₦airaland Forum

mrvitalis:
If that makes you sleep at night

All politicians are not the same.. You all just vote someone your intellectual level

Abeg enjoy

All modern day Nigerian politicians are the same. The era of the Awolowo, Azikwe, Ahmadu Bello,Balewa Okpara etc etc is long gone.

Those kind of people exist but they don’t get involved in Nigerian politics. The few that do quit if they have any principles, get compromised or realize this country can’t be saved and just look after their own interests….or will never get elected in the 1st place.

The reason is that it is this same illiterates that will prevent them from doing the right thing. So in the end what you get are politicians in it to loot or politicians who are only after writing their name in history as I was senator I was governor etc.

Anyone who gets involved in politics knows that it is the same people you are fighting for that will fight you.

Again this is the making of we the educated in our colonial mentality of always copying everything western. We copied a system of government from the west that does not take into cognizance the peculiarities of its population. How did we determine that giving a majority population consisting of almajiris, agberos and other illiterates the power to determine who leads us was ever a good idea beats me every day!! We are also absent in the delegate stage which is where the candidates emerge from. Again if you look at who are delegates, the are taxi drivers, market women etc. This is why Nigeria does not work for the educated. In the west and second republics, educated people were among the delegates because the educated people had a connection with the villages having grown up there.

You are right when you say people vote based on their intellectual level and he is right when he says all politicians are the same. The system cannot produce the kind of politicians and hence governance that will cater to the aspirations of the educated when the people who vote them in are largely illiterate.

Akpakomiza2:
By the way,Asue donated a transformer yesterday to Ubiaja community

Democracy in action

mrvitalis:
We are saying the same thing

Let them keep voting idiots

Except it is not them who suffer it is us. We are the ones conditioned to expect much they are happy with boreholes grinding machines, sewing machines and okada and they get their boreholes grinding machines, sewing machines and okada. Democracy working as intended.

mrvitalis:
My argument is not about wining an election but governance

Idiots vote idiots reason we have so many elected idiots who can't govern

I think you are missing the point.

1: Illiterates are the majority
2: The needs of the illiterates are different from the needs of the educated and urbane
3: the educated are clustered in cities and removed from the illiterates and so do not understand or connect with them
4: the semi illiterate are more in touch with the illiterates so they win or influence elections because the illiterates identify with them.
5: you can only provide good governance if you get to power
6: if your path to governance is blocked or hindered because you are not in touch or do not have someone who can act on your behalf to connect with the “illiterates” then you will never get the opportunity to provide the good governance you crave
7: having said that good governance is relative. What is good governance to an educated enlightened man is different from what is good governance to an illiterate. I cannot overemphasize this point because this is where we the educated lose the plot. This is why we are surprised that “idiots” as you call them keep winning elections. As an example an educated man knows the difference between a school and a good school, an illiterate does not know the difference all he knows is his child is in school. The illiterate in the village does not care about your airports, band A, forex, who is stealing crude, how many cars in a ministers convoy, the price of the presidents plane. He cares about borehole, farm implements, wheelbarrow, sewing machine, price of basic foods, rice, his farm, kerosene. Etc.

When we understand this we will understand why our politicians dish out things like wheelbarrows, boreholes, sewing machines, okadas etc. That to the majority of Nigerians is good governance, that to them is development.


We can call them “idiots” but the reality is we are arrogant….. We are the real “idiots”. We are the minority and we act and talk like we are the majority. Democracy will always work for the interests of the majority. The real “idiots” are we the educated Nigerians who don’t realize we are a minority and out of a misplaced sense of arrogance, superiority or stupidity allow their fate to be determined by a majority whose aspirations and concept of good governance diverges from ours and then we complain about bad leadership. Go to the villages where the real Nigeria reside, to them these guys are heroes and providing good governance!

You are missing the point because to govern you first have to win the election. To win an election you must understand and connect with the voters.

mrvitalis:
That's a big lie
A literate man won't put himself up for election if he knows he won't work

An illiterate don't even know how to help his people even if he wants to ...

Don't people love n want to help their sick love ones? But they can't because they have no knowledge

Yet it takes a doctor without emotional attachment to treat them...

Governance is complex if you are not smart u would flop

Buhari is an example
Tinubu is another

I have no interest in the Edo election. I am only commenting because I saw the debate about literate and illiterate candidates.

This is my take:

One of the big mistakes we make or things we forget is that the educated and well travelled so to speak are a minority of the population. Unlike in the 60s to the 80s, many have no connection with the grassroots. Unlike my father who grew up in the village for instance I have not been to my village in decades except for 1 or 2 burials. If I were to go there today I don’t know anyone there.

The vast majority of the electorate who vote and determine the outcomes of elections are these so called illiterates. That is why even in a city like Lagos a man like MC Oluomo is a force…talk less the hinterland.

The downside to elections in an underdeveloped country like Nigeria is that winning is not about how good you are but your ability to connect with the electorate. This is why we throw up some shocking winners of elections and we wonder how is this man a governor or senator etc.

I can boldly say that in Nigeria it is the semi-literates and those who are in touch with the illiterates that win elections. If you see a well educated man win an election in Nigeria, I can almost guarantee you that he won because he was backed by someone who is in touch with the illiterates not on his own merit.

So never dismiss a candidate because he is an illiterate or refuses to debate. Real politicians know debates are for the educated who don’t determine outcomes of elections.


We need to disavow ourselves of this literate/illiterate candidate debate and understand the true nature of the electorate that determine our collective futures. We the 10% are the ones who care about debates but we don’t determine elections. Those who win elections are those who have people who can speak to them in the language they understand….the language of the illiterate.

Nigerian politics 101: The illiterates are the delegates at the primaries and the majority at the elections. It is misplaced arrogance to think our worldly views matter in elections.

Nigeria has not produced 20m graduates in its entire history so even if all were alive which is not the case, at best in a population of 200m only 10% are graduates.

GreaterFuture:
Okay, yes, there wasn't.
But corresponding value that is...
Also in your pic, one Toyota car there was 2000 something Naira... So it was fairly possible.

And lastly, I'm not part of the "many of You". I'm an educated millennial, immersed and grew up in history.

Stop digging a hole for yourself and train your mind to think properly.

GreaterFuture:
Okay...
So it probably did in the 60s... Or 50s
So you won't say "never in the history of Nigeria" has a car cost that...

Like I said the problem with many of you is that you do not know your history. There was no Naira in the 50s or 60s. The Naira was introduced in 1973. Also 504 did not exist till 1968.

So yes. I can say authoritatively that never in the history of Nigeria has a brand new 504 cost N1,500.

Let me enlighten you as to how properly educated people debate.: if you want to rebuff or counter someone, you counter with evidence/facts not opinion especially opinion that has no evidential fact or logical thought process backing it.

IdeasYapayaski:
They don't know.

My dad bought Honda Accord Saloon Car Brand new in 1982 for N5,000.00 (Tear Rubber). But mind you salary was N18 per month. So how many N18.00 do you want to save to buy a N5,000 car?😂😂😂

the minimum wage in 1982 was N100 a month, that's what a cleaner in the civil service earned. Starting salary for a post NYSC graduate in the civil service was N400 and all university students got a federal bursary of N1,000 a session. i think that was also the year (may have been 1980or 81) my mother's driver bought a brand new 504 GL on his government driver's salary and deployed it to inter-city transport.

Burob:
Which one is if you had any brains, why the insult?

after calling my father a thief and making me explain what i had already explained?

Burob:
maybe your pops was a top civil servant chopping money back then?

.

eeediot!!!

Burob:
Only rich people could buy a Mercedes Benz 200, 230, or 250 in 1982, maybe your pops was a top civil servant chopping money back then?

Only the extra rich business men could afford the Benz 280, or Benz 500 aka concord in 1982.

In those days government workers had integrity. When my father bought his first Mercedes’, a Mercedes’ was around mid 7,000, his salary was probably 9,000. Even Adams oshiomole who was a textile worker narrated how he bought a new Volvo in the 70s. All civil servants were entitled to low interest car loans. The difference in price between a Volvo and a Mercedes’ was only a few hundred. There were some Volvos that cost more than a Mercedes’ 200 so it is only out of ignorance that you think a Mercedes 200 driver is a rich man or richer than a man driving a Volvo. It might even shock you that the made in Nigeria Audi 100 was more expensive than a Mercedes’ 200.


If you had any brains you will read what I wrote.


The duty on a Mercedes’ 230, 250, 280 and above in 1983 was 300%. The duty on a Mercedes’ 200 was increased to 75%, before then it was only 50%. The difference in duty on a 200 and a 230 was a lot. An senior civil servant can afford a Mercedes 200’, your ability to afford a car depended largely on the engine capacity, the landing ex wharf price of the car and the duty regime in force at the time. There was very little difference between the landing price of a 200 and a 230. Before 1979 and after 1983 duty was based on engine capacity. Between I think 1979 and 1983, they changed the formula for import duty from engine capacity to price. This made the 230 affordable for many people (because the difference in price between a 200 and 230 is not much) It was in 1983 that they went back to engine capacity and a 230 became unaffordable because the duty went from 50% to 300% while a 200 went from 50 to 75.


The reason only the rich could afford a Shagari in those days was because it’s landing cost was above N10,000 and like I said between 1979 and 1983 duty was based on price. Cars above N10,000 had duty of 100%. A Mercedes’ 200 and 230 had a landing cost below N10,000 so incurred duty of 50% ….very affordable for an honest senior civil servant. The reason the 230 became unaffordable after 1983 is that government reverted to engine capacity and the duty on a 230 went to 300% not even the old 100%. Ordinarily a top civil servant could afford a Shagari if not for the duty because landed in Apapa before duty the price of a 280Se was not more than N12000! It is duty of 100% and 300% that made it a car for the rich.


In fact until Obasanjo came into government, the official cars of top civil servants were Mercedes 200’….that is how affordable they were.

Below are the prices of a Mercedes’ 200 and Volvo in 1975 and the salary of a medium level senior civil servant for the year ( Icouldn’t find the salary of the most senior servant in that gazette) but a senior assistant surveyor on grade level 10 ( out of 16) can earn up to N6,500 per annum and you wouldn’t call him a top civil servant. Whereas a Mercedes 200 and a Volvo in that year was around N7,000. Also, a graduate starts on GL08, so GL10 is closer to a graduate than a top civil servant on GL14-16.


You didn’t need to be a thief to be comfortable as a civil servant in those days.


In those days even as a kid we always dreaded the budget speech because that would determine what and what you cannot afford that year because they were always changing import duties or banning items every budget speech.


Last picture is the price of a Mercedes’ in Germany in 1976. At a rate of 3DM to 1N (also deduct German vat of 11%). can see that the landing cost of a Mercedes’ 200/230 is approxx N5400 and N5600. What determined the price in Nigeria is what duty the government of the day is charging. Very affordable for a senior civil servant. Lastly I forgot to mention the problem wasn’t price, the problem was availability.

I don’t think you understand that life was very comfortable for the civil servants that is why their generation was blamed for not taking an active step in the governance of the country until things fell apart because they were comfortable though not rich.

The reason Mercedes assumed the reputation of a car of the rich was not the price but availability. There was a long waiting list because allocations were low. A Citreon cx was twice the price of a Mercedes’ 200 because the engine was above 2000cc but you would not think a Citreon cx driver is a rich man.

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Burob:
Rich man pikin.

Nothing like rich man pickin. Senior Civil servants could afford Mercedes and Volvos. The principal of my school had a Mercedes. Most of them got car loans. A Mercedes then was just about the annual salary of a top civil servant.

You may e shocked to know there were cars that were more expensive than a Mercedes’. Like Citreon and even Volvo at a time.

In those days duty was based on engine capacity, ranging from 30% to 300%. so long as you stuck to a Mercedes’ 200 it was affordable. The difference between a Mercedes’ 200 and a 230 could be up to N10,000 Naira. It is people that bought 230 and above that were the rich people.

lapintoz:
100% sure. Saw the receipt some years back. Buhari and Udiagbon had started price control then.

Like I said it is possible due to scarcity. My parents worked for the government so any official cars were at official rates so I always knew the prices so I am 100% sure the official price was not more than N10,000.


Price control had been in existence since Gowon. The problem starting under Buhari was scarcity of cars as the plants were having problems securing forex for parts. That said my dad bought a brand new Mercedes 200 in 1983 and I know it cost N17,000 because he was complaining that if the car had landed a few months before he wouldn’t have had to pay the increased duty. So it is strange that a 504 would go for N20k in 1984

lapintoz:
I was wondering o.....

My papa bought a brand new 504 with AC for N20,000 in 1984 and a beetle for N6,000 for my brother later in the year.

So this 1k must be a poorly used 3rd hand. 😁

These gen Z and millennials who have no concept of history just rant anyhow. Some of them don’t even know how to think. Rush to post but the Op did not even check the date on the receipt which shows 1977?

I am also sure that you know that by 1984, the 504L (the model on the receipt) was no longer in production. Even the much loved 504GL was no longer in production. The only models you could buy in 1984 were GR and SR. The 504L was discontinued in 1979.

Having said that 504 never reach N20k in 1984. Even it’s senior brother the 505 never reach N15k. I think a 505 was around N12k in 1984. It was after Babangida came into power (1985) that prices really exploded.

Having said that, I wouldn’t discount that prices were trading above the official price because of scarcity, so it is possible just strange for 1984 that a 504 would sell for N20k. Are you sure it was 1984?

lexy2014:
did you read the name of the document that you shared?

You are an eeediot. The receipt says 1977 Prices of all items were controlled in Nigeria until the abolition of the price control board. Go and ask your father if you have one what the price of a new Peugeot 504 was in 1977 or 1984. He will tell you there was never a time in Nigeria when the price of a Peugeot 504 was N1500. Even a beetle cost more than N3,000.

Racoon:
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/vYAVn4kxfoaXops6/?mibextid=oFDknk

Never in the history of Nigeria has a brand new 504 cost N1,500.

Below are brand new prices for 1978 and the bottom 2 are for 1975

That is a used car. In 1977, a 504 was N6,000 Naira

DGoodStudent:
I know that one day, God will deliver us from the bad leaders of this country.

Bad citizens Our leaders are not aliens from another country or universe they are the same bad citizens that become leaders that is why government come government go nothing changes.

At some point we all have to acknowledge that WE are the problem of Nigeria.

mrvitalis:
The land mtn data cable are on are not federal government land abi?

The truth is most of you APC guys from Tinubu to the road side supporter don't understand basic developmental economics at all

Reason you guys keep wondering why the economy keep tanking yet every sensible person know its APC actions

You can't protect a 200 million dollars building by diverting the road or starting it 2 km forward

But u can do that for mere MTN data cables that can be easily moved... Make it make sense

The question you should ask is why you invest $200m based on land you do not own

Internet data infrastructure is not mere data cable. We all saw what happened when the underwater cable was cut a few months ago. All communications infrastructure for thee whole country was down.

Talk like people with intelligence not every time propaganda.

zang:
We have been seating on Time bomb since 1963

Nigeria was always a ticking time bomb.

joseph1832:
Lol. This is actually funny because, Tinubu, like his predecessors, underestimate the greed of Nigerians. This greed is the very reason, why this country will take a long time, before it becomes what we truly dream of.

On second thought, this is suppose to be a joke right?

I hate to say it but that dream will not be fulfilled in our lifetime….if ever. Nigeria is blessed but destined from the start to fail and that is what is playing out and will continue to play out until the fundamental flaws of the country is addressed. You build a house with a flawed foundation it will continue to sink no matter how much reconstruction you apply to that flawed foundation, so long as you don’t address the fundamental issue of its flawed foundation.

ShoeGetSize:
Dumb, pseudo intellectual trash spewing out of a single digit IQ mind.

Yes, a retired footballer and club legend for Chelsea critiquing an underperforming current Chelsea player must be viewed through a racist lens.

Typical inferiority complex and low IQ.

You are the one with a low iQ, I have said it many times even before this episode and furthermore for eeediots like you who can’t think I listed his previous intellectually deficient low self esteem unbecoming commentaries.


But onto Jackson where was he when Mudryk who cost close to £100m has been putting in stinkers match after match? Jackson cost £30m which is low for a striker. You are getting from Jackson what you expect from a young £30m striker. Mudryk cost £90-100m which is world class price for a winger. Who should Obi be criticizing?

Jackson and Mudryk are the same age.

Plus you plus Obi eeediots

mablie:
I have never liked that fellow.
I still vividly remember how he would fake injuries when he played for Chelsea fc so that he would avoid playing for the Super Eagles.
John Obi Slowbilis a.k.a Mr Back & Side passer

A house negro: a slave who feels he is now superior to other slaves because his master gave him a role as a servant in the house instead of the plantation , wears used clothes of his master and then eager to please and gain the trust of his master, uses his position as a house slave to work against his own people in the plantation often more brutal than even his master. Perhaps adopts his master’s name and starts to speak like his master.

He forgets he is still a slave and he is still a servant.

That’s Michael (now Mikel) Obi

The white man recognizes the increasing importance of Africans in the domestic demography and international followership. So they appointed him to represent that diversity and what does the slave do? He uses his position to disparage his own people thinking he is promoting himself.

I know the British, trust me he won’t last…not because they care about his tomfoolery but because he offers little insight.

I have been saying it for sometime that Obi is an Uncle Tom with inferiority complex and imposter syndrome. That’s why he feels he has to denigrate others especially his fellow Nigerians or Africans to be relevant and accepted by whites.

1) claims he is the most successful Nigerian footballer ribbishing the likes of Okocha and Kanu
1) claims Nigerians only started supporting Chelsea because of him forgetting the like of babayaro, drogba, Essien were there before him
3) says oliseh is a useless coach
4) lambasts Jackson publicly (there are ways to talk about a young protégée)
5) disparaged Africans on air for always wanting money from him
6) willingly accepted a name change because his name was spelt wrongly. A man with self esteem will say that is not my name.
Etc etc etc

You will notice he never attacks whites (there are poor white players at Chelsea e.g Mudryk who cost a lot more than Jackson has he ever said anything? A so called club legend will say he is not ready, Chelsea need to buy as striker, not going on the attack trying to throw a young player under the bus to boost his acceptability among his white audience.

and speaks in a fake accent. Signs of someone with an inferiority complex eager to please his masters.

I don’t support Chelsea but Michael Obi or whatever adopted slave name he calls himself now is an embarrassment. He is just stoooooopid as far as I am concerned. The other day I was watching a match and I switched to a channel that didn’t have Obi as a commentator. I can’t stand to hear him speak.

SadiqBabaSani:
Mumu talk by SDM, how can a parrty with 12 governors be dead in your mind

Fayose said it over a year ago that PDP is dead as far as winning national elections but they will still win state elections.

komzy589:
Omo see foolishness na.
It’s now ‘remove subsidy fully’🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

I have been consistent. Check the dates some as far back as February

casualobserver:
Tinubu needs to sustain the Naira float, it will settle where it settles. He should remove subsidy. All these people panicking because there is difficulty only show why successive governments have led to this point. They don’t have the balls to do the right thing. What kind of person is advocating g a return of subsidies either Forex or petrol?

You cannot change your life without pain. If it costs him his second term so be it but he needs to sustain the reforms.

casualobserver:
clearly you are a product of a failed education system. i said he need to remove subsidy which implies i know subsidy is back.

casualobserver:
I will not forgive Tinubu if he backs down on these reforms, as it is I am unhappy he has reintroduced subsidy, we all need to rest our brains.

casualobserver:
You do not understand economics, this thing is above your pay grade.


We had no money as at May 29. We devalued the Naira which means the government is now getting 4 times more Naira that it did for every barrel of crude it sells. This means that for every dollar it used to get it needs less dollars to convert to Naira to meet its local obligations. Which means it can keep more of the dollars it earns and use for other things like subsidy although I have said subsidy should be removed totally. We are feeling pain because we did. It do what we needed to do at the right time. Petrol should be N1200, we are merely delaying the pain by reintroducing subsidy through the back door. If petrol needs to go to N2000, so be it. We need to change our habits. They don’t drive the cars we drive in Europe because petrol is expensive. It is only in Nigeria you will see a poor man driving a V8 gas guzzling used Lexus.

The title of this thread is exactly why I am against any form of fuel subsidy. We will eventually get back to where we were with inflated consumption numbers and where we end up subsidizing petrol for our neighbours. You cannot have petrol subsidies in a nation that has porous borders when your neighboring countries sell petrol at a rate 2x ours. If Niger, chad, Benin and Cameroun can pay N1200 for petrol then so can we, their citizens are poorer or just as poor as us and they are not rioting because petrol is N1200.

Albinoflash:
guy is too early to sound fullish ooo, tinubu said subsidy is gone,now we dey hear remove it fully,was that the agreement or the initial statement

You and I know there is still subsidy. Take your own advice.

This is why I say remove the subsidy fully or we return to square one.

Eriokanmi:
It depends on the cost of the land

What is wrong with Nigerians? Did you not read the question?

lexy2014:
who is the someone and where is the someone that pushed this idea to procure a new plane at this difficult time tinubu is telling nigerians to make sacrifice and endure the hardship he created?

the procurement of this plane makes loads of sense to Tinubu and his band of praise singers. are you now saying that tinubu is not a right thinking person?



how then is tinubu "far ahead of the others"?

I will explain this to you this way: you Lexy are a known eeediot, because you do something right does not all of a sudden negate the fact that you are an eeediot! The aircraft purchase stinks does not negate the fact that Tinubu is still the better choice of all the alternatives including your traitor boss Osinbajo.

Human beings make errors, leaders make errors. What determines whether a person is good or bad is how many good decisions they make compared to bad.

Don’t think because I replied you this time, I intend to reply you again

Put aside your support for the administration or otherwise. This jet purchase stinks!! I said it in July 16

casualobserver:
4 pages and no one has mentioned the real issue. The age of the plane!!!’


You say your current 19 year old plane is too old and unserviceable and then you go and purchase a 15 year old plane?

I can’t support this.

That you support the administration does not mean you cannot acknowledge errors/bad decisions, otherwise you sound like a brainless Obidient. that jet purchase was a monumental lapse in judgement and someone somewhere pushed this through to make some money because it makes no sense to any right thinking person.