T9ksy:

@mens dept. pls can u expantiate on your last post. what do u mean by "unfinished greatness of Fajuyi and Macaulay? FYI, Macaulay started the first political party in the country, circa 1925. it was a yoruba party before zik came along and destroyed it only to then form NCNC in the mid-40's, which was basically an igbo party with few yorubas. Fajuyi on the other hand chosed to die with his host and boss, an igbo man during the july '67 revenge coup by murtala, danjuma, Ibb and co. This is no attempt at revisionism, i have facts to buttress my claim.

So far your "facts" are inaccurate, and I'm afraid to see any further ones from you. How can you say NCNC was an Igbo party with "a few Yorubas". If that WAS true, then were those "few Yorubas" idiots?

NCNC was formed primarily from the then meeting(s) of Nigerian Union of Students, and became Naija's first political party. Macaulay was elected it's first national president and held the post until he took ill and passed. Among it's chief members and supporters were Council of Ijebu National Societies, Yaba Estate Social Club, Ila Patriotic Union, Akure Federal Union, Council of Ijesha Societies, and Ekiti Parapo Society, so a "few Yorubas" eh?

There is no doubt that he had a greater vision and performed immensely for both the area of Lagos and Nigeria as a whole, when compared to a Tribalist and opportunist like AWOLOWO. The same goes for the award winning, disciplined, dedicated, and Pro-Nigerian Fajuyi

Quote from Tksy:

Do u want a yorubaman to tell how to run your affairs in enugu?

The point is that when Ziks NCNC won that election in the Western Region, he was voted in by who? By the Yorubas, only to be denied his mandate. Who knows how developed the Yorubaland would have been today if Zik had ruled it. The votes and wishes of the comon Yorubaman eventualy counted for nothing.

The last post was addressed to T9ksy, not Tksy.

@ seanet,
You don't sound very bright , even with all your vaunted education. Instead of whinning about Komando's posts why don't you retake the thread from Bkbabe( a Kalabari) and make it respectable. WAEC dropout.

mens dept:

There is no doubt that he had a greater vision and performed immensely for both the area of Lagos and Nigeria as a whole, when compared to a Tribalist and opportunist like AWOLOWO. The same goes for the award winning, disciplined, dedicated, and Pro-Nigerian Fajuyi

1. So you are Igbo afterall. Mr. Komando had suggested the Yorubas sent you to derail the "Extent of Alaigbo" thread, but you were "walked out". You are no longer Igbo because you raised a point of objection to anything labeled Igbo

2. I am not sure who you refer to as having greater vision than Awo, but I think it is Zik. The problem is that all you want to talk about is how Zik was winning election in the West and claim that Awo introduced tribalism. It seems from what you wrote above that NCNC was founded by a Yoruba man, but when Zik took over it got converted to an Igbo party, not that it did not have Yoruba members, but they were relegated - everything was labeled Igbo. The question that is most relevant is what had Zik done as a party-man for Yorubas. Why would the Yorubas not follow someone who promised them a better deal, the great man Awo. His vision, which was overwhelmingly acknowledged, convinced Yoruba people that he was the right leader - and Yorubas were right to follow his vision. His accomplishments as a politician REMAINS UNRIVALED to this day. Yorubas are looking to the likes of Fashola for another golden age of vision. If Yorubas were simply Obasanjo would simply have had to say his name to get votes. He didn't because he was a bit short on vision, though a great pragmatist.

3. This is related in a coincidental way to (1)&(2). Unless someone allows an Igbo man to do what he wants or supports the Igbo in any way, it doesn't matter what, he is either a tribalist, coward, dog, etc. Fajuyi is all you mentioned in your view not because of those achievements, but because he chose to die with Ironsi - that is the begining and end of it for you. It is good of you to acknowledge his bravery today, but in your next breath you will declare all Yorubas to be cowards. Ah! If Fajuyi were alive today he would acknowledge Awolowo as the greater of the two, although he was great in his own right. Awo became a tribalist in your view because he stopped claims to rulership without accomplishements that was going to be pushed on his people. Today you NL Igbos claim you respect northerners because, to quote one of you, "if they tell you they are going to kill you, then they will kill you ". In reality, you are just scared of them! In your messed up psyche you love the Northerners because they are "strong", and hate the Yorubas because they are "cowards". You guys need to read up on "Stockholm Syndrome" beofre you come to here NL to expose your damaged psyche.

komando.:

@ seanet,
You don't sound very bright , even with all your vaunted education. Instead of whinning about Komando's posts why don't you retake the thread from Bkbabe( a Kalabari) and make it respectable. WAEC dropout.

Before you call out somebody's education on NL why don't you learn how to quote other people's posts properly - there is a quote button and an "insert quote" link on each message when you click reply.

Also, rather than write another post about an error in a previous post you could simply modify your original post.

You cannot dictate how I post my post.

Mensdept was misread, but now that we know him better, his a great fella. His is a proud son of Alaigbo, the hardworking tribe.

@ Koruji
NCNC was founded by
Zik. Go back and reread your secondary school government textbook.

koruji:

1. So you are Igbo afterall. Mr. Komando had suggested the Yorubas sent you to derail the "Extent of Alaigbo" thread, but you were "walked out". You are no longer Igbo because you raised a point of objection to anything labeled Igbo

2. I am not sure who you refer to as having greater vision than Awo, but I think it is Zik. The problem is that all you want to talk about is how Zik was winning election in the West and claim that Awo introduced tribalism. It seems from what you wrote above that NCNC was founded by a Yoruba man, but when Zik took over it got converted to an Igbo party, not that it did not have Yoruba members, but they were relegated - everything was labeled Igbo. The question that is most relevant is what had Zik done as a party-man for Yorubas. Why would the Yorubas not follow someone who promised them a better deal, the great man Awo. His vision, which was overwhelmingly acknowledged, convinced Yoruba people that he was the right leader - and Yorubas were right to follow his vision. His accomplishments as a politician REMAINS UNRIVALED to this day. Yorubas are looking to the likes of Fashola for another golden age of vision. If Yorubas were simply Obasanjo would simply have had to say his name to get votes. He didn't because he was a bit short on vision, though a great pragmatist.

3. This is related in a coincidental way to (1)&(2). Unless someone allows an Igbo man to do what he wants or supports the Igbo in any way, it doesn't matter what, he is either a tribalist, coward, dog, etc. Fajuyi is all you mentioned in your view not because of those achievements, but because he chose to die with Ironsi - that is the begining and end of it for you. It is good of you to acknowledge his bravery today, but in your next breath you will declare all Yorubas to be cowards. Ah! If Fajuyi were alive today he would acknowledge Awolowo as the greater of the two, although he was great in his own right. Awo became a tribalist in your view because he stopped claims to rulership without accomplishements that was going to be pushed on his people. Today you NL Igbos claim you respect northerners because, to quote one of you, "if they tell you they are going to kill you, then they will kill you ". In reality, you are just scared of them! In your messed up psyche you love the Northerners because they are "strong", and hate the Yorubas because they are "cowards". You guys need to read up on "Stockholm Syndrome" beofre you come to here NL to expose your damaged psyche.

Yorubas don't go on a regular rampage and slit their neighbours throats, that is why we are cowards in the warped minds of these fools.
You just have to shake your head when you read some of the things written by these people.

Aigbofa:


Yorubas don't go on a regular rampage and slit their neighbours throats, that is why we are cowards in the warped minds of these fools.
You just have to shake your head when you read some of the things written by these people.

Killing and maiming human beings are part of Yeruba culture, which is depicted in GBOMOGBOMO;however, you ngbatimen do not slit your neighbours throats because they are more sophisticated than you wimps.

MetalGong4:

Killing and maiming human beings are part of Yeruba culture, which is depicted in GBOMOGBOMO;however, you ngbatimen do not slit your neighbours throats because they are more sophisticated than you wimps.

Not sophisticated enough to get their throats slit by "brave" northerners though. Ingrates!!

Aigbofa:

Not sophisticated enough to get their throats slit by "brave" northerners though. Ingrates!!

Thats why ngbatimen are born wimps; always pretend as if nothing bad happened to their peeps so as to avoid provoking their Northern masters.
You guys never dare to raise voice against your northern masters, even when it is quite glaring that Yoruba peeps form a large proportion of those killed whenever there is a religious violence in the North. . . . . .

koruji:

1. So you are Igbo afterall. Mr. Komando had suggested the Yorubas sent you to derail the "Extent of Alaigbo" thread, but you were "walked out". You are no longer Igbo because you raised a point of objection to anything labeled Igbo

2. I am not sure who you refer to as having greater vision than Awo, but I think it is Zik. The problem is that all you want to talk about is how Zik was winning election in the West and claim that Awo introduced tribalism. It seems from what you wrote above that NCNC was founded by a Yoruba man, but when Zik took over it got converted to an Igbo party, not that it did not have Yoruba members, but they were relegated - everything was labeled Igbo. The question that is most relevant is what had Zik done as a party-man for Yorubas. Why would the Yorubas not follow someone who promised them a better deal, the great man Awo. His vision, which was overwhelmingly acknowledged, convinced Yoruba people that he was the right leader - and Yorubas were right to follow his vision. His accomplishments as a politician REMAINS UNRIVALED to this day. Yorubas are looking to the likes of Fashola for another golden age of vision. If Yorubas were simply Obasanjo would simply have had to say his name to get votes. He didn't because he was a bit short on vision, though a great pragmatist.

3. This is related in a coincidental way to (1)&(2). Unless someone allows an Igbo man to do what he wants or supports the Igbo in any way, it doesn't matter what, he is either a tribalist, coward, dog, etc. Fajuyi is all you mentioned in your view not because of those achievements, but because he chose to die with Ironsi - that is the begining and end of it for you. It is good of you to acknowledge his bravery today, but in your next breath you will declare all Yorubas to be cowards. Ah! If Fajuyi were alive today he would acknowledge Awolowo as the greater of the two, although he was great in his own right. Awo became a tribalist in your view because he stopped claims to rulership without accomplishements that was going to be pushed on his people. Today you NL Igbos claim you respect northerners because, to quote one of you, "if they tell you they are going to kill you, then they will kill you ". In reality, you are just scared of them! In your messed up psyche you love the Northerners because they are "strong", and hate the Yorubas because they are "cowards". You guys need to read up on "Stockholm Syndrome" beofre you come to here NL to expose your damaged psyche.

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please clap for yourself 

That so-called thread, "The true Extent of Igboland" I found to be silly, find many Igbo to be silly, just like the current thread on "The Unfinished Greatness of Pa Awo", again the silliest.

If you really want to know, I could be Igbo, with a Yoruba mummy, along with a  Ijaw half-broda with a Tiv uncle, etc., so that cheap attempt to discredit what I wrote  doesn't work.

I could care less for Zik, Awo, and Bello. Compared to GREAT men and women in history, all I could ascribe to them is that "they tried", which often isn't good enough to be considered great. Yet, since we are talking about so-called great vision, putting Awo's name in that arena is very questionable.

Why some Nigerians like to use the word "take over" is pathetic. Perhaps we all have been militarized eh'. In those days, Zik and co won elections and did not "TAKE OVER" parties, until AWO introduced rigging and tribalism on a large scale. Where and what did Awolowo win? Did he not serve in an illegal regime featuring murders and dictators?

Fajuyi was in power long enough to comment on Awo, and I'm glad he never applauded the tribal chief. Same goes if Macaulay was alive in 1968.

And please, how can you put Fashola in the AG network in today's Naija?

komando.:

You cannot dictate how I post my post.
Mensdept was misread, but now that we know him better, his a great fella. His is a proud son of Alaigbo, the hardworking tribe.

Go sit down somewhere - you are the one who considered yourself all in all enough to call out somebody as "not too bright". I have being reading your posts that way for days - so you are welcome to write your post as you see fit. Just know that you are doing it wrong

Clapping for myself loudly!!!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, no one is trying to discredit your post - just pointing out the fact that NL Igbos (note my careful use of NL) see any objection to anything Igbo as making you non-Igbo - it is the NL Igbo collective to use a Start-Trek term.

Yes, you could be Igbo or any other mixture, which proves the point that using tribe as a yardstick in anything, while common, is really nonsensical. In any case, Komando has declared that you are a true son of Alaigbo.

The contradiction I pointed out earlier is still in your reply. You said Awolowo served in an illegal regime, but you pulled up Fajuyi as example of greatness. Ah ah! Ironsi & Fajuyi WERE ARROWHEADS OF AN ILLEGAL REGIME.

You guys keep contradicting each other. Komando, not koruji, wrote that Herbert Macaulay founded NCNC. Here are two accounts about Macaulay's parties: "Macaulay became very popular and on June 24, 1923, he founded the Nigerian National Democratic Party (NNDP), the first Nigerian political party. The party won all the seats in the elections of 1923, 1928 and 1933. In 1944 Macaulay founded the National Council of Nigeria and the Cameroons (NCNC) together with Nnamdi Azikiwe [6] and became its secretary general. The NCNC was a patriotic organization designed to bring together Nigerians of all stripes to demand independence.[7] In 1946 Macaulay fell ill in Kano and later died in Lagos. The leadership of the NCNC went to Azikiwe, who later became the first president of Nigeria." Anyone that reads what you guys write here on NL would never realize that NCNC was not directly founded by Zik, since all the statements are "Zik won seats", not "NCNC won seats". The fact was that Awo's party outlined a better vision for the Yorubas than any other party. Today, PDPD is the unquestionable national party, but they are again short on vision, hence Lagos is under the control of ACN and doing better than most. The same thing goes for other regions - it doesn't make them tribalists.

I am not putting Fashola in the mode of AG, but in the mode of developmental vision shown by Awo.

mens dept:

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please clap for yourself 

That so-called thread, "The true Extent of Igboland" I found to be silly, find many Igbo to be silly, just like the current thread on "The Unfinished Greatness of Pa Awo", again the silliest.

If you really want to know, I could be Igbo, with a Yoruba mummy, along with a  Ijaw half-broda with a Tiv uncle, etc., so that cheap attempt to discredit what I wrote  doesn't work.

I could care less for Zik, Awo, and Bello. Compared to GREAT men and women in history, all I could ascribe to them is that "they tried", which often isn't good enough to be considered great. Yet, since we are talking about so-called great vision, putting Awo's name in that arena is very questionable.

Why some Nigerians like to use the word "take over" is pathetic. Perhaps we all have been militarized eh'. In those days, Zik and co won elections and did not "TAKE OVER" parties, until AWO introduced rigging and tribalism on a large scale. Where and what did Awolowo win? Did he not serve in an illegal regime featuring murders and dictators?

Fajuyi was in power long enough to comment on Awo, and I'm glad he never applauded the tribal chief. Same goes if Macaulay was alive in 1968.

And please, how can you put Fashola in the AG network in today's Naija?

You are correct in saying that Pa Awo outlined a better strategy for the West. But that strategy was one that cared less for Nigeria as a nation. You can't have that philosophy and turn around to chop money with Gowon at the so-called FEDERAL EXEC Council. It's like the Abia governor who today is PPA, then APGA, and currently PDP with possibility of going PPA again.

Was Awo a better leader for the West than Akintola or Fajuyi or anyone else?

You could make the same argument for Sarduana. Was he really better than Amino Kano?

Ironsi's regime was fair and not illegal, as the military toppled the govt before he and millions could count to three. Yet Awo, was one of the beneficiaries of what Ironsi "started".

NNDP was not Nigeria's first national party, it was NCNC. (For the record)

You are right on one point - no politician has ever, and will ever, be completely clean.

Fashola in Lagos has been accused of corruption, and I have no doubt that despite his better performance than most governors, some shady deals went down in Lagos - but there are no absolutes in politics. Heros are good for what we look up to them for, but if we dig deeper we will find some things that they said and did to be worthy of shame. That tells me that rather than pit one leader against the other or seek to tear down the good that any of them did in their lifetime we learn the lessons of their triumphs and their mistakes, and move on.

It has often been said that one man's hero is another man's villain. As such, trying to convince me that my hero, who may happen to be your villain, is a villain is completely fruitless, and vice versa. We only need to identify where our common interests are and don't let our individual interests tear that down.

If there is one thing Pa. Awo should not have done it was to go to the center as opposition - I'll rather he had continued his good works in the West and sent his assistants to the center for that purpose. In fact, it has been said that he was reluctant to do this, but was accused by some colleagues of not putting the West in the center of Nigerian politics - we now know where it all ended up. The same applies to those who can't manage their states today, but are complaining about the center. They need to combine whatever they get from the center with self-reliance to develop their part of the country. That is the only way to showcase their potential. Non-performers at the local or state level would always be non-performers at the center. Performers at the local or state level, may be performers at the center, but even that is not guarateed.

I have not read a complete history of this period - so may be you are right, but I wonder under which party Herbert Macauly won elections in those early years?

mens dept:

You are correct in saying that Pa Awo outlined a better strategy for the West. But that strategy was one that cared less for Nigeria as a nation. You can't have that philosophy and turn around to chop money with Gowon at the so-called FEDERAL EXEC Council. It's like the Abia governor who today is PPA, then APGA, and currently PDP with possibility of going PPA again.
Was Awo a better leader for the West than Akintola or Fajuyi or anyone else?
You could make the same argument for Sarduana. Was he really better than Amino Kano?
Ironsi's regime was fair and not illegal, as the military toppled the govt before he and millions could count to three. Yet Awo, was one of the beneficiaries of what Ironsi "started".
NNDP was not Nigeria's first national party, it was NCNC. (For the record)

MetalGong4:

Thats why ngbatimen are born wimps; always pretend as if nothing bad happened to their peeps so as to avoid provoking their Northern masters.
You guys never dare to raise voice against your northern masters, even when it is quite glaring that Yoruba peeps form a large proportion of those killed whenever there is a religious violence in the North. . . . . .

You live in a fantasy world. When you start to believe your own lies, there's very little anyone can do for you.

Aigbofa:


You live in a fantasy world. When you start to believe your own lies, there's very little anyone can do for you.

actually i dont know the problem with metalgong, he is a brainwashed Ndigbo flop,
he is no match for you

actually i dont know the problem with quote from seanet:  he is a brainwashed Ndigbo flop,he is no match for you.

Your mouth stinks so much I can perdieve the putrid odour from my screen. Please go brush it at once. What have you been sucking boy?

QUOTE FROM AIGBOFA
You live in a fantasy world. When you start to believe your own lies, there's very little anyone can do for you.

Fagg, go to bk, your master.

Adegoke penkelemesi was an antagonist of AWO ln Ibadan then and a strong member of NCNC.

supereagle:

Adegoke penkelemesi was an antagonist of AWO ln Ibadan then and a strong member of NCNC.

The way our people formulated words in those days was amazing; penkelemesi = peculiar mess

koruji:

The way our people formulated words in those days was amazing; penkelemesi = peculiar mess

He lived to attack Awo, He said that what AG did in the West then was penkelesi=peculiar mess.



No Igbo man will choose to die with his leader they way Fajuyi  died with Ironsi. If he did not die along with Ironsi, you know what they will be saying in the SE today.
General Adebayo also trained 3 of his children after the civil war to reduce the burden of caring for 8 children ironsi left behind on the wife.

If Azikwe had the vision of Awo , the East will be well developed than this.He more of personal interest . He teamed up with them to be a ceremonial president.

Awo was a brilliant man, a true leader

Ibime:

Awo was a brilliant man, a true leader

Yes, but without due regard to minorities in the then Western Nigeria.
That is one of his failures.

Andre Uweh:

Yes, but without due regard to minorities in the then Western Nigeria.
That is one of his failures.

Care to elucidate further.

Katsumoto:

Care to elucidate further.

While all his establishments were concentrated in Yorubaland, Warri, Sapele, Asaba, etc suffered severely.

T9ksy:

@komando,

like i said earlier, am a true yoruba man and am proud of my heritage. all i asked you is why does Zik an igbo man wants to rule Yorubaland? Was there no capable yorubaman in NCNC (assuming he did win the election which am not declaring here) that can do better? What does he know about the yorubas that made him believe he can do much to advance their interest in every sphere of the word? No one at the time believed in One nigeria then. The sardunna didn't mince his words about his opinion on the subject and neither did pa Awo, except Zik. Incidentally, why didn't zik campaign in the north? was it not the belief that the igbos were going to lord it over them that precipitated the "revenge" coup of 196, which culminated in the unnecessary and wasteful civil war ?

If the desire to have a yorubaman who understands my culture, history, laws, customs etc to take care of my affairs is tribalism in your lexicon, then yes am a tribalist. deal with it. I just don't want an igboman to tell me what to do in my own father's land, period. Do u want a yorubaman to tell how to run your affairs in enugu? I certainly don't think so. treat others as you want to be treated. No group has a monopoly on intelligence.

EXCELLENT POST! .

Andre Uweh:

While all his establishments were concentrated in Yorubaland, Warri, Sapele, Asaba, etc suffered severely.

I get the point you are trying to make but I don't think the places you mentioned were less developed than Akure, Abeokuta, Oyo or even Ijebu where Awo was from. During the period when their was agitation for a mid-western state, there were also agitations for Calabar-Ogoja-Rivers and Middle-belt states to be carved out of the Eastern and Northern regions respectively. Your guess is as good as mine about which state was created in that era. Why do you think the mid-western state was created while the two other states weren't.

Tewmuch

if you believe that then why are we one country?