₦airaland Forum

frumentius:
Ah Mike! The dogs bark but the caravan moves on!

And apparently the caravan would suffer from "sudden butt-hurt".

MikeCZA:
The S300 is a system.

The Umkhonto will be intergrated into that air defence layered system.

The S300 is a highly capable system.

I'm actually referring to the actual missiles instead of the whole system, yes the (electronic) system is highly capable and the missiles as well. However as I said, the missiles (because of their size) lack the same level of manuvablity smaller missiles offer in defending against the likes of Tomahawks.

jakeporeshenko:
off topic terror attack today in Londons Westminster close to the House of Parliament, they killed the terrisrst scum captured and manyhunt begins for the suspected second one. Trust British security services

It's something they constantly train for as stated by the officers in charge..... and also, the reason why we don't see large scale terrorists attacks is because their intelligence agencies are topnotch and that's where terrorism should be actually fought not on the streets.

Henry240:
I don't understand where all this butt-hurt is coming from, but be rest assured, it isn't my intent to cause any.

We have a "butt-hurt" because Iran is interested in a local defence system?

Wow, I think you should call all your London relatives and check if they're well because you're clearly upset over something.

Vikkie14:
They do. It was deployed at Fordow Nuclear site to safe guard it against aerial attack especially from IAF (who are just bent on seeing the facility destroyed).

So, any other SAM deal would mostly be aimed at defending their nuclear site(s) rather than protecting Tehran.

Iran claimed their home built Bavar-3(faith-373) is more potent than the S300, wondering why they weren't mass produced like they said in 2016 and why they are still going after foreign ADS if the Bavar-3 is actually capable of its stated capabilities.

There's greater possibility that the SA-21 Growler deployment and the Umkhonto deal is more of serving two purpose: fixing the tech gap/loopholes in their home grown Air Defense Systems and defending their Nuclear facilities.

There's also a possibility that the US (under Trump) could actually launch Tomahawks on suspected nuclear sites. The S300 is not much of a use there, Umkhonto can actually handle such threats because of its ability to engage smaller and highly maneuverable objects.

Henry240:
The LY-80 is one of such better systems available.


"So you're still grasping at straws?"..... How most unfortunate.

There's a dozen or two of such systems allover the world, we're aware of them Henry240 and a handful of them are in China where Iran can simply buy without bothering with other " inferior" systems.

Now don't make us go in circles.

Henry240:
Choice.

Maybe you don't understand, defending your airspace or naval area of operation from air threats is a matter of life and death. You buy the best to protect your equipment, serviceman and territory... You somehow think it's equivalent to buying a Motorola or Samsung phone where it's a matter of choice.

Henry240:
Stop pulling comments straight outta your arse. Best regards.

That is something you're rather known for.


You know that Iran has access to Chinese weapons right? You know that they could have easily evaluated all the various Chinese air defence systems without even bothering with other options - right?... The Iranians evaluating the Umkhonto SAM speaks volumes even if they don't go through with the actual purchase.

Henry240:
You came to this conclusion how?
And the South-African system isn't unreliable?

This is meant to start an off topic discussion. I'll ignore you.

Henry240:
The Chinese already has better systems available for the export market.

The Chinese have any systems for export BUT we don't know much about their sophistication, they're probably unreliable.

MikeCZA:
We talk to them in the background remember?

There's no doubt about the capabilities of the missile.

My concern would be the Chinese getting a copy from the Iranians then flooding the market with a duplicate Umkhonto.

Patchesagain:
Well...

look at this way:

If Isreal lets the Umkhonto go through... then we know its a sh1t system

Them banning it would be a badge of honor and excellent for marketing.

Egypt and Jordan would sign up quickly

frumentius:
Strictly speaking we don't have to apply for approval, as the system cannot have any conceivable double use in Iran's nuclear industry. So no reason to reject. This is more hedging of bets: should anything change whilst we're busy with deliveries, no one can accuse us of violating sanctions which didn't exist at time of contract signature, like we were with Libya.

I'm more interested in Sweden's position: they're currently on the SC and if the Iranians opt for the SAAB radar (which has been in tests here with the Umkhonto for the past 8 months), it puts them in an awkward position.

Israel doesn't want Iran to have a meaningful air defence system, remember how much they tried blocking the S300 acquisition even tried using its business influence in Russia to discourage Russia from the transaction.

This one is straight forward, Umkhonto Missile is a modern system that Israel would not like especially if they if they think Iran could use it to defend it's potential nuclear site (s).

This won't go through.

frumentius:
And in breaking news:

South Africa has applied to the UN Security Council for Denel to be allowed to sell the land-based variant of the Umkhonto surface-to-air missile to Iran. Since July 2015, UNSCR 2231 has required case-by-case approval of certain types of systems to Iran.

I thought Iran had the S300... But anyways, the US will reject the approval.

frumentius:
The Russkies in Cape Town!

PICS*:
1) Udaloy I (Project1155) class ASW Destroyer - Severomorsk #619;
2) Dubna class replenishment tanker - Dubna;
3) Ingul (Project 1453) class salvage tug - Altay.

*Courtesy of http://www.saairforce.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=9119&p=114144#p114107

What's the occasion?

Hrmnn:
I heard they had a tendency to roll into corners. Supposedly it had to do with the top heavy nature of the design.

The Rhino and Bulldog were later developments on the Buffel which were much improved. By then the Mamba was entering service though so both were not introduced in large numbers.

I remember looking at these products in a book called "Why Armscor" in the 90s.. They were kinda revolutionary, how times have changed.

Patchesagain:
Yeah, I remember there was a buffel parked on our street during the elections.

The troepies drove us round the block in it. I dont know if they were conscripts or what... probably citizen force

I think its where my fascination with military equipment stems from.

I think the discontinuation of the Buffel service was by its own design. The driver seats separate from the rest of the rifleman, if you think that most of the drivers would have been white and the riflemen would (after 94) be black. Seeing a white dude driving black dudes around wouldn't make a great image.

Hrmnn:
Mystery Buffel recently spotted on the border between CAR and the Sudan. Photographer met the owners nearby, claimed they were South Africans and not regular military personnel.

My guess is that the Buffel is possibly operated by a Saffie security / demining company active in the CAR.

South Africans haven't used Beffels since the late 80s and they were mostly with the now defunct SWATF, 101 and 32 Batallion. These could have been refurbished and sold/donated.

rawswag:
somewhere in the northeast jln115 check the flag on the left us soldiers arm...

Problem solved

andrewza:
The subs are ok, no major issues to report. I think Manthatisi is in refit but there are 2 subs in the water

Battery refit?

Frumentius, did you see the walking sticks

andrewza:
No medi still stripped of a lot. The navy just decided to make her the next target for the refit. The plan is she sails this year.



Of course the budget is tight. navy used to recruit 700 people per two intaks. Now one intake of 200 to 250. But we will see what transpires

I haven't seen SAS Manthatisi and SAS Charlotte Maxeke anywhere recently. What's happening to them.

patches689:
Nice

I would like to see the MP's and SAAF Protection squadrons getting some of these.

@Frumentius has the SANDF ever considered handing over all base security to the MP's? I know that regulars still handle most watch duties.

With STANAG 4569 Ballistic Protection and STANAG 4569 Mine Protection, its a good Mamba APC replacement contender.


I honestly wonder why the SANDF doesn't have light protection vehicles in service (like the RG32 Scout).

frumentius:
Repost.

Never seen it here before, only the LM14 was posted.

jln115:
I missed it to..
..but apparently Africaken had one of his meltdowns!! unfortunately i suspect @frumentius and @Patches689 are innocent victims caught in the blast radius and are currently serving bans with Africaken.

It's one of those Africaken254 moments, I'll assume I didn't miss much then.

WTF did I miss?

A moment of silence to those who're not seeing it

nemesis2u:
might be india not sure though

will try to confirm later if possible

Can't be India, you guys are very obsessed with "Make in India" to order anything in larger numbers from an outside country.

Henry240:
Morroco exercise flintlock

Those Moroccan helmets though

Henry240:
That's for the cameras.

Then after that everybody sings "we're going to the Emirates" through their nose

africaken254:
Egyptian soldiers departing for joint military exercises in Bahrain with UAE and Bahrain

That's a very neat sitting arrangement.

@africaken254. Please do not put your words in "quotes" because it makes it difficult for us to quote you. Just post like everyone else. Thanks.