Tearoses, ronald4lif and anyone else,

Please don't use any Nigerian celebrity to attempt to reason about marriage. I don't wanna say much, but if you knew just a quarter of their shenanigans, you would have beaten up Tiwa Savage and Teebillz for making you waste your mb mentioning their names. Even the Nigerian celebrities with "wonderful" marriages give one a headache when you finally start seeing bits and pieces of the truth. Intact, anyone who is popular in Nigeria should never be used as a standard for morality or a rallying cry about anything in society. Unless of course it's hypocrisy.

Some of the stories are slowly trickling out (you think Teebillz hasn't lived off other women in his past, you think Tiwa hasn't been a hustler willing to do a lot to get ahead? Actually, that was one of the things everyone liked about her: very determined to be a success).

Infact, just pray for Nigeria. This corruption we are fighting started from our homes. The most important question one should ask your future husband or wife isn't about "who's gonna wash the dishes" but "how much do you earn". You need to be able to match their lifestyle to their paychecks and accept the level of hoe-ism you can live with. Someone who will do anything for money is someone you're never going to able to make see reason. When a man has played his good looks towards sleeping with and driving the car and full access of cash for several women, what equality do you wanna preach to him?? When a woman has also slept with her father's agemates and spent more money than you have seen in your life, how do you expect her not to be scornful that with your basic salary, you are lording it over her

But a few hea

Tearoses and onegai

Well said. After the initial hot head, i the next few weeks calmer heads and reasoning would follow and you would see that both of them Tbillz and Tiwa are just 2 irresponsible individuals

What both of them had done to get to where they are today are things no average person would do or be proud of

Apologies I have been MIA

Good morning everyone

Okikiki:


OK your opinion is highly respected.

Needed an informed opinion on a critical but non public issue.

Check your email.

Mindfulness:


Check your email.

Done.

Okikiki:


Done.

Seen and replied.

raumdeuter:


Things like weeding the environment, electrical fixes, mechanical fixes should this be part of a domestic duties too? Or do these duties get shared?

How many times do you do these things in a week/month? How many people actually do these tasks themselves? Can we also share pregnancy and breastfeeding?

raumdeuter:
When it comes to finances, Its I want a traditional man who works and fend for his family, when it comes to domestic duties, Its I want a modern man who cooks and clean

Well, this thread was never about that.

We now have more of 'I want women to keep their traditional roles while they also contribute financially'

[quote author=postmann post=45604125][/quote]

I can't quote you.

Kindly re-post so I can respond.

Thanks

Acidosis:
My advice to men is to be careful and endeavor to iron out issues before they settle down with a woman.

There is an ongoing culture where women do not see any wrong in providing for the home as long as the man is ready to wash dishes, mop the floor, and do other household activities.

A man is made the HEAD and no amount of globalization can change that. If your husband is broke, the ideal thing is to help him out (get a job or establish him), do not think it is wise for you to stand as the provider while your husband take the chores.

My own understanding of marriage is instituted by God, that's why people like me accept the principles of Church wedding.

It is on record that the coalition of Satan with Eve is what led to the fall of ADAM. The same Satan through the activities of Jezebel instituted majority of the sexual sins in the world today (e.g. gay marriage, lesbianism, etc.).

Noteworthy is the fact that the same sets of people who support same-sex marriage are the same people behind feminism, and the belief that a woman can work while the husband handles chores.

The question then is: WHY ARE WE SUDDENLY REVERSING the values and heritage of our fathers that made their marriages stand strong till death??

What is wrong in a man being the HEAD, and the woman the HELPER as instituted by the principles of Church marriage??

What is wrong with "you people"?

First, this post has no correlation with this thread.

Secondly, don't you think a woman establishing her husband is going against the 'natural' order of headship? And if a husband does the chores, does it strip him of his headship?

HaneefahRN:
Very interesting thread.
I think all these is influenced by the Society, upbringing and most importantly the people involved.
When a man helps his wife with domestic chores in whatever form it might be, he is perceived as a woma. wrapper or some people will even say he has been bewitched.
Some people don't let their male children cook, wash plates, sweep or even fetch water, just eat and go and start playing football or go play in a neighbours house while his sisters do the chores, so he would naturally see helping out his wife with chores as beneath him.

Like there was this male neighbour of mine in the face-me- I slap you, I lived in school. I always feel nauseated when he is having a call with his gf, like if he is washing his clothes, he would be telling her 'you know what I'm doing is your job', or how he can't wait to be married, so he wouldn't have to do all these anymore (like he couldn't wait to have his own personal slave to clean up after him and cook for him), and this is someone always making noise about never marrying a liability, how his wife must bring something to the table yet he is already dreaming of putting his own chores on her shoulders.


About the bride price stuff, in as much as I see no reason for it since some people use this as an excuse to maltreat their wives. But I say, it really doesn't matter as it depends more on the individuals involved.
I have a very close family friend, the bride's wife charged the groom's family well, the anchors of the wedding also did their own plus we had to travel a bit far for the wedding but the man treats his wife like an egg. He is a medical Dr so has a busy job but whenever he is around they do everything together, he can pound yam while she makes the soup. You will wish to go and get married when around them. They are like two friends living together. And the wife doesn't even have a job yet.



And there is another couple (I've said this story before on here), the wife only took the Holy Book from him and they didn't have any flamboyant wedding.
The woman has 2 kids, does all the house chores and still contributes to the family's finance. She resumes 7:30 am to work while the husband resumes, 9-10am. She was late for work and asked the husband to help in feeding their baby while she finishes up other chores and her dressing, the man asked her if he looks like a nanny husband and refused to feed his own baby like this will reduce his manliness. At the end of the day, the Proprietor of the school noticing the woman's countenance was the one that fed the child.

That is the terrible mentality some men have. So even if you get married to such men without bride price, he might only see the wife like someone pointed out as a.
'cheaper slave '

Agree it depends on the mentality of the couple.

raumdeuter:


When the couple dont share bills the husband was probably killing himself working all round the clock 16hrs per day but his wife starts to work and he cuts down to 8hrs per day to have a better and longer life

But to these women that means he is slacking he isnt bringing in as much and now making the wife spend her hard earned money on her family instead of on herself

That is an example of the man slacking

Why this myth that a husband who is the sole provider is working 24hrs a day to make ends meet? In Nigeria, people rarely have side businesses they physically attend to everyday after their 9 - 5 so a sole provider works same hours with a co-provider.

That said, these women said their husbands no longer provide (what he has) once they see their wives are willing to contribute...

E.g. 1: a husband buys shoes of N150k while his wife is cutting costs to pay their daughter's fees. This wife is also responsible for feeding and they do not pay rent.

E.g. 2: a husband does not drop any money for taking care of their kid because she doesn't ask.

E.g. 3: another husband expected his wife to pay 50% of their mortgage (she earns half of his salary & has not seen the documents of the house till date). She also took a loan to furnish the home and takes care of feeding. (I think this is every a different case)

These are three examples I can remember.

bukatyne:


First, this post has no correlation with this thread.

Secondly, don't you think a woman establishing her husband is going against the 'natural' order of headship? And if a husband does the chores, does it strip him of his headship?

Yes

Meanwhile, a woman establishing her man can be done in many ways. Personally, I don't think I would be comfortable to beg my wife for money. The best I could do is to "borrow", and make a refund with interest.

raumdeuter:
These roles OP is talking about starts from when they are young and women are taught they are the inferior ones, the ones that should be allowed to sit first, enter vehicle first. who can hit people without any repercussion If they were equal why would anyone need to stand up or enter before anyone?

Then into teenage, men are given physically harder stuffs to do than women because they are women and men take the hit.

When dating the man is expected to woo, then spend all he has to get the girl, in a typical Nigerian setting the spending while dating is usually 90% from the mans side

The proposal in most cases is expected to be done by the men and most of the spending even for the wedding

So they get into the wedding the cry for equality starts. The same equality they never cared about at any point in their life when it comes to carrying heavy weights, relationship spending, dong tough courses in school. AT that time all you hear is "Are you not the man"

And are the women not trained to do all the chores and answer yes sir to the men while at it?

The society has mapped out the duties...

Men: Provide/give bullshit
Women: Chores/take bullshit

I am sure no woman whose husband provide will ever complain she does the domestics alone (even if it is much for her).

It becomes an issue when Party A expect B to handle part of his/her area and is inflexible. I remember a thread of a man whose wife stayed late in her shop (so she wasn't effective at home) and still wasn't contributing to the family purse. It is either she started contributed or stop selling. No eating cake and having it.

Acidosis:


Yes

Meanwhile, a woman establishing her man can be done in many ways. Personally, I don't think I would be comfortable to beg my wife for money. The best I could do is to "borrow", and make a refund with interest.

* So you believe a husband shouldn't do chores; ok
* Should a wife contribute to the family purse?

Mindfulness:


It is not even about money in the first place. It is about fairness. If the two of you work from 9-5 and you come home and expect her to continue working while you have the luxury of relaxing, then something is seriously wrong.

If the woman is willing to take this nonsense .... well, not my problem, at the end of the day.

Absolutely the crux of this thread.

You can also add you stay at home and expect her to come from work and work for you at home, then there is something doubly wrong.

ronald4lif:
I don't believe in gender roles. House chores and financing the home can be shared between couple with anyone undertaking the chores they think its appropriate. No roles should be defined and allocated.

I also won't say coz Wifey is a sit-at-home mum and not partake in house chores. It is my responsibility to keep the house clean, tidy, fix meals and nurse my baby, married/working or not.

However, I won't accept any gender equality arrangement when I'm the sole financier of the house. Any woman who wants equality with me must take responsibility and contribute to the home financing.

In Teebills case the wife was the breadwinner and he shouldn't complain if he's the one taking care of their child. A woman won't feeds you and still retire home to nurse kids and prepare meals. Head of the family shouldn't be a show of gasconade but must come with responsibility.

@Bold, what if you are solely responsible for finance and she is solely responsible for domestics?

raumdeuter:
Tearoses and onegai

Well said. After the initial hot head, i the next few weeks calmer heads and reasoning would follow and you would see that both of them Tbillz and Tiwa are just 2 irresponsible individuals

What both of them had done to get to where they are today are things no average person would do or be proud of

The problem i had with Teebliz was

1. He brought their shit online
2. He was stealing from her.

All these he slept around, she did not cook, she slept with ABC b/4 marriage, edible caterer, cocaine and drugs, verbal abuse etc. are non-issues to me. (for their class).

I tried not to tie 'equality' in this discourse because it is very broad and not white and black.

I was more focused on 'roles'

bukatyne:


Absolutely the crux of this thread.

It is and it also reveals the misunderstanding in all of it. People think it is about money and power or authority or even feminism when in fact it is about time, energy and the well-being of the person you are actually supposed to love, respect and honor. Which husband would want his wife to work double as much as he does and still expect her to be happy, healthy and beautiful?

You can also add you stay at home and expect her to come from work and work for you at home, then there is something doubly wrong.

I have seen such a marriage. The woman died very young.

bukatyne:

* So you believe a husband shouldn't do chores; ok * Should a wife contribute to the family purse?

A man MUST do chores. But a man must not be relegated exclusively to HOME work.
A woman can contribute to the family purse if she has the means.

Acidosis:


A man MUST do chores. But a man must not be relegated exclusively to HOME work.

A woman can contribute to the family purse if she has the means.

You have issues with a husband staying at home for a while....

1. A man loses his job unfortunately and has to stay at home a while till he gets another
2. A man works from home
3. He earns the proverbial N200k and wifey earns N1m and someone needs to stay at home with the kids a while.

What is your take on the above ?

Mindfulness:


It is and it also reveals the misunderstanding in all of it. People think it is about money and power or authority or even feminism when in fact it is about time, energy and the well-being of the person you are actually supposed to love, respect and honor. Which husband would want his wife to work double as much as he does and still expect her to be happy, healthy and beautiful?

I have seen such a marriage. The woman died very young.

RIP to her.

Next you hear women get older than their husbands not looking at the fundamental issue.

bukatyne:


@Bold, what if you are solely responsible for finance and she is solely responsible for domestics?

In such arrangement then I don't mind rolling on equal footing but I don't know if there's any such thing as sole domestic responsibility. Maybe not to me coz I don't see the possibility of staying in a house I don't partake in the domestic affairs.

That will be me seeing the house dirty and untidy etc and not clean it coz I foot the bills. This is ludicrous and practically impossible.

ronald4lif:


In such arrangement then I don't mind rolling on equal footing but I don't know if there's any such thing as sole domestic responsibility. Maybe not to me coz I don't see the possibility of staying in a house I don't partake in the domestic affairs.

That will be me seeing the house dirty and untidy etc and not clean it coz I foot the bills. This is ludicrous and practically impossible.

Ok, I get you.

@ Bold: Very possible.

bukatyne:


I can't quote you.

Kindly re-post so I can respond.

Thanks

quote author=bukatyne post=45597137]@postmann:

Stop feeling important

I tagged the two peeps who made me actually start the thread. They felt the culture of women looking up to their husbands as providers was obsolete.

Will get back to your epistle.

#modified:

I was actually expecting more proponents of rigid gender roles.

I think you are mixing up a househusband & a husband who is domesticated.

bukatyne:

@Tiwa: there was nothing wrong with him being a 'househusband' till he gets on his feet.

In as much as I really don't fancy talking about the lives of married couples, let me just say this; from the little I read, Blizz was the manager, getting her contracts and all that. So he was gainfully employed, however bad a manager he was notwithstanding.

But we all know the lives of celebrities. We all know the hardest test for mankind is to successfully manage wealth and fame. So I believed she forgot the Tiwa on stage was only a myth, a stage act with camera rays and lenses projecting a shadowy substance of what she isn't. She forgot she was a wife. Probably.

bukatyne:

I hate to be a parasite and what is my value if I neither contribute money nor domestics? What value was Teeblizz bringing to the table if he wasn't working and expected Tiwa twisting with Patoranking to cook for him? What was his usefulness?

He wasn't a parasite. He was her manager. Managers do a lot in managing their artists. Or maybe you were expecting him to be a Don Jazzy or make his earnings in a completely separate venture from hers.

bukatyne:

If you say that a husband is still the 'head' whether he provided or not, then it implies he is still the head househusband or not.

Was president Jonathan the head of the Ijaws even when he was president? Being arguably the richest and most influential didn't make him the head of the ijaws, rather the head was Edwin Clark.

A child may become educated and richer than his uneducated father, but he cannot usurp his father's role as the head.

And yes, a wife earning more than her husband by no means make her the head. And if you want it in a stronger phrase; women and leadership make a poor couple.

bukatyne:

Stay at home moms have more time to take care for themselves and family if they are inclined to. I am trying to understand why a wife must earn if she & hubby believes in strict gender roles.

Don't allow the modern day working settings becloud you, my dear. From the earliest of times, women have always worked and contributed in small scales to their families. From weaving to light farming. And when they inherited fortunes from their fathers, it became their husbands'.

Women contributing to the homes financially or materially has always been. But until the feminist uprising it was never seen as an avenue for authority usurpation.

bukatyne:

In the grand scheme of things, whose business is it the way my home is run?

Your husband only. And the woman is the manageress of the home. Be her the president of the Federal Republic Nigeria and her husband a stay at home, good-for-nothing retrograde.

bukatyne:
Why this myth that a husband who is the sole provider is working 24hrs a day to make ends meet? In Nigeria, people rarely have side businesses they physically attend to everyday after their 9 - 5 so a sole provider works same hours with a co-provider.

That said, these women said their husbands no longer provide (what he has) once they see their wives are willing to contribute...

E.g. 1: a husband buys shoes of N150k while his wife is cutting costs to pay their daughter's fees. This wife is also responsible for feeding and they do not pay rent.

E.g. 2: a husband does not drop any money for taking care of their kid because she doesn't ask.

E.g. 3: another husband expected his wife to pay 50% of their mortgage (she earns half of his salary & has not seen the documents of the house till date). She also took a loan to furnish the home and takes care of feeding. (I think this is every a different case)

These are three examples I can remember.

WHy should the husband provide what he used to do when he was the only one working now that they have 2 hands

1. Does a man who work not have rights to buy himself shoes, Ask the wife, how much shoes she has bought herself since she started making money. So he couldn't buy shoes before now what is wrong with him buying shoes.

If the house need 500K per month and the man was the only one providing it, Are you expecting him to continue dropping 500k even when the wife is making her own money?

2. If the husband is dropping money for something else why should he drop money for taking care of the kids? If he pays the rent, buys the cars pay the bills should he also pay for the kids? So what does the wife do with her own money?

3. So why is she having a problem with paying half the mortgage of the house she stays in? Does anyone stay free anywhere in the world? If she doesnt want to pay half the mortgage would she park out and stay elsewhere for free rent??

bukatyne:
And are the women not trained to do all the chores and answer yes sir to the men while at it?

The society has mapped out the duties...

Men: Provide/give bullshit
Women: Chores/take bullshit

I am sure no woman whose husband provide will ever complain she does the domestics alone (even if it is much for her).

It becomes an issue when Party A expect B to handle part of his/her area and is inflexible. I remember a thread of a man whose wife stayed late in her shop (so she wasn't effective at home) and still wasn't contributing to the family purse. It is either she started contributed or stop selling. No eating cake and having it.

That post was about asking for equality in everything not picking one part to ask for equality.

If you are a senior accountant that take more responsibility and a colleague who takes less responsibility. Doesnt complain but when it gets to getting official car, she starts asking for equality

Maybe women would do better to start asking for equality to do the heavier energy sapping chores, doing the proposals and buying rings, equality in paying for dates, equality in doing tough courses

I would be impressed the day women ask for equality in joining the military, equality in number of people fighting Boko Haram, equality in digging wells, working on oil rigs and not just equality in cozy office jobs

Just got back in from the city
I was standing on the platform and the train drew in
There was a gentleman in front of me when the doors opened
He stood back and beckoned that I entered the carriage first
There was only one empty seat
I stood back a little and he beckoned again and asked me to take it

Then I remembered this thread and equality and everything else
If that man had rushed to get that seat, I know the kind of looks people would have given him
Yet he probably needed it more than me, I dont know

Some things men just do and some things women just do

raumdeuter:


WHy should the husband provide what he used to do when he was the only one working now that they have 2 hands

He doesn't anymore..... instead of contributing half, he contributes nada

raumdeuter:
1. Does a man who work not have rights to buy himself shoes, Ask the wife, how much shoes she has bought herself since she started making money. So he couldn't buy shoes before now what is wrong with him buying shoes

If the house need 500K per month and the man was the only one providing it, Are you expecting him to continue dropping 500k even when the wife is making her own money?.

And he buys the shoes when it is time to pay school fees? A man has the right to buy whatever he likes.... however, there is time for everything. It is same as a woman changing her bags and shoes while the husband is hustling to pay rent & fees..

Should the proverbial man start dropping zero?

raumdeuter:
2. If the husband is dropping money for something else why should he drop money for taking care of the kids? If he pays the rent, buys the cars pay the bills should he also pay for the kids? So what does the wife do with her own money?

The husband does nada because the wife would not ask. I do not know who handles the rent though. Every other bill, the wife handles because she doesn't ask him.

raumdeuter:
3. So why is she having a problem with paying half the mortgage of the house she stays in? Does anyone stay free anywhere in the world? If she doesnt want to pay half the mortgage would she park out and stay elsewhere for free rent??

She has a problem paying half & fully furnishing a house she has not seen the documents while she handles the feeding and all other expenses.

She earns half of his pay.


I want to believe you are just playing the devil's advocate.

tearoses:
Just got back in from the city
I was standing on the platform and the train drew in
There was a gentleman in front of me when the doors opened
He stood back and beckoned that I entered the carriage first
There was only one empty seat
I stood back a little and he beckoned again and asked me to take it

Then I remembered this thread and equality and everything else
If that man had rushed to get that seat, I know the kind of looks people would have given him
Yet he probably needed it more than me, I dont know

Some things men just do and some things women just do

raumdeuter:

That post was about asking for equality in everything not picking one part to ask for equality.
If you are a senior accountant that take more responsibility and a colleague who takes less responsibility. Doesnt complain but when it gets to getting official car, she starts asking for equality
Maybe women would do better to start asking for equality to do the heavier energy sapping chores, doing the proposals and buying rings, equality in paying for dates, equality in doing tough courses
I would be impressed the day women ask for equality in joining the military, equality in number of people fighting Boko Haram, equality in digging wells, working on oil rigs and not just equality in cozy office jobs

Thread was never about equality, it was about roles and the new 'myth' in town that men no longer handle finances once their wives are contributing.

bukatyne:
The problem i had with Teebliz was

1. He brought their shit online
2. He was stealing from her.

All these he slept around, she did not cook, she slept with ABC b/4 marriage, edible caterer, cocaine and drugs, verbal abuse etc. are non-issues to me. (for their class).

The stealing from her, we cannot say for certain, Its only Tiwa that said it.

I am certain if he also had a 50mins video he would say some damaging things should we believe every of what he says too?

I have heard before on this forum that spouses cannot steal from each other or is this only when its the woman doing the taking?

https://www.nairaland.com/42446/woman-steal-husband/3

https://www.nairaland.com/146868/steal-spouse

https://www.nairaland.com/1294705/what-wife-steals-money-she

https://www.nairaland.com/593165/does-taking-money-husband-make/1

https://www.nairaland.com/1257382/what-wrong-taking-money-hubbys

I believe the same set of people who supported wifes "taking from their husband, Would be mad Teebillz "took" from Tiwa. So where is this equality?

bukatyne:

Thread was never about equality, it was about roles and the new 'myth' in town that men no longer handle finances once their wives are contributing.

This thread is about equality. Equality is the undertone.

A wife contributes "equally", shouldnt a husband contribute to domestic work"equally" to ensure no one is not treated unequal