ojlifa:
first of all the aid given ,i dear say is pea nut for Nigeria especially when we do not need it,in fact if you look at the aid properly you quickly discover that the aid in itself is designed to help american business as some kind of subsidy to allow them sell things like vaccines .

Secondly it is the duty of Trump to worry about American interest while it is the duty of Buhari to worry about Nigerian interest,we work together when our interest ally and take different sides when our interest defer. eg when america bombed Libya ,Nigerian went along rather than looking out for its interest ,today all the weapon in Libya are now what are been used to kill Nigerians.if we had refused Americas request then Nigerians wouldn't have been dying now.so my brother the hole idea of diplomacy is the ability to look out for the interest of your people

I wouldn’t call any aid peanuts, especially since some of them go towards helping the underserved. And sometimes, there are transfers of knowledge and technical capacity associated with it.

I also don’t know how you decided that we don’t need their aid - maybe you need to see the remote areas of Nigeria to see how people are impacted by aid efforts especially those ignored by our leaders.

Sure, it helps American businesses but the core questions involve whether lives are being impacted positively and whether we want to and can do it ourselves.

As to the outcome of diplomacy especially with regards to Libya, that’s a discussion for another day.

I’m just looking at the rationale behind their comments on the Obama administration and given the state of affairs, I’m still certain that the comments were aimed at winning Trump over.

ojlifa:
who told you Nigeria need forgiveness for a national interest decision.so we should side one religion against another abi ??

If you remember, Trump’s ambassador to the UN threatened nations that didn’t support their vote with withdrawal of aid. That is what I was making reference to.

We may not need it but Trump’s number one interest isn’t our national interest, it’s his country’s and their policies.

So my thinking is one way or the other, Buhari’s team was trying to win him over - and if it ever came to that, get him in the mood to forgive the vote and negotiate over supporting such policies or worst come to worst, explain why they couldn’t and won’t support. It’s normal diplomacy.

Its quite simple.

Trump is known to bash Obama and try to one up his policies and actions - remember the inauguration crowd debacle?

By naming Obama, Buhari’s team is trying to win over Trump - maybe get him to forgive them over the Jerusalem vote even - and get something good out of the meeting. It’s politics the way Trump likes it.

Whether its true or not, Buhari is still trying to punish Dasuki for stealing the arms fund so there is every incentive for the US to have stayed away from such a corrupt government - maybe Buhari has forgotten that plot and his campaign claims.

At the end of the day, the hope is that both parties are voted out soon enough.

Too much demand compared to supply.

How does this make Nigeria a zoo? How does this mean Buhari is ineffective?

If anything, it points to opportunities for expansion and new investment. Regulation could help maintain current prices but at what cost? We are already complaining about quality of service which points to a possibility that airlines need funds to provide better services.

Nigerians need to learn basic economics before joining Nairaland or even gaining access to the internet.

At the end of the day, if the industry is competitive, the market will stabilize but if it doesn't, the govt can always step in after properly researching the reasons e.g. are airlines colluding?

Its not enough to pass exams and have phd. Learn to apply knowledge and seek insight into the real world.

Pls nairalanders, answer this question;

[size=16pt]Did the doctors tell the woman that she should go for alternative care because science doesn't have answers or because she doesn't have funds for appropriate care?[/size]

I'd very much like to know the doctors that assisted her and their reasoning.

Of course, this is with the assumption that this story is even real.

Drguzzykola:

Oga, don't talk plenty hey, Maa describe my own villa give u
, this is public, make we talk am privately, seems this talk is going to yield positive conclusion of u going over there for research, beside how many village have u visited in d past this one u are saying maybe only my village own is the one working,
They won't be rich like Bill gate just because ritual money has limit, thus a need to renew, at least using atheist like u ll too make sense, I mean just tell them u are here to see what they are upto(don't worry they won't need to chop ur head @they Don moderniz there strategy, all they need is taking u in close door incantate for ya head and let see if u no go Waka till u die for hotness(madness).

I now see from ur comment that ur life after death is based" on at least u ll know u did the right thing "which has no profit to distinguish u from religious niggas(SHM) that are theist
And now don't u think it is absurd to base ur ending life after death on probability of ( this is not d game where u win or loose, this iz the game where u win or doom for eternity)
Beside I never force u to believe coz I gat no full evidence, I only gave insight to reality
_#shalom

How do you know the wealth limits of blood money? Do tell. Perhaps you know something the rest of us don't and can prove it or is it just conjecture? Lies to cover more lies?

And I've visited many Nigerian states, lived in the North, South East, and South Western parts of Nigeria. In all my travels, I haven't encountered one single evidence even when I was a tenant of a self described native doctor who started his day by ringing bells to his idols during my NYSC days. How's that for being in the thick of it?

As to the issue of probability, Pascal's wager, i.e if I die and nothing happens bla bla bla, is essentially a gamble and thus can be analysed with probability and if you've taken any time to actually study it, you'd know the chance of winning, is incredibly small as to make the wager bad. That is even assuming that a supernaturally supreme being is interested in the wager and their definition of good aligns with yours.

There is no insight to reality in all you've said. At best, you've revealed that like those who partake in blood money rituals, you are taken by fantasy and fear despite a lack of evidence as to the content of your beliefs.

Science has not forced me to believe anything, I was simply given facts to examine and experiments to conduct. More so, I can present contrary evidence to invalidate currently accepted theories. Science isn't even antagonistic to the spiritual if they exist. It is simply against claims that cannot be backed with evidence. Religion has however tried to indoctrinate me and consistently told me to ignore reality and follow blindly in expectation of rewards while dangling fear in my face. Truth need not hide itself or dangle fear in my face.

Drguzzykola:

av told u I gat better things to do than wasting my time on doing good research for athiest, tell me to describe my village to u if u don't have then I can help with that, do the research ur self and make the money, my profession given money is OK for my living
Fact is i gat nothing to loose if I die and discover religious was fake, u gat to be the victim if u die and discover religious was right,Choi, u are doomed.
so do the research ur self, I ll describe my village for u if u won't mind going, (am helpful) so wen u get there tell them they should show u /try what they are upto on u (can't laugh abeg, those niggas ll b like there is possibility here o see free material@this kind head go fit vomit money wella, , there gods /deity will b happy to see u around abeg.
Yoruba adage says(Omode e omogun, onpeelefor). Lwkmd

You keep making claims but find it a waste of time to prove them yet expect anyone to believe you? I'd do the research myself but there is no single evidence that I'll find anything magical in your village so you'll have to do better. Why should I go to your village specifically when no one has proven anything about magic in the whole of Nigeria? Is your village magical and different? Perhaps it's some hot spot for magic on this planet?

Despite all the blood money claims, no African is richer than Bill Gates. Perhaps it's because the blood money isn't real? Despite all the magic, we lost out to the Europeans when they discovered Europe. Perhaps its because magic isn't real? Despite all the magic, wars have only been won by real weapons, made out of natural elements rather than magic. Perhaps it's because magic isn't real? On and on we go.

As to whether I'm doomed or not if religion turns out to be real, I don't think you've considered that there are many religions in the world and that greatly reduces the probability of being right even if you are religious. If there happens to be a supernatural being who wants to punish us, you'd be in as much danger as the atheists you mock. LOL! And who's to say you won't be destroyed some time later even if you were right? I didn't get the memo that said freewill will be eliminated and that you'd become incapable of offending that being. So again, on and on we go.

Those that are doomed however, if we go with the resurrection and suffering claim can still be of the opinion even then that the being was wrong and may even be right from our perspective especially given the lack of evidence presented as to the existence of such being. It would be suffering as you claim but you would still have freewill. And who says the saved ones won't join you in that hell later on. Who knows?

Of course, after death, if it turns out that nothing exists, you would lose nothing in death but for those of us that care about humanity and the future, enough to actually investigate these boundless claims, whether we feel it or not, will have done the right thing.

Atheists are atheists not because they hate gods, but because they follow evidence and care enough to ensure that they do the best by their fellow man as far as these claims are concerned. Whether or not it ends in death or hell, it would have been worth it and based on what we knew, not empty conjecture and that would be satisfaction enough, even in imaginary hell.

Drguzzykola:


Fact still remain fact that u gat no phenomenon proving against my talk of dream and menopause birth,

Choi, they spent billions to prove things, I should now do that on atheist that will come and tell me the proving video was edited, abeg, no worry, ure d defaulted that need to be convince since ur negligence to believe deity existence might cost u ur life paraventure they exist, then take time to do the finding ur self, the best I can do is to tell u they exist with typing fact here, I gat nothing to loose if they don't at the end of life , abi is there any odd part for people that aren't atheist after death ? NO

, yes there are witch in my village, I won't mind to describe the location so u can go on research OYO.

Except for the fact that you are ignoring the occurrences in other religions and non-religious erstwhile barren people giving birth without medical aid or prayer which points to natural possibilities. Those occurrences and your inability to bring evidence to rule out other possibilities is what weakens your claim of causality. I don't have to lift a finger here, you bring the claim, you bring the proof which rules out other possibilities in your claim. That is how proving something works. You cannot assert something and say the occurrence of a prophetic occurrence before hand is proof of causality without bringing in evidence to rule out other possibilities.

Also, the fact that dreams are random, weird and consistently fail to accurately model or predict the real world is the evidence against it's reliability in terms of prediction. Being correct once isn't proof of anything. That is not how we establish what is true.

I don't see why I have to keep repeating myself about the above especially given that if we are to bring in the totality of occurrences and evidence, science trumps supernatural claims which is for example why hospitals, not churches or mosques are mandatory for sick dependants. Adults can believe in rice and die in churches for all we care.

Lastly, I find it funny that you are scared that people will claim your video was edited. You think scientists aren't wary of the chance that someone will claim they are lying? That is why there is a scientific method and systems for reviewing publications and findings. That is why we have to back up our claims with evidence. It is not a perfect system but it is the best we've got and if you cannot subject your claim to rigorous examination then stop making that claim.

If NASA can be accused of faking the moon landing, who are you to expect otherwise?

Also, anyone who claims it is edited would have have to convince us that it could have been edited. They would have to convince us that you have the capacity and ability to fake such in fact. Also do you think that people won't do their research and even ask for your village to see if your claim is true given that you have given them a good reason to proceed with the research? In fact, they would give you millions to bring more documentary evidence.

You think scientists have it easy? Despite the rigours of the scientific method, the system is far from perfect so we are constantly having to check and recheck, to verify and falsify. To adapt and improve. We cannot simply be content with 'God did it' for that is how complacency and evil becomes the norm.

Drguzzykola:

Young man, just laughing anytime am replying ur post, as per the barren woman, I choose to hear ur response before airing the woman step before conceiving, abeg, the woman claimed she was invited to midweek programme in the church where prophecy came out blah blah, don't worry coz even after telling u the fact u ll still tel me it was coincidence, so just shun it abeg, if God need u he ll convince u himself the way he did for Paul.

As per dream issh, ur points hasnt justify since u tagged it as "chance". Ur phenomenon proving failed there, science only talk about the part of d brain in charge of recollecting ones dream which is a normal thing as ABC, stop looking for justification that doesn't exist.

Oya what's ur say about ritual money they use kidnapers victim for, deity is involved. Funny if that one is also fake to u, then am sure some niggas will be looking at u as ( atheist are possibility means to make soft money o, let them come for practical, and let's test if money will come out after chopping off there head/prick, at least it's an experiment) (just Wana b careful of what I post, this is a public forum, can't laugh)

Going to my village to do d video record for u in person doesn't worth abeg, u gat village, go and give a trial, dare the gods they worship there, if u gat no village, tell me Maa describe mine for u, so u go there urself, at least ure on a research mission, so the ball in ur court.

I'll henceforth ignore your claims on barrenness and dreams since you are obviously trying to bring unsubstantiated claims as to the limit of what is scientifically known about dreams and the human body. I just gave you a simple statistical analysis of the predictive power of dreams and your best retort is an unsubstantiated claim about scientific understanding of dream recollection?

Moving further;

The funny thing here is that you are trying to shift the burden of proof of your claims over to me and using scare tactics like ritual killings to dissuade me from pressing for proof.

I'll play your game though. I've tried, there is no witch in my own village, our magic powers are actually tricks and no one can levitate. If you however insist on claiming such things exist, kindly offer proof.

If you cannot bring any evidence, stop saying it exists. If you don't think it's worth it to shatter current knowledge of physics and science in general to bits, to usher in a new wave of understanding of our world and universe with evidence of your claims then there is no need to continue this discussion because you obviously don't appreciate the gravity of your beliefs and claims on science and progress.

We spend billions to prove things like relativity, particles, bacteria, etc and you find it difficult to provide simple evidence of someone flying around your village or transforming into a bird and still expect to be believed?

Drguzzykola:


I see all ur point as weak induction to disprove the above claim as per barren and dreaming

Young man., I only wish u can visit my village to dare there deity festival, at least to finally confirm deity existence or not, I mean with ur eyes, let's hope ur experience after might justify ur belive as an atheist or not.

Sinkills, I sight u

You can see them however you like but unless you can actually tell the future accurately and repetitively from your dreams, or even twice in a year, it will still go down as chance as far as science is concerned. Also, unless you can convince us that you knew all what was going on with the woman's body at the time she conceived, there is no reason to claim it was a miracle unless we are defining miracle as 'rare occurrence'.

You know what? Go to your village, partner with one of those magicians and capture their magical acts on video, especially showing of them levitating around the village. You'd be richer than the owner of Nairaland and will be rewarded with a Nobel prize for unleashing a new wave of knowledge in the areas of physics and chemistry.

What's stopping you?

Drguzzykola:


nice one, i guess ure an atheist, no worry dear , I only give insight of reality,
I hope u understand when a doctor confirm a woman to be in menopause ( doctor say madam,u no longer have egg), this is not Premenopause of low ovulating hormone ( that is the 5% sure talking about dear), this was someone i knew( a barren) , she don old small, can't laugh abeg.

as per dream, science has only prove how we remember dream which is never a big deal( thats neuroscience); seems u don't understand full content of dream, I mean situation of things that never happened and u dreamt of it which in few years time came to reality bro , seeing urself in that scenerio which immediately u remember u once saw that same thing in ur dream sometimes ago, my bro atheist , this is beyond human intelligence to explain , I linked it with deity existence to show ( there are more to know than just the provable physical things), people who belief in deity belief there are things more than just physical which atheist never belief.

lastly , no deity abi, at least ogunlade is an evil deity which atheist say im no exist , ungwa come go to my village probably during festival make den use tira ( juju stick) nack u plus incantation whether u no go sick die within 24hrs, abi incantate "bojowo" for u, or rather "
or ave u not heard of this one "itagba shooting" wey doctor test u and say they can't see anything wrong with u despite dying in pain ,, seems atheist don't know the real meaning of what they meant by saying no deity ( itagba na deity o, ) don't tell me its because we belief it kill, go to old oluwa glass industry in ondo state wheat her then no use ( itagba incantate for white man working there )
would have refer u to Christian deity but those ones are slow in action, try juju own kwanu

chai , I don talk plenty, can't laugh,
Young man , I know u people ( atheist ) are smart, kudos , una try, at least , helping research work.

The woman you knew isn't the first person in that circumstance to give birth and she won't be the last. The important thing to note is that cases of barren women conceiving isn't unique to any religion (and non-religious groups) so you can't claim a monopoly on miracles or claim that it was a divine occurrence unless you can prove that you knew every thing that was going on with her body up until she conceived.

Furthermore, Our lack of knowledge and the cost of research are major issues here, some erstwhile barren women can now conceive due to improved medical knowledge and more research will drive costs and availability with positive results becoming more frequent - unlike in the case of miracles and the religious leaders who claim to possess supernatural powers yet can't replicate results.


As far as dreaming is concerned, if I write 100 things happening to x in future, I increase the probability of being correct. If I simulate images from my memories, thoughts and actions many times, there is a probability that I will paint something that will come to resemble the past or future. While we may recognise things from dreams and seem to be able to foresee things sometimes, we can't also ignore the many times our dreams have been nonsensical - I haven't become superman in real life despite dreaming I was superman when I was a kid.

My point here is that yes, we don't fully understand why dream can resemble the past or future but as with everything, there are logical explanations and with more research and time, we'll get to know more. No need to label anything as divine unless we can prove them logically and with actual evidence else what's to stop me from calling x a witch and hurting them because I can claim I saw them flying in my dream?

Lastly, If they'll let me inspect the stick and ascertain that there isn't anything physically malicious, like rubbing with poisonous substances, I'll agree to being touched with it so we can debunk such claims.

Also, that a doctor cannot diagnose something points to two things; it could be a new form of illness/disease/etc or the medical facility (especially local ones) doesn't know enough about the disease to correctly diagnose it - when did Nigerian hospitals start correctly diagnosing the different forms of cancer for example? All those people they could not correctly diagnose would probably term it as spiritual.

We have diseases and such named after people that were not hit by your so called magic because as with everything, germs, diseases, and viruses evolve and affect people in different ways. We have to constantly research and learn instead of sitting down and blaming village people.

There is no reason to believe in the supernatural unless we can prove it but surprisingly, no one can float in the air around Lagos so we can end all this argument and know for sure that supernatural things exist.

Drguzzykola:
Anytime I see topics like this I smile,

isoright , at least everybody is entitled to there opinion

mind u , anything provable is liable to be disproved, only depend on how intelligent u are, ask lawyers.
if u like , say no God, if u like say no Satan, if u like say nothing like living soul after death, but the Bible said something, assurance will be made for everybody to hear the truth so that nobody ll escape judgement with excuse of nobody told them,

sometimes I look at religion laws , it says , don't steal, don't kill, don't fornicate, don't commit adultery, still someone will say taaaahh, isoright, go and steal, kill, fornicate , ure on ur own

Hell or not , u ll understand one day, shey u need proving to believe , no problem , but the problem is time , it might be too late to now believe, na u Sabi ( OYO)
I heard they call someone saying no deity self( atheist) ,
abeg prove the phenomenon behind a barren woman concieving after menopause , ( not only one baby o, twins self) and they believed everything is physical shey, oya tell us the scientific phenomenon behind dreaming while u sleep. abi una no dey dream? ungwa tell me the scientific proving ,at least u lay on bed physically but found urself somewhere else

WO am tired , the truth ll soon be reveal wen u close ur eyes and ready to enter 6fit.

If your religion isn't the right one, I suppose you'll also be smiling to one hell or another with atheists no matter what you believe which makes this point mute.

A barren woman giving birth after menopause isn't a phenomenon unique to any religion plus non-religious people have also experienced this so your point is again mute. Science says it is near impossible given the slim chance of about 5%. But there are ways to make 'barren' women give birth now even before menopause so it seems science is going where your God hasn't gone before and doing it more frequently. I'd say reality has the upper hand on God here.

As to dreaming, you need to read more on the brain and how well we are mapping it and open new doors to the understanding of human nature. There are also a number of theories that explain dreams and they are constantly been refined and improved as we learn more. That someone cannot explain it is not grounds for using 'god' as cause and then claiming proof of 'god'. Unlike you, people are dedicating their lives and bodies to the understanding of nature and the universe instead of saying 'God did it'.

In fact, all your argument boils down to if science cannot explain it, that is proof of God for me. There are millions of things we could not explain at one point that people claimed were proof of God. Like Thunder and Lightening. Nope, not Amadioha or Sango or Jehovah. Natural explanations exist. Today, those things have explanations grounded in reality.

My point is that ignorance of the workings of a phenomenon is not a sufficient condition for bashing science in favour of any God. That is not how this works. That however is how you label people as witches and kill them to satisfy and perpetuate ignorance.

babe4wealth:


U DON'T KNOW D SCRIPTURES BRO
LOOK AT ISAIAH 45:7 AND ISAIAH 48:17
Read d Bible with other translations especially THE LIVING BIBLE TRANSLATION(TLB). It will help u.
Use google if u don't have other translations, OK

You can't quote verses which only agree with half of what you have claimed. Read those verses, creating evil/calamity is one thing, the reason is another.

Your claim is that without creating that evil, we wouldn't need your God so that is what you have to back up with evidence and also note that if your God does claim such, then there is a very good argument for not worshipping him even if he is all powerful as he is despite his claims, unethical from certain perspectives in that regard.

What if there is hell fire?

I'll happily go into it knowing that I did my best to investigate God through rational thought instead of blindly believing like OP who can't give an explanation of his faith grounded in reality.

I'll be happy knowing I cared for my fellow humans who I can see and hear instead of some god who loves hide and seek and can never regrow human limbs.


LOL!

This is just Pascal's Wager. And there are too many what ifs especially with many gods and whether any god is interested in playing to make it a good wager. It's drivel for the scared and fearful.

redcliff:


When you talk of gay relationships, please dont bring nature into it. Nature has nothing to do with this. Nature was not stupid to make man and woman and make man have a pen.is and woman a hole! You and the 37 others that liked your posts need mental help!

Nature isn't sentient in the way you speak of it. Madness is still nature. Cancer is still nature. Deviation doesn't imply wrong or bad especially if the people engaging in it are not harming anyone. So they can't give birth naturally, what's your problem? Go and give birth if it is paining you. No one is forcing gay culture on me so I'm happy to let gay people be.

Akshow:
I am pro gay and not homophobic. I'm very open minded and understand that some people's preferences by nature is for same sex BUT airing a children's cartoon based on married gay couple is a NO NO. No rational reason can explain the need for this. Children are impressionable and very fickle minded. This can mess up there sexual orientation as they may try to experiment. This is very wrong.

If you were open minded,you won't say things like 'No rational reason' or 'No No' unless you have heard reasons from both sides and can actually state why a position isn't rational.

As society increasingly accepts a sub-culture as part of the norm, it stands to reason that art will increasingly depict that sub-culture to show how it interacts with the larger society. We already have shows like Modern Family showing how being related to gay families looks. Nothing wrong with it except the occasional stare and insults from ignorant or misinformed people.

The same goes for children's TV. As long as they keep out adult content, there is nothing wrong with depicting a gay couple because those kids, especially those in the Europe and America will be interacting more and more with children of gay couples and even visiting their households. Or will you as a so-called open minded person ban your kids from visiting his/her friend who has gay parents?

A cartoon featuring gay couples is a very rational thing to expect and create. The irrational position is the one that is against the cartoon, not the cartoon and its reasons given the above.

People also disliked cartoons and shows depicting interracial couples citing 'Impressionable minds' so no surprises here. I can only hope our children will be better than we are.

babe4wealth:



IF THERE ARE NO EVILS AND TRAVAILS IN DS WORLD, DEN SUGGEST WAYS TO GOD HOW D WORLD CAN TURN TO HIM 4HELP......
LEMME TELL U A LITTLE SECRET,,,,, GOD IS LIKE A COMPUTER PROGRAMMER THAT DEVELOPS A COMPUTER VIRUS AND D ANTIVIRUS AT D SAME TIME SO DAT PEOPLE CAN TURN TO HIM FOR HIS HELP,,,, D MOMENT U UNDERSTAND THIS UR PROBLEMS ARE SOLVED

Please tell me you understand the ethical implication of the property you are ascribing to your God. You are saying that your concept of God is the creator and causative factor of evil for the sole purpose of being 'needed' or to create relevance.

A computer programmer that does this would be imprisoned because it is unethical. You cannot kill someone so that his family will buy a coffin from you and be considered ethically justified from our perspective, etc.

Not saying such a God cannot exist, the Greek Gods were remarkably flawed from our perspective and if we are going by conjecture, anything is possible including the fact that I am invisible right now. You will have to back up that claim though.

Atheists or those questioning their faith are usually advised to keep their status secret while they are still dependent on their parents or other family members.

You should not reveal your preference/status from a point of view which puts those you depend upon on the defensive. Don't even try to create religious arguments if the result is to prove them wrong immediately. Always start with simple, non argumentative questions, learn about their stance. If they appear to be dogmatic, be extra careful.

If OP isn't dependent on his/her parents, no need to worry. Stop arguing religion with them, stop making fun of them if you are, instead, start asking questions (smart questions that makes them feel like you really want to learn) and listen to what they have to say. Tell them you will think about it and do. You don't need to come back with something that makes them look foolish, instead, point out that their point may be valid but non universal, etc, and put in your own experience and why you have your own views. Don't argue, strive for peace.

If OP is still dependent however, keep things on the down low. If you've told them they are wrong, misinformed etc, apologise. Tell them you are sorry and would love to learn about their perspectives but that you won't like to be forced to accept what they believe without giving you explanations on why they believe it and time to consider their explanations.

If they tell you that the bible or Quran is the only proof they need, don't argue. Tell them about the history of how books like the bible and Quran were written, the oral traditions and time lags, the difficulties in translation, the differences in opinion/translation and tell them that is why you have trouble believing it immediately. If they are smart parents who are capable of learning, they will understand and also try to learn why you think the way you do. If they are dogmatic however, shut up, participate in non-harmful events they force you to, bide your time, and one day, you'll be independent and free to do what you like.

Let me try and answer. I'm not an atheist but I also don't believe current religions (mine included) present convincing evidence.

odijeks:
1. God reveals Himself through nature
If you are a nature-lover or have ever taken the time to appreciate the beauty of the natural world around you, you can see the handiwork that points to an incredibly intelligent creator and designer. Look at the beauty of the sunset, the awe you experience watching the earth's polar lights in the sky (aurora), the glory of the night sky with all the stars, the dawning of the day with the blades of grass glistening like diamonds as the sunlight bounces off tiny water droplets of dew, you would ask yourself questions like "would mindless and impersonal physical forces or a chain of chance-like events need or care to make something this beautiful that man can appreciate?" One would have to be willfully ignorant to attribute all the intricacies found in nature to random chaotic events. A close look at nature reveals an intricate level of design that points undeniably to an intelligent Designer (Psalms 19:1-4). Nevertheless, some still live in denial.

When I was young, dark rooms/places used to scare me and give the impression that something ominous was lurking. Was it real? probably not. Yet I sensed or felt something. Years later, as a teen, I stopped being scared, not by prayer, more of a dare that I wanted to see what was there. If they exist, let them come and do their worst. Nothing happened. Nothing has happened. I'm no longer scared of the dark.

The point here is that your feeling about nature's aesthetics is just a side effect of having a brain and sense organs which try to process the environment and fill gaps where they cannot find sufficient explanations. All those scary sounds are usually just winds and tree branches interacting. All those things you assume are intelligent may or may not be so especially given what scientists have found with certain parts of Mammals. Lets not go with the God knows why its like that, the argument here is that we know and feel they are intelligent. Turns out not everything is.

Attributing these things to random events and nature doesn't make one wilfully ignorant or evil, likewise believing in God. We all sense things differently and we haven't even determined which God we are talking about? Yours or mine? Basically, your argument tactic has now gone from appealing to common sense to attacking the reader so they feel like if they don't accept your argument, they are being ignorant or living in denial.

Not a good way to argue 'common, clear to see facts' especially if we are being true to ourselves especially on the issue of God's existence and whether your God is the real one or mine.

odijeks:
2. Our Planet Earth.
The perfection of the Earth in relation to it's support of the billions of life in it never seizes to amaze. Earth is the only known planet equipped with an atmosphere of the right mixture of gases to sustain plant, animal and human life. This is attributed to it's perfect size and corresponding gravitational pull which causes it to be able to hold the right amount of oxygen and nitrogen adequate for life. If the earth were larger, it would contain an unreasonable amount of free hydrogen in its atmosphere. If it were smaller, it may not have an atmosphere large enough to protect the planet from solar and cosmic radiations from space. Still think this is co-incidence ? Let's look at the Earth's position in space as well.

The only known planet. The universe is near infinite. Come back when Scientists have proven that no life exists elsewhere.

odijeks:
NASA places the diameter of our solar system at a humongous 288,000,000,000 km. Dispersed within this wide space are 8 planets (including Earth). The distance from Earth to the sun is at about 150,000,000 km which is the perfect distance for Earth to be inhabitable. If the Earth were any further away from the sun, we would freeze. Any closer and we would burn up. With 8 planets dispersed within such a wide range of our solar system's diameter, you can calculate for yourself the probability of luckily finding a planet at that exact distance from the sun (that is not too far and not too close), then you decide for yourself if we were just ridiculously lucky or it was placed there by intent. Even a fractional variance in the Earth's position to the sun would make life on Earth impossible. The Earth remains this perfect distance from the sun while it rotates around the sun at a speed of nearly 67,000 mph. It is also rotating on its axis, allowing the entire surface of the Earth to be properly warmed and cooled every day.

odijeks:
3. Complexity of living organisms
From all I learned in biology classes, it would require an unreasonable level of faith to believe that highly complex biochemical reactions like oxidation phosphorylation, photosynthesis, enzymatic breakdown of ingested food, our amazing immune system, transmission of nervous impulses through the body, e.t.c, resulted out of mere chance. Even if I came into the world yesterday, I can't look at the twin towers and attribute them to forces of nature, thinking to myself "the wind, after several years, must have pushed all these blocks into place". These are amazingly complex and inter-linked reactions going on in us daily of which I'm sure that the best of scientists can't think up or create such a system so complex and independent. Still, scientists wouldn't admit the intelligence behind these processes. Let's look at blood clot formation for example. The reason why animal's don't bleed out till death after they get a cut is simply because of this complexly designed process. A cascade of events involving 12 different factors ensues when a blood vessel is broken. This linked events all lead to the formation of a clot at the site of bleeding in order to occlude the opening in the vessel. If just 1 of these 12 factors were missing, blood clot formation would be impossible and it would be a normal phenomenon for one to bleed to death after having an accident as minor as a paper cut. Yet all 12 factors (not 7,8 or 11) are currently present in the blood to initiate this reaction when needed. What's even more amazing is that these factors are present in your blood as you read this, yet they don't start forming the clots within the blood vessels because that would potentially kill you. They only initiate this process when you have a cut. That's just amazing if you ask me. This is just an example out of thousands of intelligent systems in nature. Do you really think such systems were built by chance or a highly intelligent being?

Again with the complex and intelligence argument. It is already proven that many of these designs aren't intelligent from our perspective and complexity isn't a requirement for intelligence. Chaos can cause complexity. In fact, from the human perspective, intelligent design wouldn't have us being susceptible to so many diseases but then, we would move to the intent of the creator which again muddles up your argument given that we can't decide the creator in the first place; Yours or mine?Jehovah or Allah or Zeus?

odijeks:
4. Theist Scientists
Most atheists often have this wrong ideology of "God VS Science". This is totally absurd because God himself is a scientist (the best at that) as we've seen in the above mentioned points. God made all scientific and universal laws and was in fact scientific in all his creation. God was actually leaving clues of his existence by showing his brilliance and intelligence in the works of nature and his intent was for man to search them out and acknowledge him (Proverbs 25:2). Many of the smartest human geniuses that have worked the earth were theist. These were really smart people who had knowledge of scientific laws and based most of their works on facts and scientific evidences. Yet, they didn't think it foolish to believe in a superior intelligent being. Why? Because they couldn't help but recognize God's signatures dispersed in the details along the quest of their research works. Some of these theist scientists include: Gregor Mendel, Galileo Galilei, Louis Pasteur, Michael Faraday, Isaac Newton, Blaise Pascal and even famous Albert Einstein to name a few. The more we go deeper in scientific discoveries, the more of God we see. It's however unfortunate and sad that most current scientists have refused to acknowledge this glaring truth (2 Corinthians 4:4)

That x was theist isn't a good argument. There were also geniuses who weren't theist and atheist scientists exist today so this is a terribly flawed point to raise. You also haven't answered whether many of these acted like theists simply because of the order of the day. Atheists couldn't simply go about and say God didn't exist you know? Plus many were born and raised to be theists and it is very difficult to break away from that especially in those days and given the result of all our searches, the truth is that we can't prove or disprove the existence of God so why blab about that? We can simply say Christianity or Islam is wrong about Y which many mistakenly assume is sufficient ground for atheism or theism.

God was leaving clues of his existence? Let me not say anything because you have now raised too many points based on your religion thus leaving the realm of objectivity.

Many brilliant scientists were Muslim, the inventor or Algebra being an example. Does that mean Christianity is false? See why your points need to remain objective rather than subjective when discussing the existence of God with regard to intelligent design and common sense?

odijeks:
5. God exists because he impresses this fact in the heart of men
The bible says the truth of God has been made known to man instinctively, for God put this knowledge in their hearts. Yet, some push the truth away from themselves (Romans 1:18,19). This shows that God made it unavoidable for man to see or feel his existence. God did not leave us to wander alone, aimlessly hoping that somehow we would stumble across the truth, which He intends for us to recognize. God wants us to find Him; therefore, He reaches out to us. Sometimes you wonder why the atheist goes through so much trouble just to discredit the bible or refute the idea that a God he doesn't even believe in exists. The atheist probably doesn't yet realize that the reason the topic of God weighs so heavily on his mind is simply because God is impressing it. God wants to be known. He made man unique from other creatures with the intent that we would seek and know him. He not only surrounded us with evidence of himself but He keeps the question of his existence squarely before us. God is presently nudging the hearts of people so that they might realize their sinful condition, the inevitable coming judgment, and their need of a Savior (John 16:8-11). The underlying reason atheists are bothered by people believing in God is because God is actively seeking them.



I know many atheist would go through this post in order to refute the ideas highlighted, but I'm not here to disprove atheism. I'm just here to cause the reader to really think for himself in an unbiased and neutral manner on these things. Regardless of what you may have heard, the truth the bible teaches is that God intensely loves you unconditionally. He is not going to love you more if you convert to a believer. He already loves you intensely, that's why he was willing to come in form of man and personally receive the punishment on the cross for the sins you've committed in the past or would ever commit in the future (John 3:16; Romans 5:3-8 ). The misconception that God punishes people in hell because they sin or refuse to love him is not the truth of the bible. Rather, the bible teaches that though we are guilty of many sins, God justifies us anyways and gives us eternal life if we accept and receive it through faith in Christ's sacrifice (Romans 5:16). The reason why anyone would go to hell fire is not because of this person's numerous sins. No!, it has been established that everyone (including the Christian) is born a sinner and commits sin. Yet, People are only judged guilty because they refused to receive the justification and eternal life freely given to them by Christ. It would really be shameful and agonizingly regretful to see yourself in hell not because you were morally the worst person on earth, but because you were too prideful to receive the gift of life that was already given to you freely by Christ. Choose life today if you haven't. God loves you.

As I've mentioned earlier, you've become subjective and you've failed to convince anybody yet you've quickly jumped towards subjective arguments to advance the views of your religion. The point of the whole post thus becomes clear and weakens your entire argument.

[size=64pt]Who you epp?[/size]

@cao I truly appreciate your help with the device tests and the feedback - thank you. The mobile sound issue will require either developing or looking for code that allows the sounds to load before the game begins. I'll try and incorporate it in future games so that the experience is better. Thanks again.

@cao wow! Thanks for the screenshots. I didn't expect iOS devices would have issues with it and I just tested on my default browser and it had the same issue but its now fixed. I'll try and look for an iOS device to test too and improve on the game.

Glad you got it to play on one of them though.

Thanks. Happy Halloween.

PS: Did it play a sound when you clicked on the one that worked?

Everything should be working now except for opera mini which doesn't allow javascript.

@xabi2 thanks

@cao Was it that the page didn't load or it loaded but didn't play. If its the first, I think you might have tried when I was fixing something on the server. Sorry about that. Thanks for checking it out though.

Description: Click on any of the boxes labeled 1 to 25, if its the nairaland box, it will take you to nairaland, else it will show you a scary picture.

Enjoy halloween!

Link: http://ibrame.github.io/treasurehunt/nairaland-halloween.html

Thanks for playing.

dasparrow:
@Post
"Homosexuals can't reproduce: Can you reproduce whilst wearing a condom? Do we ban couples who decide not to (or cannot) have any children from marrying? etc."
This statement you made is not adding up. What has wearing a condom got to do with anything? People who are done having children will wear a condom to avoid further pregnancies. Those not yet ready to become a parent or trying to prevent an STD will wear a condom. Couples who decide not to have children cannot be persecuted because it is better to not have children than to have children and not be able to adequately provide for them. Those suffering infertility should not be discriminated against either because often times, it is not the couple's fault.

Wearing a condom outlines the fact that sex is hardly for reproduction alone. We actively prevent reproduction by wearing condoms, forget about STD's in this case. Meaning us heterosexuals sometimes also want sex for its pleasure and intimacy value and nothing else. I.e sex for reproduction and pleasure can be mutually exclusive even if they can go together. A couple might stay together for 20 years and yet have only 2 kids, meaning 98% of about 1000 sex episodes are merely for pleasure. Heck, millions of people engage in self pleasure daily. That should drive home the point about sex.

On why we shouldn't discriminate against those that don't want children. What about couples that can but simply don't want. Its not always because of of wealth or some bad psychological issue. It is simply a choice made by sane minds.

As to infertility and not being one's fault, this is very funny because it makes me wonder if you've actually considered if most gay people are doing it by choice or were born that way. Sure, they could sleep with women, but does that stop them from being sexually attracted to men or women of the same sex. What are your views on that?

dasparrow:
@Post
However, when it comes to homosexuals and reproduction, it becomes a whole 'nother kettle of fish. Why? Because biologically, an ovum and an ovum CANNOT make a baby likewise, spermatozoa and spermatozoa CANNOT make a baby. Nature did not design it that way. So even if a man and a man should get married, they will never have a baby that carries the DNA of them both like it would have been with heterosexual couples. One of the homosexual men will have to find a woman who will give him an ovum so that his spermatozoa will fertilize it. And then, he and his 'husband' will claim the baby is their child but the child will never carry both their DNA. When the child grows up, he or she will DEMAND for his/her mother because men don't get pregnant. Nature did NOT design it that way.

I guess every heterosexual couple in the world have children that share their DNA. I didn't get the memo saying that despite husbands or wives dying or divorcing, when the remaining spouse remarries, all the children (including existing ones) get the DNA of the new partners. I'm guessing you're living on another planet.

If you're living on this planet however, let me state it to you loud and clear. There are millions of kids born of heterosexual couples that will never share the same DNA with those who will care for them. We call them orphans, abandoned, unwanted, etc. There are millions of kids who live with one parent alive or divorced and will only share the DNA of that one parent regardless of how many times that single parent remarries. These cases outline the fact that the most important thing for those children is having someone who can care for you as a parent, single, heterosexual or gay.

Sure, depending on experience, perhaps some self discovery journey, some kids might want to know the other guy or girl who donated towards the embryo, but that is hardly the most important thing. I'd say the most important thing is someone to nurture and take them to and through that point

And I guess the perfect answer to your nature argument is that if nature wanted us to be all fun loving heterosexuals, we'd be. But we're not.

dasparrow:
@Post
Lastly, generally speaking, Africans strongly believe in reproduction. Any relationship that is biologically not designed to bear offspring will be shunned hence the backlash homosexuality is receiving on the African continent.

Here again with the African thing. Where exactly did you get the idea that we strongly believe in reproduction and others don't. If anything, we failed and continually fail to understand the benefits and shortfalls of reproducing as fast and as much as we do compared to the rest of the world. Ever read about Thomas Malthus, female health and family planning? Ever wondered why public goods like electricity are said to be continually stretched by our population?

dozieamadi:
I think Africans should fight gay unions based on religoius belives not some stupid self call culture or morals.we have gays in Africa mind u

I do believe fighting based on religion is right, as long as it is kept to places of worship, not our constitution.

joywendy:
Gameaddict! Answer me na!
Edited my post so just answer the question

Hello @joywendy, sorry for the late reply.

I was expressing general criteria there for banning objectively harmful behavior. Take the following experience:

We didn't ban public smoking for a long time even though we had already established that smoking was objectively harmful. The question was whether the negative impact of public smoking was high enough to warrant a public ban. (Note, we could also ban smoking altogether but we've determined that the negative impact is not high enough to do so compared to drugs like cocaine).

Do we ban driving of non-solar cars because carbon emission is harmful to people and the environment? Likely, But nobody will ban it now because debates still exist as to the actual extent of the negative impact of burning fossil fuels, the benefits derived and the lack of alternatives to provide those benefits.

On the issue of LGBT rights, I don't think society will arrive at this point till someone can prove that LGBT acts are objectively harmful.

I hope its clear now.

shotster50:
Ignorance and the natural fear of change is to blame here... When people have invested so much time and energy being a certain way it is quite hard for them to see other angles.

Agreed, change is always difficult and it is human nature to resist change. How and why we resist any change is however highly important as it determines who we are as opposed to who we say we are. Africans like to talk about Africa being the cradle of civilization yet it seems we subscribe to ignorance and sentiments more often than we subscribe to research and fair debate when it comes to issues that affect human lives.

domopps:
Op you have a point but I don't get it!
Cheeeeeers

You don't have to understand or agree with all of the points. Proceed from any that challenges or agrees with your own view on the topic. I'm also trying to understand the whole issue better by hearing the other side of the argument.

nobilis:
I just pity this thread sha because the homophobia of Nairaland will find it and pounce on it but I hope you're strong enough to withstand their onslaught.

If someone calls me gay (which is the usual go to insult) I won't be offended because its more or less like calling a black man white. I'm not, so its a non issue for me. Any other insult is the cost of participating in any online discussion.

This is a short list with brief arguments. Please share your views on the points, challenge mine and refrain from insulting anyone.

Maintaining the purity of African culture: The number of changes African culture has witnessed makes this a laughable argument. If this were a good argument, we would all be visiting shrines instead of churches and mosques, twins would still be killed in certain places, women would not be able to get jobs in some places, etc. And many of us would be ruled by Kings and Queens. The point here is that culture is a dynamic aspect of human interaction. What matters is whether the change is harmful or otherwise. And no one is saying people that are not gay should become gay. What changes is how our culture treats the issue.

And, there was a time when human culture included slave ownership.

Going further, the fact that most of us are heterosexual doesn't negate the existence, functionality or inherent usefulness of other/opposite behavior to others. Determining what should be allowed must then take consideration of whether or not such behavior objectively (rather than subjectively) impacts on others positively or negatively. Additionally, if the behavior affects others negatively, is the impact sufficient to call for a ban?

E.g Should Christians and Muslim ban each other because some of them are offended by other religious doctrines?


Religious Views: If your religion says homosexuality is bad. Then it is bad for you. You however cannot use that to prevent others from engaging in such behavior unless it meets conditions such as the behavior actually causing you harm that cannot be objectively tolerated and causes serious harm to you as a human being. Experience from the west show that LGBT behavior can be tolerated and that such behavior does not negatively harm (in the non-tolerable sense of cultural and behavioral differences) the rest of society objectively especially given that no one is forced to be gay or otherwise. If a gay person forces you to officiate a gay wedding however, you have the right to seek redress as that person is forcing you to go against your beliefs.

If you however use your religion to institute a law that criminalizes LGBT behavior, you are more or less acting like Boko Haram and ISIS albeit in a white collar form, same way stealing and corruption are inherently the same.


Homosexuals can't reproduce: Can you reproduce whilst wearing a condom? Do we ban couples who decide not to (or cannot) have any children from marrying? etc.


Human rights: This especially concerns the aspect of criminalizing gay behavior. Many of us often cry about human rights abuse by dictators, the military and police officers, etc, we also cry about terrorism and genocide but at the end of the day, we are doing the same thing over and over - persecuting others based on subjective rather than objective harm to our own way of life.

If we want to claim our constitutions (African countries) are truly based on principles of human welfare and rights, we must admit given the issues at hand that we are not upholding those principles, at least not with sufficient consideration of what should and should not constitute our welfare and rights.

anonimi:



Any business admin/economics/accounting student understands the TIME LAG between investments and performance as well as the reverse i.e. LACK of continuous investments and SUBSEQUENT deterioration.
In 1984 the peaked number of passengers benefitted from PREVIOUS regimes' investments in railways that was yet to ROT away completely.

No wonder you gave us a very small excerpt of the businessdayonline story for a complete DISTORTION of what the news was all about. You were trying to be CUNNING hoping that most of our fellow citizens are LAZY mofos who won't bother to check out the source and read the whole news. Thankfully not everyone is like that.

Let us see a much larger excerpt of the same story from your provided link =>





Just as the daft pensioner did not buy any gun throughout his two year regime of terror as military DICTATOR he also did not buy any locomotive or coach hence passenger & cargo numbers continued to decline since 1977 until the Jonathan/Sambo decided to give REAL support to this vital sector and we have been seeing the results of steady PROGRESS everywhere

The article was published almost two years ago in April 2013.
Most of the planned rehabilitation & expansion by the federal administration highlighted above have been completed and citizens who had been deprived of this alternative means of transport are benefitting.



The story for Lagos state light rail of ONLY 27kms is very pathetic. This was a project that Jakande already started CONSTRUCTION before the sadist DESTROYER of the good works of others in the form of a military DICTATOR Buhari cancelled it and made the state pay hefty fines for breach of contract in 1983.
32 years later, we have no rail!

Four years after Toronto aloku scrap train propaganda show and two years after Fashola boasted in January 2013 that five months later in June 2013 we will be tweeting from inside his aloku trains. We can only hope that the Association of Pretending Crooks, APC that has been ruining Lagos state for 16 years will not tell us it was bad business like the N8 billion Sunborn yacht floating hotel

Amaechi's case is not different from SCAMMER Fashola's deception
Since Amaechi joined APC he has abandoned whatever little governance he was doing for Rivers state and recently came out to boldly say without shame that he cannot complete the Port Harcourt light rail.

Why would any right thinking Nigerian want to swap a PROGRESSively performing federal administration of Jonathan/Sambo for the FRAUDULENT people assembled in APC?
What type of citizen would do that except those afflicted by the Cow Cloned Brain Syndrome, CCBS


P.S.: Feel free to share this as widely as possible to all those you are following on NL and even outside NL.






Kai Buhari!!!
#Liberate-Lagos

So when its Buhari, we should attribute it to lag but when its Jonathan, no lag abi? Citizens that need train have being enjoying it. Who told you I don't need train too.

Also, you proceed to tarnishing anything APC related which expresses bias on your part and makes your long post useless.

bishopclin:
I saw various posts on the social media, criticising federal government's reduction of gasoline(PMS or Petrol) pump price from N97 to N87. More worrisome is the fact that some of our youths join the bandwagon in the criticism.

I wonder why we have some youths of our country who can not make use of their brains to ponder on issues that would further enrich the country. Present day youths are being tossed around by the older ones and sometimes, by illiterates. ‎

Drivers paid an average of $2.2021 a gallon for regular gasoline at U.S. pumps of recent in the US (do some ‎confirmation) 1US gallon = 3.7854ltrs‎ ‎$2.2021 = N398.58 (@ exchange rate of N181/$) Therefore, 1gallon = N398.58 ÷ ‎3.7854ltrs = N105.29/ltr in the US

Meanwhile, in Nigeria, after taking into consideration, landing costs and other expenses, it is N85/ltr for the same litre of gasoline yet people are ignorantly ranting on social media and elsewhere. Between Nigeria and the US, which is better? What has happened to some present day youths in my dear country, Nigeria‎? Mr. President, Goodluck Jonathan has indeed shown that he has the interest of Nigerians at heart.‎

[size=32pt]OP is a tricky statistician. First he used the wrong average price. Secondly, averages can be affected by extreme values which can be due to certain conditions in some state. Most states in the US are selling petrol for about $1.5 - $1.7/gallon. Check http://gasbuddy.com to confirm[/size]

9icetoo:

In the USA supply and demand determines the final price. In our blessed Nigeria, the price is fixed by the government and not by economic laws. if the government decides to subsidize PMS to the amount you quoted above, we would be in even worse condition than we are presently. (We made a budget with oil at 75 dollars a barrel; now oil is way below 50 dollars a barrel, where do you think they will manufacture money to continue subsidizing this commodity and yet continue running the government? I still maintain that subsidy should be abolished. When it is, local refineries will spring, buy crude oil at competitive rates, refine and sell at even lower prices. Not to mention the jobs they will create during their construction and subsequent operation. win win situation for all.

So because you don't want a worse situation, the government should list petrol price at above market price for its citizens? Abi you never get say with the current price (if you compute using actual us prices, its lower - OP used outdated or manufactured prices) you are actually subsidizing the government instead of them subsidizing you?