hopefulLandlord:


Good to see that passive aggressive stance of yours loosen a bit

My conscience finds it wrong

But that's my conscience and I've always maintained that conscience and society determines what's right and wrong for me

YOU Christians claim bible is your source of morality and won't take conscience as a valid answer when given for bestiality and insest

Since that same book didn't condemn what we now call "child marriage" (mind you, what we call child marriage now is a lot different from those times, an 18 year old should not be in her father's house in those days) what makes it wrong? Like I said, if you say its a Personal thing, then all good, that's valid enough for me personally but since you didn't take that Personal explanation when tendered for bestiality and insest, it would be hypocrisy to tender it now

I need you to understand where I'm coming from

Let's assume you are arguing with a fellow atheist who sees nothing wrong with bestiality. How would you convince him or her about your stance? I'm curious.

youngestland:


simply put societal laws gives moral and not your holy books

Like bestiality and incest

youngest land , bestiality is legal in Hungary ,if you should catch your son performing sexual acts with animals will you reprimand him? Or tell him to go ahead ? Let's assume both of you are Hungarians residing in Hungary

hopefulLandlord:


Good to see that passive aggressive stance of yours loosen a bit

My conscience finds it wrong

But that's my conscience and I've always maintained that conscience and society determines what's right and wrong for me

YOU Christians claim bible is your source of morality and won't take conscience as a valid answer when given for bestiality and insest

Since that same book didn't condemn what we now call "child marriage" (mind you, what we call child marriage now is a lot different from those times, an 18 year old should not be in her father's house in those days) what makes it wrong? Like I said, if you say its a Personal thing, then all good, that's valid enough for me personally but since you didn't take that Personal explanation when tendered for bestiality and insest, it would be hypocrisy to tender it now

I need you to understand where I'm coming from

Dont get it twisted. The reason why I slowed down a bit was for your sake since you find it hard to quickly grasp stuff.

If you say Child marriage is wrong. What is Immorality? Get the definition and then connect that to Sexual Immorality as spoken of in Galatians 5: 19 to 21.

When you are done assimilating it then would my earlier reponse and the earlier response of kilo4sure make sense to you.

kilo4sure:

I think you miss the point here, Christianity does not say morals are gotten from the bible

Farmerforlife:


Why do you ask me? I am not a Christian. I am a Muslim.

What did he even ask? Am I missing something?

damogul:



Dont get it twisted. The reason why I slowed down a bit was for your sake since you find it hard to quickly grasp stuff.

If you say Child marriage is wrong. What is Immorality? Get the definition and then connect that to Sexual Immorality as spoken of in Galatians 5: 19 to 21.

When you are done assimilating it then would my earlier reponse and the earlier of response of kilo4sure make sense to you.

Gal 5: 19-21

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Oga, if you've got nothing to say, kindly shut up

What the bible regards as sexual immorality are ADULTERY and FORNICATION

Orgies there fall into one of these categories

So how does it affect me if I marry a 12 year old and have sex with her? It doesn't fall into fornication or adultery

Make up your mind and stop moving like a dry leaf on water

First it was "Christ in you" now you're quoting bible, which one is it?

I'm gonna be busy for a while

Anas09:

What did he even ask? Am I missing something?

It's in the title of the op.

hopefulLandlord:

Is there a problem sire? Or you do not understand what l meant. If God is the Good as Christians claim, then good is the ultimate. Morality becomes objective, morality is objective because of God not necessarily because of the commands of the old testament which you atheists love so much. For you atheists, you can be the most moral beings on earth but you cannot explain to your fellow immoral atheists in all cases why your stance is the more rational one.

hopefulLandlord:
Please, I need answers from: Winner01 , Richirich713, naijadeyhia scholar8200 , malvisguy212 , Muafrika2, Dejideji1 , truthman2012, Image123 , InesQor, Joshthefirst MrPresident1, gatiano sukkot, OLAADEGBU , vooks, UyiIredia , Jeromejnr, thoniameek, anas09, Tufanja, elantraceey, ceeted, Chidexter, lezz, analice107, bxcode, Topeakintola, Tellemall, Ishilove, Drefan2, Strawman, dazzle101, Dejideji1, Farmerforlife, 4evergod2, udysweet, Edelweiss44, KingEbukaNaija


Monitoring how things will turn out are: Plaetton , Johnydon22 ilovetheline, JackBizzle, Kay17, AgentOfAllah, Ayomikun37 , hahn , sonOfLucifer , frank317 muskeeto , Decker , PastorAIO , ValentineMary , Pyrrho , braithwaite , dragonEmperor , theoneJabulani , lepasharon , cloudgoddess , ifenes , brigance , stephenmorris , thehomer , dalaman , Ranchhoddas , weah96 , CAPSLOCKED , lilbrown007 , Elohim1

What are you shouting these names for?

KingEbukaNaija:


Like bestiality and incest

youngest land , bestiality is legal in Hungary ,if you should catch your son performing sexual acts with animals will you reprimand him? Or tell him to go ahead ? Let's assume both of you are Hungarians residing in Hungary

I will tell him that he is a r@pist. Animals can't give consent to se.x

The same way children, mentally impaired or drunk people can't give consent.

hopefulLandlord:


Gal 5: 19-21

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Oga, if you've got nothing to say, kindly shut up

What the bible regards as sexual immorality are ADULTERY and FORNICATION

Orgies there fall into one of these categories

So how does it affect me if I marry a 12 year old and have sex with her? It doesn't fall into fornication or adultery

Make up your mind and stop moving like a dry leaf on water

First it was "Christ in you" now you're quoting bible, which one is it?

Iwhen I called you dense you took offence. I wonder why you always rush to speak without understanding anything whatsoever.

I asked you to tell me your own opinion of the topic and u said it was wrong. And I asked you to look up immorality and its meaning and then pit sexual next to it for a clearer understanding.

And in your usual manner you blurt out what you have not even looked up and again show you lack knowledge of what you criticise.

Let me help you


im·mo·ral·i·ty
ˌiməˈralədē/
noun
the state or quality of being immoral; wickedness.
"he believed his father had been punished by God for his immorality"
synonyms: wickedness, immoral behavior, badness, evil, vileness, corruption, dishonesty, dishonorableness; sinfulness, ungodliness, unchastity, sin, depravity, villainy, vice, degeneracy, debauchery, dissolution, perversion, lewdness, obscenity, wantonness, promiscuity; informalshadiness, crookedness; formalturpitude
"he charged that the overseas press was prone to lies and immorality"


Synonyms of immorality are BADNESS, EVIL, VICE, OBSCENITY AND SO ON.

You said child marriage is wrong right? So is Badness right? Is evil right? Is vice right? Is Obscenity right?

You never ever understand anything before you speak even when I tried explaining it to you as I would a child. Are you sure you are alright?

JackBizzle:

JackBizzle . I'm nettled at your abysmal reasoning here . I said societal laws should be followed by Christians if they are congruous with God's laws . When something is congruous with another , they are in harmony or in agreement .

That means Christians should deprecate laws that that approve or legalize depravities like homosexuality and bestiality . To be pellucid and laconic about this , if societal laws approve of child marriage Christians are not expected to obey it ,and if the societal law restricts marriage to 18 years and above then Christians should obey it .

If guys don't understand me , ask me to explain my point or opinion about the subject being treated instead of deriding yourselves in ignorance - risible though

Thanks

KingEbukaNaija:


JackBizzle . I'm nettled at the way your abysmal reasoning here . I said societal laws should be followed by Christians if they are congruous with God's laws . When something is congruous with another , they are in harmony or in agreement .

That means Christians should deprecate laws that that approve or legalize depravities like homosexuality and bestiality . To be pellucid and terse about this , if societal laws approve of child marriage Christians are not expected to obey it ,and if the societal law restricts marriage to 18 years and above then Christians should obey it .

If guys don't understand me , ask me to explain my point or opinion about the subject being treated instead of deriding yourselves in ignorance - risible though

Thanks

The bible does not cover underage marriage or se.x. How can an absence of a law in the bible be congruous to a presence of a law in the country?

Guy, go and take more sleep. I think the powerful knockout you were given is still affecting you.

JackBizzle:




The bible does not cover underage marriage or se.x. How can an absence of a law in the bible be congruous to a presence of a law in the country?

Guy, go and take more sleep. I think the powerful knockout you were given is still affecting you.

Powerful knockout ? Where ? Stop being delusional abeg . Here is my explanation of pedophilia

Pedophilia is sexual perversion and can also be seen under fornication or sexual immorality . It is unnatural to lust after a child . Eww !

1 Corinthians 6:18-20
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.

Child marriage wrong because the child is immature . It is usually done out of lust and the child is forced against her will or inveigled to commit to a man . Being married to a child is ungodly and can be seen as another form of pedophilia .

Lust is wrong . Persuasion using deceit -inveigling - is wrong . And the fact she is being coerced to do so means it is wrong

Jude 1:7
Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.

Being married to a child or having sex with a child can be seen as an unnatural desire and that is perversion - so its wrong.

damogul:


Iwhen I called you dense you took offence. I wonder why you always rush to speak without understanding anything whatsoever.

I asked you to tell me your own opinion of the topic and u said it was wrong. And I asked you to look up immorality and its meaning and then pit sexual next to it for a clearer understanding.

And in your usual manner you blurt out what you have not even looked up and again show you lack knowledge of what you criticise.

Let me help you


im·mo·ral·i·ty
ˌiməˈralədē/
noun
the state or quality of being immoral; wickedness.
"he believed his father had been punished by God for his immorality"
synonyms: wickedness, immoral behavior, badness, evil, vileness, corruption, dishonesty, dishonorableness; sinfulness, ungodliness, unchastity, sin, depravity, villainy, vice, degeneracy, debauchery, dissolution, perversion, lewdness, obscenity, wantonness, promiscuity; informalshadiness, crookedness; formalturpitude
"he charged that the overseas press was prone to lies and immorality"


Synonyms of immorality are BADNESS, EVIL, VICE, OBSCENITY AND SO ON.

You said child marriage is wrong right? So is Badness right? Is evil right? Is vice right? Is Obscenity right?

You never ever understand anything before you speak even when I tried explaining it to you as I would a child. Are you sure you are alright?

Oga, you're just losing more credibility with your long rigmarole


I said its wrong for ME because MY Conscience finds it wrong

Did you base your saying its wrong on MY conscience? I'm sure you didn't, so this post of yours is as useful as lifebuoy in my room

Mind you, there are things considered " good" or at least "not wrong" by society which my conscience still wouldn't allow so don't group anything I say my conscience doesn't allow as "evil" or "wrong" generally speaking, that's just another form of intellectual dishonesty

Another long post with no substance

You're sounding more and more like you lack basic understanding

JackBizzle:


I will tell him that he is a r@pist. Animals can't give consent to se.x

Look at this one , it is LEGALIZED . So according to youngestland , as a Hungarian ,then it is RIGHT . So he is not a rapist because the act is legalized . Or don't you understand that according to your atheistic views , anything LEGAL is RIGHT .

hopefulLandlord:
Hi Christians

Since Christians claim morality comes from the Bible, what is the Bible's view on pedophilia and child marriage?

Do you endorse child marriage and Pedophilia? If no, why is it wrong? Where does the bible condemn it?

If I marry a 12 year old that has hit puberty and/or have sex with her, is it wrong? Where in the bible was it addressed as wrong?

Lol, this your question amuses me.
pedophilia is a form of sexual perversion and we all know it's not right.

There are several verses in the Bible condemning all forms of sexual perversion.

For the issue of child marriage, it's only a pedophilia that will consider getting married to small child.

JackBizzle:




The bible does not cover underage marriage or se.x. How can an absence of a law in the bible be congruous to a presence of a law in the country?

Guy, go and take more sleep. I think the powerful knockout you were given is still affecting you.

Na wa o, but this is quite simple na. Those in ancient times were probably more ignorant of the devastating effect child marriage had on the body. With more knowledge we know in our time, a child of 14 does not have her body fully developed, hence our societal law sets the bar at 18. This law is congrous with the biblical ethics that our body is the temple of the Holyspirit , hence we must do everything to protect the young female body, since you want Biblical law, is this not good enough? Must it be Thou shall not marry a child? Lol, atheists nor go kill me yo.

hopefulLandlord:


Oga, you're just losing more credibility with your long rigmarole


I said its wrong for ME because MY Conscience finds it wrong

Did you base your saying its wrong on MY conscience? I'm sure you didn't, so this post of yours is as useful as lifebuoy in my room

Mind you, there are things considered " good" or at least "not wrong" by society which my conscience still wouldn't allow so don't group anything I say my conscience doesn't allow as "evil" or "wrong" generally speaking, that's just another form of intellectual dishonesty

Another long post with no substance

You're sounding more and more like you lack basic understanding

At the bolded which you wrote. Now look at my question below which I directed at you and show me the difference if any.

Before I answer your question I need you to answer this personal question. .. is child marriage a wicked thing to you or a kind thing or a noble thing?
Answer me this and I promise to follow through with the answer to ur question.


My question was a direct question to u as an individual yet you still could not see that. I am done talking with someone who wouldnt think, understand before speaking.

KingEbukaNaija:


Look at this one , it is LEGALIZED . So according to youngestland , as a Hungarian ,then it is RIGHT . So he is not a rapist because the act is legalized . Or don't you understand that according to your atheistic views , anything LEGAL is RIGHT .

My morality as a human being and a humanist is based on logic/reasoning.


Some logic and facts for Mr. Ebuka

1) "legal" does not mean "right". It is very legal for me to insult you and your family on the street to provoke you and then, shoot you if you get close to me in confrontation. Self Defense.

2) My stance against beastiality is based on the reasoning behind the concept of "consent". It is logical

3) You can not hold a group of atheists to any moral standard. They are varied and have no unifying belief other than a lack of belief in God.

4) Hence (from no.3) questions of morality should be directed towards secular humanists

kilo4sure:

Na wa o, but this is quite simple na. Those in ancient times were probably more ignorant of the devastating effect child marriage had on the body. With more knowledge we know in our time, a child of 14 does not have her body fully developed, hence our societal law sets the bar at 18. This law is congrous with the biblical ethics that our body is the temple of the Holyspirit , hence we must do everything to protect the young female body, since you want Biblical law, is this not good enough? Must it be Thou shall not marry a child? Lol, atheists nor go kill me yo.

God akA Jehovah, could not tell the biblical people that pedophiila is wrong/.v

JackBizzle:


My morality as a human being and a humanist is based on logic/reasoning.


Some logic and facts for Mr. Ebuka

1) "legal" does not mean "right". It is very legal for me to insult you and your family on the street to provoke you and then, shoot you if you get close to me in confrontation. Self Defense.

2) My stance against beastiality is based on the reasoning behind the concept of "consent". It is logical

3) You can not hold a group of atheists to any moral standard. They are varied and have no unifying belief other than a lack of belief in God.

4) Hence (from no.3) questions of morality should be directed towards secular humanists

Wait first , should societal laws determine what's right tor wrong for the members of that society . Yes or No ?

damogul:



At the bolded which you wrote. Now look at my question below which I directed at you and show me the difference if any.

Before I answer your question I need you to answer this personal question. .. is child marriage a wicked thing to you or a kind thing or a noble thing?
Answer me this and I promise to follow through with the answer to ur question.


My question was a direct question to u as an individual yet you still could not see that. I am done talking with someone who wouldnt think, understand before speaking.

You still haven't picked up your understanding from where you left it

I find it wrong because my conscience finds it wrong

If my conscience finds it right and society allows it, then I'll do it

Since you claim bible is the source of your own morality, why do you find it wrong? Is it because hopefullandlord finds it wrong, if you find it wrong, why? Sexual immorality in the bible simply refers to adultery and fornication, it stated both MANY times in that book; if I marry a 12 year old and have sex with her, I'm not guilty of any of this

If the society you're in doesn't regard it as "immorality" on what basis does it now become immorality to you using your source of morality (the bible)?

You've already answered this question as sincerely as you could earlier by saying it's a personal thing and Christ in you, but since you've not been accepting such "personal" answers from atheists, your hypocrisy was brought forward which led to these long discussions

Do not bring this circular and senseless arguments of yours down here

Your rigmarole is getting longer and longer without saying anything

KingEbukaNaija:


Powerful knockout ? Where ? Stop being delusional abeg . Here is my explanation of pedophilia

Pedophilia is sexual perversion and can also be seen under fornication or sexual immorality . It is unnatural to lust after a child . Eww !

1 Corinthians 6:18-20
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.

Child marriage wrong because the child is immature . It is usually done out of lust and the child is forced against her will or inveigled to commit to a man . Being married to a child is ungodly and can be seen as another form of pedophilia .

Lust is wrong . Persuasion using deceit -inveigling - is wrong . And the fact she is being coerced to do so means it is wrong

Jude 1:7
Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.

Being married to a child or having sex with a child can be seen as an unnatural desire and that is perversion - so its wrong.

Copy and paste rubbish. Do you know the marriage age of girls in the bible?

Your bible actually supports underage marriage. There are sources that say that Mary in the bible was married at 13/14

KingEbukaNaija:




Wait first , should societal laws determine what's right tor wrong for the members of that society . Yes or No ?

It should but it does not always. Some leaders and lawyers make laws for their own benefit.

kilo4sure:

Na wa o, but this is quite simple na. Those in ancient times were probably more ignorant of the devastating effect child marriage had on the body. With more knowledge we know in our time, a child of 14 does not have her body fully developed, hence our societal law sets the bar at 18. This law is congrous with the biblical ethics that our body is the temple of the Holyspirit , hence we must do everything to protect the young female body, since you want Biblical law, is this not good enough? Must it be Thou shall not marry a child? Lol, atheists nor go kill me yo.

I just tire oo bro . The atheists are more concerned with outwitting Christians in arguments than actually understanding the subject being discussed - that's desperation .

That's how I said Christians should obey societal laws if they are congruous with God's laws and an atheist's illation was that I meant societal laws should determine what's right or wrong not holy books. The comment has 8 likes . Yikes !

And someone even said I was battered by the comment . Hei ! I just weak oo brother I just weak oo

When atheists appeal to their conscience to condemn something, l get confused. what is conscience by the way? Isn't the atheist conscience just the firing of molecules from the brain in random directions? These could easily lead to delusion. The Christians believe conscience is a God given gift, the writing of God's laws in our hearts, so they can appeal to their conscience. Why should l respect the atheists' conscience when it is nothing but a chemical reaction?

JackBizzle:


Copy and paste rubbish. Do you know the marriage age of girls in the bible?

Your bible actually supports underage marriage. There are sources that say that Mary in the bible was married at 13/14

Copy and paste . Please before we continue this discussion tell me where I copied it from . Oya oya oya ... tell me . State the source ... be fast

kilo4sure:
When atheists appeal to their conscience to condemn something, l get confused. what is conscience by the way? Isn't the atheist conscience just the firing of molecules from the brain in random directions? These could easily lead to delusion. The Christians believe conscience is a God given gift, the writing of God's laws in our hearts, so they can appeal to their conscience. Why should l respect the atheists' conscience when it is nothing but a chemical reaction?

According to the atheists , nothing is good or evil . So I wonder why they think child marriage is evil . They subscribe to subjective morality - that means something being right or wrong is arbitrary . That also means an atheist can marry a 12 year old child simply because the societal law assents to such or if he wants to or think it is right .

hopefulLandlord:


You still haven't picked up your understanding from where you left it

I find it wrong because my conscience finds it wrong

If my conscience finds it right and society allows it, then I'll do it

Since you claim bible is the source of your own morality, why do you find it wrong? Is it because hopefullandlord finds it wrong, if you find it wrong, why? Sexual immorality in the bible simply refers to adultery and fornication, it stated both MANY times in that book; if I marry a 12 year old and have sex with her, I'm not guilty of any of this

If the society you're in doesn't regard it as "immorality" on what basis does it now become immorality to you using your source of morality (the bible)?

You've already answered this question as sincerely as you could earlier by saying it's a personal thing and Christ in you, but since you've not been accepting such "personal" answers from atheists, your hypocrisy was brought forward which led to these long discussions

Do not bring this circular and senseless arguments of yours down here

Your rigmarole is getting longer and longer without saying anything

Dude I switched off from you since yesterday and was just keeping myself busy. Ever since you admitted not having any knowledge of what you criticise which you have repeatedly shown in todays chat. I appeal to you to kindly ......

damogul:



Dude I switched off from you since yesterday and was just keeping myself busy. Ever since you admitted not having any knowledge of what you criticise which you have repeatedly shown in todays chat. I appeal to you to kindly ......

The feeling is mutual

You've provided the sincere answer

You just didn't see the catch 22 coming hence your long Rigmaroles

Have a nice day