nass07: Nigerians need to wise up, things have changed, despite the odds white collar jobs employee nigerian can feed a blue collar job nigerian abroad and even sponsor that individual's education at home.

Why do you guys use a few people to judge the huge number of struggling Nigerians in Nigeria. I studied outside of Nigeria for my B.Sc and it would be good to tell you that a large number of Africans who are hard working where i live would have completed a nice duplex easily in Nigeria before they got their B.Sc. Now tell me, all the years i spent studying in Nigeria, i was caked up by my parent for pocket money.

Take a look at the photo (Independence day celebration in the U.S) below. Would you tell me that all these people have white collar jobs in the U.S? Let us assume the heads you see in this picture is the population of Nigerians in the U.S and they all come back to Nigeria with at least a Masters degree, who will employ them?

See, Op, life is not easy anywhere, your friend should have had a back up plan. I always say Nigerians stay back in the U.K. because they think they have found their nirvana. Europe is a big continent, go out and explore.

360command: you really want to know how good chemistry is ? just wait till you finish your degree in chemistry, watch and see where NYSC will post you too, guy, you will hate ever studying chemistry.After your NYSC, not all those ones you are telling your father about getting a job in petroleum sector, pharmaceutical sector , where you will find job is been a lab attendant in a secondary school or a chemistry teacher. Well, all of you that likes to think big, by saying 'i want to work in petroleum company or whatsoever , think twice. It level that puts people there.

Since you are in a choosy situation between medicine and chemisty , go for the chemistry and come out in another 2-3 years time.Look for professional courses in business management and do so as you can combine it with your chemistry degree. I said this because i know of a friend of mine who read Medical Laboratory in Ghana, which i believe medical lab is better than chemisty. He came to Nigeria to do NYSC , where he was posted was a dead laboratory building where nothing is functioning.The woman in charge greeted him by saying 'WELCOME TO THIS HELL HOLE'.He never accepted the transfer and looked for other places of his choice forfeiting 4 month NYSC salary. Right now, he is doing or must have finish his business management courses(PG)

This is a risible post!

Desmond, the prospects for a maths graduate has already been hatched in this section, just do some search on the forum to learn more.

I laugh in Zulu. Back to your post. As a former trainer myself, i think your first task is to find out what they actually want to learn.

joey4jo:
True talk, but some places more than others. You got to consider safety. What's the point if there's a high possibility you wouldn't finish alive. Get my point!?

Have you been to Germany before? have you lived anywhere in the Europe Union before? Are those making a living in those countries returning to Nigeria because of racism?

xplen: Yes it does, I did BSc Industrial Chemistry, now doing MSc Oil and Gas Operation Management and got another offer in MSc Chemical Engineering tho not Scholarship. But is it advisable to get 2 masters or i should proceed to PhD instead of the 2nd masters tho i dont wanna become a lecturer? Thanks

Your decision should now be, if you want to be a manager or an engineer? In my opinion it is not too much to have a second masters but you might want to get some work experience under your belt so you don't become over-qualified for some entry level jobs(not like it is a bad thing).

500 euros is almost free my bro. There is racism everywhere bro, just be yourself.

كلورين:
Are you one, if you don't mind me asking?

nah, Logistics Engineering

http://www2.uni-siegen.de/mechatronics/

Mechatronics curriculum
1st and 2nd semester: graduate courses in Control and System Theory, Electrical Engineering, Electronics, Mechanical Engineering with the corresponding laboratories
3rd semester: Advanced Control Theory, Applied Computer Science and Mechatronics
4th semester: Master Thesis in one of the active research groups of the department

http://www.come.tum.de/cms/

Computation in Engineering
Computational Material Modeling 1
FE-Modelling, Simulation and Validation
Finite Element Methods I
Continuum Mechanics and Tensor Analysis
Fluid Mechanics and Turbulence

For more, google www.daad.de then continue from there.

Oh, God bless Germany, many schools offer this course and its affiliates and for freeeeee.

And there is really no new lesson here to teach Nigerian entrepreneurs. Most Nigerians know these things.

Is the other admission you got on scholarship? if no, do you think your first masters degree is of no value to you?

Phinga: At abinibi i'm a chemical engineerin student graduatin next year by d grace of God. really need advice on how to move in the necessary direction already i did a course a on 'offshore exploration and float over technology' though will like to enrol 4 more professional courses but its d resources that's kind of delayin me. My grades are good too. I just wanna know what's d way forward.

If you have good grades, why don't you try getting a job? If none is not forthcoming, then you can as well try to apply for a masters course. You should read the Oil and Gas threads as well to get more insight. https://www.nairaland.com/768160/total-oil-gas-workers

Hope this helps

Ola2much: Pls house i really ur advice b4 making any move.pls wich of these is the best studying mathematics at unilorin or civil engr at yabatech.ur advice will be apprc8d if wit reason.thanks,ur advice will help me in d future.

Study mathematics

AjanleKoko:

Bros, this is unnecessary.
BlueDiva actually works for an oil company.
Plus, I think most of you misunderstood her. She's not trying to rain on anybody's parade. She only queried the reason for a parade in the first place. Which i understand perfectly. She's a HR person. Why would a staff of Total come on this thread and declare the company's remuneration to the general public? If you were a staff of Total, disclosing your package details on a public Internet forum is most likely a breach of your employment contract and you could be fired.

And how come the singular thing about Total that is discussed on this thread is their salary?

Is it just me (and maybe BlueDiva), or is there something seriously wrong with Nigerians?

Even if she owns total, i don't agree with her persistent flouting of this thread. If she does not work in oil and gas, i would have said its pure sour grapes.

It won't go extinct because some Americans would want to keep their jobs.

BlueDiva:

It's you again.
Does your job schedule now involve following a diva around?

BlueDiva: ^^^
Chief, don't ask o.
Oyel money people are not smiling these days.

I wonder where exactly you are from . I'd be surprised if you are not a Nigerian graduate yourself, so why the hating?

BlueDiva: Since inception of this thread how many of us are now in Total?
Baba Kasali has since made millions from his farm while majority still daydream of Total.

If you want to work in Total, send your CV to me. . .

Is this what you have chosen to do for a full time job?

richarts: ''I am just as I described?''... I dnt know wat to say. detailed, a reader, a learner, a keen observant, a good listener, someone who puts attention to questions asked.

Your posts came across to me like someone who has those highlighted qualities.

Ihedinobi:

My position on this is that, the undergrad degree is not supposed to be a sort of glorified secondary school certificate. It implies that the holder is capable of fitting into, at least, general tasks in his field. If this is not the prevailing reality, something is wrong.

The bachelor's should put its holder on the job. That training that one is given to fit into a general task encompassed by his degree only says that the degree has fallen in true value. Please allow me to illustrate.

Part of my schoolwork involved engineering law. If I had finished my degree and got employed in a company as an electronic engineer, I shouldn't need more training to be able to advise my employer to pursue a patent for one of the devices or technologies we cook up in R and D. I should even have enough foundation to, by myself, study up on the process and prepare a plan for obtaining the patent and protecting my employer's ownership rights until the patent is obtained. That's my point.

The bachelor's should testify to a bias in its holder to knowledge of a particular type. It should say reliably that its holder is grounded in such and such fields so that on the job he can come up with solutions to <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">general</a> tasks in his field without aid. I believe that the Master's says that its holder is so capable in a particular section of his field that he should be consulted on every important issue bordering on it. So the Master's holder should not be used for general tasks except on the strength of his Bachelor's. His Master's is useful for, as an instance, <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">satellite</a> design and building in the telecomm field. There are other highly specialized involvements in that field. But you get my point, I hope.

Remember that my emphasis is on "should". How do I know what "should" be or what shouldn't be? History. Why did the university come into being? What is learning founded upon? That tells whether we have gotten better or worse.

You do get my point, I hope. I really do appreciate discussing this with you guys because it's helping me understand life generally a little more and to review my current plans.

Your point is now crystal clear to me. A more practical approach should be incorporated in the Bachelors curriculum has been your stand point. Even for someone like me who traveled to different countries as an undergraduate on excursion, i still wanted more because of my wary nature to the demands from the employment market. That was how i got bludgeoned to apply for a masters program immediately after my bachelors, so that i can narrow my understanding to a chosen field and deepen my knowledge in it.

As for the placing more value to the B.Sc, a similar analogy would be, what we bought with 500 Naira 10 years ago should not be sold at 1000 Naira today

trae_z:

For interviews aim to dress as your interviewers are dressed.

Please to be proactive go and research the internet for tips on how to prepare and conduct yourself at interviews.

Talking about proactive, i actually googled that information immediately i made my first comment to get an insight. I would say there is no 'one size fits all' solution to it. All suggestions i read online were the contributors opinions. Employers preferences may vary, i bet treading the safe line should be watchword.

richarts:

I will say I fall into the category of what you described up here... detailed, a reader, a learner, a keen observant, a good listener, someone who puts attention to questions asked... Infact I prepare for interviews like its an exam. So if one falls into this category & still fail interviews then I think the problem is the person.

NB: There are exceptions of ''waiting for ones time (spiritual)'' etc but im just saying people without jobs should stop blaming the enviroment for once... Ofcourse the enviroment is not condusive but we should shift focus a little bit on ourselves. I know u would agree with me from the window through which im viewing this.

Congrats on your job success. I am sure you are just as you described in the first paragraph.

Ihedinobi:

@the bolded: How so, sir?

You have religiously asserted that teaching styles should change from what it is today. You emphasized a more practical approach to teaching as opposed to only/very theoretical approach which in itself is a good thing.

That was why i said that learning theory at the Bachelors level over a very wide spectrum of topics does not necessarily put you on the job. You still have to be trained for some time to be able to apply your school lessons to the job.

If i list what my undergraduate curriculum entails maybe you will understand me a lot better.

Ihedinobi:

This thread is not that recent, you know. I posted it when I was putting together a plan to start a new undergrad <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#"><a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">degree</a></a> in industrial engineering. I wanted to do it in Nigeria since that is what my reality allows. I had learned that the University of Ibadan was the only uni offering it and wanted to make sure of that and get some idea what the <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#"><a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">career</a></a> environment is like in Nigeria. That was why I posted the thread. I didn't get a hit in quite some time. In fact, this was the third thread I started about it. By the time you guys started responding, my plans had already begun changing.

However, I don't quite understand why you insist on limiting the sphere of my discourse to Nigeria. I was speaking of global realities and referencing Nigeria. I can reference Nigeria, sir, because I am a Nigerian living and working in Nigerian realities everyday. Yes sir, I am employed, I don't quite know why you assumed that I am not working in the Nigerian environment.

Also, how does not finishing my degree disqualify me and render me incompetent to address educational realities in Nigeria? I did spend five years in a Nigerian university, two years in a polytechnic earlier and twelve years in pre-tertiary institutions. Do I read in my submissions like I am unacquainted with Nigerian realities? Am I not making sense?

Again, look a little beyond Nigeria. Take a worldview and discuss with me on that basis.

Yet, i still maintain that you are with us on what a B.Sc is today. I don't know how different it is from the past in which you referenced your parents. The truth is, only a few Bachelors degree can put you on the job with a very very deep knowledge of your field without any prior training. That is what a Masters will do for you nowadays. The job front is very competitive, more demanding than ever. Employers don't even want to train you because it cost them to do that, hence the reason for the emphasis on 'experience'.

In Europe, most scientific universities have a curriculum that pushes students straight to the masters level without any break. This is what you see in countries like Germany, France, Finland etc. But of course, the students could have garnered some work experience during their summer breaks which we don't necessarily have in Nigeria except for compulsory I.T at our polytechnics.

Extreme competitions created the current realities on ground. That is why a polytechnic education is still a must in any progressive economy.

AjanleKoko:

An interesting summation, considering that you never finished your degree in Nigeria, nor have you worked in the Nigerian environment.
So how do you come about it? The Nigerian style of 'sweeping generalization'?

I don't think you need advice or information. Maybe you just needed a thread to blow some steam. End of.

Interesting indeed. I bet he was on the same page with us on the generic nature of a B.Sc. I found the objection rather contradictory to his proposed change to the style of educating in this current paradigm.

richarts: I observed intently on Nairaland how some people got their <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">jobs</a> via this site, how they got it by favour & how a lot of people are still looking for a job that they deserve. I observed intently my friends that we graduated together & how some are... I mean most of them have good paying jobs while some of us were still waiting to get our first job.

Dont forget im talking about jobs & not entrepreneurship here. I was keenly interested in this aspect of life ie jobs because I was a graduate, third best in my department & for a long time after service I couldnt get a job. Pls note I do not have issues with exams but I noticed I never went beyond interview... I never get called.

I started to think spiritual, I started to condemn the country. More than anything I kept believing in myself because im a <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">very</a> hopeful person. I just couldnt get a job.

All my close friends have good jobs with Harwoth & Dafinone, Ilo Chambers, KPMG, Dangote, SKYEbank... To mention a few, I started to feel so useless & socially exclusive. One thing that kept me going was that I had associated myself with good people right from <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">school</a> & so they kept encouraging me, then something happend.

I had submitted my CV with a company, did the test, with favour of Christ I passed & was called for interview... I never knew until that day that I sucked at interviews. The interviewer was from my state, knows my surname & just wanted to help. He was furious with me & was about chasing me out. I thought I was good but folks I have been the author of my own failures. I was bad at interviews... I say the wrong things.

He eventually taught me how to perform at interviews on the spot & asked me to take my time to answer him so he could just put something down. I was lucky or perhaps it was a battle that day as he was about chasing me out but God intervened. Thats how I got my job.

We need to develop ourselves folks & really understand why we aint getting those jobs. Are we too loud, too corky or unprofessional. Do we use much gestures, look away from the interviewer all the time or give wrong answers?. These are things we should <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">check</a>. Its not the economy at times but us.

My last failure was with a French company which I had worked so hard to secure that job. Done the test & other things. I was invited for a group interview & did you know my mistake?... I wore a suit. I never knew some companies are keen on business casual for group interviews. The guy that didnt perform atall & which I thought wasnt qualified was picked.

Morale of the story is to help ''drop'' a ''think'' into your ''thought''... I mean sel-evaluate & self-appraise or rather check why you havent got a job, be realistic with yourself & <a class="ktg6us78hf8vdu7" href="#">work</a> on it.

All the best.

NB: Dont hesitate to start small. What matters is what vision you have for your life. Never loose it.

I really enjoyed your post, but the highlighted got me thinking. You mentioned 'some' companies, what if some other companies were expecting you to have a suit on? I don't know if that is a de-facto way of dressing up for a group interview.

Ihedinobi:

You do remember that I said that I left my degree, right? I didn't finish it. It wasn't working.

If i revisited your earlier posts yes.

cowgurl: Thanks for the tip buddy. Lemme remind you, one being knowledgeable and getting certified if possible in all professions is very important for good business be you self-employed or not, don't wanna be limited you know, call me jane of all trade and mistress of all, lolz!

OPM stands for Operations and Personnel Management, ever heard of it?


And who says Psychology does not cut across all professions Yamakuza, you?

You kid me not? You can't do it all gurl.

diegs: Is it possible for someone who read business admin to change to maritime. If it is possible, how can one change without going back to the university to study for another 4 years? Are there any short bt detailed courses that will do? Pls a frnd of mine needs an answer. Anybody in2 maritime should also reply Tnx

Hunt for jobs mostly in the logistics field. Logistics is a broad topic but your focus should be on transportation logistics. As for short courses, register with the CILT UK and continue from there.

Ihedinobi:

I quite disagree with you both. If your position that the bachelor's degree is just theory (which educational practices outside Nigeria or Africa proves untrue), was it always so? I think not. And I think that if what used to be the work of the bachelor's degree is now the equivalent of the Master's degree then, we may infer that in the future it may be necessary to have better than a doctorate to be useful to mundane tasks in the industry. And I believe you'll agree with me that that is absurd.

The fact is that educational methods are evolving, not devolving. The bachelor's degree should be of greater value today than it used to be, if it is less, then our methods are poor. My parents are very old-timers. Both of them were, at least, close to legal adulthood at Nigeria's independence (my dad was 29, my mom was 15 in 1960). They used to regale me with stories of the elegance and quality of education way back when. I also did some reading up on my own and confirmed that entry level work back in their times (and in some cases, even today in the West) required no more than a good high school education. The bachelor's degree stood one out so powerfully because of the abilities and skills it indicated that such a person was considered capable in at least, mid-level management. The bachelor's degree implied ability and skill once upon a time in Nigeria, it still does in the more developed countries of the world. The master's degree implies mastery of a narrow portion of a field while retaining relevance in a wider frame. The doctorate stood one out as a creator or pioneer of outstanding new knowledge in a field. The professor was the disseminator of new knowledge in his field. He's actually a doctorate who's devoted himself to finding or creating new knowledge in his field and promoting it. So, when you say that all the bachelor's is good for is practically theoretical information in his field, what exactly is the point? He accumulates theories so that he gains employment to learn what to do with it? That doesn't make any sense.

Foundational knowledge that enables a person to do any task without need of expertise is such as high school or the secondary school gives, not the undergraduate degree. To conclude that expertise is not necessary to the undergraduate is to make nonsense of the idea of the university.

And I totally disagree that the realities of Nigeria should redefine the principles of life. Nigeria's current condition has us thinking upside down about a lot of things, but our conclusions are no less false for all that. And, I assure you, that no company "forces" engineers to become technicians in Nigeria. Why? Because engineers are not produced in Nigerian universities, whatever the curriculum may say.

Before i go back and forth with you on this topic, I would like to ask politely if you got a job immediately out of your Bachelors degree? If yes, how did you perform during your early spell on the job? Your answers would help a great deal.

Wow! You must be a very grateful type, coming here 2 years on to thank Nairalanders. #RareGem

AjanleKoko:

That makes a helluva lot more sense. Master in Entrepreneurship ke?



How so? Oh okay, my quip about Total abi? Don't mind me jare. Nigerians and bandwagoning. Before you can say 'entrepreneur' this thread will start to trend, and peeps will show up and post on here about how their friend just finished the masters, and immediately got a job with Total

hehehe...Total Oyel money. I believe a good career should be fulfilling (joy, happiness, challenging etc) and reward you financially. But what we see mostly from our people is a strong focus on money than anything else. That shouldn't be the case. I feel them sha.