₦airaland Forum

frumentius:
God forbid! That would wreak havoc with our NATO-oriented logistics. What we should do, seeing that we're spending a fortune chartering the damn things on an ad-hoc basis, is take out a rolling 24-month wet lease on about 3 aircraft.

The problem in South Africa is the media's sensational reporting.. You buy anything military related, they'll start talking their ignorance and then before you know the local population is out burning tyres the following day wanting free everything because "there's money to buy weapons".


Anyway it's not late, they can still acquire the A400Ms and have them assembled (or partially) at Denel's aviation facility and call it "job creation", that often works.

frumentius:
We really should not have cancelled our A400M order . With air-to-air refueling our Gripens would not have needed to stop in Ndola, Zambia and Kinshasa, DRC before reaching Bangui.

We need those A400Ms, it's either we get them or the airforce starts flying you guys on broomsticks.

You know we should also consider the Ilyushin Il-76 (God I hate Russian equipment) and remove the glass nose - we should have some heavy lifting capacity.

frumentius:
The Taurus air-to-ground missile. With an Airbus MRTT and a USAF KC-10, 2 Squadron should ask them nicely if they can practise air-to-air refueling. Only the handful Gripen pilots who transitioned from the Cheetah have the experience. The younger Grip pilots possess only theory and simulator time. And to think we were the first Gripen operator to conduct air-to-air refueling!

One would wonder why a Typhoon wasn't brought in... As for the air refueling, they should make a deal with the USAF to allow the Grip boys to play air fueling games in exchange we'll allow them to stay for 2 days in Cape Town.

Below is the SAAF refueling (before tanker retirement)

cutievik:
That's a whole lot of fire power

That's how they managed to suppress the lethal L-shaped 300m long ambush in 2013.

frumentius:
Forgot about Igirigi. In terms of sophistication and engineering complexity, this is miles from the dune buggy.
They're calling it a Hornet !
4 of these in a C-130 and your SBS can escort Buhari when he goes mediating in a dodgy place like Burundi, instead of relying only on the DSS and the host country like last time.

That's;

- 32 Specialised Operators
- 4 .50 calibers
- 4 to 8 RPG 7s
- 4 to 8 Milkor MGLs
- 8 to 12 LMGs
- 16+ assault rifles
- 8+/- Milkor BXP Submachine Guns

All deployed in 4 small vehicles in a single C130.

frumentius:
SADC military co-operation: An Angolan air force Il-76 transporting Tanzanian troops to Upington, South Africa.

Hope the Angolans brought the right ammo this time around.

Patchesagain:
I keep forgetting we have four...

Very silly to only buy 3 OPv's... would love to see their business management plan, no idea how they plan on consistently keeping one on station

One would assume we would need one on station on either coast at any one time... and thats ignoring the waters off some of our island territories, which are no doubt being ra.ped

Unless we sell one frigate and buy 2 more OPVs totalling 5.

My concern is that we have more than enough submarines, it's an overkill.

frumentius:
Ze Germans are here, ze Germans are here.
Escorted by a USAF KC-10 tanker.


PICS: courtesy of Kremlin at http://www.saairforce.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2507&p=114026#p114017

Remind me, what're the Germans testing at Overberg?

61mech:
Correct
The parts were shipped using a Portuguese helicopter buy as a cover. Apparently someone in Portugal made a huge profit as SA overpaid massively for the engines and airframes.
What the SAAF ended up with was basically a Puma airframe with composite parts and a new Makila turboshaft engines.
It actually outperforms even the newer super pumas.

Even climbs faster, flies higher and carries more troops and weight that the UH-60L Blackhawk.... I hope the engineers are still alive, we'll need their services soon

jakeporeshenko:
Forgive your ignorance, how can something be built from scratch using "imported airframes and engines". And secretly imported from who ??

Here was the scenario, the airforce wanted a new helicopter BUT they couldn't acquire it because of the embargo... The solution was to build one from scratch (which would be extremely expensive) or build one using the knowledge of a platform they already knew.
The Puma was the only helicopter the South African engineers knew very well so whatever they had to build was to going to be an evolution of this familiar platform.


New designs were made with a Puma airframe in mind, they then secretly imported them as spare parts from Portugal to "Zaire"... The tail was locally produced, the engines were highly modified resulting in a "new" helicopter in performance that had looks of an older platform.

Odunayaw:
huh??

Simplified English: No Pumas were harmed or killed during the making of the Oryx

jln115:
Nothing as in they were never put in storage.....simply rusting away somewhere in a field, some where sold to Somalia and Swaziland im guessing a few more were cannibalized and soled as spares, a handful were kept by the SAAF, some were sold to private collectors....as for the rest??...who knows?

3 donated to Swaziland to help find cannabis farms, 3 to Namibia, a few in Zimbabwe a few on private hands... There should be a dozen or two floating around.

jakeporeshenko:
How many pumas were modified into the Oryx operated today ?

None actually. The Oryx was built from scratch using (secretly) imported airframes and engines.. Both the Rooivalk and Oryx were developed simultaneously using the same engine imports.

The idea here was to have a helicopter that would last the SAAF for 40 years because of the UN Arms Embargo so the Pumas were already old and they weren't gonna hold..... 46 were built, 35 are in service.

jln115:
Nope!! All gone....except those we keep in the museums

There were some Alouette III in 2013, they would be exported to Zim, the court stopped the transaction.


We can't go from so many reserved helicopters to nothing... It's impossible.

MikeCZA:
Pumas.
Supporting the Rhodesians.

There's also a Super Frelon on the ground.

MikeCZA:
Pumas.

Supporting the Rhodesians.

Do we still have the Puma and Alouette III in storage, that should be almost a 100 helicopters I believe?

patches689:
South Africa already has the ground search radar....

Where is it operational? Definitely not around the Mozambican/Swazi/SA borders. It's a freeway of illegal crossings - its like the border doesn't exist.

africaken254:

 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToNTyc_bsC8

The permanent solution is to export the rhino to safer countries like Australia and the US. The local rhino will be extinct because our own authorities are cashing in on its demise.

africaken254:
there is also ground based SAR surveillance radar which can detect man size target farther than 30KM,out ranging EO/IR cctv cameras,the technology is there but this dinosaurs in control of our security apparatus are the problem

Interesting tech, every country fighting illegal border crossing should field it.

MikeCZA:
Intelligence.

The Swazis like all our neighbors don't corporate well with the South African security agencies. The Swazi police and military know where the dagga is planted and even know who traffics it to South Africa. They'll be like "as long as you don't sell it in Swaziland"... Same goes with Mozambique and it's rhino poachers.

jln115:
forget cctv...this is high tech!!
http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47046:csir-develops-active-aerostat&catid=90:science-a-defence-technology&Itemid=204
CIRS develops active aerostat.

That's some real sh#t, wonder why I didn't work for the CSIR...

Do you have an idea on the sensors that could be used there?

frumentius:
Only demos, I'm afraid. Though I've seen videos of action in the DRC and been on an Oryx (and an Indian Cheetak ) conducting BDA post a Rooivalk strike.

Myself, Patches and Mike what to hook you up with a GoPro cam and shoot us the post-Rooivalk raids. We're hungry for some action action

MikeCZA:
Most countries can do this. But stuff like boarder patrol needs to be sustained and sustaining high numbers is expensive.

Border patrol is literally useless if you ask me.... In areas around the SA/Swaziland border, traffickers literally ask the locals (on the Swazi side) if they have seen the South African troops, the locals would literally let them know if a Samil or military patrol bakkie passed by and when and even tell them they'll come back (because they have studied the routine).

The best solution is to go high-tech, stage visible sensor and CCTV towers then couple them with follow-up drones... Just the sight of those towers alone act as a repellant.

frumentius:
And who doesn't love things that go "boom"!

Sweet...

Ever seen a Rooivalk in firing demonstration or in live action fire while you were in the DRC?

africaken254:
Kenya administration police during Silent Drill

How much energy do you need to do that...

frumentius:
Throwback Thursday

Seeing we're in the middle of cyclone/hurricane season, 28 Squadron on a search and rescue mission in Madagascar in 2009.

Oh sweet.. It looks like they're having a memorable moment.

patches689:
Not quite

The project was put on hold. CSIR was ordered/tasked with assessing existing technology before the project could continue

Idk what that means, but that's what happened.

That means they could come up with a new custom design? Or maybe it means whatever CSIR will come up with will be made as a technical requirement by Armscor when bids open?

I think whichever way, the Army is gonna get the best APCs in the world... It's exciting

Hrmnn:
I heard the Casspir/Mamba replacement project was put on hold due to lack of funding, is that true?

Yeah it's true. Replacing thousands of APCs instantly takes some serious funding.

MikeCZA:
Ballistic protection is up to STANAG4569 A Level 4. Able to absorb those rounds. Great family of vehicles.

Would make a great vehicle to replace the Casspir with. Different design approach.

The engine moved to the side of the vehicle to create more space. Better Ratel.

If we do get it as a Casspir replacement, it would probably be the 4x4 long-wheel base variant.

frumentius:
And now that NIMR has the licence to produce them in the UAE, the UAE military places an order for 1500 of them!

Oh well, Denel gets some cuts - right?

Henry240:
At no point have i ever claimed i was in the military. However it is apparent i know way more than those who claim to be in the military.

I make no apologies for that.

I'll discuss with you no further.

Henry240:
It doesn't help when your military men don't know what they are talking about and require schooling from a civilian.

When they are largely ignorant. I find that to be quite problematic.

What happened to "I'll ignore your post"?

Anyway you're a man in suits in an air-conditioned office, we know your pic.... All you do is fantasise about the military.