RichyBlacK:

Okay, but juju proponents do not place any limits on what is doable or knowable by their priests or executioners.

On the set of terrestrial and celestial events possible in our universe, the juju proponents effectively place NO LIMITS on the powers of their juju! This is clearly a sign of fraud!

@RichyBlack,

Please, you are too intelligent in my opinion to go down this route. Every single attempt to justify your position has been poor or pathetic as someone put it as you constantly create new diversions instead of addressing issues.

Now, let me take you to task on the claims made above.

Who stated that juju does not have limits?

Just provide an answer to this simple question as it seems you have spent the greater part of your last posts holding on to this statement that I believe no human being with a brain can make - that juju does not have any limits.

So, tell us who made the claim so that we can tell the person to shut up on time.

After all said and done, this debate goes beyond NL and people from across the globe have set up prizes, up to $1 million in one instance, for any evidence of the paranormal, aka juju/winch/kpians/otumorkpo/jazz.

If Nigerians, I mean the bad eggs amongst us, can use the internet to carry out 419 fraud in a get-rich-quick scheme, why can't at least one Nigerian go demonstrate to any of these organizations the potency of their juju and make cool cash?

Did I hear someone scream "Juju practitioners don't need money!"? Are you aware of that juju man who defrauded a Nigerian politician of hundreds of millions of Naira?

Did I hear another person shout "Juju cannot be used to make money!"? So, what is the corpse-to-currency converter juju for? I mean almost every juju proponent will tell you that one can use juju to make money, so why can't they go make $$$ from any of these organizations?

Here they are:

continued

Afam:

@RichyBlack,

Please, you are too intelligent in my opinion to go down this route. Every single attempt to justify your position has been poor or pathetic as someone put it as you constantly create new diversions instead of addressing issues.

Now, let me take you to task on the claims made above.

Who stated that juju does not have limits?

Just provide an answer to this simple question as it seems you have spent the greater part of your last posts holding on to this statement that I believe no human being with a brain can make - that juju does not have any limits.

So, tell us who made the claim so that we can tell the person to shut up on time.

In my research on this subject, I have asked countless times about the limits of juju and I hardly get any response. Most juju proponents will tell you something along this line:

"My brother, if one juju no fit do something na im be say another juju they prevent am. Anything way you wan do, juju dey to do am, but if you no fit do am, e mean say you never meet the juju man way fit do am. You know see why sometimes people dey travel from Nnewi go Calabar or even Ijebu to get the juju? Dem they go far to go get the juju way fit do wetin dem wan do".

From the above statement, it is clear that the juju proponent who made this statement does not place any limits whatsoever on the alleged powers of juju. One person on this thread stated that juju may not have the power to raise someone from the dead. That's the closest to a limit I've read on this thread.

Can you, or any other juju proponent, provide a list of limits of juju? This list need not be exhaustive. Providing this list will greatly advance this debate.

POSAKOSA1:

^^^^^^Anyone engaging in dialogue with you is wasting their time.

No, they are not. The man says he has carried out extensive investigation which spans visits to places and libraries and interviews with shamans in several continents. Yet, he saw no evidence in proof of juju. So we can probably learn a lot from him. Afam, of course, says he has personally witnessed demonstrations of the paranormal. I have not had any of the opportunities either man has. That means that since I am an open minded man, I cannot speak authoritatively as they. I can, however, listen to them and file away in my mind what they say for future reference.

POSAKOSA1:

^^^^^^Anyone engaging in dialogue with you is wasting their time.

Because I'm telling you that juju claims are fraudulent?

Can you contact that your housemaid that turned into a cat to go perform for any of these organizations?

If finance is the problem, I'll pay for all that is necessary to take her to any of these organizations. She could make $1 million!

Meanwhile, I have sent that wikipedia link to a guy who told me of his friend who can wash his hands with concentrated acid. Let's see if they can make some bucks!

MyJoe:

No, they are not. The man says he has carried out extensive investigation which spans visits to places and libraries and interviews with shamans in several continents. Yet, he saw no evidence in proof of juju. So we can probably learn a lot from him. Afam, of course, says he has personally witnessed demonstrations of the paranormal. I have not had any of the opportunities either man has. That means that since I am an open minded man, I cannot speak authoritatively as they. I can, however, listen to them and file away in my mind what they say for future reference.

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,  YOU can learn from him not me. I know juju is real. .

You're not as open-minded as you claim to be.

RichyBlacK:

Because I'm telling you that juju claims are fraudulent?

Can you contact that your housemaid that turned into a cat to go perform for any of these organizations?

If finance is the problem, I'll pay for all that is necessary to take her to any of these organizations. She could make $1 million!

Accept my sympathies, your brain is VOID OF LOGIC which you claim to have. GO BACK AND RE-READ MY POST, AS TO WHAT HAPPENED TO THE MAID.

People like you CHOOSE to see ONLY what you want to see.  Sorry I don't need your money. Start a NON PROFIT AND GIVE IT TO THE POOR. There are MILLIONS OF HUNGRY CHILDREN OUT THERE than you can help.

POSAKOSA1:

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,  YOU can learn from him not me. I know juju is real. .

You're not as open-minded as you claim to be.

open-minded to what?

hearsay?

MyJoe said he was open-minded, just because you don't believe in juju doesn't make you open-minded.

RichyBlacK:

In my research on this subject, I have asked countless times about the limits of juju and I hardly get any response. Most juju proponents will tell you something along this line:

"My brother, if one juju no fit do something na im be say another juju they prevent am. Anything way you wan do, juju dey to do am, but if you no fit do am, e mean say you never meet the juju man way fit do am. You know see why sometimes people dey travel from Nnewi go Calabar or even Ijebu to get the juju? Dem they go far to go get the juju way fit do wetin dem wan do".

From the above statement, it is clear that the juju proponent who made this statement does not place any limits whatsoever on the alleged powers of juju. One person on this thread stated that juju may not have the power to raise someone from the dead. That's the closest to a limit I've read on this thread.

Can you, or any other juju proponent, provide a list of limits of juju? This list need not be exhaustive. Providing this list will greatly advance this debate.

You see why I stated that you have now gone into desperation mode? No one told you that juju has no limits yet you have repeated that those who claim juju exists claim it does not have limits. Why the obvious lie? Where then is the credibility? What of integrity?

Making a false statement just to advance your position is desperate and in bad taste.

I was certain no one made that claim hence my decision to task you on the claim. Now you have proven the claim was non existent.

What is mermaid? Does it exist?

You may watch the video below of the young girl that died at 10 with fused legs without rectum, genitals etc. Is this normal? Does this defy the physical laws of reproduction and does this follow the normal human form?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091024/ap_on_en_tv/us_obit_pepin


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8okYhcRwrgY

MyJoe:

No, they are not. The man says he has carried out extensive investigation which spans visits to places and libraries and interviews with shamans in several continents. Yet, he saw no evidence in proof of juju. So we can probably learn a lot from him. Afam, of course, says he has personally witnessed demonstrations of the paranormal. I have not had any of the opportunities either man has. That means that since I am an open minded man, I cannot speak authoritatively as they. I can, however, listen to them and file away in my mind what they say for future reference.

@MyJoe,

I started this thread precisely for people like you - those with an open mind, willing to weigh the facts and consider the possibilities.

I too have hear countless stories about how juju did this and did that, and when I was younger I used to believe those stories. I vivdly remember when I was in Primary 4, in Lagos, and had a fight with a classmate - I beat him up real good; I used to be a quiet bully those days ; I've changed o! The guy, a Yoruba chap, told me that he's going to report me to his mom and that they'll kill me with juju. I was very afraid ad asked a colleague how exactly I was going to be killed. He told me that they'll put some water in a mortar, chant some incantations, call my name three times and my head will appear in the water. Then they'll strike my head with a pestle and I'll die instantly.

I was very scared. My then girlfriend (just a friend) from Bendel State (Benin to be precise) heard about the threat and told me nothing will happen. She said "they can't do anything to you". I asked her "how are you sure?". She said nothing they do to me will work. I wanted to know how she was so confident but she just smiled and told me nothing will happen. Well, I went home and told my mom. My mom just laughed and told me nothing will happen, but advised me to stop fighting.

The next day I came to school in one piece. The little braggart who threatened to kill me with juju saw me, frowned his face and stayed away from my path. I wasn't ready to forgo a fight should he come looking for my trouble - juju threat notwithstanding!

Afam:

You see why I stated that you have now gone into desperation mode? No one told you that juju has no limits yet you have repeated that those who claim juju exists claim it does not have limits. Why the obvious lie? Where then is the credibility? What of integrity?

Making a false statement just to advance your position is desperate and in bad taste.

I was certain no one made that claim hence my decision to task you on the claim. Now you have proven the claim was non existent.

What is mermaid? Does it exist?

You may watch the video below of the young girl that died at 10 with fused legs without rectum, genitals etc. Is this normal? Does this defy the physical laws of reproduction and does this follow the normal human form?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091024/ap_on_en_tv/us_obit_pepin


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8okYhcRwrgY

Okay, I've watched that video before. I've heard you, but you didn't attempt to answer my question:

[size=14pt]What are the limits of juju?[/size]

POSAKOSA1:

USELESS THREAD.

What are you doing on a useless thread?

Wetin dey pain dis juju believer? A beg no use your juju delete this thread o! fear don dey catch me!

^^^^^^ u're very foolish. The use of African medicine/voodoo must be used purposefully. Just like Chrisitianity or Islam or any religious belief.

You have the senseless idea that someone can just wake up and do someone harm, well if that person hasn't harmed them or anyone else, it won't work.


African medicine is used with purpose. <to cure diseases>O[b] its sole purpose NOT to harm[/b]but if someone offends you it can be used for that purpose.

Juju is the actual medicine but the believe in the voodoo religion or a religion that engages the use of this medicine is just like any other religion.


If a christian prays for someone to get healed, sometimes the person they're praying for gets healed, other times they dont. Same thing goes for a Jew, a Muslim, a Buddhist.


In my story about the maid, WHY DIDN'T THE HOUSE MAID harm us ? There's no reason too! Im sure shes caused havoc to other people.

JUJU is used in the context of religion and traditions.

If your sole purpose of accepting the voodoo religion is to use JUJU it might fail and other times it might not. But YOUR SMALL mind can't comprehend JUJU in the context of religion.


I used to be a fervent follower of the voodoo religion and believe in the powers of juju until I became a christian.

POSAKOSA1:

^^^^^^ u're very foolish. The use of African medicine/voodoo must be used purposefully. Just like Chrisitianity or Islam or any religious belief.

You have the senseless idea that someone can just wake up and do someone harm, well if that person hasn't harmed them or anyone else, it won't work.


African medicine is used with purpose. <to cure diseases>O[b] its sole purpose NOT to harm[/b]but if someone offends you it can be used for that purpose.

When a fool like you calls a thread useless, aren't you the most useless slowpoke to remain on the thread? Can you take your juju-believing ass out of this place before I use my own powers to remove you? Fake ass juju zobie fool!

POSAKOSA1:

If your sole purpose of accepting the voodoo religion is to use JUJU it might fail and other times it might not. But YOUR SMALL mind can't comprehend JUJU in the context of religion.


I used to be a fervent follower of the voodoo religion and believe in the powers of juju until I became a christian.

Shuoo! See me see trouble o! Why can't you leave the useless thread for us? Juju mugu!

POSAKOSA1:

Juju is the actual medicine but the believe in the voodoo religion or a religion that engages the use of this medicine is just like any other religion.


If a christian prays for someone to get healed, sometimes the person they're praying for gets healed, other times they dont. Same thing goes for a Jew, a Muslim, a Buddhist.


In my story about the maid, WHY DIDN'T THE HOUSE MAID harm us ? There's no reason too! Im sure shes caused havoc to other people.

JUJU is used in the context of religion and traditions.

Bla bla bla bla . . .

Are you done? Can't you leave the thread for us? Why are you eating your vomit? Asswipe!

RichyBlacK:

When a fool like you calls a thread useless, aren't you the most useless slowpoke to remain on the thread? Can you take your juju-believing ass out of this place before I use my own powers to remove you? Fake ass juju zobie fool!

It is USELESS and so are you because other people who have experienced juju powers are telling you their experience and here you are still TALKING RUBBISH. Whats the point of starting a thread if you won't believe anything thats actually said.

If you have questions ask but DON'T call JUJU fraudulent.

POSAKOSA1:


HOW SAD. AREN'T YOU A MODERATOR ? HERE YOU ARE FLAUNTING YOUR STUPIDITY.

So, now your juju-infested brain remembers that fact?

Please leave this thread!

RichyBlacK:

In my research on this subject, I have asked countless times about the limits of juju and I hardly get any response.
[. . .]
Can you, or any other juju proponent, provide a list of limits of juju? This list need not be exhaustive. Providing this list will greatly advance this debate.

What of me, and our discussion?

RichyBlacK:

So, now your juju-infested brain remembers that fact?

Please leave this thread!

No need to leave. I can stay if I want. Its a PUBLIC FORUM.

POSAKOSA1:

^^^^^^ u're very foolish. The use of African medicine/voodoo must be used purposefully. Just like Chrisitianity or Islam or any religious belief.

You have the senseless idea that someone can just wake up and do someone harm, well if that person hasn't harmed them or anyone else, it won't work.


African medicine is used with purpose. <to cure diseases>O[b] its sole purpose NOT to harm[/b]but if someone offends you it can be used for that purpose.

Can your juju-infested eyes see where the insults started? Idiot!

POSAKOSA1:

No need to leave. I can stay if I want. Its a PUBLIC FORUM.

No problem with that.

Disagree with me all you want, but don't insult me. I WILL respond!

RichyBlacK:

Okay, I've watched that video before. I've heard you, but you didn't attempt to answer my question:

[size=14pt]What are the limits of juju?[/size]

I am sorry RichyBlack I will not be going down that route with you - endless diversions and questions without any end in sight.

I don't practice juju so cannot tell you the limits. I thought the issue was whether it exists or not? If correct, then your question about the limits is uncalled for.

Make no mistake about it, on this issue you goofed big time and the earlier you started reconciling the many contradictions you have gotten yourself into the better for you.

Let me break it down for you as regards the position on christianity and juju based on physical laws.

1. You believe in the stories in the bible that clearly defy physical laws based on faith.

2. You believe juju does not exist because it means it will defy physical laws based on science.

While you are at home with the two positions above let me prove the inconsistency and contradiction to you.

Now someone that believes and practices juju could hold a very valid position using the exact same logic you employed

1. The person would claim that he believes in juju even when they defy physical laws based on faith and even personal experience.

2. The person would (or could) claim that christianity is fraud simply because it defies physical laws based on logic.

In fact, the person who believes in juju would be more credible since he/she has personal experience or encounter that can add to the faith whereas in your own case the only thing you have is faith.

I wake up and sleep on science and technology. I challenge theories, I use them and I appreciate them. I also have faith and that gives me a cover for my christian belief. I have seen juju at work and based on my own understanding I believe it is more of evil powers than good powers otherwise I would have delved into it to understand how it works.

If any of the experiences had been based on good things I would have checked it out by getting into it.

You cannot claim that juju does not exist and yet be asking for people to prove it for you.

Personally, if I can make a categorical statement that something does not exist then asking for proof would mean either of two things

1. I am not even convinced in my statement

or

2. I am simply stupid and confused

For example, if I tell you that I am a man (because I have penis) and you tell me that it is a lie and ask me to prove that I am a man by getting naked and displaying my penis do you think I will do so just to prove you wrong? Nope, I will ignore your position and request because they simply don't make sense.

Put differently, if you claim you have 15 heads on your shoulders and I state it is a lie. Do you think I will ask you to prove that you have 15 heads for monetary rewards? Nope, I won't do that because the issue does not exist since I have already made up my mind that it is impossible.

So, anyone that claims that juju does not exist and is still looking for proof is either confused, silly or both as you cannot belong to both sides of the divide at the same time.

ChinenyeN:

What of me, and our discussion?

@ChinenyeN,

I meant on this thread.

Our discussion on the other thread was very insightful. You didn't strike me as someone who believed in the fraudulent claims of juju proponent but as someone who believed that a few of those claims are possible. I'll say that the level of that debate was higher that what I'm seeing hear.

rickyblack stop sending me emails.