gebest:
A CANAL MAN CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE THINGS OF THE SPIRIT, IF U OR UR WIFE OR UR CHILDREN ARE SICK ND U ADMIT DEM IN D HOSPITAL ND U AR SPENDING ON D BILLS DONT U KN DAT IS A DEVOURER, ABEG I KN FIT TALK JAREE, U READ D BIBLE BUT U DONT UNDERSTAND IT.

Image123:


You may need to dedicate time to reading my previous posts on tithes on this forum, i really don't have the time to babysit your types.

Bidam:
So are you saying there is nothing to be gleaned from Malachi just like Paul quoted the law of moses to teach the corinthians on GIVING to ministers?

Bidam:

in the same way apostle Paul drew largely from OT scriptures and the Law of Moses to teach about christian giving for ministers of the gospel so it is in the same manner that many Christains express their giving in the form of tithes in their churches.

Zikkyy:


What exactly is the lesson learnt from Malachi 3? Other than showing punishment for disobedience and blessing for faithfulness. One thing am sure of; it is not a command for Christians to tithe.

Zikkyy:


Speak for yourself. My tithing friends/relatives tithe in other to avoid the 'devourer' and a solution to solving life problems.

vooks:

The flawed logic is the argument that Christ nailed to the Cross Torah but not the practice of tithing that preceded Torah.

gebest:

A CANAL MAN CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE THINGS OF THE SPIRIT, IF U OR UR WIFE OR UR CHILDREN ARE SICK ND U ADMIT DEM IN D HOSPITAL ND U AR SPENDING ON D BILLS DONT U KN DAT IS A DEVOURER, ABEG I KN FIT TALK JAREE, U READ D BIBLE BUT U DONT UNDERSTAND IT.

Zikkyy:


To be fair, i would say what was nailed to the cross is the command to tithe. The giving of a tenth (or tithe) cannot be cancelled. Remember that every giving can be a tenth of something. If Bidam chose to give a tenth of his income out of love to his church, i believe it is acceptable to God.

christemmbassey:
have u ever wondered why he had to rush to meet Abram on d way? Abram gave those war spoils to Melchi in appreciation, lf u did nt know, know today dat Melchi action was very clear,

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Your conjecture is what scriptures call private interpretation.

chysam:


I disagree with you sir even though you are beginning to take this issue personal.You see quotes and counter quotes can and will never help a layman find direction on this.Supposing a new convert is considering whether or not tithing is good n Christendom,qoutes from everwhere would not help him.Firstly he understands christ is his master and his ideologies he must follow.To my mnd and to the minds of reasonable people,those things he personally did physically should be our first priority,then we follow his words.Please I want any or all tithe paying advocators to simply tell us as is led by the spirit why Christ and his followers did not tithe.Also tell us why those who tithed previously stopped tithing upon receiving/accepting christ as their personal lord and saviou.All of us here know such people as is recorded in the bible.The simple education we need here is why this was so.Let those who know better teach us please.Importantly people who even wrote the bible did not tithe and yet performed great miracles and even raised the dead.I think the focal point should be why they were holy enough to write the bible and perform miracles even while disobeying the law of tithing.Please am really confused about this and very curious to know.Is it that we are better christians now? Or was it that they did not place value to that law? Or is it that chrisy was paying in secret without informing his disciples? Or was it that they as Christians had nothing seriouly in common with judizers? Or is it that they will later pay their own tithe in heaven? Please explain this area.I think saul before he became Paul tithed and even killed the christians,did he continue to tithe as a christian after he left judaism? Please let somebody educate me on this.My curiosity hinges on jesus' statement that he did not come to destro the law but to keep it,but why was his teachings different from the book he met on ground? As Christians,whose tradition are we supposed to emulate? Judaism or Christianity? Which did jesus'followers emulate? Judaism or Christianity? Infact why must there be two factions to start with since we are told all scriptures are from/of God?. Abi the disciples don't forget say all scriptures are of God before disobeying with..........Aaaah! I dey fear to mention one name oo because I no whether to say hin too disobey the scriptures. Any way let a pastor or someone vast in tithing and payment/receipt help me.Thanks

MarkMiwerds:
As is yours.

Bidam:

Is it a command for christians to give?

Bidam:

Since someone is more blessed if he gives than receive, can we safely conclude the result of not giving is poverty?

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So you agree he's doing private interpretation?

MarkMiwerds:
It is foolish to use Abram's tithe to prove a man-made law.

1. Abram tithed something entirely different than the tithe you insist is to be done.
2. Abram tithed something that did not even belong to him... spoils of war that he told God he would not claim as his own.
3. It matters not that Abram tithed before the Law. Once God said his tithe was to be agricultural, spoils of war could not be tithed from any longer.
4. God wanted far less from spoils of war than a tenth... far, far less.

You argue tithes are to be observed since they were given before the law. Yet, the Word of God proves that the tithe observed before the Law was nullified once the Law was established.

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Have we ever discussed this? Any recall?

Bidam:
Is it a command for christians to give? Since someone is more blessed if he gives than receive, can we safely conclude the result of not giving is poverty? A punishment if you look at it from that angle.

MarkMiwerds:
To some extent, yes.

The Bible does not say Melchizedek rushed to that Valley where he met Abram.

But likewise, the Bible does not say we are to tithe because Abram tithed.

MarkMiwerds:
December 2013-February 2014.

Image123:


Very good. So we have nothing further to discuss on that.

Bidam:

They should incline their ears more to the word of God.

Bidam:

They should incline their ears more to the word of God. Giving should be an act of worship emanating from the heart. Once that is settled it becomes a lifestyle borne out of love and devotion and not necessarily duty or because of some devourer.

Bidam:

let the newbie enjoy his toys.

Bidam:
Why would Paul says to be carnally minded is death but to be l
'spiritually minded' is life and peace? The difference between me and you is i see the tithe as a form of giving which is an ACT of worship and a legitimate kingdom principle that is NOWHERE condemned by the apostles.

An ACT of worshhip that attracts tags such as ROBBER and failure to which DEVOURERS descend on you? And why not circumcise as well as an ACT of Worship? SMH

Can you quote where i said so? I mentioned sanitary(hygiene) rules amongst others.


If they are not relevant, the apostles wouldn't have quoted them extensively to form the foundation of the NT. So i laff in tongues when 'novices' like you wake up one day to say we should discard the OT. Even the early church never had the NT for a span of 20yrs. What torah do you think they were using? Physics textbooks abi? It smacks of bible hermaneutics.

Relevance is not proved by quoting. Paul even quoted extra-Biblical poems to drive points home sir. They are part of the Old Covenant and we are not UNDER that. Christ had to die to redeem you from that! And why not keep them Feasts as well? Start with the Sabbath

So what strawman argument are you making then so you can knock yourself out? I already showed you in previous posts where the apostles of old drew "spiritual truth" from the OT. E.g Paul using the mosaic law to drive home a simple principle about giving.

Paul drew SEVERAL examples and they had one thing in common; supporting ministers of the gospel. This he deemed a RIGHT that he ocassionally resisted invoking like in Thessalonika, not threatening hellfire and curses to exact the same
. He could have easily invoked tithing 'principles' but he didn't. He instead alluded to the OVERALL sacrificial system where the priests ate offerings

No, it is rather unfortunate that you are the ignorant folk here. Does Act 15 mentioned lying, disobedient to parents, covetousness, stealing,gossips, laziness,cursing,bitterness, strife, blasphemy amongst a plethora of laws found in OT? Or maybe the Holy spirit forgot to "mention" them according to you. Or did you not read where the Apostles took note that Moses was read in their synagogues every sabbath? Or is it only the 4 requirements we gentiles are adhering to till date as christians who have good conduct?
All those things you mention are subsequently mentioned by ALL NT writers and the reference point was God-Holy Spirit teaching man from the heart

I can also argue too that if God so wanted BADLY to end tithing in all its form anywhere in the NT; there definitely would have been CLEAR condemnation of tithing in the teachings of the apostles just as there was clear condemnation on EXTERNAL circumcision as a REQUIREMENT for salvation by apostle Paul to the galatian church.

Terrible equivocation
The reason there was NO condemnation of tithing is because it was NEVER practiced save by the Jews to the Levites. It was NEVER taught that apostles stood in the place of priests. If it had been taught, you would not have missed it in at least one of the NT exhortations to charity or supporting ministry

Ok...keep your bile and bitterness off the thread if you want us to argue reasonably as adults. Last time i checked the forum is anonymous so this allegations on my person which is false by the way is uncalled for. You attack the message not the persons. Or i desist quoting you. I have already told you tithe is a form of giving and believers are free to express their givings in the form of tithes today since it is nowhere condemn in the NT or even the OT.

Nowhere is tithing taught as free, it is always by way of compulsion and malachi curses not to mention the Devourer are bandied around for a good measure. If you can honestly confess to NEVER having taught or heard in your church the malachi curses invoked on the non-tithers, please say so and I will duly apologize and withdraw my statement(s)

Freewill sacrifices are also nowhere condemned in either NT or OT so I wonder why you don't offer them as per Leviticus 22:23?

I wonder why folks take it upon themselves to argue uneccesarily against the idea of christians tithing in church.
I wonder why folks strain and twist scriptures to justify a doctrine that was injected into CHristianity 500 years AFTER Pentecost. What is the source of this 'new' revelation? Why was Holy Spirit not interested in sharing these powerful truths with the primitive/early church?

Bidam:
Can you quote a scripture to support this? That the abrahamic covenant was nullified? Scripture pls? Not side talks or eisegesis.

MarkMiwerds:
The Bible nowhere calls hospital visits "devourer." Nor does it call Physicians "devourer"

Jesus is known as the Great Physician. People brought their sick to Him and He healed them. Using your logic we can rightly call Him a "devourer."

Sorry, but "devourer" in the Hebrew Old Testament referred to the pest that ate the garden crops.... not hospitals.

Further, God said He would rebuke the devourer for Israel's sake. If the devourer was hospital bills, sickness, etc., God musthave forgotten His promise for those who would tithe. There is no obvious rebuke, for the hospital bills continue to be given. People who have tithed faithfully (such as my mother, who tithed each month for 50+ years,... even on her deathbed in the last year of her life) die of cancer, AIDS, ebola, and other diseases. Why was the devourer not rebuked from them? Is not God faithful to His promises? My Bible says He is.

So, if He is faithful to His promises, and those who believe their spiritual leaders when those leaders say God requires them to tithe money, tithe their money and still get sick, get bills, die, etc., it is evident that the "devourer" in Malachi is not, and cannot be referring to, hospital bills, sicknesses, etc..

In all thy getting get understanding. the Bible nowhere teaches tithes to be commanded for the Church, to be carried to the Church, or to be controlled by the Church.

Zikkyy:


So in your thoughts tithers don't visit the hospital? where are you from?

gebest:
pray for spiritual understanding and then test God with ur tithe.

vooks:
Abraham's circumcision too is as much the Word of God as praying in tongues. Do you circumcise in obedience to the Word to fulfill all righteousness?

TheShopKeeper:
A question to the pro-tithers' camp.

Do the present day Jews still pay their tithes (monetary or agricultural) & also do they still have to give firstfruit offerings?