₦airaland Forum

I am going to reiterate my points to make what I am driving at clear.


*The verse speaks of angels

*there is no authentic hadith asking a woman not to hold the Quran(if there is any, please show it)

*Aisha(r.a) spoke to a woman, asking her if her hand was involved

-It is all well.I hold no grudges.
-If you convince me, I will surely give in, But I am not convinced by yours.

CAMEROONPRIDE: kaiii you muslims can lie oooo
they are muslims. are they practicing islam? me i no know ooo

Many pagans who became Muslims continued with their pagan practices, unfortunately.

What with that woman cleaning his mouth like he is an slowpoke?

Those definitely are not Islamic practices. He can be a Muslim, really.

Lol

I dont like this kind of hijab

@tbaba, there is something about your attitude at answering questions. I will let that pass.

Again,

* you quoted a verse of the Quran. The purity mentioned is that of the angels. Do you admit to being earlier wrong on that note? Or are you not agreeing with that?

* You say my analogy doesnt make sense. Wow. There's been similar analogies used in interpreting verses of the Qur'an or ahadith.

*what if I didnt read your q&a that u didnt even provide the link for? What rule says I must do what you expect? You really need to be humble.

*The link maclatunji provided makes it clear that there is no authentic hadith saying a woman cannot. All I expected of you was to provide the authentic hadith that says so. You have not or have you?

maclatunji: Relax, if I wanted to argue, I would not post the link. I just pointed my opinion, like you have rightly pointed out: you are entitled to your position.

#Laughing

I am sure I have made it known before now that I find it offensive being told to relax. It is not funny.

Actually, I wasnt arguing either. I just saw something that corroborated my points and fed on it.

CAMEROONPRIDE: shut up. what did he do wrong?

you won't give massages to your Husband?
Bad wife

Did you really ask me to shut up?

Your punishment is reserved.

I am single and searching btw

maclatunji: This is a digression but technically speaking, you can't say one has taken a copy of the Qur'an into the bathroom or toilet because data is stored in '0s' and '1s'. However, it is a different matter if the text of the Qur'an is what you have running on your screen or playing the recitation.

On the topic, I find the opinion of the majority here to be in line with what I was taught and what my research shows. Your position seems very week indeed.

Allah knows best.

Like I said earlier, majority doesnt carry the vote.

And I am not in any way shoving my ideas down people's throat. So, I assume I am safe enough..

I am sure it happens sometimes that people argue on things and later later realise they were wrong.

Some people will argue now and realise later. It isn't a bad thing. A learning process has so many phases. I am hopeful that we will all get it right someday.

There are so many things that when you show to people at first, they see you as the alien or the one with the far-fetched idea.I am used to it.

Later you end up doing the same things and all I do in such instances is smile and not even remind them of the past.


Timeout

MOdified

From the link provided, here is what I see and believe in.

The Glorious Qur'an says : "That this is indeed a Qur'an most honorable in a book well guarded which none shall touch but those who are clean : A Revelation from the Lord of the Worlds." (Surah Al-Waqi'a, 56:77-80)

The Kitabim Maknoon mentioned in the above mentioned verse does not refer to the holy Qur'an in the book form, which we have, and the word Mutahhareen does not merely refer to cleanliness of the body.

Kitabim Maknoon means a book well guarded or a protected book. This word refers to Lauh-e-Mahfooz in heaven, which is also mentioned in the following verse "Nay this is a Glorious Qur'an (Inscribed) in a Tablet Preserved!" (Surah Al-Buruj, 85:21 & 22)

Mutahhareen does not refer to mere body cleanliness but also refers to those who do not have any uncleanliness or impurity like sin and evil, thus referring to the angels. According to the commentary of Tabari, Mutahhareen means the angels.

According to Ibne Hazam, who has discussed the subject in detail, there are no pre-requisites or conditions for touching the Qur'an.

Although all the scholars, of all different schools of thought, agree upon it without any difference of opinion that it is preferable to be in wudhu
before touching the Qur'an,

however, according to Ibne Hazam there is not a single verse of the Qur'an or the authentic hadith saying that being in wudhu is compulsory.





The above sums it up for me. When I mentioned my Islamic school, it was to say that I wasnt speaking out of whim. I hope it didnt come out as anything different from that.

I take a conscious effort at learning and would not speak here for any other reason than to speak right for the sake of Allah.

May Allah forgive any sin I may have committed on this. Amin.

modified

maclatunji: ^Would it be cool for her to read from a smartphone or computer?

A lot of questions have arisen on this as well.

Now she can read from a smart phone And if truly smart, she can be right by all schools of thought and others.


There is a question on taking phones with the quran on them into the bathroom.

It is said that the people at the time of the prophet had their quran in their memory and they didnt cut their head off b4 entering the bathrooms.

When the software is reciting the quran, u close that and enter.

Wa Allahu a'lam.

maclatunji: The people at IRF have gotten this topic well-researched http://www.irf.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=468%3Aare-menstruating-women-permitted-to-recite-or-touch-the-quran&catid=76%3Aqueries-on-islam-may-2011&Itemid=199

I WILL check this article in sha Allah.

tbaba1234: Like I wrote, all four major schools of thought have this position up till today. What school of thought did your islamic school teach?

Mushaf means pieces of paper, there is no way, memory is the mushaf.

A woman going to the mosque, or the messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) putting his head on her lap is not the issue here. Nothing stops her from going to the mosque or interacting or reciting the book.

A man has to be in a state of wudu to touch the mushaf, can a woman be in a state of wudu when she is on her period? The answer is no.

A man can go to the masjid or interact without wudu but he needs it to pray or touch the mushaf.

The same thing applies to a woman.

Also, there are many viable options for her to recite the Quran, a translation or any book that has the arabic text can be used.

I urge you to stay away from a position of doubt, there is no need dragging this issue.

Of course I would have to leave it and I made it clear enough that this isnt about winning an argument.But if I have more to say about it, I'll definitely do.I cannot be coyed into a corner because someone said so and Majority doesnt carry the vote in Islam.

Beyond mentioning schools of thought you havent made a point that I see. At least mention the evidences of the school of thought??

We dont follow specific madh'ab. We do what is right.

You say mushaf means paper. I was saying that their memory was the mushaf as that was where there quran was. It wasnt to be literal.

Even when the Quran was written, a whole wasnt anywhere. So saying they can touch a half and not a whole doesnt hold water.

If they didnt hold, how could their sunnah on holding have come about?

Simply give evidences or leave the matter as well.

And thank God, mobile softwares are the now and future which would eventually not make those fatwas on not holding relevant anymore?

Ramadan is a time when we do 'all' acts of worship in order to have the blessings of Allah.

One of those acts of worship is learning the interpretation of al-Qur'an(tafsir).

Let us all learn from each other on this thread. Tell us what you learnt from a tafsir session you attended or of a verse you came about while reciting the qur'an which caught your attention and you decided to learn further.

You could also just be our NL tafsir giver.


You are welcome please.

CAMEROONPRIDE: men ain't supposed to take advices from women in public, you are not even supposed to tell me what to do in public and you dare say it will make me strong? anyway i heard you. but i will follow my parents on this one. being polite opens doors.

How are you different from the man in the video?

Azmarie: This video is stupid most Muslims , don't live like this and it's based on wolof , tradition not Islam.

Dont mind that cameroon.

This same people didnt get up to pray as shown in the video and he claims it is Islam they are practicing

Nothing stops anyone from reciting the Quran. Touching the mushaf is the issue here

What I mean by that is, to recite the quran is halal. If you tell anyone not to, in any particular way, the onus is on you to bring the evidence.

This matter was once discussed here on Nl at the time of the likes of lagosboy and abuzola. I wish I can get the link to it.

tbaba1234: Nothing stops anyone from reciting the Quran. Touching the mushaf is the issue here

As regards the mushaf, this is what Allah says of its replica.

I swear by the positions of the stars––a mighty oath, if you only knew––that this is truly a noble Quran, in a protected Record that only the purified can touch (Surah 56 75:79)

Imam Qurtubi and mazhari interpreted this way. Also the sister of umar (RA) asked him to take a bath before she gave him the mushaf to read, she also recited this ayah.

Other scholars like abdullah ibn Abbas interpret this ayah differently but base the ruling on not touching on a hadith on the authority of abdullah ibn umar.

The messenger letter to amr ibn hazm contains the statement : " Only a clean one may touch the Quran'

This hadith is recorded in Ibn Abi Dawud, the muwatta of imam malik, musnad of Abdurazzaq, Tabarani, Ibn ul mundhir, Ibn Marduyah.

All four major schools of thought consider purity as a condition for touching the book

I summarised this information from one of my tafsir books: Ma'ariful Quran.

Like I said earlier, I am not here to win the argument and I must say, like Sissie said that the best thing is to leave what you doubt for what you doubt not.

YOU see, quoting scholars of old is not a problem. BUT remember that even everyone of these scholars made it known that if in the future you find out that they may have made a mistake, leave what they said and do what is right. And I am not saying that theyv made a mistake in this regard.

I am not surprised either that the notion you hold is quite common.I used to agree so too.

I studied and actually learnt about my position at my Islamic school but I cant remember jotting down and may not be able to put/write the evidences explicitly but I will say what I remember from it.It was discussed together with entering of the masjid by a female(many would say that is not allowed either)

It is up to everyone to learn more or not.

*When Allah spoke of the quran being touched only by the Pure, the angels were the ones being referred to.

*The quran wasnt in its completed form at d time of the prophet but was held in the form that it was.

*it was in their memory(which makes the brain their mushaf)
*Aisha(r.a)'s room was in the mosque
*She used to pass through the mosque when she has her period

*the prophet (SAW) used to put his head on her laps even during her period.

*a narration by Aisha where she tells a woman that 'afteral, her hand is not what is impure'..

Here is my submission. When I have what it takes to go deep and quote more or give better explanations, I will In sha Allah.

tbaba1234: ^ Exactly, When it comes to Ibadah, everything is haram until there is evidence.

Therefore, a person has to present the evidence that makes it halal not the other way round.

TO recite the quran is halal innit?

tbaba1234: Praise be to Allaah.

There is nothing wrong with a menstruating woman or a woman who is bleeding following childbirth reciting the du’aa’s that are prescribed during the rituals of Hajj. There is also nothing wrong with her reciting Qur’aan, according to the correct opinion, because there is no report that clearly states that a menstruating woman or a woman who is bleeding following childbirth is not

it

Rather

Qur’aan.

recite

to

allowed

narrated specifically that one who is junub (in a state of impurity following sexual activity) should not recite Qur’aan when he

menstruating

to

regard

With

junub.

is

women or women who are bleeding

hadeeth

a

is

there

childbirth,

following

narrated from Ibn ‘Umar which says “The menstruating woman and the one who is junub should not recite anything,” but this is da’eef (weak). But she should recite without touching the Mus-haf, from memory. Based on that, it is more apt that she is allowed to read books in which there are du’aa’s mixed with ahaadeeth and verses from the Qur’aan etc. This is the correct view and it is the more correct of the two scholarly opinions.

From the words of Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him).

Take note of the bolded

Was there mushaf during the time of the prophet? The Quran was in their memory.


I still dont see that evidence here.An evidence from the Quran or hadith that specifically mentions that a woman cannot hold on to the Quran.


NOTE..I am not here to argue but to get things clarified.

ACTUally the onus is on the people who say you cannot do something to prove thrmselves right.

I Will try to pull my resources though but may not be able to or not soon enough.

I disagree with you o @tbaba. There are evidences to show that a woman can recite the Qur'an and with her Mushaf even while menstruating.

IF you find it possible, nothing stops you sis.

I have seen women breastfeed while praying.

The prayer to be said While breaking the fast.


*please add the other etiquettes of breaking the fast that you know of.

She can.

Wa Allahu a'lam

..

Ramadan joke.

Not bad.

Me sef dont want any cheap gift o

In fact, All ramadan messages must be written with heart moving words.