₦airaland Forum

@babyosis

Yet, you have tendered your ignorance.

Like I always do, I pity your soul with all your blasphemous statements?


@nossycheeks

Bird of a feather?

Let me not even go further, dont we have christians marrying more than one wive?

I leave you here because you dont know anything but trying to be mischievous. When you are ready with yuur sister babyosis, we will dig deep into both books and see the the reason, causes etc in the light of the Quran, OT and NT.

@stimulus

You may sound like you're not bored; however, your recent posts are a minus to the celebrated 'improvements' of the previous weeks'.


You thought so? I still have lots of threads to create but learnt that the debate is leading nowhere and will put stop to it cos of Viee and sisimose but that doesn’t mean that I wont reply you when you post any defaming rejoinder etc.



Haba alhaji, take style confess. How can you deny that all your recent efforts are not a reaction to pilgrim.1's posts, when in fact you just admitted it?? See am again:
Quote from: babs787 on Yesterday at 01:13:16 PM
I have stopped creating new threads but started it when i saw pilgrims'.

Besides, reading the debate on the issue of the 99 names of Allah shows that you haven't said anything other than recycling what you were taught by rote. Her basic questions and assumptions are yet unanswered (at least, that's how it stands with me; and I could provide more explicatory inferences for my take on that topic after pilgrim.1's rejoinder to you).


Brother you sure that you are not having sight problem? Go to the site, I have responded, backed up my answer with quotation and detailed names of Allah. Please provide your explicatory inferences jare. If you don’t understand, I said I have stopped creating thread but started when I saw pilgrims meaning that, I have stopped creating threads and have been trying to answer questions from already opened thread. I have lots of questions for you but felt that it would lead nowhere so I stopped the creation and only started it when I saw pilgrims’, you hear? I have nothing against her, she’s trying to learn about Islam and will always be ready to assist her.


If the question is simple as you stated: "WHICH IS THE REAL JESUS?" then, you can again go through the Bible and see that all of them were real in their persons; but ONLY ONE was called the Son of the living God (Matt. 16:16). None of the others claimed the same identity with the Son of God.

Are you saying that of the Mathew is the real Jesus Christ?

Which one of the other connections with the name "jesus" claimed to be the Son of God than He who is called the CHRIST??


Haba, why not read your post with regards to my questions. You claimed that he was called the son of the living in Mathew and I asked you if that of Mathew is the real jesus. If you don’t know read Luke too and tell which is the real Jesus.

As for the Jesus in book of Mathew, this is all you need to know about him
Note: following the birth of Jesus, Joseph and Mary flee to Egypt where they stayed until after Herod’s death in order to avoid the murder of their firstborn by Herod. Herod slaughtered all male infants two years old and under. There were 28 generations from David to Jesus and the annunciation occurred after Mary had conceived Jesus.

So compare with that of Luke

Note: following the birth of Jesus, Joseph and Mary remained in the area of Jerusalem for the presentation (about 40 days) and then returned to Nazareth without ever going to Egypt. There was no slaughter of the infants. There were 43 generations in all and the annunciation occurred before conception.
So tell me which is the real Jesus out of the two



No wahala, I "grabbed" the RSV and followed your directives. But even then, the same RSV also showed that Matt. 16:21 indicated Pilate's reference to TWO different people. Quote from RSV: 21The governor again said to them, "Which of the two do you want me to release for you?" And they said, "Barab'bas." Abi na lie again?


Brother why lying? You first said that there is nothing like Jesus Barabas and I gave it you but here you are singing another song?

Read your post again:
Further, please babs787, whenever you quote the Bible, could you afford to be honest enough to not misrepresent what it says? There is NO name like "Jesus Barabas";



Go read them - all the NT writers distinguished who was being referred to in the contexts where the personalities were mentioned.


I have read and that’s why I am asking you knowledgeable Christian to help me out. Let me have the real one between Jesus in Mathew and that of Luke.



Sorry, domwas2 is not an authority on Jewish thought; and you keep making reference to what he reposted for the simple reason that it provides the otiose basis for your weakly spun theories of denials.

One question, though: if Isaiah 9:6 does not refer to the Messiah, who then in Jewish and Islamic thought combined was the verse referring to??

You should ask yourself. In what way did it refer to Jesus? Was he king of Jew? Did he rule the Jew etc



And which one of them is still giving you sleepless nights??  

The other four Jesuses apart from Bar-Jesus


It's true that babs787 deliberately doesn't ask questions with the aim of learning or reasoning with people. However, we can see now at last that he is only reacting to the same tough issues referred to by TayoD - he's scooting off from thread to thread in pretence that those other issues do not exist.  


Really? I am asking in order to learn please o.  


Like I said, he's reacting to pilgrim.1's recent entries: her several questions and topics are giving him the heat; and it's not too much of a marvel to notice that he's coming round charging at just about anything in his way.


Is that what you think? No stress man. The questions are nothing but child’s pay. I am enjoying every bit of the debate, she’s learning about Islam. Dont mind stimulus my sister, you are sweet jare  



Okay, true he doesn't deserve any answers; but we dey here, and we will continue to be amused by our friend's boredom.  


Good friend. Cheers




@Olumuyiwa

with the time you spend reading the bible,i wonder if you still have time to read your "holy" quran,but its good sa,because very soon you will be giving TESTIMONIES in a Church,don't say God forbid,that,s your only way to eternal life.



What testimonies again? The one that I gave while in the dark? Come off it brother, you are joking, no going back into that darkness called christianity.

Take care all   .

Am looking for a way to end all these debates. Any body with useful idea?  

4. Khuruuj-Ya’juuj-wa-Ma’juuj (Appearance of the Gog and Magog)

Quran 21 v 96: until the Gog and Magog (people) are let through (their barrier), and hey swiftly swarm from every hill.

The Gog and the Magog people are two wild, lawless and powerful tribes of remote descendant from prophet Nuh. They will carry out murder and pillage anywhere they go. They are liker a virulent tempest against the ship. They will be so numerous that Abdullah Ibn Umar (RA) said that if the entire creation of men and Jinns are in tens, they will be nine out each. These terrible creatures have been in existence since the time of the righteous man called Dhul-Qarnayn in the Quran. They were so notorious for disorderly behaviour and incursion on the surface of the earth, that their generation could not withstand their frocity. Thus, they sought the aid of Dhul-Qarnayn to help them erect a barrier to seal them off. This Allah narrates thus:

Quran 18 v 93-99: Until when he reached the place between the two mountains, he found beneath them a people who would scarcely understand a word. They said, ‘O Dhul-Qarnayn, verily, Gog and Magog are creating disorder in the earth, shall we then pay you tribute on condition that you set up a barrier between us and them? He replied, ‘the power with which my Lord has endowed me about this is better, but you may help me with physical strength; I will set up a barrier between you and them; bring me blocks of iron; they did so till, when he had leveled up the space between the two mountain sides, he said, ‘now blow with your bellows’. They blew till, when he had made it red as fire, he said, ‘bring me molten copper that I may pour it thereon; so they (Gog and Magog) were not able to scale it, thereupon he said, ‘this is my mercy from my Lord. However when th promise of my Lord shall come to past, He will break it into pieces. In addition, the promise of my Lord is certainly true, and on that day, we shall leave some of them to surge against others, and the Trumpet will be blown. Then shall we gather.

They have continued to dig this erected rampart every day to escape from the barrier, but when they are almost through, they will postpone it until the next day. Meanwhile, Allah will return the fort into a stronger state. They will continue like that until Allah will want them to appear on earth. On this fateful day, they will return to their digging and find it so thin as they have left it. They will hurriedly finish the digging and troop out. They will wreck such destruction on everything on earth that the people will go into hiding. Allah will then inform prophet Isa (Jesus) that He has released these creatures from their abode and that He should take the believers to mount Tuur for no power can stand in their way.

They will then spread out leaping across every land and sea. Their advance groups will pass by lake Tiberias and drink up all its water so that when their rear groups get there, there will be no water. They will say, ‘at one time there used to be water here!’. They will march on to a mountain in Jerusalem (Khamar) and declare thus, ‘we have overcome those on earth’. They will start shooting their arrows towards the heavens and when they are returned with blood smearing them, they will say, ‘we have triumphed over those in the heavens too’.

Meanwhile, prophet Isa (Jesus) and the other Muslims will remain in their confinement praying fervently to Allah against the onslaughts of these creatures. Allah will create a germ in the necks of the Gog and Magog people. This will make them fall dead. Such that when Jesus and the righteous ones with him descend from the mountain, they will not find a hand’s breath of space free from the corpses of the Gog and Magog and their putrefaction and stench. They will again pray to Allah, who will then send birds as big as the neck of the Bactarian camel to carry these corpses away and dump them where He wills. Afterwards, there will be a downpour of rain to cleanse the earth of their obnoxious stench and fat. The earth will be instructed to grow its fruits and regain its fertility to the extent that a group of people will be satisfied eating one pomegranate and will be able to have shelter under the shade of its leaves. The blessing in milk will also be so abundant that the milk of one she-camel will suffice for a large company and that of a cow will be enough for a tribe and that of a goat will satisfy a family.

5. The Pleasant Wind

After the trials of the Gog and Magog, people will be at peace a while. Thereafter, Allah will send the pleasant wind to take the life of every believer. This pure breeze will strike them below their armpits because of which the soul of every believer and those who have faith in their hearts up to the grain of a mustard seed will pass into His custody. This wind will emanate from the direction of Yemen, it will be softer than silk. It will only spare the souls of the worst set of people whose men will have cohabitation with women openly like that of the donkeys. They will return to the worship of idols. Shaytan will appear amongst them in the garb of a man and ask them to do so. At this time, no one will make a mention of Allah again. They will perpetrate all devilish acts and transgress all bounds. Their provision will be plenty and their life will be comfortable.

6. The Three Mighty Eclipses

these will occur at the end of the world in the East, West and Arabia. It will be frightening and will put man in an extremely fearful situation. It will be followed by the severest earthquakes, which Allah refers to when He says

Quran 22 v 1: O mankind, fear your Lord, for the convulsion of the Hour will surely be a terrible thing.

7. Ad-Dukhaan (Smoke)

when Hudhayfah Ibn Yaman asked the prophet (saw) what the Dukhaan is, he told him that, ‘it is a smoke, which will fill the spaces between the East and the West. It will last for forty days and nights. It will afflict every believer like catarrh. Its affliction for the unbelievers will be like somebody in a state of intoxication. It will be coming out of their nostrils, ears and anus. The prophet then recited:

Quran 44 v 10: Then watch out for the Day when the sky will bring forth a visible smoke.

8. Rising of the Sun from its setting place

The prophet asked Abu Dharr whether he knows where the sun goes when it is setting. He replied, ‘only Allah and His Messenger know better’. Then, the prophet (saw) told him that, ‘it seeks permission and it is granted. That day is imminent when it will seek permission but would not be granted. It would be ordered: ‘return to where you are coming from’. Therefore, it will rise in its setting place’. The Hour will not hold until the Sun rises from its place of setting. By the time people see this, they will then believe. Alas! It is a time when faith and repentance will not benefit those who have not believed before.

9. Appearance of the Beast of the Earth

Quran 27 v 82: And when the sentence is passed against them (the unjust), we shall bring forth for them a Beast out of the earth, which shall speak to them because people did not believe with assurance in our signs.

Ibn Katheeer said this strange beast would appear at the end of the world when the sun will rise from the West, people would have become decadent and degenerate. At this time, neither will virtue be enjoined nor evil forbidden. Its appearance will mark the end of having faith in Allah for those who would not have had it. Repentance too will no more be accepted. It will have no equal in running. It will sojourn the whole world conversing with people in languages they understand. It will declare at the top of its voice that, ‘surely, Mankind do not believe in the signs of Allah’.

10. The Ravaging Fire

This will be the last of the major signs of the Hour upon which the trumpet will be sounded. It will erupt from Yemen and drive people to the converging point of Judgement.


Trumpet of the hour

The coming of the Hour will be so swift that the bowl of a man milking his camel would not have reached his lips for drinking and that of the two men bargaining on cloth would not have settled the price before it takes effect. The trumpet will be blown. Its circumference is as wide as the spaces between the heavens and the earth. Angel Israfil will be directed to blow it

Quran 39 v 68: The trumpet will be sounded when all that are in the heavens and on earth will swoon, except such, as it will please God (to exempt). Then will a second one be sounded, when behold, they will be standing and looking on!

Its sound is extremely blasting, deadening and deafening. The whole world of angels, men, animals, birds, ants, all other creatures and those in the graves will hear it.

The first blowing

As soon as the last of the major signs of the Hour has taken effect, Allah will order angel Israfil to make the first blowing. This is referred to as Nafkhatu-l-Faza-I-wa-s-Saq. It will mark the end of this world. The blowing will cause terror, horror and deathj. It will take effect while the worst of the people are steep in their most evil acts. The first person to hear it will be a man who will be pre-occupied with repairing the basin for his camels. He will become unconscious and every one around him will become unconscious too. It will be so sudden that its striking terrifying sound will throw the inhabitants of the heavens and the earth into a swoon and with it (the blowing), the world and its natural phenomena will pass into non-existence. The blowing will be very long and protracted. Then, Allah will make the mountains to move and thereafter heaped up with the earth and blown off in a single crash within a twinkle of an eye as if they have never existed. The mountains will thus disappear in a horrible movement and become like scattered dust and powder. The earth and its people shall be shaken to its depth like a ship amidst the deep sea being tossed about by waves. It will shake violently and start to split from one region to the other. It will actually rock with earthquakes and volcanic eruptions everywhere.

The links in the cosmic order will disintegrate. Man will look up to the sky, only to see as if it were a molten lead. In a whirlwind, the heavens will start bursting and exploding asunder. The sun will be overthrown. The stars will start falling. The sun and the moon will be eclipsed by compression. The seas will rise and rivers will overflow into one another. The law of gravity will disappear into oblivion.

On seeing all these happenings before his eyes and hearing them with his ears, man’s soul will almost jump out of him, the light of his eyes will become like somebody suffering the pang of death. His brain will start rioting like an insane, not knowing where to go- to the right, left, front, backward and in all directions, he will try to escape or run at once. Alas! He will become as somebody magnetized to a spot. On seeing him, one will not mince word that he is actually intoxicated. Whereas he is not but the sight, the hearing of the moment has overwhelmed him. nursing mothers will forget their nursling. Every pregnant woman will deliver her unborn foetus. Mankind as a whole will be in a drunken state. Men will be scattered in the wake of these terrible occurrences like scattered moths.

Everything living on earth and in the heavens will undergo this traumatically throbbing trmor, except the dead ones. On inquiry by Abu Hurairah from the prophet as regards those whom Allah will exempt when He says:

Quran 39 v 68: And the trumpet will be blown, and all who are in the heavens and all who are in the earth will fall down in swoon, except those whom Allah wil please to exempt…,

He replied that those whom Allah will exempt are the Martyrs. They are alive enjoying what has been provided for them in His presence. He will safeguard them from the fright of this day and grant them security from it.


Death of the Angel of Death

@stimulus

Hope I have provided enough explanation to the topic and if not, let me have your other allegations to the names of Allah.

Cheers


@babyosis,


Honestly, I pity your soul

@babyosis


You peope never knew that whatever you say bounces back at you.

1. In the Holy Quran ,we have abrogated verses and we have the reason for saying so. The abrogated verses are still there in the Quran. Now are you telling that there are no abrogated verses in the Bible despite the fact that Jesus said that he didnt come to annul.

2. What Gospel are you referring to, Mathew, MARK, lUKE, John, Acts, James etc.

Sister, I have had enough, am backing out because I have learnt that you have never answered the question(s) posed at you, rather you resort to lifting from chowdry, silas etc. I want to be committed to Islamic threads, learning about my faiths etc and leave you to your disbelief but if you need my attention, I will be eager to assist.

Peace

@viee

Never mind.

@pilgrims and stimulus

Let me have your questions outlined but dont forget that after that, we will look into

1. OT vs. Moses

2.Gospel vs. Jesus

3. God of the OT vs. God of the NT.

@nossycheek

Is that all you have to say?

@stimulus

[color=#990000]If you want to know that salvation in Islam is NOT guaranteed, then I'll be willing to help you see that in many instances. Muhammad did NOT know exactly what would be the fate of Muslims - and there are references for that, which makes one wonder about the weak position of the so-called salvation you're here posing up for.[/color]

My brother, if you are not a muslim, nothing for you, there is nothing as sweet as being a muslim. Was Jesus a christian?

Quran 3 v 85: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, never will it be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter, he will be in the ranks of those who have lost.

Quran 3 v 91;Truly, the religion with Allah is Islam. Those who were given the Scriptures (Jews and Christians) did not differ except, out of mutual jealousy, after knowledge had come to them. And whoever disbelieves in th Ayat (proofs, evidences, signs, revelations etc) of Allah, then surely, Allah is swift in caling to account.

Quran 2 v 277: Truly, those who believe and do deeds of righteousness and perform As-Salat and give Zakat, they will have their reward with their Lord. On them shall be no fear , nor shall they grieve.

I have discussed this in several instances; and you may follow some of them on this thread: Jesus: The Son Of God, Or God?

There is something I missed when I wasnt around but when the time comes, we will re-address it

[color=#990000]Bottomline is that Isaiah 9:6 clearly points to the Messiah, and declares in that verse that He is God.[/color]

I have provided rebuttal, its left for you to bring it out for me where it refers to Jesus. You may bring the verse out if you so wish and we will treat it together again.


Oh yes, the Bible speaks several times of the crucifixion - Psalm 22:16; Zach. 12:10; Matt. 27:35; Mark 15:24; Luke 23:33; John 19:37; 20:25-29. So, which Bible have you been reading to have made your denial of "your bible never supported crucifixion?"

Brother, you keep nailing yourself. Why not do us proud by posting the verses for people to see. Let me have it from the verses where it was prophesised that he would be crucified. from the OT. I have been reading same bible as yours and it never supported crucifixion.


Yep, you've always dressed the articles on those links, rank-xeroxed the verses, and then pretend them as you own - which is worse than plagiarism.

Your belief



@MP007

wow! babs .u like rap music, u been raping on this page or somein, i don't care if there is a boook of babs or whatever, if thats what they teach u in the moski, that explains why yall are violent.All i know is that Jesus christ died for my sins, wHO CARES about the was he died? all i know is that he died for my sin and guess what ? he is coming back, JESUS IS LORD, take that to the bank!!!!!


Are you referring to rapper like tupac, easy east, Krs 1, Rakheem etc. You should have been Mp 3 . I do the rap and you do the playing . Which bank should I take it, BOA, Barclays or , ?

@Davidylan & pilgrims



How did mohammed die? - you ran away after giving frivolous excuses

I didnt run. I felt that there is no need answering you because you are inclined to falsehood. His death is not controversial like that of your God Jesus. I dont participate in argument that lacks proof, evidence, facts etc.

Where are mohammed's miracles? - you fled after islam's inconsistency and falsehood was exposed.


Pilgrim requested for it and I gave her. I left the thread because it was turned to another thing. If its left for pilgrim and I, no problem but I saw that you have taken it too far, so I left you to wallow in your ignorance. If you want to learn, am here for you. Did i hear you say falsehood, ok, wait till I post more of your falsehood.


Is there salvation in islam? - you merely listed details of your rituals and promptly fled.

Unless you davidylan is blind. I have posted more than enough and I am telling you now that without you being a muslim, no salvation for you, salvation is found only in Islam.


Now here u are asking questions about Jesus! Answer your questions first then we can begin to take you lying cheat serious.

HUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHH. I sabi you very well davidylan

@pilgrims

I've also wondered with careful observation about why babs787 keeps hopping from thread to thread and dodging questions these days. Even when people try to be reasonable with him and address some of his questions (most of which do not even deserve any answers), he runs around with even more of his games in hope that readers would either be left confused or just tired out.

I will appreciate it if you and I can iron out issues without 3rd party. If you agree, its ok by me.

He was also called Christ, Son of David, the Root of Jesse etc. So what is your point?  That Jesus was the regular name He used does not make Him less "God with us", which is what John refered to when he said: And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, which is no less than Immanuel.

Brother, I am not after he was God or not, my question is 'was he ever called Immanuel'? and 'is Immanuel the same as Jesus'?



A Nazarene is a native and a dweller of Nazareth, and in that the scripturure you quoted answers itself - Matthew 2:23 - And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.

Same issue. We are now seeing who never understands question(s). The prophecy said that he would be called a Nazarene but rather he was called Jesus.



And your browsing through the Bible does not reveal to you that the place of Judas would be taken up by someone else Acts 1:20 - Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

Do you ever read bible for understanding? Read verse 22 and grab what is there.


You make the assumption that the word "you" refers to just the Disciples. Isn't that persecution still happening today? Jesus always have more than the Disciples in mind when He speaks. His thoughts are projected beyond their generation up to ours and the generations after.

Brother, read from verse 5 and you would see that he was talking to the 12 disciples.



5.
I believe stimulus or someone else already provided with this answere.  Why do you belabour an issue that has already been dealt with. The bottom line is you need to look at the event based upon the jewish tradition and calendar so to speak.

Let me have it brother. It is a well known fact that jews count their days from sunset to sunset, so count it yourself and give me your answer so that we arrive at 3 days and 3 nights. Soon, we will shed more light on 'was Jesus like Jonah or unlike Jonah'



I guess you didn't browse long enough to read 2 Chronicles 23 where the Priests and others were commanded to come to the temple on the sabath day and so profane it without being held accountable for obvious reasons.

Why not bring it our brother? Let me have it from your book of chronicles please.



Where did Jesus claim that the statement was made in Isaiah?
If you care to know, read RSV
Mark 1 v 2; as it is written in Isaiah the prophet,


The 'prophets' is more than just the book of Isaiah.  One who studies the bible will realise that Jesus was making refernces to
Isaiah 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Compare Isaiah 40 v 3 to Mark 1 v 2.



Doesn't common sense tells you that Jesus must be refering to coveting your neighbours property when he said "defraud not"?  And isn't that what Leviticus 19:13 says: Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbour, neither rob him: the wages of him that is hired shall not abide with thee all night until the morning.


Common sense did not tell me sir. Why putting words into his mouth? Jesus never said that, he said, 'defraud not'. Why didnt he put 'coveting neighbour's property'. Mind you, defraud can be given many meanings. It is not only neighbour's property that can be defrauded. Understood



Your lack of study ensures that you do not realise that Jesus hinged the fulfilment of the promises on one condition: faith.  Haven't you read that He said traditions makes the word of God of no effect?  Those who had faith in the promises saw a reality of it. Paul was bitten by a deadly snake ad never died, Paul and others cast out demons in Jesus name, spoke in new tongues and healed the sick by the laying on of hands.  That Muhammad died through poisoning only showed how powerless his allah is.


Brother, abeg make I hear word. Are you telling me that those being bitten by snake or poisonouns insects didnt have faith? Are you telling me that those at the hospitals do not have faith. Are you telling me that for you to have been ill for days means that you do not have faith. What is this brother tellling me?


l
I will answer this in two parts. The first is that Jesus will only receive anything given to him directly by His Father. Even the devil offered Him all the kingdoms of the world and yet He refused to receive it becuase it will not be coming God's way.  God's way was for Him to receive the kingdom through His death and resurrection.
Jesus will sit on that kingdom at the second part of His second coming.  That prophecy wasn't for His first coming.

Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. The prophecy wasnt for his 1st coming!! Read again, this is pure daylight roberry.

Luke 1 v 32-33: ,  and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David and he will reign over the house of Jacob for ever and his kingdom there will be no end.

For better understanding, read from verse 26. There you will read that the angel was telling Mary about the son in his womb and what he would be after his birth.


When you cross over into eternity, there is nothing like night and day as we know it. Eternity is in an ever present state of 'now' and every point in time is 'today'. The thief receiving justification meant that he will not be condemned to hell but will move into life and will be forever with Jesus in paradise which has no night nor day.

Thumbs up for brother tayo for twisting the whole verse . Jesus knew you people and therefore differentiated the day from night. Bible interpreter, you be correct guy .



I know you have tried to claim that Deuteronomy 18 speaks about Muhammad, but of course you are wrong as usual.  Deuteronomy 18 and many passages in the pentateuch were talking about Jesus.


Brother, Honestly, I am laughing here ooooooo

Quote
13. John 7 v 8-10: Jesus told them he wouldn’t be going to the feast but went later secretly.
I thought we were talking about prophecy here. So what is your point?

Solve that too brother



The fact is that there are several references to Him rising from the dead. However, most of them were in shadows meant for those who study and have His spirit to decipher. Here is a direct reference in Psalms 16:10 - For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

Let me have other references. Is there anywhere in your above verse that says he would rise from the dead?


The scripture refered to by Jesus is Isaiah 28:16 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste.  You seem to forget that the OT was written in Hebrew and the NT was written in Greek.

So 'ashamed' is the same as 'haste'!!




Your assumption is totally untrue. Paul's point was the order of ascension and not that he will be alive when Christ comes back.  He, like I would made a statement expecting the Lord's return at anytime. If I were refering to the resurrection today as well, I will mention that the dead will rise first and those of us alive will rise afterwards.  That I say that does not mean I'm implying I will be here when Christ comes.  The same Paul mentioned in severeal scriptures about his impending death and sacrifice for the cause of Christ.

Do you read bible at all? Did you see this 'and the death in Christ will rise first, then we who are alive, who are left'

Paul is saying that when Jesus comes, those that are dead will rise and they that are ALIVE and are left will meet him. Why do you like twisting the bible?


@stimulus

@vieee

Insert Quote
babs, what is even wrong with you?
whats up with bible this, Jesus that?
have got any problem with Christianity?


Honestly, I have no problem with christian because I was and have scores as friends. But am I not supposed to ask any question(s) that I do not understand?

Let me tell you little about myself and nairaland. When I first came, I never participated but decided to when I saw all the blasphemous statement being said about my religion and my prophet. I later learnt that the argument/debate is leading nowhere and decided to soft-pedalled and tried looking at the similarities and trying to bridge the gap of understanding between the two religion just like one of my brothers AbdKabir has been trying to but found out that your people never stopped being mischievous.

I have stopped creating new threads but started it when i saw pilgrims'.


why don't you try preaching love, peace unity, oneness
topics that we can really do with and let us identify your beliefs from those?

Thanks brother, I have been doing that. Go to Islamic thread and you will learn a lot. I am a Muslim if you dont know my belief and will die as one. Honestly am tired of these arguments that leads nowhere at the end of the day but you cant expect me to fold my arms when my faith is being bastardised on the guise of asking questions. When they ask question, they are not challenged but when babs does same, heaven is let loose.


you are not passing any message through this medium and stand rather you are sounding like a sadist!

I am sorry but I am not a sadist but a muslim


wake up bro!

say / post something meaningful and quit talking about issues you obviously don't even care to know about


Is this thread not meaningful? But their posts are always meaningul while that of muslims are not always.

Brother, am ignoring all questions be it on christianity or Islam, will be appearing only at Islamic threads and will try concrentrating on unity, love, etc between the two religion but we will see who will violate the law? Are you ok with that.

Am very sorry. Is apology accepted?


Thanks brother



@stimulus

Haba. I am not bored and can never be bored. I am ignoring all questions and will focus on Islamic threads. Hope you are ok with that? I love you jare.


Another one of those infantile questions, eh?
Or, is it that you got dazed by pilgrim.1's questions on the 99 names of Allah, that you got so red in the face to dribble this one. Well done!  

Is that what you think? Go read the thread, I have answered my sister.


If the question is simple as you stated: "WHICH IS THE REAL JESUS?" then, you can again go through the Bible and see that all of them were real in their persons; but ONLY ONE was called the Son of the living God (Matt. 16:16). None of the others claimed the same identity with the Son of God.

Are you saying that of the Mathew is the real Jesus Christ?



Further, please babs787, whenever you quote the Bible, could you afford to be honest enough to not misrepresent what it says? There is NO name like "Jesus Barabas"; and Matt. 27:16-17 identified two people: one called "Jesus, which is called Christ"; and the other "a notable prisoner, Barabbas". It is obvious in vs. 21 that Pilate was presenting two persons before the Jews on that day when he asked: "Which of the two do you wish me to release to you?" Did you see that also in your "ancient manuscripts" as well?

Na wa o. Dont ever try to lie. You think I just post anything without having proof. Oya Grab your RSV, read mathew 27 v 16 and you will see letter k after barabas, now go the footnote and read Jesus Barabbas yourself.


At least, your assumptions should have helped answer your own questions - they "share different attributes".

So which of the authors has real Jesus?


On the other hand, if the question is as to the Name "Jesus" proving that He was God, that is arguable; for the same name has been used of others who were mere men and differ from Him who is the very Logos (the Word), and Who in John 1:1 is called GOD.

What is this man saying. Am asking you, if the name Jesus meant the same thing as Immanuel.


Not only so, Isaiah 9:6 and several OT verses provide textual references to His deity as well His humanity. None of the others by inference of the name "Jesus" could claim the very idenity of what/who Jesus called Himself - the Son of God (John 10:36).

You know what, I dont have to argue with you on the sonship of God. A christian like you, domwas2 provided detailed explanation on that and the meaning to the Jews. You are laying claim to Isaiah 9 v6, was Jesus King of the Jews? Did he sit on any throne of Davd?


Barjesus is not the same name as JESUS. Go figure.

Minus Bar-jesus, remaining other 4 Jesuses

@viee

Thanks for the post.



@Pain

Why can't people open their eyes and realise that Islam was Muhammad's Own Contraption?

Do you have the proof and was Jesus a christian?


Please We All Know there is A God, but Islam is one of those Misunderstood, Violent and Wrong Paths to Him.

Really? Have you pondered on christianity, its foundation and relationship with paganism?


The Only Path to God Is Love. I know Id Get Pummeled -Vituperatively for this,

What is the purpose of creation?


Yeah its Understandable for a World Almost Empty of That Divine Ingredient.

What ingredient?  




@babyosis


It is amazing how babs and his likes are quick to talk of the prophets of the Bible and whatever sins they committed.
Are these not the same prophets your koran talks about howbeit in a confused manner after Mo plagiarized the Bible?
He was afterrall illiterate.

Yes he was an illiterate but the book accorded to the literate (Jesus) cannot stand his book in all ramifications as I have been telling you. My book talks about the prophets too but not in disgusting and blasphemous way your bible told the stories. The prophets are supposed to be good examples and not bad as shown by your bible. Maybe we should compare the stories of the prophets in the two books and see which is worth relying on.


Who would buy a book written by an illiterate fella with jumbled up stories on idolatory mixed with Christianity and Judaism called Islam.

. Who will buy incomplete book with pornography, mass murder, incest cases, slavery, etc. Should we compare the books in terms of science, prophecy etc?


I still maintain that Muhammad,a sexual abuser of women,murderer,pedophile and a looter is no example to follow.


I would rather give my daughter to a potent and not to an impotent. Let me ask you, what is really Jesus' age and why didnt he marry at his age?


A man who said with his own mouth of not knowing what allah was going to do to him.
How could anyman emulate him?

If you dont know, he will be the one to intercede for you on that day, even Jesus will not be able to do anything because the power of intercession wil not be given to him except the seal of all prophets.


Because he frightens you by demanding you not ask questions when all fingers point to the fact that he was mentally disturbed.
He admitted he was posessed of the devil
His wives and his own mother said so too.
Mo was an impostor,a violent impostor who killed anyone that dared oppose his ill ideas
what other evidence do you need?.

I thought if you have been reading your bible. What did Jesus' people say concerning his apostleship? Go and read and your bible and when you are through, you get back to me. Read what they said to him and how they rejected him.

It is right there in your own books,you don't need me to say these.
You now know the truth,the rest is up to to you.

What is in my book and what truth are you referring to?


lastly,I will not engage you in useless biblical arguments,it is a waste of my precious time.

Really! I have known you for long, you have not been participating in any argument except lifiting the sayings of liars like chowdry from your sites. So, your leaving will not affect seun's site.




@Pilgrims

I have told you, there is no other faith that guarantees Salvation and Paradise as Islam.

If you are a muslim, you are saved. If you are not satisfied, go over my first post where I gave you detailed response.

For you to know if you are saved, you need to know why we are created, so if you are able to know that, you will understand the rest.

If you are a muslim, be rest assured that Paradise is yours but if you are not, am very ooooo.

Good day my people . One of the characteristics of a prophet is that whenever he speaks or prophesis, it must surely come to pass. While browsing through the bible, I came across some prophesies of God Jesus which I decide to put across to my christian friends to assist in explaining to me because the Jesus is my book is never a liar  and is even accorded a high status to the extent that a chapter is named after her mother (Surah Maryam 19). Please I need explanation on these, maybe sister pilgrims and brother stimulus can assist me.


1.
Mathew 1 v 23: behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name, Emmanuel, which is being interpreted, ‘God is with us’

Note; He was called Jesus instead and nowhere do we have it that Jesus has the same meaning as Immanuel.


2.
Mathew 2 v 23: …he shall be called a Nazarene

Note: nowhere he was called such. Nowhere could we find such prophecy fulfilled


3.
Mathew 19 v 27-29: the 12 disciples will sit on 12 thrones judging the 12 tribes of Israel

Not: but Judas Iscariot who was one of the twelve disciples betrayed him and they finally remained 11 (see Luke 24 v 9)


4.
Mathew 10 v 23: but when they persecute you in this city, flee ye unto another city, for verily, I say unto you, ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the son be come.

Note; the disciples of Jesus fled and they have now perished for 2000 years with no sign of the Jesus.

5.
Mathew 12 v 39 – 40; An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign but no sign shall be given except the sign of the prophjet Jonah. For as Jonah was 3 days and 3 nights in the belly of the Whale, so will the son of man be 3 days and 3 nights in the hearts of the earth.

Note: Jesus was allegeldyl crucified on evening of Friday, but on Sunday morning, Mary Magdalene didn’t find him in the tomb. This makes up 2 nights. Friday and Saturday 1 day. Sunday none


6.
Mathew 12 v 5: or have ye not read in the law, how that on the Sabbath days, the priest in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless?

Note: nowhere could we find the prophecy in the O.T


7.
Mark 1 v 2: as it is written in the prophets, ‘behold, I send my messenger before they face, which shall prepare the way before thee’

Note: Jesus quotes a statement in whch he says appaears in Isaiah, no such prophecy in Isaiah.

8.
Mark 10 v 19: thou knowest the commandments, ‘do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, do not bear false witness, defraud not, honour thy father and mother.

Note; there is no such commandment “Defraud not” in the OT or elsewhere in the OT (exodus 20 v 3-17)


9.mark 16 v 17-18: and these signs shall follow them that believe, in my name shall they cast out devils, they shall speak with new tongues, they shall take up serpents and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them, they shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover.

Note: some Christians have died as a result of drinking poison, infact, many christiand had lost their lives as a resulty of being bitten by snakes and many are staying long in the hospital awaiting cure. Are they not believers?


10.
The Angel made a promise to many about th miraculous nature of Jesus in this world,

luke 1 v 32-33: , and the Lord God will give to him the throe of his father David and he will reign over the house of Jacob for ever and his kingdom there will be no end.

Note: but Jesus was not granted that kingdom, he himself made the confession in this world

, my kingdom is not of this world (john 18 v 33-36). Instead of him sitting on the throne, it was Herod that sat.

11.
Luke 23 v 43: and Jesus said unto him, ‘verily I say unto thee, today, shalt thou be with me in paradise

note: according to John 20 v 17, act 1 v 31, Jesus wasn’t raised until the 3rd day and did not ascend until at least 40 days

12.
John 5 v 46: Jesus said Moses wrote of him
Note: but nowhere could we find such in the OT.

13.
John 7 v 8-10: Jesus told them he wouldn’t be going to the feast but went later secretly.


14.
john 20 v 9: for as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.
Note; there is nowhere in the OT where we have the above statement.

15.
Romans 10 v 11: for the scripture said ‘ whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Note; no such statement in the OT.

16.
1ST Thessalonian 4 v 17: and the death in Christ will rise first, then we who are alive, who are left, shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.


Note: Paul had counted himself among those that wil be alive during the 2nd coming of Jesus. He even counted himself among those who will meet him in the air.

Thank you.

Going through the bible, I came across some Jesuses. There is nothing wrong in coming across names when reading any book but christians made me believe that the name is one of the reasons why Jesus is God. The holy spirit told him that the son shall be called Immauel Jesus, meaning God with us. So if the name Jesus shows that he is God , how many Gods are we having because we have the names in four or five different places.

Secondly, I found out that the Jesuses share different attributes,as a result want to know which is the real jesus out of them all.


1.

Acts 13 v 6: when they had gone through isle unto paphos, they found a certain sorcere, a false prophet, a jew, whose name was Bar-Jesus.


2.

Mathew 27 v 16-17: And they had then notable prisoner called Barrabas. Therefore when were gatyhere togwther, Pilate said unto them, who will ye that I release unto you? Barabas, or Jesus which is called Christ?

Note: Other ancient manuscript have Jesus Barabas

3.
Mathew 2 v 13 – 16: Now when they had departed. Behold an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream and said, rise take the child and his mother and flee to Egypt and remain there till I tell you, for Herod is about to search for the child and destroy him. and he rose and took the child and his mother by night and departed for Egypt and remained there until the death of Herod.

Note: following the birth of Jesus, Joseph and Mary flee to Egypt where they stayed until after Herod’s death in order to avoid the murder of their firstborn by Herod. Herod slaughtered all male infants two years old and under. There were 28 generations from David to Jesus and the annunciation occurred after Mary had conceinved Jesus.


4.
Luke 2 v 22- 40: ( a long story, I cant type)

Note: following the birth of Jesus, Joseph and Mary remained in the area of Jerusalem for the presentation (about 40 days) and then returned to Nazareth without ever going to Egypt. There was no slaughter of the infants. There were 43 generations in all and the annunciation occurred before conception.


5.
Colossians 4 v 10-11: Aristechyus, my fellow prisoner saluteth you, and Marcus, sister’s son to Barnabas (touching whom ye received commandments; if he come unot you, receive him).And Jesus, which is called Justus…


Thank you.

@pilgrims

Thanks for the post.

The door is wide opened.

After that, we will look into

1. OT vs. Moses

2.Gospel vs. Jesus

3. God of the OT vs. God of the NT.

I am with you, let me have your question(s)

@pilgrims


I thought I have answered you but if to you I haven’t, I will re-explain again

Regarding the 99 names of Allah, on the authority of Abu Hurairah (RA) who said ‘Allah has ninety-nine names, that who memorises them enters Paradise.

In another narrative, ‘that who counts them enters Paradise’.

Now you will never see it anywhere where it is said that the names are 98 or 101, be it from Hadith or Quran. The names of Allah is 100-1, the one there is Allah while the 99 are His other names. If you start the counting with the inclusion of ‘Allah’, you will arrive at 100. The names starts with Ar-Rahman (The Beneficient) and ends with As-Sabur (The Patient). If you have your own that says 101, please let me have it.

We have the names in the Holy Quran but you may not understand becauses you are not reading the Arabic Quran. If it is the Arabic Quran, you would have seen the names. For example at the beginning of chapters in the Quran, we have ‘Bismillah Rahman Raheeem’, meaning, ‘in the name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. Ar-Rahman is one of the 99 names meaning the Beneficent while Ar-raheem is one of the names too meaning ‘the Merciful’.

Let me give you some verses in the Holy Quran where the names are mentioned.

Bismillah Rahman Raheem

Lao anzalnaa hadhal qur’ani ‘ala jabalin laraytau khashiyati llahi wa tilkal amthaala nadiribuha linna la’allahum yatafakkaruuna

Huwa-Lahu Lazee La Ilaha Ilahuwa ‘Alimul Ghaybi wa Shahaadati Huwa Rahaman Raheem. Huwa Lahu Lazee La Ilaha Ila Huwa Malikul Quduusu-S-Salaamul Mu’minul Muhaymin ‘Azeezul Jabbarul Mutakabbiru Subhaana Lahi Ama Yushrikuun.

Huwa Lahu Khaaliqul Baari’ul Musawiru Lahul Asmaa’ul Husna Yus-Sabbihu Lahu Maa fi Samawaati Wal Ardi, Wa Huwal ‘Azeezul Hakeem.

Meaning

In the Name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

If we had caused this Quran to descend upon a mountain thou (O Muhammed) verily hadst seen it humbled rent asunder by the fear of Allah. Such similitudes coin we for mankind that haply they may reflect.

He is Allah, that whom there is no god, the Knower of the invisible and the visible. He is the Beneficent, the Merciful. He is Allah, that whom there is no other god, the Sovereign Lord, the Holy One, Peace, the Keeper of Faith, the Guardian, the Mighty, the Compeller, the Superb, Glorified be Allah from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him)1.

He is Allah, the Creator, the Shaper out of naught, the Fashioner, His are the most beautiful names. All that is in the heavens and the earth glorifieth Him, and He is the Mighty, the Wise.

Let me bring out some of his names from the verses above.

Rahaman Beneficent
Al-Raheem The Merciful
Al-Malik The Sovereign Lord
Al-Quddus The Holy One
Salam Peace
Al-Mumin The Keeper of faith
Muhaymin Protector
Jabbarul Compeller
Mutakabir Superb
Azeez Mighty
Hakeem Wise

Further examples

Al-Azim (The Great) Quran 42 v 4 : To Him belong all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth and He is the most High, the Most Great.

Al-Halim (The Forbearer) Quran 22 v 59: Truly, He will make them enter an entrance with which they shall be well pleased and verily, Allah indeed is All-Knowing, Most Forbearing

Al-Ghaffar (The Forgiver) Quran 4 v 43 : … Truly, Allah is oft Pardoning, Oft-Forgiving.

I thought you claimed to have been a muslim. If really you were, you must have been one of those born as a muslim but not a practicing one. If you have read the Quran , you would have seen those names and if you haven’t, try getting one of the Islamic reciters’ tape or disc and listen to it, you will hear all those names therein or try getting the transliteration of the Quran. Also, you would have been hearing names like Abdur- Gaffar, Abdur-Rahman, Abdul Bashir etc. The abdul there means slave eg. Abdullahi – slave of Allah. Abdul Bashir – slave of All seer. Abdul Rahman slave of the most Gracious . Abdul Hakeem slave of the Wise.

@stimulus


Without even going into the Quran, it has been established the the bible is incomplete. I have been telling you that if you think that the Quran is incomplete as some apologists have been claiming, bring out a verse as I have done.

In addition to the above, open your RSV of 1952, you will be shocked to note that mark 16 ends at verse 8, and after an embarrassing expanse of blank space, the missing verses appear in ‘small print’ as a footnote at the bottom of the page.

Your bible confirmed that it has grave defects. Read the preface of the RSV 1971 and I quote:

‘ The king James Version has with good reason been termed ‘the noblest monument of English prose’. Its revisers in 1881 expressd admiratin for ‘its simplicity, its dignity, its power, its happy turns of expression… the music of its cadences, and the felicities of its rhythm…. We owe it an incalculable debt.

Yet the King James Version has grave defects. By the middle of the nineteenth century, the development of biblical studies and the discovery of many manuscripts more ancient than those upon which the King James Version was based, made it manifest that these defects are so many and so serious as to call for revision of the English translation.’

The Quran is the last book revealed to the seal of the prophets because the original message of both Torah and Gospel cannot be found. We are told that Moses wrote the 5 books, do we say Moses addressed himself thus:

‘and the Lord said unto him, away, get thee down…
‘And Moses said unto the Lord, the people cannot come…
‘And the Lord said unto Moses, go on before the people…
‘And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying….
‘And the Lord said unto Moses, get down, charge the….

Moses even wrote his obituary before his death, his age, and said that he was buried when he hasn’t died.


As for the NT, we learnt that Jesus was given the Gospel but can we say the Gospel in existence is the one given to him? Do we add the book of Luke, acts to revelation as part of the gospel? The original message is lost. Four other gospels composed by men were chosen by Athanasius, a fourth century bishop to replace the lost Gospel of Jesus Christ. (The New Encyclopedia Britannica vol. 14. p. 814).

I remembered when I started the thread, ‘was jesus crucified’?, I listed Gospel of Barnabas among those that rejected the crucifixion of jesus Christ. Many Christian apologists hide under the GoB, ignored my other write ups and concentrated on GoB. I had to exercise patience in order for the topic to move on. The Christians here never knew that Babs must have got enough fact, proof, evidence etc before posting anything on Christianity here. Now if you don’t know, in the mid-4th century manuscrpt called Codex Sinaiticus, the Letter of Barnabas and the Shepherd of Hermas are incuded as part of the New Testament (The New Encyclopedia Britannica, vol. 14. p. 814).

Apart from your inability to give me missing verse(s) from my Book, am even telling you again to bring it out from your bible where it states that its complete and that nothing is missing.

1st Corinthians 13 v 9: for we know in part an we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

Which is the one that is in part and which is the one that will be perfect because we know that OT and NT are in existence.

Quran 6 v 38: , we have neglected nothing in the book.

He who sees the truth and accepts, does so for his own soul and he who rejects, does so at his own peril. Truth has come, falsehood is bound to perish.

@Pilgrims


You may doubt all you want about the Bible, and I understand that you take that as your default position simply because the Quran denies the truth in the Bible.

What truth are you referring to sister?



(a) Muhammad said that Allah has 99 names (i.e., 100 minus 1). Many Muslims today have so many different lists of 99 names; others have up to 110; yet others claim that there are many more names (revealed and unrevealed). So, who should we to believe - Muhammad; or those who discredit his 99 names claim and make it over 100; or yet the Quran does nowhere makes such a list of names for Allah?

Check my response to your question in the same thread.



(b) I have observed that you often deny Biblical truths simply because of what you have plagiarized from other Islamic websites. For instance, you argue to deny that the crucifixion is not true because none of the disciples of Jesus "witnessed" it. Please, let me ask you: if you believe what many Muslims teach and claim (that someone else was put on the Cross); WHO IS THAT "SOMEONE ELSE"??

I never denied any truth. I have been using your bible for you which in most cases go against your doctrines. Why not read the GoB for a minute and see what we have there.
The GoB was included in the mid 4th century but was expunged later.

If Jesus is the one put on the cross, why did he shout that 'my God, why has thou forsaken me' when he knew that he came to be crucified. Also there was a time when they wanted to kill him and he never walked openly just cos they wanted to do what he came for.



(c) Again, since Muslims seem to have a default position for what the Quran claims about the ascension of Jesus Christ, and because of this they deny His death and crucifixion, let me ask you: HOW DID MUHAMMAD KNOW THAT JESUS WAS TAKEN UP TO HEAVEN WITHOUT BEING CRUCIFIED? Was Muhammad a witness of all the claims he made in the Qur'an??


A very good question. Let me start with verses from the Quran

Quran 17 v 89; And indeed we have fully explained to mankind, in this Quran, every kind of similitude but most mankind refuse (the truth and accept nothing) but disbelief.

Can you beat your chest that the Gospel is the original message given to Jesus? The Last prophet and the Last Book were revealed because the original message is nowhere to be found.

If you have been reading the bible, you would have read that Jesus didnt die, God never allowed him to die. God has been saving his prophets, why would that of Jesus be different?

The jews planned to kill him, he was saved miraculously and that is the more reason he will be coming the second time, to live, die and be buried. Was Jesus the only one that was taken to heaven without tasting death?


I think we should really grow up and stop these silly childish questions that can't take us anywhere. Why is it that when the same questions are applied to the claims Muhammad made, instead of giving cogent answers, Muslims typically resort of far-fetched theories that circle round the question and never address them?

Let me have your questions


Be sure that whatever questions you ask about Christianity, it would only be fair to ask yourself the same questions about Islam before you assume the denials that the Quran teaches Muslims by rote.

Quran never teaches any denials, even disciples' early writing go against crucifixion. If you need them, we go into them.

@buluti

This will be your 3rd post towards me. Your posts carry the same tone and as such will waste no time in replying you.

In your first post to me, where I learnt that you are a Man U fan, you went biased asking me to be straight forward in my questions pertaining to christtianity. I replied you that you he who that wants to do equity must come with clean hands, that you never said anything to your folks asking me questions.

Your second post was on the Gombe crisis where you said that you christians have been providing enough explanations and that we muslims have never been and that we have been hiding something from you.

Your last post carry the same biased tone which you have been known for (sorry didnt mean to be rude). When Babs asks question(s), then you will tell them to ignore but when your folks ask and babs never responds, then you will have another thing to say. I leave you to judge yourself.

@olusleeky

God said US make man in OUR image and after OUR likeness, this statement will point out the fact that God the father was not alone.

Some questions for you.

What is the image of God?

When the Jews wanted to kill him, who did he prayed to at Gethsemane

Who did he shout to that, 'my God why has thou forsaken me

When he died (as claimed by you), who resurrected him?


When you are through with the above, we will go into other issues

@Mukina


Dont worry, you have been trying your best. We can only preach, we cant enforce. May Allah to be with you. As we proceed, we shall know if attaining salvation in christianity is by work (Jesus), by faith (Paul) or by being a virgin. (Jesus vs. Paul) . So sister, please leave them alone, the dog that wants to get lost will never listen to its master's whistle.



@nossycheeks


#Just a narration of your rituals does not guarantee salvation#

How is salvation guaranteed in Christianity?



#It is because you lacked knowledged that is why you are misplacing both. Who said Muslims avoids alcohol when they enjoy doing that especially secretly. Strong odour? who wears perfumes meant for corpses but you guys. Talking  of ablution, that is more or less physical, for us Christians, we are after spiritual cleaniness (Holiness), without which no one can see God.#


I can see that you dont know anything and as result will not waste my time arguing with you.



#The name given to your false religion does not matter, what matters is that Jesus is the way, the truth and the LIFE. No one cometh to the father except by HIM#


Was Jesus a Christian? Dont worry. When the time comes, I will shed more light  on the above verse as I have done with other verses. It is very funny how you do not undertand the bible you carry about.



#You have not said anything concrete about salvation but a story of your prayer rites. How can you change, when you keep on using bad deeds to overwrite good deeds and vice versa.#

It means you have not read anything. I told you that if you are not a muslim, nothing for you. A non practising muslim is better than you pagan.




#FORNICATION IS ALLOWED - NOT ALLOWED IN CHRISTIANITY (ABLUTION OR NO ABLUTION).#

Do you want us to back it up with verses from both books. Or you prefer only the bible where we have stories of prophet, having intercourse with their daughters and where God of the bible allowed his prophet(s) to marry harlot.



ADULTERY ALLOWED - ADULTERERS WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD

Should we use the two books to back our post?



SMOKING OF GANGA IS HIGHLY CARRIED - NO WAY IN CHRISTIANITY

Do you have the verse that say so in Islam?



MURDER IS HIGHLY CARRIED - NO BLOOD STAINED HAND WILL ENTER THE KINGDOM

Why dont you ask Hitler, George Bush, zionist etc


HATRED IS PERMITTED UNLIKE CHRISTIANITY WHERE WE ARE ENCOURAGED TO LOVE EVEN OUR ENEMIES

Really? Are you referring to God of the OT or the NT?



When Jesus Christ shed his blood on the cross, it was not the blood of a martyr; or the blood of one man for another; it was the life of God poured out to redeem the world.


Which cross is that? Wooden or Metallic cross? Was he crucified, crucificted, hanged etc? We have heard stories of ordinary beings that never show ano sign of cowardice when led to be killed but your God Jesus cried to Himself, 'Why has thou forsaken me', showing sign of hypocrite.



@babyosis


I have learnt that you know nothing apart from what you are being told by your pastors. Questions have been directed to you (most recent on the letter written to the Corinthians by Paul), you waived it aside. You have never been responding to issues pertaining to christianity but always quick at lifting from answering Islam etc when it pertains to Islam.


It is plain to see that in Islam salvation is a result of your works.

We will know as we proceed if salvation is by faith or work (Jesus vs Paul)


You may have also noticed that all Muslims, except those who die as martyrs defending Islam, go to hell. This is clearly stated in the Koran, Sura 19, verses 67-68 and 71-72.

Thank you very much for bringing out verses against you. It seems you just lifted the versesfrom one of your site without going through them. You have been known for misquoting the Quran as you have been turning the bible upside down, there is no escape route for you as far the Quran is concerned. This is what we have in the verses

Quran 19 v 67 - 68: And man (the disbeliever) says: 'when I am dead, shall I then be raised up alive"?

v 67: Does not man remember that we created him before, while he was nothing?

v 68: So by your Lord, surely, we shall gather them together, and (also) the shaitan (with them), then we shall bring them round Hell on their knees.

v 69: Then indeed we shall drag out from every sect all those who were worst in obstinate rebellion against the Most Gracious (Allah)


Allah is talking to you unbelievers and the punishment awaiting you on that day which is Hell fire straight. So never  try misquoting the Quran.



(This is Allah speaking through his prophet Muhammad.) "There is not one among you who shall not pass through hell; such is the absolute decree of your Lord. We will deliver those who fear Us, and leave the wrongdoers there, on their knees." (Sura 19:71-72)

Yes you are right. There is none among you unbelievers that will not pass through Hell unless you accept the last prophet and the last book. Read below:

Quran 19 v 71: There is not one among you who shall not pass through hell; such is the absolute decree of your Lord. We will deliver those who fear Us, and leave the wrongdoers there, on their knees.


Quran 19 v 72: Then we shall save those who used to fear Allah and were dutiful to Him. And we shall leave the polytheists and wrongdoers therein humbled to their knees in Hell fire.

Did you see that? Hell for you straight. Only we muslims that fear Allah and are dutiful to Him will be saved. Allah is the greatest.


 

In Islam there are two ways to get paradise:

1. Your good deeds are weighed against your bad deeds. If you have done enough good deeds when compared to your bad deeds, you will eventually get to paradise, after spending some time burning in the fires of hell.


Ignorant is truly a disease. Support you claim pls. It will be very hard for muslims to taste Hell.



2. Muslims who die as martyrs defending Islam go directly to paradise.

It is plain to see that in Islam salvation is a result of your works. You may have also noticed that all Muslims, except those who die as martyrs defending Islam, go to hell. This is clearly stated in the Koran, Sura 19, verses 67-68 and 71-72.

It has been treated above. Liar, there is nothing like that. The verses are for you unbelievers.




@pataki

Does Islam guarantee death? YES

So Christian will not die?


Does Islam guarantee abundance of women for sexual pleasure? YES

Can you back it up and I will show you verses in your book where sex, incest is committed freely by prophets.

Does Islam guarantee foolishness? YES

That is the reason you are not ready for the truth. You have been preaching what you cant defend.


Does Islam guarantee stupidity? YES

Same goes


Does Islam guarantee wanton destruction of lives and property? YES

You should ask Hitler, George bush, Tony Blair, Israelite etc


Does Islam guarantee Salvation after death? NO

I dont blame you, I have given you enough verses up. If you are not a muslim Hell for you straight. We will soon know if salvation is by faith or by work or by being a virgin.




@pilgrim

Without wanting to sound tedious to you, permit me to say that you have laboured in circles and have really not touched on the issue of this thread.

To you I have not but as for me I have even touched it more than what you bargained for.



It is often claimed that Islam is the religion of salvation. My question is: does it GUARANTEE salvation?

Yes Islam guarantees salvation and if you are not a muslim, nothing for you, I gave you verses where all the prophets were muslims.


I cannot fathom how Muhammad would make claims in the Quran about salvation, and yet he was NOT sure of his destiny according to the Hadiths! Is Islam merely a religion that can boast so many things, and yet be too scared to have those same claims examined?

Muhammad many times could not personally tell (even as a "prophet" his followers with absolute certainty that Allah guaranteed salvation for all those who had been his followers. WHY is that so? Just typing out volumes of texts in the Quran actually says nothing in the face of the fact that Muhammad was known to have expressed doubts in the salvation he promised others.

I have given you enough verses and if you will like to read again, here they are:

Narrated by Ibn Umar: On the Day of Resurrection, the people will fall on their knees and every nation will follow their prophet and they will say, o-so-and-so! Intercede (for us with Allah)”, till the (right of) intercession will be given to the Prophet (saw) and that will be the day when Allah will raise him to a station of praise and glory i.e the honour of intercession

(Here ignorant Christians accuse the Prophet of not knowing where he will be on that Day)

Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah. Alla’s Messenger said, ‘whoever after listening to the Adhan (call for the prayer) says, ‘O Allah, the Lord of the complete call and of this prayer, which is going to be established. Give Muhammed Al-Wasilah and Al-Fdilah and raise him to a station of intercession for him on the Day of Resurrection.

Quran 2 v 277: Truly, those who believe and do deeds of righteousness and perform As-Salat and give Zakat, they will have their reward with their Lord. On them shall be no fear , nor shall they grieve.

Quran 8 v 2: The believers are only those who, when Allah is mentioned, feel a fear in their hearts and when this verse (this Quran) are recited unto them, they (i.e the verses) increase their faith, and they put their trust in their Lord (alone)

V 3: who perfom As-Salat, spend out of what we have provided them.

V 4: It is they who are the believers in truth. For them are grade of dignity with their Lord, and forgiveness and a generous provision (paradise)

The verses above are straight forward unless you want to pretend that you do not understand.

On that day, the same Muhammed you have been saying all sort of things against will be the one to beg for you when your so called Jesus wil not be able to intercede for you. He will be the first in which the soul will be restored before your Jesus.




I only ask you one thing: Did Muhammad express doubts AT ANY TIME about the fate of his followers? When I get a feedback, then I'll come back with some of the issues that have been of grave concern to me which informed my leaving Islam and trusting Jesus Christ as my Saviour.

Let me have your issues. When you supply that, we will also go into the reason why Jesus is your saviour when he couldnt save himself when being led away.



@oyb

However, on further study one finds that no one can be sure of being saved in the religion of Islam. Therefore, if there is no guarantee of salvation in Islam, what then is the hope those who rigorously follow Muhammad's Qur'an with such uncertainties of their eternal future?


If you are not a muslim, no salvation for you and you will be among the losers on that day.

@mukina

Thanks for the post


@Ibrahim 007


Salam brother,

I will try to complete it. Its just I have been replying these haters of truth.

@pilgrims


I thought I have answered you. Allah did not say his name is 100 or 1000. If you are trying to view it as contradiction, no way sister because Allah never gives 100 or 1001 names as His.

But if I have not answered your question, let me have it.

@pilgrims

Thanks for the question. You have raised a very good question in which some lazy muslims do not understand how salvation is being attained in Islam and as a result are being led astray by Christians, telling them that it is only through the blood of jesus Christ that man can have salvation. You wouldn’t have understood Islam if I have given you one or two verses on salvation in Islam, so I have tried backing the topic with verses pertaining to worship as the only act of salvation and also make you understand Islam from the area of worship.

I want you to know that there is no salvatin for you as long as you remain a non-muslim. Salvation can be found only in Islam. It is the religion of nature and the only religion that Allah recognizes and going to accept from mankind.

Quran 3 v 85: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, never will it be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter, he will be in the ranks of those who have lost.

Q[b]uran 3 v 91;Truly, the religion with Allah is Islam. Those who were given the Scriptures (Jews and Christians) did not differ except, out of mutual jealousy, after knowledge had come to them. And whoever disbelieves in th Ayat (proofs, evidences, signs, revelations etc) of Allah, then surely, Allah is swift in caling to account.[/b]

Other religions derive their names after their leaders eg chris – Christian, budha – budhaism, tao – Taoism, sango – onisango, oshun – oloshun etc but the name Islam is given by Allah thus:

Quran 5 v 3 …This day! I have perfected your religion, completed my favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion.

Quran 22 v 78: …It is he who named you Muslims both before and in this (the Quran), that the Messenger (Muhammed saw) may be a witness over you and you be witness over mankind.

Salvation is found alone by being a muslim. There is nothing as good as sleeping as muslim in the night and waking up as a muslim in the following morning. The Holy Prophet said that all muslims will enter paradise except those that refuse. When asked that who are those that will refuse? He said those that will refuse are those that do not follow the Quran and the Sunnah.

There is a saying in Yoruba Language that, “If a woman does not try two husbands, she will never know which is better out of the two”. I have put the religions into test and can confidently tell you that there is neither a religion tat is complete, perfected, detailed and straightforward as Islam, nor there is any holy Book that is as holier, accurate, complete, detailed, touches every aspect of life, straightforward etc as the Holy Quran.

I do think at times and give praises to Allah for making me pass through Christianity foundation, because without that, maybe I wouldn’t be having the opportunity of weighing the two and choosing the truth as I have done. I then concluded that Allah at times, make someone first come across wrong people, things, religion etc and that when he comes across the right one, he will be appreciative.

In getting salvation, one need to first understand why man is created. I have perused the bible from Genesis to Revelation and did not find it anywhere ‘for what purpose is man created’ ‘why does man exist’ or ‘the essence of creation’. Allah tells us in the Holy Quran thus:

Quran 51 v 56: And I (Allah) created not the Jinn and mankind except that they should worship me (alone).

From the above verse, it can be seen that Allah created us solely for the purpose of worshipping Him, meaning that you cannot get salvation without worshipping Him which is the essence of creating mankind. The next question is how do we worship Him? we worship Him only through Solat (Prayer)

Quran 4 v 103: When you have finished As-Salat (the congregational prayer), remember Allah standing, sitting down, and (lying down) on your sides, but when you are free from danger, perform As-Salat, verily As-Salat (the prayer) is enjoined on the believers at fixed hours.

Quran 24 v 56: And perform As-Salat (the prayer) and give Zakat and obey the Messenger that you may receive mercy.

Quran 5 v 6: O you who believe! When you intend to offer As-Salat (the prayer), wash your faces and your hands (forearms) up to the elbows, rub (by passing wet hands over) your heads, and (wash) your feet up to the ankles. If you are in a state of Janabah ( i.e after a sexual discharge), purify yourselves (bathe your whole body). But if you are ill or on a journey, or any of you comes after answering the call of nature, or you have been in contact with women (i.e sexual intercourse), and you find no water, then perform Tayammum with clean earth and rub therewith your faces and hands. Allah does not want to place you in difficulty, but He wants to purify you, and to complete His favour to you that you may be thankful.

# The superiority of ablution, and Al-Ghurr-Ul-Muhajjalun (the parts of the body of the Muslims washed in ablution will shine on the Day of Resurrection and the Angels will call them by that name) from the traces of ablution

# Narrated Nu’aim Al-Mujmir: Once I went up the roof of the Mosque along with Abu Hurrairah (RA). He performed ablution and said, ‘I heard the prophet (saw) saying, “on the Day of Resurrection, my followers will be called Al-Ghurr-Ul-Muhajjalun from the traces of ablution and whoever can increase the are of his radiance should do so (by performing ablution in the most perfect manner)

# The prophet did not increase the area more than what is washed of the body parts while doinbg ablution as Allah ordered to be washed in the Quran.

Tayammum: Strike your hands on the earth and then pass the palm of each on the back of the other and then blow off the dust from them and then pass (rub) them on your face.

Quran 2 v 238: Guard strictly ( five obligatory) As-Salawat (the prayers) especially the middle solat (i.e the best prayer – Asr). And stand befor Allah with obedience (and do not speak to others during the Salat (prayer).

Quran 11 v 114: And perform As-Slat at the two ends of the day and in some hours of the night (i.e the five compulsory solat. Verily, the good deeds remove the evil deeds (i.e small sins), that is a reminder (an advice) for the mindful (those who accept advice)

# Narrated Ibn Mas’us (RA). A man kissed a woman and then came to Allah Messenger and told him that. So this Divine Revelation was revealed to the prophet “the good deeds remove the evil deeds (i.e small sins), that is a reminder (an advice) for the mindful (those who accept advice)”. The man said, ‘is this instruction for me only? The prophet said, ‘it is for all those of my followers who encounter a similar situation’

#Narrated Abu Dhar (RA) Allah’s Messenger said to me (a) be afraid of Allah and keep your duty to Him wherever you may be (b) and follow up the evil deeds with the good deeds, verily, the good deeds remove (blot out) the evil deeds (c) and (treat) behave with the people in a high standard of character.

Quran 17 v 78: perform As-Salat from Mid-day till the darkness of the night (i.e the Zuhr, Asr, Maghrib, Isha prayers) and recite the Quran in the early dawn (i.e the morning prayer). Verily the recitation of the Quran in the early dawn is ever witnessed (attended by the angels in chsrge of mankind of the day and night)

V 79: and in some parts of the night (also) offer the solat (prayer) with it (i.e rcite the Quran in the prayer), as an additional prayer (Thajjud optional prayer) for you (O Muhammed saw). It may be that your Lord will raise you to a station of praise and glory i.e th honour of intercession on the Day of Resurrection.

(a)

Narrated by Ibn Umar: On the Day of Resurrection, the people will fall on their knees and every nation will follow their prophet and they will say, o-so-and-so! Intercede (for us with Allah)”, till the (right of) intercession will be given to the Prophet (saw) and that will be the day when Allah will raise him to a station of praise and glory i.e the honour of intercession

(Here ignorant Christians accuse the Prophet of not knowing where he will be on that Day)

(b)

Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah. Alla’s Messenger said, ‘whoever after listening to the Adhan (call for the prayer) says, ‘O Allah, the Lord of the complete call and of this prayer, which is going to be established. Give Muhammed Al-Wasilah and Al-Fdilah and raise him to a station of intercession for him on the Day of Resurrection.

Al-Wasilah is the highest position in Paradise which is granted to the prophet Muhammed particularly. Al-Fadilah is the extra degree of honour which is bestowed in him above all creation.

Quran 20 v 30: So bear patiently (O Muhammed) what they say, and glorify the praises of your Lord before the rising of the sun, and before its setting, and during some hours of the night, and at the ends of the day (an indication for the five compulsory congregational prayers) that you may become pleased with the reward which Allah shall give you.

Quran 2 v 277: Truly, those who believe and do deeds of righteousness and perform As-Salat and give Zakat, they will have their reward with their Lord. On them shall be no fear , nor shall they grieve.

Quran 8 v 2: The believers are only those who, when Allah is mentioned, feel a fear in their hearts and when this verse (this Quran) are recited unto them, they (i.e the verses) increase their faith, and they put their trust in their Lord (alone)

V 3: who perfom As-Salat, spend out of what we have provided them.

V 4: It is they who are the believers in truth. For them are grade of dignity with their Lord, and forgiveness and a generous provision (paradise)

Quran 9 v 71: The believers, men and women, are helpers, supporters, friends, protectors of one another, they enjoin on the people Islamic monotheism and all that Islam orders one to do and forbid people from Polytheism and disbelief of all kinds, and all that Islam has forbidden, they perform As-Salat and give Zakat, and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah will have His mercy on them. Surely, Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise.

Quran 27 v 1-3; …These are the verses of the Quran and (it is) a Book (that makes things) clear.

V 2; A guide (to the Right Path) and glad tidings for thr believers (who believe in the oneness of Allah)

V 3: Those who perform As-Salat and give Zakat and they believe with certainty in the Hereafter (resurrectin, recompense of their good and bad deeds, Paradise and Hell).

Quran 31 v 2-5; These are the verses of the Wise Book (the Quran)

V 3: A guide and a mercy for the good doers

V 4: Those who perform As-Salat and give Zakat and they have faith in the Hereafter with certainty.

V 5: Such are the guidance from their Lord, and such are the successful

Quran 4 v 103: …Salat is enjoined on all believers at fixed hours.

Muslim relates on the authority of Uthman (RA) that the prophet said, “whenever an obligatory solat-time comes to any Muslim, and he carries out his ablution, his humility and his bowing properly, these things atone for all his previous sins [with the exception of mortal ones], and this holds true for all time.

After faith in God, which releases one from unbelief, there is no act of worship finer and mor exalted than the solat, the abandonment of which God’s messenger termed unbelief.

Quran 3 v 31: Say (O Muhammed saw) to mankind, ‘If you (really) love Allah, then follow me (i.e Islamic monotheism, follow the Quran and the Sunnah), Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, most Merciful.

Quran 2 v 186: And when my slaves ask you (O Muhammed) concerning me, thn (answer them), I am indeed near (to them by my knowledge). I respond to the invocations of the supplicant when he calls on me (without any mediator or intercessor). So let them obey me and believe in Me, so that thy may be led aright.

# Narrated Abu Hurrairah: Allah’s Messenger said, ‘ I will declare war against him who shows hostility to a pious worshipper of mine. And the most beloved things with which my slaves come nearer to me, is what I have enjoined upon him, and my slaves keep on coming closer to Me through performing Nawafil (praying or doing extra deeds besides what is obligatory) till I love him. Then I become his sense of hearing with which he hears and his sense of sigh with which he sees and his hand with which he asks for my protection (refuge). I will protect him (i.e give him my refuge) and I do not hesitate to do anything as I hesitate to take the soul of the believer, for he hates death and I hate to disappoint him.

Quran 8 v 29: O you who believe! If you obey and fear Allah, He will grant you Furqan (criterion to judge between right and wrong) or Makhraj (i.e a way for you to get out from every difficulty) and will expiate for you your sins, and forgive you. And Allah is the owner of the Great Bounty.

In addition, Allah in some verses apart from the above, tells us the qualities of a believer and the reward for such a believer whch is paradise.

Quran 2 v 2-5: This is the Book (the Quran), whereof there is no doubt, a guidance to those who are the pious and righteous, who fear Allah much (abstain from all kinds of sins and evil deeds which He has forbidden) and love Allah much (perform all kinds of good deeds which he has ordained)

V 3: Who belive in the Ghaub (unseen i.e Belief in Allah, Angels, Holy Books, Allah’s Messengers, Day of Resurrection and All-Qadar) and perform As-Salat and spend out of what we have provided for them (i.e give Zakat, spend on themselves, their parents, children, wives etc and also give charity to the poor and also in Allah’s cause – Jihad)

V 4: And who believe in (the Quran and th Sunnah) which has been sent down to you (the Torah and the Gospels) and they believe with certainty in the Hereafter (Resurrection, recompense of their good and bad deeds, Paradise and Hell).

V 5: They are in (true) guidance from their Lord, and they are the successful!

Quran 33 v 47: And announce to the believers (in the oneness of Allah and in His Messenger) the glad tidings, that they will have from Allah a Great Bounty.

From the above verses, it is seen that there is no paradise for a non-muslim and the only way you can gain salvation/paradise is be becoming a muslim. In all honesty, it will be very hard for muslims to enter hell and very easy for them to go to paradise. In solat alone, you have 27 times reward in a congregational prayer, we pray 5 times daily (excluding the Nawafil) which is supposed to be 50 daily prayers but Muhammed (saw) got it reduced by Allah from 50 to 5 through Moses. Allah then said that the reward for the 5 daily prayers will be the reward for the 50 prayers given earlier. Now using human calculation, we have 50 (27 x number of rewards per day), and we still have superogatory prayers too in which only Allah knows how He will calculate the reward.

Every man has two angels, one by his right and the other by his left. If he does a good deed, the angel on the right hand rushes and write it for him as 10 deeds, while if the man does a bad deed, Allah grants him time to repent until the scribe register the sin in his name. The prophet said, ‘the scribe on the left hand delays registering the sin of a Muslim for six hours. If he repents (within the six hours) and seeks Allah’s forgivennes, the sin is dropped off. If he doesn’t, it is written down for him as a single sin”. But even if it is registered, if the man repents sincerely before that hour (appearance of death), the sin is taken off the records then.

Furthermore, we have the branches of faith too in which the highest and the best is to declare thatthere is no god but Allah and the lowest is to remove something harmful from the road. Shyness too is a branch of faith.

Muslims relates hadith on the authority of Uthman ibn Affan, ‘whoever dies knowing that there is no deity but Allah shall enter into Paradise.

This may of course, be after a period of punishment in Hell, in proportion to one’s sin]

it is God’s will that all people shall have the possibility of salvation, He has sent Prophets to every nation

Quran 13 v 77: For every nation there has been a guide
Quran 35 v 24: There is not a single community among whom a warner has not passed.

We do not know about all of them but

Quran 4 v 164: Some Messengers, we have spoken to you, and others we haven’t

As time passes, the original message of each prophet is distorted or lost entirely, and it becomes necessary for a new prophet to appear. Since Islam is the last religion, God has preserved its message from corruption: the doctrines, social attitudes, and methods of worship which Muslims recognize today are the same as those taught by the prophets.

I have talked on the reward for Solat, and believing in the oneness of Allah, so I will now move to Zakat

Quran 98 v 5: They were enjoined only to worship Alah, sincere in their faith in Him alone and of upright religion and to establish the Solat and the Zakat. Such is the upright religion.

# For anyone why pays Zakat on his asstes, he will be removed from the evil in thm (purify their wealth)

# I swear upon three things: Allah does not equate one who has a portion in Islam with one who does not. The portions are prayer; fasting and Zakat.

The cornerstone of the Islamic economic system is the Zakat. In an authentically Muslim society, the level of government intervention is insignificant by comparison with the situation under secular materialism, whether socialist or capitalist, since a society whose members know that they are answerable to God is largely self-regulating, spontaneous charity, channeled particularly through the family structure, renders poverty and homelessness a rarity. Nonetheless, the small levy called Zakat is taken from certain categories of liquid and investment assets, to provide for those whose families are for whatever reason – unable to support them. These funds are also used for purposes such as the liberation of slaves, and returning impoverished travelers to their countries of origin.

On fasting

Whoever fasts in the month of Ramadhan, obeying all of its limitations and guarding himself against what is forbidden, has in fact atoned for any sins he committed before it.

Whoever fasts in the month of Ramadhan with faith and seeks Allah’s pleasure and reward will have his previous sins forgiven

Muslims fast on Mondays because the prophet do fast on Mondays, it’s the day he was born and there is reward for fasting on that day.

Muslims fast on Thursdays too because the prophet fasts on Thursdays, it’s the day he received salvation, etc and there is reward for it.

Also during the month of Ramadhan, there is a particular night called Night of Majesty in which the Holy Quran was revealed. Any action done therein is better than 1,000 months. So if you are able to witness that day, that day alone is enough for you to gain paradise because you may not be able to do any deeds that will have the same reward as the 1,000 months. Besides there is no assurance that one may live up to 1,000 months with his/her present age.

In addition, fasting for 6 days in the month of Shaban (the month after Ramadhan) will be like you have fasted for a year and earn reward for same.

On pilgrimage to Mecca

The reward for Hajj is Paradise.

Hajj removes all sins committed before and returns someone as a new born baby.

We also learnt that all the prophets right from to the last prophet (saw) came with one religion, one message which is the Islam and ones of Allah. Let us ask ourselves a question: can God give two prophets two different religions? No far from that, Allah made it known that all the prophets came with the same religion which is Islam. Their coming and going is like a baton in which a prophets takes over from another with the same message.

Quran 42 v 13: He (Allah) has ordained for you the same religion (Islamic monotheism) which He ordained for Noah, and that which we have revealed to you (O Muhammed saw) and that which we ordained for Abraham, Moses, and Jesus saying YOU SHOULD ESTABLISH RELIGION (i.e to do what it orders you to do practically) AND MAKE NO DIVISIONS IN IT (religion)

Quran 2 v 130: And who turns away from the religion of Abraham (Islamic monotheism) except him who befols himself. Truly, we chose him in this world and verily in the Hereafter, he will be among the righteous.

V 131: When His Lord said to him, ‘submit (i.e be a muslim). He said, ‘I have submitted myself (as a muslim) to the Lord of the mankind, jinn and all that exists.

V 132: And this (submission to Allah, Islam) was enjoined by Abraham upon his sons and by Jacob (saying), ‘o my sons! Allah has chosen for you the (true) religion, then die not except in the faith of Islam (as muslims)

V 135: And they say, ‘be jews or Christians, then you be guided’. Say (to them O Muhammed saw), ‘nay, (we follow) only the religion of Abraham (Islam) to worship none but Allah and he was not one of the Mushrikin.

V 136: Say (O Muslims), ‘we believe in Allah and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob and to Al-Asbat (the offspring of the twelve sons of Jacob) and that which has been given to Moses and Jesus and that which has been given to the Prophets from their Lord, WE MAKE NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN ANY OF THEM and to Him we have submitted (IN ISLAM).

Quran 3 v 83: Do they seek other than the religion of Allah (Islam) while in Him submitted all creatures in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwillingly. And to Him shall they all be returned.

V 84: Say (O Muhammed saw), ‘we believe in Allah and in what has been sent down to us, and what was sent down to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the offspring of the tweve sons of Jacob and what was given to Moses, Jesus and the Prophets from their Lord. WE MAKE NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN ONE ANOTHER AMONG THEM and to Him 9Allah) we have submitted (in Islam).

So my sister, it is seen that salvation can only be achieved by being a muslim, following the pillars and believe in the articles of faith. We have seen that all the prophets came with only one religion which is Islam. Islam is the only religion that touches every aspect of life and Quran is the only book that did same too. Muhammed is the last and the seal of all prophets in which no prophet will come after him and no book will be revealed after him.

Quran 33 v 40: Muhammed (saw) is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Messenger of Allah and the last (end) of the prophets. And Allah is Ever-All Aware of everything.


Jesus hangs Christians with a verse but they will never understand the meaning.

Mathew 7 v 13-14: Go in through the narrow gate, because the gate to hell iswide and the road that leads to it is easy and there are many who travel it. But the gate to life is narrow and the way that leads to it is hard, and there are few people who find it.

Satan knows that it is very hard for him to turn people away from Allah by telling them that there is no God, so he is using Christianity as a trap in misleading people. There is nothing special in being’born again’, you just believe that jesus died for you and continue doing good deeds (probably). Christianity is the wide road that leads to hell because you experience no hardship being a christian, no solat, no ablution, fasting in not compulsory, you don’t have to pray five times daily, you don’t need to purify yourself, etc, just believe and you are saved. But Islam is the narrow gate which few people are entering. In Islam, you have to avoid alcoho, strong odour, purify yourself, ablution before you can worship him etc. If not for the grace of God, Islam seems hard to practice and that is why it is the narrow gate that leads to salvation and few are practicing it while Christianity is the wide gate that leads to hell and people are going in large numbers.

So sister, a word is enough for the wise, do not be deceived, truth stands from falsehood. No Islam, no Paradise.


Shalom

@batu


Na wa for you o. I know that I am not intelligent and that is why I am putting the questions across to you, professor batu

wWhy not shun abuse and think for a while. I am neither here to ridicule Jesus as Christians have been doing unknowingly nor to argue in order to win but to bring out the truth for people to see because he who sees the truth and accept, does so for his soul and whoever reject the truth, does so at his own peril.

Why are you speaking from both sides of your mouth?

You first claimed that Jews starts their counting from sunset to sunset and later said Jesus used it symbolically.

We all know that Jews and those in those area starts their counting from sunset to sunset. Now Jesus was laid in the tomb on Friday Night, but wasn’t there on Sunday morning. Meaning that he spent on Friday, a night and no day, On Saturday, he spent a day and a night while on Sunday, he was nowhere to be found. This amounts to a day and two nights.

Let us put religion aside, am inviting Muslims, Christians, atheist etc to help us in arriving at 3 days and three nights.

Jesus knew you people well that you will try bending the verse to suit you, clarified the sign that he will spend three days and three nights in the belly of earth just like Jonah did. So let me have your calculation of three days and three nights. Jesus being buried on Friday will not amount to 3 days and 3 nights.

When you are through with that, we will shed light on the prophecy of Jonah, why jesus gave that sign of all the signs he might be having, the processes involved, did Jonah die in the belly of the fish and did he die when vomited and compare that with Jesus too.

Stay glued.

If you are saying the bible is complete

1. which is complete, the protestants (66 books) or catholics (73 books)

2. If the bible is complete, where are these verses in Revised Standard Version, Good News Bible, New International Bible, Living Bible Versions and other bibles apart from KJV

a.Mathew 17 v 21 (b) mark 11 v 26 (c) acts 8 v 37 (d) Mathew 17 v 21 (e) Mathew 21 v 44 (f) Mathew 23 v 14 etc

3. If the bible is complete

a.
Numbers 21:14 Wherefore it is said in the book of the wars of the Lord, What he did in the Red sea, and in the brooks of Arnon,

where is the Book of the Wars of the Lord?

b.Joshua 10:13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

2 Samuel 1:18 (Also he bade them teach the children of Judah the use of the bow: behold, it is written in the book of Jasher.)

where is the Book of Jasher

c.1 Chronicles 29:29 Now the acts of David the king, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Samuel the seer, and in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the book of Gad the seer,

where is the Book of Samuel the Seer and Gad the Seer?

d.1 Chronicles 29:29 Now the acts of David the king, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Samuel the seer, and in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the book of Gad the seer,…

where is the book of Nathan the Prophet?

e. 2 Chronicles 9:29 Now the rest of the acts of Solomon, first and last, are they not written in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the prophecy of Ahijah the Shilonite, and in the visions of Iddo the seer against Jeroboam the son of Nebat?

Where is the prophecy of Ahijah and Shilonite and the visions of Iddo the Seer?

f.2 Chronicles 12:15 Now the acts of Rehoboam, first and last, are they not written in the book of Shemaiah the prophet, and of Iddo the seer concerning genealogies? And there were wars between Rehoboam and Jeroboam continually.

Where is the Book of Shemaiah, the prophet?

g.2 Chronicles 20:34 Now the rest of the acts of Jehoshaphat, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Jehu the son of Hanani, who is mentioned in the book of the kings of Israel.

Where is the Book of Jehu?

h.2 Chronicles 26:22 Now the rest of the acts of Uzziah, first and last, did Isaiah the prophet, the son of Amoz, write.

Where is the Acts of Uzziah?

Let me stop here

IS THE QURAN WRONG IN STATING THAT THE TORAH WAS LOST OR CORRUPTED?

@stimulus




I couldn't help laughing out loud on reading that line, because it seemed so naturally applicable to you. Most of the verses you tried to twist will never make sense to you that are inclined to falsehood and are not ready to verify what you have been carrying and preaching all these while. Indeed, we don't want your case to be like that of Hosea 4 v 6.

Na wa o. Truth will always be bitter. I haver verified while in the darkness and am telling you now that there is no salvation for you unless you are a muslim



All the verses you quoted above, particularly Isaiah 9:6.

Let me have your own interpretation of Isaiah 9 v 6.



Please keep reading the Bible, and then you will see that all your accusations and vexations are quite suited to the Qur'an itself.

Can we compare the chapters, verses, stories etc in the two books?


Even if you use the Qur'an, your argument will run into a brick wall; because the Qur'an does not tell you what it does not know - and to that point excatly, neither Muhammad nor the Qur'an knew anything about the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Why arguing what you failed in defending. your bible never supported the crucifixion and there is nowhere in the OT crucifixion was mentioned.


Na today? Several times I have supplied the weblink from which you lift your "questions". The only difference is that you dressed them up a little and called them your own.


Thats your belief and you are entitled to your opinion. So the links have been providing me with all the verses.

@Pilgrims

I will divide your questions into two

1. On the 99 names of Allah

2. If the names do appear in the Holy Quran


1.

Allah does not in the Holy Quran say that His name should be 99. What really happen with reference to the names you call 99 names are attributes accorded to Him. Allah alone bear the names and the names shouldnt be termed same as Allah. Allah is quite different from the other 99 attributes as the meaning of God is different from Messiah, King, Lord etc so also is Allah different from other names or attributes. In addition, the names do not have same meaning as Allah and people share other attributes or names with Allah but no one shares the name Allah with Him, its reserved for only Him.


Holy Quran 17:110 : SAY: "CALL UPON ALLAH,
OR CALL UPON RAHMAN
BY WHATEVER NAME YE CALL UPON HIM (it is well):
FOR TO HIM BELONG THE MOST BEAUTIFUL NAMES


Hope I have explained? Let me move to your next question and I will answer you with just only one verse for every name.


2. I will answer your question with verses from the Holy Quran to show that the names or attributes are mentioned in the Quran. I will give you just five out of the names


a.

Al-Khabir (All aware) Quran 64 v 8: Therefore, believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammed saw) an d in the Light (this Quran) which we have sent down. And Allah is ALL-AWARE of what you do.

So if you check the Arabic Quran, you will the word "Al-Khabhir" there.

b.

Al-Alim (All-knowing) Quran 22 v 59: Truly, I will make them enter an entrance with which they shall be well-pleased and verily, Allah indeed is ALL-KNOWING, most forbearing


c.

Al-Quadir (Possessor of Power and Authority) And Allah has created you and then He will cause you to die and of you there are some who are sent back t5o serility, so that they know nothihng after having known (much). Truly! Allah is All-Knowing, ALL-POWERFUL

d.

Al-Hamid (Praiseworthy) Quran 22 v 64: To him belongs all that is in the heavens and all that on the earth. And verily, Allah - He is Rich (free of all needs), WORTHY OF PRAISE.

e.

Al-Quawiyy (Powerful) Quran 22 v 74: They have not estimated Allah His Righful estimate. Verily, Allah is ALL- STRONG, ALL-MIGHTY.

Hope you are satisfied?

Is the meaning of God the same as , Father, Lord, king, Redeemer, Saviour etc?

After that, I will move on to if we have the names in the Quran

@nossycheeks


[color=#990000]#1. Was Easter celebrated in the bible? Because we all know that the bible was written after the demise of Jesus.

Blockhead, was el da mumu and el da filtri celebrated in the Koran? Start your answers from there? I will provide you with the answers after your response!#[/color]

Thats your trademark, so I am not moved at all yet you will claim that the insult is being started by Muslims.



[color=#990000]
#Our references are from the Bible and not your Koran. Jesus was crucified!#[/color]

I have been giving you verses from your same bible too. Dont worry, I will ask three of you questions on his crucifixion and also on the issue of the 3rd day.



#And you are so confused that you are confusing the Passover and Easter. At Passover, Jesus celebrated his last supper with his disciples while he rose on Easter (3rd day after he was buried)#.[

Am not confused, I asked you a question and you have answered me.



And all his prophesy, including that of his rising from the Death has been and are being fulfilled


Can I have the prophesies?




@Alexis


The man is trying to ridicule our Lord and Saviour. Thank you for enlightening us with one of your stories you learnt at your imam feet. In all fairness, if indeed christianity is a pagan religion, how come by the name of Jesus, blind muslims eyes are open, deaf muslim ears are open, crippled muslims can walk? Or abi your all powerful allah, the founder of the "true" religion can't heal them?#[


Brother, nobody is ridiculing your Jesus, I only asked questions and Christians have been doing same. So christianity is not a pagan religion? Havent you been reading 'pagan influence in christianity or if you need sites and information too, I can provide you. Is Jesus really his name. Brother, as to the issue of opening the eyes of the blind, we have them at Kano street, Railway crossing, Sabo and they are ever ready to denounce their faith if they are muslims and we have christians there too that are still blind, deaf etc. Pastor Oyakhilome and his counterparts, Bonnke, T.B Joshua should have reduced the number of  handicapped by now.



#Jesus was crucified, rose from the dead and ascended into heaven, it was the talk of the town and recorded and attested by many people. Yet 600 years later - islam came out and said it was a lie.#

How many people witnessed the crucifixion and the resurrection? Were his disciples present?


Now tell me - who is foolish? The koran claims that it was there before the beginning of the world, that everything in it is perfect; if that was so, how come allah forgot to inform his muslim faithfuls that Jesus was raised from the dead and that at the name of Jesus, every knee must bow?


Jesus never died let alone being raised from the dead.



@Davidylan



#Who is allah? From hence is he coming from to be "clear on a fact" he has no idea about? For a "god" who only surfaced more than 200yrs AFTER the event he claims to be "clear about", his statements need to be taken with a pinch of salt. #

Dont worry. As we proceed, we will know if Jesus is clear about the whole issue or not.



 #There must be something that scares allah about the crucifiction that made him repeat "they killed him not" twice in a single verse! Why is he so particular about whether Jesus was killed or not? Why has he nothing to say about the other gods that dot the religious landscape?  #

Brother Allah is particular about the death because of you. On that, Jesus will deny you that he never knew you. He is also particular about the crucifixion in order to let u know that it is the work of satan and that Jesus was never killed but made to look like that to you christians. None of you has enough evidence but following only conjecture and that is the more reasons verses on crucifixion are contradiction each other because nobody witnesses it. It was made to look like that.



  Allah rejects "savagery"?  
Why is allah so unstable? How can he reject human sacrifice in the book of Genesis and yet encourage suicide bombers disguised as martyrs in the 21st century?
Does allah understand the meaning of the word "savagery"? What of all the banditry exhibited by his prophet? What of all the bloodletting being propagated by his adherents the world over? Sept 11, July 7, Bali, Nairobi, Sudan, Ethiopia, Iran, Lebanon, Syria, Gombe? And allah claims to reject savagery?

Dont worry, we will shed more light on terrorism, ur definition, origin,  causes, etc when the time comes


Quote from: babs787 on April 03, 2007, 09:53 AM
1. Was Easter celebrated in the bible? Because we all know that the bible was written after the demise of Jesus.

Was Muhammad's birthday celebrated in the quran?

You will never see it there because the Quran is only the words of Allah. If you dont know, we dont kill rams, cows, chicken etc like you normally do and there is nowhere that says Jesus was born on 25th. On that day, muslims seclude themselves in the mosque, listen to sermons, eg life history of the prophet, and we equally send prayers to him. We dont worship Muhammed as you worship Jesus. We are very careful as to how we honour him. The Holy Prophet said:

"Do not exaggerate in praising me as the christians do in praising isa son of Maryam, for I am only a slave of Allah. So call me the Slave of Allah and His Messenger.



Quote from: babs787 on April 03, 2007, 09:53 AM
3.   What day was Jesus Christ tied to a stake or crucified?
4.   what day did he rise?

I thought allah was "clear on the fact" that they killed him not?  


I need your response


Quote from: babs787 on April 03, 2007, 09:53 AM
One of the things to know a true prophet is that whenever he speaks or prophesies, it will surely come to pass (fulfilled)

 Please mention 3 prophecies that mohammed prophesied that came to pass

Answer my question first. This is the question again:

5.   Did Jesus fulfill the three days and three nights prophecy of Jonah.




Now to the three of you. I am not clear about the following questions, so I need your input

1. I saw a post by someone saying he was crucified publicly, did his disciples witness the crucifixion?


2. Christians say that Jesus and the disciples were aware of what he came to do, if that is the case, why did the disciples not believe that he had risen from the dead?


3. If the disciples knew that Jesus had to rise, why didn’t they return to Jerusalem to see the resurrection?


4. Is there anywhere in the bible (both OT and NT) that Jesus foretold his 'crucifixion'?


5. Where was jesus crucified, Outside Jerusalem or in Jerusalem?


@Batu

Chei na wa o. Ignorance is really a disease.


Because in Sura 4:157, 'allah' stated that Jesus was not crucified, but later allah said in the same passage (which you did not write) that 'it' (i.e. allah) made Simon to take up the 'form' or 'appearance' of Jesus, and that it was Simon that was crucified and not Jesus.

Let me have your verse in full please


In Isreal, up till this moment, the "Jewish" tradition or cultural timing is that: "a new day starts at sundown". As such, the Friday (by Greek custom) of crusifixion actually started at sundown of preceeding Thursday, up to sundown friday i.e. Day 1!. Day 2 started at sundown friday up to sundown saturday; and Day 3 started at sundown saturday. So, do you see now that Jesus in his prophecy to the Jews of Israel will definitely use the jewish description of day since that is the culturally understaood and accepted way.

I dont want to go into the full story about the sign of Jonah but will when you are able to refute my claim.


You are really a professor  

Now my professor said Jewish timing starts at sundown. So if the day starts at thursday as said by our professor, lets dig deep into it to see if the calculation is really correct.

Jesus said 3 days and 3 nights. So lets see if the days amount to that.

Our professor said Jews start their new day as from sundown meaning that they started their new day on thursday:

Easter Week                     Days                                        Nights

Thursday Night                   Nil                                          One Night
(Placed in the tomb
as put by professor
Batu)


Friday-Saturday                One Day                               One Night



Saturday- Sunday               One day                               Nil


So brother, calculate for me pls  


Thursday -Friday                  One night and one Day

Friday - Saturday              One day and One Night

Saturday - Sunday           One Night and no day.

When they got there, they found that he had risen on Sunday Morning.

Please solve the arithmetic connudrum