saxywale:

You are correct. There is even a major road in Ife that leads to modakeke called abewela. My great grandmother's house is on that road, she was modakeke. It got burnt during the last war.

Arghhh, we have an hybrid here LOL.

Sorry about your G.granny's house bruh.

These two sides have fused into each other so much that the second in rankings to Obalesun in my compound is from Modakeke, yet they still tote guns and blast without reservations at the slightest provocation.

Mynd44:

I did not say there are only 5 but the last I heard was there are 5..there might be more though

I know the Alaafin, Olubadan, Ooni are among.

Perhaps the Deji of Akure and Soun of Ogbomosho (not sure of the Soun though)

Mynd44:


http://www.lagosstate.gov.ng/pagelinks.php?p=8

Oh the title changed to Oba when the Capital of Nigeria was moved to Abuja

Mynd, nitori Olorun. That is not so!

If the site above is where you're getting your information about the Lagos throne, commence using other sources, please. I just read the page you linked. That site is a disgrace; whoever wrote or approved that narrative should be shot! Here's a gem.

"Moreover, modern day Lagosians have so intermingled that no single tribe or people can claim it even though the predominant language is Yoruba." http://www.lagosstate.gov.ng/pagelinks.php?p=8

Poor grammar + faulty historical "data" + wild speculations = baseless conclusions.

I guess those fighting over the "No Man's Land" issue can now leave NL Igbos alone and direct your ire to the appropriate source since it was reported and circulated by your very own official government website.

nduchucks:


As far as this conversation goes, the Queen of England and how she is finacially supported by the Brits is irrelevant. I do know that governors or the prime minister does not simply take money from state budget and give it to trhe Queen, as the Governors and Presidents of Nigeria do.

Besides, the Queen is already a mulltibillionaire who does not need any hand outs.

Oh, the England useless royals are exempted from your anti-monarchy campaign since they've already amassed their wealth through centuries of slavery, countless invasions and pillaging.

Chuckie, I like you immensely. But please, cease and desist your verbal threat to the Oba of Lagos throne or I shall have no other recourse but to beat you to death with my bare hands! That throne is being held in trust for my oldest child. Seriously.

ademusiwa7:


What nonsense are you talking about, they are not kings... They are Obas(duke of towns) not kingdom.. the Independent country of the kingdom of Western nigeria ran administration on dukes (Obas).

Kaaabiyeeeesi o! Aare Musiwa. I've been looking for you all these time. Damn that Seun! Let Musiwa reign!!!

macof:

Honestly I don't know much about Owu..their settlements are so many and I don't quite understand their migratory pattern but one thing I know is that Olowu resides in Abeokuta where Alake serves as foremost ruler
It's a big blow for the Olowu

Owu, after their town got sacked scattered all over. I co-researched Owu history with an acquaintance of mine in school and still have the copy at home.

Owu are in Lagos, Ogun, Abeokuta, Osun etc but the Olowu in posession of the Oduduwa given crown is in Owu Ipole in Osun state close to Ikire which makes him the paramount head of the Olowus of Owus.

The Olowu of Owu Ipole of yesterday gave us full details on Owu history and about two months after my acquaintance and I visted him for oral interview, he had an accident and passed on to meet his fathers - I still have records, kept in my archives .

The Olowu in Abeokuta does not have asunkungbade's crown.

Gringo

I just asked a question that how come the yorubas got that name, a dude said it was from hausas and oyo stuff...cant you bjust grow up a bit in ur miserable life..we learn

if you dont have any thing to trefute shut the ffuucckk uupp ..bastardo

codedslayer:
[s][/s]

See this hediot spewing trash everywhere. You are always on any Yoruba thread to post your trash and show your frustration, you have been bitter since your Yoruba landlord chased you and that skinny ugly thing out of his house. Be a man and face your life challenges instead of looking for any Yoruba thread to pass your frustration.

I was wondering how your parents felt when they did your naming ceremony, that is if they ever did that or if you were ever dedicated...i thing that you have stupidity in its finest form and your foolery is grandiose


Such a waste of sperm, i am not sorry for you but i pity your parents that assume that they have beggotten a child never knew they had an imp for a child what muslim will call iblis and some south west will call esu or whatever


you are just a regurgitated imp


dont quote me again


now run with your tail in between ur legs

logica:
Your FATHER is daft. See who is telling me to grow up. I have your antecedents on hand - from moping about how a Yoruba boss fired you (for being extremely daft like your FATHER that is). Or you've forgotten? You better fvck off before I use your entire lineage to wipe the floor.

Why must you guys curse before making a submission, hads it got to do with rampant dysfunctional parentage in your cultural milliue or has it got to do with the high level of divorce that affects a child psychological such as your case...instead of m,aking a submission in a matured manner must u lace it with curses


NOW I AM NOT INTRESTED IN THAT TRASH, TAKE IT BACK..I WONT OPEN IT
#

logica:
You obviously have a serious mental illness that makes you seek out everything to do with Yoruba and try to ridicule. I will advise you move out of Yoruba land before you are found out and dealt with outside of cyberspace.

Now, to the matter. The Oyo people had referred to their language as Yoruba; which the Hausa people tend to pronounce as Yarba. But then some mischievous ones (Hausa) intentionally mispronounce this as "YAR BAWA" which means "children of slaves" (it is the same "YAR" you see in "Yar Adua" ) rather than "YORUBAWA" meaning "Yoruba people". The Hausas did not give us our name; they simply popularized our name because they had a written culture (Ajami) before us.

http://archive.org/stream/historyofyorubas00john/historyofyorubas00john_djvu.txt

A new war brewed when Ijebu (whose reputation as businessmen is known even till today) and Ife also began to sell refugees from old Oyo as slaves. These are the Modakeke, who retraced their way back to Ife where the founder of Old Oyo had come from originally. Owu and these refugees therefore attacked Ife in reprisal, the sacred city. This turned Ijebu and Ife against Owu.

The Ijebus were the first to employ the use of guns in any battle and thus completely destroyed Owu town. Owu people fled to Egba for refuge. Ijebu went further to even attack the Egba for harboring the Owu people. Note that Egba used to be where present-day Ibadan was located. But they were scattered villages and settlements. The Owu warriors and other warriors from other destroyed or sacked provinces migrating southwards found a settlement in Eleiyele, thus beginning what today is known as Ibadan. The new city attracted other warriors who wanted to restore the old glory and because of its position in the rainforest area, Ibadan began to control palm oil belt which was just beginning to replace the trade in human beings. It subsequently grew into the largest city in West Africa. With the arrival of warriors from all over Yoruba country turning Ibadan into a military settlement. The issue of who was what ensued and the Oyo drove out the bullying Ife along with the Egba people. Egba then settled in what is now Abeokuta with the Owu people, while Ife found no love lost with the Oyo people, especially those in Ife, the Modakeke. Note that Ibadan too also became a largely Oyo city.

But still determined to totally expand the Sokoto caliphate downwards by totally conquering the dying embers of the Yoruba influence, the Hausa/Fulani/Yoruba Muslim cavalry in Ilorin relaunched another phase of war as they saw New Oyo and Ibadan rising.

Ibadan knew it could no longer control cavalry which used to be a force to reckon with in the Oyo army (Yoruba kings and chiefs still ride horses in celebration today as remnant of the horse tradition prior to these wars) but with the Sokoto caliphate in the north, Ibadan could no longer get horse supplies.Although, Ijebu first used the guns, but Ibadan, through insistent drills, perfected the use of guns in such remarkable ways.

There are many similarities between the processes by which the Fulani established their power in Nupe and those which led to the creation of the Ilorin Emirate. The only important difference is that the Nupes, being much less numerous than the Yorubas, were completely absorbed into the Empire, whereas in llorin the Fulani succeeded in detaching and assimilating only one of the many States of Yorubaland.
The Yorubas, like the Nupes and indeed the Hausas, look back to a mythical founder or culture-hero. This is Oduduwa, who is supposed to have been the son of the ruler of Mecca, in pre-Islamic days, and to have migrated to the west because of a quarrel with his father. After many wanderings he is said to have reached Yorubaland and settled down at Ife. Later, his descendants spread out and founded the other Yoruba city-states. In the meantime, according to this legend, two of his brothers, who had left Arabia at the same time, had become the rulers of the Kanuri and Gobirawa 24.
There is a marked resemblance between this tradition and the Daura legend, but the histories of Bornu and Gobir provide even closer parallels. They, too, preserve the tradition of an origin in Arabia, as has already been mentioned, and they also recognize a cousinly relationship between the three peoples. As in Bornu and Gobir the strangers from the east were apparently sufficiently numerous to have been accepted as an aristocracy by the people of Yorubaland among whom they settled. Moreover, the arts and skills that they brought with them probably made a significant contribution to the advanced culture and complex structure of society that the Yorubas were later to develop. On the other hand, the immigrants do not seem to have been numerous enough to have left any significant ethnic traces behind them because physically the Arabs and Yorubas are very different types. Certainly linguistically they made no mark at all, for the evidence shows Yoruba to be a purely African language 25. Whatever the precise course of these early events may have been, the Yorubas undoubtedly multiplied and developed so that in historical times they emerged as a power to be reckoned with.
Our knowledge of Yorubaland before the eighteenth century derives more from legend than history. It is generally agreed, however, that Oyo, which was to become the more powerful of the Yoruba States, had come into existence by the year 1400 and that its first capital, Old Oyo, was founded at about that time. The Chief held the title of Alafin and the dynasty claimed that the founder of their line was the grandson of the mythical Oduduwa.
Oyo gradually grew in strength and authority until it had extended its sway over the whole of Yorubaland and had become the suzerain of the petty States which surrounded it. By 1700, when it had just conquered the neighbouring kingdom of Dahomey, its power was at its zenith and, with the formerly powerful kingdom of Benin already in decline, it now dominated the whole region south and west of the Lower Niger.
In the eighteenth century, however, Oyo began to show signs of waning. Its military power was based on its cavalry and its prosperity on the overland trade with the Hausa States. With the growth of maritime commerce, the overland trade declined in importance while with the importation of firearms the hitherto dominant role of cavalry began to diminish. The result of these changes was that the States on the seaboard grew in stature while in Old Oyo, situated in the savannah country of the north-east and far removed from the Atlantic, the Alafins found it increasingly difficult to control them. It was therefore a sign of the times when, towards the end of the century, Dahomey refused to pay its tribute and Egba, another vassal State, threw off its allegiance altogether.
The Yorubas at this time still adhered to a complex religion of their own and, although Moslem teachers and missionaries had already appeared among them, Islam had as yet taken no real root. Furthermore, because the prevalence of the tsetse fly had kept the pastoralists at a distance, the Fulani had not penetrated into the country in any significant numbers. If the way had not been opened to them, therefore, it is inconceivable that the Fulani could ever have established themselves as the dominant power in any part of Yorubaland. As it was, however, the dissensions of the Yorubas among themselves was to enable them to do just this.
To the south-east of Old Oyo lay the city and district of florin, an important bastion which was governed by a military commander called Afonja. It will be remembered that when Mallam Dendo, the leader of the jihad in Nupe, had been driven out of Raba it was in Ilorin that he had taken refuge, probably because Afonja by this time had already come under the influence of another Fulani teacher, Mallam Alimi. Be that as it may, the insight that Afonja then gained into the fighting qualities of the Fulani seems to have given him the idea of using them himself to further the designs which he was already harbouring.
From his close association with Mallam Alimi we can assume that by this time Afonja had already become a convert to Islam 26. This in itself would be enough to weaken his loyalty to the Alafin of Oyo who still worshipped other gods. In addition he was an ambitious man who chafed at his vassal status and was eager to become a Chief in his own right. We know at any rate that, soon after Afonja had helped the Nupe Fulani to repel their pursuers, he made a compact with Mallam Alimi for the recruitment from the north of Fulani and Hausa volunteers 27. He no doubt persuaded Mallam Alimi to believe that his aims were to declare a jihad and establish a Moslem Emirate in Ilorin which would owe allegiance to Gwandu and Sokoto, but it seems likely that he was in fact playing a deeper game.
Whether Mallam Alimi had any doubts about Afonja's real motives we do not know, but there was no question about the success of his recruiting, for he attracted to Ilorin large numbers of Fulani and Hausa volunteers. By 1817, the year of Shehu's death, Afonja felt himself to be ready. He therefore threw off his allegiance to the Alafin and declared Ilorin to be independent of Oyo. The Alafin immediately reacted by sending a punitive expedition against him, but, with the help of his Moslem allies, Afonja defeated it and drove it back 28.
The rebellion of Afonja in Ilorin was the signal for other vassals to throw off their allegiance and the rickety Empire of Oyo began to break up. By 1821 the Alafin had lost most of his temporal authority outside metropolitan Oyo and was no longer strong enough to bring Ilorin or the other rebels to heel. In Yoruba history this was a development of the greatest significance, for the removal of Oyo's authority was to lead to seventy years of civil war.
In Ilorin Afonja kept on good terms with his Fulani and Hausa allies for just as long as Oyo remained a suzerain to be feared. When Oyo's power collapsed, however, and the threat of conquest was removed, he soon fell out with them. There are two conflicting versions of how this came about. According to the first, the Fulani and Hausas recruited by Mallam Alimi, who were known as the jama'a as the early reformers had been, got out of hand after their victory and started plundering friendly towns and villages 29. But according to the second, the fault lay on the other side and it was the Yorubas who, as soon as the threat from Oyo had been removed, tried to deny their allies the fruits of victory and drive them out of the kingdom which they had helped to create 30.
There is probably truth in both these accounts. Among the Fulani and Hausa volunteers there must have been many adventurers and soldiers of fortune and it would not be surprising if they were guilty of some looting and pillage. On the other hand, Afonja's ruling motive seems to have been personal ambition rather than devotion to Islam and it would have been in character if, when the Fulani and Hausas had served their purpose, he had tried to get rid of them.
Mallam Alimi himself was a soldier and teacher whose aims were religious rather than political. While he lived he did his best to keep his followers under control and his restraining influence on them, combined with the modesty of his personal aims, seems to have prevented an open breach. When he died in 1831, however, he was succeeded as leader of the Moslem group by his son, Abdu Salami dan Alimi, who was a man of much greater worldly ambition 31.
The succession of Abdu Salami at once precipitated the crisis which had long been developing in Ilorin. Afonja no doubt knew what sort of a man he would now have to deal with and made up his mind to attack the Fulani and Hausa immigrants and drive them out of the kingdom altogether. To that end he secretly enlisted the support of neighbouring Yoruba towns. They failed to provide the help on which he was counting, however, and the result was that, when he struck, Abdu Salami was able to turn the tables on him. Afonja was killed in the fighting which followed and the Yoruba cause collapsed 32.
By this victory Abdu Salami made himself master of Ilorin. Like his father before him, he had always looked to Gwandu for leadership and protection. In return he was now presented with a flag and invested with the rank and regalia of an Emir. The Emirate of florin thus came into being in 1831 as part of the Dual Empire.

9jacrip:


Owu, after their town got sacked scattered all over. I co-researched Owu history with an acquaintance of mine in school and still have the copy at home.

Owu are in Lagos, Ogun, Abeokuta, Osun etc but the Olowu in posession of the Oduduwa given crown is in Owu Ipole in Osun state close to Ikire which makes him the paramount head of the Olowus of Owus.

The Olowu of Owu Ipole of yesterday gave us full details on Owu history and about two months after my acquaintance and I visted him for oral interview, he had an accident and passed on to meet his fathers - I still have records, kept in my archives .

The Olowu in Abeokuta does not have asunkungbade's crown.

superior1:


Why don't you prove the nonsense you wrote?, oh let me see, because the name Oluyoruba doesn't exist, right?, you need your head examined.

By this victory Abdu Salami made himself master of Ilorin. Like his father before him, he had always looked to Gwandu for leadership and protection. In return he was now presented with a flag and invested with the rank and regalia of an Emir. The Emirate of florin thus came into being in 1831 as part of the Dual Empire.

Abdu Salami did not rest content with the modest domain which he had wrested from Afonja but at once set about enlarging it by making war on his neighbours. He was generally successful and, though unable to hold all his gains, won many notable victories against the crumbling power of Oyo and its warring satellites 33.

The reverses which he suffered at Abdu Salami's hands at length stirred the Alafin to action and he determined to make a supreme effort to crush what he still regarded as the rebellion in Ilorin. To this end he not only summoned to arms his subjects and such vassals as were still loyal but also enlisted the aid of the neighbouring people of Borgu, who had shown in the past that they were capable of withstanding the Fulani. In Ilorin, Abdu Salami got wind of these moves and appealed to Gwandu for help. Halilu, who in 1835 had succeeded his brother as Emir, responded by obtaining reinforcements from Sokoto and dispatching a strong combined force to Abdu Salami's assistance 34.
In the struggle which followed, the Yorubas and their Borgu allies won some early successes. They were gradually forced back, however, and the decisive battle took place near the capital, Old Oyo, in 1837. Its result was an overwhelming victory for the Fulani. The city was captured, the Alafin killed, and the allied armies routed. The Borgawa fared no better than the Yorubas and lost their commander as well as the Chiefs of Kaiama and Wawa 35.

With this defeat the ancient kingdom of Oyo, which had already lost its Empire, more or less disintegrated. The old capital was never rebuilt nor did the Alafins ever recover their paramountcy. Thereafter, Oyo was hardly more than one of the city-states into which Yorubaland now broke up.

Had the Fulani of the day been as bold and aggressive as those of a previous generation they would probably have gone on to subdue these city-states piecemeal and add them to the Empire. By this time, however, their ambitions were largely satisfied and the tide of their expansion was almost spent. The year 1837, moreover, was the one in which Sultan Bello died. They were therefore content to consolidate their power in Ilorin and did not attempt to exploit their victory by making further conquests.


One of the results of the defeat of Oyo and the flight of the Yorubas from the old capital was the founding of Ibadan. The city grew very rapidly in size and importance and for much of the rest of the century it was to be at war with Ilorin, barring the way to any further advance by the Fulani and counter-attacking them whenever the opportunity offered.


Considering what a small minority the Fulani were, the surprising fact was not so much that they let pass the opportunity of annexing the rest of Yorubaland to the Empire but that they managed to establish themselves in even a corner of it. No less surprising was the fact that they were afterwards able to maintain their position among a predominantly Yoruba population when they were all the time being subjected to heavy pressure from the great mass of the Yoruba people beyond their borders. This, however, is what they succeeded in doing. In the process they, too, acquired certain characteristics which distinguished them from their kinsmen in other parts of the Empire. But, as with the Nupe Fulani, their local colouring did not diminish either their devotion to Islam or their loyalty to Gwandu and through Gwandu to Sokoto.

KIRIJI:
Oba Oyekan I 1885-1900

www.nairaland.com/attachments/2305635_obaoyekan1_jpeg531e32d3e93f05cab990482732a7cd63

Is NegroNtns same as Kiriji?

NegroNtns:
more. . .

www.nairaland.com/attachments/482965_Esugbayiandchiefs_jpgccae5d7417e09fa73bccbefdd4aa09a5

https://www.nairaland.com/675773/great-leaders-nigerias-history-before/8#8718988

SirShymexx:


I think that was cos the Ijebus were supplying Ibadan with more than enough weapons. The Egbas on the other hand were getting weapons from the Baptist Church and Christian missionaries.

Katsumoto needs to come here to enlighten us.

And @ Hercules

The Egbas defeated the Ijebu and a portion of the Ibadan Army at Owiwi. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Oniyefun war. The Ibadans would seek revenge for that defeat and waged the Jabara war. Even though Kurunmi was allied to the Ibadans, they were still defeated by the Egbas. The Egbas would later gain a military advantage over the Ijebu and had defeated the Ijebus and Ibadans during the Iperu war until Lakanle, the Ibadan war chief responded to a call for aid by the Ijebus. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Ota war.

The Ijebu would not campaign against the Egba again and both would be on the same side against Ibadan during the Kiriji war.
It was the Egbas who stood up to Ibadan. No other side gained an advantage over the Ibadans.

Katsumoto:


And @ Hercules

The Egbas defeated the Ijebu and a portion of the Ibadan Army at Owiwi. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Oniyefun war. The Ibadans would seek revenge for that defeat and waged the Jabara war. Even though Kurunmi was allied to the Ibadans, they were still defeated by the Egbas. The Egbas would later gain a military advantage over the Ijebu and had defeated the Ijebus and Ibadans during the Iperu war until Lakanle, the Ibadan war chief responded to a call for aid by the Ijebus. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Ota war.

The Ijebu would not campaign against the Egba again and both would be on the same side against Ibadan during the Kiriji war.
It was the Egbas who stood up to Ibadan. No other side gained an advantage over the Ibadans.

The big Kats is here.

Anyway, was the Owiwi war between Ijebu Kingdom and the Egbas, or just Remos and a few Ijebu towns Vs. Egbas?

[s]

tonychristopher:
Gringo

I just asked a question that how come the yorubas got that name, a dude said it was from hausas and oyo stuff...cant you bjust grow up a bit in ur miserable life..we learn

if you dont have any thing to trefute shut the ffuucckk uupp ..bastardo

[/s]

Trash coming from a drunkard like you. I am not your landlord that chased you and that skinny hag from his house, you better go find something better to do with your miserable and cursed life instead of posting trash about the Yorubas everywhere. Animal

Katsumoto:


And @ Hercules

The Egbas defeated the Ijebu and a portion of the Ibadan Army at Owiwi. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Oniyefun war. The Ibadans would seek revenge for that defeat and waged the Jabara war. Even though Kurunmi was allied to the Ibadans, they were still defeated by the Egbas. The Egbas would later gain a military advantage over the Ijebu and had defeated the Ijebus and Ibadans during the Iperu war until Lakanle, the Ibadan war chief responded to a call for aid by the Ijebus. The Egbas would later defeat the Ibadans during the Ota war.

The Ijebu would not campaign against the Egba again and both would be on the same side against Ibadan during the Kiriji war.
It was the Egbas who stood up to Ibadan. No other side gained an advantage over the Ibadans.

I might have read it wrong then, are you quoting from Johnson's book?

SirShymexx:


The big Kats is here.

Anyway, was the Owiwi war between Ijebu Kingdom and the Egbas, or just Remos and a few Ijebu towns Vs. Egbas?

The guy just put a big hole in my praise of the Ijebus, oya, Ijebus were weaklings, Egbas were the masters, but, why were the Ijebus supporting the Egbas against Ibadan when the Ibadans were actually defending an Ijebu town?

hercules07:


The guy just put a big hole in my praise of the Ijebus, oya, Ijebus were weaklings, Egbas were the masters, but, why were the Ijebus supporting the Egbas against Ibadan when the Ibadans were actually defending an Ijebu town?

Lol.

Ijebus back then went wherever the money was. I don't really know much about the Kiriji wars - but I do know the Ijebus weren't part of the fighting, apart from selling arms.

Ibadan had a few Ijebu warriors in their ranks - so there's no point hating on us. We fought for and with everyone.

hercules07:


The guy just put a big hole in my praise of the Ijebus, oya, Ijebus were weaklings, Egbas were the masters, but, why were the Ijebus supporting the Egbas against Ibadan when the Ibadans were actually defending an Ijebu town?

Well, who said historians can't be biased? First establish that Sensei Kasunmu is not a revisionist intent on glorifying one group over the other(s). I'm not accusing, just positing a theory. (Or hypothesis. Either way, I just dey play devi's advocate. Katz, na joke )

BTW, I enjoyed your posts on the Kiriji thread and contributions on (Yoruba) history any time.

SirShymexx:


Lol. Illusion is for sissies who thrive on building castles in the air. I'm an emperor and I rule with an iron fist and speak with authority - so my word will always be my bond loool.

You are easy work - too bad you are too far away right now.

Easy work

DollyParton1:


Easy work

Lol. Not saying you are "cheap" before you get lost in semantics and start thinking something else.

I know you are somewhat hard to crack like the Egba warriors - but the emperor of all chics has the Da Vinci code like the Ijebu warriors, to unlock/conquer that badonkadonk if need be.

My sexy Egba doll.

hercules07:


I might have read it wrong then, are you quoting from Johnson's book?

Both Johnson and Akinjogbin

hercules07:

The guy just put a big hole in my praise of the Ijebus, oya, Ijebus were weaklings, Egbas were the masters, but, why were the Ijebus supporting the Egbas against Ibadan when the Ibadans were actually defending an Ijebu town?

These are different conflicts. In the first Iperu war, The Ibadans came to the rescue of the Ijebus against the Egbas. In the second Iperu war, some Ijebus aligned with the Egbas and Ijayes against Remo because it supported the Ibadans during the Ijaye war.

SirShymexx:

The big Kats is here.
Anyway, was the Owiwi war between Ijebu Kingdom and the Egbas, or just Remos and a few Ijebu towns Vs. Egbas?

It was against the Ijebus; not just Remo. See above for more details.

seunfly:

Oboy!!!!! That name go fear you ooooo, you will know he is real traditional man. Esugbayi = Adoration to Satan or Satan has respect.

Christians were the ones who erroneously referred to Esu as Satan. Esu is an Orisha who connects Orun to Aiye. Think Hermes in Greek mythology.

9jacrip:



Yes, you are right that not every town or kingdoms descended from Oduduwa - pre oduduwa period, some towns were already in existence or came into existence at the dame time such as Igbomina but saying there is no such thing as Yoruba land is debatable.

My argument is that, linguistically towns in western Nigerian are all wired together, kingship structure as well as war and diplomatic relations over the years - which spread as far as Benin and Togo. Those factors and some others have forged us into a single unit.

And if you are arguing Yoruba as an encompassing nomenclature then every town asides Oyo could detach itself from being called Yoruba but then what do we call ourselves after eons of shared history?

I think the spread of the use of Oduduwa name was due to conquests of his sons and acclaimed sons, Oyo conquests and kings seeking to validate their thrones but then, we have all, over many centuries evolved to become Yoruba.

Correct

Yoruba predates Oduduwa. The various kingdoms under different Saxon kings in the English isles didn't identify as English originally. Through the unification of these kingdoms under the heirs of Alfred, the inhabitants of the isles would identify as English.

SirShymexx:


Erm, you have to respect the greatness of Oyo. And Ife gave all Yorubas something deeper than rap.

But the rest were conquered, so Awujale reigns supreme over all of them.

Hold on

Awujale was an Ilari sent from Oyo to settle a dispute. Ijebu was definitely a vassal of Oyo.

Just to add a voice to the debate about First Class Kings.

There is a difference between a King being one of the Seven Obalades and a King elevated by political office holders. For the former, you were one of Alaafin of Oyo, Olowu of Owu, Orangun of Ila-orangun, the Owaoboku of Ijeshaland, the Alaketu of Ketu, the Onipopo of Popo, and the Onisabe of Sabe. In the latter, your kingdom was/is elevated by a governor of a state.

For me, the relevant Yoruba kings are the seven obalades as well as the kings who fought and gained their independence from Oyo & Ibadan - Alake, Awujale, Ooni. If you were in the audience when Kiriji was being fought, then you can't be too relevant. Of course Eko did not partake but Eko must be relevant.


For the umpteenth time, Alaafin was never the paramount ruler in Yorubaland. Alaafin was the strongest king at some point but that is not enough to make it the paramount office.

isalegan2:


Chuckie, I like you immensely. But please, cease and desist your verbal threat to the Oba of Lagos throne or I shall have no other recourse but to beat you to death with my bare hands! That throne is being held in trust for my oldest child. Seriously.

Ehn, You are a Princess !!!

Ok, e ma binu ma. There will be no more criticism of the Oba of Lagos by me, but I reserve the right to criticize any other corrupt Oba, Emir, or Eze

Katsumoto:

Hold on

Awujale was an Ilari sent from Oyo to settle a dispute. Ijebu was definitely a vassal of Oyo.

Big Kats, what's an Ilari?

Anyway, which of the Awujales cos I know Ijebu Kingdom predated both Oyo and Bini. Not saying Ijebu was ever militarily powerful enough to challenge Oyo - but it seems the relationship was both symbiotic and cordial, and not necessarily one of a vassal state. Think Spartans and other Greeks. Or maybe, the relationship between Scotland and England thrones from the time of James VI.

Regardless, I'm open to learning new scholarship and gaining knowledge. However, from what is documented - no stranger was ever allowed through the Ijebu Kingdom, not even Oyo - and even Ibadan at the height of its military. Only the Brits were able to break that, after the defeat of the Ijebus at Imagbon, during the Anglo/Ijebu war.

I remember PhysicsQED made the same claims about Bini as well by citing some oral boastfulness of some Bini palace attendant, to explorers - in which they questioned as well due to lack of any evidence whatsoever. However, when I asked to provide documented evidence, with pronounced cultural influences Bini had on the Ijebus - like the other Bini vassals like: Eko, Owo, the groups in Ondo, and all the Niger Delta groups - he couldn't produce anything. But there are more pronounced Ijebu cultural influences on the Binis, than the other way around.

P.S: not saying Ijebu Kingdom was militarily powerful - it is just a mystery that none of the two big empires it was surrounded by, were able to make it a proper vassal like they did to other places.

Katsumoto:

Both Johnson and Akinjogbin

These are different conflicts. In the first Iperu war, The Ibadans came to the rescue of the Ijebus against the Egbas. In the second Iperu war, some Ijebus aligned with the Egbas and Ijayes against Remo because it supported the Ibadans during the Ijaye war.

It was against the Ijebus; not just Remo. See above for more details.

The Owiwi war was between Remo and certain Ijebu towns, and the Egbas - fought on Egbado land - not necessarily an all out Ijebu war.

Based on warfare, I believe a defeat of the Ijebu would be the sacking of Ijebu Kingdom - and no one ever achieved that.

tonychristopher:
I was wondering how your parents felt when they did your naming ceremony, that is if they ever did that or if you were ever dedicated...i thing that you have stupidity in its finest form and your foolery is grandiose


Such a waste of sperm, i am not sorry for you but i pity your parents that assume that they have beggotten a child never knew they had an imp for a child what muslim will call iblis and some south west will call esu or whatever


you are just a regurgitated imp


dont quote me again


now run with your tail in between ur legs

I didn't bother reading most of your crap. But once again, your entire lineage is a waste of sperm; you this flat-headed monkey. I can even prove it - mention your Great Grandfather's name. Who is your Great Grandmother? What was your Great Grandfather's occupation? You this monkey that just climbed down from a tree.

Have you found another job under another Yoruba man? Just watch; you are about to get sacked again. You will never find a job anywhere in the South West again till you find your way to the bush you came from. I'm sure if I see you in real life, I'll probably laugh till I develop a seizure because I have no doubt you are one of those hungry looking Zombie-like losers roaming Lagos streets.

logica:
I didn't bother reading most of your crap. But once again, your entire lineage is a waste of sperm; you this flat-headed monkey. I can even prove it - mention your Great Grandfather's name. Who is your Great Grandmother? What was your Great Grandfather's occupation? You this monkey that just climbed down from a tree.

Have you found another job under another Yoruba man? Just watch; you are about to get sacked again. You will never find a job anywhere in the South West again till you find your way to the bush you came from. I'm sure if I see you in real life, I'll probably laugh till I develop a seizure because I have no doubt you are one of those hungry looking Zombie-like losers roaming Lagos streets.

What ever you wish for me or anybody you get it in tons


Why's is that your bitter . I am not the cause of your fraustration


What if I am self employed
What if I am not even in south west presently


Too much kids here ....you talk to much .stop the jealousy and start stud

Ignorance is bliss

logica:
I didn't bother reading most of your crap. But once again, your entire lineage is a waste of sperm; you this flat-headed monkey. I can even prove it - mention your Great Grandfather's name. Who is your Great Grandmother? What was your Great Grandfather's occupation? You this monkey that just climbed down from a tree.

Have you found another job under another Yoruba man? Just watch; you are about to get sacked again. You will never find a job anywhere in the South West again till you find your way to the bush you came from. I'm sure if I see you in real life, I'll probably laugh till I develop a seizure because I have no doubt you are one of those hungry looking Zombie-like losers roaming Lagos streets.

Oh my papa be this people :.....i have forgoten

Maybe u grow up son

tonychristopher:


What ever you wish for me or anybody you get it in tons


Why's is that your bitter . I am not the cause of your fraustration


What if I am self employed
What if I am not even in south west presently


Too much kids here ....you talk to much .stop the jealousy and start stud

Ignorance is bliss

Monkey, you are the one frustrated here. Don't project your miserable life on me. We are not coevals. An infant monkey speaking of kids. Which kids? You are not even fit to speak when kids speak on this forum.

Oh so you've ran out of the South West? Stop lying. If you left, where would you go? Speak in definite terms not indefinite. Maybe this, maybe that. Self employed? That's a laugh. How can a creature with the brainpower of a slug be self-employed?

tonychristopher:


Oh my papa be this people :.....i have forgoten

Maybe u grow up son

Forgotten? Or you never knew? You this monkey of no lineage. You have no history; nothing. YOU ARE NOTHING.