₦airaland Forum

@trini girl

Never mind, we will see if really the allegation about the contradictions is not correct.

The issue of Barikade and Babs is still very fresh, you may go there for confirmation of the translational error!

[b]Especially since I have little knowledge of the Qu'ran.[/b]

Then you should have done your verification before posting any Quranic Verse.

Qu'ran aside and more importantly however, and what I found interesting in this article, is the admission that there are two types of translational errors in the Bible, but it in no way lessens the truth of the Gospel of Christ.

It might not have lessen the truth of the Gospel, but can we say the current gospel is the one given to Jesus?

Also, what sort of translational error is that in which a verse is saying 18 and another 118. What is the position of the Holy Spirit here. If they have used a word to replace another it would have been better (synonyms) but for a verse to be saying 6pm and another saying 3pm, is quite unacceptable and very contradicting.

It is very glaring that none of the so called writers/authors (mathew,mark,luke & john)can be held responsible as being the real writers/authors. None of them was around, they all fled. It was only the women that stood from afar witnessing the incident. Little wonder Mary went to the tomb to anoint jesus (never mind, coming to that in my write up on the crucifixion of jesus).

Dont you worry,my next post will not be for you but for Shahan.

@babaearly

This guy has the rights to posts trash in here well

This must be Alao-Akala's style,

He has forgotten that he who lives in glass house must not throw stone

Tit for Tat

@babaearly,

The name fit you perfectly. Never mind, we will see as we move on.

And please Christians shut this guy's up. Answer his questions ok?

No problem, it will be highly appreciated.

but saying that Jesus the Christ didnt resurrect and ascend into Heaven is a blantant and very stupid joke.

Hold your breath. Dont rush yourself. We all shall see in due course.

@babyosis,

Dont tell me that you are that blind to the extent of not seeing my posts and questions.

When I first started the write-up, I posted some questions after each post. You told me that you didnt have time to go through my write-up that I should tell you my reason for kicking against his crucifixion and I gave them to you. Here you are again, telling me again to tell you the reasons/evidence that Jesus was not crucified .

If you care, these are my first questions

[b]Question 1
Since Jesus came to die on the cross, it means that he is very aware of the contract. If so, why was Judas named a traitor for the fact it has been arranged that he would die?

Question 2
Why did he charge them to buy sword. Did I hear someone saying that one of his disciples that raised sword against the Romans was rebuked? Well, am still coming to that but the question now, why did he charge them to buy sword?

Question 3

a. why did they all go to Gethsemane? To pray?
b. Could they not have prayed in the upper room?
c. Why did he go with his disciples to pray when only him can do the prayer afterall they didn’t pray with him but watched.

Question 4
Why did he take Peter, john and james further into the garden?

Question 5

a. Why did he pray to the extent of sweating blood.
b. what was the prayer for since he came to die.

Question 6

a. What did the angel of God came to strengthen him for?
b. Did he come to increase his doubts or fear?
c. To multiply his anxieties
d. Did the angel come to tell him that God had forsaken him in his disbelief?

This is my final attempt to help you come at a grown up discussion with a mature disposition.

I dont give a damn. If you like, run away. But try shutting up his mouth as being said by babaearly.

You never have the answers and will never.

Lets see if his mouth can be shut.

Escapist.

@Mukina,

Salam. Please go as being said by all. Iwill fix this mumu up.


@mrpataki

Posted by: mrpataki
Insert Quote
@ blabs 787,
You mean my question should be ignored here? Yet you cry foul of such in various topics here. Ok answer this simple question. In Islam, would Mukina be encouraged to shed more light on Islam in your congregational meetings as she is been encouraged to do such here on the internet?
Lets see whether your curse can actually leave you now?

The organogram man.

You really displayed your stupidy and ignorance here.

This is just one of the conceptions I mentioned. This pataki never knew the difference between posting a thread and listening to voice. Na wa o.

You can see that you are really cursing yourself.

Keep cursing yourself!!

@trini girl

Thanks for bringing up the already-thought dead issue. Why not take it easy by posting it one after the other so that babs will respond every contradictions? But never mind, babs will still respond to them in the way your posts were arranged.

It is very glaring that you copied everything from the same site babyosis went to seek asistance, but I will still attend to the post to show you that there are contradictions in the bible.

Before I continue, I will advise you go to this thread tagged "the 2nd coming of Jesus Christ" and read for yourself how I analysed the bible using different versions.

1.  The Foundation

The Charge of Contradiction

The Qur'an gives authority to the Bible:
The Qur'an, itself, the highest authority for all Muslims, gives authority to the Bible, assuming its authenticity at least up to the seventh-ninth Centuries.
Consider the following Suras:

Sura Baqara 2:136 points out that there is no difference between the scriptures which preceded and those of the Qur'an, saying, ", the revelation given to us, and Jesus, we make no difference between one and another of them."
Quran 2v136:
Sura Al-I-Imran 3:2-3 continues, "Allah, He sent down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus), as a guide to mankind."

As we proceed, we will know if really the present day Gospel is worth relying on, even Jeremiah 8v8 confirmed it.

"`How can you say, "We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?'

Also read Deuteronomy 31:25-29 where Moses (peace be upon him) predicted the corruption/tampering of the Law (Bible) after his death.

The present day bible can not be said to be the gospel given to jesus:

1. Most of the stories were recorded after jesus's death as a result, did not potray the real gospel given to Jesus.

2. Those that claimed to have been the author (mathew, mark, luke and john) can not be held responsible for the gospel.

For example, we will note that every Gospel begins with the introduction "According to, " such as "The Gospel according to Saint Matthew," "The Gospel according to Saint Luke," "The Gospel according to Saint Mark," "The Gospel according to Saint John." The obvious conclusion for the average man on the street is that these people are known to be the authors of the books attributed to them. This, however is not the case. Even the internal evidence suggests that, for instance, Matthew did not write the Gospel attributed to him:

Gospel of Mathew

Mathew 9v9: ", And as Jesus passed forth thence, HE (Jesus) saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and HE (Jesus) saith unto HIM (Matthew), follow ME (Jesus) and HE (Matthew) arose, and followed HIM (Jesus).

Did "Matthew" write this about himself? Why then didn't Matthew write for example: "he (Jesus) saw ME, and my name is Matthew. I was sitting at the receipt of custom…" etc.

The Gospel according to Mark

Please go to http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%2016:9-20;&version=31, where you have it that ((The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have Mark 16:9-20.))

Also in the RSV, the footnote reads and I quote, " Some  of the most ancient authorities bring the book to a close at the end of verse 8. One authority concludes the book by adding after verse 8 the following: But they reported briefly to Peter and those with him all that they had been told. And after this, Jesus himself sent out by means of them, from east to west, the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation. Other authorities include the preceding passage and continue with verse 9-20. In most authorities, verses 9-20 follow immediately after verse 8, a few authorities insert ADDITIONAL MATERIAL AFTER verse 14"

Serious doubts exists as to whether these verses belong to the Gospel of Mark. No wonder its being put as foot note.

Hope you understood?

The Gospel according to Luke

The author made it known to us that he was not inspired and also not an eye witness.He made it known to us that he collected it from people, and is is known for sure that he was not inspired by GOD Almighty to write the Book since he didn't mention about any divine inspiration, and he said ", since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, " Is there GOD's inspiration in this?

The author wrote it for the purpose of "his most excellent Theophilus."

For further verification on the above Gospel, pls go to

http://newadvent.org/cathen/14625b.htm
http://newadvent.org/cathen/14625a.htm

There is a serious forgery about Jesus' "resurrection on the third day" claiming that it was foretold in the OT when it wasn't!  Let us look at Luke 24:44-48 from the NIV Bible:

Luke 24v44-48:
He said to them, "This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms." Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures. He told them, "This is what is written: The Christ will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day,and repentance and forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. You are witnesses of these things.

NOTE: AM still coming to the issue of third day in my write on "was Jesus crucified"

Luke 24:44-48 says that it is written in the Law of Moses (i.e., the Torah) that Jesus will die and resurrect on the third day.  Where in the entire Old Testament (not just in the 5 books of Moses that make up the Law of Moses or the Torah) do you have that?!   Show me one Old Testament verse that prophesized about Jesus' third day resurrection?

The Gospel according to John:

Is john (one of jesus' disciples) the same as the john that wrote the gospel?

"The author is the apostle John, 'the disciple whom Jesus loved' (13:23; 19:26; 20:2; 21:7, 20,24). He was prominent in the early church but is not mentioned by name in this Gospel--which would be natural if he wrote it, but hard to explain otherwise.  (From the NIV Bible Commentary, page 1588)"

When one reads this gospel, one would immediately notice that it was not written by John himself.  Let us look at the following verses from the gospel:

John 1:19: "And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?"  (King James Version Bible)

John 1:26: "John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;  (King James Version)
John 3:24: "For John was not yet cast into prison".King James Version)

etc,

3. The authors were not around to witness most of the happenings surrounding jesus christ. They all fled the scene

Sura Nisaa 4:136 carries this farther by admonishing the Muslims to, ", Believe, and the scripture which He sent before him."

We will know if really they are the same with the one given to Jesus (PBUH) as we move on.

In Sura Ma-ida 5:47,49,50,52 we find a direct call to Christians to believe in their scriptures: ", We sent Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him. We sent him the Gospel,  Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein, if any do fail to judge by the light of what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel, "

Again, in Sura Ma-ida 5:68 we find a similar call: "People of the Book!, Stand fast by the law, the Gospel, and all revelation that hath come to you from YOUR LORD. It is the revelation that has come to thee from THY LORD."

No my dear, pls read:
Quran 5v68: Say (O Muhammed saw), " O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! YOU HAVE NOTHING (AS REGARDS GUIDANCE) till you act according to the Torah, the Gospel, AND WHAT HAS (NOW) BEEN SENT DOWN TO YOU FROM YOUR LORD (THE QURAN). Verily, that which has been sent down to you (O Muhammed saw) from your Lord increases in most of them (their) obstinate rebellion and disbelief. So be not sorrowful over the PEOPLE WHO DISBELIEF.

Hope its clearly understood.

To embolden this idea of the New and Old Testament's authority we find in Sura 10:94 that Muslims are advised to confer with these scriptures if in doubt about their own, saying: "If thou wert in doubt as to what We have revealed unto thee, then ask those who have been reading the Book from before thee. The truth had indeed come to thee from thy Lord."

Hey,  No, No, No. This is what we have
Quran 10v94: So if you (O Muhammed saw) is in doubt concerning which we have revealed unto you, (that your name is written in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel), then ask those who are reading the Book (the Torah and the Injeel (Goespel) before you. Verily, the truth has  come to you from your Lord. So be not of those who doubt.

The above verse even applies to you christians that are saying that the holy prophet wasnt mentioned in your bible.(Deutronomy 18v18, john 14:16, john 15v26, john 14v26, john 16v7-14 and Isaiah 42) According to the Aramaic Bible Society, the word "Paraclete" back then meant the "Praised One".  Muhammad's name was "Ahmed".  Both Muhammad and Ahmed in Arabic mean "The Honored One" or the "Praised One".

For verification, please go to:

http://www.aramaic.org/PARAVLETE.html

Finally, in Sura Ankabut 29:46 Muslims are asked not to question the authority of the scriptures of the Christians, saying, "And dispute ye not with the people of the book but say: We believe in the revelation which has come down to us and that which came down to you."

Trini Girl, why lying. Read what we have
Quran 29v46: And argue not with the people of the scriptures unless it be in a (a way) that is better (with good words and in good manner, inviting them to Islamic Monotheism with His Verses), except with such of them as do wrong:and say (to them); "we believe in that which has been revealed to us and revealed to you, our God and your God is One (Allah) and to Him we have submitted (as Muslims)

Allah in the above verse is even telling we muslims to preach to you to accept ISLAM

If the Qur'an was indeed the final and complete revelation, if it was the seal of all former revelations the Muslims claim, than certainly the author of the Qur'an would have included a warning against that which had been corrupted in the earlier scriptures.

But nowhere do we find even a hint that the Bible was contradictory, or indeed that it was corrupted.

Quran 5v13 from the Noble Quran: "But on account of their breaking their covenant We cursed them (Jews and Christians) and made their hearts hard; they altered the words from their places and they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of; and you shall always discover treachery in them excepting a few of them; so pardon them and turn away; surely Allah loves those who do good (to others)."  

Quran 5v41 "O Apostle! let not those grieve thee, who race each other into unbelief: (whether it be) among those who say "We believe" with their lips but whose hearts have no faith; or it be among the Jews,- men who will listen to any lie,- will listen even to others who have never so much as come to thee. They change the words from their (right) times and places: they say, 'If ye are given this, take it, but if not, beware!' If any one's trial is intended by God, thou hast no authority in the least for him against God. For such - it is not God's will to purify their hearts. For them there is disgrace in this world, and in the Hereafter a heavy punishment."

@shahan,

I just couldnt help laughing at your last post. You know what , I do enjoy your post a lot.  When you see that a certain question looks very tough, you quickly resorted to "you have answered him but he keep saying that they have been IGNORING his  questions" or "I have been told never to reply your post again" or better still "When you cure yourself of your blabbings and seek an educated debate". .You still went ahead mentioning the word "IGNORED" when nothing of such has been mentioned here.A very funny being.

Quote from: babs787 on Today at 02:20:45 PM
Shahan, when I threw the question at you, I expected you to give me the reason why Jesus preached to them to repent as in mathew 4v17

You did not throw any questions at me; rather, you addressed them to babyosisi - and I offered those answers to quell your complaints about people "IGNORING" your questions. You have a serious problem reading posts, and then claiming that your questions were "IGNORED". That was what those links were inserted to point out - that the claim of "ignoring" your questions is simply dishonest.

Are those answers not from you?
I quoted your response to my questions above and I never mentioned "IGNORED". So you can see that you have both visual and comprehension problem more than I do. I tried simplifying my last post but you still went ahead with the same word "IGNORED"

And since you repeatedly lacked the manners or civility to admit that answers were offered (though you might have disagreed), I simply didn't want to waste time on you any further. If you took that as a long sought break to celebrate your so-called being "too-much", then I admitted you were being cheap.

Still the same crap!! Was anything like "IGNORING" your post ever mentioned in my last post? Am very sure you are having a very dull vision and not comprehension problem because if not, you would have read my last post that nothing of such was mentioned.

When you cure yourself of your blabbings and seek an educated debate, I'm always available.

There she go again. Lets take it that you have provided 100% response to my questions so far on this thread, so lets move on. How about that?

Quote from: babs787 on Today at 02:20:45 PM
Shahan, why did jesus need to point out the above?
- - - -
Shahan, If you still disagree based on the above explanation that still, he died on the cross, let me know.

I have read and noted all the fresh questions in your post above; but like I said, my answers in subsequent posts will depend on whether or not you keep up dishonest claims about being "IGNORED." Let me know which is best for you.

Thanks for acknowledging seeing my questions and not hiding under the guise of GoB. So let the answers keep pouring in and no "IGNORING" this time.

@Shahan,

Let me start from here with you

1[b]. Twelve questions posed - all answered point-by-point with Biblical texts in Did Jesus For Our Sin? Which Sin?.[/b]

this is just one out of the twelve questions

[b]  if jesus actually came to die for your sin , and that salvation lies in his blood sacrifice, why did he preached repentance in mathew 4v17[/b]

Shahan, when I threw the question at you, I expected you to give me the reason why Jesus preached to them to repent as in mathew 4v17 not mentioning blood sacrifice because according to Paul,'no sins can be forgiven unless blood is offered'. But here, Jesus in his preaching did not say anything pertaining to blood sacrifice but only preached repentance.

You posted this
]Jesus: "I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." [Luke 13:3]

Still supporting my question above

You gave me the below verse also
Heb. 9:22
"The Law says that almost everything must be sprinkled with blood, and no sins can be forgiven unless blood is offered."[/b]

To buttress my point that blood sacrifice is not needed for salvation, lets read mathew 19v16-19: and behold one came and said unto him, Good master, 'what good thing must I do that I may have eternal life? and Jesus said unto him, why callest me good? There is no one good but one, that is, God, but if thou will enter into life (paradise), keep the commandments. He said unto him, which? Jesus said, thou shall do no murder, thou shall not bear false witness, honour thy father and mother and thou shall love thy neighbour as theyself.

No where blood atonement was mentioned during Jesus' era. Hope you understood?

also another question
if jesus came to die, why is he afraid of death in john 11v53: then from that day forth, they took counsel togetherr to put him to death. Jesus therefore walked no more in openly among the jews but went unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called ephraim and there continued with his disciples.[/b]

you responded that
The verse is 54 (not 53), and it does not teach that Jesus was afraid of death. Other verses show that He gave Himself willingly to death in view of the resurrection:

Since you said he wasnt afraid of death, i told you to read the below verse
Mathew 26v37-39: …. And he began to be sorrowful and very depressed. Then said he unto them,’my soul is exceedingly sorrowful, even unto death….’ And he went a little farther and fell on his face (just like muslims) and prayed saying, ‘ o my father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless, not as I will but as thou wilt.

2. My answers to your questions on the authorship of Deuteronomy: The Second Coming of Jesus Christ and here also.

I gave you instances that he couldnt have written the last chapter by himself as a result of these:

1. He was 120 years old WHEN HE DIED
2. , and he (God Almighty) BURIED HIM (Moses),
3. , and there arose not a prophet SINCE in Israel like unto Moses[/b]

3. My answer to your allegations and accusations of lies and stealing against Jesus in The Second coming of Jesus Christ.

Here, you levelled allegation that my Prophet committed Incest with Aisha  and I asked you to tell me
1. If Abu Bakr and the Holy Prophet relate
2. If Aisha and the Holy Prophet relate

Secondly, I also asked you if the 2nd Coming of Jesus as being said by him materialised?

Is Jesus God?; and again in this same thread.

Here I still maintain that Jesus is quite different from God. God sent Jesus.

Now to the issue at hand.

Luk 24:36-43 >>  "And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. And He said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.And when He had thus spoken, He shewed them His hands and His feet. And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, He said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And He took it, and did eat before them"

Never mind, dont rush yourself. Am still coming to the above. You will still have to tell me:

what Jesus was trying to proof when he showed them his hands and feet.

"Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I myself"

What has demonstration of hands and feet got to do with resurrection?

Do resurrected body carry any mark live the living?

Jesus tried explaining to his disciples in a very clear term that ‘it is I myself (meaning not spirit)'

For a spirit has “no flesh and bones as you see me have”.

This is a self evident truth. Jesus was telling them that a spirit has no flesh and bones meaning that he was alive. Still the same old Jesus.

Shahan, why did jesus need to point out the above?

It is simply because his disciples were thinking that he had returned from the dead, that he had been resurrected and if so he would be in a spiritual form – a spirit. Jesus was telling them that he was not a spirit (resurrected body) but a living person.

Now if say: “I have flesh and bones”, it means I am not a spirit but human being but if I say, “I have no flesh and bones”. What does that mean to you?. It means that I am a spirit. So also the message Jesus was trying to pass across to them that, “It is I myself and that I have flesh and bones, I am alive.

Jesus was telling his disciples, when he said, “behold my hands and feet” that the body he wanted them to see, feel and touch was neither a spiritualised body, a metamorphosed body nor a resurrected body because a resurrected body becomes spiritualised, they are equal to angels. It is quite impossible to touch a spirit.

And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, He said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And He took it, and did eat before them"[/b]

In order for them to believe him, he said, “Have ye here any meat”? and they gave him a broiled fish and of a honey comb and he took it and did eat before them.

Why did he do the above. Was it to prove that he resurrected or that he was still his old self? It is know that dead body are spiritualised body and are equal to angels. They do not eat and drink like the living.

Shahan, If you still disagree based on the above explanation that still, he died on the cross, let me know.

@babyosis,

Also, did you read my first evidence showing that he did not die on the cross?

Let me start with babyosis

@babyosis,

[b][b]Question 1
Since Jesus came to die on the cross, it means that he is very aware of the contract. If so, why was Judas named a traitor for the fact it has been arranged that he would die?

Question 2
Why did he charge them to buy sword. Did I hear someone saying that one of his disciples that raised sword against the Romans was rebuked? Well, am still coming to that but the question now, why did he charge them to buy sword?

Question 3

a. why did they all go to Gethsemane? To pray?
b. Could they not have prayed in the upper room?
c. Why did he go with his disciples to pray when only him can do the prayer afterall they didn’t pray with him but watched.

Question 4
Where is he taking Peter, john and james now? Further into the garden. Why did he take them further into the garden

Question 5

a. Why did he pray to the extent of sweating blood.
b. what was the prayer for since he came to die.

Question 6

a. What did the angel of God came to strengthen him for?
b. Did he come to increase his doubts or fear?
c. To multiply his anxieties
d. Did the angel come to tell him that God had forsaken him in his disbelief?[/b]

Where in the above does the issue of GoB comes in? Do the questions look like those being lifted from the GoB?

I could remember when i first posted the above, you told me to give you reasons and i posted the below.

1. why did mary go to the tomb?
2. why was the stone removed and why were the winding sheets found unwind?
3. why did mary think jesus as a gardener? do resurrected bodies look like gardeners?
4. what does mary wanted to do with a decomposing body?
5. can she alone carry a dead body?
6. what was the sign of jonah

Do the above relate with the GoB? Are they not questions from the NT?

I still ignored, continued with my write and came with other questions, still from the NT:

1. What clinical instrument was used in detecting and certifying him dead (because he wasnt touch nor his pulse felt)?

2. The instant coming out of blood and water showed that he was alive and if not, why the coming out of blood and water from dead body.

Every question was asked based on verses lifted from the NT. Do the above too relate with GoB?

Common be honest. None of the questions listed above was from GoB, all were lifted from NT.

I concluded in my last write up that if you still hold on to the claim that he was crucified by knocking out the above, that i would still proceed to the next stage in the order questions were arranged up.

Let me start with babyosis

@babyosis,

[b]Question 1
Since Jesus came to die on the cross, it means that he is very aware of the contract. If so, why was Judas named a traitor for the fact it has been arranged that he would die?

Question 2
Why did he charge them to buy sword. Did I hear someone saying that one of his disciples that raised sword against the Romans was rebuked? Well, am still coming to that but the question now, why did he charge them to buy sword?

Question 3

a. why did they all go to Gethsemane? To pray?
b. Could they not have prayed in the upper room?
c. Why did he go with his disciples to pray when only him can do the prayer afterall they didn’t pray with him but watched.

Question 4
Where is he taking Peter, john and james now? Further into the garden. Why did he take them further into the garden

Question 5

a. Why did he pray to the extent of sweating blood.
b. what was the prayer for since he came to die.

Question 6

a. What did the angel of God came to strengthen him for?
b. Did he come to increase his doubts or fear?
c. To multiply his anxieties
d. Did the angel come to tell him that God had forsaken him in his disbelief?

Where in the above does the issue of GoB comes in? Do the questions look like those being lifted from the GoB?

I could remember when i first posted the above, you told me to give you reasons and i posted the below.

1. why did mary go to the tomb?
2. why was the stone removed and why were the winding sheets found unwind?
3. why did mary think jesus as a gardener? do resurrected bodies look like gardeners?
4. what does mary wanted to do with a decomposing body?
5. can she alone carry a dead body?
6. what was the sign of jonah

Do the above relate with the GoB? Are they not questions from the NT?

I still ignored, continued with my write and came with other questions, still from the NT:

1. What clinical instrument was used in detecting and certifying him dead (because he wasnt touch nor his pulse felt)?

2. The instant coming out of blood and water showed that he was alive and if not, why the coming out of blood and water from dead body.[/b]

Every question was asked based on verses lifted from the NT. Do the above too relate with GoB?

Common be honest. None of the questions listed above was from GoB, all were lifted from NT.

I concluded in my last write up that if you still hold on to the claim that he was crucified by knocking out the above, that i would still proceed to the next stage in the order questions were arranged up.

@mukina,

Insha Allah the thread will not turn to another thing. Just concentrate on whatever you want to be posting and ignore detractors as well as mischief makers.

Maa salam

shahan,

Am not surprised

How many times have replies been made to blabs787's posts and he came back with the dishonest claim that we "ignored" his questions? You could as well amuse away your time on such drivel if you also can't read posts.

Are you referring to answer you provided on the issue of Muhammed (saw) when i asked you to tell if the prophet in any way related to Abu Bakr and also if Aisha related to the prophet?

Are you referring to the issue when i asked you to tell me if the prophesy of the 2nd coming materialised or not?

Are you referring to the answers supplied when I asked you questions on the Jesus dying for your sin?

Are you referring to answers supplied when I asked you if jesus was sent to the whole world or to the jews alone. etc

Are you referring to when i posted thread on the divinity of Jesus?

Here too answers have been supplied abi but probably ignored.

madam, you are no match for BABATUNDE You preached the above doctrine but couldnt defend rather you resorted to l playing hide and seek laying empahsis on the Gospel of Barnabas.

HERE, my questions has so far been on NT but not on GoB. I know for sure If we are have been disscusing other things, you would have posted many irrelevant bible quotes here but here you are lost, forgetting that babs has most of their versions. Even your Pope or Pastors will not be able to answer, I have dealth with those stronger in faith than you.

@shahan & barikade,

Like i said, the curse is resting perfectly on you. You claimed that I lied. This is my first question

1. where did the second denial take lace?
a. was to a maid in the gateway (mark 14v69)
b. was to another maid in the porch (mathew 26v71)
c. was to a man (luke 22v58)

Bring out and check from your Revised Standard version first if you will not see these there

was to a maid in the gateway (mark 14v69)
was to another maid in the porch (mathew 26v71)
Luke on his case said it was to someone else

The curse is working perfectly on you. Quote your RSV for me and lets see if the curse is not resting on you.

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

@Backslider,

I have been expecting this type of post from you. I intentionally ignored you post. The reason is that it is not because of pride, arrogance or whatever but because of the arrangement of the post.

It will be highly appreciated sir, if you will arrange the questions i.e. listing the contradictions one after the other and probably bringing out the verses and babs will surely respond.

you will see that the above didnt look like questions but opinion but will be happy if you can arrange them for me.

Lastly, we may be of different religion but that doesnt mean that babs will start throwing insult or resort to name calling. The reason for saying is that the tone of my post may sound somehow but never meant to be disrepectul in one way or the other. It is only when babs is being pushed to the wall that he responds with the same measure. Respect is Reciprocal.

I do hope that my post is clearly understood.

Thanks very much for the understanding and may God bless.

@lafile,

So the above post never made sense to you?

hmmmmmmmm

@naijacutee,

thanks for the wonderful post.

I started my argument with "doubt from the beginning" mentioning those that didnt support the crucifixion in which I included GoB.

The reason for including the gospel of Barnabas is that babyosis posted some historical data and I asked her the reason for her non-inclusion of the gospel of Barnabas since his name appeared in the bible and KAG told me that no one would believe in GoB and I moved on.

When I made the statement, I never repeated it but went straight to another stage where I started with "where do we begin", representing the main topic and I never asked questions from GoB. All the first 6 questions from the first post and the last questions from subsequent posts have been asked from New Testament.

You would have noticed from my post so far that no question out of the first 6 questions has been so far asked from the gospel of barnabas, all have been from the New Testament even my last questions never rested on GoB.

Thanks very much for the understanding.

Stay Blessed

@all,

Why are you trying to divert the thread to that of GoB? My questions have never been on GoB but from the New Testament. I used that as the introduction to my thread.

Cheers

Very funny indeed.

Am sure, Amby must be a Catholic while accursed Barikade, Protestant.

Lets see how the issue is being sorted out. Christian against Christian.

Amby if you are a Catholic, when you are through with the above, enlighten then on TRINITY.

So God has a mother. In West Africa, Nigeria Precisely, if a mother has any son without any father, the son is regarded as a Bastard, but here, I dont think the God being conceived by Mary in your bible fits into that because your God has mother but no biological Father!!

since God is having mother, he must also have grandmother and maybe great grandmother, he must also have maternal brothers and sisters leading to the family of God.

a very blasphemous statement.

As there is a difference between heaven and earth, so also is the difference between God and Jesus.

salam sister mukina,

May Allah in His infinite mercy continue to guard, protect you and as you continue sharing the good message of ISLAM. May you never see any problem that will be too much for you to bear thereby compelling you to ignore ISLAM.

I am very happy with this thread and am very sure, it will go a long way to enlighten some muslims that do not know anything about their religion.

Also this particular thread will go a long way in shedding light on the misconceptions people are having towards ISLAM.

Jazha Khullah Khairan

Maa Salam

@barikade.

Let me first laugh at this[i] yeye boy's[/i] stupidity. Thanks for exposing another fraud in the bible.

This mumu and other christians never knew that BABS has most of their bible versions, so no escape route for you, the curse is really working on you. By the way, where is your brother gbade.x, the curse worked on him to the extent that he went to another thread (babyosis thread), moved away from the topic and started cursing innocent Man Utd and Chelsea fans but thank God we still won wigan yesterday regardless of his curse. Now back to business

Where was it written or where did you hear it from that Muslims consider Jesus' (PBUH) sayings as blasphemy, you have nothing sensible to say in that area. Muslims never did. ode.

Why bringing Shahan into the issue now? You need support abi? When Shahan and I were disagreeing over certain issue, I said to her that "God's curse would be on liar" and we both agreed. Let me tell you this, in my recent post to her, can you bring out from my post in which same was said to her. Also have you read my post where same had been said to babyosis, havila, backslider, mrpataki etc, you will never see. You decided to bear the burden that wasnt yours and only you will continue facing the consequence except any other person that decides to be your partner because and the curse will continue working on you till God knows when.

Lets see who the curse has been working on and will continue working on. I asked where was the denial made and will also add to whom the last denial was made. You tried muddling things up but will sort them out for you. You know I asked you "where was the denial made abi", and also adding to whom the last denial was made. We will go through each versions and see if we can seee just a version in which the three authors agree.

You must have quoted from Barikade's version or Gbade.x's version.

Happy reading, the accursed Barikade

Where was the denial made?


King James Version

Mathew 26v71: …and he was gone into the Porch
Mark 14v68-69: and he went out into the[b] Porch[/b]
Luke 22v55-58: …in the midst of the hall.

Hope u can see the difference: Mathew and Mark both said it was in the Porch while Luke said it was in the midst of the hall. Lets check another version to see if the three will agree.

Revised Standard Version

Mathew 26v71:and when he went out to the Porch
Mark 14v68: …and he went out into the Gateway
Luke 22v55: …in the middle of the Courtyard

Which one are we taking? Mathew said ‘he went out to the Porch’, Mark said ‘he went out into the Gateway ' while Luke said ‘in the middle of the Courtyard’. Lets see another version of the bible

Good News Bible

Mathew 26v71: went out to the entrance of the Courtyard
Mark 14v68: went out into the Passage
Luke 22v55: …center of the Courtyard

Mathew said[b] ‘entrance of the Courtyard'[/b], Mark said, ‘ he went out into the Passage 'while Luke said, ‘centre of the Courtyard'. Lets check another version of the bible

New Living Translation

Mathew 26v71: , out by the GATE
Mark 14v68: …went out into the ENTRY WAY
Luke 22v55: the guards lit a fire in the COURTYARD…Peter joined them.

Mathew said ‘out by the gate’, Mark said ‘into the entry way ' while Luke said[b] ‘it was in the Courtyard[/b]. Na wa o. lets check another. Hope you dey see mumu

The Gideon Bible

Mathew 26v71: …gone out to the[b] GATEWAY[/b]
Mark 14v68: ….he went out on the[b] PORCH[/b]
Luke 22v55: Peter sat among them in the[b] COURTYARD[/b]

Mathew said gateway, mark said porch while Luke said it was Courtyard. The curse is working on you real hard.

To whom was the last denial made

King James Version

Mathew 26v73: and after a while came unto him THEY THAT STOOD BY and said to Peter surely thou also art one of them, for THY SPEECH BETRAYETH THEE
Mark 14v70: ….and a little farther, THEY THAT STOOD BY said again to Peter, ‘surely, thou art one of them. For thou art one of them. For thou art a Galilean, AND THY SPEECH AGREED THERETO

Luke in his own case said it was ‘another man' but not ‘they’ like his other writers and forgot to use woman for man not noting the word ‘another’.

Please don’t blame Luke because he wasn’t an eye witness, he copied from one of them and he even wrote to Theophilus and not to you all. Hear him.

Luke 1v1-3: For as much as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us even as THEY DELIVERED THEM UNTO US WHICH FROM THE BEGINNING WERE EYEWITNESSES AND MINSTERS OF THE WORLD. IT SEEMED GOOD TO ME…, MOST EXCELLENT THEOPHILUS.

Mathew said it was to bystanders, but their speech betrayeth thee, while Mark also agreed that it was to the bystanders but that their speech agreed thereto while luke said it was to another man. Lets check RSV

To whom was the last denial made

Revised Standard Version

Mathew 26v73: to bystanders…”for your accent betrays you”
Mark 14v70: to bystanders… “for you are a Galilean”
Luke 22v59: to another man (not bystanders like his friends) … ‘for he is a Galilean’

Mathew and Mark both agreed that it was to bystanders but Luke said it was to another man (a person and not bystanders)
Lets check another version

Good News Bible

Mathew 26v73: to the men standing
Mark 14v70: to bystanders
Luke 22v59: to ‘another man’
Mathew and mark agreed that it was to bystanders while Luke said it was to another man. Lets check another version again

New Living Translation

Mathew 26v73: to some bystanders
Mark 14v70: to some bystanders
Luke 22v59: to someone

Mathew and mark both agreed that it was to bystanders while Luke said it was to someone (a single person and not bystanders)
Still we check another to see if they will agree

Gideon Bible

Mathew 26v73: to those who stood by…”your speech betrays you’
Mark 14v70: to those who stood b[/b]y…”your speech shows”
Luke 22v59: [b]to a man
Mathew and Mark both agreed that it was to bystanders while Luke said it was to a man

Note; Luke forgot that it was a maid that asked question and not a man (emphasis on ‘another’). A girl first asked her and for him to have used ‘another’, it meant another lady but your Luke mistakenly or inspirationally put ‘man’

Where was Holy Spirit when all these were happening?

The curse is working real hard on you. na wa o.

@barikade,

Comprehension is really your problem. in my post, i said why was his book not taken serious because of the way he was addressed and when i asked if my write up was making sense, lafile told me 'no' and i moved ahead not referring or laying emphasis on the book of Barnabas. na wa o elder barikade. The curse is really working


@banju,

welcome, You have decided to replace gbade.x.Lets keep watching with the curse hanging on you having cursed yourself. I sensed that you wanted to be noticed. Never mind, we will see as times goes on.

@naijacutee,

Read my post again, i never asked question on gospel of barnabas (read my first post and second post)

babyosis,

When I started the write up, I threw six questions and you told me that I should give you reasons in which i gave you part but here you are , telling me that I should be prepared to follow you to European Mesuem. hmmm, just relying on hearsay and historical proofs abi.

I know very sure if you had asked me questions and I gave you the above that you should go to Museum, I know for sure, you would have been saying all sort of things.

Now is this your best evidence that Christ was not crucified?
So from the above do you admit he was actually on the cross or not
And that his body ended up at a tomb and you're asking why it was "laid" in a tomb and not "buried" since perhaps living uncrucified folks are laid (as in laid to rest lol) and dead ones are buried.
I need your answer.

where in the above questions did i ask whether he was buried or laid? hmmmmmmmm

Don't be in a hurry,there's no need for symptoms of ADHD when you want honest answers.
I pasted the historical facts earlier,would you rather I rephrased them in my own words,by the way the books were those were written can be verified,if you are in for a trip to the museum in Europe,let me know and I'll tell you where you can verify those

So it is now symptoms of ADHD.hmmmmmmmmm, Christians. 'was jesus christ crucified' is really their foundation and no crucifixion, no christianity.

No need rephrasing anything here. You backed your claims with historical facts and am asking you questions based on those facts even from your bible but you tolod me that I should be prepared to follow you to European Museum. na wa o, Havent you read from your bible that none of his disciples or authors was there to witness the incident. Luke that wasnt an eye witness even said ', and they all forsook him and fled (luke 23v49)'
also , all his acquintances and the women who had followed him from Galille stood at a distance and saw these things (Luke 15v40-41)
, there were also many women there, looking on from afart, who had followed Jesus from Galilee (Mathew 27v55-56)

I never meant to rush you, I threw those questions at you when you demanded for reasons, but in the absence of that, I will forge ahead from where I stopped not minding whatever you people might be saying.

First evidence that he didnt die

Now, Jesus prayed to God and He heard his prayers by sending Holy Spirity to strenghtened him that God would never leave him to be killed and if you do not agree to that, how do you explain the word 'strenghtened'.

The jews demanded for his crucifixion. there are two types of crucifixtion, one with a fast death and the other with a slow lingering death. Jesus is supposed to have been crucificted (did u say crucifixion?) at the same time the two thieves were fixed to their crosses too. With all their rush and hurry, the Jews could not fix Jesus before Friday afternoon.

The jews and the Romans managed to have Jesus on the cross by the 6th hour i.e 12noon and by 9th hour (3pm), he had given up the ghost (very funny).

As much as they were in a hurry to get him up, now were they in a hurry to bring him down because of their Sabbath day
Deuteronomy 21v23: His body (any crucified person) shall not remain all nights upon the tree but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day (for he that is hanged is accursed of God), that thy land be not defiled which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

In order to beat the Sabbath day, they resorted to CRURIFRAGIUM - a situation in which the legs are broken. The crucifixion was a slow one but resorted to the above in order to make it faster. The Soldiers came, brake the legs of the first and the other malefactors but when they got to Jesus, 'he was dead already so they didnt brake his legs'. (John 19v38)

We are told that, 'and they brake not his legs' was in fulfilment of a prophesy (isaiah 34v20)

If the bones of a victim were to be protected from harm, then they could only be of a benefit if the person was ALIVE. For a person already, intact bones means nothing whether sawed or smashed into pieces

What clinical instrument was used to verify his death? Did anyone touch his body or felt his pulse before conducting and certifying him already dead? (mind you, vinegar that has been known to give stimulating effect was given to him in order to give him enough strenght)

Qestion on that at the end of the write up

We have been hearing stories of 'medically certified death' cases in which some have been coming back to life, making me wonder if it was resurrection or resuscitation. You may go through the old dailies or current ones for verification but here are just two examples out of very many ones.

1. Little girl who 'died' tells how she came back to life - Daily News 15/11/55
2. Back from the dead - After being thought dead for 2 days - Post 25/7/65

God works in a miraculous way. He inspired the Soldiers to think that the victim is already 'dead' so as not to break his legs and at the same time inspired another Soldier to lance him on the side with a spear ', and forthwith came there out blood and water (John 19v34).

Its a blessing of God that when the human body cannot endure further pain, agony etc, unconsciousness supervenes. But immobility, fatigue etc on the cross might have slowed down the blood circulation.

Also, in the Encyclopedia Biblia, under the word 'cross', column 960, we are assured that 'jesus was alive when the spear was thrust'. Blood and water coming out instantly is a sure evidence that Jesus was ALIVE.

Question

1. What clinical instrument was used in detecting and certifying him dead (because he wasnt touch nor his pulse felt)?

2. The instant coming out of blood and water showed that he was alive and if not, why the coming out of blood and water from dead body.

If you knocked out the above that 'still he died on the cross' by debunking my claims up, then I move to the next stage in the order questions were thrown at you.


Take care till babs comes your way.

barikade,

can you please read the thread and see for yourself that no emphasis was laid on gospel of barnabas, i thought you are knowledgeable but couldnt understand simple sentences.na wa o, keep cursing yourself.

@babyosis

here she you go again, claiming that were 'ferreted' from the internet. na wa o

hope you know that six questions have so far been asked.

Now what is your sole evidence that Christ was not crucified,let us start from there and move on.
I don't mind you copying and pasting to answer me but do it with some commonsense and don't forget to give me that singular evidence you have.

very good question

since you wanted a quick response, let me help me

barely three hours on the cross, jesus was lifted and carried away by his secret friends nicodemus and another of his to his supulchre, he was washed and laid in the tomb (note he was not buried)

answer these questions

1. why did mary go to the tomb?
2. why was the stone removed and why were the winding sheets found unwind?
3. why did mary think jesus as a gardener? do resurrected bodies look like gardeners?
4. what does mary wanted to do with a decomposing body?
5. can she alone carry a dead body?
6. what was the sign of jonah


from here, we move on

swell weekend

[b]Posted by: bari_kade  
Insert Quote
@babyosisi,


Quote from: babyosisi on Today at 03:47:55 PM
a. was to a maid in the gateway (mark 14v69)
b. was to another maid in the porch (mathew 26v71)
c. was to a man (luke 22v58)

Are you asking these questions because you are interested in finding out how to be saved and these are your stumbling blocks or you just want to keep being a pest.

Anyone can see his curses are working overtime on him and he's been foaming out his hoo-ha as a consequence. Watch - he will come back screaming that we ignored his questions after I set him an occasion to prove it. You will soon read his usual - "IGNORED my questions!"[/b]

so babyosis  finally answered the above? so you are that blind to the extent of seeing that she only replied 2-4


[b]Quote from: babyosisi on Today at 03:47:55 PM
Does it take away from the sinless example of the  Jesus Christ the Lord?

Does it diminish his status as the soon coming king and messiah of the world?

Or change that fact that no one else can save your soul but Jesus?

No. The only agenda on blabber787's mind is to pander about his repeated so-called "IGNORED my questions" in hope you washing Muhammad's sins. It's not working - he knows that himself; and he's having sleepless nighst wondering if the latest tricks will help him.[/b]

no, it wont dimish his status. "save my soul", abeg you have no proof to that.

[b]Quote from: babyosisi on Today at 03:47:55 PM
The Bible says that now that you know the truth and refuse to follow it,you shall be beaten with many stripes,that is a proverb.
Shahan,4malik and many others here were once like you,you are not beyond redemption.

I pray he doesn't have to wait for the koboko of heaven in order to see Muhammad's disingenuous claims of prophethood. [/b]

so jesus in the bible will beat those that didnt do his wish. pls i want to know, how many strokes? iwo boy yi, i only pity your soul against the blasphemous statement you have been uttering and am also praying for you that Allah touches your heat before the day when none of your fellow christians will be able to intercede for you.

Quote from: babs787 on Today at 03:26:32 PM
@barikade


[b]Quote from: babs787 on Today at 03:26:32 PM
like i said, the curse will continue hanging on you till my questions are answered.

We already know your curses are working overtime on you, blabs787 - that is why you keep screaming that people are "ignoring" your questions. It is pretty obvious that you're a total stranger to truth, and that is why you keep trumping up your 787 lies. Well done.

well, i never made any reference to any other christians except you and gbade that are very found of posting the statement and it will continue hanging on you

Quote from: babs787 on Today at 03:26:32 PM
you posted some links claiming that shahan had answered me, why not do same if you had and if you can't, the questions are still here for you. the curse will continue hanging on you as long as you keep running from the questions

When you are cured of your curses, let us know. I guessed you can't read, and that's why your blood pressure took an astronomical shoot to come out with hoo-ha claiming your questions were "IGNORED".

see who has a very sharp vision but couldnt detect whether her sister babyosis answered no 1 question or not.


Quote from: babs787 on Today at 03:26:32 PM
1. where did the second denial take lace?
a. was to a maid in the gateway (mark 14v69)
b. was to another maid in the porch (mathew 26v71)
c. was to a man (luke 22v58)

Were you concerned about WHERE the denials took place, or before WHOM they were made? Your answer in c above simple states "was to a man" - and that doesn't indicate a "WHERE" question. English is obviously failing you, babs787.

English is obviously failing you, babs787

no wonder you posted this statement:
i only sent that who sent you that e-mail

barikade has really answered babs this time. look at his post up. he saw my glaring question yet he is still asking if it was on 'WHERE", NA WA O. so you are not satisfied with that of the man, ok i remove that. so do justice to the remaining three, a,b and c.
my question is still on WHERE.

Please carefully note that the elements in the three Gospel accounts tie together when you read the whole texts and not just isolated verses. These are the elements:

The first denial - WHERE:
Peter was in the precincts of the Palace:
"Now Peter sat without in the palace" (Matt. 26:69)
"And as Peter was beneath in the palace" (Mark 14:66)
". . in the midst of the hall, . . .Peter sat down among them." (Luke 22:55).

liar. you can see that the curse is really working. this is what we have
Mark 14v69: below in the courtyard
mathew 26v71: and he went out into the porch

@babyosis,

i was once like you but i believe very soon you will revert to islam.

now to your post.

Are you asking these questions because you are interested in finding out how to be saved and these are your stumbling blocks or you just want to keep being a pest.
Any independent person reading this whole thread can see that you have no case.

ok. put it this way, i was reading the bible when i came across the verses. as a christian, which of the two you will tell me to choose and why?

Is it possible that the journey to golgotta was such that the carrying of the cross was shared and both writers recorded it so?

babyosis it showed that none was around to witness the incident.

Mark 14v50: and they all forsook him and fled.

i wouldnt know if the journey to golgotha was such but your bible recorded the incident that
simon of cyrene carried it (mathew 27v32, luke 23v26)
while other verse said no, you were not there,
it was jesus that carried the cross by himself (john 19v17)

so which are you taking out of the two?

And what does one or two thieves prove?
Does it dampen the message of salvation of God to man by the death on the cross,a fact that has been proven by history?.

it may not but which of the two should i take and why?

where was the holy spirit when they were writing all these?

babyosis, u didnt say anything on the first question.

Jesus prays for rescue

Mathew 26v37-39: …. And he began to be sorrowful and very depressed. Then said he unto them,’my soul is exceedingly sorrowful, even unto death….’ And he went a little farther and fell on his face  and prayed saying, ‘ o my father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless, not as I will but as thou wilt.

He wanted them to ‘wait and watch’, to keep guard! But every time he returns from his prayer, he found them asleep. As he himself said
Mathew 26v40: what, could ye not watch with me an hour.

                                               His agony

Luke 22v44: and being in an agony, he prayed more earnestly and his sweat was, it were, great drops of blood falling down to the ground.

Has anyone ever witnessed a man sweating blood? Is it possible for man to sweat blood under severe agony and duress?

Question 5
what was the prayer for to the extent of sweating blood since he came to die.

The children of Israel- the Jews because of their attempt to his life, it would be a sure proof for them and for their children till eternity that Jesus of Nazareth was an imposter, liar and a cheat. Their rejection of him would leave the door open for every-would be imposter to the claim of being the promised messiah of the Jews. And hence millions of his people would be led to perdition until the Day of Judgment.

The Jews had hit upon a quick and easy way of eliminating imposters, so they thought.

Were they not told in the Torah in
Deuteronomy 18v20: but the prophet which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other Gods, even that prophet shall die.

Further in

Deuteronomy 21v23: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day (for he that is hanged is accursed of God) that thy land be not defiled, which thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

So if they succeeded in their attempt on his life, worse for him. If they failed then, they might consider his claim. It is for this reason that Jesus beseeched God so pathetically
Mathew 26v37-39: ….o my father if it be possible let this cup pass from me. Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt.

The above means God should remove his affliction and in the end, Jesus left it for God to decide.
 
                                Jesus unaware of heavenly contract

From the “call to arms” in the upper room, and the masterful deployment of forces at Gethsemane, and the blood-sweating prayer to the God of mercy for help, it appears that jesus knew nothing about the contract for his crucifixion.

                                      Jesus (pbuh) – his ordeal

Mathew 26v40: what could ye not watch with me for an hour.
Mark 14v39-40: and again, he (Jesus) went away and prayed, and spoke the same words. And when he returned, he found them asleep again (for their eyes were heavy), neither knew what to answer him.

St. mark bemoans that the disciples could give no excuse for their sleepiness. He records
Mark 14v40Z: neither knew what to answer him.
St. Luke, hazards a guess for this sleepy state of his disciples
Luke 22v45: and when he (Jesus) rose from prayer, and was come to his disciples, he found them sleeping for sorrow.

Sleeping for sorrow!!!!

                                 God answered Jesus prayer

James 5v16: the effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much
The master had also given us a very noble and holy conception of the father in heaven in our relationship with him in worship and prayer
Mathew 7v7-9: ask, it shall be given you, seek and ye shall find, knock and it shall be opened unto you, for every one that asked, receiveth, and he that seeketh findeth, and to him that knocked, it shall be opened. Or what man is there of you, whom if son ask bread, will give him a stone? Or if he ask a fish, will give him a serpent?

Here Jesus draws an analogy in the above verse between a loving human father and God. If man, the noblest of God’s handwork cannot be expected to behave like a sadist who would push a stone into the mouth of his hungry child when he cries for bread of give him a serpent when he asks for fish, then how can the Merciful God, the loving father in heaven do just that. Indeed, he would not. For we are told in the book of Hebrews that God heard his (Jesus) prayer
Hebrews 5v7: who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared.

Jesus pours out his heart to the only one that could save him from death and paul assures us that God Heard him in that he feared’.

What does it mean ‘God heard”. Is God deaf at anytime? No., we the Muslims, Christians, Jews believe that God almighty is an All Hearing God. He hears our very secret inner thoughts. Then what does it mean that God heard. It means that ‘God accepted’. We have beautiful examples in the bible of what happens when God hears the prayer of someone.
Abraham in his old age prayed for a son and God heard his prayer and Ishmael was born. Ishmael in Hebrew means ‘God heard’. ‘El’ means God and ‘shima’ means to hear.
Also Zechariah in his old age prayed for a son and God heard his prayer and John the Baptist was born. When the bible says that God heard prayer of someone, it means that God accepted the prayer and granted the request.

                                                      The result

The prayer of jesus materialized and God sent His angel from heaven with the assurance of help as in
Luke 22v43: and there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.

                                     Question 6

a. What did the angel of God came to strengthen him for?
b. Did he come to increase his doubts or fear?
c. To multiply his anxieties
d. Did the angel come to tell him that God had forsaken him in his disbelief?
God forbid!. The angel of God came to assure him that God was with him, that God was going to save him, or how else could one strengthened?
We are told again that he was destined to die. He was prepared from the ‘foundation of the world’ for a substitutionary sacrifice. If this was the scheme of God for the redemption of mankind, then obviously, he had made a wrong choice.

The Christians claim that he was ‘prepared’ that he was ‘conditioned’ for his ordeal and that in actual fact he had ‘volunteered’ for the great sacrifice. But this picture of the lamb of God led to the slaughter for the atonement of the sins of man is contradicted by what Jesus did according to the gospel narratives. The manner in which Jesus had deployed his disciples – eight at the gate and an inner line of defence, armed to the hilt – shows that Jesus was not prepared to be made a scapegoat for his followers. He had prepared to fight to the bitter end.

                                          summary of questions

Question 5
what was the prayer for to the extent of sweating blood since he came to die.

Question 6

a. What did the angel of God came to strengthen him for?
b. Did he come to increase his doubts or fear?
c. To multiply his anxieties
d. Did the angel come to tell him that God had forsaken him in his disbelief?

@barikade


let me quickly answer you befoe i go on with my write up. like i have been saying and will continue, the curse will continue hanging on you till you answer those four questions.

I hope your Islamic polarization is not going to seal your lips very early on the Forum. I could not imagine the level of hypocrisy you're magically trumping up when clearly your blabber has more than insulted others. . . and even helped to curse himself - did you miss all that, mr. 1 post?

really, so babs started the insults, have you read the number of times, havila, mrpataki, davidylan, babyosis, shahan and lately you and gbade have been saying all sorts of bullshits. when i first came on board, i thought this is going to be a thread where religious will be thrashed out, i.e disagree in order to agree but i found out that reverse was the case. i even remembered when mrpataki accused me of insulting havila and tendered my apology but along the line in other threads, i learnt that most of you are fond of foul languages and to talking to people anyhow as if they are your kids, so babs made up his mind that, the measure you mete out will meted to you too.

now, to the issue of gospel of barnabas, if not that you are really blind, did i ask questions on the gospel? i only brought out the gospel as a result of the respect accorded to Barnabas in your bible and wondered why should the man of that high status be ignored, i also asked babyosis why it was not included but because of your pea sized brain, you misconstrued me.

so, having answered you, let me go on with the continuaton.

@barikade

let me start with you. you have decided to follow the steps of your brethren

Posted by: bari_kade
Insert Quote
@babs787,


Quote from: babs787 on Today at 10:50:33 AM
@shahan,

you seemed to be their saviour, the most knowlegeable of them all, so am addressing you since the questions were posed at you, thereby ignoring them (your friends) especially the loud-mouthed gbade & barikade that are having the curse on them for their failure in responding to my four questions posed at them.

Hehehehe . . . he's at it again, screaming they are thereby "IGNORING" his questions. Your curses are really doing overtime on you, blabs787.


like i said, the curse will continue hanging on you till my questions are answered. you posted some links claiming that shahan had answered me, why not do same if you had and if you cant, the questions are still here for you. the curse will continue hanging on you as long as you keep running from the questions

1. where did the second denial take lace?
a. was to a maid in the gateway (mark 14v69)
b. was to another maid in the porch (mathew 26v71)
c. was to a man (luke 22v58)

2. who carry the cross to the golgotta
a. simon of cyrene carried it (mathew 27v32, luke 23v26)
b. jesus carried the cross by himself (john 19v17)

3. how many thief reviled jesus?
a. both the two thieves (mathew 27vv44)
b. one out of the two thieves (luke23v49-50)

4. when was the curtain turned?
a. after the cry (mark 15v34-38, mathew 27v46-52)
b. one time (luke 23v45-46)

now to you davidylan,

Posted by: davidylan
Insert Quote
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 10:50:33 AM
A VERY COMPREHENSIVE RESPONSE INDEED

there is no point since those who give u a comprehensive response are accused of "ignoring" your questions.

your name should have been david-liar.

you are still here addressing when you failed in in solving simple puzzle. in one of the threads, you claimed that no books were given to both moses and joshua yet your sister came with verses nullifying your claim but at the end you lied that you didnt say that when muske asked you questions

secondly, you also said moses' subordinates would have written the last chapter while your sister said it was moses that penned down the verse by himself before his death (very funny).

didnt you see that your sister really nailed you. you ought to have left the thread because your contribution did not tally with your sister and am sure, very soon another christians like you will be nailed. ride on boy.

you have eyes yet you refused seeing with it. Yoour saviour (shahan), really gave a comprehensive response.

havila, backslider, davidylan, mrpataki, shahan, babyosis, sokislam, barikade, gbade, lafile etc, dont worry, am still expecting more, 'e ti po to, e lo po si wa',

babs only is enough for you all.

@shahan,

you seemed to be their saviour, the most knowlegeable of them all, so am addressing you since the questions were posed at you, thereby ignoring them (your friends) especially the loud-mouthed gbade & barikade that are having the curse on them for their failure in responding to my four questions posed at them.

now let me bring out just two out of your 'supposed response'.

firstly, i asked you
4.  if jesus actually came to die for your sin , and that salvation lies in his blood sacrifice, why did he preached repentance in mathew 4v17

your response
Jesus: "I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." [Luke 13:3]

Heb. 9:22
"The Law says that almost everything must be sprinkled with blood, and no sins can be forgiven unless blood is offered."
since all of you are being programmed and you shahan, a professor failed in understanding simple question. i asked you if salvation lies in his blood and that if all have sinned and our deeds are like unfilthy rag and no one born of a woman is clean, why is he exempting children,

rather than answer my question, you still went ahead giving me the same verses that support my questions.  

a very comprehensive response

secondly, i asked
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
10. if jesus came to die, why is he afraid of death in john 11v53: then from that day forth, they took counsel togetherr to put him to death. esus therefore walked no more in openly among the jews but wenjt unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called ephraim and there continued with his disciples.

but you replied
The verse is 54 (not 53), and it does not teach that Jesus was afraid of death. Other verses show that He gave Himself willingly to death in view of the resurrection:

shahan, you said jesus was not afraid of death and i asked you to read the beow verse
Mathew 26v37-39: …. And he began to be sorrowful and very depressed. Then said he unto them,’my soul is exceedingly sorrowful, even unto death….’ And he went a little farther and fell on his face (just like muslims) and prayed saying, ‘ o my father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless, not as I will but as thou wilt.

A VERY COMPREHENSIVE RESPONSE INDEED

Posted by: lafile  
Insert Quote
lol! even a self confessed atheist (who believes the sacred word of God, the bible is a collection of fables) says the 'Gospel of Barnabas' that you hold so dear is utterly senseless. Where you gon' run to babs?

i never said or rely on Gospel of Barnabas, all i did was asking babyosis the reason for her omission of the gospel in her post.

and i even told her that my write will be based on biblical verses. i used the gospel just to let you know that some books nailed the crucifixion of jesus even from your bible which i am going to be quoting from.

also, when i first posted the first post, i asked whether i was making sense,you said no and i continued with my write up ignoring that of the barnabas, reading through the write up, you would have seen that no single question was asked from the gospel but all from your bible

lafile, i could remember your biased post in one of your christian thread labelling babs a 'liar' but thank God gbade and barikade exposed her through some of my write ups.

keep it up.

@kag,

you nailed the authenticity of Gospel of barnabas, no qualm. i have said it that with reponse or no response, i will continue with the write up and my post will be based solely on biblical verses.

shahan, davidylan, babyosis, naijacutee and the rest,

welcome back, you disappeared in other threads only for you to resurrect here, very good.

funny set of people, you laid emphasis on the book of Barnabas but failed in reading the posts in which questions were thrown at you.

i never quoted the book of Barnabas for you to to accept or not, all i did was asking babyosis the reason for her not including the gospel but you all tactically avoided the issue.

i never asked question based on gospel of barnabas but yet you hypocrites after avoiding my questions, keep saying all sort of things.

like i told babyosis, i will only be quoting from your bible and not even from the quran but they avoided the issue cos it is the foundation of their faith and they wouldnt want any one to 'spoil their show' and expose their fraud.

i know for sure you would run simply because thats is where christianity lies. no crucifixion, no christianity.

i have not even written anything, you have started shivering.

@mr pataki,

[b]Posted by: mrpataki  
Insert Quote
@ bari_kade,
I have said it before, I pity those who try to respond to babs787, I have found it to be a brain drain in reponding to him! [/b]

can you please recollect the number of times you have been bringing the issue of aisha marrying the holy prophet and the number of times answers have been provided?

the one between olabowale and havila is still very fresh. this very issue had been thrashed out between olabowale and havila but ever since, you have been re-bringing the same issue and yet no muslims ignore your questions on the pretext of re-bringing same question. They have been answering your questions despite the fact you have no other concrete question except that,but if it were babs,  you will be saying all sorts of bullshit, saying you would ignore the questions like your sister did (still coming to that) that babs copied from site and ran away having failed to answer the questions thrown at her

let me ask you again, how many muslims has ever challenged you or alleged that you copied from site despite the fact that babyosis has made it her habit of copying and pasting from sites, yet you never challenged her but if it were babs, ,

like i said in one of the threads, i dont give a damn, ve noticed that  you resorted to being biased failing to address issue when deemed necessary.

i leave you to that.

@barikade

from this your last post, i senses that you are really deluded just like your brother up.,. but i will address your post one after the other.

just like your sister, being fond of writing lenghty irrelevant words in which at the end of the day contradicts sayings of one of you christians (sorry davidylan, i didnt mean to bring past issue)

1. shahan's sound and comprehensive reply to every single one of the 12 questions you posed on Did Jesus For Our Sin? Which Sin?.

Thanks for bringing past issues and very comprehensive indeed. It seemed you were with your glasses when reading your sister’s post but lost your glasses when reading mine.

Now, lets look at the below,

This is my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
1. why is the curse still there and hangs on every generation of Adam.gen 3v14-19.

This is your sister's response
1 Cor. 15:22 - "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive."

What is the relationship between the two, yet she'd answered babs. I asked why is the curse still hanging but she quoted another verse.

I asked her a very simple question that if truly jesus died for our sin, there shouldn’t be any curse hanging as regards to the cursing of Adam, even and the serpent. It should have been cleared since he came to die for that sin.  Does her answer fit the question? meditate on that.

I also asked her again,
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
He came to die for the sin, why do we still have the curse not removed for the fact that he came to die for it?

Read her response again:
Gal. 3:13 - "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree."

Now, pls for a moment stop being biased and compare the question with the response. do they relate?

You all claimed that jesus came to die for the sin committed by Adam and Eve and along the line, God cursed the three parties involved. Since he came to die for that very sin, the sin ought to have been erased having been sacrificed (just like ogun worshipper using human being for sacrifice) for your sin.

She quoted the verse that says he redeemed you, but she failed to note that reason for his dying for you is still lying there with no solution yet jesus died for that sin.

If you don’t understand all I have been saying, go through your bible and read where God cursed Adam and eve and even the serpent and jesus came to die for that sin, the curse ought to have been removed, but  yet shahan had answered babs

Also I wanted to give this to you that jesus lied but mistakenly add it among the verses of stealing. Even a 5-year-old kid would have known the question, reading through the verse that it was about lying and I reposted the verse, till now, I never heard anything from her

here is my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM

4.  if jesus actually came to die for your sin , and that salvation lies in his blood sacrifice, why did he preached repentance in mathew 4v17
read her response
Jesus: "I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." [Luke 13:3]

Heb. 9:22
"The Law says that almost everything must be sprinkled with blood, and no sins can be forgiven unless blood is offered."

i asked a question that why did he preached repentance when salvation lies in his blood, but read you sister's post up, yet she answered babs comprehensively. do the above relate?

also my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
5. if all person are under the stain of original sin, why are children exempted (they r also born of a woman as in job 25 v4) as in  mathew
her response
Deut. 1:39
"Moreover your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, and your children, which in that day had no knowledge between good and evil, they shall go in thither, and unto them will I give it, and they shall possess it."

she unknowingly nailed herself. i asked her if really "all have sinned" and that  if "no one born of woman is clean", why did jesus exempted little ones? but rather than answer me, she unknowingly supported my question thereby maming the verses go against each other. can someone explain to her, yet she gave comprehensive response

my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
7. u claimed jesus is God, must he punish himself before he can forgive sin?

her response
Heb. 1:3
"Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high"

1 Pet. 2:24
"Who His own self bare our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed."

do any of the above shows that Jesus is God. the verse clearly showed that God is different from jesus as in "sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high"
? can you go through my question and her response again, yet she gave comprehensive response

my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
9.  if jesus can die for the sin of man, why did he plead to God in mathew 26v38-39.

her response
He died for our sins, not His own because He had none. Further, His prayers were the climax of His earthly ministry, and that can't be taken to mean He could not die for the sin of man,

climax of his earthly ministry. the question was "why did he prayed to God when there was contract between him and God but your sister comprehensively answered babs indeed.

my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
10. if jesus came to die, why is he afraid of death in john 11v53: then from that day forth, they took counsel togetherr to put him to death. esus therefore walked no more in openly among the jews but wenjt unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called ephraim and there continued with his disciples.

her response
The verse is 54 (not 53), and it does not teach that Jesus was afraid of death. Other verses show that He gave Himself willingly to death in view of the resurrection:

John 10:17 - "Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again."

if jesus was not afraid, can somebody open mathew 26v37-39 for you all to show that he was afraid of death.

my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
11. if he had prepared to die for the sin of man, why was judas named traitor.

her response
Because a traitor is one who pretends to have your best interest at heart but plots something sinister against you and your loved ones - and that is what Judas did. Nothing stopped Judas from repenting and receiving forgiveness - but his repentance was only after he was sure his plot did not work out.

na wa o, professor. judas was not supposed to be called traiot since it has been settled that jesus would die for your sisn, there shouldnt be any need calling him a traitor since he (judas) made it faster what he came to do, yet she comprehensively answered babs

my question
Quote from: babs787 on January 09, 2007, 10:26 AM
12. why do we accuse jew of handling him for what he came to do?
her response
Acta 3:17-19
"And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it, as did also your rulers. But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, He hath so fulfilled. Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord"

can someone explain the question to her. i said why do christians accuse jews of rough handling jesus since he came for the rough handling and death, but yet she's answered perfectly.


This is it again, jesus in the bible lied as in
john 7v8-10: On the feast of the tabernacles, jesus replied his brothers: go to the feast yourselves, I AM NOT GOING UP THE FEAST, and after his brothers were gone HE ALSO WENT UP, NOT PUBLICLY BUT IN PRIVATE

But your sister went another way having detected the question herself. Is the above not lying?

2. shahan's sound and comprehensive reply to your question about the authorship of Deuteronomy: The Second Coming of Jesus Christ and in this link.

One thing I have understood about you people is that, when questions are being thrown at you and you tried replying, you expected babs for one never to go into that again but babs will do because most of your ‘supposed answers’ are not in anyway relevant to my questions. Check for yourself. But if babs ask you questions based on your response, it is then you will resort to name calling saying all sort of things that babs doesn’t comprehend on time but if you ask babs questions and he replies and you still disagree with his response, nobody call you names or tell you that you don’t comprehend. You can see hypocrisy

You claimed that she’d answered all questions perfectly, let me ask you, where is her response to my question on January 31st 2007. these are the questions again
1. was abu bakr a blood relative of the prophet
2. i asked you if aisha was a blood relative of the prophet, u never said anything.
she alleged that Abu bakr was a brother of the Prophet

Where on earth was her response?
Secondly, I posed questions to her on false prophesy (still on the lies on jesus in the bible), she never said anything on that or you bring me her response, but yet, she’s answered babs.

Thirdly, I posted some contradictions in which she never answered; claiming they were copied yet shahan answered babs.

Now let me go to the book of  Deuteronomy.

Hope you have read her response to the questions and also the caging of her brother davidylan (don’t worry, one by one, you will nailing yourselves at the expense of answering questions)
In her response (January 30, 2007, 08:13 PM), she concluded that moses wrote the book of Deuteronomy and even sank her brother very well quoting verses from the quran that supports Injeel and Torah (as being put across to davidylan by a lady)

But it seems you only read her post but failed in reading my posted dated the 2nd of February 2007.

3. shahan's carefully outlined answer to your allegations and accusations of lies and stealing against Jesus: again in The Second coming of Jesus Christ.

I have answered your post above, read everything up. Comprehensive post indeed!

Now to the questions posed at you, can you show me the link where they have been answered and if you cant, you try answering them.

you made me revisit the questions, go over my questions and compare with her response,  you would see that she'd answered comprehensively indeed!!!.

and please dont run from my 4 questions.

@lafile.

thank you. let me now go to the second stage.

Where do we begin?

Firstly, it has been noted that none of the authors and disciples were around. That of Luke is very glaring in Luke 1v1…… He said he collected it from those that claimed to be eye witnesses. We will not take these as witnesses because just 24 hours to the scene

Mark 14v50: and they all forsook him and fled.

Around the table
While seated for the feast, jesus said in
Luke 22v21-23: behold the hand of him that betrayed me is with me on the table. And truly the son of man goeth, as it was determine but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed. And they began to enquire among themselves which of them it was that should do this thing.

The disciples showed no determination in discovering the traitor, they were more interested in finding out as to which of them should be counted as the greatest. The words of jesus had fallen on deaf ears. Though Peter and the others did make a show that in the event of danger, they would be prepared to go to prison for him, even unto death.

The overthrew of the temple was imminent, and a forerunner to the expulsion of the Romans. Jesus had failed to heed the warning of the Pharisees to curb the over-exuberance of his disciples as in
Luke 19v39: and some of the Pharisees from among the multitude said unto him, “master, rebuke thy disciples”.

He had miscalculated, now he must pay the price of failure

Jewish reasoning

The jewish leaders reasoned that this one man had almost brought the nation to destruction, therefore in
J[b]ohn 11v50: it is expedient for one man to die for the nation.[/b]

But with all the mass hysteria surrounding him, it was also not expedient to apprehend jesus in public. They waited for the opportunity of a clandestine arrest. As luck would have it, they found in Judas, a traitor who would sell his lord and master for 30 miserable pieces of silver.

Question 1

Since jesus came to die on the cross, it means that he is very aware of the contract. If so, why was judas named a traitor for the fact it has been arranged that he would die?

Preparation for jihad (policy change)
Jesus introduces the subject of defence
Luke 22v35-36: wh4en I sent you out without purse and script and shoes, lacked ye anything? And they said, ‘nothing’. Then said he unto them, ‘but now, he that hath no purse, let him take it and likewise his bag, and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.

The disciples were already armed. They had some foresight, they had not left Galilee with bare knuckles. They responsded,
Luke 22v38: …lord, behold, here are two swords, and he said unto them, ‘it is enough’.

Question 2

Why did he charge them to buy sword. Did I hear someone saying that one of his disciples that raised was rebuked? Well, am still coming to that but the question now, why did he charge them to buy sword?

In the open
He and his disciples could be sealed off quite easily early in the upper room in the city. He did not want to a sitting target for the jews. He would not give in without a fight. So he commanded them to the mount of olives.
Mathew 26v36: then cometh jesus with them unto a place called Gethsemane, and saith unot the disciples, ‘sit here while I go and pray yonder’.

A master tactician

Jesus deployed his forces as a master tactician in a manner that would bring credit to any officer. He places eight of the eleven disciples at the entrance to the courtyard commanding them:
…’sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder’.

Question 3

a. why did they all go to Gethsemane? To pray?
b. Could they not have prayed in the upper room?
Could they have gone to the temple of Solomon, a stone throw from where they were.
c. Why did he go with his disciples to pray when only him can do the prayer afterall they didn’t pray with him but watched.

Is prayer all that they wanted to do? No. they went to the garden so that they might be in a better position to defend themselves.

Mathew even made it known to us that he did not go alone but with
Mathew 26v37-38: and he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. Then saith he unto them, ‘tarry ye here and watch with me……

Question 4
Where is he taking Peter, john and james now? Further into the garden. To pray, no but to make inner line of defence. He had put eight at the gate and now three armed with swords to ‘wait and watch’, to guard and he alone prayed.

Summary of questions.

Question 1
Since jesus came to die on the cross, it means that he is very aware of the contract. If so, why was judas named a traitor for the fact it has been arranged that he would die?

Question 2
Why did he charge them to buy sword. Did I hear someone saying that one of his disciples that raised sword against the Romans was rebuked? Well, am still coming to that but the question now, why did he charge them to buy sword?

Question 3
a. why did they all go to Gethsemane
b. if they went there to pray, why didnt they pray together because i learnt that afterall they didn’t pray with him but watched (only him prayed).
c. Could they not have prayed in the upper room or put this way, why didnht they pray in the upper room, if its all about prayer?

Question 4
Why did he take them (Peter and James) further into the garden

like i said, in order to avoid muddling up the whole write up, ve decided to be asking questions at the end of every write up. when the questions are answered or not,i move to the next stage but will be highly appreciated if the questions are answered.

happy reading