₦airaland Forum

Joshthefirst:
Unfortunately for you this is the last time I will respond to your post in detail as you are resorting to foolishness in order to cling to your doctrine of smallness and povertyI am rich with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, and I am also prosper in finances, as the seed of Abraham.
I have accepted Christ into my heart and in no way have I compared him with money. I do not worship mammon. I am simply prosperous as my father is prosperous. If it pains you so much that I am blessed in this way I advice you to receive Jesus and his blessings into your life as well.


You always bring up the widow while she actually proves my point. I am a giver, and tithing is giving. And mark my words, you are foolish, if you think that you will be able to give as sacrificially as that widow when you have a problem with people giving a small 10%. If you have a problem with 10%, then you obviously have a problem with 100%. Change your mindset of withholding and be generous in giving to the kingdom of God and you will be blessed.



Please are you for tithing or against tithing? If you are against tithing then what authority do you have in telling me how to tithe towards God?

btw, in those days they dealt mostly in stock crops and merchandise. In these days, we deal mostly with circulating finances and paper money.


It seems you are ignorant, not knowing the scriptures or the power of god. Abraham didn't give back merchandise that didn't belong to him. When people go to war and recover merchandise, it is called spoil and is claimed by the victors of war. Abraham went to war and recovered spoil, he paid tithes on the spoil, then he delivered it to the kings, so that they will not say their spoil made Abraham rich.
I find it hard to take you seriously because you do not know the word, and you seem to have little comprehension skills too. And you're beginning to insult my person.

I and my congregation cater for the pastor. Because you should not muzzle the ox that treads the grain and a labourer is worthy of his wages.



My pastor is paid because he is a labourer who shepherds my local church and a labourer is worthy of his wages. You seem not to support the care giving of men of God. If so, you are cruel and selfish. Even Jesus had sponsors who gave him food and shelter and women who ministered to him.

And when you tithe, you receive the blessing of the tither. simple.



what are you saying? can you do the work of the Lord alone? you who cannot even pay tithe how am I supposed to assume you sponsor Gods work?

My church is reaching out to the world, and from what you've said so far I do not even think you have a local congregation. we are reaching out to the world, and we are rich and filled with comfort, because our Father is the Father of all mercies and the God of all comfort.



Stay there complaining and refusing to tithe. Poor men don't take the gospel anywhere. they only complain about even the most basic of giving, and they remain in poverty.

The Kingdom of God suffers violence, and the violent take it by force. Violent people like me take the Kingdom of God by force to the ends of the earth. We give everything, and we are rich and powerful and influential. We will continue to do what we do. stay there complaining about giving tithes.

And I do not think I will reply you again.

dolphinheart:
My claims, your beliefs, your spiritual standing does not stop your from telling us the name of your church .

And yet again, you lay a claim but refuse to quote the scriptures to back up your claim. Quote rev 1:1- 8 and tell us your understanding of verse 1 and 6.


Your church matters brocab, God does not associate with a false church, so too does a person who claim to be filled with holy spirit.
one single curruption that is kept secret you have not been able to find, keep digging. It is hypocrisy to say its important to know ones secrect while keeping a tight lip and refusing to name your church for viewers to learn about . Crippy things like dark places .

Nsonaso:
You made false assumption on me by saying I must believe that JW is the true worshiper of God since I said JW are the one's that practice true Christianity.... Why would you say such? Have I said a thing like that?

Believe it or not is your choice! being a Christian, Muslim or Pagan does not guarantee heaven, Christianity is not a certificate to heaven. Belonging to one church or the other does not guarantee heaven?

Christian, Muslim or Pagan who do the will of God will see Jesus and will go to heaven. Heaven is not meant for Christians alone, nor Muslim alone nor Pagan alone but those who do the will of God the Father.

John 14:6 Jesus answered him, "I am the way, the truth and the life; no one goes to the Father except by me he didn't say through being a Christian, Muslim or Pagan. he did not say through church, mosque or shrine. do you get it?

Mathew 7:21 "Not everyone who calls me 'Lord, Lord' will enter the Kingdom of heaven, but only those who do what my Father in heaven wants them to do. He did not say those who do what the Church say or those who does what Christianity say! So my brother you can be a good Christian and still go to hell if you do not do what is required of you by God.

Being a true Christian is different from being a worshiper of God and it only the almighty God who sees what is in the human heart knows who is worshiping him. Is not about saying it with your lips

So for the fact that I said JW are the people that practice true Christianity doesn't mean there are the true worshipers of God.... I am not God and is only God that knows his true worshipers.

And I still repeat as at today no church has the brotherly love that this people have for their fellow witness brothers and sisters. And if you can be sincere to yourself, you will admit that what am saying is the truth. but I know you may not admit it because there are not your Religious Group.
I am not not a witness but I stand by the truth.

Joshthefirst:
You're becoming quite offensive and you're misinterpreting me so terribly i beginning to find it hard to take you seriously.

My point, and the point of all the examples i gave is to show that if God accepted such sacrificial monies from 'poor' widows then he won't have any trouble accepting your 10%.

you have no problem with the widow giving all she had but you have a problem with me as a seed of abraham giving 10%? you must have a serious problem.

the word of God fills my heart, and my giving and tithing based on that very word makes my need met and blesses my pockets with the resources needed to finance the activities of Gods kingdom.

I am rich, silver and gold, I do have, and the power of God that brings healing and health, i have also.

From everything you have said here it is obvious you do not even give much. if you cannot support the gospel with 10% how can you make such sacrifice as that widow who was indeed rich toward God?

The kingdom of God is moving forward. people like me take it and will take it to the ends of the earth, because we are willing to give to support it. we are willing to pay for bibles to be translated and pay for the pastor to be kempt. we are willing to pay for missionaries travels and their upkeep in their work.

You would be foolish and not of much use to the kingdom if you think that you can give very well when you cannot even give 10% of what God has blessed you with into his work

Nsonaso:
You can't force me to believe what I don't believe... And a true Christian doesn't make false assumption on someone.

And enough of the argument bye please

Sarang:
Yes Peter had spoken in the flesh. like I said before he was human. But Jesus didnt said get me behind me Satan to Peter because he knew he was going to deny him. Jesus would never use a person's weakness against that one. Jesus understand humans perfectly having lived as one himself. Infact Peter was the only one strong enough to follow Jesus when he was caught. But did he accused the other disciples that ran away as Satans? No. Because he knew that Just like Peter,they were afraid because obviously they were Imperfect humans.

And as Jehovahs servants we do not use violence against each other or even our neighbours who are not Jehovahs witnesses.. in fact we do not partake in warfare. Many of our members are in prison in different countries because they refused to carry arms example South Korea. During the first,second world and subsequent wars many of our members were prosecuted because they refuse to carry arms. yes you are right,we pray for each other. Jehovah wants each one of the people to recieve his gift of life eternal likewise we want them to too.

Nsonaso:
Thanks man... But I've already found the truth. The search I said I was searching was then before 2012.
John 14:6 is the truth (it was shown and interpreted to me by the Holy Spirit himself. It was magical and unbelievable)

Religion be it Christian, Islamic or pagan is people's way of life is never an avenue or ticket to go to heaven nor see Christ. Religion is just like every other social gathering or social group in a society. I only mentioned Witness as people who practices real Christianity. I never said there are the true worshippers of God because it's only God himself alone knows his true worshippers.

Joshthefirst:
Stop adding your own words to scripture. paul was talking about money and financies in 2 corinthians 8. simple

italo:
False! Pope Pius XII used to sneak out to help smuggle Rome's Jews to safety during World War 2.

Many Pope's could have done it without the press knowing and spreading it. No pope would want to publicize it. Francis' secret trips were not confirmed in this story, remember.

Sarang:
He wasn't calling peter Satan. but Peter was a human and who as a human would want their friend to die?
Peter mearnt well and Jesus knew it but he also know that he has to die and it is important at that time.

So he was in effect saying to peter,do not let human emotions and thinking to make you to try to stop me from the will of my father. For if Jesus hadn't die,yes Satan will win. And also he wasn't mad at peter.

Nsonaso:
You're wrong man. Tell me how am I a man pleaser? Is it by kicking against what christ kicked against or what?

And who is the man am pleasing?

Nsonaso:
You're wrong man. Tell me how am I a man pleaser? Is it by kicking against what christ kicked against or what?

And who is the man am pleasing?

Nsonaso:
Is not about what a particular religious group claim to be but about what we see and practice in our every day Christian's life.
I've been to different churches in search of the truth and I stand to tell you no church has the brotherly love like this people and that's true Christianity Galatians 6:10
This people are not interested in your money (the best of it all) there are not like what you see in today's Christianity, money this money that.
Giving offering, sowing of seeds etc. and you show it to the entire world to notice you, even some televise theirs on TV. I use to ask myself what does these people actually read this verse Mathew 6:1-4 of the Bible?

Why I don't like some of their practices is that am not the type that like Human rules and traditions as a religion. Even in catholic there are things that turn me off too (like the monetary thing is gradually skimming into catholic). I would have decamp for a very long time when I found out that some things are not right, but I don't know why I have this strong feelings that one day am gonna make things right.

Joshthefirst:
The scripture that states that Jesus was made poor tells us why he was made poor. It's so that I, through his poverty, might be made rich! I'm rich bro! Glory to God. The El-shaddai.

He was made poor for my sake and your sake. His poverty made us rich!


2 Corinthians 8:

9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.


∆I don't know why you're so worried that God wants you to prosper, financially too. Read that 2 Corinthians 8 and you'll see Paul was talking about material poverty and riches, not spiritual one.

He was talking about monéé guy. Cash, quid, bucks, etc.

dolphinheart:
you are lying again, throughout this thread, I've been proposing that you explain the bible verses you and I posted, and even on some of the verses you posted, for everyone to give an explanation when asked about his views on Bible verses. you have vehemently refused to give explanation, you have totally refused to even quote those scriptures, often time claiming it does not matter. often time I show you Scriptural verses telling you the truth, yet you refuse to see them, and even if you are forced to see them you totally refused to talk about them. an example of how you have been avoiding the scriptures yet Tryin to claim you show scripturAl truth is your present refusal to quote and explain revelation 1: 1,6.
Your refusal to quote and explain those verses(including the others you have neglected)is bourne out from the fact that your nature is governed by fault finding and not truth seeking. you refuse to examine rev 1:1 to 6, but go straight to verse 7 and 8 cus the initial verses 1 to 6 are too explicit and cannot be twisted by you to surpport your fault finding desire.



can you hear urself, that it does not matter what the word of God says!.
you know why it does not matter to you, it does not matter to you cus that's the only way you can find an excuse not to examine it's content. or rather, you have privately examined it's content and found out it is against your falsely generated and derived doctrines, and the only way to keep your doctrines afloat is to say some verses in the scriptures does not matter.
well I tell you brocab, God knew that people like you will exist, that's why he had John record those words found at rev 1:1 to 6, so that whichever way or angle you use to cover the truth up, individuals who are seaching for the truth will find it. Because you can't cover the truth up any longer, you now says it does not matter.



first, I've never at any time asked you where your church is, so stop these attempted diversion. The location of your church or you yourself does not matter to me.

I've asked you to tell the world your church for the following reasons.
1. Your church will tell us about the doctrines you believe in, and everyone will be able to know if the church is true or not. And if you do not believe the doctrines of your church, then you are not supposed to attend such church.
2. The initial reasons for asking the name of your church is to check if it's true that your church follows Scriptural directives when it comes to how to deal with sinners in its midst. to examine if your words are true or false.
3. Another reason to know your church is for everyone to examine if truly , a person who claims to have to the holy spirit in him is associating with an organization that displays the fruits of the holy spirit.

you have so far, up till this moment shown you can't tell people about the church you attend, that you are afraid to reveal your church and thus will continue to bring up excuses rather than just tell people the church you attend.
I'm sure people reading these posts will know you as someone desiring to throw stones while living in a glass house.

In your desperate bid to alter the truth, you have so far refused to tell us who is talking in rev 3:2,12. you have read those verses and you know that quoting or explaining those verses will show the world you are a liar and a propagator of false doctrines, hence your refusal to talk about them.

Are you a Jehovahs witness?No!, so even is you say they shy away, why not show them the right way and prove them wrong by not shying away from telling people your church!

CANTICLES:
Dolphinheart ... Well done bro ! I pray Jehovah God continue to be with you.


Bro brocab ... Make una tell the name of your church, lets see if they follow the scripture regarding what is to be done concerning an unrepentant sinner

Joshthefirst:
The principle of tithing and seed showing was demonstrated by Abraham and Jacob before the law of !Moses was given. It is not part of the mosaic law. It is a principle of heaven.

And Jesus preached prosperity. If you want to stick with being impoverished, go ahead, but he was made poor, so that I, through his poverty might become rich.

Sarang:
I disagree. Peter was one out of them who was mostly outspoken.

Nsonaso:
Nope bro my uncle and his family are witness and he is also a Baptised publisher. Am a roman Catholic and am currently staying with them. And staying with them has made me learn a lot about witness and I can boldly tell you that there are the one practicing real Christianity though they have some flows that turn me off

dolphinheart:
is these your response to verse 1 and 6 of rev? said it a couple of times you can't talk about those verses cus it shows your doctrine to be false!, you have just proven, one more time that I'm right.


a born again will not shy away from explaining Scriptural verses posed to him or her, it's someone who has something to hide that will not quote the scriptures.

Look at the question you asked again and tell me if it's reasonable or not, so it does not make a difference if you claim to be born again but yet you are attending a church that condones things the scriptures told us to be against. brocab, it's important that you should be proud to tell anyone the church you attend!




and yet you have just failed to tell us the two type of christians you have. And how does this affect naming your church, or quoting and explaining rev 1: 1,6.

and what does your location or country of origin or race have to do with the scriptures?
does location,race or country make you a better christian than others? or does it give you better access to the holy spirit than others not from the same place or race?
it seems you are running out of reasons not to quote or explain rev 1:1 and 6 and not to tell us the church you attend, which has made you to try to shift it(as always) to an irelivant issue. no one cares what country you come from brocab, except you are from a war torn region.

dolphinheart:
Then quote verse 1 and 6 of rev chapter 1 and tell us what you understand by what is written there. by doing so , you have shown us you are not refusing anything.
I know who Jesus is to me, he is the one who sent by God to tell us the truth about him, to show us the way to the father, and to provide a means by which we can gain evalasting life. He is the one who God has appointed and anointed to be our savior , to judge mankind and to bring God's people to God.
He is the king of God's kingdom, he is our savior and God has provided no other person to save us than his son jesus.

Read above about who I think jesus is and stop this your false assumptions.

you sabi jesus physically ? abeg describe him for us! and where did you read that Jesus is going to walk on the earth again?

you that is afraid to name your church is telling someone he can't recognize God, describe God for us, you that have seen God with the sprit in you.

dolphinheart:
Like I said earlier, they will say they have found jesus but cannot disclose the church they associate with.


would have answered you, but I just see it as diversionary, cus I'm sure you dnt believe that Jesus is a sinner cus he bore our sins. and if you dnt believe that, it's an irony for you to ask if we expelled jesus, it's just shows your aim.


I do not judge, but the scriptures has (as mentioned several times to you)stated what should be done to one who commits such sins( as mentioned in the scriptures) and does not repent.

your drive to find fault in the way Jehovahs withnesses handle sinners among them has made you not to tell us on this thread how ur church handles someone who is a fornicator and does not change his ways. You offer no solution, but you are just out to find fault.


brocab, we are not handling assumptions here, we are talking bout a confirmed person that fornicates and is a drunkard!, one who has been proven beyond doubt that he commits those sins. tell us how your church handles such one.



loving your neighbour does not give you a right or a leeway in condoning sin!.


So the book of 1 Corinthians and 2 John where I quoted the directives to you are from the old testament right? as said before, you only see what you want to see, you wunt see scriptures that shows you your doctrine is false, you wunt quote then, neither will you explain them. I wonder where I quoted the law of moses concerning expelling someone from the Christian congregation.



another diversionary tactic. It does not tell how your church deal with one who fornicates and does not repent.


haha, you've just shown us you can't post the content of that Watchtower on these thread, cus you dnt want people to examine it with the lies you stated in your post.
It is one who wants to show that a book contains something that will provide the contents of the book to show that what he or she is saying is true, but you can't do that as doing so will show you lied. imagine , wanting me to proviDe proof of words I said does not exist.

A very important part of that page of the Watchtower was posted to you, but you can't see it as usual, if you saw it , you wunt say I did not provide evidence.



you are of those that will read books made by followers of those that don't serve God cus you are looking for hidden secrets. you try to change the topic to issues of the watchtower cus you can't agree with the numerous scriptures I've been quoting for you so far. You complain it's from the Watchtower, I told you its from the scriptures, you now shifted and say it's from the NWT , I decided to quote some specific verses from the KJv, even went further to quote from the two translations, but yet you will not see it, you will not read from the scriptures you claim to follow.

dolphinheart:
yes it does! and I'm astounded by your refusal to accept it! in verse one it tells that God gave the Revelation to jesus, this blatantly shows that Jesus is not that God refered to in verse one.
verse six now makes it clear that Jesus HAS A GOD,(the same one who gave him the revelation), that same God is jesus father. Jesus has on several occasions refered to this God as his God! also telling disciples that that God is also their God! , the God that sent him, THE ONLY TRUE GOD!, his father!. We found out that this God said he is the God of jesus(heb 1:9).
These God's name is Jehovah and superior to jesus, therefore these God is THE ALMIGHTY GOD.!

brocab, if you think I'm wrong, tell us who Jehovah is, if you fail to do so , it shows you dnt know the one who gave jesus the Revelation. remember John 17:1 to 3? know Jehovah if you want to gain evalasting life brocab.


It can be confusing to you and to those who want to twist the scriptures and ascribe to it things not found there.

listing scripture verses without quoting it or explaining it wunt help you. For your benefit, and for others to know you dnt tell the truth, i will quote those scriptures and show you what it means.

Matthew 27: 43,46,54
King James Version
He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said, I am the Son of God.
And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.

now who did the these people say Jesus called himself? almighty God? Jehovah? The answers are no! they said Jesus called himself the son of God! The son of the one he cried out to in a loud voice.

The words in Matthew and that of Psalms 22 help us to know the God jesus cried out to.

Psalms 22: 1,8 ,19
My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Why are you far from saving me, Far from my cries of anguish?
“HE ENTRUSTED HIMSELF TO JEHOVAH. Let Him rescue him! Let Him save him, for he is so dear to Him!”
But you, O JEHOVAH, do not remain far away. You are my strength; hurry to help me.
Therefore, the God jesus cried out to, the one he called his God ,is Jehovah and not trinity.!


verry funny, how did Jesus fulfil the prophecy, by saying what was said in the prophecy?


you are far off from the truth brocab, and derived analogy wunt help you. They are one does not mean they are the same person as explained to you several times.
Jesus is not the almighty God as Jehovah is superior to him. You can now see that the fact that you can't tell us if jesus is Jehovah is because the answer will show the world that your doctrines are false.

you that have the spirit, please tell us if jesus is same person as the father, if jesus is same person as Jehovah and if jesus is same person person as the one who told him to sit on the right side.

dolphinheart:
clear the screen first and you will see clearly who is coming. first tell us if jesus is same person as Jehovah or if jesus is same person as the father or if jesus is the same person as one sitted on the throne who told Jesus to sit at his right side. clearing that one away first will help you to understand who is coming. your refusal to share that information shows who you really are, someone who jumps from issues to issues, looking for perceived faults without neccessarily ready to offer solutions.

Ken4Christ:
Those who condemn tithing on the ground that it is Old Testament, please tell me which command appears more demanding. The tithe which is just 10% of your increase or the instruction our Lord Jesus gave in Luke 12:33 which is almost all the assets you possess. You must practice one of it. If you don't pay tithe, then obey what Jesus says we should do. The early church did it. And I have been in meetings where people gave away the only car for the work of the ministry. If you believe in just giving, you shouldn't give less than 10% unless you are not born again. If you are, the nature of God is in you now. Since God is generous, you too should be generous. Only carnally minded people kick against giving. The carnal mind cannot please God. If God's children do not give a definite percentage of their income to God, how will the church pay it's bill. Tithing is God's own way of paying full time workers in the house of God and take care of other logistics. Do you think God will be more pleased if we give less. If you are managing an organization, will you prefer to have a system that brings less money? The church needs more fund. A lot of believers that have caught this revelation give much more. Please don't discourage anyone from tithing. That is the very least expected of us. From the teachings of our Lord Jesus, he even wants us to give all.

Joshthefirst:
Sorry, I was replying with regards to a certain statement he made:



I was trying to show him God collected much more than 10% from widows, so his point is null.

People mostly dealt in farming back then. Will you now tell me that you aren't supposed to tithe because you're not a farmer? Weak point.

dolphinheart:
we are talking about sins that the scriptures recommended expulsion for. The sin committed and the attitude of the sinner towards the sin committed are important. The scriptures is explicit on the process, not only giving instructions but also giving examples of how such instructions had been carried out from the time of Adam till now. You can break those rules cus of sentiments, but Jehovahs witnesses will not, cus its a safeguard!
cus sin is everywhere does not mean it should be condoned brocab.


that's the difference between a true congregation and a divided one.
does moving to a new church remove the sin committed in the former church?NO!
The branches of the church should be under one body with same guidelines.

no human now can condemn anybody for eternity, it is not a Scriptural guideline and Jehovahs withnesses dnt do it. A Christian already knows he wunt gain evalasting life if he is a fornicator, he does not need to be expelled to know that. But he also knows that if he changes his ways he can gain evalasting life.


tell us pls, what did moses tell the isrealites as regards sinners among them(by sinners , I mean those who sin continously such as fornicators and adulterers and drunkards).
pls tell us, what does the scripture say we should do to those who commit such sins in the Christian congregation.
you have so far failed woefully in telling us what the word of God say we should do to such ones. not following divine instructions will only give the devil a leeway into the congregation brocad, follow Scriptural directive and do not lean on your own understanding. trust in Jehovah and do not let sentiments affect your understanding.(proverbs chapter 3)


the same church with different branches or a different church with different doctrines and process.? pls be specific. and pls be confident enough to mention the name of the church!


we dnt do it the way you do cus we prefer to follow Scriptural directives(as shown you in previous post)rather than follow man made opinions.
Jehovahs withnesses dnt have organizations, they have only one orginization, get it?
you condemn yourself by not repenting from the sins you are committing!


do not let sentiments affect your judgements, the scriptures says "do not associate with sinners". you brocab, will associate with an armed robber if she is your wife!

The church will not lose its lampstand because of an individual who wants to use sentiments to remain in the congregation and continue to practise sin!


are you serious at all brocab? or you simply dnt know or understand the topic you are bringing on. How does your committing fornication relate to sinning against me?!


you are a liar brocad, being expelled does not mean your marriage will be dissolved. If you are unevenly yoked, you are still yoked, that yoking will be respected and observed by all, and can only be broken through an act of adultery by one of the partners.

Most times when you use the letter "i", you next statement will probably be a lie cus you feel no one can investigate it.




brocab, you are a liar!, bet you where told to just post the Watchtower and you did not read it! cus if you have done so , you would not have referred to it. Probably you where thinking people wunt look for it to read cus it was published in 1981.

A part of that page shows your post as lies:[b]"Since his being disfellowshipped does not sever the family ties, normal day-to-day family activities and dealings may continue."[b].
If you truly want people to know you are not lying, pls post what is in that page of that Watchtower and tell us if their understanding of the scriptures they put their is wrong.

dolphinheart:
you have a lot to learn, what you are searching for will not help you understand what the scriptures says.
your refusal to tell us if jesus is same person as the father or if jesus is same person as Jehovah or if jesus is the same person as the one who gave him instructions to sit at his right hand will continue to affect your understanding of what the book of rev chapter one is saying.
rev 1:1 to 6 have already seperated jesus from the almighty God, yet you are desperate to link verse 7 and 8 together as talking about one person.

If you truly understand verse 7 and 8, why do you then refuse to understand verse one to 6 or explain what is written there? Your answer lies in your refusal to understand what the scriptures says in favour of your false doctrines.
ones you sit down and explain to every one what the preceeding verses 1 to 6 says, then you will know the truth.

dolphinheart:
can you see how confusing you are and how much you have confused yourself on these issues? you have tried linking jesus with Jehovah and now you are saying " one of them".

stating if jesus is Jehovah God or if they are two seperate persons will help you to understand who is coming. state your views on that first and everything will fall into place.

dolphinheart:
that's a lie, and that's why you can't tell if jesus is same person as the father or if jesus is same person as Jehovah. Jehovah is the almighty God, the supreme being who told Jesus to sit at his right side, the God of Jesus! heb 1:9