₦airaland Forum

Patchesagain:
1. What is GPS-INS guidance? How deep have Recces operated behind enemy lines and what is the "Baja 500" award?

2. Hypothetical situation, geography is irrelevant

3. What 500 km radar? Civilian grade designed for detecting airliners? What are gripen?

You think your obsolete F7 based on a 50 year old design scares us when we have Gripen?

Answer these questions and you will realize the idiocy of your post

South African recce troops will enter Nigerian oil field in Niger Delta swamps and be operating there? Asari Dokubo's militants will use your men for sacrifice to his village idols at the ever thirsty Egbesu shrine, the cult will appreciate a pot full of fresh white-men's blood

Nigerian 500 km ground radar (Civilian grade radars detect even a small Cessna plane), 407 km AWACS, F-7 jets with PL-9 missiles.....your SAAF has ZERO combat qualified Gripen pilot, and all your Hawk pilots have ZERO war experience with their jets.....NAF flew 6,000 combat sorties in 6 months.....South Africa won't have any air force left on earth if you ever manage to fly 10,000 km with your 600 km fuel....Mumu
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Patchesagain:
1. A design based on a battle tested design
2. ECM jamming does not work against the Umbani
3. Who said its snail slow?
4. Can a shilka target it?
5. Roland has a terrible combat record - 100 Roland launchers in Iraq and they only shot down 3 lowflying aircraf

"combat tested" is the last refuge a man takes when his argument is in tatters

Many Iraqi Rolands were destroyed by SEAD, massive waves after wave of American, British, French, sea/air launched cruise missiles and air to ground missiles including anti-radiation missiles ......all of which South Africa does NOT have

How does your Hawk jet travel 10,000 km with 600 km fuel ? I have asked you 10 times, no answer.....are you afraid ?
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jln115:
Air to Air refueling mate: We are getting new transports in the next 2-3 years, and if war breaks out now, we could just refurbish our boeing 707.

South Africa has ZERO air to air refueling capability, your Boeing 707 is dead, died about 5 years ago. Stop posting rubbish

Okay, may I also revive Nigeria's 18 Jaguar jets and 22 MiG-21 jets to face your Hawk jets in the air?

BTWN, you don't even know how air refueling works, the 9,0000 km distance means 10 hours flight non-stop for your Hawk jets, but the engine endurance is far less than half, even Gripen cannot fly beyond 3 hours engine endurance before it will fall from the sky from engine fatigue.

You think that tiny jet is British airways 747 international transport ? Mumu.

Your air force has a short wings that will NOT fly beyond Zimbabwe

Patchesagain:
GPS–INS for long range guidance, imaging infrared or a semi-active laser seeker for final phase attack... or just GPS-INS for the entire approach if we are hitting static targets

Ok, we blow your bridge, you fix it... we blow it again

Heavily defended? You have 16 Rolands... how many ammo dumps, forward bases, airstrips, bridges, ammo dumps, HQ's etc will you deploy in a full scale war? How much infrastructure is present in any one place?

To defend against a full scale attack from Hawks (25 with 4 Al-Tariq each) you need to deploy 12 Rolands... and that is assuming an impossible 100% hit rate for the Roland

It is impossible for you to defend a full sized formation from us, your Rolands will be clustered around one or two vital points, leaving the rest of your military infastructure exposed for attack

You keep assuming Nigeria has only Roland and no air force ! Fool, ya wanna die in battle ?

1. Forget seeker head, FLIR, infra red or infra white, any laser, targeting pod blah blah blah. Your laser needs a ground based laser designator placed on the target itself, so how did you enter Nigeria to place laser target designator on vital installations and infrastructure? You are attacking Nigeria from inside Nigeria? Are you drunk ?

Okay me too I will be inside your Pretoria presidential palace stabbing Zuma with a knife .

2. How will your Hawk jet travel 10,000 km with only 600 km fuel ? How do you attack Nigerian oil refinery 10,000 km away ? I keep asking .

3. Assume witches and wizards help you fly 9,000 km by witchcraft magical powers, but Nigeria has 500 km radar at the coastline, we detect your incoming Hawk jets from 500 kim away and scramble F-7 jets to intercept, ATR-42 has 407 km range AWACS radar mode and 200 targets tracking, ECCM jamming, ESM and ELINT + SATCOM, we control 100% of the air battle space and in 5 minutes F-7 jets will be eating up your slow speed Hawk jets before they get into range to launch a fvcking 100 km range bomb.

When NAF F-7 jets intercept, all your Soweto air force jets will not go forward, they are either fighting for survival or running back home to mummy and daddy....

#Mission Impossible
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Patchesagain:
we had the Al-Tariq's ancestors

and they were effective

You are still using bush war era SAM's

our Al-Tariq is latest technology

Which will be more effective?

The old guided bombs were battle tested, even though a lot of false propaganda claims were made by SADF, they are still ahead of Al-Tariq bomb that has not seen battle to see how it performs when facing ECM jamming from enemy and against enemy air defence with it's fvcking snail slow gliding speed that makes even a Shilka AA gun able to sh.oot it down !

The Al-Tariq has ZERO combat history to prove anything ! Roland has 100% Success in combat, it brings d.own both the enemy jet, the pilot, and all the b.ombs you drop !

Show me your Al-Tariq's war records.....I dare you
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Patchesagain:
So is that why South Korea wants to buy them? North Korea has no Airforce?

Targeting is done with GPS–INS, last I checked, its hard to move bridges/runways/radardomes/hangars/ammo-dumps/powerstations etc

For hitting moving targets, you can use imaging infrared or a semi-active laser seeker

Your FLIR or targeting pod has 120 km stand off range? No

Blow up bridge, enemy uses bridge layers or reconstruction. To blow up runway, ammo depot, etc you are attacking heavily defended targets, either your guided bomb or Hawk jet or both, will be eaten up by enemy air defenses.

# Tried Again Failed Again
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lezz:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigeria%E2%80%93South_Africa_relations

  [b]
South Africa praises Nigerian military for its apartheid-era help

by defenceWeb, February 9, 11:54 pm

The South African National Defence Force (SANDF) foreign relations head has praised the Nigerian Armed forces for its strong relationship with the South African military.


Major General Daniel Mofokeng, head of SANDF Foreign Relations, said Nigeria was in the forefront in the struggle against apartheid and that the country made huge sacrifices for the liberation of South Africa from minority rule.

Nigeria supported the then Frontline States organisation, which was established to achieve democratic majority rule in South Africa. Former members included Angola, Botswana, Lesotho, Mozambique, Tanzania, Zambia and Zimbabwe. According to the South African Institute of International Affairs, Namibia contributed an estimated US$61 billion towards the anti-apartheid effort between the 1980s and 1994.

Nigeria played a pivotal role in establishing the United Nations Special Committee against Apartheid in the 1960s while ordinary Nigerians contributed financially to the anti-apartheid movement, especially in reaction to the 1976 Soweto uprisings.

Mofokeng said that Nigeria also offered military training and support to assist the African National Congress. According to him, Nigeria's gesture helped shore up relations between Abuja and Pretoria.

"I must say the relations between the two countries most especially before 1994; has been extra ordinary in the sense that Nigeria has been in the forefront in the anti-apartheid struggle. It assisted and trained our cadre, our students and military students then. So I must say the cooperation between the two has been very great indeed".

"The Nigerian Armed Forces' very intimidating credentials, in terms of its military professionalism, is exemplified by its role in Liberia, Sierra Leone and most recently, in Ivory Coast," Nigeria's Defence Adviser to South Africa, Commodore Jacob Ajani told the Voice of Nigeria

"In most international fora you find out that it comes easily that Nigeria takes the frontline by way of providing leadership. We have provided many force commandants for the United Nations' peace keeping missions and the Africa Union as well."

The Nigerian Defence adviser had hosted fellow Defence attaches and Advisers at a reception to commemorate the 2012 Nigeria's Armed Forces and Remembrance Day celebrations in Pretoria, South Africa. The day is celebrated on January 15 every year.[/b] SOURCE:http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-23419/

# All Southies Demölished
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Patchesagain:
Ask the Angolans with their 9K33 Osa SAM's what happened to their bridges

Bush war propaganda does not prove anything.

Did you have Al-Tariq bomb in bush war? The bomb has NEVER seen battle except in dreamland
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[size=13pt]Come Help Us ! Egypt Keeps Begging Victorious Nigerian Military

http://www.punchng.com/news/nigeria-egypt-must-team-up-against-extremism-envoy/
[/size]
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jln115:
Pretoria and Abuja are only 7400km away from each other.

Assume you fly on a different route, yet does your Hawk jet range of 600 km = 7,400 km ?

Shortest easy direct route without violating other country's air space sovereignty is Cape Town to/fro Port Harcourt is about 9,000 km

http://www.happyzebra.com/distance-calculator/Cape%20Town-to-Port%20Harcourt.php

Nobody flies to war with calculation of last drop of fuel in tank. You provide for bad weather slow down in air and loiter time to acquire target.

So your SAAF Hawk jet 600 km range for combat is far far far far far far far far far below the 10,000 km distance, not even near the 7,000 km you quote....you are just as foolish as @Saengine, he is just an older fool, and a black one....you are white boy with Zulu brain, which hospital did your surgical transplant, I hear there is shortage of white brains for transplant, but plenty Zulu skulls for free
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RudzSA:
myth ...but the statement I citated was endorsed by ps Chris oyakhilome wen he was here

post the source of your citation by ps chris .

ssaengine:
120km is nothing you have. In any war, any air force would love to have this weapon. Or you think Nigeria wouldn't love to have something in a similar class. Umbani just needs a GPS location. Something that can be obtained via satellites and other methods.

In war you dont always need to target direct military threats. Your strategic industrial targets have fixed locations. Oil refineries, telecommunications etc. Not all of them can be defended. .

South Africa is to and fro 10,000 km away from Nigeria, so how does your Hawk jet that has combat range of 600 km now fly 10,000 km to ättäck a Nigerian oil refinery with 120 km bömb ? Do the distance mathematics now, foolish adult Southie

ssaengine:
-RAF had nothing in the class of Umbani during Falklands war. Hence they took part in risky low level bomb runs. You know this.

-Once the weapon is launched, it follows its own pre-programmed flight path and attack regime to target. The pilot is not involved. You know this.

-There is no need for any SAAF pilot to get within range of any Roland. Particularly using Litening III targeting pods, which according to the manufacturer work up to 40 000 feet. You know this.

British RAF and USAF all had guided bombs and long range guided air to ground missiles in Gulf war, yet Roland still shöt down sophisticated American A-10 Thunderbolt and British Tornado jets, and that was a fixed Roland that is not even mobile.

Every modern jet or weapon that challenged Roland got it's pilot kïlled ! World record.

Fly any SAAF jet you want, NAF has F-7 jets and ATR-42 Surveyor aircraft in Gabbiano radar mode of AWACS with 407 km radar and we will shööt down your jet and your Lightening pods in air to air combat.

NAF AWACS can track 200 airborne targets at the same time for our F-7 jets to demölish and any bomb Umbani Al Tariq or Al Mandela will be eaten raw by Roland missiles as proved by war history of Roland SAM....now show me one battle where your DENEL guided bomb has proved itself against targets protected by enemy air defense....show me one battle evidence....
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MikeCZAR:
Modular design.

A motor can be added.

Its ER version can reach 200km.

It doesn't fall but glide to its target. CONTROLLED!

The Raptor III will be able to strike targets. 300km away!

120 km is all you have. Forget the imaginary speculations of 300 km.

You can try use guided bombs if your target belongs to an enemy with no air force, no air defence, no radars. By the way, how do you see enemy target 120 km away and know it's exact location if we assume it does not move at all, are you a w.izard ?
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MikeCZAR:
Yes, the SAM can be destroyed.


Radar angular coverage of your SAM isn't 90 degrees and it's altitude is less than 12km.

A glide bomb with the ability to attack from any direction and angles up to 90 degrees can destroy SAM.

Air burst!!

British RAF world's best ranked jet pilots could not do that stunt VS a Roland in Falklands war, so is it your unqualified SAAF pilot that will do it?

RudzSA:
In 2013, the Economist Intelligence Unit rated Nigeria the worst
place for a child to be born out of 80 countries surveyed.

LOL....they ignored the new born babies daily R.aped in South Africa as local cure for HIV

MikeCZAR:
Modular design.

With a motor the range can be increased to 120km.

The bomb is manoeuvrable during the glide phase, so it can bypass SAM sites to hit its target.

The SAM is beside the target to protect it....Fool, you bypass bodyguard and stab a president with a knife? Fool
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mzilakazi:
Roland can never shoot gliders never.

Actually it sh.ot down bombs and supersonic jets in two wars. Leave this old and repeated argument of 2012-2015, enough said on same topic. You have no case. Roland is a missile, proved in war history. Stop all this going back to arguments settled in 2012, that's why @ddami hates this thread/forum....repetition caused by domingo blockhead Southies.

andrewza:
The bombs glided fast enough to stay above a Hawks stall speed. The final phase showed it moveing at a rather high speed. Before that phase it was rather high.

The video showels so many breaks in video camera continuity because aircraft was too fast for the bomb even near stall speed, the Hawk was no longer able to film the bomb from behind it, the Hawk turned many times and every time the sky/clouds slanted and tilted, the jet had to fly backwards when the video breaks continuity after losing contact sight of the bomb completely as the jet was faster and out-runs the slow bomb.

Then the Hawk had to change direction many times again and again, it began to film the bomb from side view most of the time, no more filming possible from bottom FLIR/Pod after launch, the rest of the flight stage glide filming after the bomb dropping, the rest of the video was done by the pilot's cockpit camera that's why we could see the cockpit glass and console all through the 2nd to final minute of the Al-Tariq bombs flight path until near the end on target.

The Hawk jet was too fast to fly behind the bomb, it turned backwards, allowed the bomb to go ahead, and the jet filmed from the side NOT from the back of the slower bomb. The slight speed difference on impact is due to gravity near ground, yet just about the speed of a sports car. The bomb was much slower during glide stage and that is the time enemy air defence will sh.oot it down, even a Shilka gun will waster your snail speed bomb.

Your video proves me right and proves you all wrong.....UNTIL YOU POST A DENEL SOURCE THAT QUOTES THE MANUFACTURERS SPEED OF YOUR GUIDED BOMB THAT HAS NO ROCKET TO PROPEL IT LIKE A HAWK JET ENGINE, your bomb runs on low power battery like a mobile phone.

Patchesagain:
So how can you say the bomb is slow if you dont know the speed it is falling at? You yourself say the speed is not stated in the video... how do you know that the Hawk is not moving at 1000 kph?

If the Hawk and the Al-Tariq both move at the same speed then you have no idea which is faster unless it is stated

No one was ever discussing the speed of glide bombs... they are different to JDAMs in that they GLIDE and dont FALL

Glide is a fall, it loses height, anything dropping to the ground is falling down.....or is it heading up to the moon ?

Nobody is interested in jet speed or helicopter speed. Argument is strictly about guided bomb speed.

@Ssaengine's video has shown us the speed of Umbani guided bomb Vs Maverick missile.

Your bomb flies at the speed of a snail, even a shilka gun will s.hoot down Al-Tariq/Umbani....case closed by video evidence.

Thank you @Saengine, may God deliver you from gay spirit...that's my prayer for you as reward for the Al-Tariq slow speed video you posted


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwbTabCqNsI
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Patchesagain:
You were the one who posted two videos

One showing that the Al-Tariq moves as fast as a jet

Another showing that a Mavrick is faster than a helicopter

What else are we supposed to conclude from your post?

Conclude that you have poor science knowledge....and you have NEVER shown a source for DENEL guided bomb speed....because it has NO measurable overall speed, it falls by gravity and oscillates with the wind interference.

The speed of the jet was not stated in the video, but we see it so slow it could trail a slow bomb and video it.

You bomb has no rocket fuel, it runs on battery and is damn slow.....proved....you need rocket engine to get speed of a missile.

Patchesagain:
So your president is a liar?

Yes, $2 billion that was moved from something else

Tell us what that something is

Budget minister

Patchesagain:
And I am not the one who said it is as fast as a hawk

You inferred it with your post.

Quote where I said the bomb is fast as the Hawk jet......I am waiting
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Patchesagain:
South Africa is 55X better to live in than Nigeria

Pigs are happy in sh1t... does that mean it is nice to live in sh1t?

This is South Africa's 'better life'

Patchesagain:
Why do I have to post a citation now? Because you misquoted me?

You are the one who just showed us a glide bomb is as fast as a jet and a rocket is faster than a helicopter

#TheFraudulentBuffoonDeomstratesHisIdiocyandFraudulentNature

That Hawk jet looks like near stall speed 200 km/hr, the video clearly shows the jet flying at very slow speed to launch, guide, and video the bomb, the clear and stable photo shows you the jet slowed down to allow the bomb move 'ahead' but hey, the bomb was going downwards and the jet was going forward, the pod or FLIR under belly of the Hawk was filming a bomb falling downwards from 40,000 feet to 0 feet, it was losing height as it glided forward.....the jet was flown damn slow for good video filming.....you need to post ths bombs official speed from manufacturer to prove it can step up it's game to match a 1,000 km/hr speed if the Hawk jet rev's up it's engine !

It's been a bad day for Patches, most of his posts got banned for posting jargonz

Patchesagain:
Al-Tariq (a glide bomb and not a JDAM) is as fast as a Jet

Post citation for speed of Al-Tariq....Hawk jet is 1,000 km/hr

#Disgraced Patches
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Patchesagain:
That's not what I said

A dividend was issued

Stop telling lies, you said it was budgeted or earmarked for something else....

patches689:
Augustus

You have simply rerouted money that was earmarked for something else

That means that somewhere in your buget someone just lost out on $1,6 billion

And that is money to plug the hole

I will stop arguing with you on finance, you KNOW NOTHING
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Patchesagain:
You also left out:

Besides, the Central Bank of Nigeria is to set up a special intervention fund that will offer between N250bn and N300bn as a soft loan to the states to enable them pay the backlog of salaries.

The President also approved a debt relief programme proposed by the Debt Management Office, which would help the states to restructure their commercial loans with banks currently put at over N660bn to extend the life span of such loans and reduce the states’ debt servicing expenditures.

Your states are going to go $1,58 billion deeper into debt to pay for the $3 billion in debt they have.

So well done, you have managed to only HALVE your debt

You are still roughly $1,5 BILLION in the hole and with no way of paying that = BANKRUPT

You know nothing about how dividends work, you said it's budgeted income, and I proved that nobody can budget on dividends because it may never be paid in cash, it can be bonus shares issue....you are not educated enough to know that.

As to your other point, USA and Canadian federal government give loans to states, it's global Public finance practice, so Nigeria can do it....or you can say USA and Canada are bankrupt because they loan cash to states....Patches is a Domingo Durango
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ssaengine:
8000 combat sorties in what time span? And is this only for fixed wing jets?

Over 2,000 were combat jet sorties....about 36 NAF jets total. Super low crash rate, even USAF will envy NAF

ssaengine:
SAAF Hawk drops Umbani bomb kit (at 40 000 feet) 40 km away from target. Tails it to the target. On board Umbani footage as well. Pin point accuracy. Fvcken cool video. Got to love South African engineering


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwbTabCqNsI

africandefence.net

Bwahahahahaa

This video finally proves my point, Guided Bombs have slow speed, we can all see it now clearly from South Africa's video evidence !

For a whole year, Patches and his gang of pirates have been arguing with me about Roland missile s.hooting down SAAF guided bomb Umbani.

The Southie fools and scientific dundees said the bomb has same speed as a Maverick missile, lots of lies about speed in vacuum or no vacuum, now we see the slow speed Umbani bomb/Al Tariq flying the way I said it will, slow, and going up and down to correct it's flight path like a yo-yo toy .....and it was struggling to focus track on a stationary target, yet they say it will hit a 60 km/hr moving vehicle that has AAA defences.

LOL, even a Shilka radar cannot will sh.oot down all SAAF guided snail speed bombs

Now compare Maverick missile speed and Al-Tariq/Umbani guided bomb speed....difference is clear o !



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwbTabCqNsI


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeLgLsM0eKg
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Patchesagain:
1. No an F7 will not do that - dont be ludicrous
2. South Africa does not tell lies just because the facts hurt your argument. The range Denel says it has is the range it is capable of.
3. Iraq bought their missiles at the same time as you, and when found in 2004 or so (about a decade ago) they were expired
4. How many missiles can the Roland guide in the air?

Roland is obsolete junk with expired missiles, 17 Hawks alone will overwhelm your entire air defence network

The fact that you have been claiming Roland AMX carries only 2 missiles instead of the standard 10 missiles until I educated you like a kid, shows you know NOTHING and it wrecks all your arguments 100% wrecked

#FvckingWrecked By Augustine

Patchesagain:
Was the money pulled out of thin air?

No?

Then somewhere else in your budgets and financial set-up is now short $1 billion dollars.

Your own president said you were broke. Is he a liar?

Poor knowledge of accounting and public finance is a disease in South Africa.

As a rule in finance, you don't budget for dividend on shares, because you never know how much it is, company needs to trade and make profit, or else dividend becomes zero, and if making profit, directors meet and decide to declare or not declare dividend, it can come as cash payout or just paper rights issue or bonus hare issue instead of cash.

So, Nigeria cannot budget on dividend income because it is an uncertain income, it can be zero ! Your dividend is never known until company has traded and profited and directors decide to pay you or not to pay for a whole year !

You know nothing about economics or finance/accounting, that's why half literate newspaper journalists dribble you around with stories of bankruptcy and as old as you are, you gladly swallow the mud that younger boys feed you with
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Patchesagain:
Was the money pulled out of thin air?

No?

Then somewhere else in your budgets and financial set-up is now short $1 billion dollars.

Your own president said you were broke. Is he a liar?

He is broke and dishing our $ 2 billion from dividend income on company shares investment.

LOL.....he is a politician and politicians tell lies all over the world.