₦airaland Forum

chieveboy:
Ultimately my contribution for this thread with you as the conductor is this:

1: No such thing as "pseudoscience" because fundalmentally, "logical soundness" (repeatable procedures with rational outcomes) are surprisingly subjective from varying angles and all angles. This goes for what you call reality and how any instance of it is not IT but an agreement that it is it. I have a thread on that and I hope it lays the foundation for your understanding that reality is indeed a simulation, in a 'computer'. All serious spiritual workers assert this publicly while knowing so internally counter to your earlier claim elsewhere. All reality is subjective in a simulative environment availed with a collective-observance properties or interfaces at which the agreements or acceptances are done.

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A most interesting take. You generally agree that this world is a sort of artificial rendition or simulation?

tctrills:
Ok, you don't even believe this but you having this argument just for the sake of it.
So let's go on, even if we are cells in the body of a great God, were we created? When we die, does the God lose cells?
Let's develop this theory as much as we can.

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These questions belong in the realm of the unknowable surely.

triplechoice:
First, your title "Simulation Theory" is a misnomer. The correct term is "Simulation Argument" or Simulation Hypothesis, as found in the very sources you took it from. In the sciences, a "theory" is a well-tested explanation for phenomena supported by evidence. A "hypothesis" is an educated guess awaiting proof. Yours is the latter. It lacks empirical evidence. Changing hypothesis to theory inflates its status and mislead your audience.

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Fair enough.

Third, "logically sound and rationally consistent" is not evidence or proof of anything. It is merely the minimum requirement for any argument. History is replete with ideas that were perfectly logical and coherent at the time, but later turned out to be nonsense. Logic without evidence is just story telling

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Nonetheless logic remains the pillar for these discussions.

Fourth, you point to philosophers debating the idea as proof it deserves serious consideration, not mockery. But philosophers debate all kinds of ideas, many of which turn out to be fiction. What is important is not those discussing it, but whether there is evidence. In this case, there is no shred of evidence we are living in a simulation. The Idea has been rejected by numerous philosophers and top scientists who call it exactly what it is; myth and pseudoscience

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In philosophy it is natural to have differing viewpoints. Indeed I would say that is the very life blood of philosophy. One thing which I want to make clear here is that i am not here to strictly advance Simulation Theory (or hypothesis if you like) in the way it has been propounded by others. Rather I seize upon the core idea that we may not be living in a real or base reality, that there may be something conjured or artificial about this reality and I would like to discuss that notion in different directions, via science, philosophy and even religious thought. LordReed please note.

Fifth, the Idea lacks any spiritual or philosophical support. No authentic esoteric tradition has ever taught that we live in a computer prigram run by invisible beings. Those spreading this falsehood have misinterpreted genuine spiritual teachings, like "the world is an illusion" or "As above, so below" both metaphoric references, and grafted them onto a modern sci-fi or Sci-Sp narrative.

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My dear friend, how on Earth would any older traditions advance the notion from the computer angle when no such thing as computers existed until the 20th century?

It should be clear to you, following from my comment in red above, that when I say this idea has existed for millenia, I am referring to the basic idea that this world is only a reflection or shadow of more real worlds. And there is no doubt that this is an ancient idea.

I already cited Plato's Allegory of the Cave and it is pre-eminent in this regard, but here, I dug up a list of other ancient ideas which align -

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1. Plato’s Allegory of the Cave (Ancient Greece)
Perhaps the most famous "shadow" metaphor in history, Plato argued in The Republic that humans are like prisoners chained in a cave, watching shadows flick across a wall.

The Concept: The shadows are the physical objects we see daily. The "real" world consists of the Theory of Forms—abstract, perfect versions of things (like the concept of "Beauty" or "a Circle " ) that exist in a higher plane.

The Takeaway: Our senses deceive us; we are looking at the projection, not the projector.

2. Maya in Advaita Vedanta (Ancient India)
In Hindu philosophy, particularly Advaita Vedanta, the concept of Maya describes the world as a powerful illusion or a "magic show."

The Concept: The material world is not "non-existent," but it is not the Ultimate Reality (Brahman). It is often compared to a "superimposition"—like mistaking a coiled rope for a snake in the dark.

The Takeaway: The physical universe is a temporary, shifting reflection of the eternal, unchanging consciousness.

3. Gnosticism and the "Kenoma" (Hellenistic Period)
Gnosticism, a collection of early mystical religious movements, took a more radical approach to the "shadow" idea.

The Concept: They believed the material world was the Kenoma (the Void or Emptiness), a flawed reflection of the Pleroma (the Fullness of the divine spiritual realm).

The Takeaway: We are "sparks of light" trapped in a lower, shadowy imitation of the true divine realm, created by a lesser deity known as the Demiurge.

4. Hermeticism: "As Above, So Below" (Ancient Egypt/Greece)
The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistus provides the foundation for the idea of correspondence.

The Concept: The "Microcosm" (our world/ourselves) is a direct reflection of the "Macrocosm" (the divine/universe).

The Takeaway: Everything on Earth is a symbolic mirror of a spiritual truth. If you want to understand the heavens, look at the patterns in the dirt—and vice versa.

5. Sufi Mysticism: The World as a Mirror (Ancient Persia/Middle East)
Many Sufi poets and philosophers, such as Rumi and Ibn Arabi, described the universe as a series of mirrors reflecting the attributes of the Divine.

The Concept: God was a "hidden treasure" who desired to be known, so He created the world as a mirror to reflect His own beauty and light.

The Takeaway: Objects in this world have no light of their own; they are merely surfaces catching the "sunlight" of a spiritual source.
----Culled

Thus, above you can see that you are wrong when you claim that there are no ancient philosophical ideas that rhyme with what I am saying. There are. Indeed, ancient philosophy and mysticism are rich with this very idea. cc: Tctrills.

So when you see criticism of this idea, please don't take it personally. The mockery is not directed at you, but at an idea that presents itself as profound but collapses under the slightest scrutiny

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I dont mind criticism and I should emphasize that I am not saying that I know the world to be a simulation for a fact. I am saying it is a serious proposition to ponder with sobriety and not a silly fringe idea to be mocked. It has deep roots in ancient thought and Simulation Theory is not the first variant of the whole idea, its just one modern variation based on possible computer science.

LordReed:
I can grant it (even though it is in dispute) because it doesn't take away from the fact that the wave function doesn't collapse which is what I said.

Now that we have that settled, what about consciousness affecting this experiment then means the universe is a simulation or illusion or however you want to describe it other than real?

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High Eminence Reed. Apologies for appearing to drop out of this conversation, the last two weeks have been rather trying for me.
Now to answer the bold, its very simple: the minute we can show that consciousness affects what is rendered, then a question mark on object permanence pops up naturally. Because the suggestion then becomes cardinal that what is rendered may be determined by what is observing. This calls into question any assumption that we are living in some sort of fixed or "real" reality and surely advances the cause of the argument that our reality is rendered based on a set of given factors which include the observer/ observation.

Now I know very well that you may dispute this, but I would like that you at least see the reasoning even if you disagree with it, and at all events whether you agree or disagree I would like us to move on to other points because there are many and we should not get stuck here.

"When people benefit from a system, they rarely complain about it. When the same system no longer favors them, they suddenly see the problem."

These words from the OP are so true and apply in many other aspects of life beyond this topic.

Azazyel:
Cos it doesn't align with your views. Very funny human being

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Not about my views. Any view that the actions of the USA in these matters are borne of altruism is naïve.

This was the most charismatic president Iran ever had.

MrsAyomide:
Real leadership will choose peace and reform, but no, Iran supporters in Nigeria who are not sure of their next meal are here cheering Iran to their doom..

Their latest line of defence now is that they are “Martyrs”

lol. Funny people

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You are the funny one if you believe that you should back down once someone invades your house and starts killing your family and beating your people.

horlique:
If you think any country is perfectly shield from attacks then u must be watching too much fake Hollywood movies,even the Big USA can be attacked..

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I was specific in what I wrote. I did not say what you are implying. I said Trump cannot bomb Switzerland and I stand by it. If you think he can, then you also need either school or hospital.

Wotowotoman:
Was Jona better than Buhari? Na only God know who worse pass between Jona and Bubu. The worst presidents in the history of this country. Very weak men that had no idea what running a local government was. Then you make them president and expect them to do what? Trash 🗑️ 🚮

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Everyone knows the worst are the last two. The present being the worst, worse than even the worst military government.

reddingtonblack:
From your excuses, compromised, intimidated which are still baseless though, it is as Good as saying On your mandate we shall stand

If a child is doing something bad and the parent watch on without trying to correct we might as well conclude the Parent are complicit

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I want to advise you never to write or utter the bold anywhere even as an analogy because it is in truth a demonic chant specially crafted by Satan himself in the presence of thirteen princes of hell, the great witch of darkness, several child-eating ritualists in the astral realm and given to a monstrous frog to be propagated in the Earth. Dont cite those words again because that may initiate you into a demonic ring that you cant understand.

What? Are minors allowed to create topics? Female minors?

reddingtonblack:
if you insisted Trump has violated and wreck the constitution then why have the congress not move to Sanction him or maybe they are in support of his actions

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Some are. Others are intimidated. Others are compromised. It's a complex mix but I don't think there has been a president in living memory who has shunted aside Congress the way he has.

reddingtonblack:
please shut up if you went to school to play

BY hierachy and constitutional provision the president is granted more power thats why president can give executives orders and grant pardons that over rides court convictions

Sani is just being dvmb as usual, what i expect him to have acclaimed is Trump is more powerful than Americans citizens he treat them like shit,

THE question to shehu sani and empty heads that support him, can Trump violate us citizens the way Tinubu gallantly treat Nigeria like nothing, can Trump pack US children that protest nd throw them into jail for treason

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It's obvious you are the one who needs some schooling. There is a constitutional order in the US which Trump has absolutely wrecked.

As for human rights, ICE and many other issues have destroyed that myth.

horlique:
If Trump drop bombs there. They will understand that those monies mean nothing without any defence

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If you think it's possible for Trump to bomb Switzerland you really need either school or a hospital.

dappydozzy:
It is high time you just leave these numbskulls alone on Nairaland, majority of them are Gen-Z, what do Gen-Z's in my dear Kwantry know? do they even know their country's history, talkless of world history.

Their opinions is always guided by what they read on social media, watch on western media and Nollywood, they are mentally colonised. They dont actually understand the term " terrorism". Terrorism has being around since ancient times till modern times. Nations have sponsoring terrorism against each other since World war 1. Many GenZs think terrorism is just when a group terrorises a community or nation. When a country sponsors fighters to destabilize a region for economic/political gain, such country is involved in terrorism, A lot of countries are involved in terrorism around the world which includes the US including countries in Africa are involved on terrorism but it takes deep knowledge and understanding international politics to analyse these issues.
The CIA is a terrorist training organisation as well as an intelligence agency, they have trained several dissident and militia groups to destabilize countries in the past like Angola, DRC, Cuba , Afghanistan during the Cold War.
The more you know about international politics, the more you can analyse global issues without seeming like a fool or an ignoramus on Nairaland .

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Thank you.

To add to what you and RealLordZeus have said, many of these children don't know that the UK branded Nelson Mandela a terrorist and the US kept him on its terrorism watchlist till as late as 2008.

What am I even saying sef, I am sure some of them don't know of Mandela.

Azazyel:
So how would that stop US and Israel? They can only talk along with other countries. Naso Dem talk during Russia-Ukraine war. The super powers no rate them. Most Iranians are even happy cos the regime that they should even be fighting for actually oppressed them too much and kpaied them. If not for that, I don't think US would have a good reason to join the war. A lot of Iranians are actually working for the US and Israel. In this kind of scenario, Iran would suffer too much losses. Regime change is the only way out. I wish Iranians the best and a better regime that would respect their rights.

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Naive.

OriOko88:
All these tiny European countries that couldn't defend themselves should sit somewhere jor. Switzerland of Less that 5m people dey chuk mouth for international matter. Shioor

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You don't know anything. That is an untouchable country talking and the only country which can protect its entire population in the event of an apocalyptic nuclear war.

mascot87:
There is nothing called international law when it involves world powers such as US, Russia, China, Israel, NK or any other Nuclear world powers. Breaking of international laws is only applicable to countries without nuclear power.

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But one struggles to remember China breaking International law.

EDGEof2MORO:
Is it not better you go back to your tribal roots and improve it with what you have learned rather than copying a colonial religion that was used to enslave your people?

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Thank you!

At least these are just signs. I once counted over twenty actual churches on one street in Lagos.

Fenrir:
Gabrielshow24 you want to know why I diluted the thread yeah. Have a look at what was here before I got here. "I am a human being." "My purpose is to live." One man answered the creator question with a story about his parents having sex. The deepest exchange in the entire thread ended with someone calling it chess with a pigeon and leaving. Then two and a half months of absolute silence.
That's what I allegedly contaminated.
Your answers were actually the most honest in the thread and question 8 had real reflection in it so this isn't aimed at you personally. But diluted implies there was something concentrated here worth protecting and brother there wasn't, there was a puddle with ambitions.
I showed up and actually did the thing DeepSight asked for. Pick something and think about it properly. That's not dilution that's the only thing that was missing.

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I found your interventions eminently bizarre, long-winded and neither here nor there. Sorry.

Thedon22:
You have not answered my question. How many people can pay for 24hrs electricity in Nigeria at average world rate per KW. Do you think investors are father Christmas? Priority first . First define what you need 24hrs for and demonstrate willingness to pay and let's see if you won't get 24hrs light within 12 months. Ordinary tolling of road, u go pay? Abi, Dem no dey toll roads for America?

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I have zero interest in reading anything from such a sad perspective. Have a good day.

Thedon22:
All these entitlement mentality has to stop. Power does not come free of charge anywhere . How many people can afford to pay for band A electricity and yet band A cost is less than SA cost? Govt is already subsidizing power for the poor. If you need 24hrs light to watch Arsenal why not install your own 24hrs solar panels? Youths need to start accepting responsibility for better Nigeria.

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Who said anything about free power?
We are talking about fixing power in this country and you are saying entitlement mentality.
Are you alright?

Goodness. This country is finished.

And in your estimation, the reason we need power is because we want to watch football?
Chai.

anonimi:
Yes, she is the author.

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I know, great writer she is. I remember reading that specific article. And it is soooo on point.

Someone like Bola needs starving people falling at his feet in order to seem like a messiah.

Thedon22:
What do you need the power for? To watch Arsenal matches abi? Or watch Big Brother? The little power given to you have you paid for it? And you want 24hrs light like America. Can you pay for the light? What is 24hrs light without using it for production? While politicians have their problems, you too should change. Do you know how much is being owed to the Discos? Is power free in America?

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Sure, we dont need power. I guess I was wrong, In fact thanks for your wisdom. I will start a campaign to ask that we cease to ask for power or even have power in this country. Thank you, oh exposed and learned sage.

As for the bold, I have words. I am beaten.

anonimi:
How do we sweep Oshiomhole’s Assembly of Past Criminals, APC from our country?

How do we purge ourselves of this scourge

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Abimbola Adelakun right?

Lithiumite:
They are both important,non supercedes the other......the govt is still paying subsidy on the power you consume and all lot of activities is happening in that sector that you still won't see the results until much later ......

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Anyone who says those particular roads are equally as important as power is lost.

Lithiumite:
Lie al you want,it's you and your family that have become paupers as for me and all those around me,I haven't seen anyone die of hunger and I haven't seen people's livelihoods worse off than it had ever been since I was born.........cbn just announced that 30 banks have met their recapitalisation requirements,if the economy was as bad as you claim where did those capital come from,who would want to invest in a dead economy.......people are getting by and making money but all you choose to see is misery,that's your problem...

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The bold is the height of delusion.
It may even be a medical dimension.

And sorry, I am no pauper.

Lithiumite:
This is a post from the coven of opposition agents who seek nothing but to attack tinubu no matter how ridiculous they sound........why is spar which has existed before shop rite growing, we have so many Nigerian retail chains doing very well,us it foreign customers or ghosts that are growing them?

We know where this is coming from and it's an infantile attempt to try to bring down tinubu......PBAT till 31!!

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In case you dont know, I was referring to the ill thought out fuel subsidy removal along with the devaluation of the naira within a month of resumption acts which vastly and unquestionably pauperized tens of millions instantly.

Lithiumite:
Show us one road that some form of work isn't going on at the moment.......has the govt told you they are neglecting the old ones?

Run a cos analysis of transiting to calabar through the old route compared to the new road when completed.

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I repeat, answer my simple question. Which is more important? Power or those roads?

simpleseyi:
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No cry, no cry, no cry. But if you want to cry, then cry well well

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What a funny people. You are content to suffer darkness just to support a particular person. Enjoy.