Ur story reminds me how wicked some of you doctors are, that was how my wife lost her eight months pregnancy in 2014 and if not God's intervention I would have lost my wife too, stop judging everyone with another persons mistake. Money wasn't a problem at all in my case, When the emergency occurred we rushed into the private clinic but the doc asked us to go back to where she registered, we begged and I was ready to deposit any amount but he refused.

I lost my baby because it took us about 30minutes to get to another one.

I hate to remember it, but God will not forgive that doctor.

Dr sofadj please, I use God to beg you, please reconsider your stance. If you go through my profile, you will understand y I am begging u.

I was rushed to R-Jolad in Lagos at 4am on a Sunday morning, with the exact case the woman that died had. Placenta abruption, I nearly bled to death. I had 4 pints transfused.

I was leaving for US to deliver my baby, I had bought ticket, made some expenses such that hubby and I had no more cash at that instance. We didn't have N20k with us at dat time of the morning

They decided to operate immediately, hubby asked how much, d doc told us my life was most important, dey couldn't even wait to screen all d 4 pints of blood. He should sign, save my life before we discuss money.

That was how I survived the ordeal. The babies died but I survived. I was admitted for 10 days b4 they brought any bill. We sold off our dollars to foot d bill of almost 300k.

If RJOLAD did not admit me that day, without a dime, where would I have been? There's no day I don't pray for RJOLAD.

My point is don't cut off the nose to spite the face. God will reward you and replenish your pockets.

claremont:


It's not every treatment though, is it?! He still gets paid from patients, from in-house Pharmacy, and from Sales Reps. I understand that some patients choose not to pay, but future emergencies shouldn't be sacrificed on the grounds that patients in the past didn't pay. The oath the OP swore to protect life first at all costs also applies in Nigeria. It's just my opinion.

"Swear to protect life AT ALL COST"... The problem is dat you always look at it as if the Doctor is d only one who works in d hospital so he's the one who'll chop all d money...the nurse or other staff follow me take d oath? My wife and pikin sabi d meaning of oath? Your own na to get your cure even if hunger kill me & my family throway or staffs jack my neck for their salary or my kids are thrown out of school or forced to enroll in a school where they use Yoruba to teach Maths...e no go better for such a useless oath!

beautycrush24:
Yea yea....the blood is not in your hands....we know. But why not charge them d least you can? Someone will b admitted for one day and d doctor will be callin 50k bill. Is that fair? When you see a patient and d people that accompanied him/her then u can guess how rich or poor they are. If u observe they're not well to do, then charge exactly what u'll need to treat them without thinking of gains. Cos wen d bill is so high, the person wont even know where to start from.
You can make ur money off the rich ones....nobody will blame u for that

Unfortunately, he also has bills to pay. He ll pay his nurses, his cleaners and Secretary and everyone. If he doesn't own the building he ll pay tent. There's no way the hospital will run if he charges the barest minimum.

nefertitiram:
Dr sofadj please, I use God to beg you, please reconsider your stance. If you go through my profile, you will understand y I am begging u.

I was rushed to R-Jolad in Lagos at 4am on a Sunday morning, with the exact case the woman that died had. Placenta abruption, I nearly bled to death. I had 4 pints transfused.

I was leaving for US to deliver my baby, I had bought ticket, made some expenses such that hubby and I had no more cash at that instance. We didn't have N20k with us at dat time of the morning

They decided to operate immediately, hubby asked how much, d doc told us my life was most important, dey couldn't even wait to screen all d 4 pints of blood. He should sign, save my life before we discuss money.

That was how I survived the ordeal. The babies died but I survived. I was admitted for 10 days b4 they brought any bill. We sold off our dollars to foot d bill of almost 300k.

If RJOLAD did not admit me that day, without a dime, where would I have been? There's no day I don't pray for RJOLAD.

My point is don't cut off the nose to spite the face. God will reward you and replenish your pockets.

It was in that situation a doctor refused admitting my wife. Placenta abruptio was what happened too. The nurses had already brought something to roll her in before the man refused, they all cried when they saw my wife bleeding.

Not an experience to remember at all, it was my first baby after 3years of marriage then.

If I have my way I will close down that clinic.

samdes02:
now that's rather unfair to the doc. You don't find it DISGUSTING that patients more often than not would prefer to give all they have to the pastors/imams/herbalist/ "chemists" etc.,who worsen things and yield no results only to come to the hospital and declare "bankruptcy". Fact is Doctors are humans and they have needs just as everyone else. IT'S not a sin for one to earn from his/her practice.

And d most annoying part is coming to quote our Hippocratic oath out of context thinking they can use that to outsmart one...very irritating set of people.

Leopantro:


For how long will you be father Christmas. Note that even in America, that places health on a high level, you must pay if you are not in insurance. If you can't pay, they would stabilize you and bounce you. You have a family to take care of and bills to pay.

As for religion, a girl has tetanus and was taken to a church were she s was told it was evil spirits. During the prayer session her two hands were broken. When the spirit refused to leave they referred her to our hospital. First was a down payment before admission and at the end of treatment, we also charged for her stupidity ( a graduate)

My brother I suffered a terrible loss early in life. I lost my mum at 7. That in part informed my decision to be a doctor. I vowed never to see someone hurt the way I did and still do as long as its within my power. I remain committed to the vowed I made as an innocent child.

However, d way patients and their relatives go about this issue of bills settlement of has been discouraging. You can't compare the Health system in the US with dat of Nigeria. Ours is terribly pathetic. Besides majority of our people live below the poverty line. Ironically, the poor are the worse hit in matters of Health.

I believe doctors should continue to uphold the sanctity of human life. However, all efforts should be made to recoup monies owed. Recently, I mentally strengthened my resolve dat no patient leaves the clinic until they have cleared their bills. Implementation hasn't been be easy but I have recorded a certain degree of success.

More importantly I have shifted focus from curative measures to Preventive measures. I believe disease prevention through health education and promotion has been grossly neglected by doctors. I now send weekly health tips some family, friends and other associates via different channels of communication. Am equally focusing on using WHO'S recognised health or health related days to promote well being. I know it's tasking to combine routine practice and this but determination and passion has been helpful.

I strongly believe dat if government can partner with doctors at all levels to place emphasis on disease prevention through health education and promotion some of the life threatening conditions we witness in our health facilities will naturally drop. It's my opinion that every doctor in his own little way try to educate his patients and others he comes in contact with on the need to be health conscious.

I think the point is how does the hospital continue to provide service if the patients or their HMO does not pay. Government cannot even fund healthcare properly. I think we patients need to ne honest and get health insurance thats the only way forward.

Expecting Private hospitals to survive like This Is unrealistic though sad.

Leopantro:


Story.
What if he employs you in the hospital and at the end of the month tells you that his patients haven't paid but because of his Oath he can't force them to pay and you should wait till next month. Your mouth will change.

Wonderful response!

Leopantro:


For how long will you be father Christmas. Note that even in America, that places health on a high level, you must pay if you are not in insurance. If you can't pay, they would stabilize you and bounce you. You have a family to take care of and bills to pay.

As for religion, a girl has tetanus and was taken to a church were she s was told it was evil spirits. During the prayer session her two hands were broken. When the spirit refused to leave they referred her to our hospital. First was a down payment before admission and at the end of treatment, we also charged for her stupidity ( a graduate)

In America all hospitals are required under EMTALA law to provide comprehensive treatment to all patients irrespective of their ability to pay.

How do you stabilize a woman in labour without delivering her!

The OP doesn't even want to stabilze any body who cannot pay
One example below:

How he did this, I do not know[font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font]

Sunnycliff:
The True Dilemma of a Nigerian Medical Practitioner!

Man have always been man's greatest threat....in Nigeria man is worst than our worst enemy.

EreluY:



[size=16pt]Whilst I understand your frustration, all medical doctors in saner climes take the Hippocratic oath -- "a ​promise made by ​people when they ​become ​doctors to do everything ​possible to ​help ​their ​patients." You won't excuse a Reverend Father who took the celibacy oath and then go on shagging women under the excuse that "body no be wood." Would you?[/size]

no I won't, but would you excuse all the women who would hinge on the said oath of celibacy andswear to lure the Padre into shagging them?

mmm i feel your frustration & pain but whats the best way out of this situation

This is terrible! This country needs anabolic and catalytic reform! Every family should make it a point of duty to have emergency savings!!! Aww!

dexpotter:
You have a right judgement. But should the latter be punished for the sins of those that came before them? What if u were not a doc n ur wife or mother fall into similar situation n u are not dere 2 hlp financially @ dat moment??

The truth is, consumables are needed for a hospital to function. Such as gauze, needles,etc and even fuel. When a hospital is running bankrupt and doesn't have the things to use, then there's no point in admitting patients.

amunites19:
Some doctors are really good and very helpful, but I think the best way to solve Nigerian health problems is doctors must find another extra way of making money instead of completely depending of their medical processes. Medical system is like men of God who try preach for God, ones they totally depend on it as their main source of income they can never get it right.

Do you know the kind of stress it takes and d energy it saps out of one just to do my job as a Doctor? So after performing a tasking 4hour operation for peanuts i should still go out and hustle to make actual ends meet and fen come back for another surgery again... Den when i doze off on a patient and forget a forceps in d intestine you'll be the first to call for my Jugular...

Despite the fact i was working alone in d ward seeing 5 different patients at the same time...i was so overwhelmed i forgot to document for a patient what i actually did for him..yet my Oga scolded me and told me i must always document first for each patient i see b4 moving to another patient because d Lawyer will not hear dat one in court oh...he'll look for every means to nail you even though i was trying to save as much people's life by attending to emergencies first b4 documenting.

Even in developed countries Doctors actually practise safety dan compassion now cos the people you're having compassion for will tear you to pieces in d court of law....

daretodiffer:
It was for the above reasons I had to modify my post on another thread where a pregnant woman died outside the hospital.

ehen. I no see that one.where e dey. Where the modification dey,where the modifier dey and where is the modified.

staymore:


It was in that situation a doctor refused admitting my wife. Placenta abruptio was what happened too. The nurses had already brought something to roll her in before the man refused, they all cried when they saw my wife bleeding.

Not an experience to remember at all, it was my first baby after 3years of marriage then.

If I have my way I will close down that clinic.

Go and close it down...

The worst is that Nigerians always have a timid and primitive judgmental attitudes.....we are killing ourselves by our actions. Yet if desperate measures are taken, we will bad mouth and tag them wicked, inhumane etc.

I think the government should step into this and make the health insurance scheme work. Also Nigerians are at apex very ignorant, so many people have no prior idea the implication of their actions, they barely know that their actions are directly or indirectly killing others, hence when nemesis visits, they'd sort for mirage excuses that feel good. People should be sensitize of how hospitals are run. You don't just assume they have it all or the government provides everything. Just as we have a failed government from the head, it affect every other parts.

So awareness should be put in place, people should be made to understand that when they fail to foot their bills it manipulate decisions of hospitals on prospective victims, hence, they took part in victimizing any casualty.

staymore:
Ur story reminds me how wicked some of you doctors are, that was how my wife lost her eight months pregnancy in 2014 and if not God's intervention I would have lost my wife too, stop judging everyone with another persons mistake. Money wasn't a problem at all in my case, When the emergency occurred we rushed into the private clinic but the doc asked us to go back to where she registered, we begged and I was ready to deposit any amount but he refused.

I lost my baby because it took us about 30minutes to get to another one.

I hate to remember it, but God will not forgive that doctor.

Sorry about your loss, but I doubt the doctor refused you treatment just because he felt like. It might have been a case that he couldn't handle and had to refer you. There are specialties in medicine. I can't expect a cardiology center or renal center to accept a clear case of acute appendicitis

EreluY:



[size=16pt]Whilst I understand your frustration, all medical doctors in saner climes take the Hippocratic oath -- "a ​promise made by ​people when they ​become ​doctors to do everything ​possible to ​help ​their ​patients." You won't excuse a Reverend Father who took the celibacy oath and then go on shagging women under the excuse that "body no be wood." Would you?[/size]

If you run a hospital obviously you would close down in 24hrs, how would you pay bills buy supply, pay staffs if you keep saving all patients to without payment. Gosh

Seems I will change my mind from building a clinic now ...learning from this your own experience.am just thinking of a business where I can invest now.may be I will go for school hostel or event centre.truly people dnt like to pay once they are fine.

staymore:
Ur story reminds me how wicked some of you doctors are, that was how my wife lost her eight months pregnancy in 2014 and if not God's intervention I would have lost my wife too, stop judging everyone with another persons mistake. Money wasn't a problem at all in my case, When the emergency occurred we rushed into the private clinic but the doc asked us to go back to where she registered, we begged and I was ready to deposit any amount but he refused.

I lost my baby because it took us about 30minutes to get to another one.

I hate to remember it, but God will not forgive that doctor.

My brother, sorry about your loss. However, could it be that the said doctor didn't have the required skill to manage your wife on presentation? Could it be that the said was obviously exhausted or had some form of emotional disturbances that could have interfered with the quality of care your wife needed? Doctors are trained. Their eyes, hands, ears and every other senses are trained. Could it be that doctor knew that this is a bad case and it would be better she been seen by her 'main' doctor?

Am not trying to make excuses for a colleague. Am only trying to paint a different scenario. Nurses, and patients relatives maybe sympathetic. Doctors are not. They are empathic. The nurses may have felt sympathy for your but it's against Medical ethics for a doctor to do same. One of the best piece of advice I received earlier on in my career was from a senior colleague. He told me a good doctor isn't d one that knows how to prescribe drugs. Rather, it's the one dat knows when to call for help. Dat advice has saved many a time.

So my brother, kindly forgive whatever wrong you felt this doctor did you. At times we need to be in people's shoes to know how it feels in certain circumstances. God has been gracious to you. Your wife is alive and you have kids now. Why don't you let go of the ill feelings?

[quote author=sofadj post=44037086]I own a hospital in Southwest- (not Osun state Nigeria ...lol). I currently have about 17 patients on my ward each of whom I have admitted at several occasions through emergency. None of these patients has paid upto 30% of his/her bill. Some of them have stayed upto 7 weeks on the ward. I admitted and attended to them based on the fact that their conditions were life-threatening as at the time they came. I made their bill known to them - and they signed before they were treated. But there is a common trend, as soon as they felt relief and became stable they pleaded for their bills to be reduced - this I vehemently refused.

About 4 weeks ago a woman was rushed in with Eclampsia having just convulsed while pregnant and she was unconscious. I promptly took her straight to the theatre without collecting a dime though i had informed the relatives of the charges - #120,000 for her operation and medications. They signed and I carried out the surgery succesfully. Mother and baby survived. Within the following 6-days they paid a total sum of #12,000 and they began pleading to go home for the child's christening ceremony. I looked at them with disdain. Till now, they have only managed to pay a total sum of #14,000.

Another man who was managed for strangulated hernia has only paid 20,000 out of 75,000 bill. And the list goes on. Their failure to pay has made it difficult for the hospital to replace consumables and medications needed to manage other people's condition.
In the early hours of today 1:30am, a woman was rushed into the hospital following delivery at the referrral center. Blood had refused to stop gushing out. I did a quick assesment and realised she would need more materials than the hospital pharmacy currently had in store. I could have my staff get from a nearby pharmacy too. However, the husband said he had no money on him and so did the numerous relatives that accompanied. It was indeed a familiar pattern. I decided to let them go. I referred her to a government hospital. Ofcourse they pleaded for me to help but there was nothing I could do. Few minutes after they left - just few metres from my hospital gate, she collapsed. She had lost a lot of blood. I rushed there and rigorously tried resuscitating her right there outside the hospital 2am early morning, but all efforts proved abortive. A young woman of 28years had just died after having her first baby. Screams, wails, cries ensued. I felt bad - this is not why i became a doctor. But her blood is not on my hands.

Her blood is on the hands and heads of all the patients on the ward who can afford to pay but refused to - on the grounds that - "What will they do?. Her blood is on the hands and heads of the government officials past and present who have made it difficult and impossible for workers to get paid for their work. But the government officials are not the target of this my narrat. It is aimed at those who take hospital healthcare and medical doctors for granted. Those (including myself) who emphasise that doctors should not put money first before treating emergency conditions. In emergency cases, relatives would go to any length through any struggle to get money. As soon as the situation becomes calm, they relax and then they refuse to pay.

Last year a distant relative of mine was delivered of her baby via Caesearian section (in a hospital in Lagos- not mine). They were billed #180,000 which they accepted before the operation. After the surgery, her husband called me and asked how much I charge and i told him. He then began pleading with the management of the said hospital to review his bill. They declined. The husband being who he is, paid #120,000 and absconded with his wife and his newly born son. How he did this, I do not know, but i know that at the christening ceremony a week later, he had two cows slaughtered to celebrate the birth of his first son.

Many times we complain of doctors who ask for charges before treating patients but no one has ever bothered to ask the doctors why they do? Doctors are humans too, we need to pay bills. This is our trade, our profession, our means of livelihood. We have needs too. We can not go to the market place with the ID showing that we're doctors and hope to get food items on credit. We need to pay our children's school fees, we need clothes , shelter etc just as you. Everywhere in the world healthcare is expensive, both services and materials are exepensive. Well we understand that you may not have money. The government should find a way. The government should find a way/policy that ensures that we get our money back after we have rendered our service. In the UK there is the National Health Scheme, in the United states they have health insurance schemes too in addition to Medicare, Medicaid. In Nigeria we have the barely effective, poorly regulated and massively corrupt National Health Insurance Scheme.

Well i have decided to change the modus operandi of my institution. The previous one has not benefitted anybody. Henceforth if any one comes to my emergency room without a dime. I will not attend to. If such a person dies, the blood is not on my hands, its on the hands of those who have received treatment in the past and failed to pay afterwards.
[/quot

it's so pathetic abt d situation of dis country DAT pple hav no insurànce to get a quicker Health service

eyinjuege:


Sorry about your loss, but I doubt the doctor refused you treatment just because he felt like. It might have been a case that he couldn't handle and had to refer you. There are specialties in medicine. I can't expect a cardiology center or renal center to accept a clear case of acute appendicitis

Thanks. The doctor didn't explain he couldn't handle such cases. He only said she didn't do her antenatal there, that I should take her to where she registered. And driving back to where she registered would take about 30minutes without hold up, with hold up could be hours.

Perils of the medical profession

Op, u wia trained to save lives @any cost, in case u dnt kw dt lady's blood is on ur hands(am nt sayn ds to make u feel bad or angry),. Nw I understand u n I cn relate to ur plight. I think wat u shuld be doin frm nw on is to detain them, afta treatment do nt allow them to go until dia bill is settled cos I wouldn't wnt u to reject treating another soul dt needs treatment b/c of d mistakes of others pls. Pls, dnt lock ur hrt, dias a reason u r a doctor n it is to save lives, dnt allow ds type of incident occur again in ur hospital. Tamper justice wt mercy pls.

julybaba:
My brother, tough people like Nigerians need to be "beaten into shape".

Hahahaha

olas24u:


So they should be given fake medication?.if he gives the lowest grades of the drugs the patient will die 12 times over.it is against the ethics of the profession to cheat ,if he does that and they discover ,you will not defend him.

you dey mind am?

laprince:
I still join to blame the government. Both past and present. NHIS os long dead and buried.

Many people don't even know or understand what NHIS stands for.

nhis isn't dead . I don't know the hospital you use but I can tell you nhis is well active .

claremont:


If I were you, I would rather quit being a Doctor than do the bolded. If you choose to place money before a life, you are in violation of the oath you swore to protect life. What I particularly find disgusting is that you try to justify your actions on the premise that a few patients in the past refused to pay you, you are now making your future patients vicariously liable for the handiwork of your previous patients. It makes no sense mate, just choose a different career path.

So when he quits being a doctor, that solves the problem?

abeg shift.