₦airaland Forum

raumdeuter:
And you are the one repeating it. Trump denied using the VP route this morning you said he is lying.

Trump also denied Project 2025. How far with that? He has been implementing it almost word for word.

Seems he is living rent free in your head

Better to keep an eye on a rogue than to worship him as you do.

raumdeuter:
Seems you pay attention to him a lot.

:
I meant that serious people know he lies as he breathes.

raumdeuter:
Look at the people who have spoken about a Trump 3rd term here, they are mostly left leaning

Its the same rhetoric of He will stop inter racial marriages, he will stop gay marriages, he will stop IVF, he will stop this and that scare tactics that every serious person now knows its just a democrat playbok and gimmick to scare people into voting them

:
Except that Leftists didnt come up with it - Trump did.

raumdeuter:
Today Trump said

"I'd be allowed to do that," Trump said on Monday, in an exchange with reporters aboard Air Force One as he flew from Malaysia to Tokyo.
But he added: "I wouldn't do that. I think it's too cute. Yeah, I would rule that out because it's too cute. I think the people wouldn't like that. It's too cute. It's not - it wouldn't be right."

:
Who pays attention to this pathological liar? No serious person does.
In Oval Office meetings attended by Congressmen, there have been Trump 2028 face caps on display.

gabbytabby:
I am optimistic that since the army and defence are not Fulani they might be better able to deal with the bandits problems more so because a Fulani has too much emotional resistance to chasing his people when they are deemed to be the ones causing the mayhem.

I hope that just knowing that the leadership has changed will cause them to change the we can do anything without consequences mindset.

"
But neither the previous CDS nor COAS were Fulani so what's the difference. In fact Chris Musa is a Christian, and his native tongues are Tyap, Hausa and Yoruba.

benalvino3:
True. They know there is no way he could run for a 3rd term and they know he is joking

There are technical ways.

E.g:

He could run for Vice President. And have the elected president resign once sworn in under a deal. This possibility has already been examined seriously by people in his think-tanks.

raumdeuter:
Seems the Democrats want Trump to run in 2028 more than Republicans

:
No one else would even consider it but Trump - to whom no rules whatsoever apply, and for whom every excuse in the world must be made. So long as he is alive, he will make an attempt at it, however clumsy.

Kukutente23:
Are your hand paining you
Go and mend him on behalf of govt instead of your e-threats

:
It never ceases to amaze me how the oppressed gather together with the oppressors to fight those who fight for the freedom of the oppressed.

LordReed:
I always hear this but in practice it tends to be quite different depending on certain factors. A person in certain places CANNOT openly declare that they have left Islam, they will be kill or prosecuted. Where is the "no compulsion"?

:
And one wonders about many things that happen in practice and in reality such as honor killing, in which fathers or brothers will kill their own daughter or sister who they believe have dishonored Islam?

raumdeuter:
They are welcome

JD Vance, Marco Rubio and Ron DeSantis await them

And Trump, Beelzebub sparing his life.

Lets take it one step at a time.

honesttalk21:
Those verses weren’t blanket orders to kill unbelievers. They were wartime instructions after enemies broke treaties and attacked Muslims.

:
Let us revisit the Sword Verses and quote the entire context.

A declaration of immunity from God and His Messenger to the polytheists with whom you had made a treaty.

So travel the land for four months, and know that you cannot escape God, and that God will disgrace the disbelievers.

And a proclamation from God and His Messenger to the people on the day of the Greater Pilgrimage, that God has disowned the polytheists, and so did His Messenger. If you repent, it will be better for you. But if you turn away, know that you cannot escape God. And announce to those who disbelieve a painful punishment.

Except for those among the polytheists with whom you had made a treaty, and did not violate any of its terms, nor aided anyone against you. So fulfill the treaty with them to the end of its term. God loves the righteous.

When the Sacred Months have passed, kill the polytheists wherever you find them. And capture them, and besiege them, and lie in wait for them at every ambush. But if they repent, and perform the prayers, and pay the alms, then let them go their way. God is Most Forgiving, Most Merciful.

And if anyone of the polytheists asks you for protection, give him protection so that he may hear the Word of God; then escort him to his place of safety. That is because they are a people who do not know.

How can there be a treaty with the polytheists on the part of God and His Messenger, except for those with whom you made a treaty at the Sacred Mosque? As long as they are upright with you, be upright with them. God loves the pious.

How? Whenever they overcome you, they respect neither kinship nor treaty with you. They satisfy you with lip service, but their hearts refuse, and most of them are immoral.

They traded away God's revelations for a cheap price, so they barred others from His path. How evil is what they did.

Towards a believer they respect neither kinship nor treaty. These are the transgressors.

But if they repent, and perform the prayers, and give the obligatory charity, then they are your brethren in faith. We detail the revelations for a people who know.

But if they violate their oaths after their pledge, and attack your religion, then fight the leaders of disbelief—they have no faith—so that they may desist.

Will you not fight a people who violated their oaths, and planned to exile the Messenger, and initiated hostilities against you? Do you fear them? It is God you should fear, if you are believers.

Fight them. God will punish them at your hands, and humiliate them, and help you against them, and heal the hearts of a believing people.

------------------

Above is Sura 9 Vs 1 - 15.

I think you should begin to tell us exactly what you think this treaty was and the origin and basis for it. I understand that treaty to be the Treaty of Hudaybiyyah, signed in 628 CE (6 AH) between the Prophet Muhammad and the Quraysh of Mecca.

It would appear that the verses are saying that these people had violated the treaty and thus should be killed.

My question is this: why are the verses specific when they say that those who disbelieve should be killed, and that those who repent, or ask for direction or protection, should be spared? Does this not specifically show that the motivation behind these verses is religious: because it appears that the verses are still made out against those who disbelieve in Islam/ Allah.

Besides the portions I have highlighted and underlined show that the issue here was really about acceptance of Allah/ Islam.

This is underscored by Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 8, Book 75, Hadith 387 (and other versions): "I have been commanded to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.'

This corroboration makes it clear that this is not just about treaties and violations but about a general direction in which the Muslims are commanded to fight to establish the worship of Allah.

For further corroboration let us go to Surah 47:4. But because you insist on context I will quote all the verse from 1 - 12. Here goes:

1. Those who disbelieve and repel from the path of God—He nullifies their works.

2. While those who believe, and work righteousness, and believe in what was sent down to Muhammad—and it is the truth from their Lord—He remits their sins, and relieves their concerns.

3. That is because those who disbelieve follow falsehoods, while those who believe follow the truth from their Lord. God thus cites for the people their examples.

4. When you encounter those who disbelieve, strike at their necks. Then, when you have routed them, bind them firmly. Then, either release them by grace, or by ransom, until war lays down its burdens. Had God willed, He could have defeated them Himself, but He thus tests some of you by means of others. As for those who are killed in the way of God, He will not let their deeds go to waste.

5. He will guide them, and will improve their state of mind.

6. And will admit them into Paradise, which He has identified for them.

7. O you who believe! If you support God, He will support you, and will strengthen your foothold.

8. But as for those who disbelieve, for them is perdition, and He will waste their deeds.

9. That is because they hated what God revealed, so He nullified their deeds.

10. Have they not journeyed through the earth and seen the consequences for those before them? God poured destruction upon them, and for the unbelievers is something comparable.

11. That is because God is the Master of those who believe, while the disbelievers have no master.

12. God will admit those who believe and do good deeds into gardens beneath which rivers flow. As for those who disbelieve, they enjoy themselves, and eat as cattle eat, and the Fire will be their dwelling.

Is this not clear enough? Why is it that Islamic scholars like to introduce to the text interpretations in brackets which are not in the text. The text and context are clear enough here. It is abundantly obvious that what is at issue here is the worship of Allah and Allah is expressly commanding the execution of those who do not believe in him.
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How does this tally with the claim in the same Quoran that there is no compulsion in religion?

Islam’s principle stays clear; there is no compulsion in religion (Q 2:256).

:
It is contradictory to say there is no compulsion in religion and to also prescribe death for apostates.

Banu Qurayza’s case wasn’t about faith. It was treason judged by their own chosen arbiter under tribal law.

:
What treason to be specific please?
And secondly how did that justify not just the murder of all men but the sale into slavery of all women and children?

Even the kill apostates hadiths referred to open rebellion, not personal disbelief. The Qur’an gives no earthly penalty for leaving Islam. Only God judges belief.

:
It is not true that the injunction to kill apostates is so qualified. It is specific, and it is from a Sahih (authentic) hadith.

spiSeyi:
You might not like Tinubu but he has done what no southern president will ever try to do even OBJ. He just delivered Nigerians from the Fulanis by sacking almost all there generals. He will now have enough capacity to deal with the bandits

When things remain the same by 2027 I hope you will say the same.

honesttalk21:
Be a little more patient with him.

:
He really has presumed alot and has no desire to engage and frankly its not by force, no one is being paid for this.

Apologies for taking offense regarding my statement. That isn't my intention. You have explored the context so clearly stating what you disagree with unambiguously or generally will save us both a lot of time.

:
Must I spell it out? That I find it worrisome that anyone would give commands to kill people for the simple reason that they are not of his faith? Must I spell out that it is worrisome that anyone would give a command to kill a person for changing his religion? Are these the things you want me to spell out? Really?

honesttalk21:
Perharps he will attend to you in due course.

.
Please forget the gentleman. In fact I am editing the OP to remove my reference to him, He is, as he said, "too big."
.

However make good effort to understand the context in which what your poser is. You could then point at what you are still unclear or satisfied about maybe I or others will be able to address these sufficiently for you.

.
I find this very tiresome. Why do you think I have not made any effort to understand the context. These are glaringly worrisome verses and injunctions and all you can say is "make an effort to understand the context and revert with what is unclear." That is patronizing at best and escapist at worst. If you dont wish to engage, simply say so, thats just fine.

Kukutente23:
Check online
You have a phone with internet access
It shouldn't only be useful for constituting e-nuisance
Why did you guys sabotage Jonathan's effort to install Mulikat Adeola as Speaker for a northerner?
What happened to Southern unity and Yoruba first then?

I don't think your patient is okay and may I suggest stronger treatment procedures by your able self.

nairalanda1:
No, not going to happen.

Remember that pdp under Obasanjo was also accused of making Nigeria a one party state, yet Obasanjo was unable to get enough support for his bid.

Is it tinubu who in a way does not have enough support within his party? Many votes for him in 2023 because if they didn't they would be out of a job.

Nigeria has too many blocs and three big tribes too. Ya think north or se would agree to tinubu 2031? That is even if he wins in 2027 self.

Consider that Obasanjo even had supporters all across the country self. And lots of hefty international backing and connections.

Do you see this particular NASS refusing any bill whatsoever proposed by the president - even if such a bill is to change the name of Nigeria to Tinubunia?

Shidinky:
This current senate is the worst rubber stamp in history headed by a very greedy akpabio who is just there to serve tinubu. He will be SP and leave and his state won't have the seaport. But he will be approving billions to lagos seaport

Rubberstamp is an understatement. He is like BAT's houseboy. The worst SP ever.

saintopus:
I agree say we have our peculiar problem in Nigeria 🇳🇬 but I don't think we will ever come to the stage where a president will remain in office more than the constitutional number of years. In Nigeria 🇳🇬 it's 2 terms of 4 years each.
Even Wike and Akpabio may not support Tinubu for 3rd or 4th term.
Na civil war you don bring come for Nigeria be that.
It will not happen here.
The highest it can possibly happen here is to rig the election and loot the country within those 8 years and after which you go your way.

Third term was defeated at the NASS under OBJ but this current NASS WILL NOT RESIST IT IF PROPOSED BY BAT.

Procashtips:
Just answer. Don't long things.

Alright. Populations develop over time. If you have an Islamic country with 4 people, it will take a long stretch of time to catch up with a country with 1000 people okay? Its too simplistic to look at the current population of Arabic countries and say ah well, that ends the discussion. What you must look at includes many factors but primarily look at the rate of growth and not the current population.

Islam today is the fastest growing religion in the world and this is not by conversion but by sheer birth rate. For this same reason, Muslims are predicted to be the majority in Europe before the end of this century.

Don't take my word for it, research. Look it up.

This is rooted in the polygamy sanctioned by Islam, but not only in that, a certain cultural disposition which tends to overly domesticate women. There is science and there are statistics to all of this.

Needless to say other factors play a role, such as poverty and illiteracy, but no one can deny the pivotal role of Islamic traditions in this matter as one can see from the global statistics on growth by birth among Muslims and as one can see by the rate of growth of the Muslim population in Europe for example.

In Nigeria, there is an almost fifty-fifty balance between Muslims and Christians but in the next fifty years this country will probably be about 70 - 80 per cent Muslim on account of the same factor.

Procashtips:
Islam indeed.

So how come some Arabic nations have less population compared to some European, African and Asian nations?

Is this a serious question?

You are joking right?

Procashtips:
Comprehension is a huge problem in Nigeria.

What concerns education with the natural capacity for women to birth children based on their demography?


I think the northerners eat more fertility-induced food or even live pro-fertility lifestyle than some of the southern states.

Come to think of it, they have the highest number of natural sex enhancing products than anywhere else in Nigeria. Seems the region specifically plant trees, fruits, vegetables solely for sex and fertility.

Its not all this. It is Islam.

Hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahha!

Hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahha! Hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahha! Hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahha!

ISLAM & SEX ! ! ! !

honesttalk21:
@DeepsSight
You specifically addressed your write up to the intended recipient who would respond to you at his own time. Copying me may not be of much value though I implore you to examine the context of what you inquire about.

Indeed, that poster was the trigger for these questions at this time, but my post is by no means limited to him, indeed he has indicated that he is "too big" to answer them. I would appreciate your views. I invited you as a result of you debates with Kukutente23 which I have been observing and you appear to patiently take your time and discuss thoroughly, so I would appreciate your input.

JimRohn:
You people clearly suffer from a serious comprehension problem.

No one needs to grant you permission to spew whatever you think you know about Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).

So stop whining for validation and either speak with knowledge or stay silent in your ignorance.

Are you going to address the issues raised or not?
Like I said, no worries if you are not so inclined.

Jakumo:
If only the people who keep shouting about the unfairness of repentance in the north and repression in the east, could just read your words.

Expecting justice to take its course with Kanu does NOT mean that one supports allowing northern terrorists to "repent" and avoid justice.

Maybe, now that there has been a major shake-up in the Nigerian military, the era of "repentant" terrorists will be replaced with true justice.

Shake up has nothing - zero - zilch - to do with improving security or seeking better justice.
In fact we are given to understand that the sacked CDS was against the idea of "repentant" terrorists and that the administration is in favour of that idea.

Kukutente23:
Only cowards fear to write what is in their minds clearly but mumble words together

Who made appointments the topic?

Zombies sha

So it is okay to betray your Yoruba sister for a northerner as long as it is not appointment

These northern slaves sha

But I even gave him a list of appointments he pretended he didn't see it.

https://www.nairaland.com/8548006/cbn-directors-president-tinubu-appoint/1#137256089

I now see what you were dealing with.

Gabrielshow24:
DeepSight, these people you called out won't answer you🤧. They can't perform any ’uno reverse’ so they will definitely stay clear😂.
Even the self acclaimed intellectual heavy weight, jimRohn, will not dare engage as it is synonymous to his downfall, it will be a massacre😅. To the rational mind, his prophet is just.... ’something else’🤧... And he is supposed to be the best of all mankind 🤕😂.

Let me just grab a popcorn and await who will take the bait. It will be fun to watch, to finally see them defend their faith without their usual 'tactics’.

Let me aid you in calling some other adept taqqiya masters.
cc: Lukuluku69, Expanse2020, Ohyoudidnt, madridguy

Well as for the great JimRohn he told me he is "too big" to answer. His exact words.

Meanwhile you never reverted on the deity of Christ thread.

hotseat:
Stop being myopic!

You have an option to to do so through the ballot box come 2027.



@hotseat

You stop being naive.

Xxxxx

Kukutente23:
Yep
That right there is the loony

Good grief.

MaxInDHouse:
So do you believe mankind need to be an organized global family?

We already are in many ways, otherwise international cooperation at many levels would not be possible. What do you think the whole idea of the United Nations is?

If so what is the way forward? 🙂

Perhaps we should consider a one world government. Although I cant see how thats presently workable.