@ Poster:

First off, I understand your frustration with naija. But also know that everywhere has its good and bad. Here's my take. If you said you were trying to migrate during the Clinton era, and pre-911, I would have actually encouraged you to give it a shot. But now, the patriot act has made things super difficult for immigrants and the shot economy has made it even harder. On a daily basis, people are losing their jobs and companies are folding.

I have been on F1 visa once, however this was back during the Clinton years where getting a job off campus was not difficult. Drawback is that with an F1, you are only allowed to work 20 hours (though I know people who do 40 hours). Ofcourse the jobs you will get will be non-professional jobs. Do you intend on feeding and sustaining your family working at the mall as a security guard or a sales associate at say, Macy's?

What do you then do after you finish school? Will you apply for a H1 visa? That is so damn hard to get in this economy and these visas are in limited issuance each year (I think about 55,000 but don't quote me). The thing about H1 is that you are bound to that employer, and they tend to take advantage of that by paying you and keeping you on a crappy salary! Trust me I know because I've been there. After my F1, I was LUCKY enough to find a company to sponsor my H1 but in the 6 years I worked for this Bluechip company, my salary didnt even go up by $3,000!!! In 6 whole years! When I got my greencard and left the company, do you know my salary jumped up by 100%?? Just to give you an idea of how I had been underpaid all the previous years?

If you told me you won the Visa lottery, I would say give it a shot, even though it would still be a challenge given the state of the economy. In my honest opinion, Yanks is NOT all that at ALL. And I am one who has spent the majority of my life abroad (was taken to England since age 2, moved to naija and lived for about 7 years, then came to Yanks). My mom likes to call Yanks "no man's land of America." She can't stand this place (Mom lives in Naija). Don't get me wrong, Yanks has it advantages. But to me, the only thing good about this place is (1) Good education (2) The exposure and work experience (3) Their blue passport, Omo if you come this country and get these three things, I say get the hell out, move back home and start making things happen. It's what I plan on doing.

Even with Naija's challenges (power supply, armed robbers, bad roads, etc), you are still around your own people. You don't have to deal with the ignorance of stereotypes, the racism etc. Very depressing place and it's every man for himself. Unless you are the inferior-complexed kind of person, you would feel lost here. I know I do and I feel relieved anytime I'm out and about and I run into say any of my naija brothers. People I can relate to.

All the best brother.

Send me a summary of your professional profile and I will be able to advise you. jerrybenchi@yahoo.com

Lax75:


All the best brother.

Are you still in SD? I may be coming down to San Clemente to pick up a car in the afternoon, maybe we can get some beers.

@ EuroMeko

Guy, how u dey na? I never forget u about the "steel." How far with your move back home na? This Yankee na land of depression o. Na so I dey make my plans too men. My own intention for naija na Residential Construction (Got degrees and experience in both Finance and Residential Construction). As I tell the poster, Yankee only good for 3 things : Get their good education, get the experience/exposure, and make u no leave here w/out that blue passport. Once you get these, move back to naija (home) and make a change.

As for me oo, I know say naija get challenges, but I plan on coming back and giving back to the soil I will be buried in someday.

Lax75:

@ Poster:

First off, I understand your frustration with naija. But also know that everywhere has its good and bad. Here's my take. If you said you were trying to migrate during the Clinton era, and pre-911, I would have actually encouraged you to give it a shot. But now, the patriot act has made things super difficult for immigrants and the shot economy has made it even harder. On a daily basis, people are losing their jobs and companies are folding.

I have been on F1 visa once, however this was back during the Clinton years where getting a job off campus was not difficult. Drawback is that with an F1, you are only allowed to work 20 hours (though I know people who do 40 hours). Ofcourse the jobs you will get will be non-professional jobs. Do you intend on feeding and sustaining your family working at the mall as a security guard or a sales associate at say, Macy's?

What do you then do after you finish school? Will you apply for a H1 visa? That is so damn hard to get in this economy and these visas are in limited issuance each year (I think about 55,000 but don't quote me). The thing about H1 is that you are bound to that employer, and they tend to take advantage of that by paying you and keeping you on a crappy salary! Trust me I know because I've been there. After my F1, I was LUCKY enough to find a company to sponsor my H1 but in the 6 years I worked for this Bluechip company, my salary didnt even go up by $3,000!!! In 6 whole years! When I got my greencard and left the company, do you know my salary jumped up by 100%?? Just to give you an idea of how I had been underpaid all the previous years?

If you told me you won the Visa lottery, I would say give it a shot, even though it would still be a challenge given the state of the economy. In my honest opinion, Yanks is NOT all that at ALL. And I am one who has spent the majority of my life abroad (was taken to England since age 2, moved to naija and lived for about 7 years, then came to Yanks). My mom likes to call Yanks "no man's land of America." She can't stand this place (Mom lives in Naija). Don't get me wrong, Yanks has it advantages. But to me, the only thing good about this place is (1) Good education (2) The exposure and work experience (3) Their blue passport, Omo if you come this country and get these three things, I say get the hell out, move back home and start making things happen. It's what I plan on doing.

Even with Naija's challenges (power supply, armed robbers, bad roads, etc), you are still around your own people. You don't have to deal with the ignorance of stereotypes, the racism etc. Very depressing place and it's every man for himself. Unless you are the inferior-complexed kind of person, you would feel lost here. I know I do and I feel relieved anytime I'm out and about and I run into say any of my naija brothers. People I can relate to.

All the best brother.

bros can you explain what you mean by the bolded part ?

Form I-9 kinda killed the illegal work thing here for foreigners, within 3 days the employer will get feedback from the INS if you're allowed to work or not. It became even more furious after 911.

Even with all the challenges in Nigeria I can't wait to be back at home. Our sojourn in US prepares us to be abel to deal with adversity and to be creative. My plan is to be on the ground every 6 months for a month until I accomplish my 3 - 5 year plan of being in Nigeria for 9 months out of the year. I'm choosing the stepped return approach.

My biggest challenge is still looking for  land for farming, I need to lease it (American ingenuity - wink), it's insane and deplorabel to see the types of stuff that we are importing into Nigeria when we can make it at home.

@ OP, here is your example of two people in the US that can't wait to come back home. You have an advantage over us, you're there already. You know the system better than we do, you know all the Alhadjis, Omo Onile stuff that we still have to relearn.

@Beeman80
I think what you have asked for is advice but the decision whether to move or not will ultimately be yours, I don't think anyone should be telling you what to do quite frankly.

I believe you have received some very useful advice so far which mainly borders on the grim economic realities in the west and the better opportunities that may still be available out there regardless. You have to match these realities side by side with your current job and family circumstances and decide if it's a risk worth taking because let's face it, it is a risk. However, what you have to understand, that is if you don't already, is that greater success in life (depending on your definition of success) involves considerable risk taking and getting out of your comfort zone.

Listen, whatever you do, I wish you goodluck and ultimately God's wisdom in making the right decision for yourself and your family.

http://www.apenandaheart..com/

If you have an opportunity to study in the USA on a student visa, then go ahead and do it, but don't move your entire family. If you had a green card it would be easier to move your family with you and transition to the American system, as in finding jobs, etc.

hai,
if u av sumfin gud doin here n ur ok wit it, u can stay if not, jet out

@ Poster : "Andrew no check out oooo!" lol. All of us "Andrews" are trying to check back in ooo.

Okay now, "Cicero" is Italian for "Family Head or Boss", right?
I give it to you Bruv, you're a real "Cicero"! Every letter of that word!

Indulge me to quote you for a third time!

Friend, it could be the best thing you ever did for your family, but just as you have to work smartly to achieve results in your present job, you need to do same and more to take this step.
If you are lazy and don't want to kick it, then don't.
If the indiscipline in Nigeria has become so 'concretized' in your person that you won't try to change, then don't.
If you are typical about women's role and status both in the family and society, then don't.
If you are and impulsive spender and you are not ready to change, then don't.
If you intend to be so occupied chasing money and other achievement while the tv raise your children, then don't
If sleeping with white women and African American ladies is your life-long dream and you must realize it, then don't
If you must not accept the fact that moving to America requires some fundamental changes that will test your endurance and intelligence, then don't.
Friend if you are willing to and you are sure destiny is beckoning you there, don't listen to anybody, just go. American is better than Nigeria in 1,000,001 ways.

Man, you said it all.
But let me add a few more lines and dress it with "Salad cream".  

@Poster: You have a family; You have a not-so-bad job; You have an MSc; Thus: You're fairly doing well!
You want to "go to the next level", You are thinking ahead; You love your family and you want to "catapult them ahead, NEXT LEVEL" (as in U.S citizenship, in the long run).

Like Cicero mentioned, let me ask you more:
*What would you do if the American economy does not improve and getting a job proves very difficult for you?

*Knowing what it takes to "abandon and check-out", if it does not work out, how easy is it for you to "abandon and check-in" again? Note: You would have lost traction, footing an contacts!

*Are you the typical "Nigerian man" (the typical Ijesha man! ) who still believe in a "Matriarchal lifestyle" that says the man is the head of the family? Be advised, that dont work over here. I smell you have a loving wife and you love your family. Will you trade that for the level of "family breakdown" we have over here in the States and Europe? (Be aware, close to 85% of immigrant families that emigrate, get irreversibly broken down within 5yrs of emigration! reason being that our men are too stiff and rigid and would not be flexible enough to the western culture where the woman is the head of the family!).
I am harping more on this issue because [/b]"family is most important" as l see it and once "anyone" (God forbid its you) develop problems in that area, that fella, his wife and their children's dreams are ruined, the Oyinbo Social Welfare people would be too happy to help you break it down further, (We cant afford "another Obama" in the future you know! )
Would you trade your family happiness (wifey and children as you have it now) for that future Green Card? Which is more important to you?
[b]Be realistic, at 85% "black family"  [b]failure rate, you can be the "struggling" 10% or the successful [/b]5%!

*Have you seen people who checked-out and came back when it did not work-out, can you talk to them and share experience so you can learn and not make the same error they made?

*Aside when someone is struggling to earn a living, what exactly do you think "abroad can provide for you" (which you cannot get by travelling there regularly on Holidays), that you think you cannot get or make a financial outlay to provide for yourself?

-Is it stable electricity? How about if you really make money and invest and install Solar cells on your own roof, completely independent of NEPA?
-Is it Security? If Security were so difficult or impossible to arrange, all those much-hated Politicians should have been dead by now, including the IBB's, OBJ's, e.t.c. It costs money, l know but it is achievable is what l am implying.
-Is it good schools for your kids? It cost money but l assure you there are some "private" schools that are better than U.K/U.S public schools in Nigeria today.
-Good medical care? C'mmon, EKO Hospital along Ikeja Road is open to everyone. Just go along with your big purse!

In essence, with money, you can provide the best for your family in Nigeria without making yourself "An Alien"   in a foreign country!

Now, on the[b] flip side[/b], can you cope with the derision of being discriminated against, at every turn, by govt Agents (Police, Customs, Immigration, Courts, e.t.c), ordinary White folks that are way below your level in Nigeria, (have you heard the term: Abroad is a leveler" before?)?

What about the weather? Until you live there, you wont know what l mean, walahi!
The cold can and have indeed shorten th elife span of some darky Nigerians O! From Arthritis, back pain, heart conditions (due to lack of adequate exercise and not sweating enough!), e.t.c.

What about the restrictions on your ability to just decide to "do whatever you like, at any fecking time" (We Nigerians call it FREEDOM and l love it sooo much" Build any kind of house, withdraw or save any amount, buy any kind of car l like, speed as l like on the Express road!, even yab Policeman if he did not give me my correct recognition ). Abroad na different sroty o! You go 'paam' and gentle like mad!
At times, even to repatriate your hard-earned money home, can be a hassle as "The Govt owns you and Whatever you have" over here.

I can go on and on but at the end of the day, its a question of putting the "Pros and Cons on a balance" and seeing for yourself where it tips for you.
Its your decision, its your funeral and its your enjoyment in future: YOU BE THE BEST JUDGE.

No Pain, No Gain! Are you ready to make the sacrifices?

Good luck and l pray that God of heaven will give you the wisdom to choose that which is right and most beneficial to you and your family, in the long run.

Cheers,
Lastpage.


Ajoo o'dabi ile, No matter where you dey, remember Area o! (Sings that "Faze" song and smacks it down with some cans of red Bull! )

The grass is always greener on the other side but look before you leap into the trap that the western world has become for a lot of exceptionally educated Nigerians who can not achieve more than 25% of their true potential because of institutionalised racism.

Your best bet is to stay put in Nigeria and try your best to get a new post in a "Good" multinational like British american tobacco and after working there for 3 years, you will thank the people who advised you against relocating to the US.

My advice to Newbie Nigerians  I meet in London is not to stay more than 11 months in london as it has a way of sucking you into the trap that it really is.

Before the recession, there was a glass ceiling for blacks in England, but now with the Global recession that has defied all solutions, it is more like a concrete ceiling for blacks in the Uk.

And the US economy is currently in a worse condition than the UK's hence the recent downgrade of the credit rating of the US.

Do you know the number of highly educated but unemployed people in the US ?

For an indication, go to the following website :-
http://www.experienceproject.com/gsearch.php?cx=partner-pub-7693235355009975%3A1bg8zj-3grl&cof=FORID%3A9&ie=ISO-8859-1&sa=Search&q=i+am+tired+of+being+unemployed#1060

look before you leap,no place like home

I will really like to applaud my people this time!
I am moved by the amount of "faithful and truthful" outpourings you 'guys' are giving freely here!

Before now, did anyone notice that No Naija person will ever advise you like this?

They always encourage you to "take the leap and find out yourself"!

You take the leap and find out that "e no easy o" but then, you also do the same to anyone aspiring to take the leap: Take it and find out yourself!

Guess this is one of the advantages of Social Networking!

One luv Bruvs, lets keep it real.

Lastpage.

@ Lastpage : The brother broke it down nicely.

@ EuroMeko : Yep, the infamous I-9 has made it virtually impossible for some to get a job. Now they even have what they call "E-Verify" where the employment eligibilty is carried out "instantly." I beg I will need to holla at you about this your "step transition" method back to naija. We need to be smarter than our parents who abruptly moved back home after spending time in England/US back in their day, when the oil boom gave us a thriving economy. That's why I emphasize on getting that blue passport. For example, you want to go into the mechanized farming industry, think of all the places in the world you can travel to w/out needing a visa where you could source for ideas, materials, equipment, etc. Simply because you get yankee passport. Here's a link that will show you all the places you can travel to w/out needing a visa as a yankee citizen.

http://visacenter.com/visa-quick-check.php

As I said before, that's all this place is good for, in addition to the education and experience.

Bros, we need to be smart and take advantage of what we have learned in this place, but use it to improve our country!

Lax75:

@ Lastpage : The brother broke it down nicely.

@ EuroMeko : Yep, the infamous I-9 has made it virtually impossible for some to get a job. Now they even have what they call "E-Verify" where the employment eligibilty is carried out "instantly." I beg I will need to holla at you about this your "step transition" method back to naija. We need to be smarter than our parents who abruptly moved back home after spending time in England/US back in their day, when the oil boom gave us a thriving economy. That's why I emphasize on getting that blue passport. For example, you want to go into the mechanized farming industry, think of all the places in the world you can travel to w/out needing a visa where you could source for ideas, materials, equipment, etc. Simply because you get yankee passport. Here's a link that will show you all the places you can travel to w/out needing a visa as a yankee citizen.

http://visacenter.com/visa-quick-check.php

As I said before, that's all this place is good for, in addition to the education and experience.

Bros, we need to be smart and take advantage of what we have learned in this place, but use it to improve our country!

absolute bollocks. all those things mentioned above are crap if you dont have money. before you return to naija you better have at least $500,000 or na suffer you dey go suffer for naija. at least OP is already in naija and is entrenched, enmeshed and immersed in the system. you on the other hand ? well

@ Buzugee  : I'm sorry did I miss something here? And do you know me personally to make your assumptions about what I have and don't have? You sound a little emotional. Is everything ok? Are you alright?

Anyways, OP, I and other people with more "realistic" appraisals of the situation, have given you some good advice. Ultimately, the decision is yours. I wish you all the best.

@op , loads of good advice, but no clear cut answer.

Like I tell most people, there's really no clear cut path to success out in the West. Everybody has a different story. You could do the same courses/certifications, and have similar work experiences, one person gets an excellent job, and the other is stuck with menial jobs for years. So just take all the advice you can, pray to your God (or gods) and head out.

Two things I should highlight that are pretty important though: empower your wife to work, and second, don't cut off all ties in Nigeria.

Lax75:

@ Buzugee  : I'm sorry did I miss something here? And do you know me personally to make your assumptions about what I have and don't have? You sound a little emotional. Is everything ok? Are you alright?

Anyways, OP, I and other people with more "realistic" appraisals of the situation, have given you some good advice. Ultimately, the decision is yours. I wish you all the best.

i sound emotional because i am emotional. doctor said it is something to do with my testosterone levels   he said i have more estrogen. anyway thats besides the point. the point is i am bored.   i am tryna kick some ruckus up in here, up in here. i am tryna stir the pot. kick some fuss. ruffle some feathers, unsettle some folks. its sundays evening lets make it happen. i assume of course that yall are here because you want to connect with fellow nigerians right ? or am i the only one  

EuroMeko:

Based strictly on the information you have provided I give you "my" opinions.

A quick story/joke. Rich American CEO went on vacation to a small fishing village in Mexico to get away from it all and relax. He is lounging there with his other rich buddies watching this "poor" Mexican Fisherman sitting in front of his hamlet watching his kids play while drinking a Corona (beer).

Rich CEO asked him "Fisherman, why aren't you out fishing"
Fisherman "I already went fishing in the morning Senor, I already caught enough fish to feed my family, keep some for tomorrow, and sold a few for money."
Perturbed, the CEO retorted "Man, there are more fishes out there, you can catch more, you can get a fleet of boats, hire more people to fish for you, set up a distribution enterprise"
Fisherman "What for, what can I gain"
CEO "Then you can become rich so you can retire early, move to a paradise and enjoy your life with your children"
Fisherman "I am already relaxed, I am living in a small fishing village that is paradise, you came here after all Senor and I am enjoying my kids - so Senor, I think I am already rich by your definition, Si?"

My short answer, stay in Nigeria. Make it work.

Instead of leaving Nigeria maybe you can think Entrepreneurial and have Mrs. BeeMan80 manage that one while you continue working and growing at your cool job.

I am not going to lie to you and my viewpoint differs from others already on this thread, the US is a beautiful place to live, but it comes at a price. We have social services. There is a team of professional and highly trained medical personel that will rush at breakneck speed to save my life by just dialing 911 on the phone, there's a team of highly trained police officers that will come to my aid 24/7 just by calling them (no brining the Commissioner), so it is relative.

So to close, as Men we have to do what we have to do, but if you really have a cool job in Nigeria as you stated, I would just make it work but your Wife is part of that equation.

Jah Guide.

Word.

@Op. Toe d entrepeneural line, find something you love doing or the Misus, get some training and begin your own biz with the money you intend to use for flight ticket. Either in Naija or anywhere else in d world, as long as you are working for someone else, you 'may' not get ahead.

My advice:-

Start your own biz here in Naija, no matter how small, with diligence, patience and prayers, you will get there. And when you do, you can travel at your pleasure and pace to any country of your choice and definitely not to wash any white man's bum. Cheers.

This is the best thread in recent time at least after 2011 election. I need to refer so many people to come and read these great expositions from the horse mouth. Thanks to you all

Now my take,
@Poster, I will strongly advise you to only go if and only if your future is guarantied. Don't think of going to become a hustler. This may be by getting a good sponsor( NNPC etc scholarship schemes and foreign ones), visa lottery etc.

dd

Your first question should be will I even be allowed into the U.S?

this is about the most sincere thread I have seen on NL in a long long while especially from our brothers in diaspora!

@Poster, like i said before,the choice is ultimately yours.

Thanks Moderator for putting this up as recommended.

@Poster  your wish is to apply for a student visa, which doesn't  guaranty any employment or permanent resident in USA. Relocation is something else e.g when you have a green card or a US citizen, or as  investor.  But i don't think you have any,or.  At your age you should plan well, you be Papa don't forget.

Lax75:


@ EuroMeko : That's why I emphasize on get[/b]ting [b]that blue passport. For example, you want to go into the mechanized farming industry, think of all the places in the world you can travel to w/out needing a visa where you could source for ideas, materials, equipment, etc. Simply because you get yankee passport. Here's a link that will show you all the places you can travel to w/out needing a visa as a yankee citizen.

http://visacenter.com/visa-quick-check.php

Done 

I have been invited to China early next year by a Nigerian mentor that lives there. Not looking to import goods for sale as we already have an influx but to look for machinery.

If you are going for MBA in IT go for Cyber security, you stand a great chance for a good job, however your family could suffer and the trickle effect could affect your kids. Life will be hard except you already have a good savings of N3-N5million to maintain your family and self during your studies. I would say continue with your job and take an online course in cyber security then try your hands on lottery visa. Be smart! Even migrating with lottery visa is a challenge if u don't have anyone here.

My simple advise is "don't rush" (step-by-step), other things follow, Good luck by the way

[size=15pt]Enough said, same applies to UK, Always remember "ALL THAT GLITTERS ARE DEFINITLY NOT GOLD" These countries are just overhyped[/size]

@ EuroMeko - Very good bros! I really commend you for that. Now you see all the countries you can travel to w/out needing a visa. You go just dey hop on plane dey travel go like say you dey hop on molue. Dem dey respect that blue passport for all over shaaa. It's the only thing this country is good for. I know once you get to the east, you will have access to some good equipment for your business in naija.

My mom actually has about 400 hectares of land close to abeokuta which she has plans for. She's looking more into the agricultural side of things, but my field is construction.

Nice 1 bros!

@OP,
Are you seriously migrating because of Boko Haram and NEPA?

@EuroMeko:
I would not bring out that "blue Palee" if l am anywhere near the Middle East, Afghanistan or even Nigeria-nistan!
O di'kwa dangerous o!

Wouldn't mind if l am included in the gist on about "post-relocation".

Cheers