hopefulLandlord:


You're a walking paradox and its hilarious

Read your comments from the first one and my replies

You and I know you are very slow on the uptake and boot slowly so let m save you from an unavoidable system crash and faux pas which you are known for.

hopefulLandlord:


I no get time to indulge you but read your Rigmaroles and my replies while facepalming yourself

Good day

How would u have time for me when its about u. But u would have time to hurriedly open a thread on anothers matter and watch over it like a hawk.

facepalm yourself.

hopefulLandlord:


Me no get time for back and forth

I've been clear that an amputee limb growing miracle would be enough,

[size=36pt]SHOULD I BRING AN AMPUTEE TO YOU?[/size]

Test me, let the limb grow right before my eyes and on camera too, then see if I'll remain atheist

Smh. You and I know your position regardless of whatever. A miracle lik that happening before your eyes would only further make you ask how I am sure it wasnt any of the other 4999 gods who did it. So save the deceipt for yourself.

Faith brings us to God and keeps us there.

hopefulLandlord:


[size=36pt]SHOULD I BRING AN AMPUTEE TO YOU?[/size]

Have u not just confirmed what I said? No Atheist here is truly seeking from anyone until they seek for themselves genuinely. Nobody can convince a doubtful soul except the person himself is willing from his heart and not lip service. What I see on Nairaland is a lot of lipservice but not heart service.

Example...Seun has used everyone elses experience ad an example except hid own. He has used everyone elses supposed spiritual ecounters or lack of as examples except his own and I wonder why.

If he gives credence to others stories as undeniable proof should this not give him the enablement to gleefully embark on a self edifying truth quest and spiritual dismantling physically rather than theoretically here on Nairaland.

Same question goes to you hopefulLandlord

hopefulLandlord:


Devil (your imaginary enemy) doesn't exist to an atheist neither does Yahweh (imaginary friend)


its your mind that's been blocked through deep indoctrination

we've been there and we freed ourselves from such delusions

someone (beejay) is about to expose the FOOLISHNESS of believing in blood money and you're advising him against it

the only reason you would do that is just so people keep believing it

demystifying it would give theists one less reason to be one

but guess what, beejay isn't afraid

just like this man that challenged Indian jazz people to kill him on national TV and all their Jazz FAILED WOEFULLY

To the best of my knowledge you are the self acclaimed aggressively open minded one so why are you not the one accepting the challenge? Why are you hiding behind every and anyone who accepts any challenge and are always quick to open a thread on their behalf yet you have never accepted any challenge of your own and in your name as a supposed curious open minded person?

Shouldn't you be the one representing yourself on a thread you created? Or is fear making you unable to accept challenges? You have repeatedly cited examples from Seuns indian post and it looks like that post gave you a second wind to run with which I feel should have enabled you to jump on this opportunity....Or is your definition of Open minded now different from mine?

Like you Ranchhoddas is also open minded but he is always logical when pursuing answers unlike you who is just derogatory and full of childish posturing.

If I ask you now what proof u seek to clear your doubts you would say heal and amputee and when that happens you would then say heal a decapitated body and when that happens you would say raise a 1 month dead body to life...

Is Nairaland the right place for your open mindednss or curiousity? Nairaland is rife with theories while the real world out there is rife with practicals....a truly curious mind would be out there in the world physically trying to douse his curiosity. Perhaps you need to pause and do a self reevaluation.

Per this your thread, I walk and work with God so care nothing about what happens on the other side or what it has to offer.

KingEbukasBlog:


This man is the white ifenes

Ifenes there is hope for you ooo

the man is a whife hybrid of Ifenes. Ifenes has local content so yes there is hope for ifenes too.

dblackninja:


You just have my pity.
Good luck!!

Keep your pity to yourself. When you are caught out you feign superman..... in other words you have absolutely nothing to say. Thank me for giving you knowledge you obviously lacked.


so can a 0.000000009 error rate out of every 100000000 nucleotides added be a product of chance or intelligence?

is it possible for chance to be this accurate?

raphieMontella:
doctoralien...
This perry marshall's stuff has been dealt with before...
Dna like gravity are ''codes''
just on different scales...

Young man chai! I have to shake my head at this your comment. chai and chai again.

dblackninja:

What do you mean by erroneous? Borne/derived out of an error? Inaccurate? Flawed?

By what standard are we going to judge that? When the dna decides to re-write it's code to adapt though it might lead to detrimental result, is that an error?


Now I don't even know how to help you. Have you heard of what we call bugs in programmes? Do you know that other things can alter programme algorithms? Do you know certain programs can alter it's structure to protect its core command, leaving the functions it was made to carry out?



Some people in nairaland always want to sound intelligent in what they don't understand or aren't sure of and won't assent to reason when it's showed to them
Just like Johnny said, this thread is nothing but another attention seeking thread. Am out of here.

You keep showing a lack of intlligence the more you respond.

DNA polymerases are highly accurate, with an intrinsic error rate of less than one mistake for every 100000000 nucleotides added so DNA accuracy is at 0.00000009 of every 100000000 nucleotides added. in a laymans language this translates to hitting the bullseye each and every time.

What you call mutation isnt mutation to the DNA its a response to an already preexisting code which gives it the above accuracy each and every time.

Please I advice that you stop responding if you have no answer to the OPs question rather than putting your ignorance on full display here.

dblackninja:


Oh very dood for you


Dna is a dynamic and adaptable molecule. As such, the nucleotide sequences found within it are subject to change as the result of a phenomenon called mutation. Why do they change? Are the changes random?
What sort of designer designs something that can erratically change forming new set of cells & perhaps a totally different form of an organism?


Your next reply will determine whether I'll go further

I asked u a single question which you ignored and then spewed this copy and paste. I asked u if the DNA code is erroneous. Well is it?

If you write a computer program can that program leave its set of written commands and begin doing something else?

If DNA molecules even though are not alive can mutate as you put it under what parameters? Those they decided on their own to do even though dead or those which it has been preprogrammed to carry out and this it does so excellently without gambling or trial and error.

So again I ask you please tell the house if DNA is erroneous.

dblackninja:


Do you know what is gene mutation? Do you know what causes dna codes to re-write & change? Answer the questions in the 2nd paragraph & find out for yourself if dna emanated from that alleged designer.

young man some of us are more knowledgeable than you when it comes to genetics and DNA so drop the gene mutation angle.
Even if you want to tow that line is the DNA code erroneous? Show me one single flaw in the code and I will become an atheist right now. Perhaps I need to take you back to school here.

dblackninja:
I wanted to give you a detailed answer but looking at the fact that you're a copycat and probably know nothing about science, I will just ask you this:

Is the designer you're talking about also the designer of gene mutations (permanent alteration in the DNA sequence that makes up a gene). How & why does it occur? Is he/it/she there to guide these changes in codes that forms a totally different dna segment?

If yes what can you say about this designer-- An experimental designer or a bad designer??

I do not think you have a clue what DNA is and how it functions. The OP already stated clearly that DNA is a code and this has been declared as true by all scientists.

This code functions within certain parameters and its always restricted eithi those parameters be they gene mutation or sequencing. However this DNA has been coded to respond in a certain way and create a unique response to environment or certain difficulties it may ecounter but never in drastic way.

DNA behaves like a molecule with its own inbuilt brain as it does not need our human brain to work and its coding even as unseen as its brain is needs super computers to decipher.

The question the OP asked is for you to show him one naturally occuring code system that came to be without an intelligent involvement and instead of answering that you give a left wing comment such as u did. Do you know any? YES OR NO!

dalaman:


Why is morality desired? You tell me.

You were obviously on a roll with the explanations so let me leave you with that....winks and hugs

dalaman:


Who are the atheist that do as they please? Read your own bible and see savagery looking at you face to face.

Its not too late for that hug bro. Never too late to accept the love being offered. You really do need it.

KingEbukaNaija:


Atheists are the savages . Only a savage will deem it sane to sleep with an animal . I just can't believe it . This is appalling , nauseating

Nay brother Atheists are worse than savages. At least savages live by self made rules as he said but Atheist just do as they please.

dalaman:


Our moral codes of conduct are savagely even to some of us. I was trying to explain polygamy to German friend of mine like 2 years ago. She just could not understand it. She felt it was the highest form of injustice ever for a man to have two wives legally. She was so bitter about it. Why? Because she grew up in a society that frowns against it. Many ladies in Africa and some other parts of the world see polygamy as a very good thing. Some also see what others practice as savagely while others see what we practice as savagely as well. There is no standard or universally accepted morality.

Again you miss it. Its not about individual moral codes its about WHY ITS EVEN DESIRED IN THE FIRST PLACE.

WHY WHY WHY?

Order has nothing to do with it because even as gorillas whom you guys claim we evolved from have a moral code. Was it genetically encoded? No it wasnt so how come we all want our own version of it even when we do not accept each others.

KingEbukaNaija:


cc : winner01 , ireorony , UyiIredia , Ishilove , Scholar8200


Winner01 , we joked about this yesterday and this man said he'll allow his kid to go sleep with animals because the Canadian law says so .

I am having a rib cracking moment here. Gosh so savages can teach themselves right from wrong but Atheists cannot.

What a way to go. Yaay for Atheism.

KingEbukaNaija:


cc : winner01 , ireorony , UyiIredia , Ishilove , Scholar8200


Winner01 , we joked about this yesterday and this man said he'll allow his kid to go sleep with animals because the Canadian law says so .

Yet we Christians who abhor Beastiality and fight against it even when the law of the land supports it are the crazy ones.

I SALUTE ALL ATHEISTS FOR TAKING A STAND. NO NO NO FOR TAKING ANY STAND AT ALL. EVERYTHING AND ANYTHING IS ALLOWED.

Its possible HIV and AIDs began with an Atheist.

dalaman:


Because chaos and order had direct impact on man and his life. Ok who taught man the difference between chaos and order? Are you saying it's God ? If it is God then why don't all men see the same things as chaotic or order?

Again I never said God did. I only said the origin of morality isnt tangible, has no scientific proof yet everyone wants their own sense of morality....WHY?

Morality has nothing to do with chaos and order because their are chaotic placss who still have their own version of morality. So whg the quest for Morality in the first place.

dalaman:


So that you'll live in a less chaotic society.

This takes me back to question one.


HOW DID MAN KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CHAOS AND ORDER?

If you say they taught themselves again then you are a liar

dalaman:


The savage man was thought to change his ways by others. In some cases he thought himself. Let's take the issue of killing of twins that was practiced here in Nigeria by some tribes. When they invading slave traders came. They thought the people that were practicing it to stop it. In some cases they forced them to stop the practice. The Romans as they went about conquering the world made the people to accept the Roman way and culture which also includes their moral codes of conduct.

So if in one of the right ups you calldd romans savages and now you say they went about teaching people their own morality, how come the morality we have today isnt savage?

dalaman:


There is no universal morality. It doesn't exist anywhere. People create moral systems for different reasons. There are different Gods, different religions, different cultures and different people. People have to chose and formulate which moral codes to live by. The same people also have to refine and change the same set of codes as they move on. No God is the source of human morality because there are different Gods and different religions.

I am not talking about a universal morality. Atheists do not believe in God or any god for that matter or even any higher power.

My question is why the interest in any form of morality at all even if there are different gods.

dalaman:


If I was raised to believe that then why not. I we watching a program on TV last year where some men in Saudi Arabia were discussing the issue of women not driving and working. They were so empathic about it and they truly believed that women shouldn't drive and work because they were raised that way. They truly believed it was wrong for women to drive and work. Even some of the women believed it was wrong for them to drive and work outside the home.

So if you agree that if you were raised to believe that and wouldnt stray from that belief why then do you believe that savage man taught himself morals when he had nothing else to compare it to?

Do u see why I said u are going round in circles?

dalaman:


There is right and wrong based on what people chose. Is homosexuality right or wrong? To a Nigerian living in Nigeria it is wrong but to a person living in England or Switzerland it isn't wrong. Why is that so?

You are still missing the point entirely and going round in circles.

If homosexuality is acceptable in other places and not in others how did they arrive at each others conclussion?

They both want some form of order so why do they seek this yet defer in laws and acceptance of behaviour?

One feels his idea of right or wrong is better than the other but at the end of the day theg still have right and wrong in other areas independent of location. So how is it that they have moral ideals in the first place

dalaman:


Man is the root of morality because he chose what ever system or set of moral codes to live by. If God is the source of human morality then why don't all moral codes come about the same way? Why don't people all see things the same way if God is the source of human morality? Why do some people see somethings as bad and others see it as God at the same time using God to justify it? People just use God and their religion to enforce what ever system of morality they chose for themselves.

So in essence there is no right or wrong in this world just choices?

dalaman:


Who else but men themselves. For example who showed men that women deserve equal rights as them? Men showed themselves and thought themselves that. Show showed the modern man not to criminalize gays and accept them? He showed himself. Men must teach themselves what ever moral code of conduct they chose to live by.

You said men criminalized such savage actd but u fail to answer how did they even know what was criminal and what wasnt?

Who gave them such a noble blueprint? What is criminal in some areas isnt in others because morality isnt the same everywhere but to those whose laws favour gays and those whose law dont what makes one think being gay is right while another says its a crime?

Thats my point. What is the root of morality?

dalaman:


They used reason to fashion these things out. It's a fact that mean lived as savages before. During the time of Jesus Israel was under occupation by the Romans. They Romans could do anything they wanted. They can grab any land they want and kill off all the people of they fail to obey them with impunity. Now no country can do that. No country can invade another without cause or reason.

If you kill my own I will definitely want to revenge. If we go about killing each other we will both lose out. If I steal what is yours you will want to steal from another person or steal from me. If we continued like that our society will be in chaos.

People formulating moral.codes of conduct because they wanted to avoid chaos. Even in the bible you will see some moral evolution. Abraham the founder of the faith was an incestuous man. He married his sister. Besides that he could sleep with his female slaves. Child sacrifice was allowed because he wanted to sacrifice his son Issac. The people lived like savages, they could invade their neighbors because their neighbors worshiped other Gods. They stoned their disobedient children to death. They married many wives and had many concubines. They enslaved each other freely. They killed gays. An eye for an eye no forgiveness. They were very brutal but over time things kept changing. In Africa it was the same. The people that lived 3000 years ago were very brutal. They weren't like us. Just 400 years ago all the blacks living in the USA were slaves. But today a black man is the president of the USA.

You are just going round in circles. People formulated moral codes of conduct? How? Who showed them right morals from wrong? How did they even know where to start from?

dalaman:


Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.




We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.

The ten commandments were given so we would see we could not be righteous enough for God and not as a guide to right or wrong. No man could keep the ten commandments because if you fail one you have failed all.

Human morality is different from Gods morality.
Before the ten commandments they had their own version of morality. At least they were not going around naked. And had human laws governing their wrong or right acts.

In one tongue u will mention man was a savage and rhe nexr thing u will say the ten commandments. Which even though it shows u are very confused still goes further to show that be us savages or followers of the ten commandments, human morality existed outside our control initially. How was this possible.

dalaman:


Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.




We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.

You are missing the point entirely. According to your write up that was their morality right? Even then they had a system of right and wrong even though it is ar variance with ours today but they had their own system of right and wrong.

The question is how could savages reflect on anything or change from being savages if they enjoyed that order and were born into it? How did they do a u turn for something else?

They say lions are savage beasts and it is known that when a lion takes over the territory of another lion, it would eat the baby lions from the other king of the pride so it would start a fresh generation using its own genes. This has been hotwired into them and has never changed as they have no reason to see it as wrong since they cannot reason past that. So how could human savages reason past theirs if indeed we once were savages.

dalaman:


To help him live in a less chaotic society. Remember we started out as savages before we go to where we are right now.

So if we started as savages as you say this men we were once mindless and behaved like beasts right?

So how come the same beasts suddenly knew what chaos and order is and suddenly desired structure. How were they able to become rational and know right from wrong and good from bad?

What is the origin of these judgements? If you know pls share with us along with proof and not some random quote.

dalaman:


No you are trying to sell to me an incredible tale. We've heard of God raising people from the dead. Healing people of cancer and all sort of miracles. We just want clear cut miracles that can never be faked an example is the restoration of the limbs of an amputee. So far no God has been able to do that. Why is it that no God can perform a clear cut miracle?

Proof of the pudding is in the eating. Even if it does happen before your very eyes you will still concoct some tale linking it to magic or something else.

I keep telling you that nothing can convince you except you are ready to submit yourself to being a living proof.

Proe God by yourself for yourself otherwise I cannot help you with that.

dalaman:


Another incredible tale. If fibroid can disappear through prayers then amputated limbs should also be restored through prayers. My friend has an amputated arm , should I bring him for prayers and restoration of his limbs?

God is not mocked. He does what he wants how he wants. I guess the ability a lizard has to regrow its tail and we evolved from such creatures why did we not borrow such an important survival tool from the lizard so we can regrow limbs?
God left blanks in a lot of things deliberately because of people like you.