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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? (37213 Views)
Is Purgatory In The Bible? / Is There Anything Like Sinful Haircut? / Catholic Purgatory: An Absolute Insult To Jesus Christ! (2) (3) (4)
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Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 6:39pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
italo:yeah you worship the virgin mary and you think you are right thinking ? lmao. deluded fellow 2 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 6:41pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y:well its not exactly called 'purgatory' in the bible but is is called the place to be 'purged'. purgatory is the same thing as purge. adding atory to the end of it is all you did. its still the same word |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by amaralizzy40y: 6:45pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
[quote author=MEILYN] lol. Trust me. I wanted to answer her... Haha. Chaii mobile phone is slow sha.... Your answer is better anyway... , didnt see dis b4 i replied above.[/quote] Ur comment did nt in any way show an evidence to existence of purgatory,notin lyk purgatory. I knw say na dysame pple. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by italo: 6:54pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: yeah you worship the virgin mary and you think you are right thinking ? lmao. deluded fellow I only take the opinions/insults of people I have adjudged to be right-thinking serious. Thank you. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 6:56pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
italo:dont you have a virgin somewhere you need to be bowing down to ? 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by italo: 7:02pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: dont you have a virgin somewhere you need to be bowing down to ? Dry! amara.lizzy%40y: You failed to answer the questions I asked you. Where is 1 Cor 3:15 talking about? Heaven or hell? Where is it that sins are forgiven in the world to come as Jesus implied? 4 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 7:04pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: i suggest you go to this thread. they are talking about people with your kind of attitude.https://www.nairaland.com/1504466/helping-most-nigerian-women-end Bros, I dey look dey laugh like Fela 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 7:18pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
doubleDx:lol chief doubleDx i troway salute Sir lol. 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by amaralizzy40y: 7:49pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
MEILYN: its a her oo. Her name now. Amala. Lizard.stp decievn n insultn urslf. al u said did nt even in any way relate to ur nonsense purgatory believe. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by amaralizzy40y: 7:57pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
[quote author=MEILYN] erm, but we've answered her question now. Watin they vex you now . Yea the truth is bitter. [/quote] Al ur comment did nt even make an atom of sense atal both of u are just blabing. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by amaralizzy40y: 8:19pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
italo:In d world to come mean anoda generation afta dis generation and nt purgatory. So ur bible quotatn did nt correspd wit purgatory. take it or live it notin lyk purgatory. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by MEILYN(m): 9:11pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y:oh. So nah the word purgatory dey worry u? Lol.... Why dont you quote a Bible verse 4 us now.... Obadiah have told you, Earth is the purgatory, There is purgatory but it is different from what other people believe... Purgatory is where you are purged, which is Earth... You are getting yourself confused, your question has been answered. When someone dies his spirit goes to God who gave it, after death is judgment, judgment is on earth which is the purgatory. Just read with humility miss, we qouted the bible to give you a better understanding... Stop being stiff necked and rebellious the word purgatory, nah e be ur wahala? 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by MEILYN(m): 9:13pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: dont you have a virgin somewhere you need to be bowing down to ?@Italo, u called dis dry?. Lmao. Very Very funny... Abey Maria Tins. 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by MEILYN(m): 9:18pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y:hey Mr. woman. What does the word purgatory mean? After telling us that. Then you tell us your own belief. If there is nothing like purgatory. When someone dies what will happen to the person? |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by victorazy(m): 9:56pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y: U no even understand his questions |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by collinsanthony: 10:02pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
I stand to tell u guyz dat there is purgatory....... |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Ediss(m): 10:08pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
Do u mean am in purgatory now . So Africa is the purgatory? Jesusssss so am dead is Israel and now in purgatory in Africa. This is serious oooh. Meaning GEJ and all these rich Africans are in purgatory? What a nice purgatory 5 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by theripper3: 10:11pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
The way Obadiah and his exclusive group of intellectuals turn an obscure topic to sometin completely arcane. Which one be Africa na wilderness again? 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Ediss(m): 10:14pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
[quote author=MEILYN] yea, have heard this before. Africa being the wilderness. Oga explain better.[/quote. ]. Do u mean am in purgatory now . So Africa is the purgatory? Jesusssss so am dead is Israel and now in purgatory in Africa. This is serious oooh. Meaning GEJ and all these rich Africans are in purgatory? What a nice purgatory |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by passion007: 10:15pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
italo: Italo, good job! Unfortunately, your co-debaters are either foulmouthed or frivolous. Your argument is flawless, and I can see how you aimed to bring the answers from Amara but she's awfully tetchy, and would rather spit fire than answer your queries. 14 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by zirisuccess: 10:18pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
Why a need for purgation after one's sin has already been forgiven? The premier example from the Bible comes from David, in the book of 2 Samuel 12:13-14: "David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the LORD." And Nathan said to David, "The LORD also has put away your sin ; you shall not die. Nevertheless, because by this deed you have utterly scorned the LORD, the child that is born to you shall die." Here we see God punishing David by taking the life of his son, even after God forgave David for killing Bathsheeba's husband, Uriah the Hittite, by putting him on the battlefront (So David could take Bathsheeba for his wife). This verse also tells us that our children can suffer mightily, even death, because of our own sins. God Himself appeared to Moses as a non-consuming fire, which didn’t burn the bush (Exodus 3:2). The book of Daniel says that the very throne of God is fire: “As I looked, thrones were placed and one that was ancient of days took his seat; his raiment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like pure wool; his throne was fiery flames, its wheels were burning fire .” (Daniel 7:9). And when God speaks, fire issues forth from His mouth: “A stream of fire issued and came forth from before him; a thousand thousands served him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him; the court sat in judgment, and the books were opened. (Daniel 7:10). In the New Testament, at Pentecost, God the Holy Spirit appeared as non- consuming tongues of fire to the apostles (Acts 2:3). So we see that God and fire can be seen as one and the same. In the First Book of Samuel 31:13, the survivors fasted for the dead, which makes no sense if the deceased were not in a place where that penance (fasting) could do some good for them. In Matthew 12:31, Jesus told the parable about blaspheming the Holy Spirit (not believing that the Holy Spirit can save you, no matter what – the sin of despair), and said that anyone who does blaspheme the Holy Spirit " will not be forgiven in this age or the age to come " (Matthew 12:32). Since sins aren't forgiven in Hell, and those in Heaven are already forgiven for their sins, then this one statement indicates another place after death where sins can indeed be forgiven. When Jesus told the parable of the man beating up others who owed him money, after he himself had been forgiven his debts (Matthew 18:23-34), He said “And in anger his lord delivered him to the jailers, till he should pay all his debt . So will my heavenly Father do to you , unless each of you forgives his brother from his heart" (Matthew 18:34-35). Since there is no release program in Hell, and no one wants to ever leave Heaven, this also indicates that there is another temporary place of torment where saved sinners go who have been forgiven their sins, but who have not paid all of their debt, down to the last penny, for their sins. In fact, in Matthew 5: 25-26, Jesus says “Make friends quickly with your accuser, while you are going with him to court, lest your accuser hand you over to the judge, and the judge to the guard, and you be put in prison; truly, I say to you, you will never get out till you have paid the last penny .” The only possible prison that there could be that one gets out of eventually is purgatory. In Hebrews 12:22-24, St. Paul says the following: “But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering, and to the assembly of the first-born who are enrolled in heaven, and to a judge who is God of all , and to the spirits of just men made perfect, and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks more graciously than the blood of Abel. " We know who the angels are, as well as the first born (those who go directly to heaven upon death), & the judge (Jesus), but the spirits of just men made perfect is another category of heavenly residents. Those would be the just men and women who were not ready for heaven upon death, but who were cleansed in the fires of purgatory and MADE PERFECT. In 2 Timothy 1:16-18, Paul prays for the soul of the departed Onesiphorus: May the Lord grant mercy to the household of Onesiphorus, for he often refreshed me; he was not ashamed of my chains, but when he arrived in Rome he searched for me eagerly and found me; may the Lord grant him to find mercy from the Lord on that Day -- and you well know all the service he rendered at Ephesus. Revelation 21:27 says that "nothing unclean shall enter heaven; " so it can be assumed that if we are still unclean when we die, thanks to God's amazing grace, we shall still be able to enter heaven thanks to the cleansing fires of purgatory. Purgatory is NOT another chance to be saved…Once death occurs, you are either saved or not saved. If you have suffered greatly in this life, or during your death, that pain and suffering alleviates your purgatory time, if it was done for Christ, and not wasted in anger at God. All purgatory does is to detach you from your love of sin, and to pay your debt to God for all of the sins that you have committed while alive on earth. This is directly analogous to someone who robs a bank and then asks for forgiveness. While the bank president will probably forgive him, the thief still has to give back the money and pay his debt to society through prison time. After all, nothing unclean or defiled shall enter Heaven (Revelation 21:27). Even Isaiah, as good a prophet as there ever was, when he was caught up into Heaven (Isaiah 6:1), he proclaimed himself unclean (Isaiah 6:5). A seraphim angel (seraphim means "burning one" then took a burning ember and stuck it to his tongue to cleanse him (Isaiah 6:6-7). Similarly, we will be cleansed in the fire of purgatory before we see God. St. Paul talks about this in 1 Corinthians 3:13 when he says, " The work of each will come to light, for the Day will disclose it. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire (itself) will test the quality of each one's work. If the work stands that someone built upon the foundation, that person will receive a wage. But if someone's work is burned up, that one will suffer loss; the person will be saved, but only as through fire. " And then there are these 2 verses of scripture that talk about God and fire and us: Mark 9:49: For every one will be salted with fire. Hebrews 12:29: "For our God is a consuming fire." 1 Peter 1:7: "The genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold that is perishable even though tested by fire , may prove to be for praise, glory, and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ." In the First Book of Peter 3:19 and 4:6, Peter says that after the crucifixion and death of Jesus, that Jesus "went to speak to the spirits in prison" to bring them the good news of His saving power. This prison was basically a holding tank for Old Testament people who followed the teachings of God, and looked forward to the coming of the Messiah, who would once again open the doors of heaven to man, which had been shut since the sin of Adam. This scripture also indicates that there is a place mentioned in the bible besides Heaven and hell for dead people to go to before they can enter into Heaven. We, as the Church Militant (still alive), can help our relatives and friends (and ENEMIES, by the way), who are in Purgatory (The Church Suffering) by praying for them, saying rosaries for them, offering up our sufferings here on earth for them, and most powerfully of all, having Holy Masses said for them. No need to wait for All Souls Day, although that is a GREAT time to have Masses said for them. See your parish secretary and have masses scheduled in remembrance of your loved ones as soon as possible. Once they make it to heaven, they will remember your kindness, and become powerful intercessors with Jesus for your salvation. Definitely a win-win effort!! No sacrifice for the dead is ever wasted. For example, if your loved one is already in heaven, then God, in his infinite mercy, will apply the sacrifice you make to someone else who most needs it. There are some who think that it is sacrilegious to pray for the dead, in spite of what the second Book of Maccabees says.. Well, think about this…There is no time in Heaven. God exists only in eternity, and knows the future. God, in his infinite wisdom, thus knows when a person dies that a loved one will be saying prayers for him/her years down the road. He then applies those yet-to- come prayers to the dead person's sentence in purgatory at the time of death. Of course the worst thing in Purgatory, besides the cleansing fire, is the knowledge that you are separated from God, because of your sins on earth. That intense longing to see God is both painful and comforting at the same time, because you know that you have made it, but must still wait to be cleansed. To sum up, the Church, under the direction of the Holy Spirit has always taught that Purgatory does exist. It is not a second chance to be saved, but rather, a place of cleansing for the already saved before entering into heaven. People who die with unexpiated sins or the attachment to sin on their souls go there, and are cleansed in the purifying fire of Purgatory for a period of time. Once they are purified, they go to heaven and enjoy the Beatific Vision forever. These people remember who prayed for them while they were in Purgatory, and then start offering prayers to Jesus for them. St. Therese, the Little Flower, and the 33rd Doctor of the Church, tells us that it offends God greatly when people say that they will surely have to spend time in purgatory after death. She says that Jesus would rather not send anybody there, and he would prefer that one has TOTAL TRUST in HIM now so that they won't have to spend one second in purgatory later. It seems that believing in one's own sinfulness rather than in the infinite mercy of God to forgive them becomes a self- fulfilling prophecy to spend time in the fires of purgatory instead of going straight to heaven. 14 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by try69: 10:20pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
italo: |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by ekochris(m): 10:24pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
Don't forget wat d bible said in James "nothing impure shall enter heaven" and in Romans "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God"; so you should judge yourself and see. Remember that purgatory is an English word and must not be referred to as "purgatory" in the Bible, just like "trinity" was not used in the Bible. One word of advice, every idle word that men speak shall be used against them on the day of judgement! 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by prof800(m): 10:26pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: we in hell brother. tis getting better though cuz we at the end lolOh Goodness! |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 10:28pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y: there is nothing like purgatory. It is not and cant be proven from the bible. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by donezra(m): 10:28pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: yeah you worship the virgin mary and you think you are right thinking ? lmao. deluded fellow We don't worship her. We adore her. This is because She intercedes for us to the Father. I know your believe won't let you agree with me but let me give u an instance. If u love ur mom so much and it happens u r the Governor of a state. Now someone from the masses tries to see u to ask for a favour or has met u once for a favour but u are busy to grant it. Or he has done something bad in the past for that you don't want to grant his favour. This man now goes to ur mom and pleaded with her to help u talk to her son on ur behave. This your mom who have a good heart agrees and comes to u with the young man's plea. After calling u all the sweet names and making u happy, she succeeded in making u to grant that man his favour. Now, that is exactly what happens u when we adore Mary and ask her to intercedes for us. Another perfect example can be found in the wedding in Canaan. 2 Likes |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by donezra(m): 10:28pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
obadiah777: yeah you worship the virgin mary and you think you are right thinking ? lmao. deluded fellow We don't worship her. We adore her. This is because She intercedes for us to the Father. I know your believe won't let you agree with me but let me give u an instance. If u love ur mom so much and it happens u r the Governor of a state. Now someone from the masses tries to see u to ask for a favour or has met u once for a favour but u are busy to grant it. Or he has done something bad in the past for that you don't want to grant his favour. This man now goes to ur mom and pleaded with her to help u talk to her son on ur behave. This your mom who have a good heart agrees and comes to u with the young man's plea. After calling u all the sweet names and making u happy, she succeeded in making u to grant that man his favour. Now, that is exactly what happens u when we adore Mary and ask her to intercedes for us. Another perfect example can be found in the wedding in Canaan. |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by satellitedaisy: 10:38pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
Both reason and faith tell us that there is a middle ground of expiation, where the soul is cleansed from all stain of sin before it can enter the glory of heaven. "There shall not enter into it anything defiled" (Apoc. 21:27). Christ said, "Amen, I say to thee, thou will not come out from it until thou hast paid the last penny" (Matt. 5:26). Even persons who deny the existence of purgatory instinctively pray for their loved ones who have died. This would be great inconsistency if their reason did not tell them that their prayers would do the dead good. Prayers are useless for those in heaven or hell. http://www.catholicbook.com/AgredaCD/MyCatholicFaith/mcfc078.htm 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by SalC: 10:39pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
amara.lizzy%40y:Are you implying someone who lived and sinned in this generation should reincarnate and live in the next generation to be forgiven? |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by sylvar02(m): 10:41pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
All... Na heaven sure pass |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by theripper3: 10:42pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
donezra: Oga, ur analogy is flawed, u peeps revere her so much it is almost like worship. Was driving through lagos one day and i saw a grown a-s-s man kneeling down to an assumed image of Mary ululating. The only reference u guys have for this idolization of Mary is the marriage of Cana. 1 Like |
Re: Please Is There Anything Like Purgatory? by Nobody: 10:44pm On Nov 04, 2013 |
donezra:Why bother yurself explaining, All those protestant nitwits got nufin on us. They just love to criticize everything we do. Na today we begin dey explain say na honor we dey do and not worshipping?? Anyway, they are free to hate, the Catholic church has existed for thousands of years and no form of hate is pulling we down 1 Like |
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