[size=13pt]THIS IS WHAT WE WON'T TAKE. IF SEUN OR WHOEVER INSTALLED A CHECK-VALVE IN MUSLIM TOPICS LIKE A RESTRICTION ON WHO COMMENTS ON MUSLIM THREADS THEY SHOULD PLACE SUCH HERE. FAIRNESS ONLY GIVE WAY FOR PEACE AND MUTUAL RESPECT. NO MUSLIM IS PERMITTED TO COMMENT ON A CHRISTIAN TOPIC OR THREAD SINCE WE ARE DIVIDED ON RELIGIOUS LINES NOW HERE..........[/size].....

ProFuhrer:
Why are Muslims allowed to comment in a Christian thread and even post their koran verses here? The topic specifically requests for what the Bible has to say about Mary, the mother of Jesus.

Anybody posting koran verses should be banned and the comment deleted.

FrancisDiote:
Who asked you to honour her? Is it the bible or mary herself. Mary does not intercede for anybody. Generations also call Abraham blessed that does not make him special or deserve to be honoured. Anyway its not anybody's fault b'cos we are all reading from a book that was initially prohibited from the public, a book that has undergone series of modification, and is been interpreted by people who are after their own purse putting everybody into confusion.

@ Bold, are you kidding me? Please tell me when the bible developed "mouth" to talk, if not God speaking through human instrumentation.

The argument I see on Nairaland is sometimes nauseating

nnatom:




Note, the bible is not a story book. and messages are not passed like your reader Edet lives in calabar.


King David is the
man after God's heart and God made a
promise to him. CHRONICLE 17:11-14
11 And it shall come to pass, when thy
days be expired that thou must go to be
with thy fathers, that I will raise up thy seed
after thee, which shall be of thy sons; and I
will establish his kingdom.
12 He shall build me an house, and I will
stablish his throne for ever.
13 I will be his father, and he shall be my
son: and I will not take my mercy away
from him, as I took it from him that was
before thee:
14 But I will settle him in mine house and in
my kingdom for ever: and his throne shall
be established for evermore.

and this God fulfilled by sending Jesus whoes lineage could be traced back to David through Mary. for more information go to this thread

www.nairaland.com/1581928/lineage-jesus-mary-not-joseph

I think is talking about Solomon here!

nnatom:


I know you have a problem understanding English language.

catholic says Mary intercede for them and u are missing it up with mediator. yes Christ is the only mediator between God and man. but Mary intercede,i.e plead on our behalf.

dictionary meaning of mediator and intercede

To intercede is to go or come between two
parties, to plead before one of them on behalf
of the other. "Mediation"
means a standing in the midst between two
(contending) parties, for the purpose of
bringing them together.

mary was just a human like us, so why should she intercede for us when Jesus is there?
I don't even think Mary should be recognised in a prayer!

FrancisDiote:
Who asked you to honour her? Is it the bible or mary herself. Mary does not intercede for anybody. Generations also call Abraham blessed that does not make him special or deserve to be honoured. Anyway its not anybody's fault b'cos we are all reading from a book that was initially prohibited from the public, a book that has undergone series of modification, and is been interpreted by people who are after their own purse putting everybody into confusion.

Revelation 12:17 says,
Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring—those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus.
Referring to Mary as the woman and the church as her offspring. I believe the ten commandments also says honor thy father and thy mother. I believe "father and mother" here does not refer to biological parents alone. That's all.

SalC:


Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; 26 and whoever lives and believe in me will never die. Do you believe this? . John 11:25-26

Jesus is asking if you believe his words above. I believe it, do you?

Did Mary live and believe in Jesus?
If Yes, do you still consider her "dead"?

Interesting, isn't it? In that case why do we narrow it to only Mary? I think it should have been all believers we know.

Just saying ooooo!!!!!!!!!!

Instead of serving God through the way we think is right, we should rather follow the instructions of Jesus "the way" which says
"John 14
6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."KJV

Ukutsgp:
so what type of couple are are they?

pls forget ur early church tradition here. d bible said mary had other children. it is either u will believe d bible or forget it. so where did the bible tells u dat joseph had married before? una dey lie sha.

where did the Bible say that Mary had other children?

Ifebazz:

God could have 'chosen anybody' but He didn't choose anybody but Mary Immaculate. I like the passion you guys put into trying to disprove Catholic stuff. Have you guys also ever put same energy into 'not believing everything' that your half baked-money-seeking flashy pastors say?

Same way God could have chosen any body to be samson, Elijah, Paul, Samson, Moses...etc.

Pastor?? I read my bible bro.

My bible is all the word/prove I need and am sure the pope, your priest and catholic doctrine is all the prove/word you have.

Now who is brainwashed

nnatom:


I know you have a problem understanding English language.

catholic says Mary intercede for them and u are missing it up with mediator. yes Christ is the only mediator between God and man. but Mary intercede,i.e plead on our behalf.

dictionary meaning of mediator and intercede

To intercede is to go or come between two
parties, to plead before one of them on behalf
of the other. "Mediation"
means a standing in the midst between two
(contending) parties, for the purpose of
bringing them together.

The guy just quoted the bible...why dont u go ahead and do the same....I am not a christian, but u r confusin me. If u read the same bible i should not sound confusing

thread fight between Catholic Church and other Churches, just like PDP and other parties

ProFuhrer:
Get out of this thread and return to your secluded section in Nairaland.

pls tell me......d 'section' female pastor

Ukutsgp:
so what type of couple are are they?

pls forget ur early church tradition here. d bible said mary had other children. it is either u will believe d bible or forget it. so where did the bible tells u dat joseph had married before? una dey lie sha.

Guy ,na u fit these ppl. i like how cool u reply their logic teaching. the word of God is not logic.

The body that conceived and bore Christ will never fall into the hands of satan. Mary is in heaven body and soul like prophet Moses.

PROPHET ISA
In many verses of the Glorious Qur'an Allah the Exalted denied the claim of the Christians that He has a son. A delegation from Nagran came to the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). They began to talk about their claim about the Trinity, which is that Allah is three in one, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, with some disagreement among their sects. That is why Allah affirmed in many verses of the Qur'an that Jesus is a slave of Allah, whom He molded in the womb of his mother like any other of His creatures, and that He created him without a father, as He created Adam without a father or a mother.
Allah the Almighty said:Allah chose Adam, Noah, the family of Abraham and the family of Imran above the Alamin (mankind and jinns)(of their times). Offspring, one of theo other, and Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower.
Remember when the wife of Imran said: "O my Lord! I have vowed to You what (the child that) is in my womb to be dedicated for Your services (free from all worldly work; to serve Your Place of worship), so accept this, from me. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All Knowing."
Then when she delivered her (child Mary), she said: "O my Lord! I have delivered a female child," and Allah knew better what she delivered, - "and the male is not like the female, and I have named her Mary, and I seek refuge with You (Allah) for her and for her offspring from Satan, the outcast."
So her Lord (Allah) accepted her with goodly acceptance. He made her grow in a good manner and put her under the care of Zechariah. Every time he entered Al-Mihrab (a praying place or a private room), he found her supplied with sustenance.
He said: "O Mary! From where have you got this?"
She said: "From Allah. Verily, Allah provides sustenance to whom He wills, without limit." (Ch 3:33-37 Quran)
Allah declared that He had elected Adam (pbuh) and the elite of his offspring who obey Allah. Then He specified the family of Abraham (pbuh), which includes the sons of Ishmael (pbuh), and the family of Imran, the father of Mary.
Muhammad Ibn Ishaaq stated that he was Imran Ibn Bashim, Ibn Amun, Ibn Misha, Ibn Hosqia, Ibn Ahriq, Ibn Mutham, Ibn Azazia, Ibn Amisa, Ibn Yamish, Ibn Ahrihu, Ibn Yazem, Ibn Yahfashat, Ibn Eisha, Ibn Iyam, Ibn Rahba am, Ibn David (Dawud).
Prophet Zakariyah's (pbuh) wife's sister had a daughter named Hannah. She was married to Imran, a leader of the Israelites. For many years, the couple remained childless. Whenever Hannah saw another woman with a child, her longing for a baby increased. Although years had passed, she never lost hope. She believed that one day Allah would bless her with a child, on whom she would shower all her motherly love.
She turned to the Lord of the heavens and the earth and pleaded with Him for a child. She would offer the child in the service of Allah's house, in the temple of Jerusalem. Allah granted her request. When she learned that she was pregnant, she was the happiest woman alive, and thanked Allah for His gift. Her overjoyed husband Imran also thanked Allah for His mercy.
However, while she was pregnant her husband passed away. Hannah wept bitterly. Alas, Imran did not live to see their child for whom they had so longed. She gave birth to a girl, and again turned to Allah in prayer: "O my Lord, I have delivered a female child," and the male is not like the female, and I have named her Mary, and I seek refuge with You (Allah) for her and her offspring from Satan, the outcast." (Ch 3:36 Quran)
Hannah had a big problem in reference to her promise to Allah, for females were not accepted into the temple, and she was very worried. Her sister's husband Zakariyah, comforted her, saying that Allah knew best what she had delivered and appreciated fully what she had offered in His service. She wrapped the baby in a shawl and handed it over to the temple elders. As the baby was a girl, the question of her guardianship posed a problem for the elders. This was a child of their late and beloved leader, and everyone was eager to take care of her. Zakariyah said to the elders: "I am the husband of her maternal aunt and her nearest relation in the temple; therefore, I will be more mindful of her than all of you."
As it was their custom to draw lots to solve disagreements, they followed this course. Each one was given a reed to throw into the river. They had agreed that whoever's reed remained afloat would be granted guardianship of the girl. All the reeds sank to the bottom except Zakariyah's. With this sign, they all surrendered to the will of Allah and made him the guardian.
To ensure that no one had access to Mary, Zakariyah built a separate room for her in the temple. As she grew up, she spent her time in devotion to Allah. Zakariyah visited her daily to see to her needs, and so it continued for many years. One day, he was surprised to find fresh fruit, which was out of season in her room. As he was the only person who could enter her room, he asked her how the fruit got there. She replied that these provisions were from Allah, as He gives to whom He wills. Zakariyah understood by this that Allah had raised Mary's status above that of other women.
Thereafter, Zakariyah spent more time with her, teaching and guiding her. Mary grew to be a devotee of Allah, glorifying Him day and night.
Ali Ibn Abi Talib narrated that the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said: "The best of the world's women is Mary (in her lifetime), and the best of the world's women is Khadija (in her lifetime)." (Sahih Al-Bukhari)
Abu Musa Al-Ashari also narrated that the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said: "May among men attained perfection but among women none attained perfection except Mary the daughter of Imran, and Asiya the wife of Pharaoh, and the superiority of Aisha to other women is like the superiority of Tharid (an Arabic dish) to other meals."
While Mary was praying in her temple, an angel in the form of a man appeared before her. Filled with terror, she tried to flee, praying:"Verily! I seek refuge with the Most Beneficent (Allah) from you, if you do fear Allah."
The angel said: "I am only a Messenger from your Lord, (to announce) to you the gift of a righteous son."
She said: "How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, nor am I unchaste?"
He said: "So (it will be), your Lord said: "That is easy for me (Allah): And (We wish) to appoint him as a sign to mankind and a mercy from Us (Allah), and it is a matter (already) decreed, (by Allah).'" (Ch 19:18-21 Quran)
The angel's visit caused Mary great anxiety, which increased as the months went by. How could she face giving birth to a child without having a husband? Later, she felt life kicking inside her. With a heavy heart, she left the temple and went to Nazareth, the city in which she had been born where she settled in a simple farm house to avoid the public.
But fear and anxiety did not leave her. She was from a noble and pious family. Her father had not been an evil man nor was her mother an impure woman. How could she prevent tongues from wagging about her honor?
After some months, she could not bear the mental strain any longer. Burdened with a heavy womb, she left Nazareth, not knowing where to go to be away from this depressing atmosphere.
She had not gone far, when she was overtaken by the pains of childbirth. She saw down against a dry palm tree, and here she gave birth to a son. Looking at her beautiful baby, she was hurt that she had brought him into the world without a father. She exclaimed: "I wish I had died before this happened and had vanished into nothingness!"
Suddenly, she heard a voice nearby: "Grieve not, your Lord has placed a rivulet below, and shake the trunk of this tree, from which ripe dates will fall. So eat and drink and regain the strength you have lost; and be of good cheer, for what you see is the power of Allah, Who made the dry palm tree regain life, in order to provide food for you." For a while she was comforted by Allah's miracle, for it was a sure sign of her innocence and purity.
She decided to return to the city. However, her fears also returned. What was she going to tell the people? As if sharinhis mother's worry, the baby began to speak: "If you meet any person say: 'I have vowed to fast for The Beneficent and may not speak to any human today.'" With this miracle, Mary felt at ease.
As she had expected, her arrival in the city with a newborn baby in her arms aroused the curiosity of the people. They scolded her: "This is a terrible sin that you have committed." She put her finger to her lips and pointed to the child. They asked: "How can we speak to a newborn baby?" To their total amazement, the child began to speak clearly: "I am Allah's servant. Allah has given me the Book, and has made me a prophet, and has blessed me wherever I may be, and has enjoined on me prayers and alms-giving as long as I live. Allah has made me dutiful towards she who had borne me. He has not made me arrogant nor unblessed. Peace unto me the day I was born, the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive."
Most of the people realized that the baby was unique, for it Allah wills something, He merely says "Be" and it happens. Of course, there were some who regarded the baby's speech as a strange trick, but at least Mary could now stay in Nazareth without being harassed.
Allah the Exalted revealed:And mention in the Book (the Qur'an, O Muhammad, the story of) Mary, when she withdrew in seclusion from her family to a place facing east. She placed a screen (to screen herself) from them; then We sent to her Our Ruh (angel Gabriel), and he appeared before her in the form of a man in all respects.
She said: "Verily! I seek refuge with the Most Beneficent (Allah) from you, if you do fear Allah."
The angel said: "I am only a Messenger from your Lord, (to announce) to you the gift of a righteous son."
She said: "How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, nor am I unchaste?" He said: "So (it will be), your Lord said: "That is easy for Me (Allah): and (We wish) to appoint him as a sign to mankind and a mercy from Us (Allah), and it is a matter (already) decreed, (by Allah).'"
So she conceived him, and she withdrew with him to a far place (Bethlehem valley, about four to six miles from Jerusalem). And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm tree. She said: "Would that I had died before this, and had been forgotten and out of sight!"
Then (the babe "Jesus" or Gabriel) cried unto her from below her, saying: "Grieve not! Your Lord has provided you a water stream under you; and shake the trunk of palm tree towards you, it will let fall fresh ripe dates upon you. So eat and drink and be glad, and if you see any human being, say: 'Verily! I have vowed a fast unto the Most Beneficent (Allah) so I shall not speak to any human being this day.'"
Then she brought him (the baby) to her people, carrying him. They said: "O Mary! Indeed you have brought a thing Fariyya (an unheard mighty thing). O sister (the like) of Aaron (not the brother of Moses, but he was another pious man at the time of Mary)! Your father was not a man who used to commit adultery, nor was your mother an unchaste woman."
Then she pointed to him. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"
He (Jesus) said: "Verily! I am a slave of Allah. He has given me the Scripture and made me a Prophet; and He has made me blessed wheresoever I be, and has enjoined me prayer, and Zakat, as long as I live, and dutiful to my mother, and made me not arrogant, unblest. And Salam (peace) be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!"
Such is Jesus, son of Mary. (It is) a statement of truth, about which they doubt (or dispute). It befits not (the Majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son (this refers to the slander of Christians against Allah, by saying that Jesus is the son of Allah). Glorified (and Exalted be He above all that they associate with Him). When He decrees a thing, He only says to it, "Be!" - and it is.
Jesus said: "And verily Allah is my Lord and your Lord. So worship Him (Alone). That is the Straight Path. (Allah's Religion of Islamic Monotheism which He did ordain for all of His Prophets)."
Then the sects differed (the Christians about Jesus), so woe unto the disbeliveers (those who gave false witness saying that Jesus is the son of Allah) from the meeting of a great Day (the Day of Resurrection, when they will be thrown in the blazing Fire).
How clearly will they (polytheists and disbeliveers in the Oneness of Allah) see and hear, the Day when they will appear before Us! But the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers) today are in plain error. And warn them (O Muhammad) of the Day of grief and regrets, when the case has been decided, while now they are in a state of carelessness and they believe not. (Ch 19:16-39 Quran)
It was said that Joseph the Carpenter was greatly surprised when he knew the story, so he asked Mary: "Can a tree come to grow without a seed?" She said: "Yes, the one which Allah created for the first time." He asked her again: "Is it possible to bear a child without a male partner?" She said: "Yes, Allah, created Adam without male or female!"
It was also said that, while pregnant, Mary went one day to her aunt, who reported that she felt as if she was pregnant. Mary in turn, said that she, too, was feeling as if she was pregnant. Then her aunt said: "I can see what is in my womb prostrating to what is in your womb."
The Jewish priests felt this child Jesus was dangerous, for they felt that the people would turn their worship to Allah the Almighty Alone, displacing the existing Jewish tenets. Consequently, they would lose their authority over the

Heart2heart:
[size=13pt]THIS IS WHAT WE WON'T TAKE. IF SEUN OR WHOEVER INSTALLED A CHECK-VALVE IN MUSLIM TOPICS LIKE A RESTRICTION ON WHO COMMENTS ON MUSLIM THREADS THEY SHOULD PLACE SUCH HERE. FAIRNESS ONLY GIVE WAY FOR PEACE AND MUTUAL RESPECT. NO MUSLIM IS PERMITTED TO COMMENT ON A CHRISTIAN TOPIC OR THREAD SINCE WE ARE DIVIDED ON RELIGIOUS LINES NOW HERE..........[/size].....

Where is it written in the bible that we are divided here now? Leave the Muslims jor, is it now bad for outsiders to tell you your myopia?

simplisity:
I believe solely that Christ is d only mediator we have. But dont forget that sometimes we ask our priest, pastors, brethren etc, to pray for us or to intercede for us. That is y in some ministries we have intercessors and their prayer is wat is keeping d ministry. So, if we can ask people on earth that is full of sin to intercede for us and their prayer is working, how much more the person that gave birth to Christ, whom we all knew that she is in Heaven. Remember d experience she had with Christ in Canaan on d wedding feast how she told Christ that d wine is finished, althou Christ told her that his time to work has not started, but she knew already that Christ will grant her request, bcs she understands Christ more than anybody bcs he is part of her. That is y her only response was to tell d wedding servants to do watever Christ tell them to do and we all knew how d story ended, Christ did as she requested. Her work is to intercede for us and nothing else, as Abraham interceded for d people of Sodom and Gomora, especialy for his brother lot. As moses interceded for the children of israel wen God decided to destroy them and raise a new generation frm moses. It is our duty to give her d respect that is due to her, as it is writen that d whole world shal call her blessed.

Okay, in that case, we should also pray to God through Moses and Abraham. After all, was Abraham not a friend of God?
Let me be clear, the bible makes us to understand that 'no man cometh to the father except through Christ'. Praying through any other deity or person be it Oyedepo, adeboye, or Mary is not right. And we all know the truth.
Someone has pointed out that Jesus had siblings, yet some people won't agree even after seeing it clearly written in the gospel.

Be wise.

people. Therefore, they kept the miracle of Jesus's speech in infancy as a secret and accused Mary of a great misdeed.
As Jesus (pbuh) grew, the signs of prophethood began to increase. He could tell his friends what kind of supper waited for them at home and what they had hidden and where. When he was twelve years old, he accompanied his mother to Jerusalem. There he wandered into the temple and joined a crowd listening to the lecture of the Rabbis (Jewish priests). The audience were all adults, but he was not afraid to sit with them. After listening intently, he asked questions and expressed his opinion. The learned rabbis were disturbed by the boy's boldness and puzzled by the questions he asked, for they were unable to answer him. They tried to silence him, but he ignored their attempts and continued to express his views. Jesus became so involved in this exchange that he forgot he as expected back home.
In the meantime, his mother went home, thinking that he might have gone back with relatives or friends. When she arrived, she discovered that he was not there, so she returned to the city to look for him. At last she found him in the temple, sitting among the learned, conversing with them. He appeared to be quite at east, as if he had been doing this all his life. Mary got angry with him for causing her worry. He tried to assure her that all the arguing and debating with the learned had made him forgot the time.
Jesus grew up to manhood. It was Sabbath, a day of complete rest: no fire could be lit or extinguished nor could females plait their hair. Moses (pbuh) had commanded that Saturday be dedicated to the worship of Allah. However, the wisdom behind the Sabbath and its spirit had gone, and only the letter remained in the Jews' hearts. Also, they thought that Sabbath was kept in heaven, and that the People of Israel had been chosen by Allah only to observe the Sabbath.
They made a hundred things unlawful on Saturday even self-defense or calling a doctor to save a patient who was in bad condition. This is how their life was branded by such hypocrisy. Although the Pharisees were guardians of the law, they were ready to sell it when their interests were involved so as to obtain personal gains. There was, for example, a rule which prohibited a journey of more than one thousand yards on the Sabbath day. What do we expect of the Pharisees in this case? The day before, they transferred their food and drink from their homes two thousand yards away and erected a temporary house so that from tthey could travel a further thousand yards on the Sabbath day.
Jesus was on his way to the temple. Although it was the Sabbath, he reached out his hand to pick two pieces of fruit to feed a hungry child. This was considered to be a violation of the Sabbath law. He made a fire for the old women to keep themselves warm from the freezing air. Another violation. He went to the temple and looked around. There were twenty thousand Jewish priests registered there who earned their living from the temple. The rooms of he temple were full of them.
Jesus observed that the visitors were much fewer than the priests. Yet the temple was full of sheep and doves which were sold to the people to be offered as sacrifices. Every step in the temple cost the visitor money. They worshipped nothing but money. In the temple, the Pharisees and Sadducees acted as if it were a market place, and these two groups always disagreed on everything. Jesus followed the scene with his eyes and observed that the poor people who could not afford the price of the sheep or dove were swept away like flies by the Pharisees and Saducees. Jesus was astonished. Why did the priests burn a lot of offerings inside the temple, while thousands of poor people were hungry outside it?
On this blessed night, the two noble prophets John (pbuh) and Zakariyah (pbuh) died, killed by the ruling authority. On the same night, the revelation descended upon Jesus (pbuh). Allah the Exalted commanded him to begin his call to the children of Israel. To Jesus, the life of ease was closed, and the page of worship and struggled was opened.
Like an opposing force, the message of Jesus came to denounce the practices of the Pharisees and to reinforce the Law of Moses. In the face of a materialistic age of luxury and worship of gold, Jesus called his people to a nobler life by word and deed. This exemplary life was the only way out of the wretchedness and diseases of his age. Jesus's call, from the beginning, was marked by its complete uprightness and piety. It appealed to the soul, the inner being, and not be a closed system of rules laid down by society.
Jesus continued inviting the people to Almighty Allah. His call was based on the principle that there is no mediation between the Creator and His creatures. However, Jesus was in conflict with the Jews' superficial interpretation of the Torah. He said that he did not come to abrogate the Torah, but to complete it by going to the spirit of its substance to arrive at its essence.
He made the Jews understand that the Ten Commandments have more value than they imagined. For instance, the fifth commandment does not only prohibit physical killing, but all forms of killing; physical, psychological, or spiritual. And the sixth commandment does not prohibit adultery only in the sense of unlawful physical contact between a man and a woman, but also prohibits all forms of unlawful relations or acts that might lead to adultery. The eye commits adultery when it looks at anything with passion.
Jesus was therefore in confrontation with the materialistic people. He told them to desist from hypocrisy, show and false praise. There was no need to hoard wealth in this life. They should not preoccupy themselves with the goods of this passing world; rather they must preoccupy themselves with the affairs of the coming world because it would be everlasting.
Jesus told them that caring for this world is a sin, not fit for pious worshippers. The disbeliveers care for it because they do not know a better way. As for the believers, they know that their sustenance is with Allah, so they trust in Him and scorn this world.
Jesus continued to invite people to worship the Only Lord, Who is without partner, just as he invited them to purify the heart and soul.
His teaching annoyed the priests, for every word of Jesus was a threat to them and their position, exposing their misdeeds.
The Roman occupiers had, at first, no intention of being involved in this religious discord of the Jews because it was an internal affair, and they saw that this dispute would distract the Jews from the question of the occupation.
However, the priests started to plot against Jesus. They wanted to embarrass him and to prove that he had come to destroy the Mosaic Law. The Mosaic Law provides that an adulteress be stoned to death. They brought him a Jewish adulteress and asked Jesus: "Does not the law stipulate the stoning of the adulteress?" Jesus answered: "Yes." They said: "This woman is an adulteress." Jesus looked at the woman and then at the priests. He knew that they were more sinful than she. They agreed that she should be killed according to Mosaic Law, and they understood that if he was going to apply Mosaic Law, he would be destroying his own rules of forgiveness and mercy.
Jesus understood their plan. He smiled and assented: "Whoever among you is sinless can stone her." His voice rose in the middle of the Temple, making a new law on adultery, for the sinless to judge sin. There was none eligible; no mortal can judge sin, only Allah the Most Merciful.
As Jesus left the temple, the woman followed him. She took out a bottle of perfume from her garments, knelt before his feet and washed them with perfume and tears, and then dried his feet with her hair. Jesus turned to the woman and told her to stand up, adding: "O Lord, forgive her sins." He let the priests understand that those who call people to Almighty Allah are not executioners. His call was based on mercy for the people, the aim of all divine calls.
Jesus continued to pray to Allah for mercy on his people and to teach his people to have mercy on one another and to believe in Allah.
Jesus continued his mission, aided by divine miracles. Some Qur'anic commentators said that Jesus brought four people back from the dead: a friend of his named Al-Azam, an old woman's son, and a woman's only daughter. These three had died during his lifetime. When the Jews saw this they said: "You only resurrect those who have died recently; perhaps they only fainted." They asked him to bring back to life Sam the Ibn Noah.
When he asked them to show him his grave, the people accompanied him there. Jesus invoked Allah the Exalted to bring him back to life and behold, Sam the Ibn Noah came out from the grave gray-haired. Jesus asked: "how did you get gray hair, when there was no aging in your time?" He answered: "O Spirit of Allah, I thought that the Day of Resurrection had come; from the fear of that day my hair turned gray."

If something that is as glaring as the introduction of the ''Mary Concept'' into Catholicism is still being argued till date, then there is no need spending my time debating this issue which is clear. When history itself has effectively traced the introduction of images in worship, the immaculate conception concept etc. etc.

Yet we are still here arguing about this. The Human mind is a wonderful and shocking thing.

The early Christians never worshipped, honoured, or asked Mary to intercede for them, or pray for them. Jesus in defining how Christian should pray, fast, treat their neighbours, give alms, etc. etc. never instructed anyone to ask Mary to intercede or pray or do anything on our behalf.

The early Christians who were persecuted for their beliefs never called on to Mary to intercede for them. When the apostles preached and epistles and letters were written, no where did they mention about Mary interceding for anybody or the need to honour her or ask her to pray for us or to intercede or to meditate. Who gave Mary these roles, and where was it stated that she plays these roles? If this was so important would Christ or any of the disciples and apostles not have stated this? Would the prophets of old not have stated this or hinted about this? I respect my Mum and I resect Mary and Patience Jonathan and every other Woman out there, they have all played roles (good, bad, etc.) to the benefit of man and the human race. They were and are human beings. Mary begat Christ, good deed. She played her role.

The introduction of the ''Virgin Mary'' concept amongst others have been clearly traced. That is another matter to be discussed perhaps in another thread/topic.

I wonder why this should generate arguments. From a Christian and biblical perspective, the Mary concept was never a part of the Christian belief as taught by Christ and his apostles. It was introduced way latter in the evolution and metamorphosis (if these are even the right words) of Christendom. It was introduced by MEN! From the merging of the Roman religion with Christianity!!!!!

Nobody should come here and try to say ''we honour her'' or ''we don't worship her she only intercedes for us''. As Christians if May was that important do you think Jesus would have left her out of his teachings? For many years he learnt from the scribes and the priests and asked question. For almost four years he taught and preached and performed miracles. He never mentioned Mary as interceding or doing anything important for us in heaven. As a matter of fact when stating those that will seat with him in the right hand side of his father, he never mentioned MARY!!!

When he gave the model prayer as contained in Mathew he never mentioned Mary. Neither did he tell us to shake our heads vigorously and repeat ''Die by Fire'' a thousand times.

I am still shocked that something as glaring as this, is still being debated with silly examples like Mary asking Jesus to help with a wine at a wedding feast. If I was there and I knew Jesus and what he could do, I would have done the same. I would have asked him. Today I do know him and I do ask God his father through him to help me, help my family and help others.

Before u know it they have started insulting others. As u sabi English reach u no know say Intercede n mediate are synonyms @nnatom. And I hope u know wat synonyms are...

I know you have a problem understanding English language

dictionary meaning of mediator and intercede

To intercede is to go or come between two
parties, to plead before one of them on behalf
of the other. "Mediation"
means a standing in the midst between two
(contending) parties, for the purpose of
bringing them together.

Am sure you are one of the kind of persons that rush to their kneels when they see ordinary mother of a state governor. U give unmerited and unnecessary honour and respect to ur state first lady but u find it too hard to honour d mother that brought Jesus into d world. I don't blame you; a child grows up to believe what he/she is told or meet. But u are Expected to use your head.

InglishTeechar:


If mary intercede for you, then what is Jesus's role in your life.

Since you understand english very well please kindly tell us the meaning of idolatery, God rejects it in his Ten commandment yet catholics commit this sin every time they bow to the image of mary and kissing the rosery. Or maybe they are ignorant of what God says...they read the bible yet they dont understand what is written in it. May God deliver you all from your ignorance. Amen.

My guy GOD will bless u ten million times. no body will make u believe wrong and idolatrious teaching .AMEN.

dabriggs:
If something that is as glaring as the introduction of the ''Mary Concept'' into Catholicism is still being argued till date, then there is no need spending my time debating this issue which is clear. When history itself has effectively traced the introduction of images in worship, the immaculate conception concept etc. etc.

Yet we are still here arguing about this. The Human mind is a wonderful and shocking thing.

The early Christians never worshipped, honoured, or asked Mary to intercede for them, or pray for them. Jesus in defining how Christian should pray, fast, treat their neighbours, give alms, etc. etc. never instructed anyone to ask Mary to intercede or pray or do anything on our behalf.

The early Christians who were persecuted for their beliefs never called on to Mary to intercede for them. When the apostles preached and epistles and letters were written, no where did they mention about Mary.

The introduction of the ''Virgin Mary'' concept amongst others have been clearly traced.

I wonder why this should generate arguments. From a Christian and biblical perspective, the Mary concept was never a part of the Christian belief as taught by Christ and his apostles. It was introduced way latter the evolution and metamorphosis (if these are even the right words) of Christendom.

Nobody should come here and try to say ''we honour her'' or ''we don't worship her she interceded for us''. As Christians if May was that important do you think Jesus would have left her out of his teachings? For many years he learnt from the scribes and the priests and for almost four years he taught and preached and performed miracles. He never mentioned Mary as interceding or doing anything important for us in heaven. As a matter of fact when stating those that will seat with him in the right hand side of his father, he never mentioned MARY!!!

When he gave the model prayer as contained in Mathew he never mentioned Mary. Neither did he tell us to shake our heads vigorously and repeat ''Die by Fire'' a thousand times.

I am still shocked that something as glaring as this, is still being debated with silly examples like Mary asking Jesus to help with a wine at a wedding feast. If I was there and I knew Jesus and what he could do, I would have done the same. Today I do know him and I do ask God his father through him to help me, help my family and help others.

Honestly, it is the very same way the pharisees seeked to disprove christ teaching that you follow. Na una sabi the scripture pass. My father no do something and me come they do am then it is wrong. That logic is just so stupid. If you can tell me anywhere that christ or the early apostles says praying to or honoring Mary is wrong then I will keep shut. Till then I remain a catholic and Mary remains my mother.

Why is there so much arguement about the teachings of catholic church. Our God works in diverse ways Mary is a woman highly favoured by God. Just as the pentecostals calls their pastor's wifes mummy that is who Mary. There is no human jugdement or critisisim that can change the fact that " hence forth, all nations shall call her blessed" to delibrate on the issue is a waste of time. If Jesus remebered His mother at the point of death it shows how much Jesus loved His mother. Jesus is our Savoiur Marry is the vessel used to bring goodnews to the world M she is blessed belive it or not

Joavid:


Same way God could have chosen any body to be samson, Elijah, Paul, Samson, Moses...etc.

Pastor?? I read my bible bro.

My bible is all the word/prove I need and am sure the pope, your priest and catholic doctrine is all the prove/word you have.

Now who is brainwashed

And you are equally sure of the 'source' of this 'your' bible right? You have not related the bible to the life you are living, hence my insistence on quote from the bible. It is pathetic that children of these days (pentecostals) wants to show their parents (Catholic) where they resided. Overzealousness is actually the problem I'm seeing here. The other main issue is, fundamentals. Since most non Catholics lack the actual fundamental knowledge of the scripture but rely on 'sweet poetics' and rhymes and mimes of flashy young pastors, it is actually difficult (almost impossible) to teach the lost in the word. No offence meant because I know it is the truth. (next they'll ask me to show the book, chapter and verse of the bible).

I praise God for being a Christian. Yes we are the people of the books

dis is y i always say evrione to his own
to bring up arguments about religion does nt end well..

even d last chapter in d book of john said dere r many tins dat r not recorded in d bible...
d new testament said old things have passed away..jesus came nd washed our sins away..which means dose laws written in leviticus and exodus(lyk d one of killing a woman whu commited adultery nd not sleeping on d same bed with a girl during her menstration cycle)
we've neglected dose laws but den we read d psalms for protection which is in d old testament..d old testament gave us 10 commandment nd d new testament gave us two...
even in leviticus,,,to cut ur beards is a taboo nd drawing of tattoo as well.jesus never cut his beards...but den pple will say it is d old testament nah..all dose tins have passed away cos jesus is d savior...i gues we have to neglect d commandments to because it d OT.
(o..k nw am deviating)


wat im saying in essence is dis,,,d bible was written by human lyk
us....jesus did nt write d bible cos if he did,,trust me,,u wunt b able to carry d bible cos it will b d bigest book ever...
pple saying tins lyk show me were it is written in d bible r just sooo dumb...
the bible was written by diff men,,each saying d knowledge dey have.
d protestant say show me were mary is dis nd dat
buh den,,it was jesus dat told the rich man to go sell all his property bfor he will b able to enter into d kingdom of God..but den ur pastors r busy acquiring jets nd sending deir children to d best uni in d world...ur here rebuking another religion wen urs is highly at fault
the protestants at first rebuked d catholics for using bread as the body of jesus........today,,,,dey r doing dat same thing in their church

dis is y i dnt blame the atheists at tyms
diff religion battling demselves

no one knows what is required of us
to gossip is a sin buh i dnt c it in d bible

Evrione to his or her beliefs.
wen we meet on judgement day we will c if all d protestants will go to hell or all catholics will go to hell or anglicans too

It is only unintelligent people that argue about religion!

Ndukwe007:
My guy GOD will bless u ten million times. no body will make u believe wrong and idolatrious teaching .AMEN.

Mary is called the mediatrix that is female mediator and she is also an intercessor. But I don't understand why you all think both Mary and Jesus can't be both albeit Mary a lesser one in the sense that Mary leads to christ and christ to God. That's all.

With all the grammar this morning, my question is 'where in the Bible are we informed that Mary is in heaven?' Also apart from Mary appearing to Catholics were in the Bible are we told Mary intercedes and can hear our prayers?

Ichiato:

Honestly, it is the very same way the pharisees seeked to disprove christ teaching that you follow. Na una sabi the scripture pass. My father no do something and me come they do am then it is wrong. That logic is just so stupid. If you can tell me anywhere that christ or the early apostles says praying to or honoring Mary is wrong then I will keep shut. Till then I remain a catholic and Mary remains my mother.

The teachings of Christ were not on how to cook food or how to make tea! Those you can define various ways to do. He taught you true worship on how to pray, getting closer to God through true worship amongst others. These were not just generic but with specifics! The apostles built on that. How Mary came into Catholicism is not hidden. If you don't know where you are coming from, you may never know why you are where you are and where you are going to.

Mary is your mother. Good! That is your choice to make. However the fact that you have made a choice doesn't mean facts should be upturned and futile attempts be made to logically justify what is well known and glaring. We make right and wrong choices, knowingly and unknowingly however does that change what the facts and truths are?