UnchangeableGod:
What do you mean by my conscience disturbing me? You made a carpet condemnation of all Pentecostal pastors and members and I decided to correct your wrong impression. Thank God you finally agree that God has real His followers. By His grace, I am one of them. You can join us. Thanks and may God bless you.

How do we know you are one of the real men of God? Let others speak for you not you speaking for yourself. All in all,God knows His people.

MadCow1:


It's "R.I.P" not RIP..

The former is the proper abbreviation for "Rest In Peace" and the latter means to tear something up.

Since we were in an English class I thought I should point that out.

Do not throw stones if you don't have arms.

madcow i don't have ur fucken time

Nofuckgiven:
I have known Father Edet to be a good man of God with special anointing in preaching the word of God. He is not the first priest to leave the Catholic church and he won't be the last. Since when is it a crime for a man to resign from priesthood and marry?? As long as he is no longer a priest, he can marry and live his life like any other normal man. As for the dolts saying trash about the Catholic church can you tell me why their population is still the highest even without seeking new members like most Pentecostal churches? Keep hating on the true and first church while chasing 'miracle' churches with pastorpreneurs!

THEIR POPULATION REMAINS HIGHEST BECAUSE THE DESTINY OF MULTITUDE IS ALWAYS IN A POPULAR WAY THAT LEADS TO DESTRUCTION.

emmalux2:



THEIR POPULATION REMAINS HIGHEST BECAUSE THE DESTINY OF MULTITUDE IS ALWAYS IN A POPULAR WAY THAT LEADS TO DESTRUCTION.

You have been noticed. Oya swerve

Nofuckgiven:

How do we know you are one of the real men of God? Let others speak for you not you speaking for yourself. All in all,God knows His people.

You are right. But no one in this forum knows me other than myself. But thank God you have realized that there are genuine Christians and real men of God. That suffices me. Thanks.

UnchangeableGod:
You are right. But no one in this forum knows me other than myself. But thank God you have realized that there are genuine Christians and real men of God. That suffices me. Thanks.

I don't know you Oga. Kindly stop quoting me. Bye

Nofuckgiven:

I don't know you Oga. Kindly stop quoting me. Bye

Finally, you can become one of us by repenting of your sins and surrendering your life to Christ. Then you look for a Bible believing Church where you will fellowship with other believers to know more about Christ and the will of God. Be prayerful and always study the Bible. You will grow in grace. As you continue in faith till the end, you will make heaven at the end of your life in Jesus' name, Amen.

701ecilana:

A Sis here, not a bro. lol

Forgive me. May God bless you and keep you in faith till the end I J N, beloved sister.

chipower:


The man in question didn't tell you that he left because of celibacy related wahala. like i said before, it is assumption. It is very unlikely he left cos of that. I said so because if he had wanted to marry he could've easily notified the church and they will give him go ahead to leave. There must be something that the Bishop told him told that he refused to do or something that he was doing that the Bishop told him to stop doing that he refused to stop doing . Don't be in a hurry soon the whole story will emerge. Sometimes some of these priests will refuse to go on tranfer when they are tranfered. Sometimes they are not prudent with money. When the Bishop tells them how to use fund, they will not follow instructions. Etc In your church, are pastors not taking orders from church authority on how to run the affairs the church. These orders might not be convenient for you sometimes but you must do it. That is obedience. If you refuse, it's called disobedience. Overseers do the same to pastors in their churches.
What do you mean by "in accordance with God's word." If you are tranfered and you refused to go, what has that to do with God's word. Was he told to go to okija shrine and become the chief priest there.

Again, i can see that you are not comfortable with celibacy in the Catholic church. This is not the topic of discussion but let me clear you on that. Nobody is forced into Catholic priesthood. You can't force an adult to do something that he doesn't want to do unless you have a gun on his head. It takes approximately 10 yrs to become a Catholic priest. So the person knows what he is entering into. During this time, you read will read philosophy and theology, you will go to apostolic work etc. All this time is enough for you to decide whether you will go on or not. Catholic priests don't marry cos the church doesn't want diversions of attention. And it's working well for them. It's our standard, simple. it's biblical. Some churches don't allow women putting on trousers. I can't go there and tell them what to do. If you enter their churches with trousers they will throw you away. Some don't allow ear rings.

Finally, im not pained that he left. I commented cos he was trying to make it look as if the church forced him to leave. Cheap blackmail. I believe that he is the one who pushed himself out due to disobedience.

You are not even sure of why exactly he left yet you are in a hurry to accuse and judge him of disobedience. You are just pained. Of course, the Catholic Church will likely come out with an explanation and I don't expect their story to favour the man who left their fold. Then you can run with that. I pray that more peoples' eyes will be opened to the truth, the clergy and laity alike in Jesus' name, Amen.

UnchangeableGod:
Forgive me. May God bless you and keep you in faith till the end I J N, beloved sister.

Amen. May God bless and preserve us until His appearing.

UnchangeableGod:
Yes, because you are yet alive in the flesh. Once you die, you can no longer pray for anybody. Thanks.

People in heaven are not dead to us, spiritually. We say they are departed.

UnchangeableGod:
You are not even sure of why exactly he left yet you are in a hurry to accuse and judge him of disobedience. You are just pained. Of course, the Catholic Church will likely come out with an explanation and I don't expect their story to favour the man who left their fold. Then you can run with that. I pray that more peoples' eyes will be opened to the truth, the clergy and laity alike in Jesus' name, Amen.

Bros, let me ask you a question. Are you pained when people leave your church? Are you trying to tell me that some people have not left your church. You sound like a person who can't handle rejection. I have seen people like that. Don't project your personality onto someone. I told you my real reason why i commented. And you can't prove otherwise.

Yes, i was not sure why he left and i admitted it. You also said it might be because he wanted to get married. Were you sure when you made that comment?

The main reason Father Edeth left was because he was about to be sent to residence. He didn't want to be removed from the position he was holding. In summary, he didn't want to be transferred. He might have other reasons but this was what brought about his exit. He felt being pushed around. Good for him, there are people like that. They don't want to be told what to do. Tell me how this is not disobedience. I agree with him on this one, he is free from being told what to do by the church authority. I wish well.

You said that the Catholic Church will come out with fake reasons. Why is it that Rev Edeth refused to tell the exact story behind his exit? Did you notice that he refused to mention exactly what transpired before he left. Im still waiting for him to reveal it. Is he afraid? My answer is 'No'. He is a free man now , remember.

I discovered that you avoid my questions in your replies. Let me repeat my question again. In your church does your pastors disobey instructions from your church authority? Do your pastors do what they like in your church? Pls answer me.

On the issue of your eyes being closed or open. The problem with this position is that the people who left your church will also accuse you of your eyes being closed.They will also pray that the eyes of pastors and other members of your church will open. Thanks

chipower:


Bros, let me ask you a question. Are you pained when people leave your church? Are you trying to tell me that some people have not left your church. You sound like a person who can't handle rejection. I have seen people like that. Don't project your personality onto someone. I told you my real reason why i commented. And you can't prove otherwise.

Yes, i was not sure why he left and i admitted it. You also said it might be because he wanted to get married. Were you sure when you made that comment?

The main reason Father Edeth left was because he was about to be sent to residence. He didn't want to be removed from the position he was holding. In summary, he didn't want to be transferred. He might have other reasons but this was what brought about his exit. He felt being pushed around. Good for him, there are people like that. They don't want to be told what to do. Tell me how this is not disobedience. I agree with him on this one, he is free from being told what to do by the church authority. I wish well.

You said that the Catholic Church will come out with fake reasons. Why is it that Rev Edeth refused to tell the exact story behind his exit? Did you notice that he refused to mention exactly what transpired before he left. Im still waiting for him to reveal it. Is he afraid? My answer is 'No'. He is a free man now , remember.

I discovered that you avoid my questions in your replies. Let me repeat my question again. In your church does your pastors disobey instructions from your church authority? Do your pastors do what they like in your church? Pls answer me.

On the issue of your eyes being closed or open. The problem with this position is that the people who left your church will also accuse you of your eyes being closed.They will also pray that the eyes of pastors and other members of your church will open. Thanks

I did not say he left in order to get married. It is what a lot of people especially those who are not happy that he left the Catholic Church were insinuating. I only said if that is indeed true, then he is not wrong, biblically speaking. Well, you must be an authority in the Catholic Church to be so sure of the reason he left even when the Church is s yet to come out with am official position. I did not say the Catholic Church will come out with fake reasons as you accused me of saying. I only said I was sure their reason(s) will definitely not be in favour of the priest who left the Church especially considering the circumstances and I was so sure you will be happy to hear bad news about him whether true or not from your mindset and comments so far. If people have good reasons (or reasons best known to them) to leave the Church where I worship, there is no big deal. It is against the Scriptures for me to slander or blackmail them for that.Thanks.

701ecilana:

Amen. May God bless and preserve us until His appearing.

Amen.

9inches:


People in heaven are not dead to us, spiritually. We say they are departed.

Yes, I said that earlier. My point is that it is not biblical to ask any dead or departed saint to pray for you. It is only the living saints that can do that. It is only Christ Jesus, Who is our Eternal Priest, Who ever liveth to make intercession for us, ditto the Holy Spirit (Hebrews 7:24,25; Romans 8:26,27). So stop wasting your time disturbing Mary and other departed saints to pray for you. I stand to be corrected with biblical verses where a departed saint prayed for or was requested to pray for the living. Thanks.

UnchangeableGod:
I did not say he left in order to get married. It is what a lot of people especially those who are not happy that he left the Catholic Church were insinuating. I only said if that is indeed true, then he is not wrong, biblically speaking. Well, you must be an authority in the Catholic Church to be so sure of the reason he left even when the Church is s yet to come out with am official position. I did not say the Catholic Church will come out with fake reasons as you accused me of saying. I only said I was sure their reason(s) will definitely not be in favour of the priest who left the Church especially considering the circumstances and I was so sure you will be happy to hear bad news about him whether true or not from your mindset and comments so far. If people have good reasons (or reasons best known to them) to leave the Church where I worship, there is no big deal. It is against the Scriptures for me to slander or blackmail them for that.Thanks.

I did not say that you said you were sure he left because of celibacy. I used' might ' which is under probability . You used 'may be' which is also under probability, so i think i quoted you correctly. Go back to your comment and correct me if I'm wrong.

Must i be an authority in the Catholic church to know what is going in my church? The same goes with you, must you be an authority in your church to know what is going on in your church? The only thing someone needs is to get the information from the right source. I'm very close to the church i know how to get my info.

Whether the reasons favour him or not is not important at this point cos i have given you the reason. I have told you the last incident that took place that made him to leave. Don't get me wrong, his reasons are logical. He doesn't want to take orders from the church authority anymore. He has had enough. That's fine with me but trying to talk as if he was forced to become a priest is what is called preposterous pretence.

If he is free now, who kept him in bondage before now. He entered seminary without coercion, spent average of 10yrs to become a priest on his own free will only to come out and start talking as if he was forced to become a Catholic priest.

Take for example, if i approach your church to become a pastor in your church , you now walk me through the rules and regulations of your church, and i accepted. After being a pastor, the church authority tells me to leave the thing that im doing and go to somewhere else to serve. Instead of going there, i will start telling them that they are not giving me free hand to operate. I start accusing them of keeping me in bondage cos I'm not having my way. After that i will go to a tv channel and annouce that im free now, free from all human directives. That to me is a smart way of being disobedient.

You said that i will be happy to hear bad news about him. No sir, im not that kind of person. Again, i think you are projecting your personality on me. I have been consistent with my point, that he is disobidient. That's all. He didn't offend me in anyway so why wish him evil. The problem with Christians these day is that they wish one another evil. They hardly pray for people outside their churches who are need. They don't even help people outside their respective churches who are in need. How sad. Perhaps you might think i wish bad too. Very sad indeed.

I didn't slander anyone. I said that he disobeyed people in authority. At least I'm entitled to my own opinion. Thanks

chipower:


I did not say that you said you were sure he left because of celibacy. I used' might ' which is under probability . You used 'may be' which is also under probability, so i think i quoted you correctly. Go back to your comment and correct me if I'm wrong.

Must i be an authority in the Catholic church to know what is going in my church? The same goes with you, must you be an authority in your church to know what is going on in your church? The only thing someone needs is to get the information from the right source. I'm very close to the church i know how to get my info.

Whether the reasons favour him or not is not important at this point cos i have given you the reason. I have told you the last incident that took place that made him to leave. Don't get me wrong, his reasons are logical. He doesn't want to take orders from the church authority anymore. He has had enough. That's fine with me but trying to talk as if he was forced to become a priest is what is called preposterous pretence.

If he is free now, who kept him in bondage before now. He entered seminary without coercion, spent average of 10yrs to become a priest on his own free will only to come out and start talking as if he was forced to become a Catholic priest.

Take for example, if i approach your church to become a pastor in your church , you now walk me through the rules and regulations of your church, and i accepted. After being a pastor, the church authority tells me to leave the thing that im doing and go to somewhere else to serve. Instead of going there, i will start telling them that they are not giving me free hand to operate. I start accusing them of keeping me in bondage cos I'm not having my way. After that i will go to a tv channel and annouce that im free now, free from all human directives. That to me is a smart way of being disobedient.

You said that i will be happy to hear bad news about him. No sir, im not that kind of person. Again, i think you are projecting your personality on me. I have been consistent with my point, that he is disobidient. That's all. He didn't offend me in anyway so why wish him evil. The problem with Christians these day is that they wish one another evil. They hardly pray for people outside their churches who are need. They don't even help people outside their respective churches who are in need. How sad. Perhaps you might think i wish bad too. Very sad indeed.

I didn't slander anyone. I said that he disobeyed people in authority. At least I'm entitled to my own opinion. Thanks

You got your information that he was being 'disobedient' and you believe your informant must be dead right, don't you? I never said anyone forced him to become a priest. Not at all. All I am saying is that as he entered the priesthood by his own free will, he can opt out by his own free will as well. the length of his seminary and priesthood notwithstanding. What do you mean by me accusing you of wishing him evil? I don't know where you dug that out from. Certainly that is not what I mean. What I mean is that having pronounced him guilty of disobedience, you will surely be delighted once the Church comes out with a position that aligns with yours 'vindicating' you. I am not one of those who wish people evil because it is a sin to do so. Praying that the eyes of people should be opened so that they will know the truth and be free from error and eventual eternal damnation is not wishing people or a denomination evil. God knows and He is the Perfect Judge of our actions and motives. A pastor is under obligation to obey his superior pastors. However, there are times when a superior can be wrong while a lieutenant can be right. If the junior officer cannot convince his boss, I think his best bet will then be to throw in the trowel ie resign honourably without any acrimony or fuss. God will approve of such an action.The bottom-line is this - let the man be.

UnchangeableGod:
You got your information that he was being 'disobedient' and you believe your informant must be dead right, don't you? I never said anyone forced him to become a priest. Not at all. All I am saying is that as he entered the priesthood by his own free will, he can opt out by his own free will as well. the length of his seminary and priesthood notwithstanding. What do you mean by me accusing you of wishing him evil? I don't know where you dug that out from. Certainly that is not what I mean. What I mean is that having pronounced him guilty of disobedience, you will surely be delighted once the Church comes out with a position that aligns with yours 'vindicating' you. I am not one of those who wish people evil because it is a sin to do so. Praying that the eyes of people should be opened so that they will know the truth and be free from error and eventual eternal damnation is not wishing people or a denomination evil. God knows and He is the Perfect Judge of our actions and motives. A pastor is under obligation to obey his superior pastors. However, there are times when a superior can be wrong while a lieutenant can be right. If the junior officer cannot convince his boss, I think his best bet will then be to throw in the trowel ie resign honourably without any acrimony or fuss. God will approve of such an action.The bottom-line is this - let the man be.

Bros, as i said before, i got my info from the right source. I trust the info . In your church, you know how to get information if you need one. Are you saying i shouldn't trust the information from my church. Don't you trust the information from your church? Like i said before i wonder why Rev Edeth refused to say or write in details what transpired before his exit.

My point is simple. You said he entered on his own free will and left on his own free will. Agreed, good point but he was talking as if the church chained him all along. He was the one who chained himself by becoming a priest and promising to obey the church authority so he should not blame anyone. Do you get the logic?

At this point, i would like to quote you using your exact words . You said "and I was so sure you will be happy to hear bad news about him whether true or not from your mindset and comments so far." As far as im concerned what you said is that it would give me joy if i receive bad news about him whether the news is false or true. It might be on this matter or other matters. You didn't specify. This simply implies im not wishing him well but i still welcome your clarification. English is not our first language. I'm not at all perfect in it.

Thank you for concurring that we should obey our superiors. What is wrong in transferring someone? What is wrong in assigning another duty to someone? Must we do only the things that we like to do? Must everything go the way we want it to go? Others are being transferred why would he be afraid of it. My uncle was sent to a village in Malawi for missionary work. He spent ten years there. When we heard the news, some of us were unhappy but he came home and gathered us together and addressed us. I will never forget what he said that day. He said " like the apostles, Jesus is sending me to Malawi to win souls for him. Pray for me so that God will help me to accomplish the task. where you are sent doesn't matter but what matters is how many souls you were able to win......... " I will never in my life forget those words. This is a man who is ready to serve God. He didn't fight the Bishop for removing him from his comfort zone. He obeyed. If my uncle had refused, he would have been induging in disobedience. Father Edeth refused the task assigned to him so he guilty of disobedience. Is as simple as that.

I'm not disturbing Rev Edeth. I don't even know where he is now. All of us are here to express our opinions on matters like this and possibly learn one or two things from one another. Thanks

chipower:


Bros, as i said before, i got my info from the right source. I trust the info . In your church, you know how to get information if you need one. Are you saying i shouldn't trust the information from my church. Don't you trust the information from your church? Like i said before i wonder why Rev Edeth refused to say or write in details what transpired before his exit.

My point is simple. You said he entered on his own free will and left on his own free will. Agreed, good point but he was talking as if the church chained him all along. He was the one who chained himself by becoming a priest and promising to obey the church authority so he should not blame anyone. Do you get the logic?

At this point, i would like to quote you using your exact words . You said "and I was so sure you will be happy to hear bad news about him whether true or not from your mindset and comments so far." As far as im concerned what you said is that it would give me joy if i receive bad news about him whether the news is false or true. It might be on this matter or other matters. You didn't specify. This simply implies im not wishing him well but i still welcome your clarification. English is not our first language. I'm not at all perfect in it.

Thank you for concurring that we should obey our superiors. What is wrong in transferring someone? What is wrong in assigning another duty to someone? Must we do only the things that we like to do? Must everything go the way we want it to go? Others are being transferred why would he be afraid of it. My uncle was sent to a village in Malawi for missionary work. He spent ten years there. When we heard the news, some of us were unhappy but he came home and gathered us together and addressed us. I will never forget what he said that day. He said " like the apostles, Jesus is sending me to Malawi to win souls for him. Pray for me so that God will help me to accomplish the task. where you are sent doesn't matter but what matters is how many souls you were able to win......... " I will never in my life forget those words. This is a man who is ready to serve God. He didn't fight the Bishop for removing him from his comfort zone. He obeyed. If my uncle had refused, he would have been induging in disobedience. Father Edeth refused the task assigned to him so he guilty of disobedience. Is as simple as that.

I'm not disturbing Rev Edeth. I don't even know where he is now. All of us are here to express our opinions on matters like this and possibly learn one or two things from one another. Thanks

OK if you are rocket sure that your unofficial gossip-based information about him refusing transfer is correct and not based on animosity to blackmail, then let us accept he disobeyed his superiors. But you should understand that not all disobedience to man equals disobedience to God. What if God did not sanction his brand of priesthood which has been done away with in the New Covenant established on better promises? (Hebrews 7:1-28; 8:1-13; 9:1-28) What if he entered this outdated Old Testament brand of priesthood in ignorance and later realized it? What if he had an encounter that drastically changed his perception about ministry? What if he has finally been convicted about the truth having read the Bible over and over? What if and what if?.........There may just be something you and I don't know about his exit. Let God be his judge. Thanks.

UnchangeableGod:
OK if you are rocket sure that your unofficial gossip-based information about him refusing transfer is correct and not based on animosity to blackmail, then let us accept he disobeyed his superiors. But you should understand that not all disobedience to man equals disobedience to God. What if God did not sanction his brand of priesthood which has been done away with in the New Covenant established on better promises? (Hebrews 7:1-28; 8:1-13; 9:1-28) What if he entered this outdated Old Testament brand of priesthood in ignorance and later realized it? What if he had an encounter that drastically changed his perception about ministry? What if he has finally been convicted about the truth having read the Bible over and over? What if and what if?.........There may just be something you and I don't know about his exit. Let God be his judge. Thanks.

At least you have understood what I'm trying to point out. The fact is that he disobeyed the church authority. Of course, to him, he was sure that his disobedience was the right thing to do. That was why he did it. Is as simple as that.

Other things you pointed out might or might not be a factor in his exit. The only thing I'm sure of is the one that made him to leave. His final clash with church authority.

Mind you, the church is not judging him. Im not judging him. I just pointed out that he disobeyed his superiors. Sincerely i don't wish him bad. Thanks.

chipower:


At least you have understood what I'm trying to point out. The fact is that he disobeyed the church authority. Of course, to him, he was sure that his disobedience was the right thing to do. That was why he did it. Is as simple as that.

Other things you pointed out might or might not be a factor in his exit. The only thing I'm sure of is the one that made him to leave. His final clash with church authority.

Mind you, the church is not judging him. Im not judging him. I just pointed out that he disobeyed his superiors. Sincerely i don't wish him bad. Thanks.

Are you sure you and your Church members have not been judging him (saying or implying that what he did amounts to sin) by your comments so far? Happy to learn that you do not wish him bad. May the Lord direct and guide him in the way he should go henceforth so that he will fulfill his ministry. May the Lord also help you and I to follow and do His will alone for our lives no matter what is popular and whatever others may say I J N, Amen. It is well. Thanks.

UnchangeableGod:
Was he a member of a cult?

Definition of a cult according to the dictionary


a system of religious beliefs and ritual;


Yeah he is a member of a cult called Christianity.

701ecilana:

Uben pls Stop summersaulting Scriptures nah. You are taking Scriptures right out of context hoping they would mean what you want them to mean. Chai bros.

There is no provision for resignation in the bible, infact the Church only allows it because she knows we are weak and doesn't wish to tie someone to an unpleasant situation, as such Church laws apply.×
Now, who says there's no room for resignation which can also be termed as backsliding? If there's no such room, the word backsliding wouldn't find it's way into the Scriptures.

Here are some folks resigning from discipleship;

From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?

John:6: 66-67

Do you just write simply to contradict me or is it that you misunderstood my post.

I repeat there is no provision for resignation in scriptures in fact john 6 which you reference is talking about backsliding not resignation.


Resignation involves removing yourself from the duties and obligation of a particular office. If i was an usher in my church and i was commission for another leadership role, I will resign from the office of usher and begin my new role, it doesn't mean i have backslided. I only resigned. As far as i can tell fr edet simply resigned from the duties and obligations of a Catholic priest, he did not backslide in fact he still exercise ministry through his fellowship.


So i repeat there is no provision in scriptures for resignation and backsliding isn't the same as resignation.



Be careful before you accuse someone of twisting scriptures.

The church is empowered to make such laws as matt 16 & 18 say "whatever you bind on earth is bound in heaven whatever you lose on earth is loosed in heaven" [/b]
This is not true and totally taken out of context.
What is Matt 16 & 18? What does it say?

Matt 16:18-19
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

This is what Christ is saying here. Peter, you have been given a revelation of who Christ truly is. This revelation empowers you to be as firm as a rock in your believe and work with me. With this kind of revelation a Church is built and no matter what happens you'd remain unshakable.

Base on this revelation you have, i will give to you the keys of the Kingdom of the kingdom of heaven, i will empower you with authority against the forces that will encroach on you trying to sniff out and destroy your faith in me.

The power to bind and loose here is against the gates of hell not against fellow believers in Christ. Its against Whatsoever constitutes the gate of hell which threatens the faith of a believer in Christ Jesus.

the disciples were encouraged that, as they moved forward in their apostolic duties, they would be fulfilling God’s plan in heaven. When the apostles “bound” something, or forbade it on earth, they were carrying out the will of God in the matter. When they “loosed” something, or allowed it on earth, they were likewise fulfilling God’s eternal plan.

What the above implies is that, Satan will orchestrate scheme and devices against the church, but they have the right to say no or allow it happen.
Whatever they allow will stand, whatever they forbade heaven will back them up and stop it.

Pls let's teach truths and loose people from satanic bondages.

No man is held down against his wish to serve Christ. It's a personal resolve. If you want out, then out you go.
Any man or men who compel others to remain under them using the name of Christ, is against Christ.

Jeaus says 'Whosoever is hungery, whosoever is thirsty let him come'. It's a completely free willed choice we choose to make. It's an invitation to the ones interested and if you come but chooses to turn back, you are free.

Scriptures never empowered anyone or any organization to do what Christ did not do.

here again your bolded only proves my point that the Church has power to allow or sir allow.

UnchangeableGod:
Yes, I said that earlier. My point is that it is not biblical to ask any dead or departed saint to pray for you. It is only the living saints that can do that. It is only Christ Jesus, Who is our Eternal Priest, Who ever liveth to make intercession for us, ditto the Holy Spirit (Hebrews 7:24,25; Romans 8:26,27). So stop wasting your time disturbing Mary and other departed saints to pray for you. I stand to be corrected with biblical verses where a departed saint prayed for or was requested to pray for the living. Thanks.

The reason we pray to the saints is that they are still members of the Body of Christ. The life which Christ gives is eternal life. Therefore, every Christian who has died in Christ is forever a member of the Body of Christ. This is the doctrine which we call the Communion of the Saints. Everyone in Christ, whether living or dead, belongs to the Body of Christ.

The Bible encourages Christians to approach the saints in heaven, just as they approach God the Father and Jesus Christ the Lord:

(Heb. 12:22-24) "But you have approached Mount Zion, the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and myriads of angels, and the assembly and church of the firstborn who have been enrolled in heaven, and God the judge of all, and spirits of righteous ones who have been made perfect, and Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and the sprinkled blood which speaks better than that of Abel".

The Bible says we should approach the saints with our prayers:

John (in Revelation 5:8 ) saw the Lamb, Christ Jesus on a throne in the midst of four beasts and 24 elders. When the Lamb took the book with the seven seals, the 24 elders fell down before the Lamb in worship, "each one having a harp and golden bowls of incenses, which are the prayers of the saints."

Similarly, (in Revelation 8:3-4) when the Lamb opened the seventh seal of the book, "Another angel came and stood on the altar, having a golden censer, and many incenses were given to him, in order that he will give it with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne. And the smoke of the incenses went up with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God."

UnchangeableGod:
Are you sure you and your Church members have not been judging him (saying or implying that what he did amounts to sin) by your comments so far? Happy to learn that you do not wish him bad. May the Lord direct and guide him in the way he should go henceforth so that he will fulfill his ministry. May the Lord also help you and I to follow and do His will alone for our lives no matter what is popular and whatever others may say I J N, Amen. It is well. Thanks.

Well I'm sure, i have not judged him and so far the church has not judged him. Forming an opinion about an issue is not judgement. For example, i cannot accuse you of judging the Catholic Church cos of some of the opinions you have formed about the Catholic church. To do that will be childish of me. In a dialogue /debate the two opposing sides must have their opinions about the topic that is being discussed.

Bros, for example, i can't assume because you have a negative opinion of my actions therefore you must hate me. That should, again, amount to being childish. I hope you understand me. Again, I wish him well. The same goes with you too.

As for your prayer, i say Amen. Remain blessed

chipower:


Well I'm sure, i have not judged him and so far the church has not judged him. Forming an opinion about an issue is not judgement. For example, i cannot accuse you of judging the Catholic Church cos of some of the opinions you have formed about the Catholic church. To do that will be childish of me. In a dialogue /debate the two opposing sides must have their opinions about the topic that is being discussed.

Bros, for example, i can't assume because you have a negative opinion of my actions therefore you must hate me. That should, again, amount to being childish. I hope you understand me. Again, I wish him well. The same goes with you too.

As for your prayer, i say Amen. Remain blessed

Ok. Judgment belongs to God. He is the perfect Judge. Remain blessed as well.

9inches:


The reason we pray to the saints is that they are still members of the Body of Christ. The life which Christ gives is eternal life. Therefore, every Christian who has died in Christ is forever a member of the Body of Christ. This is the doctrine which we call the Communion of the Saints. Everyone in Christ, whether living or dead, belongs to the Body of Christ.

The Bible encourages Christians to approach the saints in heaven, just as they approach God the Father and Jesus Christ the Lord:

(Heb. 12:22-24) "But you have approached Mount Zion, the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and myriads of angels, and the assembly and church of the firstborn who have been enrolled in heaven, and God the judge of all, and spirits of righteous ones who have been made perfect, and Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and the sprinkled blood which speaks better than that of Abel".

The Bible says we should approach the saints with our prayers:

John (in Revelation 5:8 ) saw the Lamb, Christ Jesus on a throne in the midst of four beasts and 24 elders. When the Lamb took the book with the seven seals, the 24 elders fell down before the Lamb in worship, "each one having a harp and golden bowls of incenses, which are the prayers of the saints."

Similarly, (in Revelation 8:3-4) when the Lamb opened the seventh seal of the book, "Another angel came and stood on the altar, having a golden censer, and many incenses were given to him, in order that he will give it with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne. And the smoke of the incenses went up with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God."

Sir, you are so wrong. The Bible NEVER asked any believer in Christ to approach the dead or departed saints with our prayers. NEVER! Hebrews Chspter 12:22-24 which you quoted is talking about believers (saints that are still alive) sharing same experience and privilege with the departed saints, angels and heavenly beings - a privilege the Old Testament saints did not enjoy (if you read the whole Chapter). It has nothing do to with praying with or through departed saints. The prayers of saints mentioned in Revelation refers to your prayers and mine (those who are born again and living right). Departed saints are not inferred either directly or indirectly where you quoted. In fact, departed saints are just resting from their labours as their rewards follow them (Revelation 14:13). It appears that some people have been indoctrinated to believe that anytime saints are mentioned, it must be the dead. Before one can become a dead saint, he or she must have been a saint while alive. The prayers of living saints are ascending to the Throne of God, working wonders and will yet do. Praise the Lord if you are a saint by His mercy and grace, Alleluia! Thanks.

Ubenedictus:







Definition of a cult according to the dictionary



a system of religious beliefs and ritual;



Yeah he is a member of a cult called Christianity.

I am a Christian by the grace of God and I don't belong to any cult. A cult in the context of my question is a clandestine group that do heinous evil, perform sacrifices with human body, blood or destiny in order to be rich, powerful or influencial. Such a group have skeletons in their cupboard - embarrassing secrets that must NEVER be let out of the bag. Their rules are so sacred and membership is for life. As such, if any member violates their rules or decides to leave, such a one will be targeted and killed or rendered useless so that no outsider will know their secrets. In the light of this explanation, is the Catholic priesthood a cult?

If a Priest could say he was in bondage performing his priestly duties in church and to community, I wonder what the laity is in?

Now that he is free from the bondage of the church, I guess he has come to know the truth that makes free.

UnchangeableGod:
Sir, you are so wrong. The Bible NEVER asked any believer in Christ to approach the dead or departed saints with our prayers. NEVER! Hebrews Chspter 12:22-24 which you quoted is talking about believers (saints that are still alive) sharing same experience and privilege with the departed saints, angels and heavenly beings - a privilege the Old Testament saints did not enjoy (if you read the whole Chapter). It has nothing do to with praying with or through departed saints.

What sort of experience are they sharing, and if I tag it 'Communion of Saints', would you say I am wrong? If I am to apply your Sola Scriptura here, then tell me where the bible says only the saints on earth can pray for one another. Read also Matthew 18:10 and increase your knowledge on such connection between saints in heaven and on earth.

The prayers of saints mentioned in Revelation refers to your prayers and mine (those who are born again and living right). Departed saints are not inferred either directly or indirectly where you quoted. In fact, departed saints are just resting from their labours as their rewards follow them (Revelation 14:13). It appears that some people have been indoctrinated to believe that anytime saints are mentioned, it must be the dead. Before one can become a dead saint, he or she must have been a saint while alive.

There is nothing like a dead saint. It's a deliberate and preposterous formulation. Only if you would learn the theology that goes with Christianity. Such ignorance from pesticostals who are "experts" in interpreting the bible that was written and first taught by the Church's early Fathers centuries before the first schism; you can google search a lot of their teachings and commentaries (as early as 1st to 5th century) on the scriptures.

NB: The Bible does not claim to be the sole rule of faith. The doctrine of sola scriptura is itself unbiblical. Please show me where the Bible claims such a status for itself. Nowhere does the Bible say, "Scripture alone is sufficient" and nowhere does the bible imply it. Neither you nor your pastor, if you have one, has any authority over the bible as far as its interpretations go. Go figure who has such authority.

UnchangeableGod:
I am a Christian by the grace of God and I don't belong to any cult. A cult in the context of my question is a clandestine group that do heinous evil, perform sacrifices with human body, blood or destiny in order to be rich, powerful or influencial. Such a group have skeletons in their cupboard - embarrassing secrets that must NEVER be let out of the bag. Their rules are so sacred and membership is for life. As such, if any member violates their rules or decides to leave, such a one will be targeted and killed or rendered useless so that no outsider will know their secrets. In the light of this explanation, is the Catholic priesthood a cult?

Sorry you seem ignorant of the fact that there is more than one meaning for a word.






Definition of a cult according to the dictionary
a system of religious beliefs and ritual;




By this definition Christianity is a cult whether you like the term or not.