trying to stop the real scientists(physiologists, Biochemists and microbiologists) from practicing laboratory science as obtainable in other parts of the world. What goes around comes around! Doctors! make una no gree oo!

nobilis:

Please, my dear, I will advise you to desist from giving inputs in matters which you have not fully understood.
There is nothing wrong with nurses and pharmacists and any others being called consultants. It is not about the name. What's in a name? If it ends only in their answering the name "consultant", no one gives a damn. But the issue is that they are disrupting the work of doctors because they see themselves as consultants and therefore, they feel they have the right to do so. They usurp consulting rooms from doctors. They meddle with treatment plans fashioned out by doctors without consulting the doctors. They prevent the doctors from doing their jobs. Because they want to show the doctors that they also have a say. And who suffers in this situation? The patients.

But you have comfortably refused to see the anarchy breeding in the hospitals because of the clamor for such positions. And you have comfortably fixed your mind on the greed you perceive from doctors.

People like you are the people I refer to as the gullible populace with whom JOHESU scores her cheap points. Itz either you are that or you are a JOHESU operative. When JOHESU went on strike and tried to disrupt the work of doctors who were still working and taking care of hospital in-patients, what did the NLC/TUC and the general Nigerian populace say about it? Absolutely nothing. But NMA has gone on strike now and u see them as d devils who are heartless and want to kill people.

Nigerians, until we learn to uphold truth and justice, progress and unity will remain very far from us.

nobilis:

So from what you are saying, people in the Nigerian Civil Service are now paid according to the degree they have instead of according to the work they do. So salaries are now dependent on the degree and not on the job description. If it is so, I wonder why a teacher who is a bachelor's degree holder doesn't earn the same thing as an engineer holding a bachelor's degree as well.

Every degree-holder has the right to reach the peak of his career without interference. But does that peak entail disrupting another person's work? Does that peak entail trying to prevent another person from doing the work he is entitled to do?

Be objective, sir. I've always somehow respected you because you always talk with facts in your posts. Just try and be objective and speak what the truth is.

nobilis:

NMA is not trying to stifle anybody's growth. You are the ones causing troubles for yourselves. Let us take one instance. Just like lab scientists will say, there is a difference between a lab technologist and a lab scientist. What will the lab scientists do when the lab technologists start agitating that they are not being paid equally and that they also want to be addressed as scientists and that they should also have a say in the work the lab scientists are doing to the extent that they may actively disrupt such work?

Other health professionals in Nigeria are not trying to grow. No. They are trying to measure up to the doctors. They want to be paid the same thing as the doctors. They want to accorded the same amount of respect and prestige that they see doctors as having. You and I know that it is the truth. Because if they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" pharmacist will swear that he must make sure that the position of Chief Medical Director is not left to doctors alone. (But in our universities for example, there is ASUU and there is NASU. And we all know that VC's, Deans, and HOD's all come from ASUU. Yet NASU has never gone on strike to protest that. Because they know what their position and their work should be. After all, both ASUU and NASU are "professionals in the university educational system). What concerns the noble clinical pharmacy profession with chief medical directorship. Is dat position the highest position a clinical pharmacist can attain in his life?

If they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" nurse or "consultant" pharmacist will want to be paid the same thing a doctor is paid when they are not doing the same kind of job. That alone is against all forms of justice available on earth. Just like I suggested before, when janitors and orderlies start clamoring for consultancy and equal pay with nurses and pharmacists, I would love to see the pharmacists and nurses accept that in good faith. After all, the janitors are also entitled to advancement in their careers.

I still advise you, JOHESU, always speak the truth and it will set you free. Stop saying that doctors are trying to prevent your advancement in your field when it is obvious that the only advancement you seek are those backhand and ill-gotten advancements that will make u earn the same thing as doctors. You guys should stop deceiving the unsuspecting and gullible Nigerian citizenry.

nobilis:

Oh good. Thanks for giving me the correct info. So you guys encourage the technicians to obtain a BMLS in order to get paid like the scientists. Yet when doctors encourage you guys to go back to school and obtain the MBBS degree in order to get paid like doctors, you will say doctors are being unrealistic.

The bottomline still remains that a technician cannot be paid the same thing as a scientist even though both of them work in the laboratories. But JOHESUITES want to be paid the same thing as doctors just because they all work in the hospital.

This is pure injustice. And even a blind man can see it.

nobilis:
because of d lacklustre nature of your post, it is safe for me to assume that you are among the brainwashed members of JOHESU. Ok. You want consultant physiotherapist, consultant optometrist, consultant pharmacist and consultant nurse. Why don't you also want consultant ambulance drivers, consultant sweepers, consultant orderlies, consultant records clerks, consultant secretaries, and consultant works technicians. Are these people not entitled to reach the peak of their own careers and are they not also part of JOHESU?

You don't want to clamor for the establishment of programs that will further train these people so as to make them well equipped for the consultancy work. But you just want to be landed with the title, "consultant". And yet you guys will turn around oo and say it is d doctors that are hankering after titles.

From what has been observed in some places where this consultancy thing is in place, you guys want to be consultants just to disrupt the work of doctors and frustrate them and show them that you have arrived. Nothing more. But this is not the case in all those countries you cite as examples. So from what has been observed, you want doctors to just sit down and allow you guys to spread disorder and anarchy in the health sector? There is an igbo adage that the taste of faeces is determined from the odor of fart.

When JOHESU went on strike, they locked up everywhere: the clinics, the blood banks, the surgical theaters, and even tried to kill ICU patients by turning off the ICU generating set in a southeastern hospital. And all these they did in order to make sure that doctors will find it difficult to do their work. And yet, JOHESU is d lover of the masses and is people friendly.

But when doctors are on strike, they just refuse to show up at d hospital. They stay at home and they don't try to interfere with anytin or anyone at the hospital. Yet they are the evil bedeviling the health sector.

At least with this strike, you JOHESUITES can prove to the Nigerian populace that you can do without doctors. That is what you guys have been claiming all along. Now is the time for action. Rise up and meet the challenges.

YourHealthlabs:

I agree that people are paid according to what they do, but i'll advise you get a copy of the Health Civil service scheme and point out where it says that Scientists, Pharmacists and Nurses can not become Directors of their directorates.


You keep harping on SALARIES. Be informed that Resident and Intern physicians in the US, UK, and Canada are paid far lower than established Scientists, pharmacists, Nurse and physios but in Nigeria they earn almost triple of a Consultant physiotherapists salary. How are you guys addressing that warped relativity?. Nigeria is the only country where Intern and Resident docs routinely threaten the Nigerian patients and the Government that pays their school fees and salaries as doctors-in-training.

NMA since the days of Dr Ransome-kuti( an NMA member) set the precedence of "grab-all-you-can-and-interfere-with-others" including special plate numbers, special road like they are asking for today. etc

If the Scientist also begin to ask for same because we need to "clear road for him" as to rushes to the emergency blood bank to cross-match safe blood and save accident victims, why whine when others seek to toe your line? Afterall "you lead others follow"

YourHealthlabs:

You are ignorant. The medical Laboratory Science field is a regulated one . In the U.S they are called Clinical Laboratory Scientists, in U.K they addressed as Biomedical Scientists, In Aussie the title is Medical Scientist. All in all, they Scientists. It is a global trend.

The physiologists, Biochemists and Microbiologists are very important people too, but the training of a Scientist who works in a medical laboratory is more encompassing and comprehensive. Take a good look at the B.MLS curriculum here and abroad, you'll understand

During undergraduate years, Scientists in the medical laboratories were trained in the fields of pharmacology, clinical chemistry,Medical micro, hematology, anatomy, physiology, biochemistry, parasitology, blood transfusion science, counselling skills, medical sociology among many important courses. They are fundamentally Generalists with final majors in one the 5 sub-disciplines.

Now how comfortable will you feel if a Biochemist reads an antibiogram or runs an AFB, and then signs the patient's result as a Biochemist.

Everyone can't be a Physiologist, Pharmacists, Physicians, Medical Laboratory Scientists or Nurse.

nobilis:

Okay. Since the time that the issue happened till now, how has the nurse been sanctioned? And secondly, who will sanction the nurse? Yet you claim it is pure wickedness to prevent consultancy appointments.

Now tell me why the NMA should insist on Doctors being team leaders when the other health workers have refused to work as a team. Is it not when those you work with come up with team-working spirit, then doctors will be compelled to comply.

If there is a team, it means there is a team leader. Every ship has a captain. Every plane has a pilot. And who should be the leader of the medical team. That position is not a political position and should not be open to elections to see who is fit to lead the team. There are several reasons why a doctor is and should always be the head of the medical team treating a patient.

1. When the patient was being admitted, he was admitted into the doctor's (consultant physician/surgeon) unit. Meaning that the patient practically "belongs"(permit me to use that word) to the consultant physician or surgeon throughout his stay in the hospital. So who is better suited to lead the team treating that patient if not the consultant into whose unit the patient was admitted?

2. A doctor has a broader based medical education than the other health professions. A doctor has a knowledge of pathology ( so as to know when to order for tests and which tests to order for in certain disease conditions and interpret the results of tests when they get back to him). A doctor studies pharmacology (so as to acquaint himself with the way drugs work in the human body and to discover how drugs interact with each other and so on and so forth). The list goes on and on.
Because of his broad-based education, a doctor is better equipped to know when to call in other members of his team to play their roles. He decides when a patient needs laboratory and radiological tests. He decided when a patient needs drugs. You will agree with me that it is not every patient that comes to a hospital that is sent to the lab for tests. And it is not all patients that are given drug prescriptions. So among all the health professionals, who is the best suited to lead the medical team? Answer by yourself. Now you accuse doctors of not being team players when it is you JOHESUITES who have refused to work as a team.

As for the position of chief medical director, it is still the doctors who are best suited for that post. JOHESU has been hammering that doctors lack the administrative prowess needed to run that position. And the gullible general populace believe their stories. JOHESU comfortably forgot to mention that every hospital has a Director for Administration who is not a medical doctor and who is in charge of all the administrative functions in a hospital.

JOHESU, you guys should tell yourselves the truth. Stop trying to deaden your consciences. You all know the truth but have chosen to sit on top of it.

nobilis:

Okay. Since the time that the issue happened till now, how has the nurse been sanctioned? And secondly, who will sanction the nurse? Yet you claim it is pure wickedness to prevent consultancy appointments.

Now tell me why the NMA should insist on Doctors being team leaders when the other health workers have refused to work as a team. Is it not when those you work with come up with team-working spirit, then doctors will be compelled to comply.

If there is a team, it means there is a team leader. Every ship has a captain. Every plane has a pilot. And who should be the leader of the medical team. That position is not a political position and should not be open to elections to see who is fit to lead the team. There are several reasons why a doctor is and should always be the head of the medical team treating a patient.

1. When the patient was being admitted, he was admitted into the doctor's (consultant physician/surgeon) unit. Meaning that the patient practically "belongs"(permit me to use that word) to the consultant physician or surgeon throughout his stay in the hospital. So who is better suited to lead the team treating that patient if not the consultant into whose unit the patient was admitted?

2. A doctor has a broader based medical education than the other health professions. A doctor has a knowledge of pathology ( so as to know when to order for tests and which tests to order for in certain disease conditions and interpret the results of tests when they get back to him). A doctor studies pharmacology (so as to acquaint himself with the way drugs work in the human body and to discover how drugs interact with each other and so on and so forth). The list goes on and on.
Because of his broad-based education, a doctor is better equipped to know when to call in other members of his team to play their roles. He decides when a patient needs laboratory and radiological tests. He decided when a patient needs drugs. You will agree with me that it is not every patient that comes to a hospital that is sent to the lab for tests. And it is not all patients that are given drug prescriptions. So among all the health professionals, who is the best suited to lead the medical team? Answer by yourself. Now you accuse doctors of not being team players when it is you JOHESUITES who have refused to work as a team.

As for the position of chief medical director, it is still the doctors who are best suited for that post. JOHESU has been hammering that doctors lack the administrative prowess needed to run that position. And the gullible general populace believe their stories. JOHESU comfortably forgot to mention that every hospital has a Director for Administration who is not a medical doctor and who is in charge of all the administrative functions in a hospital.

JOHESU, you guys should tell yourselves the truth. Stop trying to deaden your consciences. You all know the truth but have chosen to sit on top of it.

YourHealthlabs:

You are ignorant. The medical Laboratory Science field is a regulated one . In the U.S they are called Clinical Laboratory Scientists, in U.K they addressed as Biomedical Scientists, In Aussie the title is Medical Scientist. All in all, they Scientists. It is a global trend.

The physiologists, Biochemists and Microbiologists are very important people too, but the training of a Scientist who works in a medical laboratory is more encompassing and comprehensive. Take a good look at the B.MLS curriculum here and abroad, you'll understand

During undergraduate years, Scientists in the medical laboratories were trained in the fields of pharmacology, clinical chemistry,Medical micro, hematology, anatomy, physiology, biochemistry, parasitology, blood transfusion science, counselling skills, medical sociology among many important courses. They are fundamentally Generalists with final majors in one the 5 sub-disciplines.

Now how comfortable will you feel if a Biochemist reads an antibiogram or runs an AFB, and then signs the patient's result as a Biochemist.

Everyone can't be a Physiologist, Pharmacists, Physicians, Medical Laboratory Scientists or Nurse.

Jman06: It's funny that you readily remembered that graduates of MLS are called 'scientists' in other parts of the world, but refused to mention (or ignorant of) the fact that in those countries too, practice of medical laboratory science is not monopolized by graduates MLS. In the US and UK for instance, graduates of biomedical sciences such as Biochemistry, Microbiology, Physiology etc are usually admitted into internship programs that qualify them for award of associate membership of institutes of medical laboratory science(AIMLS) and to practice laboratory science. Before now, we used to have that in Nigeria. But the medical laboratory council of Nigeria out of sheer greed, cancelled that program and now exclude graduates of related fields from being registered to practice. Now, to answer your question, ofcourse i will feel great so long as the Biochemist does a good job. Afterall if you go to many hospitals today, you will still find many Biochemists who were registered prior to the embargo excellently doing their jobs. Like i stated earlier, the problem is not that those guys ain't good, but that the so called medical lab scientists are simply GREEDY. Not that i care much cos i have since choosen a different career path, but i pity those of you that will still want to come and do Msc or PhD in my department. Nothing for una here!

Peaceworld: This is how your association is trying to deceive everybody...nobody is trying to usurp your role as team leader of the medical team. Nobody. Stop spreading that fallacy. And a general ward round is an important aspect of patient care. Get enlightened. There are some issues the doctor might overlook in a patient's care. That's what a general ward round addresses. Because you think a patient doesn't need a physiotherapist doesn't mean you'll always be right. There lies the problem. No one profession knows it all. Your 'thinking' that this is the case, that a patient can do without any other professional could be wrong at some point. No member of the health team is an island. TRUE. If a doctor will be the one deciding when every other team member comes into patient care, then which team is he leading?

Jman06: It's funny that you readily remembered that graduates of MLS are called 'scientists' in other parts of the world, but refused to mention (or ignorant of) the fact that in those countries too, practice of medical laboratory science is not monopolized by graduates MLS. In the US and UK for instance, graduates of biomedical sciences such as Biochemistry, Microbiology, Physiology etc are usually admitted into internship programs that qualify them for award of associate membership of institutes of medical laboratory science(AIMLS) and to practice laboratory science. Before now, we used to have that in Nigeria. But the medical laboratory council of Nigeria out of sheer greed, cancelled that program and now exclude graduates of related fields from being registered to practice. Now, to answer your question, ofcourse i will feel great so long as the Biochemist does a good job. Afterall if you go to many hospitals today, you will still find many Biochemists who were registered prior to the embargo excellently doing their jobs. Like i stated earlier, the problem is not that those guys ain't good, but that the so called medical lab scientists are simply GREEDY. Not that i care much cos i have since choosen a different career path, but i pity those of you that will still want to come and do Msc or PhD in my department. Nothing for una here!

YourHealthlabs:

Oga, it used to be like that before. Any science graduate could to the Institute of Medical laboratory Technology do a 2-year program and become an associate, but it was discovered that there were knowledge gaps that a 2-year associate couldn't fill.

Knowlege in pharmacology, physiology, hematology and other clinically-inclined courses became imperative for optimal performance as a fully grounded Scientist. B.MLS curriculum was borne out of that necessity.

Biomedical Science in the U.K is not a 2-year associate. A bachelor is awarded.

In Canada it's B.MLS
http://www.unb.ca/academics/programs/undergrad/fr/medical/

In New Zealand same story.
http://www.otago.ac.nz/courses/qualifications/bmlsc.html

In Aussie,Medical Scientists are not different.
http://www.csu.edu.au/courses/undergraduate/medical_science/course-overview

Americans have taken it to a whole new level. Doctorate of Clinical laboratory Science.
http://shrp.rutgers.edu/dept/CLS/DCLS/

Medical practitioners started out as associate diploma Medical Assistants. Why are you not clamouring that Medical assistants treat patients.

Necessity my brother, that's the key word right there

nobilis:

NMA is not trying to stifle anybody's growth. You are the ones causing troubles for yourselves. Let us take one instance. Just like lab scientists will say, there is a difference between a lab technologist and a lab scientist. What will the lab scientists do when the lab technologists start agitating that they are not being paid equally and that they also want to be addressed as scientists and that they should also have a say in the work the lab scientists are doing to the extent that they may actively disrupt such work?

Other health professionals in Nigeria are not trying to grow. No. They are trying to measure up to the doctors. They want to be paid the same thing as the doctors. They want to accorded the same amount of respect and prestige that they see doctors as having. You and I know that it is the truth. Because if they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" pharmacist will swear that he must make sure that the position of Chief Medical Director is not left to doctors alone. (But in our universities for example, there is ASUU and there is NASU. And we all know that VC's, Deans, and HOD's all come from ASUU. Yet NASU has never gone on strike to protest that. Because they know what their position and their work should be. After all, both ASUU and NASU are "professionals in the university educational system). What concerns the noble clinical pharmacy profession with chief medical directorship. Is dat position the highest position a clinical pharmacist can attain in his life?

If they were really interested in growing, I don't see why a "consultant" nurse or "consultant" pharmacist will want to be paid the same thing a doctor is paid when they are not doing the same kind of job. That alone is against all forms of justice available on earth. Just like I suggested before, when janitors and orderlies start clamoring for consultancy and equal pay with nurses and pharmacists, I would love to see the pharmacists and nurses accept that in good faith. After all, the janitors are also entitled to advancement in their careers.

I still advise you, JOHESU, always speak the truth and it will set you free. Stop saying that doctors are trying to prevent your advancement in your field when it is obvious that the only advancement you seek are those backhand and ill-gotten advancements that will make u earn the same thing as doctors. You guys should stop deceiving the unsuspecting and gullible Nigerian citizenry.