₦airaland Forum

jason123:
Beaf, to be honest, I understand what you mean but do you not think the statement above (bold) would be difficult? Even if Nigeria splits (north and south), do you not think the minorities in the South would scream marginalisation, domination of igbos and yorubas etc? Who would such a country work?

In my opinion, I think what the North needs is just massive educational programs. Once they are educated, their leaders would not be able to use the religion card to get votes. Also, i think going back to regional governments would be the best bet! Although, when a region becomes too powerful and has nothing to gain from Nigeria, it might break away. Also, the SS cannot complain because they collect the highest allocation from the oil revenue but it is being used to enrich the political elite's pocket so we cannot blame Nigeria or the North

Can you see the country is in a dilemma . Just to add, regional system promotes tribalism (the SW is a living example).

What do you think the solution would be? I want to know your answer. BTW, the idea of SS republic etc is flawed because they would also encounter these problems.

You have got it all wrong. If anybody wants out of Nigeria, or a more equitable Nigeria, why would they try to repeat the same failings in the current set up? I don't get your reasoning.

My mantra is true federalism which to a very large extent, negates ethnicity or ethnic population and at the same time, increases citizen representation at every level by several magnitudes over what we now have. The entire constitution will have to be rewritten to accomodate this.
It should all be about the citizen, not their ethnicity and the easiest way to achieve this is to give every ethnic group the same representation at the centre (same number of senators). Within the ethnic groups themselves, they can have the number of LG's that their population requires; the House of reps will also be population driven. The benefit of such a system is that, no ugly law passed by the house based on the population of a section (eg sharia) will be able to pass through the Senate (which will be based on representation.

It will be impossible to marginalise any group with the above innovation. And with the other benefits of true federalism, we will be guaranteed a rapidly developing and focussed country, not the chaotic rat hole we now inhabit.

[quote author=Kilode?! link=topic=578293.msg7455519#msg7455519 date=1294089239]LOL and SMH@ our prospects but;

I'm confident we have a good imperial future with warriors like Beaf and my Ijaw brothas, it's time we stop the rancour and look at how we can re-colonise little little irritants like Gambia and Ghana.

BTW, we will post the scenario on NL. Yes we can![/quote]Dude, ND people are only tired of being treated like dirt. There is no country in the World where citizens are exploited in the fashion the ND is in Nigeria, in fact other nations are appalled by it; that is why the ND kept cropping up in discussions throughout the BP spill in the US. But did Nigerians care or even feel any shame?

What we are asking for is so simple. Let us practice true federalism, it is the only govt framework that can bring rapid development and equity to Nigeria.
You've got to wonder why there are such staunch enemies of true federalism in the core North, this is a link to an article in which Jubril Aminu ambushes every sensible progressive thought on Nigeria, I posted it in 2009:
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-358828.0.html

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7455380#msg7455380 date=1294087714]The war games stuff they do is pretty standard. I'm a bit surprised they post it online and such, but I'd imagine that this is because it is lower level stuff. Higher level stuff (response in case of say a conflict with China, Russia, North Korea, etc) is probably kept strictly under wraps.

But 3rd world countries like Nigeria and the like that could be subdued with only 20k soldiers or so? May as well make your plans and post it online After all, what can we do about it anyway?[/quote]It was not only put online, but publicised at the least opportunity over and over again. The US hated the Islamist Yar Adua govt and the increasingly alarming direction Nigeria was tilting in. I believe it was put as a warning that the US was willing and ready to march in at the slightest notice.
The US also denied they were about to march into Abuja when the cabal were making the country look like a crap yard not worth pissing in. But someone had leaked it to the press that they were readying an invasion force. There is also word that they directly called specific top soldiers and gave them the low down of the personal calamities any thoughts of a coup would herald.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7455350#msg7455350 date=1294087446]Lol.

US doesn't give a sh1t about any almajiris, child marriage, etc. Northern Nigeria is a useful tool for enforcing their agenda, nothing more, nothing less. Sentiment has nothing to do with it; they aren't supporting the current structure of Nigeria out of some fond feelings for the Hausa man.[/quote]You mean after the huge amounts of problems the US has caused in the Middle East, you think they don't care? The wikileaks talks between Jonathan and their ambassador that showed how concerned the US is about free and fair elections should be a pointer. They want a modern, equitable Nigerian society, not one packed with unfulfilled almajiri's and all sorts of other bigots that might ultimately target the free flow of oil. You will note how desperate the Americans were about supervising the elections and supplying voting software; it really upset them that Yar Adua and Iwu didn't give them what they wanted. It also really upset them that Yar Adua's govt tilted sharply toward Iran, Saudi and China.

The current govt in Nigeria is exactly what the  is happy with; a son of the soil who can pacify folk from the SS and begin the introduction of civil behaviour and law and order (no more gra gra id!ots). Watch out for massive changes in PDP too, there will be little space for ethnocentric champions and crude politicians after GEJ's 2011 victory.

I don't see the US's interest in Nigeria as a bad thing, we need a lot of help and a partner that can offer that help, similar to the experience of South Korea. We just need to outgrow our ethnic bigotry and begin to embrace merit. The relationship will be what we make of it.

No coup plotting bastar'd will ever rule this country again.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7455314#msg7455314 date=1294087100]@Beaf: My bad, you are correct. Neither group I mentioned is listed as a terrorist org.[/quote]Now, put that in the context in which it took only a few hours for Obama himself to speak out on the Abuja bombing, for the US head of Homeland Security to declare the act terrorist and for FBI and MOSSAD boots to hit Abuja soil.

Gayigaskia:
Since when being a fighter has become a bad behavior?

When they begin using bombs on innocent people and when they employ Boko Haram to burn babies.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7454962#msg7454962 date=1294082598]@Rousseau: To some extent you are correct. But I don't think the US even fears one ethnic group alone. If Yoruba act up, hire Hausa and Igbo to put them down. If Hausa act up, have the other two put them down (pretend GEJ wins and these Boko Haram types cause trouble. GEJ could then wipe them out w/o the US intervening to help the North.) And we saw what happened when the Igbos and the "strongest army in Black Africa" (pardon me if I misremember the quote from Ojukwu   ) tried to cause wahala.

The scenario that would truly threaten the interests of the US is if two or more of the big three agreed on something. Of course, this isn't likely to happen, since all three of us dislike each other (at least, imo).

@Beaf: Iirc, Boko Haram and MEND are both considered terrorist groups by the US. OPC got removed from the list recently, if I'm not mistaken.[/quote]Dude, you are just arging from a sentimental point of view. MEND has never ever been considered terrorist by the United states, rather MEND is classified as a group of interest (find out what that means). It is very easy to find the list of groups the US considers terrorist, I would have supplied the link, but I honestly can't be bothered. It is high time Nigerians learnt to see clearly and stop being blinded by ethnic supremacist considerations.

I repeat, MEND has never ever been considered a terrorist group by the US. What is instructive, however is the speed with which the US and its staunch ally, Israel rallied to GEJ's support after the Abuja bombing. For the first time, an incident in Nigeria was termed terrorist by the very highest organs of US security. . . and it wasn't MEND.

The only reason the US will not support an outright breakaway of the oil bearing areas from the rest of the country, is that they are likely to consider the South as an important block to put down Islamic terrorism in the North, bring modernisation, eliminate crude practises like child marriages and educate almajiri's. These things are immensely valuable to the US who do not want any religious or ethnic bigots disturbing their most important new source of oil (they are diversting from the Middle East, cos the area is too troublesome). The North is unlikely to see power for the next generation if that calculation is correct.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7454162#msg7454162 date=1294071760]So I googled, here is what I found:

http://allafrica.com/stories/200908140153.html
http://www.army.mil/-news/2008/05/07/9017-unified-quest-focuses-on-future-persistent-conflict/
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008/05/war-game-minus/



Here is a quote from the second article
Beaf dude, are you 100% sure that if the US inteferes in Nigeria, it will be to help you and your boys? The language they are using, YOU are the red team, not me (by me, I mean the Yoruba, since that group [and our allies] are mostly what I'm interested in.) I don't have a terrorist organization blowing up stuff in the ND, Abuja, you do. I'm not the one kidnapping foreign oil workers, that is you. I'm not threatening to overthrow the government if the election goes poorly, that is you and your boys. . .

A quote from the first article:
Is there any language here indicating that the US gives a damn about anything in the ND but the oil? They don't seem interest in you, your cause, your people, just securing the resources there. All they care about is "stability."

Stability doesn't equal equity or justice. Hell, stability might mean an even worse situation for the ND than before. Or are there some articles and analyses that I have missed? I've seen nothing so far that supports your position. Of course, if I've missed something, please point it out for me.[/quote]The red team is the core North. Thats as plain as daylight. All Nigeria's terrorists are in the core North.

nasgrz:
America's Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) has offered to help Nigeria in the on-going investigation of 2011 New Year Eve bombings and others. Personally, I don't buy the idea of giving them full role in the investigation but they should collaborate with our security agencies in fishing out the culprits. Fellow NL what is/are view(s) concerning this issue? Pls I need concrete arguments.

http://dailytrust.dailytrust.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9295:bomb-blastfbi-agents-head-for-nigeria&catid=2:lead-stories&Itemid=8

Sadly, you forgot to add that MOSSAD is also in Abuja.

The only people scared of the FBI are the core Northerners who have threatening violence that will make the country ungovernable. That is why their mouthpiece, DailyTrust is running scared.

If they wish to continue bombing and Boko Haram tactics, they not only see FBI and MOSSAD fishing their arses out, they will also be subjected to bombing attacks by US drones, just like in Yemen and Pakistan. Bloody fckers!

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=578293.msg7453939#msg7453939 date=1294069315]@Beaf: Hard for me to tell if your post is parody/sarcasm or not.

Just in case you were serious, that is not how the US operates.

In any such battle in Nigeria, the US will stand idly by the side until the winner is clear, then join that side (but not even with troops or military resources, just words.)

They will not get directly involved.[/quote]Go to the AFRICOM website and search for the 2015 scenario. That was a full military rehearsal for an anarchic Nigeria, anything else is guesswork.
Nigeria is the 4th top oil supplier to the US, and is set to overtake Saudi Arabia in the very near future. That should put the ND's position in US foreign policy in perspective:
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

The SS is Nigeria as far as the World is concerned. Better to try resolving SS issue's than any ethnic think they can bully the SS, but Nigerians like to live in fantasy land and avoid straightforward matters.

Dude, I surely wasn't being sarcastic. The US will obliterate any doubting Thomases that imagine the ND is free game, they have been getting impatient for quite sometime now and the Abuja bombs might just be the required catalyst. The ND is viewed as part of United States security.

Abagworo:
Pray not for war because it is pain without gain.That said SS cannot fight the rest of Nigeria for more than a week because every other ethnic group will deny any affiliations with Ijaw and even join the bigger Naija to massacre them.The Biafran war should be a lesson to anyone nursing such ambition.Two days of steady bombardment with cluster bombs will win the war.

Have you heard of Tomahawk missile? It is a long-range, all-weather, ground hugging cruise missile. The last time I looked, the US had zillions, while Nigeria had zilch.
Anybody attacking the Niger Delta will very quickly learn the meaning of hell.
Rather than be fools, people would have watched the speed with which Obama himself, mentioned the Abuja bombs (less than 24 hours) and the speed with which the American head of Homeland Security granted an interview, during which she described the Abuja bombing as terrorism.

We are nobody's slaves.

In fact, I easily see the Igbo's, Middle Belt and huge chunks of Ondo state (possibly the whole of Yorubaland even) joining the ND in case of conflict. The winning side will be very very clear.

It is a sin to mess with oil.

[img]http://www.militarypictures.info/d/150-2/tomahawk_launch.jpg[/img]

www.nairaland.com/attachments/317132_ROTFLM_gif474f1382cac6aa709538e551d507cbfc

For instance, it emerged in some quarters recently that some of those who voted for the candidature of Alhaji Atiku Abubakar as candidate of the NPFL did so because of the expectation that even though he could lose the presidential primaries, he could “fight tough and dirty.”

In our brand new lingo, fighting tough and dirty means applying any means including bombing and terrorism. We need to know the boundaries of “fighting tough and dirty.”

No be only FBI de Abuja, MOSSAD sef full ground! The bombers and their masters are in for a tough game. Bloody terrorists!

[size=14pt]North, PDP and 2011 presidential election [/size]
Written by Taiwo Adisa
Monday, 03 January 2011
https://tribune.com.ng/images/stories/website_images/yaradua4.jpg
Late Umaru Yar'Adua
Group Politics Editor, Taiwo Adisa, examines the push by some Northern political establishments to seize the presidency through the 2011 election.

THE bid to retain the political power of the country in the hands of northerners has remained constant on the agenda of northern political elite since the dawn of the current democratic dispensation. Though the June 12, 1993 election debacle slowed down that quest in the post General Sani Abacha administration, leading to the installation of President Olusegun Obasanjo as a civilian leader in 1999, the northern political class sees the development as a temporary setback. They were even said to have backed Obasanjo as president in 1999 with the belief that the former military head of state would yield power to a northerner at the slightest request.

While such an attitude, which tends to demean the intelligence of the other parts of the country is not a widespread view in the North, the vocal few who hold on to the feeling have never relented in the perpetual search for power, ostensibly in the name of the North.

Such thinking was identified at the base of the power struggle that characterised the latter part of the administration of the late President Umaru Yar’Adua. While Yar’Adua was ill and rendered incommunicado by his ailment, a section of his followers continued to tell the nation that the man was recuperating fast and was set to return to public life. The essence of the deceits was to continuously hold on to power, prevent the ascendancy of Dr. Goodluck Jonathan as Acting President and then exercise presidential authority by proxy.

The fear among those who were afraid of the ascendancy of Jonathan as Acting President in line with constitutional provisions was deeply rooted in the ethnic configuration of power. They feared that Jonathan’s emergence as Acting President could eventually lead to his emergence as substantive president and the relocation of power to the South. So, notwithstanding the constitutional provisions that the sick president needed to transfer power to the Vice-President in acting capacity, Yar’Adua’s handlers politicised that provision and even got court judgments to domesticate the Vice-President as a lame duck Acting President.

The demise of Yar’Adua on May 6, 2010 and eventual inauguration of Jonathan as president ensured the change in calculations. It meant that power had returned to the South once again, three years after Obasanjo’s eight year rule. The generality of the North felt shortchanged that a man who should represent its interest in power supposedly for eight years had been succumbed to the power of death. It also meant that a reconfiguration of the power structure should ordinarily take place to accommodate the emerging realities.

The Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) which produced the president, however, failed to seize the bull by the horn, allowing the mooted tones to turn into loud voices. While many could not say it before May 6 that the real reason why some political actors were preventing Dr. Goodluck Jonathan from attaining the highest office even while it was obvious that President Yar’Adua was incapacitated was the fear of the North losing the slot, the voices started coming into the open immediately Jonathan got into office.

He faced the quick and recurrent question of whether he would contest in 2011 or not even before the expiration of the seven-day mourning period declared by the government for the late Yar’Adua.

Eventually, Jonathan faced the question and tackled it in September 2010, when he declared his candidature for the 2011 election. It was a big jolt for those scheming for the North. Though most of the actors appear to be working for personal gains, they easily couch the struggle as a northern agenda. The aspirants saw an opening for their agitation in the constitution of the Peoples Democratic Party, which recognizes the zoning of political offices. The section indicates that the party shall ensure that political offices are rotated among all segments of the country in such a way that no particular segment would be left out of the government structure.

Four Northern aspirants including former military President, General Ibrahim Babangida, former Vice President Atiku Abubakar, former National Security Adviser (NSA), General Aliyu Gusau and the Kwara State governor, Dr. Bukola Saraki, pulled themselves together in search of a consensus candidate for the North. Under the umbrella of the Northern Political Leaders Forum (NPFL), led by the former Finance Minister, Alhaji Adamu Ciroma, the aspirants believed that they could score the votes to defeat incumbent President Goodluck Jonathan.

They also believed that the zoning policy of the PDP was sacrosanct and perhaps superior to the 1999 Constitution, which ultimately guides the conduct of political office. The constitution does not preclude any member of the polity from contesting election at anytime, even though it recognizes, in line with the federal character principle, that government positions must not be monopolised by a section of the country in a way that will perpetuate such section in office at the detriment of others.

In pursuant of their belief in zoning, the NPFL named Atiku Abubakar as its preferred candidate in November and asked the other three to step down for him. The trio also publicly agreed to back Atiku, thus began the titanic battle for the PDP ticket ahead of 2011 election.

[b]Notwithstanding the persistence of the zoning advocates on the PDP constitutional provision, there remain some unanswered questions relating to their quest. There is no reference to the fact that the PDP constitution zoned presidency to the North from 2007 to 2015 since such cannot be seen in any part of the books. There are also questions as to why the 2007 presidential primaries of the party was contested by candidates from North and South, whereas certain elements of the party continue to hold on to zoning. There are also questions as to why former Vice-President Atiku Abubakar would join the 2003 presidential race against his former boss, President Olusegun Obasanjo, if it was sancrosant then that the seat was zoned to the South. Again, there appears an omission on the part of the drafters of the PDP constitution to state categorically what a vice-president who takes over power from a late president would do in the face of a zoning arrangement.

The failure to clearly state what happens when a president dies in office is today the Archilles’ heel of the acclaimed zoning war.

While the 1999 Constitution clearly states that a sitting vice-president would take office on the death of a president, the PDP constitution is silent on this scenario, which played out in May 2010. But zoning advocates have ignored the begging questions. They want bite to be given to their interpretation of the PDP constitution and they apparently slugged it out with the opposing views at the National Executive Committee meeting of the party in August 2010. At the meeting, however, the party resolved that it would adhere to the constitutional provision, giving an incumbent president the right to contest election with any other candidate.[/b]

That decision, which set the tone for the actions of the NPLF and emergence of Atiku and the choice of the zoning advocates cleared the route for Jonathan to slug it out with others. On the strength of the series of arguments on both sides of the zoning debate tension has been raised. Politicians are behaving as if one section of the country does not belong to the power caucus and that it is only by locating power in a region that zoning can be said to exist.

But while much of the blame lies with the politicians who are merely fanning personal embers in deperate bid to outwit their opponents from the power equation, the PDP, which continues to speak from both sides of the mouth on this issue should also share the blame. If the party has got its acts together, nothing stops it from redrawing the zoning policy in favour of the incumbent president if it feels that such an order should take precedent. The party can then proceed to amend its laws to firmly take care of future situations.

While the PDP has failed to take firm decisions as regards the arguments, it has allowed tempers to rise and festered a reminder of the divisive politics often readily played by some politicians.

[size=14pt]For instance, it emerged in some quarters recently that some of those who voted for the candidature of Alhaji Atiku Abubakar as candidate of the NPFL did so because of the expectation that even though he could lose the presidential primaries, he could “fight tough and dirty.”

Those who claimed to be in the know said that while members of the NPFL were confronted with the choice of the former vice-president, they defended the choice by claiming that he is a man who will not necessarily apply the kind of caution some others would apply in search of the presidential ticket of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP).[/size]

It was learnt that series of inquiries followed the announcement of Atiku as the consensus presidential hopeful of the Adamu Ciroma-led NPFL by stakeholders from the North and that [size=14pt]those who volunteered information declared that one basic reason for the announcement of Atiku was that where General Ibrahim Babangida would not want to go beyond “certain boundaries” in pursuit of his ambition, Atiku could bypass any political boundary.

A source quoted one of the respondents as saying: “Babangida would have provided much vigour than Atiku to challenge President Goodluck Jonathan; but it is believed that Babangida would not want to bypass certain political boundaries,” further observing that the members feel that the region needs a man who could “fight tough and dirty” against the incumbent in the presidential race.

It is sad that some political actors would ascribe such dimensions to the presidential race, especially when those in question are highly regarded. But such is the gain of indecision of the PDP and perhaps the dynamics of political calculations of those concerned.[/size]

http://tribune.com.ng/index.php/politics/15547-north-pdp-and-2011-presidential-election

[quote author=nwaigbo_mg link=topic=577593.msg7451111#msg7451111 date=1294016180][b]THE CHALLENGES OF HETROGENEOUS NATION
i laugh when i hear something like NIGER NIGER REPUBLIC. I wonder who and who that make up this would-be prosperous nation. i am sometimes temted to ask questions like these: when did the romance between ijaw and ibibio/anang/efik started, when did ijaw and isekiri became best of friendS, when did ijaw and urhobo become good neighbours, when did isekiri and isoko started seeing themselves as one people, when did the ijaw and ogoni stoped fighting themselve. anyway it is a long story. go to PH, ijaws and ikwerres are killing and maiming themselve all in the name of claiming ownership of PH. urhobo and ijaw have fought each other bitterLY all in the name of claiming ownership of warri. warri has been divided into 4 LGs to accommodate the two groups but yet, they are still fighting. okrika man, bonny man, obobo man degema man KALABARI MAN, all will claim to be ijaw it comes to Nigerian politics but in their minds they believe otherwise. i strongly belive that if NIGER DELTA REPUBLIC SUCCEEDS, IBIBIO/ANANG/EFIK people will never join them, they may join the neighbour and kinsmen the igbo or REMAIN ON THEIR OWN. IF NIGER DELTA REPUBLIC SUCCEEDS,,,,,,,, IT will not last long, because all minority groups will not tolerate another being superior or dominating them. they may decide to go their separate way, giving room for the creation of another 10 nation within NIGER DELTA WITH THE POPULATION OF, PROBABLY, IJAW REPUBLIC 5MILLION, EFIK/ANANG/IBIBIO REPUBLIC (AKWA IBOM AND CROSS RIVER) 15 MILLION, URHOBO REPUBLIC IMILLION, IKWERRWE (WITH THEIR BROTHERS) 5 MILLION, OGONI repulic ( AND THEIR BROTHERS) 250,000, ISOKO REPUBLIC, 200,000 IKSEKIRI REPUBLIC 500,000, OTHER REPUBLIC 2MILLION, I STROGLY BELIEVE ND REPUBLIC CAN'T WORK BECAUSE IT IS NOT HOMOGENEOUS. THEY PEOPLE HAVE NEVER SEEN THEMSELVES AS ONE BEFORE.[/b][color=#990000][/color][/quote]Can you provide a link to the fight between Urhobo and Ijaw? That is a challenge.
Since you won't be able to do that, you need to shut up about what you don't know. I have picked just one thing from the bunch of crap you wrote.

Barkono:
Quote from Beaf:
It will not be long before we start seeing US drones bombing extremists in the North, just like in Pakistan.

We can see how warped your mind is. The yankees are more smarter than that. They have respect for the people of the north than those who smitten their investment on daily basis in the creeks. Come to Kano, on a traditional sallah durbar, and see top CEOs of the major oil companies,ambassadors etc with their families, enjoying sallah celebrations.
With no investments in the North, they are at home anytime.
I wonder how Boko Haram is a threat to their investments?

Keep wondering. The topmost officials in US security have labelled an incident in Nigeria as terrorist for the very first time. . . Keep thinking the word "terrorism" is a description for how American enjoy Sallah celeberations in Kano.

Many of us on NL really do not understand the World.

morufoye:
i like beef, sorry cow, oh my bad, camel. Bea[/b]f, at last i got it. [b]He has ready made answers to all questions. why then is his brother afraid of debate? beats me

Not ready made answers. . .
How about simply accepting that I am smarter, think faster and have a memory you can only dream of?

aisha2:
Beaf, I consider you my friend before all the GEJ bruhaha. Please what is daft about the victims of this henious crime against humanity giving an account of the horror thier lives haad turned into? I almost lost 3 sisters who had gone to buy fish in the barracks. I spent 2 days in the Asokoro Hospital and it is horrible, the sergent on the day of the blast was brought in without arms or legs worst sight i ve seen. His 6 year old daughter may loose her leg. haba Beaf, have you lost any sense of reasoning? Am saying this as a friend before you turn on me. My sisters can hardly sleep since the blast, pain and they say they see the scene playing in thier head when they close thier eyes. Has loyalty made you so blind to reality?"

I hope you read through the thread before making this comment?
It isn't the topic of the thread that is daft, but the wicked post the OP introduced here https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-577975.0.html#msg7447620
Some people are immoral enough to trade in the blood of innocent victims and that post is part of the blood trade. Please check that post and tell me what its benefit is and why the OP put that amongs the others like it has anything to do with the victims.

13volts:
if advance countries like japan, south korea, isreal and even u.k. Would request usa technogical assistance in time need i see no reason why 9jah would welcome the fbi wit open arms

If you people had developed the country when you had a chance, then Nigeria wouldn't be in need now. Lets welcome the FBI with open arms, America is your friend.

daroz:
Sorry o, but when did Edo ceased to be South-south?

I wouldn't worry about the antics of some the ethnic bigots that have posted here. Don't worry about the ignorant.

[quote author=Kilode?! link=topic=577593.msg7450149#msg7450149 date=1294002195]Ok, right, but what is GEJ doing about it?

Correct me if I'm wrong, he's yet to articulate his ideas about true federalism, I'm yet to hear him speak in support of state police, or even resource control, or the repeal of all those military era, oppressive land use acts. GEJ seem either confused or too afraid to ruffle feathers.

Tell GEJ we are ready to support him if he can make true federalism a political agenda, push it, champion it and campaign on that. I doubt he will do that. I wonder who he's scared of though, it's not like the North will support him anyway.

beaf, That is the issue with bros, he seem more of the same.

On a personal note; Tell him to lose that odious Portuguese/colonial bowler hat and I'll vote for him [/quote]GEJ cannot do any of the above overtly in the short time he has, or in any election year. It will take a lot of diplomacy to bring such through, many in the core Northern elite absolutely hate the idea. We are talking deep constitutional and structural changes.

However, in the background there's been several projects begun that could be seen as either research toward, or directly supporting true federalism. For instance, statistics that have been anathema in Nigeria are being collated. There are projects to find out exactly how much each LGA generates financially etc.

[quote author=Ileke-IdI link=topic=577593.msg7450114#msg7450114 date=1294001689]So exactly which place has the money developed?

Please, dont mention Lagos and Enugu states, those are not the only states in Nigeria.[/quote]Such money has not and will never develop any place. Even the so called ND states have no other business but oil.
We need a different outlook to economics in Nigeria and only true representation at all levels can provide it. The only vehicle that can offer true representation at all levels in a diverse country like Nigeria is true federalism.

Even Lagos is wretched compared to cities in the developed World. Indeed I have posted statistics over and over to show that there are several cities the World over that produce more money than the entire Nigeria. Our centralised economy is destroying our creativity and giving the ND people a an oppressed outlook.
We can all win by changing thoughts about revenue generation. Maybe we need a separate thread to really thrash this issue out, cos many who don't give a hoot about Saraki will miss the gist here.

oyb:
again, disgraceful duplicity

can you list some of the capital projects you are blathering about?

or you think the rest of nigeria also believes in sitting around doing nothing waiting for monthly thug allowance?

That is for "Abubakar" Oloye Saraki to tell you. Am I your governor?!
Give up the life of a dunce and accept true federalism.

[quote author=Ileke-IdI link=topic=577593.msg7450053#msg7450053 date=1294000782]What are you trying to say? That the villagers dont need to survive?

By the end of the day, if they still had pocket money, atleast they'd thank God. My people work hard to live, and to live, they must survive. So yea, Nigeria can take it's pocket money, and shove it where the sun dont shine.

How has any of that money helped developed Nigeria , talkless of Ekiti? Go to Ekiti state and see the state of the roads. I believe the fixation of those roads [and electricity]  will [/b]begin the development of EKITI. Hoping it's left to better hands.

Ive said it over and over again, I know many many professional Ekitis in the USA, ready to help develop Ekiti state, even my family and relatives are compromised of high paying, educational professionals. But who should they trust with their funds? All Ekiti ppl talk about over here is WHEN and WHAT TO DO WHEN they go back to Ekiti. Most of us wants to go back home!!! But to what? Fcccux it, Nigeria is so shoitty!!

[b]Sorry, not taking my vexation out on you jare   [/quote]I repeat the the budget is not pocket money for villagers. It is money from the FG that is meant to develop the place.
Question is, does it make sense to recieve free money than to generate it locally and fuel development?

We cannot keep going on about how smart or resourceful any people are, because words dont not develop places, actions do. How can we bring about true federalism so we don't end up ranting at the Moon? How can we focus our energy in such a way that in the nearest possible time, Nigerian youth are sensitised to the need to kick our current backward unitary system into the bin?

true federalism is the only answer.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=577593.msg7450009#msg7450009 date=1294000141]So $11 million/month for Ekiti State.

Chicken scratch. Given our population of 2.7 million, $4/month. 13 cents a day. 20 naira/day

I'd much rather have 24/7 electricity supply than 20 naira/day. I'm more sure most Ekiti would agree

But no doubt we would all starve to death without this 20 naira a day

EDIT: Do these #s take into account LGA monies as well?[/quote]The budget is not pocket money for villagers. It finances capital projects that have a chain effect and pays salaries.

oyb:
thank you for reminding me. i wonder how many of beaf's kinsmen are pushing for federalism

funnily enough,one of  the most vocal supporters of federalism is drug baron tinubu. go figure


should i fish out your posts on boyloaf and amnesty?

the first set when you said he was not real mend - during the days when okah was your hero and darling, or the second set, where you endorsed him as the leader of mend after the oct 1 bombings

do all those twats lining up and doing gra gra because of allawi look s if they care about federalism?

please spare us your duplicitous hypocrisy.

not to worry, i am saving these pages. when gej loses we will see you begin to celebrate okah and togo as heroes for federalism once again

whatever the saraki's antecedents, they are politicians of the old school, who win by hearts and minds, unlike people from your region, who win by the gun.

i mean, look at you. a person who cannot take dissenting views without resorting to caterwauls, insults and daft innuendo. and you are the most omnipresent person from your region here.

Oh please do, I know you follow my every utterance. I grant you permission to worship me if you like. Fool.

^
If you didn't notice, the argument has risen beyond the id!ocy introduced by ethnic bigots and the folk I am discussing with here are overwhelmingly from the SW, not core Northerners. Get on your bike with your foolishness.

[quote author=Kilode?! link=topic=577593.msg7449954#msg7449954 date=1293999197]See 2008 numbers below. Ekiti gets about the smallest allocation.

I can swear I saw 2010 allocation itemized somewhere on the fmf.gov.ng site late last year but can't seem to find it now.

I agree with the thoughts on food sufficiency. Nigeria does not depend on imported food, save for rice, our staples and diets are largely supported by locally grown food and crops, So food or hunger will not be an issue if SS or SE secedes. Oil boku for Ilajeland in Ondo state anyway

I doubt Beaf supports secession though, na mouth he dey make. Funny guy

GEJ and beaf know they can't survive without the SW fighting their cause for them, check Awolowo, check Soyinka and the ND militants. They trust SW leaders more than any other group in Naija!

All these talk na just for 2011 election. SS need SW progressives, they know they believe in federalism and they care about equity

Beaf! no go give bros GEJ nonsense advice o, else Niger Delta go carry last.


http://www.fmf.gov.ng/portal/uploads/files/FAAC/State_faac_April2008.pdf[/quote]Sessesion can only be a very last resort and you are right, I love 9ja. I needed to lay out stack scenario's to the bigot that took the argument in an anti-SS direction.
Like I said, it is cheaper to talk than look to bigotry.

Anyways, we SS peeps have no qualms at all with the SW and thats plain to see. In fact, my own ethnic group shares relations with the SW through our Edo connections.

[quote author=eku_bear link=topic=577593.msg7449829#msg7449829 date=1293997446]Indeed. Federalism is the answer, rather than the centralist arrangement we currently have. That and increased resource control would do the entire nation a lot of good, imo.[/quote]The question is, how do we achieve these things. I strongly believe that rather than react to every national tragedy and embarrassment with a micro step toward true federalism (eg privatising power generation), we need a concrete set of steps along a well defined path. Something that will work from the grassroots and be achievable in a sensible time frame.

More than anything, Nigeria needs a national ideology. Right now, we are a ship without any direction. Our country moves in chaotic directions, because it is founded on chaos, ignorance and hubris.

oyb:
mend and its offshoots do not give a rats backside about federalism. they only shout federalism so they can garner support from people who should know better.

its the same sort of rhetoric boko haram is spouting when they blather about retaliation for their people being killed and other stories.

Are you a member of MEND?
Tell us about "Abubakars" prospects in your Kwara state and leave matters you are clueless about well alone.

flexshop:
@post, confirmed he (SARAKI) joined ACP.
How will this affect the concensus agreement?

That agreement has always been a dead dog as far as the Saraki's are concerned. Bukola's brother was among the those that led the Middle Belt endorsement of GEJ, Bukola himself was among the govs that endorsed GEJ, now his dad and sister are in ACPN.
The Saraki's are too involved in a family survival headache to be bothered with "concensus" stuff.

The other factor in Bukola's concensus calculations, IBB, is deeply bitter and on his way to ANPP or CPC. As for Gusau, he doesn't give a toss as far as IBB doesn't get it. Atiku has been left drowning with the weight of an agreement which makes no sense to the people he claims to represent.